I'm watching streamers that have beta, but never play it. They're giving accounts with level 16's access like yours. I'm missing 3 rogue BiS items and I've done all but 5 quests in the game (scarab lord raid quests and abyssal sceptors) and I still don't have access to test... just seems really biased. I wanted to bug test and try out builds, but now I'm just losing all interest in ever logging in again.
zirene is like the worst player to ask regarding questing and levling. sounds like he literally want a button to click to get to lvl 70. how about removing the ledges? or the things that you use to jump up on the ledges. how about blocking the entrances to the ledges so that the mobs evade and reset? there are more ways to stop the boosting without affecting the classes.
@33:20 The discussion about the warriors, looked into the video to see if I could spot what kind of spec they were. Shameless is Arms with Cataclysms Edge Shaltika is DW with the Warglaive set. Not saying Warriors will be good/bad, just saying you're taking an ideal gearing in t6. I've not delved further into the video to see if Sunder/Expose were up on every trash pack. Would like to see Zirene put together a melee comp on raid testing later today to try it out.
@@OzzyOstwand The Blacksmithing weapon is only BIS in the main hand, it's already worse in the offhand than T5 weapon drops, and Dragonstrike is replaced by Warglaives which is an absolutely massive increase in dps. Dual wielding the blacksmith maces is still good even if it's not BIS, but it's not even possible on Classic TBC as they are mainhand restricted until Sunwell releases. And for Arms, blacksmithing sword is only BIS until Kael'thas Sword, and it's quite a lot worse than Cataclysm's Edge from Hyjal.
If you are hyped for TBC you should be getting "prepared" in classic. Waste of time to grind in the beta if you aren't a streamer/content creator. Alts need levelling, mats need hoarding.
Solution to mage boosting that avoids stealth boosting would be to have a multiplier on a buff that ticks up as you get a kill that consumes for large xp on a boss kill.
Warglaives will be bis single target dps for warriors regardless of what argument you make. Yes 2 slow weapons for trash is bis but for single target warglaives will always be bis, far above anything else. Whirlwind damage makes up such a small amount of your single target dps.
An economists approach to the boosting problem is to just buff questing. If you want people to do it: Incentivize it. People fundamentally chase what they perceive to be valuable. The current discussion on TBC leveling has mage boosting firmly in the lead in that regard. It's not ideal but the original spirit of the game will never be replicated for the reasons outlined in here "its not them it's us".
@@patrickhenry1249 I didn't miss it. The point of my post was to address the discrepancy between boosting and questing and how to address the imbalance. You could also nerf xp from boosting to close the gap even further. I personally have nothing against boosting but there is something to be said about the sentiment being a reflection of player's sentiments on how rewarding the questing experience is.
my only problem with hiding logs is that it seems like they are waiting until no one can do another run with dmf to beat them. Considering the snowboard analogy sno did, to me it seems like they went to the olympics and did the best run ever, but no one was allowed to see it, and then they claim the gold. And then after the event is over they show what they did.
In what world would someone at the olympics be required to tell other people how their trick works ahead of the finals though? If other people bring better innovation they can beat progress’ time.
@@ClassicRoguecraft can you reread my comment? think you misunderstood it. they say they have a world record already, so they've been to the olympics already and gone home with the gold, but they havent showed you the tricks they already did. get it? its like you cant prepare for the next olympics becuase you have no fucking idea what they even did at the last one. because they havent showed it.
@@ClassicRoguecraft but thats the point, it seems to me like they will hold the logs until like 1 day before prepatch launches or until they know there is no dmf before prepatch and then no one is able to even get the chance to take the record back. isnt that kind of shitty? doesnt that go against the spirit of competition at all?
@@Verbstiltzkin You could easily also say that it's against the spirit of competition to believe you need your competitor to give you their strats to beat them. Anyone can innovate new speedrun strats and beat what Progress is doing if they believe they are better at not just execution but innovation as well. In snowboarding for example, my competitor wouldn't expect me to show them how I do every trick I have saved up or expect to have time to take my best trick and perfect it before the final contest. You prepare before the contest and if you're not ready with your own strat and innovation on the day that's on you - not your competitor.
He's spot on to what I think people have been overlooking with these comp calculators. They're juggling modifiers, with no regard to base damage, what are you modifying? They're taking it for granted that warlock/hunter are best and warrior/rogue is bad. Bad players and exceptional players exist.
Since instances are a source of reputation (and we need that!) I think a limit to this would be absolut nonsense! Also the easiest way for Drums is to let everyone use them, WITHOUT a Bonus?!?!??! Leatherworkers craft them, and all can use them. Good for economy good for everyone!
Dual-wielding Blacksmithing weapons is currently not possible on Classic, and will not be until Sunwell. Even if it was it's not the optimal setup, the proc doesn't stack so you'd just run one in the main hand. Warriors in T5 are gonna be scrambling over Rod of the Sun King and Talon of Azshara for the offhand, also gotta hope for Dragonspine Trophy to actually drop. I love the idea of the Warrior novelty stack, but you're gonna run into issues. Think about Kael'thas, how you gonna kill Kael'thas with half a raid full of Fury Warriors, they can't generate rage on his pyro shield. Or think about trying to kill Vashj, all those Warriors get rooted in poison and half your raid is wiped out in an instant. They definitely do a lot of dps, but there are other issues.
the thing is with beta testing is that it makes me hopeful that they will actively tune the raids during the beta so that they are more difficult/challenging.
I think the sunder argument has some validity, but at the end of the day it's only making caster comps look stronger. Even with 6-7 warriors in the raid it's gonna take a little while to get everything sundered up on trash. Depending on how quickly things die that might be too much of a ramp up time on every pull compared to just going full blast right away with a caster comp. It's also worth considering that BT and Sunwell are very much opposites when it comes to trash-boss ratios. A moving wrecking ball comp might do really well in BT where there's a ton of trash and a lot of "weaker" bosses, but in Sunwell there's way less trash (with a higher proportion of "big mob" pulls) and all of the bosses are designed to take a lot of time. Overall, if you don't have a super flexible roster I think a caster comp will be much more suited to deal with most of the raid content, and be much more flexible, while a melee comp might find it's stronger very specifically for just BT.
you guys had some interesting discussion about raid variability for speed run comps. One thing I'm looking forward to is more experimentation by top end raids. I feel like with classic due to the 40 man raid comps and the high stakes nature of DMF and full wbuffed runs, guilds are less inclined to experiment with raid compositions. Do we know for sure that a 25 mage comp with extensive trash pulling isn't viable? Not really, but no one's ever gonna try it so who cares. Hopefully with reduced raid size and less "only 2 runs per month matter" will encourage guilds to branch out and try to shift the meta.
giving exp from dungeon bosses instead of trash is what they do in FFXIV. You still have to implement it properly though, because if the exp per boss is not balanced right, people will just kill the first boss or two and reset, because it's more time efficient than doing the whole dungeon. Though I suppose the instance cap solves that problem. People will still want to kill trash for rep though and might still want mage to boost them for that reason instead.
If instance cap is 30 you will be 70 and instance capped for 3 days... then it doesn't impact you at all... Instance cap is good. Instance cap was not to stop mage boosters. It was to stop bot exploits... For example, they could hack to the end of dire maul and farm 3 nodes instantly and repeat.
People need to chill on the hate to mage boosting. I have levelled 3 characters to 60 boost free (and have two others I am actively levelling via questing) throughout the span of the game and I have never had my ability to enjoy it soured knowing that just behind the corner is a group AFK in SM getting phat xp. I feel like it is a super loud and grouchy minority that is really upset about this, and I think it has more to do with them being a puritan concerned with how others play the game more so than how it actually impacts them. Play on a high pop server and you will see more people out in the world this phase than I remember seeing in vanilla. We have to remember these servers have a lot more players on them than back in the day. I don't play on any low pop servers, so I can't really speak to what the experience there is like.
That raid comp will be awful in sunwell lol. One (disc lol) priest aka 1 MD for Felmyst, one SoC for muru and an affli lock tanking twins monkachrist. Resto druids healing shadow cleave? U have 6 healers I assume u want 5 shamans and imp spirit buff?
If your gunna make raid or dungeons harder then it ever was back in the day, you might as well play on a private server. I don’t see how economy inflation matters. If you have to grind less for your mounts and re-spec it’s better.
There were many reasons, from bot mage boosting, to the bots spamming strat/brd dungeons and such - none of that has been solved though so the point is kind of a tangent.
I am 100% with Zirene. It's getting risky for Blizzard. I am MT, GL and Raidlead in a speedrunning guild and even I feel burned out with Naxx and at risk of never picking up again if we get a break thats longer than 2-3 weeks between actively raiding Naxx and TBC.
1:11:49 Put most or all of the XP in the bosses. Make bosses only spawn after mobs you would normally kill on the way are dead. This prevents mage boosting and also stealth boosting.
I really like the idea of melee comps in t6 content but i would rotate out the prot warrior entirely and play double feral + prot paladin and let the prot be the maintank on bosses. Paladins have insane threat against all the demons and the ferals can do kinda decent dps in catform while not tanking bosses. And u can kick the debuff on RoS and with the right gear a paladin can also tank illidan. Archimonde is kinda different but speedruns in MH are probably a joke anyway and u can swap the prot paladin with a warrior at that point anyway
Progress has been openly telling people their best time from private logs, so people will always know what their current time to beat is to avoid a last day time drop situation
@@ClassicRoguecraft Kinda unfair advantage tho. Don't tell me you guys have never adopted a strategi you guys saw someone else do either from their logs or the vods. It's like the kid in school that wants to read the homework of the others to check if he's good enough, but when someone wants to check his homwork he wont show it, kinda silly. Also, going to be real fun when all guilds hide logs and vods. Cant wait to watch the vod of world fastest BT....oh....wait....
@@soral9999 Its so funny how the guilds on retail went from progressing for world first privately to streaming it and now the trend in classic goes from streaming to not showing it :D
Hey awesome content. I didn't know you guys did wow content but will definitely be subscribing on twitch. I hadn't considered the weapon speeds and alternative options with regards to warrior warglaives prio. Another would be, to your point, the variability of ideal target scenarios. Are warriors better when warlocks / mages can get them to
We had the guild stop doing Naxx so we stopped for the same reason. The rest that wanted to keep doing Naxx took it hard but most found another spot in other guilds. Yep, leveling in classic... you don't stay in 1 zone, you do maybe a handful of quests go to another and then come back or to a third and back to the first, then off again timed to the second if solo with the hearthing and go to this spot and die and take rezsickness as it is so much faster then running around and potentially dying from the mobs anyway.
Why not just nerf the number of targets that any aoe spell can hit to a certain number? There is no reason why we have to allow anyone to hit 300+ targets in one spell
everyone hates on instance cap, level boosting, multi accounts for professions and shit like this.... in the end all economy problems and misbalances comes from Bots! Dont loose focus on this HUGE fucking bot problem!
@7mins 26 secs. Yeahp!, I got access to tbc. I'm so insanely used to addons xD and my complete ui overall, for instance I dnt even have buttons on my screen. most addons and elvui etc doesnt work yet. I got ganked and killed about 30times before i could enter the portal and keybind vanish or sprint xD. auto run macros, auto dismount, instant quest text. holy crap so much things. Then on the other side I have to prep for tbc by leveling alts, gathering profession matts and Raid. and last but not least. TBC is where it started for me, but I kind of wna savior it again like I did with leveling in classic. Those first 2 months of classic launch was the most fun ive ever had in this game or in anygame for that matter. Also another point, I think they moved beyond the nitty gritty bug test, they will just get duplicate reports of bugs now. It's moving more into stress test territory at this point
They could make drums give you a debuff like the "Exhaustion" debuff from bloodlust/heroism. With that you wouldn't force everybody to take leatherworking but it would still be viable to have like 5 people with it in the raid. i don't have any clue why they thought making it more annoying by making it more expensive to craft drums, would make people stop stacking leatherworking. it's just more annoying and why would you like to make your game more annoying to your customers?
Dude, 100% agree with buffing other forms of leveling instead of nerfing mage boosting. Nerfs in all forms always feel bad, so I'm all for finding interesting buffs instead.
I feel like TBC is super grindy, and since its not on a live server and all my progress on the BETA means nothing... I dont want to grind for nothing to show. Reputation on beta, dont care. Levels on beta, dont care. Prebis, nope. I want to do all these things on a live server where my progress means something. I would rather grind gold on classic which will boost me going forward. Also all my friends are on classic so I would rather talk to them there
I want the heroics to be were AOE all the trash pulls is not possible i want to see having to cc 1 or 2 mobs per most pack. I have seen a few videos of beta heroics and it looks like they might be that hard for were the average player will have to cc 1 or 2 mobs on packs that are 4 or higher mobs. And i hope it stays this way until at least the last 2 phases of TBC
"Why are we still doing the raids for the people who don't have the gear from it who helped everyone else get their gear from it?" That's insanely toxic holy lmao.
When you say there arent a lot of people in Beta, im paying subscription to play game, if they want beta testers they should hire people to do it, im not gonna do their job and pay them to do it. I understand why streamers are doing it but for us regular players there is no point.
We need fresh servers or this will epic fail. Naxx ppl will clear t4 in one week. 5156565611654k golds on alts enocomy broken,normal/hc raids no challenge for players who waiting tbc 2 years
all you have to do to solve mage boosting is make it to where mobs are teleported to you after being in combat for x amount of time, problem solved. It's unreasonable to be in combat with trash mobs for 10-15 mins BTW, who says 'mahna' ?
@@MrPeaceFroggy How you figure? It doesn't require much on the devs part. In fact, this already occurs in raids when trying to run from a boss. Simple, easy fix. And what alternative do you have to offer? Please indulge me. Usually when people put a negative spin on an idea with nothing else to offer that simply says it all.
I won't be playing TBC. I don't know why everyone just auto assumes we all want TBC. If Blizz doesn't release a fresh Vanilla server at the end of the current classic server life, I will likely leave WoW permanently. We fought so hard form Vanilla for so long, and were given a very cheap/unfinished version of it. (I still had lots of fun.) However, we were not fighting for TBC. The entire point was to have legacy servers for Vanilla.
@@skeletalarkeus5728 You'd be surprised. My friend. Have fun w/ your TBC servers man, I hope you spent enough hours grinding to compete w/ the inflated economy, or maybe you are into RWT. Either way, sounds fun!
@@skeletalarkeus5728 Dude it's so sad how you kids get on the internet and get so angry. Start projecting all of your emotions onto other people. You are pathetic.
Join the discord with over 7K members and watch vod/live earlier ►► discord.gg/T9XQJw7gJj
I'm watching streamers that have beta, but never play it. They're giving accounts with level 16's access like yours. I'm missing 3 rogue BiS items and I've done all but 5 quests in the game (scarab lord raid quests and abyssal sceptors) and I still don't have access to test... just seems really biased. I wanted to bug test and try out builds, but now I'm just losing all interest in ever logging in again.
zirene is like the worst player to ask regarding questing and levling. sounds like he literally want a button to click to get to lvl 70. how about removing the ledges? or the things that you use to jump up on the ledges. how about blocking the entrances to the ledges so that the mobs evade and reset? there are more ways to stop the boosting without affecting the classes.
@33:20 The discussion about the warriors, looked into the video to see if I could spot what kind of spec they were.
Shameless is Arms with Cataclysms Edge
Shaltika is DW with the Warglaive set.
Not saying Warriors will be good/bad, just saying you're taking an ideal gearing in t6. I've not delved further into the video to see if Sunder/Expose were up on every trash pack.
Would like to see Zirene put together a melee comp on raid testing later today to try it out.
Bis Weapons come from blacksmithing though
@@OzzyOstwand The Blacksmithing weapon is only BIS in the main hand, it's already worse in the offhand than T5 weapon drops, and Dragonstrike is replaced by Warglaives which is an absolutely massive increase in dps. Dual wielding the blacksmith maces is still good even if it's not BIS, but it's not even possible on Classic TBC as they are mainhand restricted until Sunwell releases.
And for Arms, blacksmithing sword is only BIS until Kael'thas Sword, and it's quite a lot worse than Cataclysm's Edge from Hyjal.
If you are hyped for TBC you should be getting "prepared" in classic. Waste of time to grind in the beta if you aren't a streamer/content creator. Alts need levelling, mats need hoarding.
The exact same thing i was thinking !
Whatever helps you sleep at night loser
@@taylorgravely2004 go away douche bag
Solution to mage boosting that avoids stealth boosting would be to have a multiplier on a buff that ticks up as you get a kill that consumes for large xp on a boss kill.
Warglaives will be bis single target dps for warriors regardless of what argument you make. Yes 2 slow weapons for trash is bis but for single target warglaives will always be bis, far above anything else. Whirlwind damage makes up such a small amount of your single target dps.
An economists approach to the boosting problem is to just buff questing. If you want people to do it: Incentivize it. People fundamentally chase what they perceive to be valuable. The current discussion on TBC leveling has mage boosting firmly in the lead in that regard. It's not ideal but the original spirit of the game will never be replicated for the reasons outlined in here "its not them it's us".
@@patrickhenry1249 I didn't miss it. The point of my post was to address the discrepancy between boosting and questing and how to address the imbalance. You could also nerf xp from boosting to close the gap even further. I personally have nothing against boosting but there is something to be said about the sentiment being a reflection of player's sentiments on how rewarding the questing experience is.
my only problem with hiding logs is that it seems like they are waiting until no one can do another run with dmf to beat them.
Considering the snowboard analogy sno did, to me it seems like they went to the olympics and did the best run ever, but no one was allowed to see it, and then they claim the gold. And then after the event is over they show what they did.
In what world would someone at the olympics be required to tell other people how their trick works ahead of the finals though? If other people bring better innovation they can beat progress’ time.
@@ClassicRoguecraft can you reread my comment? think you misunderstood it. they say they have a world record already, so they've been to the olympics already and gone home with the gold, but they havent showed you the tricks they already did. get it? its like you cant prepare for the next olympics becuase you have no fucking idea what they even did at the last one. because they havent showed it.
@@Verbstiltzkin they've not taking the official title until they release any logs/vods. It's unofficial until then, which seems fine.
@@ClassicRoguecraft but thats the point, it seems to me like they will hold the logs until like 1 day before prepatch launches or until they know there is no dmf before prepatch and then no one is able to even get the chance to take the record back. isnt that kind of shitty? doesnt that go against the spirit of competition at all?
@@Verbstiltzkin You could easily also say that it's against the spirit of competition to believe you need your competitor to give you their strats to beat them. Anyone can innovate new speedrun strats and beat what Progress is doing if they believe they are better at not just execution but innovation as well.
In snowboarding for example, my competitor wouldn't expect me to show them how I do every trick I have saved up or expect to have time to take my best trick and perfect it before the final contest. You prepare before the contest and if you're not ready with your own strat and innovation on the day that's on you - not your competitor.
He's spot on to what I think people have been overlooking with these comp calculators. They're juggling modifiers, with no regard to base damage, what are you modifying? They're taking it for granted that warlock/hunter are best and warrior/rogue is bad. Bad players and exceptional players exist.
Doesn't matter how exceptional you are if you play a bad class. The #1 hunter parse in the world was still close to last on his raid's dps.
Since instances are a source of reputation (and we need that!) I think a limit to this would be absolut nonsense!
Also the easiest way for Drums is to let everyone use them, WITHOUT a Bonus?!?!??!
Leatherworkers craft them, and all can use them. Good for economy good for everyone!
Zirene seems to think +4% physical damage does not apply to Hunters projectile damage. I would assume it does.
Dual-wielding Blacksmithing weapons is currently not possible on Classic, and will not be until Sunwell. Even if it was it's not the optimal setup, the proc doesn't stack so you'd just run one in the main hand. Warriors in T5 are gonna be scrambling over Rod of the Sun King and Talon of Azshara for the offhand, also gotta hope for Dragonspine Trophy to actually drop. I love the idea of the Warrior novelty stack, but you're gonna run into issues.
Think about Kael'thas, how you gonna kill Kael'thas with half a raid full of Fury Warriors, they can't generate rage on his pyro shield. Or think about trying to kill Vashj, all those Warriors get rooted in poison and half your raid is wiped out in an instant. They definitely do a lot of dps, but there are other issues.
the start of his comp bit he explained all he cared about with the comp was bt and sunwell.
Does the fact that the warriors can't DW the maces make any difference for your comp or comp ideas?
Going to have 15 raiders who never get loot in this setup lmao
@@johnfrittz5966 Do speedrunners care about Naxx loot?
very nice podcast again. Looking forward to see/hear the next one! Thank you
the thing is with beta testing is that it makes me hopeful that they will actively tune the raids during the beta so that they are more difficult/challenging.
Really Enjoying the podcasts, keep it up?
I agree?
I think the sunder argument has some validity, but at the end of the day it's only making caster comps look stronger. Even with 6-7 warriors in the raid it's gonna take a little while to get everything sundered up on trash. Depending on how quickly things die that might be too much of a ramp up time on every pull compared to just going full blast right away with a caster comp.
It's also worth considering that BT and Sunwell are very much opposites when it comes to trash-boss ratios. A moving wrecking ball comp might do really well in BT where there's a ton of trash and a lot of "weaker" bosses, but in Sunwell there's way less trash (with a higher proportion of "big mob" pulls) and all of the bosses are designed to take a lot of time.
Overall, if you don't have a super flexible roster I think a caster comp will be much more suited to deal with most of the raid content, and be much more flexible, while a melee comp might find it's stronger very specifically for just BT.
you guys had some interesting discussion about raid variability for speed run comps. One thing I'm looking forward to is more experimentation by top end raids. I feel like with classic due to the 40 man raid comps and the high stakes nature of DMF and full wbuffed runs, guilds are less inclined to experiment with raid compositions. Do we know for sure that a 25 mage comp with extensive trash pulling isn't viable? Not really, but no one's ever gonna try it so who cares. Hopefully with reduced raid size and less "only 2 runs per month matter" will encourage guilds to branch out and try to shift the meta.
lost meh at glaives, then the ego stroking started in the comp bit.
those "speedrunning" comps for bt and sunwell are honestly cringe - seems more like a coping warrior rather than a reasonable assumptions
giving exp from dungeon bosses instead of trash is what they do in FFXIV. You still have to implement it properly though, because if the exp per boss is not balanced right, people will just kill the first boss or two and reset, because it's more time efficient than doing the whole dungeon. Though I suppose the instance cap solves that problem. People will still want to kill trash for rep though and might still want mage to boost them for that reason instead.
If instance cap is 30 you will be 70 and instance capped for 3 days... then it doesn't impact you at all... Instance cap is good. Instance cap was not to stop mage boosters. It was to stop bot exploits... For example, they could hack to the end of dire maul and farm 3 nodes instantly and repeat.
People need to chill on the hate to mage boosting. I have levelled 3 characters to 60 boost free (and have two others I am actively levelling via questing) throughout the span of the game and I have never had my ability to enjoy it soured knowing that just behind the corner is a group AFK in SM getting phat xp. I feel like it is a super loud and grouchy minority that is really upset about this, and I think it has more to do with them being a puritan concerned with how others play the game more so than how it actually impacts them.
Play on a high pop server and you will see more people out in the world this phase than I remember seeing in vanilla. We have to remember these servers have a lot more players on them than back in the day. I don't play on any low pop servers, so I can't really speak to what the experience there is like.
That raid comp will be awful in sunwell lol. One (disc lol) priest aka 1 MD for Felmyst, one SoC for muru and an affli lock tanking twins monkachrist.
Resto druids healing shadow cleave? U have 6 healers I assume u want 5 shamans and imp spirit buff?
If your gunna make raid or dungeons harder then it ever was back in the day, you might as well play on a private server. I don’t see how economy inflation matters. If you have to grind less for your mounts and re-spec it’s better.
1:31:05 not the reason why the cap was implemented.
There were many reasons, from bot mage boosting, to the bots spamming strat/brd dungeons and such - none of that has been solved though so the point is kind of a tangent.
Welp the weapon thing went out the window they are mainhand only
I am 100% with Zirene. It's getting risky for Blizzard. I am MT, GL and Raidlead in a speedrunning guild and even I feel burned out with Naxx and at risk of never picking up again if we get a break thats longer than 2-3 weeks between actively raiding Naxx and TBC.
1:11:49 Put most or all of the XP in the bosses. Make bosses only spawn after mobs you would normally kill on the way are dead. This prevents mage boosting and also stealth boosting.
Yep... bosses need to die, but then you get the stealth runs that just kill bosses/select mobs.
I really like the idea of melee comps in t6 content but i would rotate out the prot warrior entirely and play double feral + prot paladin and let the prot be the maintank on bosses. Paladins have insane threat against all the demons and the ferals can do kinda decent dps in catform while not tanking bosses. And u can kick the debuff on RoS and with the right gear a paladin can also tank illidan.
Archimonde is kinda different but speedruns in MH are probably a joke anyway and u can swap the prot paladin with a warrior at that point anyway
Watching these podcasts have definitely peaked my interest in speed running. Keep it up!
private logs is nothing to complain about, dropping top logs on the last day so no one could challenge it would be lame
Progress has been openly telling people their best time from private logs, so people will always know what their current time to beat is to avoid a last day time drop situation
@@ClassicRoguecraft ahh cool, shows how closely i follow it haha
@@ClassicRoguecraft Kinda unfair advantage tho. Don't tell me you guys have never adopted a strategi you guys saw someone else do either from their logs or the vods. It's like the kid in school that wants to read the homework of the others to check if he's good enough, but when someone wants to check his homwork he wont show it, kinda silly. Also, going to be real fun when all guilds hide logs and vods. Cant wait to watch the vod of world fastest BT....oh....wait....
@@soral9999 Its so funny how the guilds on retail went from progressing for world first privately to streaming it and now the trend in classic goes from streaming to not showing it :D
Hey awesome content.
I didn't know you guys did wow content but will definitely be subscribing on twitch.
I hadn't considered the weapon speeds and alternative options with regards to warrior warglaives prio.
Another would be, to your point, the variability of ideal target scenarios. Are warriors better when warlocks / mages can get them to
ty! sure go ahead.
@@ClassicRoguecraft Actually just posted it >.>
Thank you for getting back to me.
We had the guild stop doing Naxx so we stopped for the same reason. The rest that wanted to keep doing Naxx took it hard but most found another spot in other guilds.
Yep, leveling in classic... you don't stay in 1 zone, you do maybe a handful of quests go to another and then come back or to a third and back to the first, then off again timed to the second if solo with the hearthing and go to this spot and die and take rezsickness as it is so much faster then running around and potentially dying from the mobs anyway.
Why not just nerf the number of targets that any aoe spell can hit to a certain number? There is no reason why we have to allow anyone to hit 300+ targets in one spell
So a problem with beta is missing people to quest with? You're making a case against the boost
Boost goes to 58 fyi, not 70. Beta is people leveling in TBC from 60-70.
Blizz screwed up Classic too much...so I think a lot of people aren't gonna bother with TBC.
everyone hates on instance cap, level boosting, multi accounts for professions and shit like this.... in the end all economy problems and misbalances comes from Bots! Dont loose focus on this HUGE fucking bot problem!
@7mins 26 secs. Yeahp!, I got access to tbc. I'm so insanely used to addons xD and my complete ui overall, for instance I dnt even have buttons on my screen. most addons and elvui etc doesnt work yet. I got ganked and killed about 30times before i could enter the portal and keybind vanish or sprint xD. auto run macros, auto dismount, instant quest text. holy crap so much things. Then on the other side I have to prep for tbc by leveling alts, gathering profession matts and Raid. and last but not least. TBC is where it started for me, but I kind of wna savior it again like I did with leveling in classic. Those first 2 months of classic launch was the most fun ive ever had in this game or in anygame for that matter. Also another point, I think they moved beyond the nitty gritty bug test, they will just get duplicate reports of bugs now. It's moving more into stress test territory at this point
They could make drums give you a debuff like the "Exhaustion" debuff from bloodlust/heroism. With that you wouldn't force everybody to take leatherworking but it would still be viable to have like 5 people with it in the raid. i don't have any clue why they thought making it more annoying by making it more expensive to craft drums, would make people stop stacking leatherworking. it's just more annoying and why would you like to make your game more annoying to your customers?
that warrior is stacked with feral buff, wf, hunter buff. like what else do u need?
Dude, 100% agree with buffing other forms of leveling instead of nerfing mage boosting. Nerfs in all forms always feel bad, so I'm all for finding interesting buffs instead.
Any thoughts on Nano's video?
Sno pro snowboarder that is like a master's degree in arts KEKW
who hurt you?
I agree ferals will be main tanks in highly optimized runs
A slave to the slave pen
The reason you have like an Arms war in a Warlock comp is so that the tank can get more threat. Locks will pull threat like crazy.
I feel like TBC is super grindy, and since its not on a live server and all my progress on the BETA means nothing... I dont want to grind for nothing to show. Reputation on beta, dont care. Levels on beta, dont care. Prebis, nope. I want to do all these things on a live server where my progress means something. I would rather grind gold on classic which will boost me going forward. Also all my friends are on classic so I would rather talk to them there
Hype is only low in between episodes.
I want the heroics to be were AOE all the trash pulls is not possible i want to see having to cc 1 or 2 mobs per most pack. I have seen a few videos of beta heroics and it looks like they might be that hard for were the average player will have to cc 1 or 2 mobs on packs that are 4 or higher mobs. And i hope it stays this way until at least the last 2 phases of TBC
Agreed I want it to be a bit of a challenge as well
just fix the pathing? mage boost dead
Zirene just seems like a dusche. Why would anyone play with him?
"Why are we still doing the raids for the people who don't have the gear from it who helped everyone else get their gear from it?" That's insanely toxic holy lmao.
ez sniped
Wow, Zirene is just the worst. Not likely to slog through another one of these videos
When you say there arent a lot of people in Beta, im paying subscription to play game, if they want beta testers they should hire people to do it, im not gonna do their job and pay them to do it. I understand why streamers are doing it but for us regular players there is no point.
We need fresh servers or this will epic fail. Naxx ppl will clear t4 in one week. 5156565611654k golds on alts enocomy broken,normal/hc raids no challenge for players who waiting tbc 2 years
Nobody likes speed runs
all you have to do to solve mage boosting is make it to where mobs are teleported to you after being in combat for x amount of time, problem solved. It's unreasonable to be in combat with trash mobs for 10-15 mins BTW, who says 'mahna' ?
pretty dumb solution..
@@yvngsavage8249 pretty dumb comment
The most stupid solution I've ever seen
@@MrPeaceFroggy How you figure? It doesn't require much on the devs part. In fact, this already occurs in raids when trying to run from a boss. Simple, easy fix. And what alternative do you have to offer? Please indulge me. Usually when people put a negative spin on an idea with nothing else to offer that simply says it all.
I won't be playing TBC. I don't know why everyone just auto assumes we all want TBC. If Blizz doesn't release a fresh Vanilla server at the end of the current classic server life, I will likely leave WoW permanently. We fought so hard form Vanilla for so long, and were given a very cheap/unfinished version of it. (I still had lots of fun.) However, we were not fighting for TBC. The entire point was to have legacy servers for Vanilla.
Think you are in the minority my friend. Hope you can find a private server to enjoy or something
@@skeletalarkeus5728 You'd be surprised. My friend. Have fun w/ your TBC servers man, I hope you spent enough hours grinding to compete w/ the inflated economy, or maybe you are into RWT. Either way, sounds fun!
@@keredification lmao you're actually mad that's hilarious. I was being genuine but fuck you I guess
@@skeletalarkeus5728 Dude it's so sad how you kids get on the internet and get so angry. Start projecting all of your emotions onto other people. You are pathetic.
@@keredification stay mad kiddo. Go smash ur head against the same content over and over.