Versus Strikezone: Darth Bane Vs. Count Dooku (An Obvious Conclusion)
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- Опубликовано: 9 июл 2024
- [0:00] - Introduction
[2:09] - Analysis
[6:55] - Verdict
After writing up Mace Windu versus Darth Malak, I started considering other match-ups that have obvious conclusions but still possess dynamics and interactions that make them intriguing to discuss. Given that my impending collaboration with EvanNova95, Malak versus Dooku, remains so fresh on my mind, Count Dooku became my next candidate. And the opponent for him that I found most intriguing yet pointless was Darth Bane.
Both are classical Lawful Evil Sith Lords who betrayed the academic institutions that brought them up because they regarded them as impure, both are defined by their purist dedications to their respective schools of lightsaber combat, and both even share the distinction of being armed with curve-hilted dueling lightsabers.
My assessment of Darth Bane will be based on his primary appearance in The Darth Bane trilogy of novels, written by Drew Karpyshyn, in addition to the character's manifesto in the Book of Sith, written Daniel Wallace. My assessment of Count Dooku will be based exclusively on Legends continuity material, excluding the 2008 Clone Wars animated series.
Though TCW provides some of the best depictions of the Makashi lightsaber form, it also throws Dooku under the bus in regards to his performance level, playing up his vulnerability against Anakin Skywalker's Djem So technique, and the storyline of the season one episode Dooku Captured humiliating him and stripping him of all credibility as an antagonist. Even the season six episode The Lost One, which provides Dooku's strongest combative showing, also depicts what is easily his most bone-headed strategic decision, where he tries to conceal his involvement in a conspiracy by personally killing a key witness right in front of the people investigating the conspiracy, thus confirming his involvement.
Moving on.
Citations:
- Darth Bane: Path of Destruction - 2:29, 2:40, 2:58, 4:40,
- Darth Bane: Rule of Two
- Darth Bane: Dynasty of Evil -2:25, 2:35
- Attack of the Clones
- Yoda: Dark Rendevous - 2:43
- Labyrinth of Evil - 2:25, 2:57, 4:30, 5:57
- Revenge of the Sith -3:12, 4:03, 6:18
- The Dark Side Sourcebook - 5:38
- The Complete Visual Dictionary - 3:32
- Book of Sith - 4:16, 5:57 
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Id always love to see a young dooku in action, that guy mustve been an absolute demon in his prime, without his physicality being a detriment to him
I tend to believe that Dookus time as a Sith Lord was his prime in a overall sense. Sidious taught him quite a bit and his teaching made Dooku much stronger overall, especially in terms of force abilities which to a point can make up for an aged body.
I think Dooku may have been just as powerful as a jedi and possibly superior as a swordsman, the darkside only added lightning plus other exclusive sith powers.
Sometimes the dark side actually makes force users weaker which is what happened to Sora Bulq.
@@benerdick_cumberbiatch I disagree. During their force exchange in ATOC Yoda says "Powerful you have become,Dooku" which heavily suggests to me that Dooku had grown as a force wielder under sidious's wing. EU comics also show Dooku going out of his own way to acquire sith Holocrons.
And unlike Bulq, Tyrannus actually received a good amount of proper sith training. Bulq just got the basics,since all he was meant to be was a dark Jedi type
@@jacobt1027 Well it may have added some power and more variety, but he was already second only to Yoda as a swordsman and he was already skilled with telekinesis and taught the subject.
Unfortunately, there is very little information on Dooku as a jedi. There is a Disney canon (barf) comic I believe that depicts him and yoda in a sparring match. But like sifo diyas, very little and would require a large amount of assumptions
Dooku got shafted so hard by TCW. It's supposed to be HIS era as the open antagonist to the jedi/heros, yet Maul steals his screen time. And what little screen time Dooku does get is so poorly thought out, just like everyone/thing else.
If Bane and Dooku were born in the same era, I bet that they would have been teacher and student, or possibly master and apprentice, depending on how they interacted.
I will never get tired of witnessing Jensaarai beating the dead tauntaun that is TCW.
Statement: TCW may not be an organic meatbag, but it is a meatbag nonetheless, and must be treated as such.
@@Jensaarai1 Affirmative.
I find it interesting that, while he has the roots of an archetypical Sith Warrior, Darth Bane tried hard to overcome this in order to diversify his skills with the dark side of the Force to pursue his goals of manipulation and concealment in opposition to martial skill. He is basically a natural Berserker who is trying hard to pursue a more scholarly way of the Force like an Inquisitor would. While the assumption is that this combination of martial might with Force training is deadly (and it certainly is all things considered), it also spreads him a bit thin in some ways compared to brutally efficient warriors like Darth Malgus (who imho is the epitome of everything a Sith Warrior should strive to be).
As always, great video, very polished.
PS: looking foward for your collaboration with Evan!
PS2: Have you considered on making a Nerd Rage Rant about the current state of Canon? That would be interesting... however if I had to guess, you are so done with Canon that a rant at this point maybe is redundant, because Legends has essentially become a different media (which is sadly only continued in the SWTOR game no less, a shame).
He pretty much already made his point clear about canon, or at least TCW. Would like to hear him rant and tear down the sequels to make my day. Or at least hear his thoughts about jedi fallen order.
One thing that perhaps isn't quite relavent but still interesting is the fact that the dual phase function on Dooku's weapon can only shorten the blade, it can't enongate it further than it's average height which perhaps shows that Dooku may have studied alternate saber forms like Trakata not nessecarily for use in combat but rather to give himself a better understanding of each type of style he could potentially be going up against and work in counters within his own Makashi technique
How absolutely annoying it is that only NOW, under Disney, we are gonna get some young Dooku footage, which means it's gonna be just a watered down version of what we could've gotten. And to add insult to injury, it's called Tales of the Jedi. How can someone defend Filoni anymore ?
That aside, I actually am on the fence on who would win between the two.
Blind, sheepish loyalty. Ironically, the same braindead and mindless loyalty they (Filoni fans) claim to detest in the clones.
@@bluehero-96 Noticed that firsthand....
Ive heard about tales of the jedi. I've heard that its a show on the clone wars era and empire era jedi? I'm uncertain. Can anybody explain to me?
@@lapplandkun9273 It's yet another Ahsoka hype train set during and slightly after TCW, with also stories of Dooku when he was a Jedi Master. 6 episodes.
@@yrooxrksvi7142 Really? That's disappointing considering Ahsoka is getting her own show, and they're still giving her more screentime when she already has plenty enough? Disney really is milking the shit out of her. Why could they not focus the show on Jedi Dooku and young Qui Gon?
When Bane isnt hopped up on orbalisk juice, he is a surprisingly defensive and cunning fighter. He'd probably pick up on Dooku's enormous dueling talent and desire to quickly slip past his guard, and Bane would adopt a defensive posture, replete with heavy shunts and blocks that jar the old Count's arms. Fatigue would eventually force a mistake in Dooku, but it is Bane's force powers that would conclude the duel long before then. Whereas the Count's powers are always precise and efficient, a natural extension of his fighting style and desire to prove his superiority in skill, Bane would be a true juggernaught of destruction, tearing up the ground, floor and cieling while unleashing torrents of lightning even as they cross blades. Even if Dooku's TK barriers stay up, he would be subjected to a withering storm of pebbles, boulders, and rubble, bloodying, bruising, and eventually battering him to a slow and unpleasant death in an even more viscious echo of Vader vs Luke on Bespin
I agree.
To many Sith, and even a notable number of jedi, Djem So is characterized as an offense or domineering fighting style. However, the cornerstone for any counter-centric style is a duelists’ defense, and Bane himself, before taking the title ‘Darth,’ successfully applied a perfect ‘wait-them-out’ strategy against Sirak on Korriban. Even when Kas'im broke out his two weapon, Darth Bane was not cut-down as Darth Sidious did to 3 Jedi, nor humiliated as Count Dooku inflicted to Kenobi on Geonosis. Even while ‘floundering with the desperation of a drowning man,’ Bane’s own defensive skill and desperation managed to keep him alive until he got outside the temple and brought-down the house.
Even on Tython, against 3 Jedi, Darth Bane had to go pure-defense to protect his face and he held-out; until JOhun Othone cut his hand with a shallow gash.
Incidentally, the hand which was wounded on Tython, was the same limb which developed a tremor 7-8 years later (I think, the wording in a tad vague on which hand Othone wounded).
For the broader subject of this video, I actually view the Force as the most decisive factor between Dooku and Darth Bane. Darth Bane has a slight bad habbit towards combative Force powers and martial skill; whenever he has a lightsaber in-hand he favours martial might over mystical powers. On Tython and in his duels with Zannah, if Bane was wounded or dis-armed, he would apply his Force-powers more proactively; yet with a weapon in-hand he often only applied Force-lightning or reactive telekinetic powers.
Tython=he could Force-grip both Farfalla and Raskta together, or after Othone cut his hand and Bane blasted 3 Jedi away, instead of charging to cut-down Master Worror Bane could have applied a saber-throw, Force lightning or Force-choke to break the preoccupied Ithorian's 4 throat's casually.
Doan=without his Lightsaber, Bane was highly evasive in a narrow corridor to duck around a double-blade lightsaber (even in Zannah's hands that should not be easy), he used a static-barrier to protect himself from one blade, and struck an explosive charge with Force-lightning to cause a cave-in.
Ambria=in Darth Bane's final duel, he never used a Force-throw, nor a sabre-throw. Even after Zannah summoned her Darkside Tendrills, Bane's only solution was Force-lightning, and a bull-rush; a)he could pair lightning with a sabre-throw, forcing Zannah to defend one or the other, b)Bane could borrow a page from Darth Caedus' book and pull one of 3 shuttles at the campsite down on top of Zannah, whom could easily mistaken it for a Force-push, c) Bane could throw-up the static-barrier again as a layer of protection from the tendrils, d) if Zannah could tap into a Force nexus, why could Bane not and begin a mystical tug-of-war to pause or dispell the tendrills?
Even 1 of these options would have at least distracted Zannah and give Bane a clear avenue to charge her. But, he didn't.
Consistently, Darth Bane applies his own powers reactively, after another individual exercises their own against him. The bad news for Count Dooku, is that his own combative Force-powers would coax Bane to "go darkside avatar," responding with his own intense magnitude against Darth Tyrannus. Unlike Anakin or Obi-Wan, Bane has some robust Force-barriers and he's skilled enough to push away Dooku's thrown objects just as Yoda did on Geonosis. A Force-duel between both would actually fatigue Dooku, and unlike Yoda, Darth Bane would cast his own powers directly at Dooku while defending himself from the Count.
If Dooku had Kenobi's degree of creativity and subtly, I think that would confuse and disrupt Bane more effectively; but he does not. Even in the Count's best-case scenario and he does injure Darth Bane, Dooku prefers light cuts to cripple an enemy then kill them as he inflicted on Obi-Wan. Which would re-create the scenario on Tython with Bane channelling the pain into rage and Dooku is screwed.
Personally, I think a hypothetical fight between Dooku vs. Darth Bane, would play-out as a combo of Yoda vs. Dooku and Bane vs. Kas'im.. A martial or Force-duel evenly for the start, or possibly alternating between either type of fight at separate stages, with Darth Bane escalating the longer it goes on. Dooku's lacking stamina aside, I do se that could he injure or disrupt Bane similar to how Kas'im did and take a noticeable advantage, only for Bane to channel an injury or realize Dooku's power is capped and channel his full magnitude in a martial or metaphysical scale the COunt cannot handle.
About their lightsabers, I slightly disargee how it would have no impact on the contest between them. Makashi is thrust-centric and linear, while Djem So's slashes and direct cleaves paired with curved hilt sabers create a slight advantage to the former. In Kendo, or answer school of swordsmanship with a curve or recurve handle, the edge on a slash can have minute changes by twisting at the wrist. Yet in foil-epee fencing, or any thrust-centric technique, a straight handle would demand movement at the elbow for subtle changes in the point of impact; whereas the curving handle has drastically less movement by creating the same changes, at the wrist not the elbow or shoulder.
Dooku's style in highly linear but he can and will apply slashes, parries or blocks, with the curved-hilt creating a broader range of different angles, or he can change and leverage his target around Darth Bane's blade, with less telegraphic hints. Whereas Darth Bane's broad hammer-blows, and even his Juyo jabs, wouldn't apply the same technical range the Dooku holds.
This could transition to a martial advantage, but parring masters of this calibre, the one whom applies their weapon with the higher number of advantages can decide the fight. Dooku exploits this more than Darth Bane does, and could grant him a slightly stronger edge to the martial conclusion.
Here’s what I think. Early fight is 2-1 in favour of Dooku. Bane would come with his very tempered Djem So and could overwhelm Dooku. But if Anakin couldn’t overwhelm Dooku right off the bat, neither would Bane. Dooku’s footwork and fineness would initially cope.
Mid fight is 2-1 in favour of Bane. Bane would leverage his strength against Dooku more, and though Dooku had shown that he could cut around it, he would start to wither. Dooku and Bane would add in their force ability, which Dooku could cope, despite Bane’s great power.
Late fight is Bane 4-0. Dooku would be exhausted, and wither under Bane’s strength with lightsaber and the force. Hence, Bane’s advantage would be 7/10.
As rare as it is to see you post, the videos are always a treat. I don't know if you take RUclips requests, but want to put it out there that Satele Shan is pretty underrepresented in the Star Wars battle community. Maybe Satele vs Bane since you just used Bane.
People underrate Dooku so badly its sad. The guy was literally a living legend. He's the only person to be Padawan to both the greatest light side user (Yoda) and dark side user (Sidious) in one lifetime. His knowledge of the force is only overshadowed by his two masters. People are quick to forget that Dooku had to contend with Obi-wan, as well as Anakin, when he was killed. Sure he dispatched Obi-wan easily, but the fight still started off as a 1v2, It would have been taxing to fight two of the greatest Jedi's of all time, at the same time. People remember Dooku for his final act, that being killed by Anakin, yet they forget his lifetime of achievements. The guy fought Yoda to a stand still, and was known to best Mace Windu in sparring. Dooku is a far superior force wielder than Bane, and he's also a far better duellist, he outclasses bane on every end of the spectrum. The only advantage Bane has is his youth.
Near unbeatable during the clone wars
There was no standstill against Yoda. Dooku realized that he had no chance of defeating Yoda and therefor he created a distraction and escaped.
@@danmarusan2878 yoda slowly gets the edge yes. Also skywalker and voss are the only ones able to disarm the count. Dark disciple teaches us that you must use anger, fear and hatred if you want to defeat Darth Tyranus. You will also need a unpredictable, powerful saber combat style. Without yoda, or drawing on the dark side, hes near unbeatable during the clone wars.
I find it a fun coincidence that this video comes out the same day that the new animated series involving young dooku and teen Quigon announcement made . I’m curious if Disney will continue the trend of portraying Quigon accurately ( minus the age retcon.)
I really don't think it's fair to call this a forgone conclusion if the two are so closely contested.
Bane's greatest weakness in combat is the unorthodox. He relies very hard on his textbook perfect knowledge of the saber forms, and as soon as he goes up against a style he wasn't trained to deal with, he comes up extremely short. Dooku won't be able to exploit the dual-sword weakness, as he doesn't carry a second blade around, but the fact that he studied under the greatest textbook-perfect duelist in history (Yoda), and he was competent enough in all seven forms to train Grievous in them all, means that there is absolutely nothing Bane is bringing to the table that Dooku won't know how to counter or break. And I don't really think Bane is a good comparison to Anakin because we've never seen Bane fight anyone on Anakin's level. The absolute highest I think you can scale Kas'im as a swordsman is Kit Fisto or Satele Shan. So to that end, I think Dooku is skilled enough and familiar enough with what Bane is bringing to the table to pull off a win in the majority of scenarios.
Bane would smack Dooku. End of argument. He’s the most powerful dark Lord of all time. When Lucas said Sidious was, he quite literally hadn’t even created Bane, Plaguies, any of those dudes yet. He said that in the 90’s before the prequels had even come out. Sidious is beyond overrated, especially as a swordsman. Bane’s form 5 onslaught is literally second only to Vader/Anakin in the entire ‘verse, neither Dooku or Sidious would be able to handle it.
@Wes Bradley-Taubner Not really.. Who acts like that lol.. And yes, he would. Bane is stronger than Sidious ever was. Sidious may be a more well-rounded force user, maybe a slightly more skilled one; but not a stronger one. Bane was the reigning master of the physical side of the force until Vader/Anakin came along…. DE Sidious is no more or less powerful than he was in ROTS or at any other point. The force doesn’t work like that dude. He was already 60 years old by ROTS. You do not just keep growing in actual power/strength, not after your physical prime, damn sure not after you’re considered “venerable”…. It is solely the ease with which you can access said power that changes. This is why pre-suit Vader IS the strongest force sensitive in history, at “full potential” Anakin just would’ve just been able to access that power with much less effort. Your skill is what grows or rescinds. Not your actual Strength…. Bane is literally referred to as “the darkside’s most powerful lord” on more than one occasion. When George Lucas said that Sidious was the most powerful Sith ever, he quite literally hadn’t yet even created Bane or Plagueis or almost any other Sith Lords yet that was even before Dark Empire came out. And like I said, HE directly created Bane. Bane is the Sith’ari for a reason, not Sidious. Sidious wouldn’t even be anyways, he sat on his hands while Vader destroyed the Jedi order. I mean Sidious quite literally tells Vader clear as day “Well done Lord Vader, you are more skilled than ANY Sith before you” , that includes himself. Point is, Sidious can’t be the Sith’ari he didn’t fulfill any of its tenets/requirements at all. Bane was. The opposite of the chosen one. He was the strongest Sith Lord ever, because well we don’t really count pre-suit Vader because he lasted all of 5 minutes. (Like 3-4 days). Like I said, before Vader/Anakin he was the master of the physical side of the force, he’s a far better and more knowledgable swordmaster & martial artist than Sidious ever was. Sidious is blatantly overrated as a swordsman. He’s either basically lost or been stalemated in every lightsaber duel he’s ever been depicted in.
@Wes Bradley-Taubner lmao. Because Tom Veitch, the most incompetent writer in Star Wars fiction, wrote it that way bud. And there is a difference between strength and skill, between depth and knowledge. LIKE I said, Sidious may be a more well-rounded more knowledgable force user, but bane is the stronger one. And yes, he WAS just as powerful as he was in DE. It doesn’t matter if you “didn’t see it” dude, like I told you, the force does not work that way. Bane could do the same thing bud . Sidious doesn’t know how to do the vitiate ritual where he literally starts sucking the entire force sssense from countless other powerful Sith Lords around him making them feel like “teeth baring down on their throats” like bane did. Bane was never in the POSITION to where he had to “rip space time open” , which is literally stupid to begin with, like I said, Tom ceitvh was just trying to make something “as crazy as he could make it” , literally no other Star Wars story does anything they ridiculous. That’s not the standard you go by bud. And like I said, Sidious isn’t the ONLY one who could pull that off to begin with. Not at all. Bane, Tulak Hord. Vitiate. All 3 stronger than Sidious ever was…. No, Sidious has more overall, well-rounded KNOWLEDGE than they do, but NOT more raw power, that’s my entire point. Sidious is maybe top 5. At best. His own master was stronger than he was. James Luceno directly stated that himself. There’s a reason he chose to kill him when he was literally passed out shit-faced than to face him head on toe to toe. Sidious is blatantly overrated. Period. Pre-suit Vader, Tulak Hord, Bane, Vitiate, and Plagueis are all 5 stronger than him in terms of direct strength/raw power. Like I said, he maybe be more WELL-ROUNDED than they are, but NOT stronger. Like I said, not even top 5. I put him at #6. At best.
Oh, and the fact that you literally just tried to say Anakin is “overrated” in any regard whatsoever especially as a duelist literally discounts you from this argument altogether. You absolutely have no idea what you’re talking about. Congratulations proving that. Vader/Anakin is literally referred to in more than one place as “arguably the greatest swordmaster in galactic history” , which, he IS. Nice try there.
Always great to see a video from you. Thanks.
4:40, you’re really bringing up a fight from when Bane was a neophyte? 😅
It wasn’t that Bane wasn’t able to deal with Fohargh’s Makashi, it was specifically Fohargh transitioning from Soresu to Makashi faster than Bane was prepared for at that level of his training… and the fact that Fohargh simply had more training and was more skilled at this point.
For the record, Bane utilized Makashi against Zannah in their final duel, and I think it’s fair to say he wouldn’t use it against Zannah unless he was quite proficient in it.
So while it’s advantageous in a general sense to be more masterful of more forms, the simple fact of the matter is that Dooku’s form of choice is Makashi, and Bane’s is Djem-So, notably known to be Makashi’s Achilles’ Heel.
5:07, Dooku’s contention with Mace was remarkably brief, and regarding his fights with Yoda, most sources have Yoda as Dooku’s clear superior, with their last fight being on Vjun, a dark side nexus, where Dooku’s abilities would be enhanced, while Yoda’s, hindered, and Yoda still won. Then there’s Yoda’s parity with Sidious, and the numerous quotes both indicating and outright declaring the disparity between Dooku and Sidious.
6:37, that’s simply untrue. Bane has actually shown remarkable mental fortitude. 20 years pre-prime he plunged his hand in the orb created by the Thought Bomb, and repelled the trapped spirits within with contemptuous ease. For comparison, Darovit barely touched it, and was nearly driven mad, eventually regaining his sanity after being essentially catatonic for a couple to a few hours. Bane, also 20 years pre-prime, was superior to Kaan as a telepath.
And regarding almost succumbing to Zannah’s spell of madness in their final duel, this is more a feat for Zannah than an anti-feat for Bane given how powerful of a sorceress Zannah was.
Honestly pleasantly surprised by your verdict; given the way it seemed to me like you were framing the rest of the video, I didn’t expect you to favor Bane winning… but maybe that’s what you were going for given you apparently thought this match-up to he essentially one-sided, in which case, props I guess! 😅
Well said!
When is Dooku vs Malek coming out?
I think Dooku be it as a Jedi Master or Sith Lord would win he is the ultimate master of Makashi and was considered a high telekinetic servant as a Initiate yeah.
When Jen uploads a video
*visible hapiness*
Nice to see this match in here and I look forward for the matches you've announced for this year. Mainly the Marek vs. Malgus fight.
Been watching so much of your stuff recently. Love you man.
Only if bane doesn't fall in the mid fight which I don't think is as underdog a victory as you say. Dooku was a master swordsman who used all seven forms grounded in makashi, just like you said, where as bane only used 3 grounded in djem-so. Personally I think that while bane was superior in his power and magnitude with the force, it's really dookus game until bane whips out the force abilities. His form is designed to compensate for his age and didn't u quote the novelization as saying that during the fight with obi wan and anakin he "...fought with such grace as to appear to be dancing..." or am I misquoting you there? Yes I understand that's the fight in which dooku died but I place that due more to anakins tactics rather than his swordsmanship.
If bane starts feeling like he’s going to lose then he definitely will unleash his force powers, he did that against kasim in PoD
Dookus is a decade too old
It was simply that Anakin was so angry and enraged by that point that Dooku had nowhere to go. He couldn't back up any further, and Anakin (the single most Force potential of any being ever) is using an innate version of Dark Rage to amplify his output. That said, Dooku has superior skill and a large amount of experience when compared to Bane. For perspective, Bane only had three major duels in his life: the duel with Kas'im, the duel with the Jedi Strike Team on Tython, and Zannah at their duel. Dooku has several more duels even if we discount TCW. And he has definitively lost only two, as his retreat against Yoda wasn't as much a fear of losing to Yoda as it was self-preservation. The whole of the Jedi on Geonosis were on their way to his location and he had to leave. I can't say I blame the man. His loss to Yoda in Dark Rendezvous was pretty definitive, however. Anyway, Dooku also possessed much more variety than Bane in the Force, and more precision in his usage. He also was more willing to use his powers in the middle of a duel, not just when at a disadvantage. He used the Force to set up an engagement, retreat from and engagement, outmaneuver the opponent, blindside the opponent, overwhelm the opponent with a multi-pronged assault, and even end engagements with telekinetic manhandling, Sith Lightning-based torture or murder, or a combination of the two. Bane's Force usage by comparison is fairly elemental.
I still love them both, but I personally give Dooku the advantage here.
Went from watching star wars to star wars. Nice.
My two absolute favorite characters in the verse, happy with either outcome. Miss watching this channel, been away far too long. Cheers from Finland.
I haven’t seen the full video yet
I feel like the outcome of this is obvious (Dooku should take this handily), but I haven’t seen anything from you which makes me think you favor one heavily over the other, so I’m curious what you see in this matchup which makes it one sided, so I’m looking forward to see your analysis on the two
Edit: Yeah, I’ve gotta disagree. Dooku’s technique is superior to Bane’s, and I would say that a duel between them would actually look very similar to the due Dooku had with Anakin and Obi Wan had in season 6 of TCW, as Bane gets frustrated very easily when dueling people who match him as a swordsman, and Dooku’s sheer level of finesse and skill trumps that of Bane’s. Once Bane switched to the Force, I don’t think Dooku would have trouble keeping up. Bane’s best force feat was collapsing part of the ceiling of a Sith Temple as a child, but this level of power isn’t actually unprecedented. Even Darth Maul as a teenager was able to collapse an entire barracks with a Force Scream. While Bane would have grown in power immensely from that point until his prime in DoE, Dooku stands far above that, as I think it’s fair to say teenage Maul pales to Dooku in regards to power, not to mention Dooku’s own feats and direct scaling to people like Windu, Yoda, and the combined power of Anakin and Obi Wan. Looking at Dooku’s feats, I find it hard to look at what Bane’s done and argue he could replicate any of it given his proven struggles against people like Raskta Lsu’s team and a very pre-prime Darth Zannah. And all that’s not even to mention that there are several quotes in Legends which confirm that every Sith in the Rule of Two is beneath their successor in terms of power and knowledge.
Tbh I don’t really see an argument for Bane here, and after reading his novels I don’t see a reason why so many people in the Star Wars Versus community hold him so highly. Honestly I find it hard to argue that he could beat ROTS Kenobi, much less Dooku
School of thought for both dualist for sure you bring good argument for dooku Yes you do.
Banes technique was superb in DOE novel no longer brutish bane cause of the armor he wore on tyhon 2 diffrent styles of banes. Now dooku takes early advantage in the fight and early midway counts best chance is to kill bane midway in the fight.
For dooku lets take a look at what gives him trouble-
At the end of the war count dooku has trouble defeating gg in sparring simply put gg was a pain in the ass to defeat during training.
Savage opress same thing.
obi wan in rots novel dooku does not have the time work out a game plan against obi wan form 3 and obi is his equal in dualing.
Now add in skywalker on the invisible hand with the back fire of dun moch dooku is dead.
Lets take a look at darth bane
physically darth banes at 6.4 heavily muscled takes that.
bane as lightsaber dualist is the best dualist of his day with his specific styles of form 7 form 5 and form 3
bane is a highley strategic dualist bane would re asses his situation if was down in lightsaber combat which he would early in the fight once bane switched to form 3 and applies, patience dooku would be hard pressed to sustain form 2 offensive during the late fight when bane throws in form 7 using form 5 bane would destroy dooku in my opinion.
Its nice too talk to you i have been reading you at least 5 or six years now lets not be strangers anymore.
@@greensaber-specialagent.95 Darth Bane did have a great lightsaber technique, but I think it’s foolish to compare it to Dooku’s. He’s plenty skilled, but you’re comparing him to one of the most precise duelists of all time, someone who’s constantly a threat to those even above his own pay grade because of his sheer skill. Bane certainly isn’t a brute, but I see nothing from him which suggests that he would stand up to an assault from someone like Dooku. While Kenobi was able to stonewall Dooku’s attacks, it must be noted that not only was Dooku downplaying Kenobi, the latter also had assistance from Skywalker AND Kenobi’s mastery of Soresu is highly implied to be the best there ever was. If Dooku were to duel with Darth Bane, I see no reason to believe his precision wouldn’t be able to pierce Bane’s guard.
The thing is that these duelists all enjoy advantages Bane simply doesn’t against Dooku. Grievous’s dueling speed and power puts him above all but the absolute best of all time as a duelist. Savage’s pure physical strength is vastly superior to Bane’s, and even then if Dooku is able to properly defend against Savage’s attacks, he can cast him aside like he’s nothing. I’ve already talked about Obi Wan, and Anakin has not just the strength, but the power to press Dooku with Djem So (as I’ve explained, I believe Dooku is far beyond Bane in terms of power, and an all out Anakin would put him even further beyond that)
Bane may be the best duelist of his day, but he’s still met his match plenty of times, like with Kas’im and Raskta Lsu, neither of whom even come close to the people Dooku has matched.
You say Bane could reassess the situation, but given that even later in life Bane has been shown falling victim to his anger and getting frustrated when on the backfoot, I believe he wouldn’t get much time to do that before he fell victim to Dooku’s blade.
So yeah, I stand by my initial claim, Dooku defeats Bane handily.
@@tannerlowrie8084 Well said. Indeed Your points are well taken so are mine.
Now when we compare feats dooku does take feats.
I have to side with jen1 on this case banes staminia, djemso, juyo, soresu, physicality catch up to dooku and in my opinion bane closes the gap in the late fight and kills dooku.
Bnae in the the late fight breaks threw makashi moon guard defense.
I side with Darth bane.
Great analysis, but I see this fight as being considerably closer. Possibly even a split or 5.5/10 in DoE Bane's favor.
Dooku's only serious weakness against Bane is his old age and waning stamina, and Anakin was able to take advantage of these things in the Invisible Hand fight mainly because Dooku initially underestimated his opponent. He's fought evenly with Windu and contended with Yoda--two duelists with combative and Force feats exceeding Bane's--and his own telekinetic feats and usage of Tutaminis aren't anything to sneeze at either.
Bane would have to lean into the Dark Side hard in order to beat Dooku and while that's entirely possible, Dooku with his greater dueling experience has a good shot at reading what Bane is doing and outfencing him before he can leverage his advantages.
So glad to see you again, hope you’re doing well!
About god damn time you got another video brother XD
Any idea as to when Dooku vs Malak will be coming into the fray?
Glad to see more work from you bro
Good to see two of the best Star Wars characters get some spotlight action in your Strikezone.
yeah this is one fight never in doubt, but would be breath taking to see depicted properly. Great video dude!
Wonder how strong a fully delved into the dark side dooku would be
It's kinda funny how similar their approaches to combat are. Really the only major difference is that Bane is a strength build, while Dooku's a dex build.
Good observation. I minor disagree though, as Darth Bane applies separate pure-off and pure-defensive habbits. Which Dooku has an evasive and balanced push-and-pull style without falling too far into either roll; and the only occassions did did become purely defensive or purely offensive he wound-up in trouble (again Yoda and Anakin, respectively).
@@geoffreyedgson7875 Sounds about right.
I'd like to counter the notion that Bane never faced a Makashi master since his early days as an apprentice at the Sith Academy as Valenthyne Farfalla is heavily hinted at as being a Makashi wielder during their duel on Tython, though it should be noted Bane was wearing his orbalisk armour and therefore was almost completely invulnerable to all forms of attack and so this matchup doesn't really count and it should also be noted that Farfalla was inferior to Raskta L'su who was the only one amongst the group of Jedi who contended evenly with Bane in pure skill and would have killed Bane had he not been encased in his armour, I should also note that Farfalla's own skill level though inferior to L'su's was not fully scaled as Bane basically manhandled him with superior physical strength rather than overpowering him with pure skill.
I’ve got to disagree here.
Not only do I think this conclusion isn’t obvious, but instead a decent fight, I actually see Dooku taking the win. He is considerably more skilful as a duellist than Bane, and is at least comparatively powerful, if not more so given his impressive scaling with Yoda who is comparable to Sidious who is far above Bane.
Banes only advantage is his physicals, but it wouldn’t be enough to carry him. For me Dooku wins this mid-high difficulty
If you were basing your knowledge of bane solely off POD then I’d agree. But just because Dooku CAN scale to yoda does not mean he = yoda and therefore sidious. That’s some very strange logic. Bane has more than enough raw power both in the force and physically to absolutely demolish a combatant like dooku.
@@ohgoditsdave2837 I am not basing my knowledge off of POD, I am basing it off of DOE, and even then Bane had no where near the power to ‘demolish’ Dooku.
Bake is unfortunately stuck beneath a mountain of scaling, with the Sith growing in strength over 1000 years. He was on par with Zannah by the end of DOE, but then Zannah herself would continue to grow in strength until Cognus surpassed her, etc. etc. for hundreds of years until we get to someone like Tenebrous who would therefore be significantly above early ROT Sith such as Bane. Plagueis was roughly on par with Tenebrous by his own admission when he killed him, but Plagueis then grew in power over the next couple of decades until TPM, At which point Palpatine was on par. Palpatine then felt a ‘gravatic shift’ in the dark side after killing Plagueis and wondered if anyone had ever felt so powerful. Sidious then continues to grow in power over more than a decade until ROTS, and then after order 66 the dark side (and Palpatine felt it in himself too) grew stronger with every Jedi death, making him stronger than ever. At this point Yoda is roughly on par with Palpatine as we saw play out, maybe slightly below as he couldn’t beat him. The same Yoda that, although Dooku is below, is still close enough to give a hard fight to. So In conclusion:
ROTS Sidious post-66 > ROTS Sidious pre-66 > TPM Sidious after killing Plagueis > TPM Sidious before killing Plagueis ~ end of novel Plagueis > early novel Plagueis ~ Tenebrous >>> Cognus > later in life Zannah > DOE Zannah ~ DOE Bane
By contrast, ROTS Sidious ~ ROTS Yoda > Dooku
Dooku scales leagues above Bane, sorry. And if you want to look at feats, what duelling feats does Bane have on par with Dooku’s performances against Yoda, Anakin or Kenobi? None even close. What force feats does Bane have comparable to Yoda who Dooku contended with? None even close. In fact Dooku has better tk feats than Bane.
There is almost nothing in Banes favour in my opinion.
Great video! I definitely enjoyed your analysis on both of these characters. I've actually been looking forward to this particular match-up since it was announced earlier this year (aside from Galen Marek vs Darth Malgus). That being said, I do wonder if analyzing Darth Bane from Path of Destruction would still change the outcome of this match-up.
Ressurected Darth Krayt vs Exar Kun.
Oooh now we're talkin! Reborn krayt vs exar kun,That's a fun match
I’d say Reborn Krayt, Exar Kun would fall short in saber combat and Force powers only compounds Exar Kun’s defeat, Exar Kun’s greatest strength and weakness is the same, his reliance on equipment
@@KumaoftheForest I´ve always wanted to see that battle just because i have never seen Exar Kun lose one before on this channel.
Rico Chico Malico and Rob Terra did this one, it's pretty good even if I don't agree with all of their conclusions.
@@wristofkings I agree. They did a good job, and while I agree with their overall conclusion on who would win, I disagree with a lot of points they made along the way.
Darth Bane is a colossus, a genius and master swordsmen. This fight would end similar to Anakin's final fight against Dooku. But I think that unlike Anakin Bane would not end the fight by chopping off Dooku's hands. I think he will disarm Dooku force push him into a wall hard enough to break some bones and then he kills Dooku with force choke.
While I always appreciate a video from Jensaraai, I must say for us plebians, the conclusion is not obvious at all. Yes Bane is more powerful in the force, but Dooku should be strong enough to contend, and while Bane's form has an advantage over Dooku on paper, he doesn't necessarily have the experience or skill to prove it. While I agree with the verdict, I disagree this is an obvious conclusion, and I believe this would be a pretty close fight.
On another note, since you've made your thoughts on the current star wars clear, what are your thoughts on Marvel? Do you think they're slipping? Or are our expectations just too high after endgame?
Also, do you watch Anime? Just asking
Bane is more power in the force but is he more powerful than Anakin? Nah
@@silcoxjakob anakin never reached his full potential. Bane is stronger than anakin by a decent margin
@@silcoxjakob I made no reference to anakin, I just said I agree with outcome but disagree with 'obviousness' of conclusion
I feel like Jen looked at Dooku's final fight with Anakin and saw in Darth Bane that he could repeat Anakin's performance (I be it, to a very slightly higher degree) in a very similar fashion, which is why I think Jen labeled this fight as a obvious conclusion. I honestly don't care that he labeled it this way, as long as he doesn't downplays/messes up Dooku's analysis/viability of a threat he is in this encounter
@@lapplandkun9273 Anakin at full potential blinks Bane away lol. Anakin is far more powerful when he beats Dooku than Bane is, unless you think Bane is close to Sidious (he isn't).
What do you think would happen in a Shaak Ti fight with Dooku? She might be good enough to survive long enough on the losing end for Dooku to burn up most of his energy at that point the fight could tip in her favor.
Are you going to a breakdown on Obi-wan vs Vader at the end of the Kenobi TV show? Would love to hear your take on it. Was he overpowered or was that a true representation of Obi-Wan fighting without the emotional restraint of his friendship with Anakin or was he Disney glorified to be awesome?
Hey just wondering I can’t find your ventress vs sedris video
Even if the conclusion is obvious, I very much enjoy these videos because we get to see more characters compared and pitted against each other. Having it be a forgone conclusion shouldn't hold such interesting versus videos back from being made.
I disagree with your verdict. You're using a soft analogy like Anakin vs Dooku on the invisible hand to justify a late game victory for Bane.
Dooku would never allow it to progress that far, since he's conteded with opponents who scale much higher than Bane, such as Yoda (after running a gauntlet against a 7 and and or 8 by Nick Gillard's scaling) or IH Anakin. Even then, in the IH fight, Anakin had help at the early stages with Kenobi, who actually pushed Dooku. Anakin's native strength would be lower than Banes, but his force imbued strength is far greater, and he has more reserves to draw off of.
Bane is not even close to an equal against IH Anakin, via feats or creator statements, and Dooku running a gauntlet before fighting Yoda automatically puts him much higher than Bane.
Your logic for Bane's victory is purely in a technical sense, while native abilities and feats are an afterthought for you.
What if Ganon was in star wars?
@@abstraction6212 he gets bodied by someone as early as exar kunn. There are quotes and feats putting him at DE sidious level in his Pinnacle during the ritual. Kun at his weakest took out a much larger sith Wyrm with just his voice.
@@DarkLordofTheRizz with the triforce of power he may as well create a galaxy destroyer (A galaxy sized star forge that can destroy a galaxy with a mega death star cannon.) out of thin air, spawn billions of demons out of nothing, create multiple corporations and go crazy with the triforce of power create a supermassive infinite army.
@@abstraction6212 He needs more feats and accolades to even be considered planetary in regards to Ganon. At his very best, Ganon is continent level on his very best day.
Huh, didn’t realize there were so many connections between these two but I think the bout would be very interesting!
Great video as always. Darth Bane is one of my favorite Sith Lords and it’s always nice seeing Dooku get the credit he deserves. Speaking of which, what are your thoughts on the game Star Wars Battlefront Elite Squadron? Specifically the clones X1 and X2.
All right this match is very simple so lets break it down. Sources and all
1. The Banites grow with every generation
"Over a millennium woven with shadowy conspiracy, their dark powers grew, teetering the Force into imbalance." - Databank: Sith Vengeance
"When the apprentice becomes more powerful than the Master, he destroys his Master and chooses an apprentice of his own." - Sith Wars
"Never again would there be more than two Sith Lords at one time, but members of the order continued expanding their dark powers without the knowledge of the Jedi, waiting for the opportunity to seize control of the galaxy." - The Official Star Wars Fact File #1
"As they gained knowledge of the dark side of the Force, their powers increased with each generation." - Episode 1: The Phantom Menace Scrapbook
"For a thousand years, we continued to follow Bane's Rule of Two, existing in the shadows, biding our time, growing in power, feeding our hatred." - Insider #88
"Ultimately, Bane's plan produced more powerful Sith Lords with each generation." - Force and Destiny
2. Each masters power *directly* transferred to the apprentice meaning with each gen their power multiplied
"Bane's power has been passed down for a thousand years. I vow to be its last recipient." - Darth Sidious, Book of the Sith
Even from a distance, she had sensed an incredible burst of power - the same power she had sensed in Bane himself. She didn’t know how it was possible, but it almost seemed as if the Dark Lord’s life energy had burst free of his physical form in one glorious instant, releasing itself upon the material world. Then, as suddenly as she had sensed the presence, it was gone, vanishing like an animal gone to ground.
Darth Bane: Dynasty of Evil
Awake in the oppressive heat, he replayed the events of the previous day, still somewhat astounded by what he had done. The Force had whispered to him: Your moment has come. Claim your stake to the dark side. Act now and be done with this. But the Force had only advised; it had neither dictated his actions nor guided his hands. That had been his doing alone. He knew from his travels with and without Tenebrous that he wasn't the galaxy's sole practitioner of the dark side - nor Sith for that matter, since the galaxy was rife with pretenders - but he was now the only Sith Lord descended from the Bane line. A true Sith, and that realization roused the raw power coiled inside him.
[…]
With 11-4D deep in processing mode, Plagueis withdrew a vial of his own blood and subjected it to analysis. Despite the recent amplification of his powers he sensed that his midi-chlorian count had not increased since the events on Bal'demnic, and the analysis of the blood sample confirmed his suspicions.
- Darth Plagueis
A tremor took hold of the planet.
Sprung from death, it unleashed itself in a powerful wave, at once burrowing deep into the world's core and radiating through its saccharine atmosphere to shake the stars themselves. At the quake's epicenter stood Sidious, one elegant hand vised on the burnished sill of an expansive translucency, a vessel filled suddenly to bursting, the Force so strong within him that he feared he might disappear into it, never to return. But the moment didn't constitute an ending so much as a true beginning, long overdue; it was less a transformation than an intensification - a gravitic shift.
A welter of voices, near and far, present and from eons past, drowned his thoughts. Raised in praise, the voices proclaimed his reign and cheered the inauguration of a new order. Yellow eyes lifted to the night sky, he saw the trembling stars flare, and in the depth of his being he felt the power of the dark side anoint him.
[…]
The dark side had made him its property, and now he made the dark side his.
Breathless, not from exertion but from the sudden inspiration of power, he let go of the sill and allowed the monster to writhe through his body like an unbroken beast of range or prairie.
Had the Force ever been so strong in anyone?
Sidious had never learned how Plagueis's own Master had met his end. Had he died at Plagueis's hand? Had Plagueis, too, experienced a similar exultation on becoming a sole Sith Lord? Had the beast of the end time risen then to peek at the world it was to inhabit, knowing its release was imminent?
Darth Plagueis
3. Maul is the culmination of the Banite line
The Sith Knights were started by a fallen Jedi Knight, who was tempted by the dark side. The secret was that they were patient and they trained and studied, that they didn’t make their presence known to anybody until we get to episode 1 here, where they finally make their move to try and take over the universe.
-George Lucas, Episode 1 fights featurettes
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The Sith are fierce warriors who wield great power. They have been in hiding for centuries, honing their skills and biding their time. Finally, they reveal themselves to the Jedi. Darth Maul briefly appeared on Tatooine. Now he is on Naboo and it takes two great Jedi to battle him.
-Star Wars: Mysteries of the Jedi
4. And of course Dooku is above Maul and equal to Yoda
At the risk of getting a slew of Maul-loving mail, the short answer is that Count Dooku is more skillful than Maul. Think of Maul as a bulldog of a Jedi-killer. He attacks at full speed, full tilt, holding nothing back. That approach has its merits, but it doesn't always apply. Dooku was much more restrained and sophisticated, and he had a much better grasp of Jedi techniques and tactics. Maul was an impressive flurry of fury, barely giving his opponent time to think. Dooku, on the other hand, countered Kenobi's moves almost effortlessly because he knew precisely where to block. This left Dooku with the energy to deliver the surprise blows when his opponent dropped his guard.
(Star Wars Insider Magazine #69)
"Count Dooku's fall has troubled us all," Obi-Wan acknowledged. "Now we have a great and powerful enemy." His thoughts turned to his battle with Dooku. He had never met such power in battle before. He had never come up against something that had completely overpowered him. Even meeting the Sith Lord who had killed Qui-Gon had not been the same.
(Star Wars Legacy of the Jedi)
More sophisticated, more calculating, and if anything deadlier than Maul, Count Dooku (a.k.a. Darth Tyranus) proved himself more than a match for the combined skills of Obi-Wan Kenobi and Anakin Skywalker in Attack of the Clones.
(Star Wars Art: Comics)
ruclips.net/video/NzzckJOwSlk/видео.html
5. Maul is roughly on TPM Kenobi/Qui-Gon level as
Obi-Wan is an exceptional lightsaber duelist and a formidable opponent for Darth Maul. - -The Complete Visual Dictionary
Battling against telegraphing anything, Gillard wrote the fights as real confrontations of near-equals. “This was meant to be like matching Porsche Turbos against each other,” he says with a grin. “And no fight was written with an inevitable conclusion,” he notes. “This makes an outcome all the more unexpected when it happens. - Starwars.com - Episode I: Jedi Swordplay
Keep in mind Dooku godstomped and toyed with a Kenobi who was only able to truly connect with the force *after* the duel with Maul
Though well trained in the Jedi arts, Obi-Wan is young and inexperienced. Only after the death of his Master at the hands of Darth Maul is he able to truly connect with the Force and realise his potential as a Jedi Knight.
(Star Wars: Episode I: The Big Flap Book)
So that lays it out cleanly. Bane gets godstomped by Dooku. No question.
ewww Vegak shit
@@TrajGreekFire Vegak is trash
Great post
@@DB6195 then why are you using something as stupid as he does
Even his mastery of all forms would be meaningless to dooku. Bane was able to literally stop rain from touching him via his Saber. A guy with his strength at THAT speed and precision, both mentally and physically, is going to thrash anyone who also specializes in lightsaber combat, no matter how many more forms his opponent knows.
Still, Dooku is underrated
Do you still have a SubscribeStar? or a Patreon?
Since you've done an assessment for Bane, I'd love to see another Strikezone (likely another Obvious Conclusion Strikezone) between the man that began the Rule of Two and the man who ended it, Palpatine. (Or Vader if that would make for a more interesting fight. Or both. Both is good!)
Could you or evannova95 do Darth jadus vs darth nihilus and lord vs darth marr
Like Malak vs Windu, impressed the entire video is compressed to under 10 minutes, and the analysis itself is about 7 minutes.
1:40 that doesn't show Dooku as weak. Instead it shows the awesomeness of Hondo. Though I'm a bit biased towards Hondo.
Darth Banes development always struck me as intresting. I consider someone with the mind of an Inquisitor and the body of a warrior. His physique, Djem so mastery, and focus on direct offensive force abilities match the Sith warrior but his intelligence, and hunger for knowledge matches a Sith Inquisitor.
Im not sure if I would classify Dooku as a Sith inquisitor given his passion and focus on swordsmanship.
As for this being an obvious conclusion, this is basically Anakin vs Dooku all over again. Bane's greater strength bullies through Dooku's dexterous techniques and beats him down to death. But this isn't unwinable for Dooku.
Dooku does have a chance but it’s not a great one
I like Hondo's character, but I also agree with Jen that it felt like they were degrading dooku simply for the sake of plot.
same dooku slaughters multiple nightbrothers at once and contends with fucking Yoda, there is no consistency
@@TrajGreekFire Dooku contending with Yoda is consistent. It was widely believed that only mace and yoda could match dooku, with anakin and obi wan also reaching that point in ROTS
@@lapplandkun9273 and yet he can't beat hondo's goons because
I know you will hate the title since it references tcw cannon, but a matchup I always wanted to see is Maul vs Ventress (children of dathomir) would love to see your take on it.
believe it or not, that's a matchup i'm currently drafting the script for.
You should do dooku vs Old Ben kenobi
While I do disagree with the verdict of this matchup being "An Obvious Conclusion" I do agree with most of the stated character feats and accolades. I believe Dooku vs Bane mirrors a hypothetical Dooku vs WIndu. Superior Mastery and skill vs superior power and youth. It in my mid could go either way, while neither Bane nor Windu have displayed power on the level of Dooku's ultimate killer, that being an amped rage-fueled Anakin goaded by Palpatine into focusing his rage, both are a great deal physically stronger than Dooku. Despite the physical disadvantage I feel as thought Dooku would be better suited to facing Bane than he was Skywalker or WIndu, Bane possesses neither the nth-degree mastery of Djem-So of Skywalker or the possible Vaapad enhancement and stated history of sparing matches of WIndu. I view this as a matchup of completely opposite masters of combat, the Broadsword vs. the Rapier, and I refuse to designate this as an obvious conclusion, what we have here is to my analysis a match between Mastery and Power, Experience and Youth, and Calm Analysis vs Instinct Reaction. Despite my disagreement as always I applaud and praise your use of true Pre-TCW Expanded Universe material as it 9/10 offers a more complete accurate view of the characters involved. In the case of Dooku, while TCW does have some impressive visuals regarding Makashi I feel it oversimplifies Dooku severely, making him an old man who happens to have an elegant fighting style who gasses 5 seconds into a duel, and makes Anakin's victory over him analogous to Kenobi's victory over Grievous in "canon/TCW Legends". That being a hero beating a villain whom he had been making a fool of for the last 3 years. Anyways Cheers Jensaarai and may the force be with you.
I know that you said that Bane never faced a Makashi user after Fohargh, but isn’t Valenthyne Farfalla implied to also be a user of Makashi?
Implied but not confirmed. Plus the only indication is the line that he "struck with clean, elegant blows, his form perfect as he harried Bane's right flank" which is highly vague.
Versus Strikezone idea: Darth Wredd vs Galen Marek(obvious conclusion/ cunning abductees)
Great Video.
Cal Kestis vs Zayne Carrick
And Rahm kota vs tholme
Zayne wins due to luck manipulation. Don't know what it really is as I do not own the comic, but what I read from another comment is that Zayne has force manipulation, or force luck, that allows him to indirectly ,manipulate the force in his favor against a foe, allowing him to contend and survive against those who far outclass him. Can anyone confirm this?
Voting kota due to greater magnitude of force abilities
Since Kota is a Juyo practitioner he's a master of at least 2 other lightsaber forms since this knowledge its necessary to learn Juyo. He's pretty strong in the force and an experienced tactician. Tholme would have a very hard time. Since the best he could do is keep up until he has nothing left in the Tank. His guerilla warfare tactics would not work against Kota since he's a former child soldier and Jedi Master with lots of battle field experience.
Cal Kestis vs Zayne Carrick sounds pretty interesting though.
@@lapplandkun9273 Based on my understanding the ability Zayne has is supernatural/force luck. He unconsciously manipulates probability to give him the ability to do things he normally can't. On paper, this power is hax.
Can you do a Darth Marr vs battle?
How about Darth talon vs Ahsoka?
What about a army vs series such as the old republic vs the clone wars era?
Talon takes a comfortable win against ahsoka
By far with ease this is your best work.
Me and bradley i mean are creating some good stuff for vs series soon.
By far your best short sweet simple for dolku and bane
scale of 1 to 10
I rate this 10.
Request
Darth nhil vs ki adi mundi
sora bulq vs shado vao
plo koon vs original starkiller
Bulq vs Vao is one I've wanted to see for a while now.
Nihl vs mundi sounds cool
I don’t know if it’s feasible but do you think “Darth Starkiller” could be used in a versus match up?
Honestly, there's just way too little information on him to make a decent video. Far too many random guesses have to be made to get anywhere.
@@kiambraleflore7537 well I mean we already have plenty on starkiller before and the cutscenes after. His lightsaber style seems very similar and his lighting is amplified a bit.
Gary Sue. While I by my admission would discredit those who would consider TFU galen marek/starkiller as a gary sue because the novels and various other supplementary material make it clear that he is not one if they bothered to do their research, Lord Starkiller to me is an example of a gary sue because his entire story involves him winning against all adversaries. There is no way to use him because he is that overpowered, while you can count multiple jedi and sith who can relatively beat galen/starkiller with minor difficulty
@@lapplandkun9273 I disagree with that due to his difficulty with obi wan. Lord Starkiller is a Sith warrior with speed, agility, and lightning. Many characters in the original trilogy are very ill equipped for that type of fighter. Someone like Exal Kreesh would achieve damn near identical results. Vader taught Starkiller more than most Sith teach their apprentices. Allow for a lot of improvement from the apprentice. I’d argue that both Starkiller clones fit Gary Stu more than Lord Starkiller ever would. On top of that, Lord Starkiller leaned into Ataru and Juyo more, meaning that he could keep pace with many Jedi Masters and leverage his Powers more effectively. Obi wan only lost due to the integrated physical strikes which made him lose his concentration allowing for that incredibly small opportunity for Lord Starkiller to exploit. And out fencing Empire strikes back Luke isn’t hard.
Yeah pretty obvious verdict but still interesting to match them up
I would love to see Bane vs Malak one day. I think that would be an interesting contrast
Oh shot, hes alive!
nice vid. reminds me, I wonder what Jensaarai's thoughts on SethTheProgrammer's Sith tier list are. From N tier to S tier, he puts Bane in H tier and Dooku in D tier, heavily relying on the notion that every successor in the Rule of Two is stronger.
I disagree with Bane and Dooku's positions in this system; since Count Dooku was never directly a true Sith under the Rule of Two nor trained from day 1 in those traditions or doctrines. Dooku was a Jedi whom evolved into a unique Sith Lord, after spending 6 decades as a Jedi. He was always a place holder and never sincerely part of the evolutionary line Darth Bane envisioned. He also was never trained as Darth Plageuis or Darth Sidious were, and while Darth Maul was never a true Sith of the same line, his infiltration and combat skills were developed in the same standards and regimens that emerged after 30 Sith Lords and 1,000 years; cullminating in True Sith whom are equals with Jedi Grand Masters.
Personally, even in Darth Bane's era I view him as stronger and greater than jedi GM Fae Coven.
Despite what I feel about the Naruto versus community where they have judges, trashtalk each other, and have discusions on Discord with nothing resolved after about 2 and a half hours, I sometimes enjoy SethTheProgrammer's videos on the Naruto franchise since he knows exactly what hes talking about. Usually when he doesn't talk about that specific universe, I feel he comes up short, I don't feel like the arguments holds that much water. I know you didn't ask for my opinion, but hey, its the YT comments.
EDIT: Just watched the video in question. It seems like he simply put every Sith in, for the most part, a chronological order. without much thought put behind it. I can get behind some of the arguments in the vid, but Bane below Maul and (a Sith?) Oppress seems weird to me.
@@GeneralErlend I agree with everything u said haha
@@GeneralErlend Except its clear he doesn't know jack shit about the franchise. He honestly should have stuck with anime, manga, and comics, because those tend to be right up in his alley where he can present his own analysis while star wars matchups and comparisons are something Jen and the other versus series content creators have already gotten down and know much more than he ever will.
Also, Seth's arguments for various characters is somewhat flawed. He pits two characters such as Kakashi and Sasuke against each other relative to their timeframe and arcs. Not say a character from another arc down the road versus a earlier incarnation of a character. He also presents an ulterior motive for each character by saying they wouldn't kill each other and so were not "bloodlusted". It was the argument he used in his kakashi vs sasuke video, so the characters wouldn't use certain techniques because of "morals".
In his Sasuke vs Akatsuki argument, he states that hebi sasuke would have beaten hidan, konan, and various other lower tier akatsuki members without presenting a wincon for each of them or how they can handle sasuke or work around a way to defeat him. It's just that sasuke wins and that's it because he has advantages over those characters
I hope he doesn’t go back to talking about Star Wars cause that list hurt to watch, especially when you put savage opress who granted is actually underrated, being put in a tier above the likes of nihilus, Malgus, plagueis, and bane himself, when in all honesty I could see them body savage in their own respective ways. I like some of seththeprogrammers stuff but this was definitely not one of them.
Darth bane vs darth plagueis
That's a match-up that I've been toying with since I started my Vs Series, and it's one I keep flip-flopping on.
@@Jensaarai1 I’d love to see it bro. It would be such an interesting match up
Bane did support his superior physicality with armor for a while though with the Orbalisks. Not sure if that helps or hurts against Dooku because there is vulnerability to force lightning there, I don't remember how much it takes since it's been years since I read Rule of Two but apparently it was quite a lot required and Dooku's force lightning wasn't the strongest but if I remember that was a weakness he wasn't cognizant of so if anything it might give Dooku more of a chance given how outclassed he is even when Bane doesn't have it.
An obvious conclusion. For Dooku?
Yes, his defeat
@@jakealter5504 impossible
I have a proposal for another interesting vs obvious conclusion: Darth Vader vs Darth Krayt.
Krayt would definitely be a major threat seeing as he did help to beat abeloth and abeloth makes Vader look like a joke
@@jakealter5504 Yeah, I'd see Krayt winning around 7 times per 10. Though Krayt fought Abeloth with Luke and it doesn't mean they were stronger than her, Vader wouldn't also manage to survive. But the matchup would be interesting.
Rico Chico Malico did this one. IIRC he came to the conclusion that Vader wins 6/10 but that's pretty highly disputed, for me Krayt takes it 6-7/10. Not a stomp by any means but he holds most of the major edges.
@@wristofkings Yeah, your conclusion is pretty much it. Though Reborn Krayt from Legacy War, would have better ods. 8-9/10 ig. Also, not a stomp though.
@@emzonik8851 I meant that abeloth was WAY stronger than Vader
Mara Jade vs Darth Zannah?
mara jade would cut that shit down zannah is too much of a light weight i think would be an entertaining fight tho
What do you think of banite scaling?
The idea that every rule of two sith increased in power.
Because of that some people believe that Bane was only jedi council level.
I don't think Baneite scaling actually works. We know that there were historical gaps in the Rule of Two, plus there's nothing saying Baneite Sith actually have to be stronger. Some apprentices became the master through duplicity (as Sidious did), or through simple opportunism (like Plagueis).
Nonsensical. SethTheProgammer used that scaling. So, by his assessment, Maul was stronger than Bane?
@@wristofkings Exactly its not a perfect ascension of power, hell even in Darth Zannah's case her win was ultimately VERY situational (although if she had successfully built up the energy for a fully power Sith Terror Spell its arguable she could have beaten Darth Bane outright thus Cognus' visions having her win) I would be WAY more okay with Zannah being credited as surpassing Darth Bane had she 1. Had Niman as part of her skillset 2. Had access to force lightning (something every other sith sorcerer has). They didn't even have midiclorian tests back when Bane made the ROT so you can't even use the argument every apprentice could have had a higher M count because each master had no way of knowing at least up until around the prequel area when we know such tests exist
@@lapplandkun9273 I go by the old EU so Maul was never a true rule of two sith and died in TPM and never came back.
I don't like the idea of banite scaling and I like to get other people's perspectives on it.
I was actually banned from a discord group because I thought it was a bad idea.
It just doesn't make sense for Sidious to be over 10 times as strong as Bane.
@@benerdick_cumberbiatch Yeah, I know. I go by TCW and Rebels. But all three versions of maul are weaker than Bane by a huge margin. I don't like the Rule of Two scaling either.
While all three versions of maul had their benefits, TPM maul was calculating and cold. TCW maul was a deranged monster who was a danger to others, and Rebels maul was insightful and knowledgeable. But all three versions of him are weaker than Bane. Especially considering Rebels maul's skills atrophied since he went into hiding from the empire
Might as well add Zannah vs Dooku, Bane vs Ulic Qel Droma and Yoda vs Krayt
Dooku would brush off Zannah's mindfuck and dissect her defense.
Bane vs Ulic is a Djem So slugging match and I think Bane > Ulic (+ Bane's massive edge as a combative force user)
Yoda vs Krayt is super close but leaning on Krayt. They are comp as duelists and force power, but Krayt has hax. Dark Transfer + Shatterpoint is some broken stuff.
Darth Zannah vs Satele Shan!
1.) 2 females
2.) Dark Lord of the Sith vs Jedi Grand Master
3.) Double bladed lightsaber vs double bladed lightsaber
4.) Both freakishly strong in the force
^^ This would be a great match up!
Love your videos bro. Keep it up.
They’re not equal. The point of strikezones being matchups that is interesting to discuss but the conclusion is obvious or there simply is not enough time so it’s shortened as a result
@@lapplandkun9273 satele would obliterate zannah
@@jakealter5504 Exactly
Its kind of funny that alot of people do double bladed lightsaber matchups.
But this I don't think the matchup is super interesting. Satele negates illusions with BM and obliterates Zannah.
@@robertgeorge4602 its not interesting nor its equal. Satele pretty much demolishes zannah
Freaking lol at calling Dooku fighting Yoda “punching above his weight class”
You’re aware Lucas flat said they’re equals right?
death of the author
Could you explain how Bane is stronger in the Force? At all? Like Bane is the first of the rule of two has not done anything to match Dooku's force power or skill. Also what's stopping Dooku from hitting him with force techniques which he does often far faster than Bane
There's nothing to state that dooku is quick on the draw with force abilities even more so than bane. He is just as fast and it would just devolve to a force duel of lightning and telekinesis
@@lapplandkun9273 1. He used them immeadeately on Anakin, Obi-wan and Yoda in ATOC.
2. Proof? Bane is below every rule of two sith that is stated more than once
The rule of two doesn’t just mean each generation necessarily surpasses, over the millennia Jedi and sith generations are more powerful but the strongest surpass their generation, many different sources have confirmed this and bane is always confirmed as one of the most powerful in history whereas dooku is not quite there
@@397llederson6 Well there was the statement by Cognus that Darth Bane was the greatest source of darkside energy she felt despite witnessing Thon contain the dark side energies of Umbria into Lake Nath.
Which means Banes force power > dark side energies that life wiped Umbria which would puts Bane's max power in the multi - continent level. And I don't think Dooku has done anything on that level.
@@robertgeorge4602 How about Anakin stopping a giant storm?
What’s up pateesa!
Dooku wins in my opinion. He's the better duelist and better with force powers. The only disadvantage for Dooku is that Bane has his lightsaber resistant armor.
Better with force powers? Lmao. You’re literally hilarious kid. Bane is literally directly equals with Sidious & Vitiate. What are you even TALKING about.. And Dooku ISN’T that much better than Bane as a swordsman either. Bane is second ONLY to Vader/Anakin as the form 5 master of all of Star Wars. You VERY clearly have absolutely no idea what you’re talking about.
@@dazdavis7896 you know nothing about Count Dooku.
@@LordVader254 😆😆😆😆😆😆😆😆😆😆😆😆 kid, stop fucking talking. Now. I 100% guarantee I know a thousand times more about every single aspect than you do kid, Nice TRY. Stop talking. Even the moderator BLATANTLY said “the obvious winner” is Bane. Because he IS. He would slaughter Dooku. He’s the 2nd greatest Djem So powerhouse in Star Wars behind Vader/Anakin, and he’s a thousand times stronger than Dooku has EVER been kid. YOU know nothing about Count Dooku. STOP bein a blatant fanboy, and like I said, stop talking. Nice try.
@@dazdavis7896naw Dooku has better force powers and is a far better swordsmen. Also Dooku is handsomer
@@kaynawests262 Kid your headcanon IS NOT Star Wars. It is direct in-universe FACT Bane is multiple times stronger than Dooku has EVER been. Sit down…. And he’s the 2nd greatest Djem so master in the ENTIRE Star Wars universe solely behind the Chosen One/Vader. He’d flatten Dooku in seconds in a duel JUST like ROTS Anakin did. ACTUALLY read the film novelization and learn a thing or two about Star Wars kid.
Alas my two favorite sith lords and combatants test their mettle!
Oh, this should be interesting.
Hmm, for a future Strikezone video, how about the Canon Grand Inquisitor vs Jerec. Obviously once Jerec breaks out the force powers the fight ends pretty quickly, though a discussion of their respective dueling styles would probably be interesting.
He doesn't do Canon Characters.
Jerec would turn the Grand Inquisitor into a bloody smear on the wall. Boc, Maw and Sarriss would likely beat him too, but those fights are a bit more even.
@@wristofkings Jerec is low council tier and has shown the ability to kill Jedi Masters while The Grand Inquisitor ended up losing to a Padawan who never properly finished his training.. Enough said.
I think Dooku vs Jerec would be another good obvious conclusion video.. Jerec could challenge him a bit but Dooku no doubt is a significantly better swordsman and force wielder.
I feel like that a fight between the Grand Inquisitor and Jerec would be one-sided confrontation in Jerec's favor given his power in the dark side compared to the Grand Inquisitor.
@@allenmurallo3730 The Grand Inquisitor got made a fool of by a Padawan who never finished his training.
While yes Kyle was a plucky self taught Padawan he already had some good dueling experience and was fighting a significantly weakened Jerec.
Idk, i think it's way closer and not entirely obvious at all, Dooku was comparable to Yoda in terms of skill with a lightsaber. If he starts to get tired either way he'll end it sooner rather than later.
I hold Dooku a tier above Bane personally, so I strongly disagree with this being one sided in Banes favour. But an entertaining video none the less
Can you do a video of Luke Skywalker vs Count Dooku
Which Luke Skywalker? ROTJ, Thrawn campaign, or GM?
To tell the truth, I think ROTJ could pull a dark-horse victory not only due to Djem So and athleticism, but he also managed to defend himself from Darth Sidious' Force lightning for a few moments; should he pull that off I image he can resist Dooku and compel the fight back to martial arts. Dooku is a superior swordsman overall, but if Padawan Anakin could match him on Geonosis and over overextend, I can see Luke managing a better performance since he wouldn't over-commit.
@@geoffreyedgson7875 anakin impressed dooku in ep2 but the advantage was still clearly dooku's I highly doubt ep6 Luke could win. Gm, Luke all the way. Dooku would be a threat that can't be taken lightly but overall outclassed like with Katarn. Idk enough about the thrawn series to give a valid opinion so I won't give one. Otherwise I would
@@greilthelegendaryhero252 Focusing on AOTC Anakin, intialy he did surprise Dooku with twin-lightsabers, yet after Dooku sliced one in half, Anakin fell-back on his own Form V (more Shien than Djem So) and did contend with Dooku for a handful of minutes, longer and better than Kenobi did. personally, i think the Geonosis duel often goes over-looked towards Count Dooku stamina, as he did go through 3 duels back-to-back without the heavy fatigue the ROTS novel describes he felt against Anakin alone.
With ROTJ Luke, a more conservative but still talented duelists, whom I do view as more skilled than Padawan Anakin, a match could be more even than at first glance.
@@greilthelegendaryhero252 I want to say that dookus sword skill would not be matched by skywalkers. I can see dooku disarming him first
ROTJ luke loses hard
Dark Empire Luke takes it in a very close match
GM luke stomps
That's it.
Bane is hardlocked massively below TPM Maul via G-Canon along with a half dozen C-canon sources as well.
Dooku then scales significantly above TPM Maul.
Dooku oneshots. Video only need be the 20 secs it takes to say that.
I’m sorry, are you really saying that Bane is weaker than Maul? How? In what canon is that a thing? How?
@@kingofthings7929 the rule of two Sith grew in power significantly from generation to generation over a 1000 years which is stated in many sources. Dooku being a late rule of two Sith Lord and capable of contending with his eras top tiers should place him above Banes pay grade, who would be massively below those top tiers due to a millennia of significant power growth between him and them.
I don’t agree with Dooku one shotting at all because Bane does have many impressive feats when comparing the two, but I do still hold Dooku a tier above Bane.
@@macattackk Common misconception. The Rule of Two did not produce consecutively stronger Sith over time. It was meant to, but ran into the reality of there being a general cap on how powerful Force sensitives can be. Baring exceptions such as Sidious or Bane, which are uncommon. We can see this in the magnitude of power of the Rule of Two Sith. Dooku was not stronger than Bane, most Sith before and after Bane were weaker than him. Bane was one of those once in a generation force sensitives, like a Sidious or a Revan. The only beings who can surpass someone like that are either the Force Gods of Morris or if you happen to be a Skywalker.
TLDR; the Rule of Two failed to create consecutively stronger Sith because there’s a cap on how powerful a single Force sensitive can be and Bane hit it immediately.
@@kingofthings7929 that is pure headcanon. You can think that if you want, but multiple sources state otherwise
@@macattackk It’s headcanon, it’s what we see. What has Dooku done that surpasses Bane in terms of feats? Or Maul?
And yes, Sidious is stronger than Bane but Sidious stronger than everyone not named Luke Skywalker. And Vader is also a Skywalker so he’s abnormal too.
Also, what are those sources?
Agree
I don’t agree with your assessment of Dooku in TCW. Very few characters could even stand up to him. He outright stomped Savage and Ventress in a 2v1, and beat Anakin every time they fought.
He had to resort to more and more tricks to beat Anakin towards the end and Bane is closer to Anakin in episode 3 where he's top tier form 5 user and a physical juggernaut. Bane and Anakin are Dooku's kryptonite, beasts with enough skill that Dooku can't just outclassed them with finess.
@@kronos1794 Yes, but Anakin beat down a tired Dooku, who had been fighting Anakin and Obi-Wan. In a true 1v1, it’s almost a toss up on who wins.
@@rhuttner12 Not really, later in the clone wars Anakin was straight up beating Dooku 1v1 with Dooku having magna guards. Without help and spamming force lightning Anakin had Dooku more than a few times. Bane and Anakin are just bad match ups for Dooku. He can't outclass them, their styles are hard counter to his, and he can't bully them with the force.
@@rhuttner12 Novel Anakin stomped the carp out of Dooku.
"This is the death of Count Dooku: A starburst of clarity blossoms within Anakin Skywalker’s mind, when he says to himself Oh. I get it, now and discovers that the fear within his heart can be a weapon, too. It is that simple, and that complex. And it is final. Dooku is dead already. The rest is mere detail."
"Dooku’s decades of combat experience are irrelevant. His mastery of swordplay is useless. His vast wealth, his political influence, impeccable breeding, immaculate manners, exquisite taste-all the pursuits and points of pride to which he has devoted so much of his time and attention over the long, long years of his life-are now chains hung upon his spirit, bending his neck before the ax. Even his knowledge of the Force has become a joke. It is this knowledge that shows him his death, makes him handle it, turn it this way and that in his mind, examine it in detail like a black gemstone so cold it burns."
@@7632ios Are we ignoring that Dooku was 1v2ing the Greatest Soresu Master and Djem So Prodigy? If the fight STARTED as a 1v1 the fight would be a lot closer.
YES
Post resurrection Darth Krayt vs either Luke or Sidious
Krayt beats Sidious, but loses to Luke. ((Luke wins with difficulty.))
@@abstraction6212 I agree but I still want to see it LOL
@@abstraction6212 In most cases Krayt, resurrected or not, would not beat post-rots Palpatine. While he may have surpassed Sidious in perfecting lightsaber dueling, he's special abbilities only grant him advantage in specific situations. Raw dark side power of Palpatine is vastly greater than the Tusken's.
@@emzonik8851 if you're referring to dark empire palpatine then yes Darth krayt would actually beat him. After all if Luke Skywalker who wasn't even at the Pinnacle of his power infused with battle Harmony could defeat palpatine, then post Resurrection Darth Krayt armed with shatter point and dark transfer should be able to do the same. At the time palpatine was also incredibly arrogant, he will underestimate the dragon of the sith, and that's a dangerous thing to do especially with someone who's armed with shatterpoint. Having raw power doesn't always guarantee a victory. Darth krayt is powerful in all the right areas to take down any variant of palpatine. He's a vastly better swordsman, he's in better physical condition, and his power is close to sidious. Close enough to where shatterpoint and dark transfer tip the scales in his favor
@@timothyeckard5182 Like I said, I actually meant post cw/rots Palpatine, especially OT Palpatine. Despite what some Dark Empire sources might say (parts of dark empire are non canon anyway), Palpatine in Dark Empire is rather weaker than stronger, he is dying and unstable, his mind is fading, that's why he's loosing his mind (although a few months prior he was actually more reasonable than pre-rotj, as he contemplated oj his mistakes and considered that he might die). Healthy Palps wouldn't allow Carnor Jax to sabotage him. Assuming that OT Palpatine could create force storm, which is very much propable, then DE Palpatine is at his downfall, nit prime. Krayt could defeat him, as decaying clones made DE Palps physically weak. That's why Luke defeated him, not because he was already more powerfull or sth. Palpatine in his original body is a different story though, I see Krayt winning but not in most cases.
Darth Bane would definitely beat Dooku just off of superior force abilities. Dooku is still superior to Malak though
How
@@397llederson6 Are you asking about why I think Bane > Dooku or why I think Dooku > Malak?
@@dynastywarriorlord07 I think he is referring to the force abilities. How exactly would bane be superior to dooku in the realm of force abilities
@@lapplandkun9273 Darth Bane's force lightning was capable of frying someone into ash. Dooku mostly uses his lightning to torture and kill people slowly and painfully but very rarely in any immediately lethal way. Also Yoda was able to easily block Dooku's lightning. If it had been Bane, I think Yoda would have struggled significantly more. Darth Bane is also capable of essence transfer
Malak is ridiculously above dooku
Dooku be it as a Jedi Master Or Sith Lord would best Bane with moderate difficulty in Legends yeah.
The thing is bane is never shown beating a form 2 specialist on Dooku's level and Dooku can overcome opponents who are significantly stronger,Just going by in universe feats I'd feel this is Dooku's game although not a guarantee.Anakin also had time to study form 2 beyond academics and a fight with an inexperienced acolyte.He had multiple encounters with Dooku and designed his style as a result of his loss to Dooku,none of those same factors are in banes corner.In my opinion his force powers simply aren't up to roftl stomping dooku In a heated duel and his power level isn't so high above Dooku that he is going to rag doll him. He's at the tail end of his prime and doesn't enjoy the same advantages anakin does, especially with his injuries that tend to flair up during prolonged fights.
Like who? Dooku got overpowered by Savage who is nowhere near Dooku in skill. He was being taxed by atoc Anakin and lost to him in revenge of the sith.
@@richardajayi3194 Again clone wars nerfed Dooku and gave opress a number of feats that made no sense.Anything that savage managed to do was only when Dooku was purely paying attention to asaji a 1v1 against bane won't involve that.He is shown throughout the fight to effortlessly deflect Savages attacks and jensarri himself says that they overstated the weaknesses of Dooku's form in tcw I mean look what they did to grevious.
@@richardajayi3194 Also Anakin entered essentially an avatar state in revenge of the Sith and had the aid of Kenobi for a lot of the fight. Not to mention the other advantages i pointed out that bane lacks. As well as his only showings against a Makashi user being a failure.
@@TheDixieBassMan Still doesn't change the fact that Dooku is weak to kinetic based attacks. How was Dooku nerfed? He seemed just skilled in the clone wars as the prequals.
@@TheDixieBassMan Anakin beat Dooku because Dooku used Dun Moch on him. Obi-Wan was already incapacited by Dooku so I don't see how he helped him.
Love your VS videos! plz keep em coming :D
As a Dooku fanboy, I disagree ;P
I think Dookus finess is enought to outmanouver Bane and thus give Dooku the time and energy to find propper counters.
I dont se Bane being as "tecnical" as Anakin and that is my premise for Dooku outmaneuvering him and not prime Jedi Anakin.
Personally I don't like this idea for these short versus videos where there is an obvious conclusion I much prefer it when you made your videos as long as they need to be and use characters that actually do need a deep analysis to figure out who would win this is a step back in my opinion
He does strikezones videos because he doesn't have the time to develop a full length video despite the matchup clearly having good thematic elements between both characters
YES, I FUCKING LOVE JENSAARAI ONE VERSUS VIDEOS
I WANT TO FUCKING HEAR FOR AN HOUR WELL-SAID, WELL-RESEARCHED SCHOLARLY-ESQUE ANALYSIS UNLIKE MOST STAR WARS RUclipsRS, WHO TEND TO BE WIDE-EYED OBNOXIOUS FANBOYS
Memes aside, I'm very glad to see a new versus. And doubly so since it is a battle most would see as obvious. We need more of these analyses. Wonderful analysis as always.
There's nothing wrong with wide eyed fanboys. It's that most of them when comparing star wars characters in a fight that they primarily utilized ridiculous and baseless arguments. For example, a few fans argued that anakin was stronger than vader and would beat him in a fight. Rebels Ahsoka is somewhat overrated by her contention with Vader, and people think she's council level. Im serious. Someone on Quora believed that TCW season 7 ahsoka and Rebels ahsoka was Council Level, perhaps even equal to ROTS anakin and obi wan, to which I say fuck that. Even though I like her character and grew up with TCW, people are blowing her dueling feats out of proportion. She stomped the Disney inquisitors most of them who weren't impressive in the first place. Rebels ahsoka is a not a bad duelist, she's actually solid, building up her skillset in during the dark times of the empire, but she is not Vader level and doesn't stand a chance against old ben much less council level masters. Vader was holding back in his duel by a ridiculous margin and once he did try, she could not face him
TEAM MAKASHI & TEAM DJEM SO. i love them BOTH.
i will say an issue with Bane is that he simply has less then what, 5 duels to base him off of? but at least Dooku has had multiple fights across multiple mediums against a wide spectrum to work with. Bane is a bit of that whole Rocky champion ship thing is retire before you fight the new champion type thing. or well. Zhanna did beat him so.
( I understand your issues with 2008 for plot nonsense, but I will contend that some very good insights into him as a physical combatant. everyone has off days against charming Pirates!)
Unfortunately, while I do like Hondo's character (He's just Clone Wars Jack Sparrow and that's enough for me) The episode degraded Dooku as a strategist and his character a bit.
Even Sith Lords have their off days.
I like the analytical style of these videos and as such, I’d like to offer some interesting suggestions for future project ideas:
Darth Vader and Darth Malgus vs Maul and Savage Oppress
Yoda va Maul and Savage Oppress
Ahsoka Tano vs Count Dooku
Shaak Ti vs Asajj Ventress
Kot Fisto vs Plo Koon
*kit fisto
An additional idea matchup is Darth Sidious vs Darth Caedus
Vader and Malgus by a mile
Yoda
Dooku
Shaak Ti
Plo Koon
Technically everybody after bane was stronger as they absorb there masters power but idk how that works in legends
1:37 finaly can we talk about how clone was series makes it look plausible for mandalorians and bounty hunters to go toe to toe with jedi even thought they should've been superhuman? Seriously the marvel and dc movies with lightsaber vfx videos seems to be more aligned with the physical feats of the jedi/sith than the sw movies themselves.
And? What is your point? Durge, Jango and Boba are serious threats to the Jedi even in Legends. Aurra Sing was force sensitive. So in Canon and in Legends the Jedi had trouble with bounty hunters.
Bane would win for the same reason anakin did brute force with precision and speed. And unlike anakin Bane would match and exceed dookus force powers and skills. He will also be able to outlast dooku and ware dooku down. I honestly see this as a stomp unless dooku gets Bane off guard early in the fight
No he wouldn't
@@397llederson6 so bane who has strength on the level with rots anakin along with having lightning stronger tk and speed will not beat dooku explain how jedi knight anakin can beat dooku but darth frigging bane can't
@@StefanWinchester 1. Bane does not match Anakin's strength at all. There is actual incredible feats for Anakin's strength that puts him above bane easily
@@StefanWinchester 2. Lightning that Dooku can block with his hands
@@StefanWinchester 3. What has Bane done in TK that rivals Dooku lifting and throwing a cruiser easily years before his prime