Testing Ellen White's Writings (Seventh-day Adventism) | Part 3
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- Опубликовано: 26 авг 2021
- Did Ellen White commit plagiarism as pastor Walter Rea said? Why did the General Conference pay an attorney to argue that Ellen White did nothing wrong?
References in order of appearance:
1. Ramik Report adventistdigitallibrary.org/i...
or whiteestate.org/legacy/issues...
2. Photo by DAVID ILIFF. License: CC BY-SA 3.0
commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...
3. James White’s reference to his personal dictionary
-Advent Review and Sabbath Herald from June 17, 1880 (page 393)
documents.adventistarchives.o...
4. Definition of plagiarism (Webster’s Dictionary 1884, page 301)
ia802205.us.archive.org/15/it...
5. Ellen White An Appeal to Mothers (1864, page 34)
ia802701.us.archive.org/2/ite...
6. Plagiarism is taking another’s work and passing it off as your own (Uriah Smith, editor of RH).
-Advent Review and Sabbath Herald from September 6, 1864 (page 120)
documents.adventistarchives.o...
7. Richard Rogers Bowker biography
www.britannica.com/biography/...
8. Copyright it’s history and it’s law by Richard Rogers Bowker (published 1912)
ia600308.us.archive.org/26/it...
9. Arrival of the Great Eastern at her Dock (Ship), unknown illustrator.
commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi...
10. 19th century piracy
www.britannica.com/topic/publ...
11. Definition of piracy (Webster’s Dictionary 1884, page 300)
ia802205.us.archive.org/15/it...
12. The Great Controversy 1885 edition (Unfortunately, 1887 edition is not available online).
ia601603.us.archive.org/5/ite...
13. The History of Protestantism by J.A. Wylie (1870s)
ia600303.us.archive.org/19/it...
14. Canright article by G. I. Butler
-Advent Review and Sabbath Herald from March 22, 1887 (page 185)
documents.adventistarchives.o...
15. Seventh-Day Adventism Renounced by D.M. Canright (1887/1888)
ia801005.us.archive.org/22/it...
16. Spirit of Prophecy volume 4 (1884)
adventistdigitallibrary.org/i...
17. The Great Controversy (c1911)
ia802804.us.archive.org/20/it...
18. Daniel March, Night Scenes of the Bible (1869), page 453-454
ia600903.us.archive.org/22/it...
19. … "Great Controversy," … should be sold everywhere. Sister White is not the originator of these books. They contain the instruction that during her life-work God has been giving her. They contain the precious, comforting light that God has graciously given his servant to be given to the world.”
-Advent Review and Sabbath Herald from January 20, 1903 (Facsimile shown on camera) documents.adventistarchives.o...
[Page 15, left side]
20. Literary Ethics by H.M. Paull published in 1928. Page 45. Unfortunately, I have not been able to find an online version of this.
---------------------------------------------
All books shown on video were printed and copyrighted before 1915, and are thus in the public domain, except for The White Lie by Walter Rea which was used with permission, and Literary Ethics by H.M. Paull published in 1928 but without a copyright notice, thus in the public domain at this time.
Photos of Ellen White courtesy of the Ellen G. White Estate, Inc.
#seventhdayadventist #ellenwhite #adventist #adventistchurch 
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Clarification (32:56): Text from the History of Protestantism was used in this section of the Great Controversy (as shown). However, I want to clarify the text was not used for the entire book. The Great Controversy is made up of several books of which Wylie's was one, and contained illustrations of the History of Protestantism scattered within.
Appreciated. May God bless you for this exceptional research that puts THE QUESTIONS FULLY AND COMPLETELY TO REST.
I cannot stress enough how much I appreciate the quality and professionalism of your work. Keep it up! I checked for this video for weeks!
Thanks! I am glad they are helpful.
@@TesttheProphet Relying on attorneys is an easy way to avoid facing an an unpleasant fact. It's part of self-deception. The masses of humanity accept authority of tradition as conveyed by priests, pastors, experts, politicians, parents and so forth. Reliance on authority is good for practical matters. We accept authority of a doctor or someone who is in a specialized field, who knows more that the layman. In matters of spiritual truth, however, there is no room for authority. I feel that investigation of spiritual truth is the responsibility of every human being. Most Jews appealed to the authority of tradition to deal with Christ's challenging message. And they rejected Him on the basis of the authority of the ideas of their forefathers. So, this video, while its subject is Adventists, it fits almost all human beings. Yet we are all endowed with the capacity to investigate and to distinguish what is true from the false. The very curiosity such as that which have have manifested will give the energy and open the door. This what, you, sir, have done. What an example you have offered us! Thank you.
@@healinghumanity1782 "In matters of spiritual truth, however, there is no room for authority. I feel that investigation of spiritual truth is the responsibility of every human being."
I fully agree.
@@TesttheProphetmerci pour votre travail suite au visionnage de toute cette série j’ai fait ma demande de radiation de cette secte mensongère.
À cause de vos vidéos traduites en français nous avons décidé un groupe d’amis en Martinique de demander notre radiation,merci du fond du cœur pour ce travail.
Sister White is not the originator of these books but SIster White will collect all the royalties from these books🤣🤣🤣🤣
Exactly. What more do we really need. The producer of these videos really does not need....should not need hours of info to really convey that we have been duped.
My 16 year old daughter attends a SDA chur.....um, organisation with my spouse on saturdays. I noticed she had been given a copy of Desire Of Ages by a friend. I sat my daughter down and have her read;
"All this displeased His brothers. Being older than Jesus, they felt He should be under their dictation. They charged Him with thinking Himself superior to them, and reproved Him for setting Himself above their teachers and priests and rulers of the people. Often they threatened and tried to intimidate Him, but He passed on, making the Scriptures His guide". Ellen G White, Desire Of Ages, pg 87
After completing the paragraph, I asked my daughter if there was anything unusual, odd or wrong with what she just read. She looked at the passage again, then looked at me and said "no". I asked her to have another look, then looked at me rather puzzled since she could not understand why I was asking these questions. I quietly said to her, "if Jesus had older brothers, as EGW (pointing to the book in her hand) wrote, then how could Jesus' mother, Mary, be a virgin at the time of Jesus' birth?"
My daughter was quiet in thought, then replied "Oh yeah!".......the lights came on at that moment.
I proceeded to explain to her the way that SDAist's justify this is by saying Joseph had sons with a previous wife, therefore, these older "brothers" were step-brothers.
My daughter listened intently as I explained that the idea of Joseph having sons born prior to Mary is NEVER found in the bible, and that Jesus had older brothers is aswell NEVER found in the bible and that SDA's have two source's of authority, the bible and EGW, where SDA's HAVE TO BE IN 100% AGREEMENT with EGW and believe her unbiblical additions to scripture.
Well done and hopefully the seed of Adventist error will grow
Wow I never thought of that
The Bible does speak of Jesus having brothers but I don’t remember them mentioning them being older or younger
@@thekingsson1757 Right, the bible does not, but Adventist discovered the error of their prophet and then had to invent a "reason" which of course is not found in the bible. So, the next time an Adventists utters the words "Sola Scriptura", you will know it is not truly what they believe.
@@AcademyApologia it all boils down to "Sola EGW" for the SDA
I pray many Adventists watch this series. Most of my family are still sda, from nominal to old school conservative sdas and I doubt any would ever listen.
The most challenging idea for an Adventist is to entertain the thought they may be wrong. I had this same difficulty. If one is in the remnant church and all other churches are Babylon (to some extent), then to challenge your worldview is to question your sanity and salvation. That is how exclusive historical Adventism is. You cannot simply change from Adventism to a Baptist, or any other denomination.
I hope that these videos provide some hard evidence as to why it is ok to question Ellen White. Good luck with your family.
@@TesttheProphet that's exactly right, when you have "present truth" for the last generation/s you reject everything else as error. I have some sda family that wanted to seperate from me in preparation for the end times that they believe will happen, namely I will persecute them etc.. it took my nominal sda family members to stop them from doing that.
Yeah, I hear ya. There are some dark places that people go when contemplating the narrative Ellen White wrote. Fear sells and holds them in captivity.
They may not listen to you, but im sure they'll listen to the Holy Spirit. Pray for them, sometimes that's all we can do.
It will be a hard day when you find out the NT was written
In some secret societies the devil refers to as "the light" and she kept talking about "the light"
God bless your soul Testing The Prophet. This has been keeping me up for 2 months. I think God has given me an answer when you posted this yesterday
I'm glad it was helpful, Joshua. May God bless you as well.
I am so sad these days because the people that is Seventh day Adventist I look up to for so long turn out to be very disappointing. I now consider them to be one of the most deceptive religious organization. Jesus must truly be at the door now more than ever. Your presentation is the light that is needed now. Thank You and Jesus Bless you.
Excellent presentation bro. Your research and refutation of their arguments is stellar.
Thank you, Elce.
@@TesttheProphet you're welcome bro.
This video presents facts and data and presents its information with actual sources. It just does not get any better than this by showing actual period sources. Actual period sources to Adventists is like Kryptonite to Superman and Adventists are paralyzed in the face of actual period sources.
By the way and for those Adventist still wishing to defend their false prophet; I have the original 1760 first English dictionary (That is England for public school graduates, as I was) by Samuel Johnson where plagiarism is defined as: Literary Theft. Not only was plagiarism defined as theft in the 1820’s as this video has shown, it was already known as theft in the mid 1700’s. Ellen White was a literately thief and Adventist ought to be ashamed.
Very true.
Keep up the good work on your channel.
SDA must be exposed since too many are trapped under that witch's spell.
All glory to the Lord Iyesus Kristos.
My husband and I we love your channel and always looking for your new video. Highly educational and very detailed .
Gave me enough proof that EGW was a false prophet. Thank you
Been very blessed by both of your channels. Thank you for all your well presented and thorough research. God bless.
I want to let you know that I'm a former SDA from France.
But I have to play devil's advocate here
If she plagiarized previous authors, how come she was able to do that ?
Wasn't she uneducated ? I was taught she couldn't read or understand these concepts, so maybe maybe 🤔 someone was actually doing plagiarism and she was faking those visions on the other side, so that people would believe the writings even more....
I don’t believe she had any issues reading. She did report issues with comprehending Biblical concepts when she was young though. If someone was ghostwriting her books she has even bigger problems.
Bravo!!👏👏👏👏👏 Well researched and presented. This is a blow to the very heart of SDAism. Can't wait for the next one.
God bless.
Your words betray you as an agent of Satan. That you could be happy about this attack on the SDA church means you're spiritually immature and a fool. May the Lord God rebuke you and all the works of darkness.
You have to admire the Ramik report author’s legal dexterity and skill At lawyering🙂
I just read where Adventist are looking to place more "Signs of the Times" news boxes. Well, I am an Adventist Digital Missionary (I signed up early this year and they let me in!) and received this notice where they were seeking places to put these news boxes. This too, I would love to find all the boxes in my zip code and I would go clean them all out.
Interesting. It's been a while since I've seen one. Here's a recent advertisement...
ruclips.net/video/tzIdsQNlWoA/видео.html
@@TesttheProphet I need to find these in my area and clean it out..........And then place Adventist tracts in the box..............
Stealth covert action by an army Ranger. Excuse me if I got the branch incorrect. Thank you for your service. Good to hear from a real man.
Censorship is a great idea! Who needs religious freedom?
Explain you love signs of times? Or see them as thievery and Ellen white work or prophecies
It blows my mind that not a SINGLE sda I've told about Ellen's plagerism gives it a second thought. It doesn't bother them in the least...usually they warn me to stop crititizing "God's Prophet" Their intellectual dishonesty and Bible illiteracy is astounding. so sad. Sean's wife
The most difficult idea to entertain as an Adventist is that you may be wrong. I was there at one point too.
Good point Sean’s wife. It’s not only the ignorance but the arrogance. Adventists are proud to be in the remnant church in their mind. The sickening sense of superiority is what blows my mind.
I agree with you their hearts seem to be hardened towards integrity.
@@stephencoe2231 Adventist leaders know Adventist doctrines are gross error. They don’t care. They lie to protect the Adventist business. Adventist ministers are highly paid and the business is overloaded with administrators at many levels. Adventists are going to milk the heresy cash cow to the last drop.
@@TesttheProphet being wrong is painful. Adventists have a lot invested in being right.
I guess I am simple, but the moment I read she was selling the words she claimed came from God, that was enough. She finds her credibility right next to Joseph Smith, Brigham Young and other false prophets and teachers as far as I am concerned. Your presentation is excellent, and took obviously an enormous amount of time and research. Thank you for your gracious and articulate style in sharing these very serious and important facts.
“ There is much profit left in our pens.” James White, in a letter to his wife Ellen White.
Advent Defence League
You side stepped Prairie Girls observation/question which indicates a deep root of deception.
The Truth is that we live in a fallen world-and Gods Word has always been available-and this doesn’t mean there has been no cost…that is not what I’m saying..many have given their lives to preserve Scripture..I’m saying that we are living in a spiritual realm and the reality is what we can not see…God is so magnificent He has preserved His Word and His remnants..and there is no jewel gold silver or money that can obtain His Word…it is One Thing that He’s made freely available…it can not be bought or sold.
Obviously we know the point I’m making…Gods Word is priceless.
Would you like to continue to ignore the excellent point that clearly refuted EGW the puppet of the hidden hand club?
There are so many places where The Holy Bible refutes these heretical writings and false teachings.
For example The Sabbath.
Is The Sabbath about a day?
Let’s read and see what God says about What…or WHO The Sabbath actually is…shall we? (You checked out long ago but I pray those who are reading this use His Word to rebuke the false teaching about a day..and that you from ADL repent and have the veil taken from your eyes but most of all your hearts)
Let us absorb The Truth-Jesus Christ is The Truth:
Hebrews 3 and 4 read each Word…each line carefully and slowly…read it over and again…it will sink into good ground…TODAY do not harden your hearts.
Read Genesis 2:3.
Now really take in what He’s trying to show us…start at Hebrews 4:6…every Word…and now 4:9-11…notice how it ties into Gen 2:3.
We are to cease from all OUR works as He did from His and we are to abide..to REST IN HIM 24/7.
Hello ? Anyone home?
Read each and every Word here as well…really allow your ego to dissipate and wither away and His Word to wash over you and to change you from the inside out.
2 Corinthians 3:7-18….
What does He say? Their minds were blinded..for until THIS DAY…the SAME VEIL REMAINS…
There is so many more passages that destroy the wine of Babylon that Adventists drink.
Jesus is The Way.
The Truth.
The Life.
@@TruthSetFree-zm1ep This is great! What you got on soul sleep? I’m saving your last comment for my family friends still lost in SDA.
@@TheseSignsShallFollow The Sabbath is legit, Ellen White is not. This is what all denominations do (ie, cause division which is forbidden by Paul in 1 Corinthians, several times)
It's a logical Fallacy to say, because they are false on ____x____, then they are false on everything.
All poisons and snares are mostly good food, so we must use discernment.
"Soul sleep" or whatever you want to call it, is also legit, (1 Cor. 15) but again, Ellen White is a snake. This is the go to game plan of the Prince of the World, ie, control those who are under your yoke (eg, any denomination) with:
1) truth __x___, but laced with lies
or
2) Push those who are not under your yoke (denomination) away from the truth due to overgeneralizing the extent of the lies.
Either way, the God of this World wins when that happens. Well, at least until Judgment Day. On that Day, the World will see Ellen White, and the other snakes in these churches across the land, in absolute terror, as they become the very personification of fear, but it will be too late
Except Joseph Smith told no false prophecies and only true ones unlike Ellen G. White and Brigham Young.
If the SDA church felt the need to argue that Ellen White’s writings on health reform merely mirrored that of prominent health reformers of her day, are they saying that God inspired these other health reformers?
Their argument is that God told her what to take and what not to take from those around her. However, if you read her health writings you will quickly find there is a lot of ridiculous ideas that do not hold up. This is something I am looking forward to cover later on.
@@TesttheProphet : Exactly! Ellen White was a purveyor of quack medicine and outlandishly ignorant therapies. She subjected her children to the indignities of phrenology. Imaging being able to determine the character of an individual by the shape of their head🤣🤣🤣🤣🤭🤭🤭
The Adventist position went from Ellen White did plagiarize to God showed her what to STEAL from others. This argument makes God a plagiarist and a deserving candidate for the scorn and ridicule deserving of a practitioner of the ignoble practice of plagiarism.
Personally I have no sympathy for anyone who subscribes to such an abysmally inadequate standard of scrutiny. That supposedly educated people like Walter Veith could accept this proves that Adventism is a pernicious corrupting influence which de-agencies the individual.
@@TesttheProphet : You should also looking into the blatant racism of Ellen White, Uriah Smith, James White and pioneering Adventism. There is ample documentation proving beyond a shadow of doubt that pioneering Adventism was characterized by racial bigotry despite the deceptive abolitionist stance outwardly expressed.
@@TesttheProphet : It is also interesting that Ellen White encouraged the consumption of pork and meat during the controversy in Adventism regarding diet being a test of faith.
Some even challenged Ellen’s stance on supporting pork arguing that eating pork was inconsistent with the provisions of a biblical sabbath and biblical dietary laws.
Ellen White in her many about turns changed her position on pork and dairy, meaning that the health message she supposedly received from God was incomplete and required frequent adjustments in line with the thinking of health reformers of her day.
ELLEN WHITE WAS AND IS A BONAFIDE SCAM.
@@TesttheProphet Ikr Animalism and many logical arguments that traps your mind and tempts you to follow her because it is logical and yet doesn't mean we are obligated to keep them. In fact 1st Timothy 4 clearly prophecies of people like her.
This is so mind wrecking. I have been raised SDA my whole life and recently came back to the fold. The church I go to doesn’t even mention EGW.
I was also raised SDA my whole life. I've attended churches that mentioned EGW and those that did not. If you study Adventist history however you will find that all of our beliefs align with EGW's beliefs, which is why questioning her validity as a true prophet can be so "mind wrecking" as you so accurately described. The Bible instructs us to test claims of prophets and this is why it is important to do so. The wonderful outcome of considering the possibility that she was not who she claimed to be is that you realize Christianity has a lot more to offer than the small world of Adventism, and the Bible alone can be your guide. If you would like more resources feel free to email me at testtheprophet@outlook.com
Often Adventist churches preach and teach EGW but in a covert fashion. Her doctrine and theology and in every sermon and in every Sabbath school lesson. You're fully immersed in EGW in Adventist churches whether you are aware of it or not.
So the Ramik report’s argument is that since there is no ‘recognized’ victim with regard to financial loss, no harm no foul🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
This is the flag Adventism waves in defense of it’s prophetess🤣🤣🤣🤭
hey brother, i used your videos to show some of my SDA friends the false hood in Ellen's work. it caught them off guard bro. God Bless You!
I’m happy to hear it was helpful to you. God bless.
When will part four be out?
Likely 6-8 weeks.
@@TesttheProphet no that's to long this stuff is so vivid and incredible we need more ASAP this may help save souls this is crucial
Matthew, I appreciate your enthusiasm, but these videos take a lot of time. I work 40-50 hrs a week and have other obligations. Also, I aim for accuracy which requires a lot of verification (all this takes time). I still anticipate part 4 to be finished by the end of October or at the latest early November, but life can always throw a curve ball. Part 4 is coming along well.
@@TesttheProphet yes it does take allot of time. I do wish I could afford all of these original books because even though you and academyapolagia show originals these SDA still say it is the devil deceiving with false information. It is sad really. Thank you for all of your effort videos like this are and will be absolutely crucial to bringing people out of the "truth" of Ellen White and the SDA denomination
How do I include brazillian portuguese closed captions? I want to translate it so I can share with my SDA friends...
I think you will have to download the video and repost it with the translation
You had done a great and meticulous job of establishing the facts that all Ellen G Whites books and other writings were not inspired by God but stolen from other writers of that Era. How can they the SDAs continue to hold onto and follow her beliefs and writings to this modern times. Can't they see that the church she founded was based on false prophesies and even the doctrines are nonbliblical. She only use some books in the Bible like Daniel and Revelation to support her credibility as the Spirit of Prophecy. The last person to have visions and his book is included in the New Testament was Apostle John who wrote Revelation never formed and new church apart from the one he was part with brothers and sisters in Christ in Jerusalem. Ellen G White claimed to have visions from God and then formed the Seven Adventist Church. But with all her writings and books are found to be based on stolen materials from other writers then she be condemned and declared a false prophet and the so called church be abolished. She created the greatest cult spread all over the world who teachings were based on falsehood.
There's actually a documentary, called the Bible vs. Joseph Smith. I think it was produced in Israel, but the host sits down with a Mormon and shares Bible verses that show Joseph Smith fails the test of a prophet. It is done respectfully, but it is very difficult for him to acknowledge that fact. It's also difficult, even when done respectfully, to share these truths with Adventists. But the Bible says... False prophets and teachers would come in the name of Jesus... And not deceive a few, but deceive many.
I watched that movie/documentary a little while back, it takes most information out of context and uses false and biased “archeologists” to boast their claims. I also doubt the “Mormon” they interviewed was even a Mormon. The “false prophecy” they claim Joseph gave also has a very reasonable explanation that they literally give in the documentary. I consider their biased documentary a violation of scripture, instead of testing him, they just wanted to validate the idea he was wrong (which he isn’t) and slandered him.
(For an example of out of context claims, the JST section literally proves that the documentary is misleading. They claim that the JST basically changed the entire Bible into a mess of edits that validate the Book of Mormon. However they fail to mention that the book they were holding-the one that shows the KJV and JST changes back to back-is mostly full a changes that consist of “shall”s being changed to “will”s, which is considered to be correct by linguistics. They also misrepresent what the JST actually is, “translation” is the correct word because it just means to change, but they claim Joseph was trying to make people think that he translated from manuscripts, something he never claimed. The JST is actually a mix of fixed linguistic translations with the KJV, theological fixes-like Lot wanting his daughters to be raped and God hardening people-and restored scripture-Genesis 50 ending.)
Thank you for another great video. Looking forward to the rest!
Sir..... I salute you in these excellent series....
Well researched, articulated, clear explanation & concise & to the point.
Remember this EGW is the founder & in my view (& I'm not alone here) with her plagiarism makes it a VERY unstable foundation that the 7th day Adventist church still stands on today...
Now... Proud SDA'S will argue/protect/defend to the hilt as you found have out!.... But ...do not be discouraged my friend as this matter needs to be brought to the light & you have done this admirably! 🇭🇲
Robert, thank you for the encouragement.
I have a question. These are remarkable videos by the way! I appreciate all your hard work & research that have gone into it. Here's my question. In light of this new information you are sharing with us, what do we do with the mark of the beast theology in Adventism and sunday worship? How do we now interpret this?
Duncan, thank you. The mark of the beast in Adventism is based on the assumption that Sunday worship = the mark of the beast and Sabbath keeping = seal of God. However, there is no mention of either of these assumptions in the Bible. They come from Ellen White. Further, if the sabbath was meant to be kept to keep the saints from receiving the mark of the beast you would expect to find it all over the New Testament, except there is not one command to keep the Sabbath. Why leave out something so important?
“In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, who is the guarantee of our inheritance until we acquire possession of it, to the praise of his glory”. Ephesians 1:13-14
“And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption”. Ephesians 4:30
“I saw some, looking too far off for the coming of the Lord. Time has continued on a few years longer than they expected, therefore they think it may continue a few years more, and in this way their minds are being led from present truth, out after the world. In these things I saw great danger; for if the mind is filled with other things, present truth is shut out, and there is no place in our foreheads for the seal of the living God. This seal is the sabbath. I saw that the time for Jesus to be in the most holy place was nearly finished, and that time can last but a little longer; and what leisure time we have should be spent in searching the Bible, which is to judge us in the last day. - Ellen White Topsham, ME 1/31/1849
Just think about that… she said time was not expected to last a few more years back in 1849! All this by a prophet who claims to have been given the day and hour of the second coming. Here is an example of a false prophecy.
Here are some further resources into the mark of the beast, recommend viewing in this order:
1. ruclips.net/video/iJKmT5dlfS8/видео.html
2. ruclips.net/video/AM2BSTwkiwk/видео.html
3. ruclips.net/video/uWbg8paWk7o/видео.html
4. ruclips.net/video/Xt--RyDyybY/видео.html
5. ruclips.net/video/6N9gWmhhnJE/видео.html
6. ruclips.net/video/UN2cP-AetN8/видео.html
Good luck with your studies.
@@TesttheProphet Thank you for your prompt reply. And please keep producing your videos! They are magnificent, praise GOD!!! I have already shared your video with an SDA friend of mine. I am in the process of transitioning out of Adventistism altogether after 30 years, and my friend is waist deep in Ellen G. White right now. I've brought to him the false predictions and contradictions and he keeps saying I'm taking them out of context. I mean they are clear cut contradictions!! One that I shared with him was that Ellen G. White said the enemy decieved Adam. But the Bible clearly states that Adam was not decieved at all. He full well knew what he was doing. The woman was decieved. He quotes to me that some will in the last days refuse her writings. When I saw your video about this particular false prediction, ( if I was the enemy, I would insert a prophecy like that to keep people in fear and not seek to test the prophet). I have found too many subtle contradictions in her writings to continue on in Adventistism.
Yes her warning is quite brilliant. The options are:
1. You don't test her and continue to read her writings.
2. You test her and decide she is a true prophet.
3. You test her and decide she is a false prophet. However, this then leads others to claim this only confirms her as a true prophet because she warned that you would leave her eventually!
You can't win.
@@TesttheProphet So what do e do. Knowing what I know now, I can't go on believing that she is a true prophet. If she wasn't led by the Spirit of GOD, she must have been led by the enemy. And maybe the enemy put that clause that people would turn against her writing as a clever ploy to entrap anyone who may question her writings. This is not of GOD. GOD allows us to test even his prophets. This is a trick of the enemy to entrap us.
@@duncanragnar3484 It was during Lesson Study that the red flag was raised ,the class was talking about the Sunday law and the Mark of the Beast but the teachings was not supported by the Bible ,that when i started investigating all her teachings that make up the doctrine of SDA -Fundamental belief no 13,18,20,24 -after 3yrs of research i walked away from Adventism knowing well that i had nothing to lose -It is impossible for one in whom God's Holy Spirit resides to remain in a place of falsehood
This outstanding work that I have seen so far. Will you also be covering her actual false prophecies?
I do want to investigate her prophecies in the future, however, I will cover a few of her visions first.
This has been up for a day and as with the last presentation from AcademyApologia the defender's are silent.
They are afraid to get bibled.
@@clarkent61 Haha!! True!
Wonderful work!!! Can't wait for the next video!!
It seems that those under the old Covenant system of law, are more apt to be led by a written law code, (thus if the law doesn’t say it exactly so… then it’s ok to do the act) most old Covenant believers are NOT led by a conscience of the Spirit, that inner voice that says. “What you have done is Wrong”
If there were no laws regarding stealing or murder, if the opportunity for you to do either was made available and you could get away with it. Would you do it? If so, then your conscience might be seared. It was unconscionably what EGW did, an acclaimed prophet at that. Whether she repented or not I know not, but the White Estate and the Denomination will come under severe judgement from God, because this is a Christ less denomination, and void of the gospel and they continue to uphold these erroneous doctrines through these plagiarized books that make void the Cross and the blood of Jesus.
The pitfall is coming, and I pray there will be survivors IN CHRIST. I am one of them.
Excellent point. Ellen White was the moral superior of no one.
She was also racist and do was her husband and much of pioneering Adventism.
While your point is taken, perhaps we shouldn't judge Ellen White too harshly. Most human beings are not free of self-deception, especially when they are defending their Self-identity. Many people present themselves as being in the right. They tend to have fixed opinions. Yet we should always be open to fresh look at what we believe because we could be wrong. I, too, might be mistaken.
@@healinghumanity1782 it’s important to know Ellen White proclaimed God had slammed shut the door of mercy and all humans were doomed except the tiny little flock of shut door people. Former Adventist pastor Dale Ratzlaff sorrowfully stated it’s difficult to fathom the darkness of a soul that could make such a statement. Ellen was mean and without natural affection. She was vindictive and regularly said she had visions rebuking those who disagreed with her. To understand Ellen is to judge her harshly, but I respect your desire to be merciful. Ellen deserved no mercy. She’d responsible my father being in eternal hell and millions more. Damn Ellen White.
Your response is appreciated. I am with you in wishing that Ellen White did not close the door of mercy to the majority while opening it only to a tiny group. Yes, there is some meanness in being vindictive and rebuking those with differing views. Don't you, however, see that judging her harshly, damning her, is falling into the same trap? Can we transcend this framework of harsh judgment? After all, most human beings have that same disease--seeing others as wrong and themselves as right. Is it possible, therefore, to have consideration to all of us, poor and imperfect beings?
So next time anyone is accused of plagiarism instead of defending your cause to the full extent of the law, by providing original manuscripts and proof of scholarship………. You can just get a legal opinion and copyright it. Case closed✌️🙂🤣
What I find troubling is the deception of the White Estate when they write that she did give credit (because of the 1888 preface), and that a copyright attorney cleared her of piracy/copyright infringement and plagiarism. It's a face saving move just as 1844 and the investigative judgement was.
Any amount of study quickly shows these defenses to be full of holes. But how does the average Adventist begin to question the spirit of prophecy? It's akin to questioning God.
@@TesttheProphet : It is interesting that Robert Olson was fired from his position of chief researcher in the White estate when it was discovered that he presented a different and flattering report on his commissioned research into Ellen White relative to the one he presented to John Hopkins for his degree in theology.
This is the sort of people who run Adventism. He realized that he could not maintain his funding and position within Adventism if he shared the truth about Ellen White to his employers at the White Estate.
THANK GOD RONALD NUMBERS, DM CANRIGHT, WALTER RAE etc had the courage to speak the truth.
@@TesttheProphet : This is the same White estate that owns the copyright privileges to the Ramik report which is supposed to vindicate Ellen White of the charge of plagiarism🤭
@@TesttheProphet : If the Adventist laity would simply read the Bible and not Ellen White’s corpus of purloined putrefaction, they would see that God enjoins is to TEST THE PROPHET.
Here is the biblical prophetic litmus test:
Deuteronomy 18:21-22
King James Version
21 And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the Lord hath not spoken?
22 When a prophet speaketh in the name of the Lord, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass, that is the thing which the Lord hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.
@@TesttheProphet : The White Estate is NOT an objective source and resource for determining the validity of Ellen White. The White Estate has long waged a disinformation campaign in service of obscuring the palpably efficacious fraud of Ellen White.
WHEN IS THE NEXT VIDEO???????
Keep on bro i will be watching
good job
Great work sir 👌
Can’t wait for your next video
Where is Part 4?
Hi. I'm working on it. Due out late next month.
I have a question for both ex-SDA's and SDA's.
In Desire Of Ages pg87, EGW says Jesus had older brothers.
1. Has EGW, in any of her writings, corrected this to the current position of SDAism that these older brothers were step-brothers?
2. If there is no evidence by EGW herself in her writings of a correction, who then was the first SDA to use the "step-brother" line and sinker?
3. Is this individual who made this correction have the authority to change the words of the S.O.P? Who does the Adventist believe, the inspired EGW/SOP (who the used the term "older brothers") or the non-inspired individual who CORRECTED EGW?
Are these legitimate questions or am I over thinking these things?
Did EGW have financial gain from her publications? Seems like a stupid question but having grown up in the church this thought never crossed my mind.
Apparently she did. Check out Dr. Steve Daily's video here on RUclips entitled *Ellen G White A Psychobiography* part 1.
@@NoSundayLawComing i like your screen name! And thank you!
For 30 pieces of silver it is possible to get a legal opinion and then copyright the said legal opinion which is touted as an exoneration of the charge of plagiarism.
Neat piece of business if you ask me🤣🤣🤣🤣
What does the Lord say about this subject?
Jer 23.30 Therefore, behold, I am against the prophets, saith the Lord, that steal my words every one from his neighbour.
31 Behold, I am against the prophets, saith the Lord, that use their tongues, and say, He saith.
32 Behold, I am against them that prophesy false dreams, saith the Lord, and do tell them, and cause my people to err by their lies, and by their lightness; yet I sent them not, nor commanded them: therefore they shall not profit this people at all, saith the Lord
"...with the intent that the appropriated material be viewed as originating with the appropriator and not the originator." This is very evident with Ellen White's writings. Changing the order in which sentences, or words within sentences, appear in the text is a clear indicator of deliberate, willful attempts to hide the origin of the text. Eg. "...they have clothed themselves in garments that shone like the lightning..." to "They have appeared clothed in garments that shone as the lightning..." If you were studying for a university degree and presented an essay with this kind of word juggling you would find yourself being accused of plagiarism. You are not even permitted to replace words within a sentence with synonyms if the general order of the sentence remains or to change the order in which sentences appear in the original text, and then claim it as your own simply because you moved some sentences around. And the assertion from the SDA organisation that Mrs White did nothing wrong by the standards of the day, or whatever the excuses, ignores the essential question of inspiration. Were her writings from God or not from God? Clearly, if she had to "borrow" from other authors, then the latter is the case.
I couldn't agree more--and the fact that she avoided mentioning her dependency on other writers is what is disturbing.
May God richly use your compilation of contradictions within the SDA.
Gloire à Dieu pour ces vidéos.
Merci pour ces informations édifiantes, utiles à notre salut qui est en Jésus-Christ seul.
Surely there is a moral argument against merchandizing messages from God. In any case God and NOT Ellen White s should have collected the royalties associated with these sales🤣
A general admonition of pilfering is NOT a proper citation.
Because my books focus on controversial topics they AVERAGE 700 pages and a THOUSAND citations because I have established myself as an investigative journalist and not a story-teller desperately passing themselves off as a prophetess by stealing the inspiration of others and calling it "angelic visions".
I think that rock to the head took out Ellen White's ethics.
A general public admission of taking other's ideas would have been a good start for her...still looking for that.
Interesting, I'm not for Ellen white as a profit but... it is interesting her book there came from many other athurs as the Bible mentions proverbs 15:22. The other thing is the Bible is composed of many authors though the credit is credited to most of them it seams
One book 📚 egw didn't copy was the bible as anyone's eye 👁️ can see reading the shut door policy
If the argument is that there was no financial loss due to plagiarism... you just tacitly admitted to plagiarism. I'd be curious to see a direct quote from EGW about something revealed directly from God or a vision juxtaposed to the source she copied from. Maybe something so direct doesn't exist but that would be the biggest 'case closed' detail in my opinion.
This is what I will be showing in Part 4.
Ellen White's Vision
"I was shown that one great cause of the existing deplorable state of things is that parents do not feel under obligation to bring up their children to conform to physical law. Mothers love their children with an idolatrous love and indulge their
appetite when they know that it will injure their health and thereby bring upon them disease and unhappiness... They have sinned against Heaven and against their
children, and God will hold them accountable. The managers and teachers of schools...."
(Ref Testimonies for the Church, vol. 3, 141 (1872))
Here is the writer she took this vision from:
"Parents are also under obligation to teach and oblige their children to conform to physical law for their own sakes....How strange and unaccountable that mothers should love their children so tenderly as to indulge them in what they have occasion to know may injure their consitutions and impair their happiness for life. May many
children be delivered from such mothers, and from such cruel lindness The managers and teachers of schools ..."
(Ref Philosophy of Health: Natural Principles of Health and Cure, LB. Coles, Boston: William D. Ticknor & Co, 1849, 1851, 1853, 144, 145)
@@thykingdomcome4241 : FANTASTIC OBSERVATION!!!!👏👏👏👏👏. The woman was a bonafide FRAUD!!!
This is one of the ones I will be showing in part 4. She takes even more than what was listed here by Rea.
@@TesttheProphet : How can anyone other than the deluded and willfully ignorant, believe that Ellen White was true prophet😳😳😳😳
Was king David a true or false prophet? Did he commit adultery, lie, kill? Was Abraham the father of faith a true prophet? Did he lie more than once? How about Jonah who went against God’s will or command, was he a true prophet? The test of a true prophet has to be found on the word of God, it is God who calls the prophets. The fruits, to the law and testimony, etc…
If you do not hold that the characters in the Bible are trustworthy than discussing Ellen White is futile.
Show me in the Bible where Ellen is mentioned.
You're comparing apples to oranges here. The wrong deeds are written aboutcand used as examples. EGW's wrong doing is denied and covered up. Huge difference.
Translation of this one is nightmere
Give me your email and I'll send you the script to make it easier on you.
@@TesttheProphet No no, - i am finishing almost; will be ready soon.
Next time I can give you a PDF if that will be easier. Thanks for what you do!
@@TesttheProphet Thank you. God Bless.
@@TesttheProphet Polish transaltion of your film part 3 is done and finished. Translating this one was purley law issues and law language so it taken longer, films is done by you very well ofcourse. Hope it will make impact on polish battlefield with adventism.
And i advice for better cooperation sharing with me messenger/whatssup/ telegram or communitators like that.
I have to ask do you still attend the Sda church or did you leave if so where to go they all seem to have
some wrong doctrines all men made churches that is. I still attend this church even if I don't believe
in the church doctrines. I know we are save by grace not by the Law our savior gave us 2 commandments
Love God and love our neighbor in this two is the law fulfilled. for me I believe the true religion is my Bible I welcome comments
I have not returned to the SDA church since COVID began. Instead I have used this time to study the church, its theology, and Ellen White (as you have seen on this channel). I would recommend finding a church that has Christ as its focus, and not the Law. While there are SDA churches that are more geared towards faith alone, the organization as a whole is still a works based religion. That is why others looking into Adventism from the outside call it a false gospel. You are still contributing to your salvation instead of accepting the free gift of Christ.
However, when you hold salvation by faith alone as the centerpiece, you quickly realize Adventism is not the "remnant church" that you must be apart of to have salvation. Any decent church will do! Find one where people love the Lord and want to be there! I decided I could not remain in a church founded on deception (EGW/Investigative Judgement). Why would anyone want to raise a family in that?
@@TesttheProphet you are absolutely correct that's exactly what I told my wife a church
founded on a false prophet.......thank you so much for reply.
@@TesttheProphet A church Founded by a false prophet 1844
True I’m of the same mind even though I know these things are not binding on me anymore I still enjoy worshiping on Saturday. But most of the time I am not getting fed by the gospel of grace when I attend SDA churches
@@thekingsson1757 Brother you couldn't Said it any Better AMEN
An amazing video idea would be examining the plagiarism of Ellen white when she is supposedly directly (in parenthesis) quoting God or an angel and even that is direct plagiarize.
God has appointed me, to send the presenter a message. Good old Enoch has misplaced your cellphone number. He asks that you kindly post it here.
The Lord also warned me, that you would doubt his humble messenger.
If you post the number (as the Lord requires) you do well... but if you fail to post it, you have only confirmed the word of the Lord. -what a sick way to instill fear -and demand obedience
I always cringe when adventists say "New light" or "Lesser light) etc.etc. Can they find truth in the words of Jesus "I am the light of the world, whoever believes in me shall never walk in darkness"?
@TesttheProphet You keep saying “a large amount of her books” are copied or plagiarized. You have demonstrated some but nothing new really that I am aware of (I am aware of very little) … so are you being fare by saying “a large amount”… I’m not defending her, because I am on the fence and have been for a while… but I don’t have to have her writings to
Come to some of the same conclusions either… most if not all of our teachings are derived and taught before us. (SDA).. I am fascinated by this topic… How do you know that the source she copied wasn’t inspired? And what do you say about that we have examples of this in the Bible, copied and borrowed literacy?
My counter questions would be "How much stealing from others is necessary for it to be wrong?" "How many times do you have to lie before it becomes wrong?" "How much money did the Bible writers make from their copying?" "Do you really think that Paul quoting some philosopher in one line of his writings is the equivalent of what EgW did?" "Was Paul ever asked if he was using the work of others and denied it?"
@@jayceejm did Ellen white deny it? Was she formally asked? If so please show me… I don’t have the answers, but what would anyone say about her not breathing for up to 30 min while in vision? This seems to
Be very compelling information and claim…
If she copied ANYTHING from someone.....then she's not inspired.
Period.
These authors who she copied from never claimed to be inspired, just like someone can write a great religious book to help people, but that doesn't mean the book is divinely inspired.
How much proof do you need?
The evidence is in the books. You're asking if the authors she copied from are inspired? What?
No they weren't and never claimed to be. The fact proof is here but you close your eyes to it....I don't know how else to help you.
@@heydanfran17 did anyone of the inspired authors of the Bible repeat or copy??? Choose your answer carefully… know before you answer… again I am not defending her, I am
Asking questions… becasue we for sure are not perfect therefore our reasoning and judgment are not perfect…
Meanwhile... Ted Wilson Announces GC Plans to Distribute 1 Billion Copies of “The Great Controversy”.
atoday.org/ted-wilson-announces-gc-plans-to-distribute-1-billion-copies-of-the-great-controversy/
greatcontroversyproject.org/
The WATERED DOWN VERSION🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 Adventism is the fraud that keeps on fraud frauding. They cannot even distribute the original copy published by Ellen White🤭
The link has Ted Wilson stating there will be 1 billion copies of the The Great Controversary distributed in 2023 and 2024 "IN PREPARATION FOR JESUS' RETURN". The SDA's are at it again! Jesus is apparently returning some time AFTER this mass distribution. Who's to say Jesus can't come before it?!! Why is Ted so sure that Jesus won't return before this distribution?
@@LoCoWi : I think people should just ignore Ted Wilson and these delusional Adventists. Jesus Christ will come again as the Bible tells us but we do not know the time and we should NOT date set.
Ted Wilson is just doing what his job demands which is to keep these gullible Adventists on their feet, so they will continue the tithes and offerings flowing to the GC.
This is what makes Adventism a diabolical fraud. Of course Jesus Christ will not come before he has handed out these billion watered down copies of the Great controversy which also itself is a great controversy 🤣🤣🤣🤣
If only there was a way to find out where these distributions will occur? If they were to occur in my area, I would simply follow the Adventists around and pick up every GC and save it for kindling to start fires.
@@AcademyApologia : I love your sense of humor sir🤣
Go back and read the early church fathers, these are the men who knew the apostles and the earliest disciples. Read what they believed and how they worshiped.
Ellen's son said his Mother had basically a photogenic mind and could call almost everything she read. in detail. Under inspiration of the HS the would use phrases that other authors used and looked like she copied them when in reality she used these phrases because they said what the HS said. that is not plagiarism, that's inspiration. She did not quote parts other authors wrote that were clearly not Biblical.
Another test of a prophet is the fruit of her writings. The SDA Church is the only "Blue Zone in NA. according to DanButtner of National Geographic. It's the healthy life style some SDAs have chosen because of her wring on health. She was fully 50 years ahead of her time. The only reason SDAs are the only "Blue Zone in NA is because they headed her counsel on heath. It is the only reason Advenist hold the "Blue Zone title in North America. Praise the Lord! I am 82 have no aches or pains and still put in a 15 hour a day labor- because of her writing on health. Blessings Pastor Terry McComb
// "Ellen's son said his Mother had basically a photogenic mind and could call almost everything she read. in detail. Under inspiration of the HS the would use phrases that other authors used and looked like she copied them when in reality she used these phrases because they said what the HS said. that is not plagiarism, that's inspiration."
Hi Pastor Terry. So the difference is we take her word that she was divinely inspired? That's it? This is not a convincing argument to me. Not to mention this was written after her death by Willie as a defense.
As to the Blue Zone's--correct me if I am wrong as it has been a minute, but many of the other Blue Zones did not conform to Ellen's health message; for example they ate unprocessed meat and drank wine. Ellen wrote at length about the animal passions that would arise from eating meat and the subsequent decrease in vital force. Thus, the fact that these other blue zones live as long as Loma Linda residents, even though they have increased animal passions and decreased vital force, does not seem to be consistent to Ellen's message and your position on longevity. I disagree, she was not 50 years ahead of her time, she was a product of her time as the health reformers also wrote the same things!
I am happy to hear you have been healthy but your story is anecdotal and I have seen many 80 year-olds who do not follow Ellen's health message that feel great as well (anecdotal as well). There are many things that affect longevity. I wish you a long life and happiness.
I was a member of this church for 32 years in three different churches. I've seen "the fruit" and it's THE main reason I left. It's sad that you were not able to speak to the renewed hearts or evidence the people who have been conformed into the image of His Son.
If the best you can find is the "Blue Zone" argument then you are a people in great need of the Saviour.
"In some cases where a historian has so grouped together events as to afford, in brief, a comprehensive view of the subject, or has summarized details in a convenient manner, his words have been quoted; but in some instances no specific credit has been given, since the quotations are not given for the purpose of citing that writer as authority, but because his statement affords a ready and forcible presentation of the subject. In narrating the experience and views of those carrying forward the work of reform in our own time, similar use has been made of their published works" (The Great Controversy, p. xii).
She admitted to using other people's writings and even noted that she didn't give specific credit, because the writers were not being used as authorities on the matter. I will admit I don't know the details from a legal perspective, only what I have heard, which is that she didn't break the laws of her time. But from what she wrote in the statement above, I see no moral issue. In the Bible we often see writers quoting from other writers without giving reference.
"In some cases where a historian has so grouped together events as to afford, in brief, a comprehensive view of the subject, or has summarized details in a convenient manner, his words have been quoted; but except in a few instances no specific credit has been given, since they are not quoted for the purpose of citing that writer as authority, but because his statement affords a ready and forcible presentation of the subject. In narrating the experience and views of those carrying forward the work of reform in our own time, similar use has occasionally been made of their published works." ( The Great Controversy 1888, p. h ).
The first quotation was from the 1911 version, which differs from that of the 1888 version. In the 1888 version she said "but except in a few instances no specific credit has been given" but, after putting in many citations in the 1911 update, it reads "but in some instances no specific credit has been given". This may have been that the times were changing over the 23 years in between, leading to a desire to give more citations. But note that she wasn't trying to dupe anyone, because the statement was in the author's preface of the 1888 version as well. So it isn't like she got caught and decided to do the updated in 1911, because it was an admitted practice in the 1888 version.
Andrew, did you watch the video? Guess not...
Plagerism existed in the 1700s it was a crime in her time. The moral issue is she said the words were "not one from a mere human but directly from the Holy Spirit. The moral issue is whether it was legal or not, she ONLY corrected the theft in 1888 when camwright called or on it. That was after the 87 edition of Contraversy, then they fixed it up some more in 1911 because they got sued, yet SHE STILL CONTINUED TO USE OTHERS WORDS AND NOT QUOTE THEM AFTER SHE KNEW IT WAS WRONG watch all the videos then go to academyapologia and read The White Lie" by Walter Rae and CL Camwright book!!!
@@incidentalauditor great points. It’s Dudley Canright. He was personally recruited by James White as a young man. He was personal friends with James and Ellen White until he spoke out and then they hammered him
Rationalization is not honesty. Here’s Walter Rea who was a hardcore pioneer historic Adventist pastor so into Ellen White he wanted to read what she read. That’s when he discovered she stole material. “ I wish once the church would provide evidence Ellen White gave credit to a writer she quotes.” Doesn’t matter if she didn’t break a civil law; she broke the law of God- thou shall not steal. Copyright law existed when Ellen stole from others. Her two secretaries were so filled with guilt one starved herself to death and the other became mad, crazed. There is no defense for Ellen. Adventists are dishonest.
This is objective proof of devious management practices by lousy SDA administrators. A bran new Church is required, with a grass root organisation, not abused by false theologians.
So far all you doing is talking about her copying from others but you haven't proof anything whether she's a true Prophet or not.
You asked and I shall deliver:
At a conference in Battle Creek in 1856 she gave a "vision" where she said some of these at this conference would be translated to heaven. Spoiler alert, none were translated to heaven:
“But we were yet to pass through another severe trial. At the conference a very solemn vision was given me. I saw that some of those present would be food for worms, some subjects for the seven last plagues, and some would be translated to heaven at the second coming of Christ, without seeing death.”
White, Ellen. Spiritual Gifts. Vol. 2. Ellen G. White Estate, Inc., 1860/2011, p. 209
Matthew 7:15-20 "Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves. (16) You will recognize them by their fruits. Are grapes gathered from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? (17) So, every healthy tree bears good fruit, but the diseased tree bears bad fruit. (18) A healthy tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a diseased tree bear good fruit. (19) Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. (20) Thus you will recognize them by their fruits.
To add to that...
"The hour will come; it is not far distant, and some of us who now believe will be alive upon the earth, and shall see the prediction verified, and hear the voice of the archangel and the trump of God echo from mountain and plain and sea to the uttermost parts of the earth." - Ellen White, Advent Review and Herald 7/31/1888
adventistdigitallibrary.org/islandora/object/adl:350407/datastream/PDF/view (page 482 middle left)
All of those people are dead. As the last-day prophet you would think she would be able to get one thing correct -- the second coming.
17:00
ugh
Check her claims with GODs words. Thats all what is needed. Thats the reason why the SDA tell their people that GODs word is not literally GODs word. They told our Lord Jesus is the Archangel Michael for decades and later skipped it. And they all will probably take the mark of the beast in the endtimes which is not the Sunday law.
When we are dealing with the issue of one being a prophet of God, is to determine from the scriptures if what the person writes or speaks, is supproted by the Word of God, the Bible.
Example: Acts 17:10-12. The Bereans heard Paul preached , they took note if what he said and when and searched the scriptures to see if his sayings were supported by the scriptures. That's how we can prove if one is a prophet of God. Of course, there are other ways.
Many of the New Testament writers copied from authors of the Old Testament without giving credit.
All it does is show the validity of the fact being shared by multiple people.
Nothing to see here folks but a good specimen of a well-programmed, finely-tuned, indoctrinated member of a cult.
Wrong.....they did "copied" more so quoted other OT authors because those authors were well known to the readers and the reader would know who they were referring too.
This is so not the same as copying the work of a author 30 years before you thinking and pretending you saw it in a vision, trying to deceive people
18 minutes in and the point is made, this really is too long of a vid to simply prove that heretic plagiarized authors. And with all that research you should have known that you could use portions of that attorneys document in a documentary or for educational purposes.
Human Thoughts or Divine Truths?
This is the name of an article from Ministry Magazine (a journal for Pastors). I'll share a quote or two below:
The questions of inspiration, infallibility, and authority must be addressed in the light of known literary borrowing. Space permits us to deal with these three areas only as they relate to Ellen White's use of sources. Following are some of the conclusions that are beginning to come into focus: (1) Inspiration is not be equated with originality, (2) Inspiration does not involve the dictation of divinely chosen words, (3) Inspiration is not diminished by the use of uninspired sources, (4) Inspiration is affected by outside human influences, (5) Inspiration goes beyond what has been presented in vision, and sometimes stands independent of visions, (6) Inspiration provides the narrative for those portions of visions that were symbolic or that lacked a narrative, (7) Inspiration must include divine guidance in the selection of sources.
Ellen White's authority does not reside within herself; it is not centered in a mere person. It is a derived authority. It is God-given and Bible-centered. Her authority, while less than that of Scripture, is higher than each of us as individuals. God has given her special insights into spiritual things, insights that we do not possess or that we possess only faintly. To reject her authority is to substitute our wisdom for a wisdom higher than ours.
On the other hand, to exalt her writings above Scripture is actually to weaken her authority instead of strengthening it, because this in effect nullifies what she herself has written-that her work is not to supersede the Bible.
Her proper relationship with Scripture has been most aptly described in these words: "Little heed is given to the Bible, and the Lord has given a lesser light to lead men and women to the greater light."- Colporteur Ministry, p. 125.
I see you have found an article written to Adventist pastors by the legal counsel of the Adventist Church - Warren Johns. Fun fact, this is the same person who hired Ramik to write his report.
“God has given her special insights into spiritual things, insights that we do not possess or that we possess only faintly.”
---You mean the special insights she took from other authors but claimed to be from God? What about things seen in vision from other books?
“To reject her authority is to substitute our wisdom for a wisdom higher than ours.”
--Yeah. I’m still waiting for you to tell me specifically, what evidence from the Bible have you found that separates Ellen White from another author writing about Christ? Otherwise, I see no reason to subject to her authority when evidence points otherwise.
Frazier, no one is buying these arguments you write.
@@TesttheProphet
I posted the article for the point he makes regarding inspiration (divine inspiration). This is critical to your claim regarding plagiarism. Secondly, one of the 7 points that's listed addresses the plagiarism charge making. If you skipped over those 7 points, I do hope you go back to them for review. Third, I answered your question already my evidence is my faith in what the Bible teaches regarding the gift of prophecy/Spirit of Prophecy.
1. If Warren Johns believes those 7 points, why did he commission Vincent Ramik to argue she did not commit plagiarism? If it's not an issue why pay the legal fees?
2. Why did the General Conference commission the Veltman Report if plagiarism is not an issue? Why pay Veltman for 8 years using conference money to investigate her plagiarism if it is not an issue?
3. If I recall, when I asked you "What evidence from the Bible have you found that separates Ellen White from another author writing about Christ?" you replied it was based on two chapters in the fundamental beliefs book. Based on these two chapters you are convinced EGW was a true prophet. What I am asking for is a specific reason/bible verse out of those chapters. I am not going to spend time reading those two chapters on top of everything else going on. I've read them in the past.
@@TesttheProphet
1 and 2: (Personally) The article and others acknowledge the claim of plagiarism against her and are giving a response to it. I don't believe, however, that its "not an issue." I believe they (the General Conference, etc.) readily acknowledge the claim of plagiarism against EGW (which is an issue) and have worked to address the claim and debunk it. I personally believe the point regarding divine inspiration is a critical piece against your claim of plagiarism against her. That's my two cents. Someone else may be better able to answer what you've asked. What matters to me the most is those 7 points and what them mean when it comes to EGW. I don't believe you're dismissing those 7 points, but, I'll be honest and say that I didn't expect you to ask the 2 questions you mentioned.
3. The content as well as the proper interpretation of those scriptures is what I believe in as it relates to the fundamental beliefs. If you disagree with scripture and what it says about the gift of prophecy/Spirit of Prophecy, then, I'm not sure what else I can say when it comes to answering why I believe what I believe regarding EGW.
whiteestate.org/legacy/issues-faq-egw-html/#faq-section-b4
The White Estate makes the case that she admitted she used other’s writings (implying it would be wrong not to). They make the case she did not plagiarize by listing the Ramik Report (implying it would be wrong if she plagiarized). Nichol has several chapters in his book attempting to defend EGW against plagiarism, even saying the extensive copying from Sketches from the Life of Paul was justifiable because she recommended a book at one point that she took from without quoting (this also implies that if she does not recommend a book she plagiarizes that this would be wrong). I have several Adventist documents from the 1800s that callout plagiarism and call it a sin at the same time EGW was plagiarizing! This is why I do not care what Warren Johns opinion is. As I demonstrated in this video the trustees have been trying to show that she was not a copyist all the way since the 1860s. However, now that it cannot be denied anymore they are now switching their game up and saying … well we know she copied, but now we can make it sound as though it is perfectly justified by the Bible and wind up back with a respectable prophet!
Just because the Bible mentions the gift of prophecy and then Ellen White comes along and claims to hold this gift, does not automatically mean she is a true prophet. Any Christian author can write about Christ and affect large change in the world (bear fruit). I want to see something that cannot be from a mere Christian author. You show me that and you have a case. But what I see is a woman who has formed an empire from other authors and has lied about it. The Bible has strong words to say about those who claim false visions.
I’m going to take a break from commenting to focus on part 4. Have a good day.
Who is the presenter, please?
All I can say, is that by reading EGW I have come to love, understand and respect the Bible more, I have come to love Jesus as my friend and personal saviour more and see Him more clearly in His word. I have become a better husband, a better father and better person.
I have been called to acknowledge my sins and come humbly before Jesus whom I have offended to confess and receive forgiveness and power to overcome.
I have come to understand what the Bible says in regard to what God expects of me.
As far I can tell, her messages magnify and agree with the Holy Scriptures, draw me closer to Jesus and keep me keenly aware of my true condition (a sinner needing daily supplies of Grace).
It is undeniable that she used material from other authors, it is undeniable that she did not acknowledge them, however that for me is not sufficient evidence to reject what she wrote as uninspired. (if God is the giver of every good gift then all material that leads to Him comes from Him. James 1:17)
The moment I am shown that what she wrote is against scripture then I will reject her.
I do not think of her as superior human being, I do not think of her as a perfect human being. when I review the overall picture of her life, I see a person who lived and sacrificed to serve God and her fellow human beings.
If anyone wishes to be fair then I would invite that person to read her books and compared them to the tenor of the Holy Scriptures and she if there is a contradiction.
If you are looking for faults, you will always find them. Many people find faults with the Bible as well.
But if you are sincerely looking for God’s will for your life and to do His will, the Holy Spirit will guide you and show it to you. (John 7:17,18)
(1) Does plagiarism = false prophet?
(2) If so, then, how did the SDA church miss this?
(3) What is God's role in this?
(4) What are the rules of plagiarism regarding writings of the same topic?
(1) plagiarism=theft (thou shall not steal). This makes EGW a true thief and a commandment breaker. She has truely convinced her followers like yourself she is innocent of anything wrong.
(2&3) SDA church CHOOSES to close their eyes to the errors of EGW, so God leaves them in they're deluded state. Only through the grace of God and His mercy, He will draw some from SDAism, some but not all.
Why did God allow SDAism to rise in the 1800's? Well, He also allowed the Mormons and JW's to form and grow too. God has freely given us His Word to rely for all truth and those who know it will be able to see the false docrtines of these like-minded counterfeit "churches".
The practical application for you Mr. Woods, is to listen to the warning given to you by christians to leave SDAism.
(4) watch the video again by Test the Prophet, or wait for up coming video's.
@@LoCoWi
You didn't answer whether plagiarism equals being a false prophet. You simply told me what plagiarism is essentially. (2&3). I'm confused. The foundation of EGW as a true prophet is that God appointed her. Right? So, they're connected. You're saying God is not at fault here but "left" the SDA to themselves. I disagree, but ok.
The practical application for me is (1) wait until the video about the biblical test of a true prophet to be presented. This will answer all claims regarding plagiarism and its relevance, (2) think critically with what's being presented. These were general questions and I do plan to watch the video in it entirety (I did skim some of the most important point, the definitions and the examples, etc.), (3) continue to review what the Bible says and align it with the conclusions of objectors....right now, there's not enough evidence for me to "leave" Adventism.
@@frazierwoods9912
Exactly what I mean by "God leaves SDA's in their delusion". I point out what plagiarism is and related it to EGW, and you glaze over it without any concern for yourself, and EGW is still innocent of theft. That is called delusion.
You said "The foundation of EGW as a true prophet is that God appointed her."
Are you calling EGW a prophet? I thought SDA's don't go that far to label her a "prophet" but as a messenger of the Lord, as EGW never stated that she was a prophet. Are you the new Spirit of Prophercy for the SDA chur.....organisation Mr. Woods, that can exercise the authority over 170+ years SDA teaching?
Seriously, where in scripture, book, chapter and verse, does God mention He appointed EGW as a true prophet?
I have a question for you after this topic is done and dusted.
@@LoCoWi I didn't glaze over anything-you didn't answer the question. I didn't ask if she broke a commandment. I didn't ask if she was a thief. I asked if her plagiarism made her a false prophet. You didn't give a direct answer to that.
(2) I believe her to be a prophet. Prophet/messenger of the Lord are both used regarding SDA and EGW. She herself never claimed to be a prophet (as you outlined). When it comes to the test of a prophet of God, I believe EGW meets those requirements based on scripture. No, I'm not the new anything. I just point to the Bible for what I believe.
(3) The book, chapter, verse question is something that I understand but its not set up like that. The short answer is found in the SDA fundamental belief #18. It'll give you some background and a number of scriptures for study. You can start there in your study and research other similar info. for support.
(4) For any questions, hit me here or fjwoodsjr@gmail.com at any time.
I cannot tell if Frazier keeps changing his mind or if he's simply trolling at this point. He already admitted in part 2 "I'd personally be uncomfortable if 60% or more of her writings were stolen (hypothetically speaking)." So, he clearly admits that plagiarism is a problem for someone claiming to be a prophet -- but then he continues to post that plagiarism is not an issue. The bar for entry to prophet-hood is continually lowered by Ellen apologists so that almost anyone can claim to be a prophet. Lie about your source of information? -- no problem. Have false prophecies? -- no problem, don't you know all of her failed prophecies were conditional (though never mentioned as such)! Personally, I believe a true prophet will only fulfill the tests of a true prophet, while a false prophet can fulfill some of both. Otherwise, Jesus would not warn us about a wolf in sheep's clothing. We should be looking for the wolf tail, not the sheep's wool.
Frazier will likely reply to this comment with his typical "LOL!!!" or "smh".
I think I'll spend my time better elsewhere than argue in circles with someone who is inconsistent.
According to Ellen White the selections of accompanying essays in her book How to live, we’re not intended to compliment and acknowledge the scholarship of other health reformers but to show how similar Ellen White’s views were to the most enlightened medical opinion of her day.
WHAT SORT OF PROPHET DOES THIS?🤣😳
Ellen White in her typical serpentine fashion is validating her corpus of literary larceny by the opinion of medical practitioners of her day. I thought God should be the authenticated of his own message?
It is clear that Ellen White was a FRAUD among frauds as much of the health reform principles banded about by maverick practitioners were indeed contrary to reason and science.
Ellen White was NOT an honest woman.
AND same for the leadership of the SDAC from 1863 till today.
Have you left Adventism? Congregate elsewhere?
Because she included such selections from other authors in her writings, critics have charged Ellen White with plagiarism. But the mere use of another's language does not constitute literary theft, as noted by Attorney Vincent L. Ramik, a specialist in patent, trademark, and copyright cases. After researching about 1,000 copyright cases in American legal history, Ramik issued a 27-page legal opinion in which he concluded "Ellen White was not a plagiarist, and her works did not constitute copyright infringement/piracy." Ramik points out several factors that critics of Ellen White's writings have failed to take into account when accusing her of literary theft or deceit. 1) Her selections "stayed well within the legal boundaries of 'fair use.'" 2) "Ellen White used the writings of others; but in the way she used them, she made them uniquely her own"--adapting the selections into her own literary framework. 3) Ellen White urged her readers to get copies of some of the very books she made use of--demonstrating that she did not attempt to conceal the fact of her use of literary sources, and that she had no intention to defraud or supersede the works of any other author.
She plagiarized Paul and many others while False Apostle Paul plagiarized Plato.
How was Paul a false apostle?
I feel sorry for you.
I had to take a screenshot of this comment. She has decided to throw the Apostle Paul under a non-existent bus in order to keep believing in "her prophetess". Best evidence of the problem I've ever encountered. Thank you ma'am.
Yes, You are being very repetitive....and you are a lawyer, apparently.