10mm vs. .357 Magnum For Alaskan Bear Protection Episode 2: Buffalo Bore HardCast
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- Опубликовано: 12 янв 2021
- 10mm verses .357 Magnum for Alaskan Bear Protection? As a Back up gun to your .45-70? Are they the same power? Which one penetrates more? Which would you choose?
Note: We were shooting in a safe location following all Safety Rules!
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I believe that once you run out of ammo the Ruger will make a better war hammer than the polymer framed Glock. 🤔
True but it takes over twice as long to run out of ammo in the Glock.
That's why I got the spiky pointed guide rod for my Tanfoglio. Steel framed "hammer" for pistol whips, and steel spike for stabby stab time.
But my G20/G40 just run.
And you're gonna fight off a bear by pistol whipping him? Doubt that lol
@@rickterrance4981 I think it’s called humor.
@@texasbeast239 I am looking at that Tanfoglio in 10mm, I have a hate affair with Glock ergonomics, sights and trigger after using one as my duty gun.
Big .357 Magnum Fan !!!🤠
Nothing wrong with that
Definitely
Love that gp100! The bronze turned out very nice
Thank you! I'm tickled pink with it.
@@AlaskanBallistics what did the Sarah coat job cost?
@@dangerousfreedom4965 they did it for free to see it on the channel.
I’m a 10mm and Glock fan... but yeah, that thing is beautiful!
Absolutely 😎
While I have no problem with the 10mm, .357 mag has been around and helping people stay healthy since 1935. In all honesty, the best one is one that a given person can shoot the best and can carry in a way to be unobtrusive.
Agreed...
Holy crap! The .357 Magnum is screaming at 973 ft lbs of muzzle energy!!!!! *Grins delightfully*
Yeah surprised me...
Seems weird that a 220 grain bullet which is 22% heavier while 25% slower than the 180 grain has 25% less muzzle energy. Doesnt really make much sense to me since the increased weight seems to not cancel out any of the velocity disadvantage hardly at all. I was thinking just 25% less velocity would have 25% less energy but apparently that is not how it works. Apparently equal mass bullets , one traveling 25% faster has ~77% more energy.
That's how it works.
@@AlaskanBallistics That's why there is truly a science behind bullet technology. And it's all mathematical. And lets not forget sectional density and distance, and barrel length affecting the coefficient. How would both affect a target out of a carbine, at let's say, 150 yards?
I wouldn't personally use either for beyond 100 yards
Thank God! I was worried the. 357 might not be enough. I personally can't shoot much hotter than full house .357. Simply put my wrists aren't as strong as they once were and I would likely just miss with a full house. 44 mag. A hit of .357 is better than a miss with a .44
Well then get your 16 hits with a deeper penetrating 10mm and way less recoil.
I really like that thinking!!!
My wrist and hand is all messed up from working at the slaughterhouse when I was younger and I feel arthritis settling in. I used to shoot the piss out of my old wood handle 44 I had back then and had fun doing it actually but I don’t think I can do much more than my 357 nowadays. We don’t have anything bigger than black bears around here in Tennessee anyway. How’s that 10 mm Glock kick compared to a heavy 6 inch 357 Smith? That’s the heaviest shooting handgun I’ve shot in probably a decade other than that little 410 derringer I got. I feel that mean little bitch kick in my hand a week after. But I’m an idiot too I’ll just blast away till I run out of ammo not even feeling it till I can’t hardly close my hand the next day and I’m like “Oh yeah okay that’s probably what did that” lol.
@flapthecrapster because it's in a heavy semi auto, the recoil is mild
@@AlaskanBallistics thanks for the reply bro and thanks for the videos. I been thinking of getting me one because down here during the ammopocalypse I couldn’t even find hunting bullets for my 308 but there was stacks of 10 mm that and 10 mm is about the same price as 357 if you can ever find it.
Dad unfortunately passed away October 12th. I am the oldest of 4 boys. I say all the guns are all of ours but legally they have to go to a name. We have all decided that we don't care who's name just we can all use them. He bought a Ruger 5.7x28mm in February and never got to put 1 round through it. He also has (had) a 45 Smith and Wesson 1911, a Taurus g2c Millennium 9mm, 32acp 6 shot revolver, 357mag Colt Trooper. Because I am the oldest my 3 brothers are looking to me to do my best and make choices although we have agreed they are all for everyone. This is not including rifles or shotguns! (I believe 17 total rifles and 5 or 7 total pistols) many of these are handed down and unfortunately for most of them I am the only one that remembers the stories of how the guns were acquired. It is hard for anybody to lose their grandfather and especially their father. Sorry for my rant! Ty for the video
Sorry for your family's loss. Praying for y'all. I'm sure you'll make a great decision on each one. Godspeed.
Sorry for your loss
Sounds like a looming fight
I hope you all are doing better, brother. You never fully get over losing a loved one.
Keep your mouth shut and don't involve the government.. you and your brothers divide it up and that's that. None of them are likely " registered " and unless you in a country or one of the couple of communist states in America, you aint gotta register nothing
It's 357 mag for me. If I need more power, I'd pick up a 44mag.
Check out today's video
That will be my next gun
10 mm is good for me both gun's will kill that's all that matters period. Like a Underwood 180 gr extreme Defender it will stop anything.
Everything we played with..10mm did little more damage than the 45..etc..but carry what you can get ammo for..
This video's Fudd Award winner has been found. 🏆
Very good results out of both. Semiauto fans have user friendly 10mm with greater capacity, wheel gun fans have serious knockdown power with recoil friendly 357. I call it even, simply because have always preferred 6 shooters.
Fair analysis sir. Godspeed Ave thank you for watching and the comment.
Yeah but they do make seven and eight shot 357 now and those Moon Clips make it a lot quicker to load
@@user-rd8vp6nq8b don't forget Desert Eagle has 10 round magazines. Drawback is they are heavy.
Both rounds are very awesome
Both seem great. Personally I'm a revolver guy so I love the .357
Lately I've been carrying both into the woods. Godspeed.
Same here... As a gunslinger I'm going with a .357 Magnum revolver - Buffalo Bore hardcast. 🐃💪
I am also a revolver guy. I prefer a revolver for any situation where I might find myself in a physical contact situation or in which perfect grip might be compromised. I do understand the desire for excess capacity.
I think if I were buying a handgun specifically for this application I would either go for a 6 shooter in something starting with a 4 or a 7 or 8 shot in 357. But I wouldn't feel naked with the GP at all.
@@mkshffr4936I agree! A carry a SW 686 plus in .357 magnum in the back country
357 backs up my 454. Both Ruger Revolvers of course. 👍
Nothing wrong with that
My 357 S&W 8 shooter backs up my S&W 500 magnum. Both Killery hole deleted.
Gonna be a late comment but I'd stick with 357! My main gun would be my 444 Marlin!! Great video!!! Hope you never have to shoot a bear.🐻🐻🐻
444 Marlin is a bad dude.
Had a Marlin 444 back in the early '80's, sweet rifle and I preferred it to the 45-70's and like an idiot (I am) I sold it, big mistake. Also had 2 Marlins in 45-70 and like I said, being the idiot I am I sold them too. If it was only possible to kick one's own behind I would surely be eating standing up to this day.
@@sharonw2475 you can get another.
My hubby has a 357 Ruger, with only a 4" barrel. For black bear protection here in Florida, he bought the same Buffalo Bore ammo tested in this video. We feel a lot safe, during our early morning walks - carrying this gun & ammo load !
Good choice. Thanks for watching and the comment
That's perfect....all you need for Florida.
@@TexasBarnRats Yup - just saw a 500 lbs. black bear last week only 3 blocks from our home. A typical 9mm round wouldn't do much against that kind of bulk, if it had charged us. Luckily, nothing happened.
@Mary A the 9mm 147gr +p hardcast would do the job. But I'd still prefer more.
You need to carry one too. Defence is not just for men.
That 357 180 grain must me going 1860 FPS out of a carbine man. 357 mag all day for me cause get more velocity in longer barrels in comparison to 10 mm in carbine slower
Not really a problem for me , we have black bears in parts of the state I live in so either would be fine . I do love that revolver you have, it's really nice. Thanks for sharing.
I love that revolver too. Thanks for watching
I like them both! I stand by my 10mm! Thank you for your time and hard work sir!
You're welcome. I like them both too!!
You got that right 10mm all the way.
I own the Glock20 Gen4 10mm if that means anything but I love the 10mm round.
I plan on getting one of those sometime... love my g40 though shoots smoother. May get another g40 since the wife has appropriated mine
@@AlaskanBallistics check out the Glock 29 as well excellent carry option for those trips to the city and back
@Matt cat I've got a whole playlist with the Glock 29
I figured the 10mm would penetrate a little deeper due to being a heavier round, I was right for once lol. Both are powerful rounds to say the least. Excellent video as usual Chuck, God bless you and the family 🇺🇸
That's all dependent upon speed and bullet construction
I expected the equal-ish momentum and higher sectional density of the 357 round to favor it, but it's harder to predict in water than gel.
One thing is for sure that 357 rocked them juggs way harder!
That's opinion, more penetration is better
@@molochi it turns out the SD is almost identical and so was the terminal performance of these two rounds at least as far as one can tell with jugs. In order to get a precise idea of relative penetration you would need a continuous solidish media like gel blocks.
Thank-you for making this vid.
You just helped me make up my mind.
I've been leaning towards the 10mm.
This confirms it.
I was trying to decide between these two. So glad to have come across this vid. I no longer have to be paralyzed.
You're quite welcome sir. I actually carried both on my 4 wheeler last night up the mountain from my house.
The 10mm is great and I shoot it way better and faster.
I do love that revolver though. But it's more of an heirloom gun now.
And if you're going revolver, especially up here, you go .44 magnum or higher
Thanks for the response.
I'm from the lower °48, but with cougar and mostly black bear, oh yeah, and some crazies.
This should do the job! Mind made up!
G-40! 😊
G40 is the way to go
Great job on the comparison. I like how you've added the energy comparison slide and also the weight retention and not just shot jugs with both. I'd say whatever the shooter is more comfortable with then go with that firearm. I'd take a Marlin 1894 in 357 mag with a sling and the ruger on the hip. Thanks man. Keep up the awesome content.
Thank you for watching. Why not a 45-70 on the hip?
@@AlaskanBallistics That sounds like so much fun. 😉
They are
Not to be in favor of one caliber vs the other but if you have ever taken game with a 357 magnum and seen the destructive contact force it offers over total penetration, it removes parts vs. slow slug penetration and to say that one best the other if you hand load you can get almost the same results minus the 44 mag it reigns king in energy and destructive force depending on, once again handload capabilities.
I played around with this a few years ago and figured out that .357 out of a 6" barrel performs about as well as a .44 mag fired from a 4" barrel.
I'll have to try that
Either one, your well represented!
Much better test this time. It was a lot more even and comparable. Thank you!
Same as before. Underwood just didn't load their 180gr hardcast right in the first test
@@AlaskanBallistics
Yes that's what I meant. No fault of your own. I enjoy your videos
Just got my G40. You and Chuke convinced me to make the buy. I couldn’t be happier
Awesome! Good shooting to you!
I’ll take the 10. I think the fact you have 16 rounds vs 6 gives the advantage to the 10mm. It’s nice to see this resurgence of 10’s and anmo offerings. I’m liking that new M&P 10 a lot. Awesome content here as always.
Thank you kindly sir. Jury is still out on weather the m&p 10mm handles hot loads for bears
Well I went ahead and bought one Super Bowl Sunday and finally got to shoot it this morning. I ran some 200 grain hard casts and a couple boxes of the 135 grain Noslers from Underwood. All in all I enjoyed it a lot, great trigger and I’ll be mounting a dot soon. It’s got s great feel, I seem to shoot it a little better than my 20 but I’m not sure I’m accomplishing anything more than my 20 is capable of. But it’s a keeper, my 4th 10mm with my 220/Bruin/g20- hopefully it does hold up well, it seems well built to me. Only time will tell.
6 rounds vs 16 rounds? If you get 2 or 3 rounds off you would be lucky on a charging bear. I was a guide for 3 years. I was charged twice, one griz and one black bear sow. I didn't kill either one! Luckily muzzle flash and noise scared both. I elk hunt in bear county. I either carry a 500 S&W or a ruger 454 casul. Just my Indian nickel worth. Carry what you want. Good luck and happy hunting!!!
There are many documented cases of people dumping way more rounds with a semi auto than 2 or 3
Did you make eight shot 357 now
I'd wear one on each hip! Thanks for the info. I have the GP 100 with new Altamont grip, love it!
Nice!!!
Like these, thanks, G20 is now a hiking companion, chosen partly with you Alaskans doing these videos
Thank you kindly
It's a great choice honestly if you got the right ammo you can never go wrong with 10mm.
Great video! I originally thought the .357 mag would penetrate more, due to the velocity readings, but the outcome was interesting.
I thought so too. Crazy.
Faster light round = more expansion less penetration
Slower heavier bullet = less expansion more penetration
@@berettaxd7566 Odd. Because 9mm penetrates better than .45 I also suspect 10mm will have better stopping power than 357 because the bullet is heavier.
Thanks a lot. 😣 I just bought a Glock 29, and I place part of the blame on your videos.
(Keep up the great content!)
Your welcome shouldn't fire this in your stock glock without a stiffer recoil spring and fully supported barrel.
@@AlaskanBallistics Duly noted. I've already got a compensated KKM barrel on the way, but I haven't looked into after market springs yet.. Any suggestions?
Alaskan Ballistics Hmmmmmm
No i bought mine used and it already had a titanium spring in it that's a slight bit heavier. My ndz spring has worked well in my g40 so far
@@AlaskanBallistics I'll look into it, thanks!
Either would be a fine backup to my primary backup but both of these would be a shorter barrel version as my last ditch effort to keep breathing. Rifle, followed by a.5" 44 mag with hardcast, followed by the "get this furry slobbering creature off of me" gun. Already own a 3" GP100 Wiley Clapp so I guess that would be my choice for "pinned under the bear" work. Great video Chuck!
Yeah those are good choices
Even though I own a .357 magnum and a Glock 20, I would most definitely choose the 10mm every time. Considering the combination of ballistics and power, 10mm is a total beast of a round.
It is thank you
Honestly, I thought both bullets would penetrate more being hard cast. That cerakote job looks sharp!
Me too.
So from my perspective on bear defense. Near me it would honestly be angry moose but either way. I see anything that consistently is 1100 fps and up is going to net solid results for defense in most any situation. Love the video!
I agree
That GP 100 looks beautiful! I wouldn't feel under gunned with either!
It's awesome for sure. May carry 10mm or .45 super on my chest and it on my hip
@@AlaskanBallistics very nice!
Unfortunately the rounds stick badly in the chambers. Tried cleaning it out with flitz
I use both but definitely prefer the.10mm. Good video
Thank you sir. I prefer the 10mm too
Very useful info!!!! Definitely enjoying the 10mm tests!! 🇺🇸🇺🇸
Thanks man. I've got a bunch of 10mm tests planned
Great video. Both rounds kick butt. The 10mm penetrated slightly more but the 357 mag seemed to tear the bottles apart more with that 973 foot pounds of energy. I do not have a 10mm (yet) but do have a 7 shot S&W 686 357 mag with a 4 inch barrel. I love it.
The Underwood xtreme hunters get about 939 ft lbs in 10mm out of this gun
One would think we this figured by now. Great video! I run an old 66 and got the hard cast rounds for self protection. They fire hard and hit hard. But aggressive bears don't stop attacking quickly according to hunting guides. Trying for 10mm but industry is super backlogged. So I run my old shotgun.
Just waterproof your slugs! Thanks for watching
I've got a S&W model 66 in .357 mag also but felt it was on the lighter side of adequate against very large black bear so I upgraded to .44 mag. I'm glad I did - recoil is very manageable and I'm a middle-aged man average hands and build.
@@sstritmatter2158 The old 44 is a fine thumper as is the 45LC.
High quality, thanks I enjoyed the video
Thank you. Godspeed
Good job, keep em coming!
Thank you. Sorry i didn't see this comment earlier.
I have a new video every Wednesday morning and will do so until RUclips kicks us off. Thanks for watching and commenting and sharing.
There's a reason the Taylor Knockdown formula focuses on momentum, rather than energy. For a big bruin, penetration is your friend. They're genetically predisposed to shrug off flesh wounds. They're kind of Monty Python 'Black Knight' badasses that way...
"I'll bite your leg off"
Yeah that's why these are only backup to your 45-70
Momentum as in a heavy bullet?
Momentum as in mass times acceleration?
@Alaskan Ballistics Not acceleration. Acceleration is the measurement of how quickly something takes to speed up from point A to point B. I think you mean velocity or speed. But still, if momentum is just the calculation of velocity and mass, it really isn't all that different from a bullets energy. Although momentum seems to favor mass more than velocity But I believe they are very very similar. I absolutely do not know much about physics though. Also, my original comment was more just pointing out it seems the Taylor Formula cares more about mass and diameter of the bullet rather than momentum (although I guess you could argue mass is more heavily favored in a momentum calculation than it is in the formula for energy)
You're right i meant speed/ velocity
Neither are guaranteed or likely to drop a bear with one shot, but I think the capacity of the 10mm will be the best advantage, especially when firing under stress.
👍 👍 👍 👍 agreed sir
Truth
@@AlaskanBallistics Unfortunately you're relying on the number of shots rathan than the placement of your shots. That's the expected down fall (negative results) of relying on capacity, instead of accuracy. "Aim small miss small" is a true proverb.
Yeah and it happens so fast that you need both speed and accuracy. Revolvers a demonstrably slower unless you're jerry michulek
bears move fast and you are only going to get 3-4 shots max if they charge out of the woods; its better for a few shots to hit hard than to have unrealized quantity
Thank you for this video comparison. For the Kentucky Grizzly, I carry my S&W 460 Magnum as my primary gun, and backup with my S&W 357 in my left shoulder holster and my Sig Sauer P220 Legion 10mm in my right shoulder holster.
That oughta work
Thank you for watching
I took my GP 100 4” to Alaska last year(fishing). Used the same Buffalo Bore ammo and luckily, never had to verify penetration on a bear. While I was there I was wishing that I had brought a 44 instead! But since I don’t own one, I took what I had.
Better than nothing, still capable and you shoot it well. Good choice
Difficult choice, however I would probably have to say 10mm for me. Simply due to the capacity and penetration. However that GP100 is sweet! Really like the finish and it puts up great numbers since Ruger reworked it!
Yeah it's a tough one but i agree with you there.... 10mm
Love my GP100 and I've smoked 15 deer with Buffalo Bore ammo since 2005.
Nice!! Any big ones?
I think the argument of higher capacity in the semi auto is irrelevant in these scenarios. Especially if these guns are used a back up weapon. In this case, I'm not sure you will get more than 6 or 7 shots off, no way to unload the full mag of 10mm on a charging bear within 50 yards.
You probably won’t get many more than that no, but it’s nice to know that they are there if you need them. Plus the increased penetration in the 10 mm would be nice. Nothing wrong with a .357 though! But if I had the choice I would probably go with the 10mm.
I have 1 box each in 9mm, 40s&w, & 45acp for camping. Depending on which gun I decide to bring I will always have this ammo, Its amazing how the 9mm was able to take down a bear in Alaska from a s&w short barrel, when the fishing guide had come across a rough bear that charged him.
Shot placement and that bear paused just a hair. He got lucky and said he wouldn't do it again. I like 9mm but it's not my first choice ... nothing below 10mm
@AlaskanBallistics so are you trying to negate the fact 9mm took down brown bear??
Are you trying to negate the fact 10mm has more power and penetration and would be better at the job? Also many documented users of 10mm
Best ammo reviews on youtube.👌
Thanks!!! Man please share looks like RUclips is showing me down.
@@AlaskanBallistics 👍👍
Handsome revolver there with that coating. Both those handguns performed equally well. Nice work nice handguns.
Thanks Aaron
Ether might get the job, too many variables and circumstances. I have a 7 shot Ruger GP 100 in .357 and even shooting Buffalo Bore 180 gn'rs follow up shots are pretty quick. Precision cast makes a nice hard cast 180 gn bullet. Love the looks of your .357 with the new treatment. Keep up the good work.
Thank you much. I'll have to look into those bullets!
Too bad there isn't a factory 200 gr hard cast option. Of course it is easy enough to load one up oneself.
I'm still digging that cerakote.
Dang straight it turned that channel giveaway gun into my son's heirloom
Thank you I loved that video! I liked and subscribed because of it! First let me say what great cartridge to 10 mm is! I will own one in the near future. I am also a huge 357 Magnum fan!! 200 more ft/lbs more muzzle energy with the most comprable load than the 10 mm, which is already very healthy! Cool video! Two great cartridges. The 10 mm gave a slight Edge in penetration. Thank you for that presentation.
You're welcome. Thank you for watching and subscribing
Yes you're welcome..
First of all... your GP100 Cerakoted looks awesome! I went with a Glock G29 because it gave me similar energy numbers, 10 rds and shaved off 7 ounces over my 4" Ruger Security Six. So I get a compact form-factor (something I got to liking, carrying Sig P238 in non-bear country), more rounds and less weight! PLUS another biggie for me was that I learned that at night, the iron sites on the Ruger can't be seen and thus would be of no benefit during a 3am disturbance at your tent. Really got to likng the nice chunky night sights on that little Sig. So that also made it a no brainer going for the G29 as a replacement since bunch aftermarket support. Got some Trijicon's waiting to be installed on her.
I love my g29 and it saved my life from a bear with a warning shot
I enjoy my GP100 7 shot. It's not harsh shooting hot 357 loads. I would take it to back up my shotgun. Good content.
Thank you. With a 12ga you would have to waterproof your slugs
Another viable option would be a 44 mag, 45 LC, or 454 casull and pick up a lever carbine in the same caliber. The 45 LC ballistically matches the 44 mag with Buffalo bore ammo with a slightly larger diameter, and 454 surpasses both in terms of ballistics. Then you only need once type of ammo
@@sleeper.simulant7327 I have a 3.5 inch Bond Arms Derringer in 45LC. It kicks like a mule!
@@AlaskanBallistics Please explain waterproofing your slugs.
They're not naturally waterproof like birdshot.
Always an advantage in additional capacity, but I would feel pretty comfortable with either .357 or 10mm for the smaller bears, for the black bear I run into around where I live, I generally carry a 10mm. My old man ran into big bears in the 50's hunting in Alaska, he ran with hopped up .357s initially but dropped those quickly when .44 mag came out.
Good choices.
Holy cow! That bronze gp100 is absolutely stunning!
Thank you man! Call Brian at Ruger to get it done. Be nice if they made a special batch.
@@AlaskanBallistics When I get one, I absolutely will, thanks for the recommendation. A special batch would be awesome, they'd sell like hotcakes!
Thanks for the video. If I was in Alaska I would carry something a bit bigger. In my home state of MN I have both .357 and 10mm available to depending on my circumstances. There is a good population of Black Bears in my area and though they can get to be large typically they aren't aggressive. And the Timber Wolves usually avoid people as much as possible. So a heavy jacketed bullet in either is sufficient.
Well as the video stated only a backup to your long gun, and you would be surprised a number of times ten millimetre has been used here successfully
Good video. Both of those bullets really hammered the target but I can see why the 10 mm is popular. Thanks for sharing and take care.
Thanks for watching brother
Good video. My outdoors carry is a Ruger SP101 4.2" with that same 180gr Buffalo Bore. Here in Minnesota we don't have brown bears. I figure that load is enough for anything around here, with the exception of a moose.
It'll do ok on a moose too
@@AlaskanBallistics Is it possible to use .357 magnum, .44 special, .45 colt standard pressure or + P to counter the ingots and wolves in the overall Buffalo bore outdoorsman load?
Sure
Good comparison. Thanks!
Thank you Pat!
This was really good thats the most foot lbs in a 357 mag that i have seen thank you🙂
It's a powerful one for sure
If I had to worry about bears where I live I would have kept my 460 I have a 357 magnum ruger convertible still so I'm good. Good video.
Yeah these are only a back up to the .45-70. Thank you for watching!
@@AlaskanBallistics shot my buddy's 45-70 revolver it's SAF.
They're both very powerful 👏 I personally believe either will get it done.......
With good shot placement.
@@AlaskanBallistics yeah a head shot but I do remember reading about 3 men exploring and skiing across the north pole, back in the 70's, killed a 1500+ pounds polar bear that attacked them. 5 shots with a 357magnum.
Nice. I've heard one shot with a 10mm but that guy got lucky
Thanks " good work Chuck .
You're welcome thanks for watching!
Great vid! Thanks for the content
You're welcome thank you for watching
Great Video Chuck. Your content is excellent as usual. I love the way you let the 357 "stretch its legs" and play with the big boys. FWIW I have loaded a bunch of 200 gr .358 hardcast with H-110. Without pushing it, it gives 1,200 fps out of a 4" bbl. I wonder how that would compare to the best of 10mm on a hot load?
Hmmm i get 1340 with 200gr in factory Underwood, but that's a 6.5" barrel. So probably close
@@AlaskanBallistics Well, there is your next video then. Unless you have done it since your posting?
I haven't. Haven't started reloading 357 yet
@@AlaskanBallistics Totally understand. I have been loading for over 30 years, but just picked up a couple .357s recently. Loaded some 180 hard casts for them recently.
For the past 30 years it's been all .44 mag, 10MM for Montana Grizz.
Was actually loading some 255 grain Keith bullets over the weekend for the .44
But, 9mm rivals .357 Magnum?! LOL. That long revolver barrel is a beast with that ammo.
Lol yeah love that revolver
Very well done .. I like the Ruger gp in Bronze nice... My pick and mainly it's because i carry a 357 revolver 6" barrel loaded with hard cast 170 grain bullet and i wear a speed loader on the front of my belt which gives me a fast reload ...Both are great ctgs and both have their ++++ to them ...
I know two fellows shooters who carry the 10 mm , there is no doubt about it being a powerful ctg ... Some bear experts with years in the field hunting the big bears say , nothing under .44 mag should be considered as a backup handgun.. But still if and only if one can keep his cool long enough to put bullets in the vital areas a 10mm or .357 could very well save your life ..
You laid it out very well ... good job ..
Thank you kindly sir. I still carry a 45-70
@@AlaskanBallistics I have seen the Magnum Research BFR revolver in 45-70 now that's a backup handgun caliber beyond any doubt ..
I own a Ruger rifle chambered in 45-70 and it has the power to handle the bear problems .. I know only one person who carries a BFR revolver chambered in .444 Marlin, so far hunting with him it's been a fine ctg for big game ...
Yeah for bear protection you don't want a single action. Too slow
Great video, thanks.
Thank you for watching
Buffalo Bore needs to give lessons on how to manufacture 357magnum ammo. Great job by Tim on this one 👏
Underwood could use that lesson if you saw the first video
@@AlaskanBallistics Underwoods 10mm is probably the best but their 357magnum is little more than 38+P+ I've noticed Underwood is usually about 200 fps slower than Buffalo Bore at pistol velocities that's A LOT slower.
10mm Underwood wins, .357magnum anything beats it just about
Great Vid. I feel .357 takes the trophy here. Enough penetration with more energy. 6rds with a speed loader or 2 is capacity enough for me. Easier to shoot=better accuracy. Rds cheaper,more available. Also that is one sexy Ruger!
Rounds aren't more available here. No where as easy to shoot as the 10mm for me, I'm less accurate with it. But if it works better for you, that's great.
Speedloader won't work as i cannot get the spent casings out without a rubber mallet since i got it back from ruger. Polidhed each chamber with flitz, still nothing.
Currently there are plenty of 8 round 357 revolvers. I didn't even know this until a friend showed me his. Hard to beat 8 rounds of 357 in my opinion. Or you can go with the Desert Eagle semi auto that can hold 9 or 10 rounds of 357.
Or 16 rds of 10mm that penetrates deeper will be fine
@@AlaskanBallistics Sounds like excessive case expansion from really hot rounds. Do standard 125gr loads do the same? Also are you seeing primers backing out of the pocket? Those hardcasts are on the high end of the saami spec. Pressures have to be respected.
All casings all ammo does it... not backed out primers brass is pretty
This is what makes this channel awesome - ACTUAL TESTING! In my mind, a 45 Super or even 45 ACP with a heavy enough projectile COULD be optimal. Options are nice! Do you have a Patreon?
I do thank you. Patreon.com/Alaskanballistics
Interestingly, a .45 super is the only round I've shot through a grizzly bear head.
@@AlaskanBallistics joined - thank you! I love all big bore stuff - with 10mm, 45 ACP and Super we have amazing options. I live in Western Montana and we have some big fury critters. A 45 colt took care of business many years ago, so I'm a believer!!
Great work on all you do!
One day at the range, I was teaching a NRA Basic Pistol Class to accomplished shooters as a part of a 3 day NRA Basic/NRA BIT/NRA Pistol Instructor crash course. The temperatures at the outdoor range was between 3 and 6 degrees Farenheit. We had a variety of revolvers and semi-automatic pistols at our disposal for the students to shoot their qualifications with. Every single semi-auto had problems - Rugers, Berettas, Glocks, Smith & Wessons, etc... We only had a few revolvers on the range that day. The Taurus M66 .357 ran like a champ, the Ruger Single Six 22LR ran flawlessly, and even the Heritage Rough Rider 22LR (a $129.99 gun) functioned without any issues.
So the original question that was posed was "Which bear-protection and/or Alaskan capable defensive side-arm would be more effective?" My personal experience lends me to believe that a Taurus, S&W, or Ruger revolver in .357 magnum that is loaded with Buffalo Bore ammunition would be more reliable in the winter conditions that winter hunting/hiking or any outdoor activities in Alaska might offer. I would never trust my life to a Colt Python or Anaconda - the overly tight tolerances make for great competition guns, but those tiny cylinder gaps might play havoc on an otherwise great revolver in temperatures well below freezing.
I carry a 1981 vintage Taurus M66 .357 loaded with 180gr Buffalo Bore whenever I am hunting or hiking. When in-town, my everyday carry is a Glock 43x or 48 or a CZ 2075 RAMI (all 10-round 9mm, all loaded with Federal LE HST hollowpoints).
My point? Bear defense, with Alaskan bear defense specifically mentioned in the parameters. .357 Magnum revolver is more reliable than a semi-automatic Glock in temperatures that are well below freezing. A frozen boomstick is a short metal club, not a gun.
I've tested mine extensively from -10 to 20°f no issues. But i respect your opinion. I'll never carry a Taurus because I've seen too many problems with their quality control.
All of these are back up to your 45-70 anyways.
Thanks for watching and the comment. Godspeed.
Great ammo. Huge improvement. I think they are very comparable. For reliability I would choose the wheel gun. Still think copper might penetrate better.
Wheel guns actually will quit first with mud and dirt and even my old winter gloves getting into the mechanism (my thick glove got caught between the frame and trigger
I like the 10mm but I'll take the 357. I think the 10mm penetrated a little further because it was moving slower, the faster it goes through the water the more energy is lost. That's why harpoons work so well in water.
Don't want 10 more rounds? Ft lbs of energy doesn't kill penetration does
What do you mean energy doesn’t kill the energy out of the 357 magnum was insane number one also a lot of people think that in a real life situation against a charging bear that more rounds is gonna be better but in all reality a bear will literally be on top of you before you can even come close to emptying a full mag on it most of the time unless the bear is a really significant distance away from you but in most real life instances and this is true! you’ll be lucky to get off more than one or two shots so I would want something that’s gonna hit like a freight train and have a shit ton of energy
Energy doesn't kill.. penetration to the vitals does...i
You hit the grizzly in the foot (or guts) with your .357 magnum, and I'll hit it in the head with 147gr hardcast 9mm+p ... which one of us is not getting eaten?
And in reality, many documented cases of people being off 15rds with a semi auto.
Id have to go with the ten mil because i don't have a 357. So choice made for me. Good comparison video buddy.
Thank you kindly
Alaskan Ballistics, im a new subscriber here today. glade to find you like many others. im a 10mm owner. i have the EAA witness combatsport match elite. it will handle rounds up to 1600fps with the right recoil spring. and im talking about 180gr projectiles i load myself. they run 1250fps store bought rounds. i think that 357 is just a bit better than 10mm as much as i dont want to say it. but i love 357mag as much as 10mm. i want you to try the 10mm mag, against the 357mag next time.
Thanks for subscribing! I'm actually going to film 10mm vs. 41 magnum right now. I have no access to firearms or Ammunition for 10mm magnum
Good video! 10 mm definitely has the advantage with the heavier bullet. I like 357 magnum but 10 mm does make a lot of sense. You could always be that one guy and carry both.
Typically i carry a .45 super and a 44 mag. But I've carried my g29 in pocket and my gp100 before
@@AlaskanBallistics interesting honestly out of all your videos I’m really becoming interesting in the 45 super. Is it technically it’s own caliber or a +p variant of the .45 auto? If I ever went to Alaska I’d want either a 10 mm or 45 super and a 357 magnum as backup.
I shoot my .357 gp 100 really well so thats what id carry! I like how you presented facts. Not simple opinions.
That's a smart decision. ! I shot my 10mm better. So i use that. Sometimes i carry both though!
Impressive ballistics from that Ruger, but I think I’d choose the G40 if I was out in BFE just because of the capacity and the ability to carry an additional 15 round magazine. 🤷♂️
Or like me and carry 3 spare mags. Lol thanks for dropping by!!@
Well, I don't have a 10mm but I do own a Smith & Wesson .357 Magnum Model 19 with a 6" barrel, so I will go with that. Both appear to be excellent choices, but in a do or die situation, I see the definite advantage of having 16 rounds at your disposal if you're facing a monster like a Kodiak. I also own a Ruger Super Redhawk .44 Magnum, so if I was in the back country in Alaska, that's probably the one I'd be carrying..., plus a back-up, just in case. Excellent video and very informative!
Thank you very much. sounds like you have great choices
@@AlaskanBallistics Thanks to channels like yours, I’ve been able to make informed choices. Alaska is one of four states I haven’t been to and probably the one I’d most like to see. Must be nice living in a state where natural beauty is at your doorstep.
Awesome, babe!
You're awesome baby
10 mm is a pretty good self-defense round for Bears because you got the capability of having a standard magazine of 15 rounds and they also make extended magazines for them as well given the 357 definitely has more power it's revolver frame and lack of ammo capacity I would prefer to have the 10 mm because it would give me more chances.
Well now, glad this popped into my feed for whatever reason. Can I twist your mind? Here in British Columbia, like the rest of Canada, there in zero carry allowed. We also have the exact same bear populations of Washington and Alaska as we are right between them.
Here comes the twist part, I'm less worried about the bears and more concerned with the mountain lions and wolves. No, not a bobcat or lynx, a panther sized mountain lion. The cats are pure predator and far faster in movement than the bears. The wolves hunt in packs.
To be legal when out hunting in season, each gun weather pistol or rifle has a max capacity of 5 shots in Canada. Yup your 16 round 10mil needs to have a "pin" in the magazine stopping it from taking more than 5 rounds in Canada. The pin can be a small screw that you can remove after leaving Canada.
Even with the hefty restrictions and lack of carry, Canada is one of very few countries that even allow ownership of firearms at all.
The .357 mag. is always gona beat 10mm in real life. I like all calibers and there is no flies on a hot 10mm but 4" .357 would still be my choice close quarters and better yet .44 mag. or .460/.500 s&w for bear, thanks for the video!!!
You're welcome thank you
The 357 kind of seemed to initially dump more energy though, blew that jug straight in half, and it least if you jam in into a bears gut it wouldn't be out of battery. Whatever your more comfortable with I'd say is the better choice
Honestly it might the revolver on my go and the 10mm in the chest holster
Shoot it before it gets close enough to touch.
'dump energy' is meaningless to a bear....; you need an adequate wound, and, as much penetration as possible.
@mdd1963 exactly!
It happened in New Mexico. A guy was attacked by a big black bear and the Glock 10mm went out of battery because the bear was on top of him and the muzzle was against its body. Lucky for him the bear went back and bit his leg so he was able to clear the jam and shoot it in the head as it was clamped on his thigh. One scenario where a revolver is a far better option.
Cheers! 10mm is the best MM
Amen!
They both performed really well. I’m just a 10mm guy myself. I just wish the ammo was more abundant and less expensive.
True
Great video chuck. Pulled both ways. Like the 10mm do 200gr gives better pentrashion do to bullet weight plus hold extra rounds plus fast follow up hits. But 357mag from a revolver is good woods gun and has been for years. Many mountain men live and run dogs in western country and for north east will admit to it. Dad carry one for years in pa with 158gr jsp. To he went to a 9mm+p pocket gun for ccw.
A revolver can be fired faster than 99%of semi auto pistols, and the heavier guns will mitigate recoil better.
The plastic guns are easier to carry and have capacity tho.
@Heywood yep got that right. Why like my heavy slide old ruger sr40c controls recoil and snap of the 40 realy well. As hard hitting big calibers always perferd have a revolver.
I don't think they can be fired faster... the double action trigger would have to be smoothed and lightened quite a bit to achieve that
@@AlaskanBallistics they can. It’s been proven numerous times but even if you don’t believe me. Think about the total movement of the action on an auto pistol vs a revolver.. the speed of a semi auto is limited by the time it takes the action to unlock and the slide to reciprocate backward then forward, the speed of a revolver is limited by the distance the cylinder turns which is on,y limited by the speed of the person pulling the trigger.
Trigger jobs help on a revolver but they aren’t needed if you have a strong hand.
Yeah 12 pound triggers are harder to pull and the reciprocating slide takes the recoil out of the equation. You're not going to fire it faster than ax semi enough that a charging bear notices the difference
Given both function reliably, I'll take accuracy and penetration. Also 15 rounds of 10mm or 6 rounds of 357 in my opinion is a pretty easy choice given both do about the same damage. One thing to consider is when the confrontation becomes physical the 357 edges out the 10mm do to the chances of going out of battery. It doesn't take that much at muzzle contact on most auto's to render them useless. Also if anything gets caught in the slide,(hair, clothing, mud or debris), or chamber you have problems. With the revolver if it isn't putting pinching force on the cylinder or downward force on the hammer, it's likely to go boom.
Nice job!
Keep'em coming my friend!
Those are things to consider for sure.
@@AlaskanBallistics
Weapon retention and disarming. Funny how repetitive training and practice stays with you so long. I was telling a young lady friend some tips on this topic. She said, so how do you remember all this. It caught me of guard. I said touch your nose. She did and I said how do you remember to do that? She had a blank look for a few seconds and then said I get your point. It's true that in any situation you will perform as you have trained. If you have trained right and enough. I figure you are done when it is similar to scratching an itch?! 🤷♂️🤣😂
A fair point
Same with a revolver, bit of mud in the wrong spot and shows over.
if mud or something get under the cylinder if wont fire as it wont be able to lock in place
The physics drag equation is similar to the kinetic energy equation in that the velocity is squared. Meaning that the faster the it is going the amount of drag goes up significantly. All things being equal a heavier bullet with the same energy as a lighter faster bullet will penetrate deeper. I bet if you wanted an even more impressive number for kinetic energy you could go to a lighter bullet in the .357 but you would likely lose penetration once again everything else being equal a 140 grain brass or copper machined homogeneous solid may deform less and penetrate better.
Cool video between the two calibers with buffalo bore. Its moving pretty fast out of the .357. 10mm is still the best mm though.
Agreed
Thanks for watching brother
Thanks for the great demo. I usually just ask the bear what he would prefer.
Good idea
With similar penetration I would go with the round that has more kinetic energy dumped into the target.
Good point, but it's different with different ammo ruclips.net/video/jKCi0BP79LM/видео.html
Trying to recall the comparison with these two and when you tested your .44 magnum in the 2.75" Ruger Kodiak redhawk?
This one? ruclips.net/video/OniKk-UUWD8/видео.html
That was a good test Chuck
Thank you sir
Excellent. Thanks. I don't have a 10mm, but man that is something you have there. That specific model would definitely do just fine.
I tend to break plastic clips and connectors more when it's cold out - so, I have always wondered if polymer framed firearms fatigue any faster when discharged in cold weather.
Anyway, that wouldn't stop me from wanting one now. Thanks.
They don't. It's polymer not plastic
I think that I'd take the 16 rounds of the 10mm as a primary backup. Secondary backup ... a .357 Magnum, probably a Ruger Redhawk Alaskan or a Smith N-frame, either with 8 shots.
I think I'd take a 6 shot 44 mag as a back up to my back up, but gotta have at least 4" barrel to stabilize a lot of bullets
@@AlaskanBallistics I can agree with the barrel length, but a 180-grain solid from a .357 is going to penetrate. I'm looking for penetration here--get to the lungs/heart of the bear. If that means that I can hold two more shots in the cylinder, I think I'd go with it. Having said that, if I had to actually go out and get a S&W 27, I think I'd save the money and use the Ruger Redhawk .44 Magnum that my dad has. My sister, when she was 16 or 17, shot a full cylinder of full-house .44 Magnum loads and liked it. I have to say that the Redhawk seemed to recoil less than my 6" Python with fairly warm handloads.
I’m old school sooooo..🤔
357 🤠
Nothing wrong with that
Good demonstration
Thank You!
I saw this video I thought I lefted a comment. This color is super sharp on the Ruger 💯. Through the chorograph 180 gr .357 Magnum beasts the 10mm like the 1 shot .41 Magnum vs 10mm❗But the 10mm penetrats deeper than the .357 Magnum 🤔. Regardless of bullet's capacity. It would depend on what I was shooting @. In my neighborhood, 10mm would be first choice carried for a number of reasons. But I definitely would have the Mag in the mix 🤝🏾
Good idea!