Save Money, Go for the Gas V8? 2024 Chevy Silverado HD Takes on the World's Toughest Towing Test!
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- Опубликовано: 1 сен 2023
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( www.allTFL.com ) Check out our new spot to find ALL our TFLstudios content, from news to videos and our podcasts! The big Duramax V8 costs $9,500. So can you save money and go for the new 6.6L L8T V8 2024 Chevy Silverado HD? Kase and Andre find out by taking this Silverado 2500 on the World's Toughest Towing Test!
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Just ordered mine. I’ve been wanting to buy these for awhile and now I had a reason.
will do a video testing the gmc hd2024 equivalent to this truck on the gauntlet with both engines and give your opinion which version of new gas gm truck hd is better based on the results and then determine which gm diesel model is better? andrea please settle the debate for good!
For serious heavy towing theres no replacement for a turbo diesel. However the large majority of the owners of HD trucks never get close to maxing them out or towing as heavy as this, and as a result i think this 6.6 gas will be more than enough for the majority of people. Less upfront cost and way less maintenance/DEF/fuel cost than a diesel.
They're great on the plains or rolling hills but towing through the mountains really requires a diesel.
Well I am doubtful that you actually save any on fuel I think the diesel is probably better
I guy down my street with a 6.2L F250 tows a good sized 5th wheel! Don’t know how far he goes but it seems to do the job. Oh, and that’s with the 6-speed.
See my comment above. Yes, a diesel engine is superior, and a gas engine takes second place by a sizable power margin. However, a gas engine does the job just fine. The few times with gasoline regret were: Lack of power at an uphill onramp - slow acceleration unless on level ramp. Passing a slow semi on a long steep uphill climb. And, hearing the engine rev to 5,000 to supply the needed torque and power or or to help slow the rig going downhill. I neglected to mention that with record summer heat - 90 degrees plus - the 6 speed transmission temp never exceeded 220 degrees on my 4500 mile trip.
You are 100% right, this truck just took a huge durability hit with this tow. 5k rpm and 240f trans temps! Nothing on any gasser or trans will last doing that. If this was my rig I would have slowed down to 45mph or so so I wasn’t WOT the whole way
Be interesting to see the 6.8 and 7.3 from Ford with this same trailer.
7.3 would crush it
@@propertypreparedness6846 that already did
And the Ram 6.4 Hemi, to round out the comparisons.
More HP doesn't mean better.
GMs always have had more efficient and more reliable drive trains.
@@philllsxga.7737 "GMs always have had more efficient and more reliable drive trains." Except in this case.
Kase and Andre make a great team with these videos. The best duo in my opinion. Well done.
It’s great you guys are doing RV towing! More of this please!
Thank you for watching.
I’ll second this. Love to see you using more RVs for testing.
Articulate, insightful and not cringy or awkward, Kase is the best thing to happen to TFL Studios.
Kase is a great addition. Put of the new talent, he is the best, in my opinion.
I agree....hands down the best of all the new additions.
yeah i dunno about that lol
@@BikerJim74That’s ok.
Remember this was at altitude with a naturally aspirated engine - no turbo compensation. I think the L8T with the 10-speed is a great option. Plus no DEF. No regeneration BS.
Yes this is a at max of 11,100 feet which is higher than any other highway or interstate in the US. This is not normal everyday towing but an extreme towing stretch for 8 miles. 99% of towing is not even close to this
Yeah to put in into perspective with the power loss of being at 2 miles up this 6.6 was making 90 less HP and 80 ftlbs less than a 5.3L. So really if you had a 5.3L with beefed up components it would tow better than this at normal altitudes.
No DEF, and no DEF system and the problems that come along with it. :-/
No expensive oil and more expensive parts!
@@Nick-sx6jmYeah, not quite.
Love my 24' 2500 LT. I tow campers for my business weekly. Already have 8500 miles on it since April and it pulls like a dream. Fuel economy could be better, but it's not all that bad either. Your test is definitely an extreme that 99.9% of people will never have to do, but Im glad you guys do it. Definitely showed that the 6.6 gasser is a great towing machine on normal roads if it can survive the guantlet.
Kase is a natural. Very pleasant to watch the two of you hit the target on everything!
Like him better then mr truck
Absolutely love your gauntlet Andre! Your partner did amazing also, thank you for your information and incredible personality. You are the reason I watch the channel
I decided on the LT version 6.6 gas when I purchased in '21 to save myself the added cost for the diesel and LTZ add-ons. I tow a 12,000lb 5th wheel from Northeast Pennsylvania so my elevations are much less and I'm very happy with the capability and the truck overall. I do wish I had the 10spd though.
Be happy that you have a standard 6 speed. It has a much more predictable shift pattern, will last longer, and be much cheaper to replace if anything ever happens.
@@Lamtitude why will it last longer?
@@vicenteochoa6498 there’s less that can go wrong with it and it’s already been proven to be reliable.
If you ever do it need replaced I bet you could probably slap a 10 speed in it. The computer might need adjusted and maybe some other adapters
@@vicenteochoa6498 6 speed is a much simpler design, less parts, proven design
I have a ‘22 6.6 Gas and couldn’t be happier. I’m in Iowa and don’t have mountains to tow in, so the gas engine works great for me. I also don’t expect it to run like a duramax with 975ft/lbs. I don’t honestly see the 10 speed as a game changer. I do think GM should be offering lower gear ratios though.
Switched from a LML duramax to the 6.6 gas. Absolutely love it, I pull a tractor/some heavy things every once in awhile. Great looking truck, gets 14 mpg most of the time and is so much cheaper/more reliable to daily drive. If I pulled a big trailer daily id maybe switch but diesel is just not justifiable for like 90% of what I do.
Really good video. Truck is super nice. But the presentation improvement and video quality in general was impressive. The conversation was natural informative and well filmed. Nice job.
I went with a high optioned LT gasser when I bought my 22 2500HD. The 6 speed does plenty well for what I need. I just towed our boat and a full short bed of camping gear 800 miles over labor day weekend and it didn't even skip a beat. I've pulled a 7000lb TT with a bed full of gear through the ozark mountains and was still able to accelerate from 55-70 without even breaking a sweat. The gasser makes a great truck for when you don't tow every day but when you do, you need the extra power and payload capacity that just isn't available in a half ton.
Yet you did that at low elevation, now try doing that out west where you get 6% and 10% grades at 10.000 ft elev. I guarantee you'll be begging for a diesel. But yeah it's fine for that piddle ass boat towing. Try towing a 15,000 5th wheel RV anywhere with that truck and see how you like it.
:)😁
@@sdw48erWho GAF? Not all of us "live out west" nor tow and any appreciable elevation. You buy the diesel for 10k extra and deal with all the recurring costs that go along with it.
@@mattwag11 It's tough towing in the mountains in The east too. Like in Tenn. And my 2002 Duramax was never in the shop even one time in 20 years. And so far my 2022 Duramax has never been in the shop either. So I don't know what extra cost you're talking about. But just like He says in the video above they had to slow down to let it cool off, you don't have to do that with a diesel. If it gets hot, you speed up to take the engine to just below redline and it will cool off while driving down the road. Diesel has many advantages over gas engines.
One advantage is they last longer and go many more miles than a gas engine. Second they get better gas mileage.
These 10 speed transmissions run A LOT warmer than what you're traditionally used to. They use a low viscosity fluid that is designed for higher temps. They mostly did this for cold weather performance and fuel economy. For example, without towing, 200F is where my 2018 F-150 with the 10 speed stays during normal driving. So 243 is completely normal, especially when towing. I have also seen multiple videos where Ford and GM engineers say these trucks can get well above 250 and its still safe to tow with
Whoah, that seems really hot.
Can extra coolers be connected to these things?
250°F does seem hot. I know a 550hp Cummins engine in a semi truck maintains around 1,000°F internally. These high temps won't hurt a diesel engine whatsoever, 1,000°F internal temp results in cleaner fuel burn. Normal coolant temperature in a semi is around 180°F
Different 10 speed
Great video, TFL team. Love the truck and the awesome testing you guys do in the mountains of Colorado, my backyard.
I’m hoping to own a Silverado HD here soon. My plans with it, towing heavy trailers across the country, definitely the Duramax 3500 dually is the best option. Towing and hauling light loads for shorter distances, gasser is a good option as well. Duramax is my favorite, but I do have a soft spot for the gasser.
Great job, as always, Chevrolet.
I tow a 14,400 lbs , 37 ft. 5th wheel for 15 years with a 2002 Silverado Duramax long bed, single axle. Never had the wind push me anywhere. And we were carrying cargo that put us a 16,000 lbs. But I ran Royal Purple in the eng. Royal purple in the transmission, Royal Purple in the rear differencial.
Never had a problem in 20 years of owning that truck. Traded it in on a 2022 Silverado crew-cab, long-bed, Duramax, dually, and love it. Btw I have to say that my 02 was not stock. KN air cleaner, Magnaflow Exaust, and Edge Atitude with juice programer that I ran in tow mowed giving me 40 extral hp, and 125 more llbs of torqure. Climbed 11,000 ft. 6% grade pass at 55 mph. towing that load with no problems. I would never use a gas eng for towing in the mountains because of the terrible gas miles and lack of hp at high elevation. If you own a Duramax long enough, you'll pay for it with the gas mileage savings.
How ever, and this is my experience with my 2015 duramax. The cost of my brake downs, with all sync. lube included, far outway the price of the gas extra. Nox sensors def heaters, glow plugs, no one gets away from eventual replacement of these. Great vid. Towing all the time, yep diesel. Reg. everyday use, gas.
Nothing like starting your weekend with Saturday morning coffee, and the IKE Gauntlet! Thx guys!
Except a Saturday morning beer! 🍺
Fantastic review! BUT. I purchased a 2022 Silverado 3500HD LT, Dually - Long bed/crew cab with 6.6L gas engine and the 6 speed transmission. Due to Covid GM ordering issues we ordered the LT model adding a bunch of packages to nearly match an LTZ. That approach greatly expedited the delivery date. 98% the same truck without the Z. Delivered price was about $63K. It's just over a year old with 10K miles. We tow a 35 foot fifth wheel weighing about 12,500 lbs loaded. We just finished a 4,500 mile plus camping season, towing from NY State to Bar Harbor ME, Disney World in Florida and then back to Upstate NY. We encountered every imaginable type of road and mountainous area east of the Rockies. Not quite the Gauntlet, but many stretches were similar. The truck performed wonderfully. I always felt stable and in control even in strong wind and on the wash-board roads of I 81 in Pennsylvania. We averaged 8.0 MPG for the 4,500 miles and alternated using 87 and 89 octane. I didn't notice any performance difference. GM even provided a TPMS for the trailer tires, and a wireless rear trailer camera that displays directly on the truck's screen. I grappled with Diesel vs Gas, but glad I saved the $10K differential in cost, have easier maintenance and no need for DEF. At times the engine does rev uncomfortable high under load uphill and when entering the highway. When in trailering mode a tap on the brake pedal downshifts to hold speed going down hill. Another tap and there is another downshift and more aggressive "engine braking" going downhill. However, when the engine revs to 4,500 or 5,000 RPM it's a bit disconcerting. I used this many times in the Blue Ridge Mountains. You didn't emphasize this in your review. Not equivalent to a diesel, but it did hold downhill speed and reduced the need to use the brakes on long downhill runs. The gas engine is smooth and quiet, but does need more torque. Looking back, I'd order it again without reservation. Another item . . . I had many comments along the trip. "Great looking truck and 5th wheel set-up, but it's a gasser and a GM product" . . . There's a pervasive mindset that an HD gas truck is a waste of money. Also, brand loyalty snobs are ubiquitous. It pulls my rig safely and reliably, so my "problem" . . . $mile. I neglected to mention that with record summer heat - 90 degrees plus - the 6 speed transmission temp never exceeded 220 degrees on my 4500 mile trip.
I was looking to purchase a srw Denali 3500 gasser for a 13k 42ft fiver which will be towed less than a dozen times per year. Haven’t pulled the trigger yet cause I’m still considering a DRW, but this would also be my every day driver
So if I understand the numbers, this gasser is about $75k with options? Holy moly. 🤯 My 2021 Allison/Duramax was only $71! LTZ, 3500. Cost of new trucks are insane.
Ya. Screw these prices. I picked up a 21 duramax LTZ for 59,000 with 48k on it about 3 months ago. Truck was in excellent condition.
Looked at 2016 duramax 3500 dully. They want 57k for a 7 year old truck coming up on 90k miles. Nuts
@@shanebrown2963wayyyy too many miles on it
Hell cost more than a big rig
At that point might as well just buy a diesel. I know I found one of the new Denali Ultimate recently for around $92 and getting quite a bit fancier truck and you can only get the Duramax in the Ultimate.
Great show guys, seeing you two traveling that stretch of highway brought back memories of me on that same stretch way back in the early 80's driving a 1975 4 door dually, 454 4 speed 410 gears, pulling a 35' single wheel three axle trailer, I dont remember the gvw etc. but I do know I ran 26,000lb plates and I always meet or exceeded that weight every run, I dont remember fuel mileage being quite as bad as yours, but my memory well that's another story, and I never timed any uphill runs even though I'm sure yours is faster, but as I look back I wasn't in that big of a hurry and was grateful to make it to the top. Thanks TFL
Got to love those old 454s they may not have been fast but they got the job done
Our 2500 had 6.6 gazer has limited engine braking along with the Allison 10 speed. Works well
Absolutely love this channel!
Great video guys! I help build every type of GM HD trucks with the best people from Local 598 at Flint Assembly, and I enjoy seeing you guys put them through rigorous tests. It’s great to be able to see what our trucks can do, and relay that information back to the folks at work.
Those trucks are garbage
I guess you're not building anything right now, your union is on strike
@@user-uj3zk2cx8t…and yet here you are. Trolling is quite unbecoming and immature 🙄
@@RoadieWingZZ yup here I am. Get over it
Awesome, you'll be building my truck soon. Midnight Edition 2500 LT gasser, do a good job please.
that was a great comparrison especially with the historical data from the other trucks too!
I recently had a chance to drive a 6.6 gasser with the old 6 speed. I watch all these videos, but you don't fully appreciate it until you experience it. Holy crap was I impressed. That '22 GMC pulled every bit as well as my '99 Cummins used to. I know I'll get hate for that, but it's true.
I have a new 24 GMC AT4 2500 HD 6.6 gas with the 10 spd and it is very similar to my 2004.5 LLY Duramax as far as hp and torque. I have about 91 more HP and only down 46 ft/lb of torque. The LLY Motor for 2004-2006 had 310 HP and 510 ft/lb. The only thing it lacked was a 6spd trans and the larger fuel tank. I sold that in 2018 and bought the new L5P and had nothing but problems. I ditched that in 2023...had so many issues with it, It actually went through the lemon law process it was that bad (that was almost a 2 year process). I got all my money back and ordered the truck I have now and couldn't be happier. My trailer loaded with my 2 seat Can Am is only about 5K lbs so I am still way over as far as the truck I need but I know down the road going to a bigger trailer is not an issue. The last trip I did with my trailer was 727 miles and for the whole trip I got 10 mpg. Not bad.
Good video.... I'm so glad my 2018 L5P with 146,000 is paid for.
Good comparison guys. I’m glad I got the 2024 GMC Sierra diesel. We are headed to Colorado next week.
I work/daily drive the 2024 GMC 2500hd pro version of this truck with about an additional 1000lbs including my tools and a lift gate and have to say in the last month this truck has been pretty solid. the mountains haven't been to troublesome at all my only real complaint has been with mpg. But honestly solid motor/transmission combo for a work truck
Thanks for the video! Everyone was asking for the new GM 10 Spd Diesel versus gas on the 2024. I think this video is a great comparison and speaks for itself. This was the video we all waited for 💪🏼
Great test guys!!
I think this really shows how tough this test actually is.
Also, if you don’t tow heavy on a weekly basis, I would 100% choose the gas. On the other hand, the diesels have the most problems when you’re just putting around town, so if you buy a diesel, make sure you work it hard.
Diesels are made to work long hard miles. Short light hauls are very hard on a diesel. For example driving to work a few miles every day without a trailer
Exactly. One of my subs has a newer Duramax and has a CEL on because he doesn’t tow with the truck. Dealer told him the same thing. The diesel is built to work and needs to be pushed in order to perform. Driving unloaded around town is NOT good for them.
Great content as always! Love to see you go back to Ike with a Ford Superduty 7.3L and see how it would do with same trailer and weight - Regardless - I have a 3619 ATC and a 2022 F-350 Tremor 6.7L with 10 speed and that is a great combination - I also run a GenY 5" offset ball moving hitch back like GM does and swapped the 5er out for a Reese Goosebox 20k - which is an amazing towing combo. In addition my truck has 37.5x12.5x18 tires, Carli E-Venture suspension, full spring pack, air bags and 60 gallon S&B tank and to me it makes for the ultimate on/off/tow rig - I have over 600 miles of tow range with the S&B - that is my favorite upgrade! Thanks for the great information flow!
That’s the truck and lift I want. What kinda mileage are you getting towing and not towing on 37’s?
👏👏 THANKS ANDRE AND KASE ....LOVE THE SHOW ....
Awesome.. Case rocking the Ike! Well done young man!
Nice review… for a non-forced induction engine. That’s very respectable.
And much faster than the previous generation truck.
In the diesel vs gas debate, the one topic that you havent covered is reliability. And I am talking about the entire truck, but primarily the emissions systems that come with the diesel. I had a cummins powered ram and loved it..... right up to travelling fully loaded in the middle of the night and the middle of the state when the truck gave me the 150 mile countdown because of a DEF problem. I had my entire family and it was a close call on whether I could make it home or not. I learned later that there are parameters that limit the derate so you can make it to your destination. But I didnt know it that night. After a hassle to get it into the dealer, they shrugged their shoulders and said they couldnt find anything wrong. I pay to run platinum DEF to avoid these problems. It didnt matter. The net is full of similar stories where DEF issues ruin vacations etc. That was enough for me, I sold the truck and went back to gas. Coming up on 25K miles with zero issues on the gas rig. Gas is ole reliable at this point. Diesel is running on the ragged edge due to emissions. I would love to see kind of an investigative piece on diesel emissions issues. Does running a diesel truck, with all of the benefits, come with a price beyond what you paid for it??? Inquiring minds want to know.
@xfactor
Thank you for the real world comparison from an owner’s experience!
I agree, I have a 2018 GMC Sierra 3500 HD Crew Cab Long Bed SLE 4x4 6.0l gasser. Truck does great, 50k miles never been in the shop bought it brand new. Just got back from California towed 2 cars on a 36' flat bed gooseneck trailer probably around 16-17k pounds to Colorado went over this exact pass actually, I live in north eastern CO. Truck handled it great other than going 25 mph at the top of the hill but trans stayed cooler around 225 at the top. Even in 110 degree whether through Nevada truck never over heated nor trans.
Don't mistake it, people don't NEED diesels, they want diesels, unless you're really towing 16-17k+ there's no point to them. And you're right emissions systems are complicated and expensive. I can buy a new motor cheaper than someone can buy a new emissions setup. I wouldn't own a diesel unless it was pre-emissions. I do have a 2014 Chevy Cruze 2.0l turbo diesel, tuned deleted and straight piped good car I think 187k miles on it now nothing too major in repairs. But that car will do mid 50's on the highway. At 100 mph it'll get about 33 mpg. Drove that car from Colorado to Kentucky doing 100 mpg basically the entire way because speeding is fun, made good time, 15 hours or so straight never shut it off, only filled up 1 full tank, then a little extra fuel at the end never had an issue never stopped working never over heated. I'd trust that car even pushing 200k miles to drive to Europe and back if they made a bridge long enough. I'm not a diesel hater I just won't drive anything with emissions. Also have a 92 2.4l turbo diesel Hilux Surf, right hand drive pretty cool had EGR, that was deleted even.
Mine left the dealer lot, crossed the street , went through an immediate weight reduction, zero issues, immediate mpg and tq increase, and done safely. Oohhh and the dealer 3 months later paid me mad cash for some of the emission components for another customers broken down pos, long as I bring it to them there was never a warranty issue on the truck.
My next truck will be deleted before the plastic come off the seats.
@panthermartin7784 I'm not anti delete don't get me wrong, but I wouldn't bet on being able to keep a deleted truck around for the next 10 years. You'll be spending a lot of money on getting everything put back on lol. That's an expensive way to go.
Just delete it and all the problems go away.
I bought a 2024 2500 gasser. Coming from a diesel, this makes more sense for me now. I only tow a 9500 pound camper 3 to 4 times a year on vacation and it does it very easily. The diesel will always beat out the gasser, but for me it didn’t make sense to pay the up charge plus all the additional maintenance of a diesel just to tow a few times a year. So this is all situational.
Exactly my situation, sold my 2019 High Country Duramax, have a 2024 Midnight edition gasser on order as we speak. Can't wait to get it. Regens drove me nuts as I daily drive and tow a handful of times a year. Just couldn't justify the diesel not to mention diesels don't like short trips.
A great video on basically reaffirming that you need to pick the right tool for the job that you need done. It would have great to see a break even analysis between the gas vs diesel for a few different scenarios. Frequent, long drives, and high elevation will always lend itself to having a diesel for better performance but there are probably use cases where it makes negligible differences.
Their is no break even with the diesel. I’ve talked to fleet operators and they tell me that the diesel costs more to buy, own and operate and you don’t get it back on resale. (10k to buy 6k back on resale). You buy the diesel for just one reason. You want or need the power. There is no economic argument for a diesel.
If you want to tow 50% of the rated tow rating you should just get a diesel or something bigger. Sure on the flats you might be fine, but hit a mountain and you will be staring at the gauges, who wants to do that on vacation?
@@atodaso1668 I mean I have a 2018 GMC Sierra 3500 HD Crew Cab Long Bed SLE 4x4 6.0l gasser, towed a 36' Gooseneck Lamar flat bed trailer, duel dually axles on it here from Colorado to California about 1k miles, picked up 2 cars that are probably about 5k a piece, so combined weight I'd imagine is at least 16 or 17k pounds maybe even pushing 18k, trucks only rated for 13.7k. Drove it back home no issues another 1k miles went over this same pass in the video trans only hit 225 at the peak before the tunnel but I was keeping it reasonable wasn't trying to push the truck that much. Trucks at 50k miles handled it no problem even at 110 degrees towing that weight outside Vegas it never over heated. Flat ground the trans was running 160-180 typically. I can replace my motor and my transmission for cheaper than you can replace the emissions system on a diesel, and I'd have a new trans and motor for another 300k miles lol.
Then again my truck runs everything Amsoil, front and rear dif, transfer case, transmission, engine oil and coolant is all Amsoil, only liquid that's not Amsoil is brake fluid. So maybe that just makes everything more efficient. I'd never roast my trans to 240+ degrees I really try not to get much over 220. Even with my similar 36' 2005 Montana Fifth wheel gvwr on that is 14.3k usually loaded around the 12-13k pound range I've gone over the pass and never hit over the 220s. I don't think GM did a very good job with this truck or they were just pushing it too hard, either way if you wanted to tow heavy with it in extreme conditions like that a couple hundred bucks in an external trans cooler would be a wise upgrade.
Diesels are great, love them, but unless you live in a place with no emissions I'd never own a modern diesel really just not worth the head ache. Replace a 3 and 5 and 6k dollar part every couple years you'll wish you had a gas truck. And the Governments not going to get any les strict on that stuff, if I bought a new truck in 2023 I'd want it to last 20 years to justify the cost, that's 2043, everything's going to be electric by that point or something else and there's going to be no more deleting most likely, that's just how it goes. 2003 we didn't even have emissions, 2023 we have them and can kinda silently delete them, 2043 you'll either be in electric or forced to keep emissions systems going and that's an expensive battle.
Nice book, I read the first couple sentences. I got as far as you were staring at the gauges lol @@dedalliance1
One comment about the downhill portion. I own a 2022 2500hd with the 6spd. If you apply the brakes lightly for a time (in tow/haul Mode) the transmission will downshift and reduce your speed. If you apply the brakes like you seem to in the video the reduce your speed quicker the transmission doesn't have time to react. I tow my 39' 5th wheel and use this to slow down the truck on grades etc. It is similar to using the manual shift button without having to shift it into manual. I know its not the gauntlet but it works well on the hills of the northeast.
Thanks for posting this. Is this mentioned anywhere from GM? In the user manual maybe?
Copied from owners Manual, pg. 240;
Tow/Haul Mode Grade Braking
Tow/Haul Mode Grade Braking is only
enabled while the Tow/Haul Mode is
selected and the vehicle is not in the Range
Selection Mode.
Tow/Haul Mode Grade Braking assists in
maintaining desired vehicle speeds when
driving on downhill grades by using the
engine and transmission to slow the vehicle
Andre is awesome, per usual!
Great video and very entertaining. Not all that relevant for me as I tow a 6,900 lb bumper pull trailer with a Silverado 1500 5.3. Still fun to see how the bigger trucks with a huge load do it. For what it is worth, my truck and trailer work great! I use a Weigh Safe WDH and it literally tows like it is on rails, as some might say. The truck is all stock. No cold air, no Borla exhaust (although they sound great). Typically three people and tools, etc., in the back. Near max payload but well within max towing capacity. Very pleased with my third 5.3 even after three 6.2 Escalades.
Great review Case and Andre!!!
Transmission temps is why I installed the missing transmission cooler on my '19 Tundra that for some reason Toyota decided to remove. I just towed all of my stuff in a cargo trailer to Alaska and didn't want to toast the transmission in the middle of nowhere in Canada on the way. Even still I saw pan temps in the 220's and TC temps in the 250's on some of the climbs on the Alcan. Can't imagine what they would have been without the cooler.
Pin your thermostat. It’ll make the fluid circulate at all times and run even cooler. They make these run hot for “MPGS” but at the the cost of long term reliability.
The transmission temp isn’t an issue. Remember the Ford engineer said the transmission can run at 250 all day and GM and Ford use the same transmission.
It's not quite the same transmission. As I understand the light duty 10 speeds were co-developed, and share considerable parts, but the heavy duty transmissions each manufacturer took that knowledge and went off to develop their own. I think a few teardown videos have shown some quite different internal workings between them.
Ford transmissions built much stronger there a video comparing ford and chevyt
I have a 2024 and I know my camper is only 7000 lbs but the highest temperature I’ve seen on my transmission is 186 degrees and that was in in hills of Arkansas some 7% grades.
The height of this trailer cannot be ignored when looking at the MPG. For example a heavy for my F-150 TT that had a tall wall front pulled so much different on the highway vs a more aerodynamic TT. Around town where there was little aerodynamic effect and that heavy flat front trailer towed with ease. Unless climbing hilly, towing tall/heavy and doing this regularly I would save your money and go gas. Great test!
Mr truck has lost so much weight he looks so much younger!
I know , he looked almost like a teenager riding shotgun with andre
Bah ha ha
It depends how long are you plan to keep it. Diesel is heavy ($9500 option) but the exhaust braking will come in handy
Ive had both the 6.6 gas and the 6.6 duramax in a Chevy 2500 that tows a lot and even in Texas, towing 14,000lbs frequently, the gas engine just didnt cut it. Its ok for an occasional tow with that much weight as itll get you where you need to go but its really weak when getting up to speed on the highway. I dont regret switching back to a deisel at all.
2.5 things:
First, If possible, do a second test with a 30ft Travel Trailer and see how it does/compares.
Second, I wish they would force induct the gas engine to get a better comparison to the diesels. There was a time when the diesel was not turbo charged. That would make it more apples-to-apples comparison.
Keep up the great content, I enjoy it!
Case needs a cowboy hat. He can be the mini Mr. TrucK
Kase wearing a cowboy hat would be...well, kinda hard to picture! I'm actually surprised to see him wearing a ball cap. That's not usually his style.
Andre is the Slavic Mr Truck
Next you guys should test the 7.3 Ford and the 6.4 Hemi with the same trailer weight (or as close as you can get for those trucks' respective ratings).
Please!! Do it!!
They did run those trucks up the Ike already earlier this year. I won't spoil the results for you but I'll tell you that the Ford is a beautiful blue color, and the Ram I believe was grey. I know the Ford they were towing a horse trailer that was about 2k lbs heavier. I believe the Ram had the same trailer.
Had a 2020 hemi ram bighorn crew 4x4 that claims to tow 11,750 with the 5.7L Hemi and I believe it will easily start the load rolling because of the gearing in the 8 Speed transmission and the 3.9x gear ratio, but I am not sure the temperatures of the transmission or the engine could handle it without modifications.
@@B.V.LuminousSeems relevant.
Was waiting for this video thanks guys ..
Great, informative video guys
Love ya kase great adventure bud. I’m proud of you.
Thanks for the comparison. I love my Duramax. It would be very difficult to go back to gas.
I have a 6.7 Cummins in a 2022 Ram 2500 (G56 manual and 3.73 gears) and a 2022 F-250 Tremor with the 7.3 Godzilla. I have absolutely no issues with either one of them towing my 9000 lb travel trailer (just used the Tremor to tow the trailer from North Dakota to Sacramento) and averaged about the same fuel economy. Going down even the steepest mountain passes I never had to touch the brakes because the 10 speed would down shift keeping me at the speed I had the cruise control set at.
@@dundonrl, Ram hasn’t offered the G56 since the 2018 models, so unless you did a complete swap (doubtful), you’re not being truthful.
@@CornFed_3 Whoops.. meant 2012, sorry..
In their June 10, 2017 video ("2017 Chevy Silverado HD 2500 Takes on the Super Ike Gauntlet"), the 2500HD/L96 6.0L gas engine managed to pull a 13.5k lb trailer (although it had a lot less frontal area than the trailer in this test) in 10 min, 21 sec.
I own an 22 model 2500 LT8 gas truck and pull a tandem axle trailer with a Polaris 1000xp heavy lifted and hunting gear to Ohio from NC multiple times a year! My buddy has f350 6.7 pulling same load and our fuel mileage is same. We pull mountains most of the 9 hr trip and although not super heavy weight the gasser will service most weekend warriors camping, pulling equipment etc under most conditions.
This was the video I needed. Just bought a 2023 2500 HD Gasser w/ the 6 speed and was concerned about towing a future 5th wheel but half the weight of the one you tested. This made me feel better about my purchase. I still love deisels though :)
You only need as much truck as you intend on towing. Not everyone needs a diesel. That comes from a 40 yr diesel mech.
@@lawrencefiebig2033 appreciate the comment. thank you
I plan on getting a Sierra Denali 3500 to tow a 13,000 pound trailer that’s 42 feet long
The Diablo motor! 6.6 engine with 6 brake applications.
hahaha !!😂... 👹👺
Or maybe call it the “Beast Mark” or just “The Beast”…😂
We run all 6.6L gassers for our service body fleet. Our trucks never tow but they take a lot of payload. The engine is simple and torquey. Unless you need to max tough, hard to justify the diesel costs.
I would like to see the f150 2.7 turbo v6 vs Chevy Silverado 2.7 turbo four cylinder towing test !!! Great video
You should buy the diesel if you are towing this heavy very often. Not like most people that have a diesel and tow a couple times a year with their 5k lbs boat or camper.
Also you have to consider how long you will be keeping the truck.. remember after the warranty expires diesel engines are stupid expensive to repair. You can usually replace the entire gas engine for what it costs to do just some fairly minor work on a diesel.
Yeah I once knew a chick who's husband went out and bought a big F250 to tow his... bass boat. Like, bro. A 4Runner could tow that boat.
The biggest problem with using a gas engine to pull one of these trailers is trying to get gas at a station in a sea if cars all around you and how close the pumps are together. It’s much easier to go to a truck stop where it’s designed for long trailers.
Most truck stops have RV lanes now and usually the regular car gas lanes are much larger at truck stops. I just avoid regular gas stations and never have any issues
Bingo! This is exactly right. I was, frankly, a little disappointed in this performance, and the "economy". I expected more. Would have hated to see the transmission temps if the truck had been loaded to its max rated towing weight! I suspect that Andre would have pulled off the road to cool it down, which is a fail to me. I do wonder what Allison thinks of this design that they left to Ford/GM to do and rubber-stamped it (OK, not exactly, but it's not a true Allison)
I have a little overkill. I pull a 28’ toy hauler with a 2020 6.6,Duramax Denali HD and love it. It’s like pulling a pop up camper. There’s just me and the wife and we don’t have a need to pull a house behind us. We just load up the bike and go. The fuel mileage is wonderful compared to what I was getting with the 6.0 2018 Chev 2500 Gas.
I dont see an oil temp. But you guys are slowly getting better and pointing out the gauges. Lets face it, we really dont care much about anything else if we are destroying anything. So we REALY REALLY REALLY REALLY want all the temp information on all the tests from here on out, wrote on paper and tracked. THANK YOU
The 6.6 gasser with the Allison transmission will likely be a good fit for lots of towing needs. The nearly $10K in savings over the diesel is significant.
I can't help but think though that a Duramax engine would last much longer than a gas engine, as diesels usually do, therefore making it well worth it in the long run. Then again how many people do 600k+ miles
The only thing Allison is the spelling the emblem.
@@GlobbsThe engine is only one variable in a modern diesel power train…
Finally GM matches the 8.1 2003 truck! But my trans ran 150....
Really cool how thorough you guys are tow testing the trucks, it is such a good way you are showing what they actually are capable of.
Great work, love your videos, thank you for all your hard work 🤗
I’ve been waiting for this one. I plan to order a Silverado 2500 or Sierra 2500 6.6 gas in this very spec., right down to the color.
I’d love to see a full review of this truck, mpg run, etc.
Please do the 100 mile loop MPG test with this truck unladen.
With the extreme expense of both the diesel engine up charge, the fuel costs and the extra costs of diesel maintenance, no matter how more efficient they are it becomes harder and harder to justify buying one…unless you tow and tow heavy and often like once or twice a week, it doesn’t appear to make financial sense to spend 70-80k for even a basic spec diesel truck
Yes if you are buying a truck to keep forever diesel makes no since, even given the longevity…. Which is less and less real these days.
Even if a diesel lives longer than a gas (which is no longer the given it used to be) it’s gonna take a helluva lot more money to achieve.
If you cycle into a new truck Avery couple years and can afford the initial ante of the extra cost, sure the diesel makes sense. You’ll carry your ante forward with each exchange, and get most of it back when you get off the ride.
@upshifter5316 I have a shop and have repaired several diesels with 200k miles or a little less that needed repairs that were more than gasoline crate motor would cost. I'm not counting diesel fuel system repairs for water or DEF poisoning. I don't see the HD gas motor trucks with issues at 200k. No track record on the GM 6.6 at 200k that I've serviced. I have counseled countless customers that don't tow to get gasoline next time. Some listen and they usually drop to 1/2 tons.
That’s almost price for a base model lol
Except you get all that up charge back when you sell or trade the truck, the diesel has almost double the warranty of the gas engines, and the diesel can do more and do everything better.
@@jimmyaber5920 My work has a fleet of ~20 F550s, we had 2 gas trucks and the rest were diesel. Management thought we didn't need the cost of the diesel.
Anyway the two gassers are both on engine number 3 at roughly 5000 engine hours. 2022 model year trucks. Lifters fail and kill them every time. We have diesel F550s from 2011 that are still on the original engine coming up on 20k hours.
If you work these trucks hard the gassers die.
Thanks for the videos. I really enjoy them. I have a question. How much more torque and power would you be able to get by adding a turbocharger or supercharger to that gasoline engine 6.6 liter?
Back in 2020, TFL did the Ike with the new 2020 F-250 with the 7.3L gasser. It crushed this new Silverado. It towed a 16,000lb 40FT horse trailer and did it in 8 min 42 sec.
The lack of available axle ratios turns me off on the GM products. A Ford 7.3 with 4.30 or a Ram 6.4 with 4.10 ratio would be the trucks I look at.
Great test! One thing is how hot the transmission was running. I don't see that with the Duramax and 10-speed. Is there a difference in cooling capacity between trucks with gas and truck with diesel?
The diesel likely has an auxiliary or upgraded trans cooler because the towing capacity is higher for those trucks
@@theconfused_fisherman - Mine has a lot of cooling, that's for sure. Towing, the transmission only runs 180 - 185 degrees. Not towing it runs 135 to 140 degrees depending on outside temperature. They ought to put that same cooling in the ones with gasoline engines.
Dont forget the diesel part where your def tank heater goes out in the winter and your truck doesn't start so you tow it, and then you get it fixed and a month later the DPF is clogged and you are limited to 25mph max speed :)
It all depends on how often you tow, how heavy you tow, how far you tow, and conditions you tow in. Towing heavy, thru the mountains, you have to buy a diesel. But if you are a contractor hauling a few miles across town, even if heavy, you can do gas, especially if you are empty or small payload the rest of the time.
It must have been running with the torque converter unlocked that whole run with the pedal floored to build up that much heat.
As many gears as these newer vehicles have, I see no functional reason to not lock the torque converter while climbing for better efficiency and lower temps. The only reason I can think of that they perhaps don't is if the torque converter clutch can't handle the engine's full torque output.
In the 6 speed days it locked at the top of each gear and full lock at 45 which is nice to towing heavy at low speed aka hauling hay or anhydrous wagons and seed tenders they thought of the farmers and construction workers 10 years ago
No it's due to low line pressures on the 10 speed Allison. This is trans slip 'as designed' per GM.
And I wholeheartedly believe the 6 speed does grade shifting better than the new 10 speed does.
Agreed
I agree also.
Thanks you made my mind up for me. Was thinking going for gas after I need to put in new injectors.
I own a 24 6.6 gas with gm allison. Pulled 8,000 lb travel trailer 500 miles to beach. Many hills through Tn and Alabama and hardly tell it was behind me
How many brake pads can you buy, for $9000.00?
About 10 brake jobs front and rear
In the real world wouldn’t you manually lock out the higher gears and make the transmission work for you on the down hill vs waiting for the computer to figure it out and down shift ??
I don’t tow much, or heavy or the Ike gauntlet so just curious? I know it’s a test but in theory could you manually get that brake application down (obviously respecting trans temp and RPM’s)
Not only that but with interest, you are paying more than 9k
I believe they do it this way to remove any driver skill input. This show cases the vehicle’s capabilities not the drivers and allows for better comparison of the vehicles.
@brians.1357 I manually shift my gas auto tranny I like to be in control of it.
GM you need to 4:10 gear the 6.6 gasser. It is lugging too much with the tall 3:73.
I have always found GM transmissions to be slow to downshift until they break in. This has been true since the 4l60E forward. I had one that would not shift to 1st till it got below 30 but when it broke in would kick down up to 42 and it was completely controlled by electronics and with no throttle cable connections.
With how hot the transmission got going up the hill, how long did it take for the transmission to come back down to matching coolant temperature after the mountain climb?
For whatever reason, this transmission runs hot 🥵. I’ve seen it in other videos of this powertrain. Crazy, my Hemi and ZF never get much above 180. I think it would also be nice if gm offered 4.10 gears, especially when ford offers 4.30 with a more powerful motor…
I’ve never seen mine above 186 towing my 7000 lbs camper. That was pulling a 7% grade
The Ford 10R140 runs ~35 degrees F hotter. I'd see ~210 F all the time unloaded, normal daily driving. The GM 10L1000 'Allison' likes to stay ~175 F in the same conditions.
@@27dmarshall I saw 232 degrees pulling a 9000 lb travel trailer over Donner pass at 70 mph on my 10R140 in my F-250 Tremor (7.3 Godzilla engine).
Boy if you going to sit in Mr Trucks seat you have to get a hat! But good job working with Andrea on another great video, it will take some getting used to 😂
Must be a pain with that big hat 🎩
Kase wearing a cowboy hat would be...well, kinda hard to picture! I'm actually surprised to see him wearing a ball cap. That's not usually his style.
That guy is a goober.
@TFLtruck You need to find a 7.3L Godzilla w/ 10spd and pull this SAME trailer & weight up the IKE (same ambient temperatures) for a real world comparison for those comparing the GM 6.6L L8T w/ 10L1000 'Allison' to the 7.3L Godzilla w/ 10R140. The previous 7.3L tested trailer had very low wind resistance compared to the trailer tested here.
Great job, really enjoyed this one! Will be interesting to see how this stacks up to the Ford drivetrains next!
Ford gassers are delaminating cams and lifters faster than they can replace them
That's not what a number of others have said !!@@Billybob50119
Chase did a great job in this video!! Could we get a Mr.Truck and Chase Ike run??
Lol is this his mom’s secret account?
Nah man! Lol! You can't leave Andre out! He's the reason for the Ike run!
Whatever money you skip in options on the diesel you pay in repairs to the emissions system not to mention fuel cost and maintenance
There is plenty of emission stuff on the new diesels - DEF, regen and whatnot. You also have to factor in DEF costs into fuel mileage which most reviewers conveniently omit. Of course there is nigher insurance costs for the $10,000 more expensive truck and nobody talks about that either.
I think if you're towing over 10k lbs regularly, especially in terrain like this, just get a diesel. I have a 2024 gasser Sierra 3500, and towing my 27' travel trailer this summer over one 25-mile stretch with a 4,000' elevation gain the max transmission temp I saw was 203 with an outside temp of 100, so I was happy with that!
First when we only had 3 gear automatic transmission we down shifted and put it in low gear either L1 or L2 so now try with locking it in gear 4th or so
Huh??
GM could have made a. Functional air scoop for the gas like a cold air in take
Couldnt you lock the truck in say 6th or 7th gear?
If the trailer is towing level now you don't want to add only a taller pin box to raise the front. You really would need to lift the suspension as well. If you don't then you will likely overload the rear axle.
Call it the Oil Burner! I have one and since it was new it burns oil like crazy. Seems like something all new Gas engine are doing.
So that’s a huge trailer for any SRW truck but it’s within the ratings of all of the modern trucks (you’d have to go Ram 3500 SRW however). It’s nice that you run the Duramax with the same trailer too to give an example of the modern diesel Vs the modern gasser.
With that said I think people are glossing over the fact that this truck performed pretty well with this trailer. This is a huge trailer and it creates a lot of drag not to mention it’s weight. People get too hung up on the weight of trailers when the type of trailer is more important. The truck would have performed exactly the same even with this trailer empty due to the drag alone.
And also it’s worth mentioning that the 1996 F250 7.3 or any diesel from that era (or as recent as even middle to late 2000s) wouldn’t even be rated to tow this. And for TFLs old Ford truck, it couldn’t pull this on the this test and survive. It had a failure with an 8,000 pound open trailer. This truck would have smoked a test like that and I wish you guys would use something like that with these new gas HDs to just show how far they have came.
It is concerning that the transmission got as hot as it did and this is the only test on RUclips so far that’s even remotely got the transmission that hot. I think most of that comes from the type of trailer being towed but who knows. Given that the Ford 10 speed will run over 200 empty I’d be interested to see what it did on this test with that trailer. In every other test the GM 10 speed is running as much as 20-30 degrees cooler.
great write up..