I thought this episode was fascinating. I appreciate you talking with experts and professionals (episode 27 included). If the podcast continues, this is the direction I'd love to see it continue to take. Great episode.
This episode is one of your best. Once again, people who have actual knowledge about important subjects are saying that the Renner theories are nonsense.
1:27:25 Start here if you just want to hear what these criminologists think happened to Maura Murray. The rest of the show is good too, but it's mostly about the relationship between social media and crime.
I know you guys think nothing of it but it just makes sense: If you look on a map, the place where they supposedly found Maura's car on Wild Ammonoosuc Rd. is going in the direction to Bethlehem, NH, where the UMASS cabin is. It's only 20-30 miles away from Bethlehem, NH. I think she was headed there, for sure. She called those resorts because she wanted to get away, but after calling she realized she couldn't afford them with the $280 in her pocket, so she headed for the cabin. It was probably deserted at that time and she knew it. So after she realized she couldn't afford those resorts and have the trip she thought she would, she was like "fuck it" and started drinking on her trek. She hit something or something hit her while on route to the cabin via back roads (Wild Amm.). She freaks out about possibly getting a DUI so she flees the scene. Maybe she tried to get as far as she could to the cabin but didn't make it. That is the most likely and most logical sequence of events IMO.
Any other assumptions about escaping abuse etc sound far fetched. Those are things we will never know unless someone admits them, so we should stop squeezing them to death. The facts are she was headed somewhere up north and since we know she knew of the cabin, that is the most logical destination.
Maybe it is that people's psyches are ready to handle more of the dark shadows in the world....This,in the end,will help the human race be a better civilization...when we understand what happens in bad situations and what causes it, we are better able to make adaptations for ourselves and our children...In this situation with Ms Murray, I want to know how not to make the mistakes she made and I want to make sure my children do not either....(I feel some of the mistakes include her not having the ability to fail...She should have been able to fail...Then, she should have had the ability to rest...regroup rethink re-analyze and create new ways to handle new problems....She did not seem to have a safe place...She just went from jaunt to jaunt, this to that without having anyone who really advised her about everything...I try to allow my children to voice their opinions ...after having high expectations in ethics....I always try to see where they are at, try to see if they are sad, scared, angry....And I allow them to feel the feelings. "It's okay to be angry"....I say...I allow my children to fail and I work with them...both of us figure out a way to overcome the failure..together...And I have to be okay when my children aren't the best and will never be the best at many things...
Perfectly stated- we are a small part of humanity. The expert is probably right, her remains are there- they just haven't been found. Sad but all things point or a solo trip, with definite intentions.
My theory on this case has changed so many times. I'm still undecided as to what I think actually happened to her. I do have a question though. What ever happened with the coordinates? Are you going to check them out?
I think that there's basically no chance that Maura was going to the cabin. It would've been very suspicious if the entire track team happened to be gone the night Maura went missing (plus it would've just been weird to do on a Monday). There's too many holes for that to be the case. If the track team did go there, why wouldn't they tell the police "yeah Maura was supposed to go party at the cabin with us, but she never showed up". They didn't do that. The only explanation would be that she made it there, and something happened (like the kid who took a bunch of LSD) and they hid her body so they wouldn't get in trouble. Even that has a bunch of holes in it though; she left her car just sitting on some road she doesn't know, and she didn't take the alcohol she purchased. It's extremely unlikely, and "a girl mysteriously disappears on the way to a party in the mountains with her track team" just sounds like some weird episode of Criminal Minds, not an actual event that's likely to have happened.
Maura would not have gotten into this mess if she had gone home and worked as a bag girl in the super market for year...contemplating how to succeed in a stressful environment and saving up money...She had a crazy insane schedule...no support system nearby...and she did not have an inner support system and strong coping skills....She needed therapy...She may have come from a family like mine that poo poo-ed therapy....But if a family has not given a person proper coping skills, therapy is a way to get repairs tend....You can't be successful if your parents haven't given you the correct tools....You internalize your parents...If they are critical towards you while not helping you adjust, then you will be critical towards yourself and will not seek to learn to adjust..If they helped you develop tools to cope with a variety of circumstances, then you will seek help in developing tools to cope on your own...YOU INTERNALIZE YOUR PARENTS...so it is very important that parents parent in a way that their child can grow up and use those exact techniques with themselves.....
It's hard in vision the area she wrecked in, because I feel like you have to see, ans pur yourself there. And get a feel for the area it's been 20 years a lot has changed. But given the area and the cold weather/snow, you're only getting so far especially when you just wrecked and your not all there and shaken up. Let's say she did run away how far would she really have gotten? Without being seen, she would have gotten lost out in the woods. Something happened and you really have to think about the fact she hasn't been seen since that night of the wreck. I highly doubt she has gone all this time without talking to her family. She only has limited resources, it really seemed like she was just getting away not leaving for good. I don't think she committed suicide either, the facts are just to unclear there has been too much speculation and assumptions. He has to be simplified certain questions and thing's like that party has to be moved on from it doesn't matter anymore. We need to know what happened after she wrecked, and there are people that saw her when she wrecked. There is a possibility she may have gotten help as in a ride and something happened.
For some reason I have never gotten a good vibe when I hear about him. Not saying he did anything wrong, but the only way Maura is alive is if she's held up in a basement somewhere. The FBI should get involved and search the entire area, houses included, near the site of the crash. A lot of perps that would do that sort of thing get involved with the investigation to allude innocence. Too bad it's 12 yrs later. So much evidence is gone.
Right, thank you they've always just accepted his word when in nearly all cases whoever sees and speaks to the person last is the one.. well he was last. and the scent was lost right in front of his house... who knows though. but it annoys me how so many theories and people's witness statements are thrown out but his isn't...
Do a google maps search of the area she went missing. It’s sparsely populated. Also, check out bootleg pass on RUclips. He drove around the areas and that will give you a video of the area. Definitely look at old peters road. That’s a dirt road that was a short walk from the accident. If she went down that road and went off trail and died, she may never be found
most of the local cops are humble, but the ex sheriff of haverhilll got in trouble for drinking and driving, and the witness A saying she saw the 001 police suv there, and the haverhill police saying it wasnt. just seems really weird to me, why would the witness A lie about seeing that suv there. Who knows but there is proof of the ex sheriff drinking and driving and getting a DUI, investergators have a theory that the sheriff could of hit her on accident because he was drinking. I hope the FBI take the case over, If I had a daughter and something like that happened to her I honestly wouldnt know what i would do, they would have to lock me up because i would probably kick in every house door within a 50 mile radius.
I'd just like to point out that "going native" is no longer considered an appropriate term for ethnographic/participant observation approaches to analyzing cultures in the US as it objectifies and otherizes the people being studied.
Geez, who cares what two Poms think regarding this case? How disappointing. How about an episode on listener theories? At least it would be germane to the case. Plus, the truth just may be in one of the *seemingly* whack theories. Especially since the truth isn't embraced by most people in the current zeitgeist. BTW, one doesn't need a PhD. in psychology to "understand" psychopathy as the pompous Pom male bleets. Puh-leeze. His field fails to label psychopaths out of PC pandering...which doesn't help the victims and society as a whole. In the past the field was quite ready and on target doing so. Disappointing episode!
+Jarlath Caolan Thanks for the incorrect correction but Poms is indeed what they are. If you knew what it means it would be apparent. Good for you if you like boring talk most listeners are already privy to but for some of us we are already well versed in what these bores think is academic. It's wonderful this episode enthralled remedial listeners like you. Not everyone has an average IQ and your group got a special episode so you can catch up with the big boys.
I agree with "Plus, the truth just may be in one of the seemingly whack theories." I don't like the term whack, but life is stranger than fiction. That is a fact.
You know what I think guys? I got to episode 6 and gave up. It's all a load of bollocks. She just ran off into the bush after the crash and perished there, possibly scoffed by animals after. that's it.
Settling on one theory leaves a whole lot of weirdness unexplained. And if you gave up 22 episodes ago, why are you here, instead of say, cute cat videos?
I thought this episode was fascinating. I appreciate you talking with experts and professionals (episode 27 included). If the podcast continues, this is the direction I'd love to see it continue to take. Great episode.
This episode is one of your best. Once again, people who have actual knowledge about important subjects are saying that the Renner theories are nonsense.
1:27:25 Start here if you just want to hear what these criminologists think happened to Maura Murray. The rest of the show is good too, but it's mostly about the relationship between social media and crime.
This. The majority of the episode is boring.
Thanks
I guess I'm the only one who enjoyed this. I really found what they had to say insightful and interesting.
I know you guys think nothing of it but it just makes sense: If you look on a map, the place where they supposedly found Maura's car on Wild Ammonoosuc Rd. is going in the direction to Bethlehem, NH, where the UMASS cabin is. It's only 20-30 miles away from Bethlehem, NH. I think she was headed there, for sure. She called those resorts because she wanted to get away, but after calling she realized she couldn't afford them with the $280 in her pocket, so she headed for the cabin. It was probably deserted at that time and she knew it. So after she realized she couldn't afford those resorts and have the trip she thought she would, she was like "fuck it" and started drinking on her trek. She hit something or something hit her while on route to the cabin via back roads (Wild Amm.). She freaks out about possibly getting a DUI so she flees the scene. Maybe she tried to get as far as she could to the cabin but didn't make it. That is the most likely and most logical sequence of events IMO.
Any other assumptions about escaping abuse etc sound far fetched. Those are things we will never know unless someone admits them, so we should stop squeezing them to death. The facts are she was headed somewhere up north and since we know she knew of the cabin, that is the most logical destination.
Maybe it is that people's psyches are ready to handle more of the dark shadows in the world....This,in the end,will help the human race be a better civilization...when we understand what happens in bad situations and what causes it, we are better able to make adaptations for ourselves and our children...In this situation with Ms Murray, I want to know how not to make the mistakes she made and I want to make sure my children do not either....(I feel some of the mistakes include her not having the ability to fail...She should have been able to fail...Then, she should have had the ability to rest...regroup rethink re-analyze and create new ways to handle new problems....She did not seem to have a safe place...She just went from jaunt to jaunt, this to that without having anyone who really advised her about everything...I try to allow my children to voice their opinions ...after having high expectations in ethics....I always try to see where they are at, try to see if they are sad, scared, angry....And I allow them to feel the feelings. "It's okay to be angry"....I say...I allow my children to fail and I work with them...both of us figure out a way to overcome the failure..together...And I have to be okay when my children aren't the best and will never be the best at many things...
Perfectly stated- we are a small part of humanity. The expert is probably right, her remains are there- they just haven't been found. Sad but all things point or a solo trip, with definite intentions.
My theory on this case has changed so many times. I'm still undecided as to what I think actually happened to her. I do have a question though. What ever happened with the coordinates? Are you going to check them out?
Great episode.
Great episode....
I think that there's basically no chance that Maura was going to the cabin. It would've been very suspicious if the entire track team happened to be gone the night Maura went missing (plus it would've just been weird to do on a Monday). There's too many holes for that to be the case. If the track team did go there, why wouldn't they tell the police "yeah Maura was supposed to go party at the cabin with us, but she never showed up". They didn't do that. The only explanation would be that she made it there, and something happened (like the kid who took a bunch of LSD) and they hid her body so they wouldn't get in trouble. Even that has a bunch of holes in it though; she left her car just sitting on some road she doesn't know, and she didn't take the alcohol she purchased. It's extremely unlikely, and "a girl mysteriously disappears on the way to a party in the mountains with her track team" just sounds like some weird episode of Criminal Minds, not an actual event that's likely to have happened.
Maura would not have gotten into this mess if she had gone home and worked as a bag girl in the super market for year...contemplating how to succeed in a stressful environment and saving up money...She had a crazy insane schedule...no support system nearby...and she did not have an inner support system and strong coping skills....She needed therapy...She may have come from a family like mine that poo poo-ed therapy....But if a family has not given a person proper coping skills, therapy is a way to get repairs tend....You can't be successful if your parents haven't given you the correct tools....You internalize your parents...If they are critical towards you while not helping you adjust, then you will be critical towards yourself and will not seek to learn to adjust..If they helped you develop tools to cope with a variety of circumstances, then you will seek help in developing tools to cope on your own...YOU INTERNALIZE YOUR PARENTS...so it is very important that parents parent in a way that their child can grow up and use those exact techniques with themselves.....
Nicely said about the parent thing. Why is this shit not taught in schools k-12?
I enjoyed this episode! Very interesting
The lack of footprints is obviously irrelevant - nobody saw footprints in any direction.
when's the next pod cast coming?
I am totally lost, when did anyone say that Maura was a psychopath?
Are you continuing the podcast?
Funny! At 1:22:30 the commentators don't even realize they are talking about their own behavior.
It's hard in vision the area she wrecked in, because I feel like you have to see, ans pur yourself there. And get a feel for the area it's been 20 years a lot has changed. But given the area and the cold weather/snow, you're only getting so far especially when you just wrecked and your not all there and shaken up. Let's say she did run away how far would she really have gotten? Without being seen, she would have gotten lost out in the woods. Something happened and you really have to think about the fact she hasn't been seen since that night of the wreck. I highly doubt she has gone all this time without talking to her family. She only has limited resources, it really seemed like she was just getting away not leaving for good. I don't think she committed suicide either, the facts are just to unclear there has been too much speculation and assumptions. He has to be simplified certain questions and thing's like that party has to be moved on from it doesn't matter anymore. We need to know what happened after she wrecked, and there are people that saw her when she wrecked. There is a possibility she may have gotten help as in a ride and something happened.
loved them, but just when you ruled out suicide...
Check the bus drivers house
For some reason I have never gotten a good vibe when I hear about him. Not saying he did anything wrong, but the only way Maura is alive is if she's held up in a basement somewhere. The FBI should get involved and search the entire area, houses included, near the site of the crash. A lot of perps that would do that sort of thing get involved with the investigation to allude innocence. Too bad it's 12 yrs later. So much evidence is gone.
Right, thank you they've always just accepted his word when in nearly all cases whoever sees and speaks to the person last is the one.. well he was last. and the scent was lost right in front of his house... who knows though. but it annoys me how so many theories and people's witness statements are thrown out but his isn't...
Wilson is always on UK TV - he isn't taken seriously here....
So she took her own life and her body wasnt found...dont think so. Maybe in Alaska but not in NH which is rankes number 21 in population density.
Do a google maps search of the area she went missing. It’s sparsely populated. Also, check out bootleg pass on RUclips. He drove around the areas and that will give you a video of the area. Definitely look at old peters road. That’s a dirt road that was a short walk from the accident. If she went down that road and went off trail and died, she may never be found
I have grew up in the area my whole life and I have to say i think someone grabbed her or the local police are cover up some shit.
Question, does the police force up there seem to have an inflated self-ego or are they more humble?
most of the local cops are humble, but the ex sheriff of haverhilll got in trouble for drinking and driving, and the witness A saying she saw the 001 police suv there, and the haverhill police saying it wasnt. just seems really weird to me, why would the witness A lie about seeing that suv there. Who knows but there is proof of the ex sheriff drinking and driving and getting a DUI, investergators have a theory that the sheriff could of hit her on accident because he was drinking. I hope the FBI take the case over, If I had a daughter and something like that happened to her I honestly wouldnt know what i would do, they would have to lock me up because i would probably kick in every house door within a 50 mile radius.
I'd just like to point out that "going native" is no longer considered an appropriate term for ethnographic/participant observation approaches to analyzing cultures in the US as it objectifies and otherizes the people being studied.
It's definitely not appropriate, but unfortunately there is recent evidence of its widespread use even in late 2016. :/
Jmjt. Jmjt
Geez, who cares what two Poms think regarding this case? How disappointing. How about an episode on listener theories? At least it would be germane to the case. Plus, the truth just may be in one of the *seemingly* whack theories. Especially since the truth isn't embraced by most people in the current zeitgeist. BTW, one doesn't need a PhD. in psychology to "understand" psychopathy as the pompous Pom male bleets. Puh-leeze. His field fails to label psychopaths out of PC pandering...which doesn't help the victims and society as a whole. In the past the field was quite ready and on target doing so. Disappointing episode!
+Jarlath Caolan Thanks for the incorrect correction but Poms is indeed what they are. If you knew what it means it would be apparent. Good for you if you like boring talk most listeners are already privy to but for some of us we are already well versed in what these bores think is academic. It's wonderful this episode enthralled remedial listeners like you. Not everyone has an average IQ and your group got a special episode so you can catch up with the big boys.
I agree with "Plus, the truth just may be in one of the seemingly whack theories." I don't like the term whack, but life is stranger than fiction. That is a fact.
You know what I think guys? I got to episode 6 and gave up. It's all a load of bollocks. She just ran off into the bush after the crash and perished there, possibly scoffed by animals after. that's it.
Sossarado Yet you commented on episode 28?
Settling on one theory leaves a whole lot of weirdness unexplained.
And if you gave up 22 episodes ago, why are you here, instead of say, cute cat videos?
Where’s the backpack and booze?