True, but it appears they only provided a few basics and she actually did pick up on the other things. Either way, when looking for insights, then they cannot dismiss the information garnered for any little statement may lead to even more insights.
This case is solvable. There are people in positions of authority keeping it from happening. The psychic hit on many good points. The most important is when she said Thomas,Tom. And No! its not Tim. There is a Thomas or Tom who knows what happened to Maura. Psychic Lady heard it correctly. Thomas...Tom. This person may be in a position of authority or was. Jobs are being protected if not freedoms.
If I were hosting this show, I would require that any psychic who wanted to be a guest would have to provide the GPS coordinates of where Maura is--no less, no more.
The most simple and logical explanation is the Maura was murdered by a local. Looking at a map of the area, there are numerous houses scattered amongst the woods. Very easy to pick her up in a car and take her somewhere else. It probably didn't start out as threatening, it was likely a pick up by someone who recognised a possibly drunk but certainly vulnerable young woman. Perhaps later she struggled and too much force was used resulting, sadly, in death. Its a very common scenario. How easy to then bury.dump the body - all trace gone by spring thaw. The police really need to start again and do some very thorough investigating of everyone who was living within a 5-10 mile radius of the area - especially those who a) had need to regularly use the road and b) had/have access to remote buildings.
I am part of Lori Bruno's shamanic family, and i come from a long line of psychics. I may be able to help.....I know nothing about this case. Contact me i only read the comments on here, and seeing those putting down Lori who was tryin to help frustrates me.
I have always been intrigued by Maura’s case. It’s so baffling. I listen to every interview, podcast, etc… on this case and I am 10 episodes into this podcast so far. I must say BRAVO!! 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻 You guys are doing a great job of dissecting details and I never get tired of hearing anyones theories. I love it! Keep up the good work!
As I was listening to Lori Bruno, she said that she was near a pond. There's a pond very close to where the crash was on 112. If you zoom out it's kind of back behind the Weathered Barn. Does anyone know if the police checked here for anything?
Its named 'French Pond'...some investigators used sonar to search the bottom oif the pond and found an Anmoly about 3ft wide by 5ft long. They marked the location on GPS. The investigators left with the intention of returning with divers to actually see what the Anomoly was. Trouble is..immediately after the investigators left. Local Fish&Game dredged the bottom of the pond The imvestigators returned and used the GPS to find the anomoly..well,The anomoly is now gone
Although personally I have pretty much zero belief in psychics I've got the utmost respect for you guys in terms of not dismissing any avenue of exploration and putting yourselves out there for the inevitable criticism that consulting a psychic will bring.I randomly stumbled across this case yesterday and,as I've seen many others say,there's something about it that grabs you and does not let go! I sincerely hope that one day resolution will be found.In the meantime props to you both for the work that you're putting in!
I wish you showed the video clip of the entire interview. I think she was right on with Maura having a strong love for her sister Kathleen. Kathleen wasn't as "perfect" as Julie and Fred jr. Maybe she didn't feel judged by Kathleen considering Kathleen seems to make many mistakes herself.
Hi guys, I absolutely love your efforts in solving this case. I am touched and wish to help. I personally speak to the dead. It's not something I speak about hardly ever. I am not fond of labels, you see. Therefore I never publicize the fact. However, since the early days of this case I have had visions of Maura being picked up by someone and unfortunately dying the same night. Mrs Bruno is correct in saying she isn't living, but not really dead. Maura wanted to disappear, but she didn't want to die. She feels she can't leave this world of ours because of all the hurt she left behind. She is holding on to her guilt, wanting to fix all those things she felt she "messed" up before her death. She wants closure but is lost in her sorrow. Her guilt is overwhelming! I hope you will use this info for what I intended it for. I just feel like this needed to be touched on. Keep up the great work, and know your fans are anxiously awaiting the movie release. Thanks for your time and I pray something breaks in this case. Maura deserves to rest peacefully, as we all do.
I also have an ability, I'm not psychic, or about to speak to the dead, but I am a sensitive. and I'm able to receive info from spirits, and pick up on energy. Maura was a very damaged soul. she had good intentions, but lived a lie. she put an act on everyday, and pretended to be happy. she pretended to like to do the activities she was involved in, like running. but I believe she didn't really have a passion for it. I believe Maura thought of herself as a very caring, compassionate, great person, and wanted others to think the same. but she had many struggles within herself. I believe she ran to cover up her possible eating disorder, and that running/working out just became habit of everyday life. possibly an addiction in a sense.. and I do believe she struggled with drinking and possibly some other stimulant"s". I believe she was with Billy to convince herself and others she was worth having.. I could say so much more but this would be a mile long!! I'm sure most can catch what I'm throwing! I think Maura was very depressed and just wanted to get away for a week and collect her thoughts and figure out what she really wanted to do with her life. and I think someone harmed her. I do think there's more that her friends are not saying that could shed light or give more clues to Maura's state of mind that night.. specifically Kate. *I also kinda think Maura was going up to meet someone up there, and that's possibly why the friends won't talk about it cuz they don't want that person to be considered a suspect, as they "the friends" don't believe they "whoever Maura was meeting" were involved..*
You may have given her nothing before you went into the meeting, but you gave her TONS of info throughout the convo. This was fun, but she's not credible.
Refusing your "blood money" is a great way to get publicity on your platform. She didn't pay for advertising, you didn't pay her for 'services', even Steven.
The psychic kept saying she got a feeling of Maura being "alive and dead" at the same time. Maybe Maura's PHYSICALLY alive, but mentally and emotionally dead due to being in captivity for such a long period of time.
And maybe she's really Schrödinger's cat. Just when if thought this show couldn't sink lower than having hours of Renner's patting his own ego, here's this episode with...psychics. ::facepalm:: As a sceptic, I'm kissing this episode good-bye. If it keeps up with Renner and more psychics, I'll just forget the whole podcast. It's amazing how people wonder why the Murray family is 'apathetic', when they don't appreciate how gruesome, pointless, and irrelevant stuff like talking with psychics and Renner is. If it were my sister or child, this crap would make me feel like giving up. Apathy, my ass.
alive and dead at the same time because her old self that lived in America is mentally and emotionally physically dead because she probably now lives in Canada under a new identity
If you’re psychic why do you have to know what you said before to work on it now? It sounds like she’s worried she’ll say something contradictory… but if she’s psychic shouldn’t she just be able to tap in and it would be consistent?
The psychic lady who declined to be on your podcast because she had little memory of the previous reading, I don't trust her. As my Papa always told me "if you tell the truth you'll never have to remember what you said". Seems like she is worried about saying something that contradicts her previous reading 🤔
It absolutely breaks my heart that psychics get involved in cases like this. As other viewers/listeners noted, Lori was given a lot of information. The generalizations that she came up with are ones that you or I could have conjured up. Her "reading" only gives false hope to those searching for Maura.
I agree. I was just looking at some old footage of Sylvia brown on The Montel Williams Show many years ago. She told Amanda berry's mom, that Amanda was dead. She also told a woman, whose fiance was killed in 911,( he was a fireman)...that he had drowned somewhere! Even the gf knew he had burnt up. She was wanting to know, if any of his remains could be found! She corrected SB right quick! But, SB tried to cover it up with even more of her bs!These psychics literally prey on the most vulnerable of ppl.
alice smith was Amanda Berry not dead? I'm not familiar with that case. I believe there are genuine psychics, but also know there are plenty of fakes. I haven't listened to this podcast yet, I came to the comments first. I believe aldin killed Maura, I have a specific reason for that belief.
if she disappeared in Canada with her tandem friend .. who is it? Where is he? Is he missing too? Any police reports for anyone in MA missing around the same time Would Maura do this to her mom? Her dad? Would she torment her family all these years ? If she staged her own disappearance? Yes, she had a lot of problems., which she brought them on herself . But She did homework, she only took clothes for few days. She wasn’t pregnant. She has birth control pills with her , few was gone Her mom died on her birthday .. how ironic !
Why not let the psychic speak? If she is a true psychic, she shouldn't need pr be asking for so much information. One guy even mentioned the theory of her being picked up by a passenger because dogs left her scent as she was flee8ng the scene. This was a horrible psychic meeting!
I do agree somewhat, but not about the psychic being terrible. I do, however, think that they should have had some two or three available from different skill strengths. Give them some basic alleged facts and just sit back and be prepared to run batteries down on equipment and get writer's cramp from note taking because it will be nothing short of amazing. If they had done something like this more immediately, then they might have found her or at least have solved the case. Of that I am very certain. If several female psychics then if there were several males, they would not stand a chance and it is irregardless of attraction in any typical sense. ;)
Interesting, but this is very typical for psychics. She does things like ask questions and then later repeats your answer as if she's somehow came up with it out of nowhere. "she's near a body of water" is an easy one because basically everywhere is near a body of water. Not to mention the fact she is a psychic based in Massachusetts, there is no way she's never heard of this case.
This so-called psychic played herself. She said she led police to the body of Nikki Evangelous in Clinton, Mass. This Parole Board review for her killer states otherwise: www.mass.gov/eopss/docs/pb/lifer-decisions/2012/piercebrian9-28-12.pdf Read the top of the 2nd page: A MALE INFORMANT wearing a wire helped the police by getting him to admit that he wacked her. Old pathological liar trick: Pick an old or obscure event that you think is hard to research because no one will be able to call BS on you.
Isn't it weird two of the psychics used the name Ben unless Lori has seen brians prediction I'm definitely liking this episode would love to see more like this its one of the most interesting episodes yet
+Courtney Armstrong It is weird. And it actually slipped past Lance and I until we saw on Twitter that someone mentioned that. We went back through the episode to confirm it for ourselves. Very strange. We are going to try and follow these leads.
+Missing Maura Murray I can't remember where I saw a post that Maura had a new boyfriend. It may have been on Renner's blog. Someone said she had a new boyfriend and she ran away with him. Has anyone looked to see if there was "Ben" in any of her circle of friends? Maybe Ben is the new boyfriend. Has anyone checked to see if a Ben from that area has gone missing?
+Courtney Armstrong I'd much rather the episodes concentrate of facts. I don't feel this episode is helpful nor does it advance the investigation. As for the predictions - Ben is a common enough name and there are lots of lakes/ponds in the area as a result the so called predictions sound plausible enough to be true. These people work on a percentage game - they do not have special super sensory "gifts" - even if they convinced themselves (and others) that they have.
I think you should've played your cards a little closer to your chest, so to speak, with this psychic. Not reacted as much, let her form her own hypothesis from her perceived "abilities". Entertaining but not really all that believable because of how much information you gave her willingly
It just makes me think of the beginning on the movie "Ghost" where Whoopi Goldberg would feed off in info given to her..... Of course it ended differently. I DO think this woman was fed way too much info.....
I agree that this could have been better. Find a few good ones that are noted for their abilities and have those help choose a few more from impartial sources. Then there will be some action on this case.
Guys, I sincerely hope you're not discouraged by the viewers who dislike this episode. I can't applaud your bravery enough! In any investigation, you're gonna dig through lots of piles of bulls**t before you find gold. Great job! The episodes like this, in my opinion, prove your podcast to be very well rounded. You're touching every base before you run home. Well done, guys! On another note, have you ever wondered why, if Fred wants access to the police investigation so badly, he doesn't declare Maura deceased...? In theory, this would grant him access to the police report he claims to so desperately want to see. I might be wrong, but I believe his access is denied because the case is still "open". A death certificate would, again in theory, "close" it. Just a thought...
A death certificate will not “open” an ongoing criminal investigation. The death certificate would only theoretically open a case if it was a voluntary disappearance/starting a new life and then she was actually deceased after doing so, which is astronomically unlikely.
A death certificate will not “open” an ongoing criminal investigation. The death certificate would only theoretically open case materials to the public if it was a voluntary disappearance/starting a new life and then she was actually deceased after doing so, which is astronomically unlikely.
Since you guys are covering all angles, even the paranormal ones, it might be worth it to look into the Missing 411 series by David Paulides. They cover a range of mysterious disappearances in National Forests/Parks, which, as Maura was relatively close to a National Forest, as her father's letters indicate, may hold some interest to you guys. Just a thought, but otherwise, keep up the good work guys! Much love from Bonnie Old Scotland!
+Liam Currie Great point Liam. I'm very familiar with his work. I actually reached out to him to appear on the show and haven't heard back from him yet.
+Liam Currie Let's just go ahead and let everyone know that David Paulides believes that the missing people in his Missing 411 series were abducted by Bigfoot, OK? In my opinion, there are already enough unknown factors in this case and the producers have veered far enough down the Road of Ridiculous with the psychic angle as it is. I'm sure that my past criticism of their Renner episodes and now the psychic one has not earned me any love from the MMM team. But if you want to get rid of me forever, then go ahead and interview Paulides, yeah.
I follow Paulides work as well....and he doesn't come out and say Bigfoot and WONT, even if he implies it. And agreed that he wouldn't be interested in this.... He also studies "clusters".... Not individual cases.
+Curt Rowlett You have more in common with that psychic than you know. She is covered in trinkets including a pentagram around her neck, while your avatar is filled with Satanic symbols, the lightning bolt, and skull and bones.
It’s a bronco. Very wide back. Butch Atwood had one. Barb Atwood says it in a recent interview. She was also a really big woman. She called 911 according to her. Even though in the story everyone says bitch did.
Ill give you guys credit because at least you're willing to cover every area now that being said. I think physcics are full of crap i don't believe in any of it. They all do the same thing come up with random names well if uou actually knew them you would tell us. They all do the dame exact thing..
"I feel cold" right after they say it's February in New Hampshire. They were telling her everything about the case and she was more or less just repeating what they were saying but rewording it.
I'm sorry but I was thoroughly unimpressed by this psychic. You had to feed her way too much information. And WTF is it with psychics (in general) and throwing out names? Come up with actual useful information. Anyone can throw out a name that in some way or another can mean something that relates to the case. If spiritual voices are audibly talking to her - TELL her something effing useful.
+Theo Volz Psychics are a joke. James Randi (look him up) has a standing offer of one million dollars to any psychic who can prove they can actually do what they claim. How many takers in the past 20 years...NONE.
+Pasic TP I assume you mean "owe"? If psychics are going to charge people money - and let's face it most of them use their abilities to make a living, then yes: they damn well should be accurate.
You're feeding the psychic all the info. Only thing she came up with a dark SUV maybe black or blue or gray. I could've guessed better than she did. Lol you tell her they searched the house then she tells you she's not in the house. Well duh.
This is the theory I've had all along. I think she got into the stranger's vehicle having no other option being in such a dark, cold desolate area. I wonder who this Ben character is. I hope she receives more information from Maura.
I am 100% skeptical toward psychics and the like, but there is no point in being angry about this episode. If we're following a podcast about a complex case, it's good to hear every angle and aspect. I want to hear everything, given that Fred sought the help of a psychic. If that hadn't happened, then I understand and agree with why an episode about psychics would be useless. Regardless, if you only want to know the basic details of the case, read the Wikipedia page or watch the Disappeared episode instead.
Giordano Bruno is what is known today as a syncretist. He believed and brilliantly illustrated how all world religions had a common ancient root based in an understanding of natural sciences and astrology that became lost or clouded in symbolism that was no longer understood by the average man. He followed in the footsteps of the Neo-platonists, was deemed a heretic by the Roman church and executed as such for exposing this knowledge. Some may even call him a gnostic. Today I would recommend someone like Santos Bonacci if you're interested in the topic as he draws directly from Bruno's material and blends it with other syncretist works new and ancient. Interesting stuff for sure and right here on RUclips.
How? I've seen no evidence of a cover up just a girl that disappeared with evidence supporting the fact that she was trying to get away and told no one.
I found this very chilling, because I've been seeing a maroon Ford Explorer* as a vehicle of interest. *not sure of model, but definitely a Ford SUV, pre-2002...
I look forward to these episodes, they are so interesting. The more I listen to them the more I want Maura to be alive. To know that she masterminded her disappearance and somehow lived her life the way she always wanted to these last eleven years. Personally, I don't put much stock in psychic abilities. It sounded like the psychic featured on this episode was questionable. She asked a lot of leading questions like, "whose Thomas?" Then one of you said "oh, Tim..." Then she just agreed with you. It felt like you were feeding her answers (not intentionally) and she wasn't really intuiting a lot on her own. I still really enjoyed the podcast and thought it was an interesting avenue to go down. I wouldn't mind seeing a few more psychic's brains picked on here.
Sandi Bozarth I think the psychic actually has an ability. if you're not a sensitive you typically wouldn't understand. when we open ourselves allowing spirits to bring us info, we're open to everything. and sometimes we get energy that doesn't intend on being helpful, or energy that isn't directly related to what we're searching. it's just like everyone comes to you at once and are all talking at the same time. it gets hard to defer, and distinguish between what's relavent and what's not. so that's why sometimes not everything they say relates to the topic you're discussing, and also why we sometimes ask questions so we know which road to go down so to speak. hope this helps you understand! *I am not a psychic, but I am a sensitive, and I have a gift*
sometimes psychics need more info. being a psychic is hard. when they open themselves to receive info, it's the same as if you had 15 people standing in front of you all talking at once. it's hard to decipher between what's relavent and what's not. this psychic wasn't trying to prove her abilities, hence why she asked questions. and to me when a psychic is comfortable to ask questions like that that tells me she's comfortable with her ability. people that fake having an ability would be cautious about asking questions cuz they want you to believe they're really psychic.. so they'd b more paranoid about that. you know what I'm trying to say? lol I also have an ability, I'm not psychic, or about to speak to the dead, but I am a sensitive. and I'm able to receive info from spirits, and pick up on energy. Maura was a very damaged soul. she had good intentions, but lived a lie. she put an act on everyday, and pretended to be happy. she pretended to like to do the activities she was involved in, like running. but I believe she didn't really have a passion for it. I believe Maura thought of herself as a very caring, compassionate, great person, and wanted others to think the same. but she had many struggles within herself. I believe she ran to cover up her possible eating disorder, and that running/working out just became habit of everyday life. possibly an addiction in a sense.. and I do believe she struggled with drinking and possibly some other stimulant"s". I believe she was with Billy to convince herself and others she was worth having.. I could say so much more but this would be a mile long!! I'm sure most can catch what I'm throwing! I think Maura was very depressed and just wanted to get away for a week and collect her thoughts and figure out what she really wanted to do with her life. and I think someone harmed her. I do think there's more that her friends are not saying that could shed light or give more clues to Maura's state of mind that night.. specifically Kate. *I also kinda think Maura was going up to meet someone up there, and that's possibly why the friends won't talk about it cuz they don't want that person to be considered a suspect, as they "the friends" don't believe they "whoever Maura was meeting" were involved..*
Brilliant show,two of them saying Ben I got the shivers,a couple in a car&the womans saying come on we will help you,well that makes us woman feel safe, but history shows us men use these woman to lure unsuspecting woman in need.fred west was only successful because rose was so friendly&nice to the woman they picked up,said by a woman who survived there capture.look forward to the next one guys well done.
Shirley Scrimgeour If I’d been driving while drinking and had just said No Thanks to the bus driver and figured that the bus driver was going to call the police right away... then at 21 I’d be apt to jump into the next vehicle real quick.
Wow this is a new low, you guys are feeding her WAY to much BUT I really hope you investigate the cop theory mentioned early on. Not just from a psychics standpoint but from actual facts. What exactly did the cop do for 2 hours at the crime scene? Sadly in the end this episode is a huge waste of time. Focus on the facts and ask some uncomfortable questions and you will make a much better documentary.
Living and dead is also when a person does not know they're dead. In addition, I strongly suspect she was pregnant even though her friend cleared it up by saying their nursing assignment was on maternity and that is why maura had maternity searches on her computer.
I always found it strange that she would refuse help from Mr. Atwood, but then agree to take help from a passing stranger, by getting in their vehicle. But this lady brings up a good point that I missed. If there was a female in the car, she may have been more inclined to accept the ride, and things went bad from there. I never really thought about it, but it's probably what I would do too. I see a male and a female, assume their a couple, and assume everything would be alright. Could this case be as simple/evil as a couple/stranger abduction?
You state that she got into a vehicle of a passing stranger as if it were not only voluntarily but a given fact. It is not and is speculative. We don't know but that it could have been somebody she knew and was planned.
Just trying to get in her head- if I had just crashed (and had all the legal trouble she did) and Butch Atwood stopped in his bus and asked me if I needed help…… I would be scared sh*tless (no offense, Butch RIP) and say the same thing she did. I think after he pulled away she realized she had no service and was stuck so started thinking “okay, I have to get out of here before police come, he drives a school bus, he lives right down the street, he didn’t kill me just now… maybe he’s safe” and started walking up the street towards his house while he’s inside telling his wife to call police. Maybe just before getting up to his house (where the dogs tracked her scent to) someone else drove up and they looked less scary than Butch (cause don’t all the craziest ones?) so she accepted because she’d rather take a chance than get in MORE trouble and bam, she made a mistake. If those remains found at Loon Mountain are her, I think this is the likeliest scenario
@@amyashley3182 exactly it’s really obvious what happened. She was on probation and couldn’t risk a DUI. She couldn’t risk being seen by police on that road. I would of risked getting in the first ride that stopped. The only alternative is her hiding in the woods to see when the police had gone. But there were no foot prints.
"Mr.112dirtbag" his real name is Alden Howes Olson and his address is 29 Golden Ct, Hadley, MA 01035...I urge people to write to him or go see him in person and explain to him why it is wrong to make sadistic videos mocking the Murray family's pain..."
I just listened to Erinn's interview with Fred ( posted on 22.Dec 2017) and was surprised to hear Fred say that Tim Carpenter's truck was maroon, not red as I had read everywhere. Also, Fred saw a cover for the maroon truck in Tim's garage. More info on TC in that interview as well re a lake, etc.
Maura's arm may have been yanked by the suspect. This may have happened near or on Old Peter road which is about 200 feet from where her car came to rest.
You need to do this again with a different psychic and say NOTHING, you are literally telling her the whole story!! A good psychic only needs a belonging of the subject to hold or a photo of them and NOTHING else
That lady is a joke. Basic psychic tricks. Talk to any carnie and they will be able to do the same. They are fantastic and asking questions without asking.
+Cynthia Horn That is possible, we hadn't talked about that. We think she may have meant Old Peter's Road, which is a very small road very close to the crash site.
+Missing Maura Murray My thinking was perhaps Petrit was a variation of Peter just like Mikael is a version of Michael. I tried to research the name but, I couldn't find anything other than it's Albanian in origin.
She did. She said who is Peter or Peterson. That's what made me think she meant Petrit. It seemed like a version of Peter she was picking up and chances are she would not be familiar with the name Petrit. Though, that's a good thought about the last name. Has anyone checked to see if a Ben Peterson has gone missing?
Oh, c'mon, you mean to tell me she never heard of one of the most famous disappearances of the last two decades. She is just guessing it's icy cold and a car accident. Really? Have we become that gullible?
If you pay attention she would let the guys talk then interrupt by repeating the info they just gave her but say it in a way like she asking confirmation. This way it looks like she got the info on her own. The rest of her statements are either common sense or ambiguous. She first says she dead and near water (a pond). Then she says that she senses her dead but alive. Then she says its possible she is alive & living under an alias. Obviously Maura is either alive or dead ..regardless the lady has set things up to where she will be right one way or another. My guess is this psychic has read up some on the case. We know she is into true crime . If Renner has kept a list of all the psychics he got emails from - I would check the list & see if this lady is on it.
If I'm not mistaken wasn't their a mention somewhere that they was questioning 2 brothers at one time? At around 47 mins the physic lady keeps mentioning 2 men and one with a beard. Just curious if the brothers I read about somewhere could be who she might be referring too.
Maybe. I'm pretty sure I read that they were local and worked construction or something and had a record as well or one of them did. I been looking where I read that at but those 2 def need to be checked into more and where they were at the time all that happened and yea I think it was from the A-Frame house.
You talked about that red truck acting strange and the woman who was walking to the store saw it, and thought it was weird. She was a large woman who saw the truck. There were possibly two men in the truck and it had a large eagle on the back. You dont remember this from your podcast? You dont think this truck has anything to do w her dissappearance?
There are some psychics that are so confident that they ask a few simple questions (some of the questions are seemingly trivial and non-meaningful) and then take off like crazy. Talk about skill.
Is it possible she was having a clandestine affair with a high ranking officer from West Point who was married and feared a scandal, could even have helped stage the circumstance of her getting thrown out so they could carry on the affair out of the public eye with her seemingly no longer in the picture? And this guy was older than her, may have even resembled her father somewhat - so some could be getting a vision of him thinking it's the father. And this guy had some sort of dissociative disorder PTSD condition, like a Jeckyll/Hyde situation - and just snapped when they met up, possibly even on some level having the urge to erase her for fear she knew too much about him - more than just the affair? And maybe she went to meet him and that's why she took the alcohol, planning a rendezvous in a hotel? Maybe he got very close to her and confided a lot about his past then regretted it? Maybe she was unstable and taunting him with what she knew and could blackmail him with if he ever broke things off? This would also explain why the police/govt cover-ups if any - to protect this individual in "the brotherhood" and even more so, the potentially disruptive secrets he was holding that a full investigation here could make public. If this is so, it will never be "solved." Also the full-blown psychopath/sociopath may be the officer more so than Maura but her being young and heavily under his influence, even bordering on what's known as "folie a deux" - when one person is psychologically pulled into the pathology of another. Maura might have been lured to this remote location by him, threatened for her life and interrogated then taken out, the body destroyed in some chemical process to leave no evidence and personnel silenced with non-disclosure agreements and threats. Her father might have taken her the money to try to help her go on the run and may not be telling all for fear of retributions against the family. Like he's hoping someone unearths this info - but not him. This would've been handled by special ops and exists only as sealed classified info. Happens all the time. My guess is Maura was fascinated by those she saw as powerful men and liked to play with fire - until she got burnt. I think this thing is such a hot potato because it contains a landmine of classified intel nobody wants to see the light of day.
coolintensity1 I agree it's a possibility.. but I wouldn't go as far as your entire theory lol but something similar could have happened. I doubt they all got rid of her body together n signed NDA n stuff tho. good thought tho! anything is possible
I hear you guys giving her information and her making vague statements. She repeats a lot of what you said back to you. Also she's from the same state Maura went to school in. Is it really so hard to believe that she has heard of this high profile case before and has some knowledge of it on top of the information you gave her during the interview? I don't believe in psychics, but I will hear them out and I have never heard any one say something that was not a vague statement that people applied retroactively. These people are attention seekers who capitalize on grieving or gullible people.
corriec18 psychics are def real. you just need to go see a real one. when you schedule an appt you only give a first name, doesn't have to be yours, call from a phone not related to you, and don't give an address or state/town relating to you. that way you have no reasons to dispute any info they give you because they weren't able to do any search of you prior to the reading. 😊
in this episode the Maura beeing alive and dead, by the psychic, made me think of a question that I had in my mind:- did you check Maura medical records? - 3 car accidents could mean that she had or was developing some kind of neurological impairment
Mr 1974. Eh, that adds up to 21, Mauras age. I don't think he's involved but could be why he picked 1974. Lol but since I'm 3 years late to the podcast I'm basically talking to myself.
It's difficult to judge this when you gave her so much detailed information to work with; should've just let her talk. Shame really, missed opportunity.
They fed her all the info she needed to twist the answers and appease what they wanted to hear......then she fed those answers back to them like ice cream to a baby.
You guys gave her way too much information. First rule, give them the least. Like a photo and that's it. She was just feeding back what you were telling her basically, which isn't fair to her.
Could this "psychic" have possibly asked any MORE questions?? Shouldn't she be giving you information and not the other way around? The entire narrative was built for her lol. With the game exception of this episode you guys are doing a great job. Good luck with the documentary! :)
I think it's important to look for an SUV or truck with duallys, with the driver/and/ or owner named Ben. I'm also wondering why you guys didn't ask her about Claude moulton
Maybe its the way you guys talk about people that makes them not want to be on your podcast. You just insinuated that she was fake and could just have gone on the internet to tell the family what they wanted to hear and then you're surprised when people don't want to come on. You condone people who aren't doctors to diagnose people and you insinuate that people are lying or involved is peoples disappearances. No, the answer is no. You ruined it for yourself they aren't coming on.
2TH?313 flashed in my head when she said "...there's a 3 at the end..." I don't claim psychic, I only mention in case there is something to this psychic thing??? Way far away in both space and time here.
I'm wondering what was behind the decision to share Maura's name and date of disappearance upfront. Not only is this a well known disappearance...certainly in New England where Lori lives...this is a woman who claims to specialize in missing person cases. She portends to work with many missing cases and with law enforcement... in her view she's on a quest to find justice, so of course she knows this case "cold." As an aside, when many, including Lori, remember Maura's story the feeling of that deep winter cold almost immediately strikes...the back roads in blustery NH, a young woman alone at night, her breath almost crystalized and suspended in front of her, and not a light in sight. At least that's how I feel it. The setting is what horror tales are made of! Something similar happened to me in very rural Maine in February. I was lost and almost out gas, and not another car or house light to be seen. Just broken down old barns in fields.. so creepy. Technology likely saved my life that night in more ways than one. Anyhow, onward to your next cast!
I hope they do not ignore her impressions about this matter and take due note for future comparison with others. There might be very valuable information. Psychics (if you will) are like other people in that there are not always details provided or sensed at the exact time that others feel it should be. This does not mean that the psychic is incorrect.
I applaud the two of you for being so respectful and sitting through that because after 10 minutes I'd be yelling, "WE ALREADY KNOW THAT!!!!" Lol I thought it was interesting though!
Hey guys love your podcasts and love that you gave the psychic route a shot, when you have a person missing what is there to lose with trying that out!? I have a question, I know based on evidence of lack of footprints in the snow that she must not run off but gotten into someone's car. And if that's the case she must have. But what puzzles me is why she would want nothing to do with help from a school bus driver- a school bus driver to me seems very non threatening- but then a minute or few later accept it from some other stranger? Obviously with force of a gun or something yes, but even that why wouldn't she scream being houses and people were near, and what is the likelihood hood of an armed killer driving past in such a ridiculous short period of time. I definitely welcome input on this I'm genuinely curious on the psyche behind that since I personally would be glad to accept help from the school driver if I'm crashed stranded in the cold. And before accepting help from a stranger I would walk over to one of those nearby houses to use the phone and get help. It just doesn't make sense. Also, the mention of the name Peter fr the psychic was interesting since petrit is foreign form of Peter. I new a petrit who's family and friends called Peter. And I have always felt like there could be something to the idea that Maura could have been the one to hit him. It would make sense someone to have a break down and skip town over that, as apposed to just family or boyfriend problems that are common for most people. Am I far off here? Lol
I just started following the case and I am only on episode ten. I started with the podcast with no prior knowledge so I am worried about googling and muddying my mind with trolls comments. Anyways, I just wanted to say a green and white licence plate is also from Saskatchewan, Canada.
Was she talking about the license plate being green and white? I thought she was referencing the vehicle and linked it to the police SUV. This may imply different plates being used and there may some other unsolved cases out there.
I did find it very interesting that she said there was a conflicting feeling she got with Maura being alive, but also not alive. This would make sense if she took off and assumed a new identity. Also interesting was the comment that Maura's boyfriend wanted her to think before she did stupid things. But, as most psychics do, she said Maura could be found near water. Which was disappointing. Psychics always say that about missing people.
+Auntie Didi Water indeed! The earth's surface is 70% water. New Hampshire, in particular, has above average precipitation. So, if you guess that water will be nearby, you can't lose. Also, if you say someone could be both alive or dead, you can't lose there either.
This is an older episode, so my comment may not get spotted, but I'm curious listening to this again: She is shuffling papers as she works? What materials, if any, did she have with her for reference? Just wondering. Great work, Tim and Lance - I'm a fan.
The clip played mentions Franconia with familiarity? Did you use a local psychic or someone in the area or already familiar with it or was she completely impartial and from a different area?
If she seriously didn't know 'about' Maura Murray, this gives me the chills. I have always believed Psychics were just throwing darts and then hoping they landed on the bullseye. Eventually they would find a reaction and role with it. But she immediately said they found her car but not her... That makes me wonder... I want to believe in things like Psychics and the Paranormal but I have never had enough of a 'interaction' or 'experience' to find proof. Either way I am open to the possibility. She seems to not have much to say after but knowing about the car and mentioning a SUV is very specific and not overly general it could apply to anyone or anything. Often they say things like Oh you have had a hard life... which everyone has had, those are the ones that ruin the name of Psychics. Very very weird.
It's called cold reading: she asks for bits of info, then she extrapolates possibilities. Notice how she's always responding to info, not offering it up. The initial car guess was lucky...and within the realm of an easy guess.
The guys gave her way too much information. They are supposed to ask the person questions and say yes or no and let them figure it out
They aren’t testing her abilities....they are looking for Maura.
True, but it appears they only provided a few basics and she actually did pick up on the other things. Either way, when looking for insights, then they cannot dismiss the information garnered for any little statement may lead to even more insights.
"That SUV, that's your key." The drunk police chief who arrived first but off the record! (John Smith, you agree?!)
You guys have the psychic way too much info.
I always thought she ran off after the accident because she was afraid of the cops (dui). She may have flagged down the wrong guy.
This case is solvable. There are people in positions of authority keeping it from happening. The psychic hit on many good points. The most important is when she said Thomas,Tom. And No! its not Tim. There is a Thomas or Tom who knows what happened to Maura. Psychic Lady heard it correctly. Thomas...Tom. This person may be in a position of authority or was. Jobs are being protected if not freedoms.
Totally agree 💯
If I were hosting this show, I would require that any psychic who wanted to be a guest would have to provide the GPS coordinates of where Maura is--no less, no more.
The most simple and logical explanation is the Maura was murdered by a local. Looking at a map of the area, there are numerous houses scattered amongst the woods. Very easy to pick her up in a car and take her somewhere else. It probably didn't start out as threatening, it was likely a pick up by someone who recognised a possibly drunk but certainly vulnerable young woman. Perhaps later she struggled and too much force was used resulting, sadly, in death. Its a very common scenario. How easy to then bury.dump the body - all trace gone by spring thaw. The police really need to start again and do some very thorough investigating of everyone who was living within a 5-10 mile radius of the area - especially those who a) had need to regularly use the road and b) had/have access to remote buildings.
Your theory is very much in line with RUclips psychic "Dark Rose". Check out her impressions on this case. Sounds close to what you wrote.
@@saltpeter7429 OK - thanks! Not convinced by psychics but I will take a look and keep an open mind :-)
This is one of the theories that makes the most sense to me.
This my theory too.
Growing up in NH I don’t believe this . I think she ran away
I am part of Lori Bruno's shamanic family, and i come from a long line of psychics. I may be able to help.....I know nothing about this case. Contact me i only read the comments on here, and seeing those putting down Lori who was tryin to help frustrates me.
I have always been intrigued by Maura’s case. It’s so baffling. I listen to every interview, podcast, etc… on this case and I am 10 episodes into this podcast so far. I must say BRAVO!! 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻 You guys are doing a great job of dissecting details and I never get tired of hearing anyones theories. I love it! Keep up the good work!
Agree 👍🏻
As I was listening to Lori Bruno, she said that she was near a pond. There's a pond very close to where the crash was on 112. If you zoom out it's kind of back behind the Weathered Barn. Does anyone know if the police checked here for anything?
There's also a lake not far and back up behind Atwood's. At least according to maps.
Its named 'French Pond'...some investigators used sonar to search the bottom oif the pond and found an Anmoly about 3ft wide by 5ft long.
They marked the location on GPS.
The investigators left with the intention of returning with divers to actually see what the Anomoly was.
Trouble is..immediately after the investigators left.
Local Fish&Game dredged the bottom of the pond
The imvestigators returned and used the GPS to find the anomoly..well,The anomoly is now gone
Although personally I have pretty much zero belief in psychics I've got the utmost respect for you guys in terms of not dismissing any avenue of exploration and putting yourselves out there for the inevitable criticism that consulting a psychic will bring.I randomly stumbled across this case yesterday and,as I've seen many others say,there's something about it that grabs you and does not let go! I sincerely hope that one day resolution will be found.In the meantime props to you both for the work that you're putting in!
I wish you showed the video clip of the entire interview. I think she was right on with Maura having a strong love for her sister Kathleen. Kathleen wasn't as "perfect" as Julie and Fred jr. Maybe she didn't feel judged by Kathleen considering Kathleen seems to make many mistakes herself.
Hi guys, I absolutely love your efforts in solving this case. I am touched and wish to help.
I personally speak to the dead. It's not something I speak about hardly ever. I am not fond of labels, you see. Therefore I never publicize the fact.
However, since the early days of this case I have had visions of Maura being picked up by someone and unfortunately dying the same night.
Mrs Bruno is correct in saying she isn't living, but not really dead. Maura wanted to disappear, but she didn't want to die. She feels she can't leave this world of ours because of all the hurt she left behind. She is holding on to her guilt, wanting to fix all those things she felt she "messed" up before her death.
She wants closure but is lost in her sorrow. Her guilt is overwhelming!
I hope you will use this info for what I intended it for. I just feel like this needed to be touched on.
Keep up the great work, and know your fans are anxiously awaiting the movie release.
Thanks for your time and I pray something breaks in this case. Maura deserves to rest peacefully, as we all do.
I also have an ability, I'm not psychic, or about to speak to the dead, but I am a sensitive. and I'm able to receive info from spirits, and pick up on energy.
Maura was a very damaged soul. she had good intentions, but lived a lie.
she put an act on everyday, and pretended to be happy.
she pretended to like to do the activities she was involved in, like running.
but I believe she didn't really have a passion for it.
I believe Maura thought of herself as a very caring, compassionate, great person, and wanted others to think the same.
but she had many struggles within herself.
I believe she ran to cover up her possible eating disorder, and that running/working out just became habit of everyday life.
possibly an addiction in a sense..
and I do believe she struggled with drinking and possibly some other stimulant"s".
I believe she was with Billy to convince herself and others she was worth having..
I could say so much more but this would be a mile long!!
I'm sure most can catch what I'm throwing!
I think Maura was very depressed and just wanted to get away for a week and collect her thoughts and figure out what she really wanted to do with her life.
and I think someone harmed her.
I do think there's more that her friends are not saying that could shed light or give more clues to Maura's state of mind that night.. specifically Kate.
*I also kinda think Maura was going up to meet someone up there, and that's possibly why the friends won't talk about it cuz they don't want that person to be considered a suspect, as they "the friends" don't believe they "whoever Maura was meeting" were involved..*
You may have given her nothing before you went into the meeting, but you gave her TONS of info throughout the convo. This was fun, but she's not credible.
Refusing your "blood money" is a great way to get publicity on your platform. She didn't pay for advertising, you didn't pay her for 'services', even Steven.
The psychic kept saying she got a feeling of Maura being "alive and dead" at the same time. Maybe Maura's PHYSICALLY alive, but mentally and emotionally dead due to being in captivity for such a long period of time.
+TheMYERSFAN25 glad I took time to read before I posted as you said exactly what I thought.I thought that from the first time she said that.
And maybe she's really Schrödinger's cat. Just when if thought this show couldn't sink lower than having hours of Renner's patting his own ego, here's this episode with...psychics. ::facepalm:: As a sceptic, I'm kissing this episode good-bye. If it keeps up with Renner and more psychics, I'll just forget the whole podcast. It's amazing how people wonder why the Murray family is 'apathetic', when they don't appreciate how gruesome, pointless, and irrelevant stuff like talking with psychics and Renner is. If it were my sister or child, this crap would make me feel like giving up. Apathy, my ass.
Maybe psychics are frauds? Maybe this is a fools errand and they need to fill air time?
maybe she a con artist? Alive and dead? Red/Blue/Dark SUV? Sure
alive and dead at the same time because her old self that lived in America is mentally and emotionally physically dead because she probably now lives in Canada under a new identity
If you’re psychic why do you have to know what you said before to work on it now? It sounds like she’s worried she’ll say something contradictory… but if she’s psychic shouldn’t she just be able to tap in and it would be consistent?
The psychic lady who declined to be on your podcast because she had little memory of the previous reading, I don't trust her. As my Papa always told me "if you tell the truth you'll never have to remember what you said". Seems like she is worried about saying something that contradicts her previous reading 🤔
It absolutely breaks my heart that psychics get involved in cases like this. As other viewers/listeners noted, Lori was given a lot of information. The generalizations that she came up with are ones that you or I could have conjured up. Her "reading" only gives false hope to those searching for Maura.
I agree. I was just looking at some old footage of Sylvia brown on The Montel Williams Show many years ago. She told Amanda berry's mom, that Amanda was dead. She also told a woman, whose fiance was killed in 911,( he was a fireman)...that he had drowned somewhere! Even the gf knew he had burnt up. She was wanting to know, if any of his remains could be found! She corrected SB right quick! But, SB tried to cover it up with even more of her bs!These psychics literally prey on the most vulnerable of ppl.
alice smith was Amanda Berry not dead?
I'm not familiar with that case.
I believe there are genuine psychics,
but also know there are plenty of fakes.
I haven't listened to this podcast yet, I came to the comments first.
I believe aldin killed Maura, I have a specific reason for that belief.
Em & Em no, Amanda Berry had been kidnapped and was being held not far from her home.
Stephanie Harlowe 💜💜💜💋
Stephanie Harlowe I wasn't expecting to see you here, I love your channel! 💗
What ever came of the psychic getting a picture??? Did she pick up anything ?
if she disappeared in Canada with her tandem friend .. who is it? Where is he? Is he missing too? Any police reports for anyone in MA missing around the same time Would Maura do this to her mom? Her dad? Would she torment her family all these years ? If she staged her own disappearance? Yes, she had a lot of problems., which she brought them on herself . But She did homework, she only took clothes for few days. She wasn’t pregnant. She has birth control pills with her , few was gone
Her mom died on her birthday .. how ironic !
Funny his psychic matched his theory, one that no o e agree with
Why not let the psychic speak? If she is a true psychic, she shouldn't need pr be asking for so much information. One guy even mentioned the theory of her being picked up by a passenger because dogs left her scent as she was flee8ng the scene. This was a horrible psychic meeting!
I do agree somewhat, but not about the psychic being terrible. I do, however, think that they should have had some two or three available from different skill strengths. Give them some basic alleged facts and just sit back and be prepared to run batteries down on equipment and get writer's cramp from note taking because it will be nothing short of amazing. If they had done something like this more immediately, then they might have found her or at least have solved the case. Of that I am very certain. If several female psychics then if there were several males, they would not stand a chance and it is irregardless of attraction in any typical sense. ;)
Interesting, but this is very typical for psychics. She does things like ask questions and then later repeats your answer as if she's somehow came up with it out of nowhere. "she's near a body of water" is an easy one because basically everywhere is near a body of water.
Not to mention the fact she is a psychic based in Massachusetts, there is no way she's never heard of this case.
She said to look in Franconia twice. It’s not that far from where she went missing.
This is the only episode of yours I skipped. Sorry. I'm only interested in hearing theories based on reality.
This so-called psychic played herself. She said she led police to the body of Nikki Evangelous in Clinton, Mass. This Parole Board review for her killer states otherwise:
www.mass.gov/eopss/docs/pb/lifer-decisions/2012/piercebrian9-28-12.pdf
Read the top of the 2nd page: A MALE INFORMANT wearing a wire helped the police by getting him to admit that he wacked her.
Old pathological liar trick: Pick an old or obscure event that you think is hard to research because no one will be able to call BS on you.
You think the parole board is going to write a psychic solved the case? You obviously don’t have a clue how that would sound in the legal world
Renner is the Ultimate Grifter...FACT
Why would a psychic have to ask people for any information? Pretty embarrassing...
Isn't it weird two of the psychics used the name Ben unless Lori has seen brians prediction I'm definitely liking this episode would love to see more like this its one of the most interesting episodes yet
+Courtney Armstrong It is weird. And it actually slipped past Lance and I until we saw on Twitter that someone mentioned that. We went back through the episode to confirm it for ourselves. Very strange. We are going to try and follow these leads.
+Courtney Armstrong They also both mentioned Maura being in or near water.
+Missing Maura Murray I can't remember where I saw a post that Maura had a new boyfriend. It may have been on Renner's blog. Someone said she had a new boyfriend and she ran away with him. Has anyone looked to see if there was "Ben" in any of her circle of friends? Maybe Ben is the new boyfriend. Has anyone checked to see if a Ben from that area has gone missing?
+Courtney Armstrong I'd much rather the episodes concentrate of facts. I don't feel this episode is helpful nor does it advance the investigation. As for the predictions - Ben is a common enough name and there are lots of lakes/ponds in the area as a result the so called predictions sound plausible enough to be true. These people work on a percentage game - they do not have special super sensory "gifts" - even if they convinced themselves (and others) that they have.
isn't there a small town called "BENton" nearby ?
I think you should've played your cards a little closer to your chest, so to speak, with this psychic. Not reacted as much, let her form her own hypothesis from her perceived "abilities". Entertaining but not really all that believable because of how much information you gave her willingly
It just makes me think of the beginning on the movie "Ghost" where Whoopi Goldberg would feed off in info given to her..... Of course it ended differently. I DO think this woman was fed way too much info.....
I agree that this could have been better. Find a few good ones that are noted for their abilities and have those help choose a few more from impartial sources. Then there will be some action on this case.
Guys, I sincerely hope you're not discouraged by the viewers who dislike this episode. I can't applaud your bravery enough! In any investigation, you're gonna dig through lots of piles of bulls**t before you find gold. Great job! The episodes like this, in my opinion, prove your podcast to be very well rounded. You're touching every base before you run home. Well done, guys!
On another note, have you ever wondered why, if Fred wants access to the police investigation so badly, he doesn't declare Maura deceased...? In theory, this would grant him access to the police report he claims to so desperately want to see. I might be wrong, but I believe his access is denied because the case is still "open". A death certificate would, again in theory, "close" it. Just a thought...
Lisa Thomas q
You have a low iq
A death certificate will not “open” an ongoing criminal investigation. The death certificate would only theoretically open a case if it was a voluntary disappearance/starting a new life and then she was actually deceased after doing so, which is astronomically unlikely.
A death certificate will not “open” an ongoing criminal investigation. The death certificate would only theoretically open case materials to the public if it was a voluntary disappearance/starting a new life and then she was actually deceased after doing so, which is astronomically unlikely.
Since you guys are covering all angles, even the paranormal ones, it might be worth it to look into the Missing 411 series by David Paulides. They cover a range of mysterious disappearances in National Forests/Parks, which, as Maura was relatively close to a National Forest, as her father's letters indicate, may hold some interest to you guys. Just a thought, but otherwise, keep up the good work guys! Much love from Bonnie Old Scotland!
+Liam Currie Great point Liam. I'm very familiar with his work. I actually reached out to him to appear on the show and haven't heard back from him yet.
+Liam Currie Let's just go ahead and let everyone know that David Paulides believes that the missing people in his Missing 411 series were abducted by Bigfoot, OK?
In my opinion, there are already enough unknown factors in this case and the producers have veered far enough down the Road of Ridiculous with the psychic angle as it is.
I'm sure that my past criticism of their Renner episodes and now the psychic one has not earned me any love from the MMM team. But if you want to get rid of me forever, then go ahead and interview Paulides, yeah.
I follow Paulides work as well....and he doesn't come out and say Bigfoot and WONT, even if he implies it. And agreed that he wouldn't be interested in this.... He also studies "clusters".... Not individual cases.
+Curt Rowlett You have more in common with that psychic than you know. She is covered in trinkets including a pentagram around her neck, while your avatar is filled with Satanic symbols, the lightning bolt, and skull and bones.
I do not believe she was killed by somone , I think she died in the woods , from the cold.
The cop was driving the dark SUV ( Re Police car # 001 - Witness A & Timeline / Cover up)
Maura's not dead because she's still being held captive
It’s a bronco. Very wide back. Butch Atwood had one. Barb Atwood says it in a recent interview. She was also a really big woman. She called 911 according to her. Even though in the story everyone says bitch did.
Ill give you guys credit because at least you're willing to cover every area now that being said. I think physcics are full of crap i don't believe in any of it. They all do the same thing come up with random names well if uou actually knew them you would tell us. They all do the dame exact thing..
"I feel cold" right after they say it's February in New Hampshire. They were telling her everything about the case and she was more or less just repeating what they were saying but rewording it.
I'm sorry but I was thoroughly unimpressed by this psychic. You had to feed her way too much information.
And WTF is it with psychics (in general) and throwing out names?
Come up with actual useful information. Anyone can throw out a name that in some way or another can mean something that relates to the case.
If spiritual voices are audibly talking to her - TELL her something effing useful.
totally agree. I was going to say the same and you did it for me
+Theo Volz Psychics are a joke. James Randi (look him up) has a standing offer of one million dollars to any psychic who can prove they can actually do what they claim. How many takers in the past 20 years...NONE.
+Pasic TP I assume you mean "owe"?
If psychics are going to charge people money - and let's face it most of them use their abilities to make a living, then yes: they damn well should be accurate.
+Pasic TP (I realise the one in this case didn't charge for her "help")
You're feeding the psychic all the info. Only thing she came up with a dark SUV maybe black or blue or gray. I could've guessed better than she did. Lol you tell her they searched the house then she tells you she's not in the house. Well duh.
This is the theory I've had all along. I think she got into the stranger's vehicle having no other option being in such a dark, cold desolate area. I wonder who this Ben character is. I hope she receives more information from Maura.
I am 100% skeptical toward psychics and the like, but there is no point in being angry about this episode. If we're following a podcast about a complex case, it's good to hear every angle and aspect. I want to hear everything, given that Fred sought the help of a psychic. If that hadn't happened, then I understand and agree with why an episode about psychics would be useless. Regardless, if you only want to know the basic details of the case, read the Wikipedia page or watch the Disappeared episode instead.
You guys told her most of the story lol wtf kinda joke is this
Giordano Bruno is what is known today as a syncretist. He believed and brilliantly illustrated how all world religions had a common ancient root based in an understanding of natural sciences and astrology that became lost or clouded in symbolism that was no longer understood by the average man. He followed in the footsteps of the Neo-platonists, was deemed a heretic by the Roman church and executed as such for exposing this knowledge. Some may even call him a gnostic. Today I would recommend someone like Santos Bonacci if you're interested in the topic as he draws directly from Bruno's material and blends it with other syncretist works new and ancient. Interesting stuff for sure and right here on RUclips.
I think the dream physic is on to something. Its makes so much sense about it being someone in the police department.
How? I've seen no evidence of a cover up just a girl that disappeared with evidence supporting the fact that she was trying to get away and told no one.
I found this very chilling, because I've been seeing a maroon Ford Explorer* as a vehicle of interest. *not sure of model, but definitely a Ford SUV, pre-2002...
Charles Cothran Are u psychic
I look forward to these episodes, they are so interesting. The more I listen to them the more I want Maura to be alive. To know that she masterminded her disappearance and somehow lived her life the way she always wanted to these last eleven years. Personally, I don't put much stock in psychic abilities. It sounded like the psychic featured on this episode was questionable. She asked a lot of leading questions like, "whose Thomas?" Then one of you said "oh, Tim..." Then she just agreed with you. It felt like you were feeding her answers (not intentionally) and she wasn't really intuiting a lot on her own. I still really enjoyed the podcast and thought it was an interesting avenue to go down. I wouldn't mind seeing a few more psychic's brains picked on here.
Sandi Bozarth I think the psychic actually has an ability.
if you're not a sensitive you typically wouldn't understand.
when we open ourselves allowing spirits to bring us info, we're open to everything.
and sometimes we get energy that doesn't intend on being helpful, or energy that isn't directly related to what we're searching.
it's just like everyone comes to you at once and are all talking at the same time.
it gets hard to defer, and distinguish between what's relavent and what's not.
so that's why sometimes not everything they say relates to the topic you're discussing, and also why we sometimes ask questions so we know which road to go down so to speak.
hope this helps you understand!
*I am not a psychic, but I am a sensitive, and I have a gift*
@@emem694 good explanation.
sometimes psychics need more info.
being a psychic is hard.
when they open themselves to receive info, it's the same as if you had 15 people standing in front of you all talking at once.
it's hard to decipher between what's relavent and what's not.
this psychic wasn't trying to prove her abilities, hence why she asked questions.
and to me when a psychic is comfortable to ask questions like that that tells me she's comfortable with her ability.
people that fake having an ability would be cautious about asking questions cuz they want you to believe they're really psychic.. so they'd b more paranoid about that.
you know what I'm trying to say? lol
I also have an ability, I'm not psychic, or about to speak to the dead, but I am a sensitive. and I'm able to receive info from spirits, and pick up on energy.
Maura was a very damaged soul. she had good intentions, but lived a lie.
she put an act on everyday, and pretended to be happy.
she pretended to like to do the activities she was involved in, like running.
but I believe she didn't really have a passion for it.
I believe Maura thought of herself as a very caring, compassionate, great person, and wanted others to think the same.
but she had many struggles within herself.
I believe she ran to cover up her possible eating disorder, and that running/working out just became habit of everyday life.
possibly an addiction in a sense..
and I do believe she struggled with drinking and possibly some other stimulant"s".
I believe she was with Billy to convince herself and others she was worth having..
I could say so much more but this would be a mile long!!
I'm sure most can catch what I'm throwing!
I think Maura was very depressed and just wanted to get away for a week and collect her thoughts and figure out what she really wanted to do with her life.
and I think someone harmed her.
I do think there's more that her friends are not saying that could shed light or give more clues to Maura's state of mind that night.. specifically Kate.
*I also kinda think Maura was going up to meet someone up there, and that's possibly why the friends won't talk about it cuz they don't want that person to be considered a suspect, as they "the friends" don't believe they "whoever Maura was meeting" were involved..*
No, it's not, they're just conning people.
Brilliant show,two of them saying Ben I got the shivers,a couple in a car&the womans saying come on we will help you,well that makes us woman feel safe, but history shows us men use these woman to lure unsuspecting woman in need.fred west was only successful because rose was so friendly&nice to the woman they picked up,said by a woman who survived there capture.look forward to the next one guys well done.
Shirley Scrimgeour
If I’d been driving while drinking and had just said No Thanks to the bus driver and figured that the bus driver was going to call the police right away... then at 21 I’d be apt to jump into the next vehicle real quick.
When butch went to search and I use that term loosely. He used his bronco. Says barb Atwood.
Wow this is a new low, you guys are feeding her WAY to much BUT I really hope you investigate the cop theory mentioned early on. Not just from a psychics standpoint but from actual facts. What exactly did the cop do for 2 hours at the crime scene?
Sadly in the end this episode is a huge waste of time. Focus on the facts and ask some uncomfortable questions and you will make a much better documentary.
WTF Ben/Benjamin was the possible cop guy the Brian dream state psychic guy saw also!!! Mind BLOWN!!!!!!!!
"She is both living and dead" I have heard this before. A physic was talking about a lady that died but her baby lived.
So she was just dead, is what you're saying.
Living and dead is also when a person does not know they're dead. In addition, I strongly suspect she was pregnant even though her friend cleared it up by saying their nursing assignment was on maternity and that is why maura had maternity searches on her computer.
I always found it strange that she would refuse help from Mr. Atwood, but then agree to take help from a passing stranger, by getting in their vehicle. But this lady brings up a good point that I missed. If there was a female in the car, she may have been more inclined to accept the ride, and things went bad from there. I never really thought about it, but it's probably what I would do too. I see a male and a female, assume their a couple, and assume everything would be alright. Could this case be as simple/evil as a couple/stranger abduction?
You state that she got into a vehicle of a passing stranger as if it were not only voluntarily but a given fact. It is not and is speculative. We don't know but that it could have been somebody she knew and was planned.
Just trying to get in her head- if I had just crashed (and had all the legal trouble she did) and Butch Atwood stopped in his bus and asked me if I needed help…… I would be scared sh*tless (no offense, Butch RIP) and say the same thing she did. I think after he pulled away she realized she had no service and was stuck so started thinking “okay, I have to get out of here before police come, he drives a school bus, he lives right down the street, he didn’t kill me just now… maybe he’s safe” and started walking up the street towards his house while he’s inside telling his wife to call police. Maybe just before getting up to his house (where the dogs tracked her scent to) someone else drove up and they looked less scary than Butch (cause don’t all the craziest ones?) so she accepted because she’d rather take a chance than get in MORE trouble and bam, she made a mistake. If those remains found at Loon Mountain are her, I think this is the likeliest scenario
@@amyashley3182 exactly it’s really obvious what happened. She was on probation and couldn’t risk a DUI. She couldn’t risk being seen by police on that road. I would of risked getting in the first ride that stopped. The only alternative is her hiding in the woods to see when the police had gone. But there were no foot prints.
She's creeped out by Alden Olson. Alright guys I think she's legit.
"Mr.112dirtbag" his real name is Alden Howes Olson and his address is 29 Golden Ct, Hadley, MA 01035...I urge people to write to him or go see him in person and explain to him why it is wrong to make sadistic videos mocking the Murray family's pain..."
I know right? nailed that one lol
Maybe don't urge people to go to his house. Doesn't sound like a safe idea. Omg
I just listened to Erinn's interview with Fred ( posted on 22.Dec 2017) and was surprised to hear Fred say that Tim Carpenter's truck was maroon, not red as I had read everywhere. Also, Fred saw a cover for the maroon truck in Tim's garage. More info on TC in that interview as well re a lake, etc.
When Lori hit on the name "Peter" maybe she was referring to Petrit Vasi. Then she says something about arm hurting. Worth noting.
Maura's arm may have been yanked by the suspect. This may have happened near or on Old Peter road which is about 200 feet from where her car came to rest.
You need to do this again with a different psychic and say NOTHING, you are literally telling her the whole story!! A good psychic only needs a belonging of the subject to hold or a photo of them and NOTHING else
I just found these incredible podcasts! Wow! My favourite case.
That lady is a joke. Basic psychic tricks. Talk to any carnie and they will be able to do the same. They are fantastic and asking questions without asking.
I caught something in the episode and just wanted to run it by you guys. The psychic asked who is Peter? Could she have meant Petrit?
+Cynthia Horn That is possible, we hadn't talked about that. We think she may have meant Old Peter's Road, which is a very small road very close to the crash site.
+Missing Maura Murray My thinking was perhaps Petrit was a variation of Peter just like Mikael is a version of Michael. I tried to research the name but, I couldn't find anything other than it's Albanian in origin.
She did. She said who is Peter or Peterson. That's what made me think she meant Petrit. It seemed like a version of Peter she was picking up and chances are she would not be familiar with the name Petrit. Though, that's a good thought about the last name. Has anyone checked to see if a Ben Peterson has gone missing?
and who is Benji? and Beth?
@@Cynthia_H444 who is Ben Peterson? (I realize this comment I'm responding to is a million years old)
I was impressed! The interviewer woman asked all the right questions and the medium guy just trotted out all the answers without hesitation!
Oh, c'mon, you mean to tell me she never heard of one of the most famous disappearances of the last two decades. She is just guessing it's icy cold and a car accident. Really? Have we become that gullible?
So the psychic said "what can I do for you gentlemen." Wasn't she surposed to know?
If you pay attention she would let the guys talk then interrupt by repeating the info they just gave her but say it in a way like she asking confirmation. This way it looks like she got the info on her own. The rest of her statements are either common sense or ambiguous. She first says she dead and near water (a pond). Then she says that she senses her dead but alive. Then she says its possible she is alive & living under an alias. Obviously Maura is either alive or dead ..regardless the lady has set things up to where she will be right one way or another.
My guess is this psychic has read up some on the case. We know she is into true crime . If Renner has kept a list of all the psychics he got emails from - I would check the list & see if this lady is on it.
If I'm not mistaken wasn't their a mention somewhere that they was questioning 2 brothers at one time? At around 47 mins the physic lady keeps mentioning 2 men and one with a beard. Just curious if the brothers I read about somewhere could be who she might be referring too.
Moulton brothers from the A frame house maybe?
Maybe. I'm pretty sure I read that they were local and worked construction or something and had a record as well or one of them did. I been looking where I read that at but those 2 def need to be checked into more and where they were at the time all that happened and yea I think it was from the A-Frame house.
You talked about that red truck acting strange and the woman who was walking to the store saw it, and thought it was weird. She was a large woman who saw the truck. There were possibly two men in the truck and it had a large eagle on the back. You dont remember this from your podcast? You dont think this truck has anything to do w her dissappearance?
Eyeseeyooh
Good points
There are some psychics that are so confident that they ask a few simple questions (some of the questions are seemingly trivial and non-meaningful) and then take off like crazy. Talk about skill.
Colorado also has a green and white license plate with mountains on it.
ABQ82 yep
Yea what u think was meant by this 3 was it a cop car or sivilian car n the 3 was the NASCAR driver number 3 car sticker or sum shit like that?
Back the NH's licences were green as well.
Is it possible she was having a clandestine affair with a high ranking officer from West Point who was married and feared a scandal, could even have helped stage the circumstance of her getting thrown out so they could carry on the affair out of the public eye with her seemingly no longer in the picture? And this guy was older than her, may have even resembled her father somewhat - so some could be getting a vision of him thinking it's the father. And this guy had some sort of dissociative disorder PTSD condition, like a Jeckyll/Hyde situation - and just snapped when they met up, possibly even on some level having the urge to erase her for fear she knew too much about him - more than just the affair? And maybe she went to meet him and that's why she took the alcohol, planning a rendezvous in a hotel? Maybe he got very close to her and confided a lot about his past then regretted it? Maybe she was unstable and taunting him with what she knew and could blackmail him with if he ever broke things off?
This would also explain why the police/govt cover-ups if any - to protect this individual in "the brotherhood" and even more so, the potentially disruptive secrets he was holding that a full investigation here could make public. If this is so, it will never be "solved." Also the full-blown psychopath/sociopath may be the officer more so than Maura but her being young and heavily under his influence, even bordering on what's known as "folie a deux" - when one person is psychologically pulled into the pathology of another. Maura might have been lured to this remote location by him, threatened for her life and interrogated then taken out, the body destroyed in some chemical process to leave no evidence and personnel silenced with non-disclosure agreements and threats. Her father might have taken her the money to try to help her go on the run and may not be telling all for fear of retributions against the family. Like he's hoping someone unearths this info - but not him. This would've been handled by special ops and exists only as sealed classified info. Happens all the time. My guess is Maura was fascinated by those she saw as powerful men and liked to play with fire - until she got burnt. I think this thing is such a hot potato because it contains a landmine of classified intel nobody wants to see the light of day.
coolintensity1 I agree it's a possibility..
but I wouldn't go as far as your entire theory lol
but something similar could have happened.
I doubt they all got rid of her body together n signed NDA n stuff tho.
good thought tho!
anything is possible
I hear you guys giving her information and her making vague statements. She repeats a lot of what you said back to you. Also she's from the same state Maura went to school in. Is it really so hard to believe that she has heard of this high profile case before and has some knowledge of it on top of the information you gave her during the interview?
I don't believe in psychics, but I will hear them out and I have never heard any one say something that was not a vague statement that people applied retroactively. These people are attention seekers who capitalize on grieving or gullible people.
corriec18 psychics are def real.
you just need to go see a real one.
when you schedule an appt you only give a first name, doesn't have to be yours, call from a phone not related to you, and don't give an address or state/town relating to you.
that way you have no reasons to dispute any info they give you because they weren't able to do any search of you prior to the reading. 😊
in this episode the Maura beeing alive and dead, by the psychic, made me think of a question that I had in my mind:- did you check Maura medical records? - 3 car accidents could mean that she had or was developing some kind of neurological impairment
She sounds like Joan Rivers.
Mr 1974. Eh, that adds up to 21, Mauras age. I don't think he's involved but could be why he picked 1974. Lol but since I'm 3 years late to the podcast I'm basically talking to myself.
it got to me that both her and the scitzophrenic guy mentioned someone called Ben tho
Lori Bruno seems to mostly repeats what is told to her and points out the obvious. What a hack.
It's difficult to judge this when you gave her so much detailed information to work with; should've just let her talk. Shame really, missed opportunity.
Wasn't there another show who put Alison Dubois of 'Medium' fame on the case? She said a serial killer is responsible..
Alison dubois is a certifiable psychopath who is full of it.
when she mentioned the name Peter.... maybe she was thinking of Petris(is that his name?) the guy from the hit and run.
@@standishism Or Peter Heed?
That's what I thought!
They fed her all the info she needed to twist the answers and appease what they wanted to hear......then she fed those answers back to them like ice cream to a baby.
This psychic is a little daffy, but she has the gift!
You guys gave her way too much information. First rule, give them the least. Like a photo and that's it. She was just feeding back what you were telling her basically, which isn't fair to her.
Could this "psychic" have possibly asked any MORE questions?? Shouldn't she be giving you information and not the other way around? The entire narrative was built for her lol.
With the game exception of this episode you guys are doing a great job. Good luck with the documentary! :)
I think it's important to look for an SUV or truck with duallys, with the driver/and/ or owner named Ben. I'm also wondering why you guys didn't ask her about Claude moulton
I REALLY enjoyed this episode!!
"The man who took her is named...Ben?" Convenient how the spirits always give out generic first letters or names, but never last names.
Maybe its the way you guys talk about people that makes them not want to be on your podcast. You just insinuated that she was fake and could just have gone on the internet to tell the family what they wanted to hear and then you're surprised when people don't want to come on. You condone people who aren't doctors to diagnose people and you insinuate that people are lying or involved is peoples disappearances. No, the answer is no. You ruined it for yourself they aren't coming on.
2TH?313 flashed in my head when she said "...there's a 3 at the end..." I don't claim psychic, I only mention in case there is something to this psychic thing??? Way far away in both space and time here.
I'm wondering what was behind the decision to share Maura's name and date of disappearance upfront. Not only is this a well known disappearance...certainly in New England where Lori lives...this is a woman who claims to specialize in missing person cases. She portends to work with many missing cases and with law enforcement... in her view she's on a quest to find justice, so of course she knows this case "cold." As an aside, when many, including Lori, remember Maura's story the feeling of that deep winter cold almost immediately strikes...the back roads in blustery NH, a young woman alone at night, her breath almost crystalized and suspended in front of her, and not a light in sight. At least that's how I feel it. The setting is what horror tales are made of! Something similar happened to me in very rural Maine in February. I was lost and almost out gas, and not another car or house light to be seen. Just broken down old barns in fields.. so creepy. Technology likely saved my life that night in more ways than one. Anyhow, onward to your next cast!
I hope they do not ignore her impressions about this matter and take due note for future comparison with others. There might be very valuable information. Psychics (if you will) are like other people in that there are not always details provided or sensed at the exact time that others feel it should be. This does not mean that the psychic is incorrect.
I believe in psychics but even more so when you tell them all the details
I applaud the two of you for being so respectful and sitting through that because after 10 minutes I'd be yelling, "WE ALREADY KNOW THAT!!!!" Lol I thought it was interesting though!
Hey guys love your podcasts and love that you gave the psychic route a shot, when you have a person missing what is there to lose with trying that out!? I have a question, I know based on evidence of lack of footprints in the snow that she must not run off but gotten into someone's car. And if that's the case she must have. But what puzzles me is why she would want nothing to do with help from a school bus driver- a school bus driver to me seems very non threatening- but then a minute or few later accept it from some other stranger? Obviously with force of a gun or something yes, but even that why wouldn't she scream being houses and people were near, and what is the likelihood hood of an armed killer driving past in such a ridiculous short period of time. I definitely welcome input on this I'm genuinely curious on the psyche behind that since I personally would be glad to accept help from the school driver if I'm crashed stranded in the cold. And before accepting help from a stranger I would walk over to one of those nearby houses to use the phone and get help. It just doesn't make sense.
Also, the mention of the name Peter fr the psychic was interesting since petrit is foreign form of Peter. I new a petrit who's family and friends called Peter. And I have always felt like there could be something to the idea that Maura could have been the one to hit him. It would make sense someone to have a break down and skip town over that, as apposed to just family or boyfriend problems that are common for most people. Am I far off here? Lol
seaturtlegrl I think that's a very well thought possibility!!!!
I just started following the case and I am only on episode ten. I started with the podcast with no prior knowledge so I am worried about googling and muddying my mind with trolls comments. Anyways, I just wanted to say a green and white licence plate is also from Saskatchewan, Canada.
Watch Disappeared that features her case.
Was she talking about the license plate being green and white? I thought she was referencing the vehicle and linked it to the police SUV. This may imply different plates being used and there may some other unsolved cases out there.
I did find it very interesting that she said there was a conflicting feeling she got with Maura being alive, but also not alive. This would make sense if she took off and assumed a new identity. Also interesting was the comment that Maura's boyfriend wanted her to think before she did stupid things. But, as most psychics do, she said Maura could be found near water. Which was disappointing. Psychics always say that about missing people.
+Auntie Didi Water indeed! The earth's surface is 70% water. New Hampshire, in particular, has above average precipitation. So, if you guess that water will be nearby, you can't lose. Also, if you say someone could be both alive or dead, you can't lose there either.
Its Didi or if she was killed and her soul hasn't moved on
I feel her body will be found search needs to be done in the area where she said to look
This is an older episode, so my comment may not get spotted, but I'm curious listening to this again: She is shuffling papers as she works? What materials, if any, did she have with her for reference? Just wondering. Great work, Tim and Lance - I'm a fan.
Melissa Lang you can hear the guys saying they were giving her pictures n stuff to look at..
Sooooo.... who was Jack the Ripper, then? Did that psychic lead go anywhere?
shes asking them more questions than they are asking her rofl
The clip played mentions Franconia with familiarity? Did you use a local psychic or someone in the area or already familiar with it or was she completely impartial and from a different area?
If she seriously didn't know 'about' Maura Murray, this gives me the chills. I have always believed Psychics were just throwing darts and then hoping they landed on the bullseye. Eventually they would find a reaction and role with it. But she immediately said they found her car but not her... That makes me wonder... I want to believe in things like Psychics and the Paranormal but I have never had enough of a 'interaction' or 'experience' to find proof. Either way I am open to the possibility. She seems to not have much to say after but knowing about the car and mentioning a SUV is very specific and not overly general it could apply to anyone or anything. Often they say things like Oh you have had a hard life... which everyone has had, those are the ones that ruin the name of Psychics. Very very weird.
It's called cold reading: she asks for bits of info, then she extrapolates possibilities. Notice how she's always responding to info, not offering it up. The initial car guess was lucky...and within the realm of an easy guess.