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Still think Jamarcus "Purple Drank" Russell is the undisputed king of the POS's although Henry 'my Masterati does 185" Ruggs is on that Mt Rushmore of caca.
You know he wasn't so bad as a Raiders coach. He was a great offensive coordinator in 2010 and led a top 10 offense with Jason Campbell as QB1 and Darius Heyward Bey as WR1. The team was one decent defensive player from definitive playoff contention
Ok, but we're those TE's awful? From the top of my head, I can only name a couple bad Lions draft picks from the 2010's-2020's (TE included). Nick Fairley, Eric Ebron, Laken Tomlinson, Jarrod Davis, and more recently, Jeff Okudah. I'm not including Riley Reiff, Ezekiel Ansah, nor TJ Hockenson because they've either been solid starters or pro bowlers with the Lions. 2nd round picks aren't included.
@@Younima4 brandon pettigrew was a top draft pick too iirc and he is most well known for the being the victim of the picked up flag in the lions cowboys playoff game fuck dallas btw
It always felt to me as if the Lions thought that "no matter who we have on the team, no matter how many star players we have, we will still sell the same number of player jerseys to fans. So Why Draft other star players?" That's the way it always _seemed_ anyway.
One knew at the time that Julio Jones was going to be something... but it was probably fine given the Browns were an awful team and therefore didn't get a chance to ruin his career too.
Browns got Pick 27*, 59, 124 and a 2012 1st and 4th for that. They... - Used picks 27 and 70 to trade up to 21 to get Phil Taylor - Saw the Ravens (who had pick 26 but were late) drafted Jimmy Smith at pick 27 - Saw the Chiefs use pick 70 to draft potential-HOFer Justin Houston - Drafted Greg Little with pick 59 - Drafted Owen Marecic with pick 124 - Drafted the aforementioned Brandon Weeden with the 2012 1st - Use the 2012 4th (along with picks 139 and 211) to move up from pick 4 to pick 3 - Drafted Trent Richardson with pick 3 - Saw the Vikings select pro-bowler Matt Kalil at pick 4 - Saw the Vikings select Jarius Wright with the 2012 4th - Saw the Vikings select Robert Blanton at pick 139 - Saw the Vikings trade pick 211 to the Titans for a 2013 6th, which turned into like four trades... which was highlighted by being involved in the Carson Palmer trade from Oakland to Arizona (here's your shoutout of incompetence, Raiders fans!) Ok, maybe it fizzled a bit at the end, but it's save to say the Browns somehow turned "good draft capital" into draft disaster after disaster while two HOFers, a Pro Bowler and two more solid guys (Smith, Wright) went elsewhere with those direct picks.
Unfortunately, it had the opposite effect, as a law was passed in CA decriminalizing DUIs for BACs less than 0.950. Too bad the Raiders didn't stick around
The Raiders are so bad at drafting that they had the pick just before a future Hall of Famer 4 times in a span of 5 years: Ed Reed, Larry Fitzgerald, Aaron Rodgers and Calvin Johnson. That is just unbelievable to imagine all those players being on the same team.
That's why I think the draft is scripted because no one can be that dumb...that's like someone giving you the winning numbers to the lottery ticket and saying nah I'm going with my numbers.
That's the worst thing you can do, could've should've would've. So if Marino went to the Steelers, would he have been as good? Rodgers to the Raiders or Calvin Johnson? Jerome Bettis doesn't get traded to the Steelers and the Rams don't pick Lawrence Phillips? Smh, so if you did marry and divorce your first wife but met your 2nd to have kids, would you be crying about that to?
Let's not forget that the Browns were so smitten with 34 year old QB Jeff Garcia that they felt no need to draft Findlay, Ohio (about 2 hours out of Cleveland) native and Miami of Ohio star QB Ben Roethlisberger who only went to have a 26-2-1 record against said Browns
And Big Ben became the most winningest QB in firstsynergy stadium before Mayfield managed to win more games. And yet they still get rid of Mayfield. This is why Brown would never succeed unless they change owner.
@@youcantseelim1751 Mayfield gave them a great season, tore him to shreds, and then tossed him to the side. The Panthers, with three QBs, utterly wasted the guy. Mayfield is an average QB, so treat him like that instead of putting him under your heel
The year Kansas City beat the 49ers in the Super Bowl, both teams combined had about 10 former browns players, just to show our incompetence as a team.
To be fair, the GM in charge of the draft in 2017 was absolute garbage. On the other hand, the current Browns GM was an assistant at the time and wanted to take him. All you have to know about how bad the GM of the time was, Sashi Brown, is that he drafted god damn DeShone Kizer in the 2nd round when the roster sucked so much ass that it was very obvious that the team would be at the top of the draft next year and in position to draft a QB.
Loving the more Balls Deep content you’ve been posting recently! I like your normal breakdowns but I feel like with these you get to show your individuality more. Keep up the good work!
They may be fine players, but if the Raiders "knew" they would be good they should have drafted them higher. It says more about their development of players than draft skills.
🤦 Well....I guess you could kinda have something almost resembling a valid point there when you consider that list is so short it would only take 7 syllables to mention it [but you do realize that other (decent) teams can routinely hit on nearly half their picks in a good year, no? And to them, two players in one draft wouldn't be considered that much of a reason to celebrate, let alone a generational happening that's this exceptionally awesome windfall of talent and cause to throw a week long, 24-7 block party compared to their normal draft results?].
The Browns worst decision ever was when they passed on Big Ben and took Winslow in 2004. That was their biggest mistake ever. I never count any team passing on Brady because every team, including NE, passed on him 6-7 times. But Ben was right there, an Ohio kid no less, and they decided TE was the better route. And he then went on to make their life awful for almost 2 decades.
Winslow Jr was considered a great pick at the time, super athletic with good blocking, and had a decent year but it was completely understandable they passed on him.
As a Bengals fan, I have really grown to love and appreciate all the football teams in our wonderful AFC North. The Ravens and the Steelers are time honored winners with grit. No I don't think it is weird that we have a 3 team division.
To be fair, a lot of the draft busts might have fared significantly better if they weren't in completely dysfunctional franchises like the Raiders and Browns. And all of those HoF players they could have drafted quite likely could have been ruined by the surrounding incompetence.
@@ELIJAHNUBOYD you smoking on that bhutanese shadow garden pack my boy, take a look at any of my sports related shorts and you'd know I've been slated with the miserable fate of being a Bears fan my whole life
You put out my favorite sports content to consume, going through a tough time right now and watching your videos brings light to my day, I appreciate ya
22:19 Let be honest: Pat Mahomes, Deshaun Watson, Josh Allen, Lamar Jackson... All those guys had holes in their game and needed to work and develop into who they are today. If either team had drafted, they probably would not have put the right support and coaching around them to help them develop. Case in point: Jon Gruden, Josh McDaniels, Hue Jackson, Freddie Kitchens. Yeah, they could've drafted those guys, but it's likely they would've just ruined them.
Honestly the Lions are also up there in terms of worst drafters if you exclude the last couple of years. Brad Holmes has turned it around, but it was really bad for a while (but they have certainly hit on some picks too)
Before watching this video, I’m gonna say the Browns are worse at drafting. Despite the Raiders drafting Jamarcus Russel at one point, they did draft some sort of QB stability in the form of Derek Carr. This is compared to the Browns and their infamously long list of failed QBs. I’ll edit this after watching the vid
as much as I agree on the utter incompetence of my Raiders during nearly every year's first round, I think you shorted us REALLY hard when you mentioned "later round gems". Including Kirk Morrison means the 3rd round was in play, but no mention of Maxx Crosby?? That was probably our best pick in the entire timeframe this video covered lol. AND Nate Hobbs was a 5th rd pick!! In nooo way do I want to come off as defending the Raiders as some sort of paragon of great drafting. Faaaar from it. I just think our ability to pick the good players of any given class where they *should be* taken is completely FUBAR and has been for decades now. But on the flipside, I'd argue we can, and do, find gems/late round talent at an average-to-above-average rate compared to the rest of the league. The draft is a complete gamble, especially after those first couple rounds, and we have actually won that bet more than I'd expect to. But that gamble is supposed to pay off huge if/when you do hit because, in theory, the first pick or two should be near guaranteed to be pieces that truly build your team. Since we've made a tradition of whiffing on those rounds, our late gems dont actually end up paying off very well, as they just end up needing to fill in for the gaps that should have been stepping stones filled by our early rd guys. Maxx ends up just being what our #4 pick shouldve gotten us, but they picked Cle Ferrel instead Hobbs ends up just being the ONLY good DB on the roster, despite the prior 5(at least) straight high rd picks on DBs like Arnnette, Mullen, Conley, Abram, Joseph, etc.
Because he's a Broncos fan 😂 Maxx and Josh Jacobs gives him nightmares and I can't blame him. Broncos with the #1 run defense? Don't worry. They'll look like a high school defense by the time JJ is done raw dawning Denver. And Mad Maxx? Constantly harassing the QB.
You know why the raiders never win because any defensive player the raiders draft by mid season every year the raiders have half their team injured and by the time they get back from injury another round of starters get hurt and with no elite QB the raiders never overcome the injuries just watch what happens this year they will be depleted on defense again and the average QB who can't elevate the injuries will win 7 games and here we go again the dense fans will blame the defense but the raiders are smart they keep watching every team in the league slowly but surely get their 1 rd QB and the raiders keep crying defense defense..were stuck as average for many more years to come that obvious.
Oh trust me I feel your pain but I also laughed my ass off because I've been a die-hard CHIEFS fan for 50 years. And that was a rough 50-years let me tell you. Now if you guys suck for another 20 then I'll start feeling bad for you
The Browns are worse. The Davises have always had a priority on Keeping the Owner Happy & being too hands-on under Al to having Mark be a too-hands-off figurehead, with winning as a distant 14th priority. The _Browns_ are _TRYING_ to succeed & as such are hilarious.
@@choosecarefully408 oh the Browns are definitely worse. no question. As far as Mark I've liked his approach the last few years. He knows he doesn't know ball like his dad so he just hires people that do know ball and let them work. We just gotta find people that can actually get it done 😅
the browns suffer from a total lack of expertise at the ownership, GM, and head coach level for most of the years since 1999. that is simply too much to overcome. they had ONE guy that actually knew football in all of those years, GM john dorsey. im not saying dorsey was perfect, but the overall talent level of the browns was rapidly rising while he was GM. but the rest of the organization didnt know football, and so they ganged up on him and fired him. then they hired yet another rookie GM in berry and yet another rookie coach in stefanski, and the talent level is now in full decline.
It's funny since an old clip has been going around about Merrill Hoge talking with Stephen A Smith and Skip Bayliss about Johnny Manziel. Hoge said he would be bust and anyone who took him in the first round would regret it heavily, while Skip trumped up Manziel as eventually being better than Brady.
15:10 There's Gabe Jackson again after his accidental cameo on GPS yesterday ;-) Great episode everyone :-) To be fair Phil the Power Taylor has more world titles than Tom Brady.
Lifelong raiders fan here: Crosby, Jacobs, Hobbs, Renfrow are literally the only four even halfway decent draft picks we have had in the last 4 years, with two of those years having multiple first round picks from the Mack/Cooper trades(2019 and 2020). Moral of the story: In the last 4 years, it’s not up for debate. No team has even sniffed being as atrocious at drafting and developing players. I hate it here.
I mean, I know it isn't enough to really tip the scales in any way, but Maxx Crosby (4th) not making it to your late round gems for the Raiders seems strange.
Especially at quarterback, Drafting in the first round is way different than later rounds. The natural desire to acquire the best available talent can easily turn your attention (as a team with a pick) from aspects of fitting in the scheme and potential to develop, as well as personality. And it looks like some gms know how to deal with this pressure, and some will prefer to get some assets for it. Because a lot of the teams who fail their 1ts rounders still were quite successful with picks from later rounds. Again, i refer to qb's
The problem is those idiot dont know how to develop the talents they drafted with high picks. In another universe, I believe if Brown ever draft Mahome, he will be just another mediocre shit. And Mayfield could have win a Super Bowl if he were drafted by the Chief.
The sad thing is these two teams have die hard fanbases that will show up to their games no matter what they do. These owners make a ton of money without having to put anything back into the teams
I'm pretty sure the statistics say my jets are the worst. We're only not in the conversation right now is because we're only a year removed from probably our best draft in franchise history and followed it up with what looks like a decent draft this year
As a life long Steelers fan, born and raised in the Steel City - I loved every second of this video.. No matter which was declared “worst” out of these two teams, I knew it was going to end with one of them… and that makes me happy…
Minor nitpick: William Green. Another Browns first round pick who underperformed on the field and ended up in all kinds of legal trouble. As a lifelong Browns fan, I enjoyed this trip down misery lane. Thanks Perna.
7:00 It was disgusting how Stillers fans tried to defend that cheap shot. Just as bad was the Browns sending McCoy back in the game when he was clearly out of it.
The Browns and Raiders are two very dysfunctional teams with bad ownership, bad coaching, and bad management. Everything starts at the top. This has led to decades of bad drafting. Everything rests on ownership and coaching. If both are bad, the team as a whole will reflect that.
@Luis Castaneda I know. I eas bummed when we lost him. But at the same time, when Carr went down and the season spiraled, he didn't win us anything alone. So to trade him to end up with a franchise record setting RB and to get Maxx out of that domino effect, worth it.
Looking back on some of Cleveland's draft picks: Tim Couch lasted five seasons in the league. Courtney Brown was always injured. Gerard Warren started for a decade but was never a star. Kellen Winslow is in prison. Joe Thomas is in the Hall of Fame for playing over 10,000 consecutive snaps. Alex Mack was an All-Pro lineman. Joe Haden was also a good cornerback. Johnny Manziel crashed and burned. Miles Garrett is an elite edge rusher. Baker Mayfield has one last chance to prove himself in Tampa Bay.
I think getting Johnny Football despite the red flags gets the Browns the win. I am a Browns fan as well. Also thank goodness we did draft Tim Couch over Donovan McNabb, we would have destroyed his career earlier.
Brandon is right about Sebastian Janikowski. A lot of people talk about how great he was but I don't remember him hitting any big kicks. I do however remember him missing a lot of big kicks. He had a lot of power but no accuracy.
Point of clarification: since you talked about the stockpiling of picks the Browns did and showed John Dorsey at the same time, that’s not entirely an accurate fact. Sashi Brown and Podesta were the ones that led the front office to tanking seasons while acquiring draft capital. It wasn’t until they were fired and Dorsey came along that they finally reaped the rewards of that stockpile…. If Sashi were still in charge during the 2018 draft, I think CLE would have drafted Allen or Lamar instead of picking first overall. IMO, Dorsey made solid choices as GM, but in hindsight I think the Browns would have looked a lot more different had Sashi overlooked the 18 draft.
I don't know what is more impressive. Browns and Raiders consistently missing on draft picks, or Lions drafting much better comparatively yet still as bad of a team
The Lions late round selections would be where the problems really went wrong as unless it was the top 2-3 rounds the barrel was dry for the most part of 20 years of any productivity.
You've neglected one very real possibility. It may be that these many players who were drafted before Hall-of-Fame-level talent had the same potential as those drafted after them. It may be that the Browns and Raiders do recognize talent just fine, but they also squander it. It may be that some of these draft busts would have had legendary careers if they had only landed on a team that wasn't a dumpster fire.
I'm a die hard Raiders fan, we can't draft and we don't know how to evaluate talent. We got lucky with Maxx Crosby. But our entire 2020 draft class was a failure, our 2021 draft isn't looking great, it's just insane how bad Las Vegas/Oakland is at drafting. I feel you could throw a dart on a board and do just as well
The Browns are worse, and it isn't even close. At least the Raiders nailed it with Khalil Mack and Derek Carr was also a good pick and they hadn't taken any sociopaths (which in the Al Davis era would have been a feature rather than a bug)...and let's face it, on paper, JaMarcus Russell was no-brainer. The dude was a GOD at LSU, how were they to know he'd be lazier than a cut dog?
As a Browns fan, I'm not really sure how rookie Watson or Mahomes would've done in 2017 with the team they had. Sure the O line would've been fine, but Terrell Pryor and Corey Coleman as their top 2 WR's and Isaiah Crowell as RB1 wouldn't have helped much.
same thing with the idea of taking Josh Allen over Baker Mayfield the year after. Josh Allen now is one of the best in the league, but he was rough coming out of the draft. He's only ascended to become the absolute monster he is because of McDermott and the rest of the coaching staff's work with him. Do we really think Hugh Jackson was gonna get that kind of play out of Josh Allen?
Factory of sadness. No fan base can hold a candle to the misery and devotion the brown and orange have been through and display. And yet, we still show up. Great clip. Happy to hear we won another award. Bwahaha
If we are talking recently, the jets have been pretty bad at drafting. Just gave a 1st round pick a 2nd contract for the first time in 8 years lol, plus like 5 or 6 2nd round receivers that were all busts.
Alright even though this is basically a roast of the browns and raiders, I really like the fact that you went back in time and gave some real facts about both but specifically my browns! Now I see why we're so bad lol thank you the more you know 😂
Like I get that they could have had Josh Allen and Lamar Jackson but I don’t think you can say that either player would have been near as good as they have been with either team
@@marcomcdowell8861 I mean mayfield had 263 yards and 3 touchdowns the browns defense let up 37 points I mean yes the Steelers had 4 turnovers but but I think baker had a solid enough game to say that he was a reason they won that game
There's a lot of embarrassing facts here, but i think Cleveland taking 3 QBs in the first round over 7 seasons and getting a 10-30 record out of them is incredible.
I had forgotten about Gallery. It's not the same level, but that's almost as bad as 89 with Green Bay. Aikman, Barry Sanders, Deon Sanders, and Derrick Thomas and they get Tony Mandarich
To be fair... It's really hard to draft players... We have seen people who were Heisman trophies ended up being a draft level... Sometimes you really seems that you can do all the formwork to who you going to draft and yet still be wrong and it could basically be a coin flip to see if this player is going to be the right choice
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Can confirm the lawn mower 4.0 is the best wingman this side of the Mississippi. Shave to save
Can't wait for the Raiders to sweep you guys again lol
Can't wait for Josh McDaniels to creatively blow a game
I'll never forgive the Browns for passing on Brady. They could have destroyed his career and saved me a lot of headaches.
🤣
Bruh 😂😂
100%
You're obviously not a Browns fan. If they'd have drafted Brady, he would have been traded before he even played a snap. Bank it.
No. Come on. He would of sucked if they drafted him. And every team passed on him 5-6 times lol
Jamarcus ''I watched all the tapes coach'' Russell alone will put us in the top spot for many years to come.
JaMarcus "I watched all the tapes" Russell vs Johnny "0.0 Hours on his Tablet" Manziel
Still think Jamarcus "Purple Drank" Russell is the undisputed king of the POS's although Henry 'my Masterati does 185" Ruggs is on that Mt Rushmore of caca.
Hue Jackson coaching both teams seems like a deciding factor.
You know he wasn't so bad as a Raiders coach. He was a great offensive coordinator in 2010 and led a top 10 offense with Jason Campbell as QB1 and Darius Heyward Bey as WR1. The team was one decent defensive player from definitive playoff contention
Lol
Jackson was a good assistant who defined the Peter Principle when promoted to HC.
@@243Abolerz They had a very healthy Darren McFadden playing against a weak AFC West.
Maybe some day Cleveland can rebrand as Birds. Just so you can hate on them more.
The Lions were terrible until recently. They kept drafting TEs in the 1st round that they eventually get rid of.
Ok, but we're those TE's awful? From the top of my head, I can only name a couple bad Lions draft picks from the 2010's-2020's (TE included).
Nick Fairley, Eric Ebron, Laken Tomlinson, Jarrod Davis, and more recently, Jeff Okudah. I'm not including Riley Reiff, Ezekiel Ansah, nor TJ Hockenson because they've either been solid starters or pro bowlers with the Lions. 2nd round picks aren't included.
ebron lmao
@@Younima4 brandon pettigrew was a top draft pick too iirc and he is most well known for the being the victim of the picked up flag in the lions cowboys playoff game
fuck dallas btw
Matt Millen 's tenure as Detroit's GM included 3 straight 1st round picks(2003-05) used on WRs.
It always felt to me as if the Lions thought that "no matter who we have on the team, no matter how many star players we have, we will still sell the same number of player jerseys to fans. So Why Draft other star players?" That's the way it always _seemed_ anyway.
You forgot to mention that the Browns decided to trade back from 6th overall in 2011 letting the Falcons draft Julio Jones.
Don't bring that up. Thanks. Go Browns...😢🤎🧡🤎
As a lifelong Browns fan I know it's hard keep track of all the stupid decisions. Cut the guy some slack.
One knew at the time that Julio Jones was going to be something... but it was probably fine given the Browns were an awful team and therefore didn't get a chance to ruin his career too.
Browns got Pick 27*, 59, 124 and a 2012 1st and 4th for that. They...
- Used picks 27 and 70 to trade up to 21 to get Phil Taylor
- Saw the Ravens (who had pick 26 but were late) drafted Jimmy Smith at pick 27
- Saw the Chiefs use pick 70 to draft potential-HOFer Justin Houston
- Drafted Greg Little with pick 59
- Drafted Owen Marecic with pick 124
- Drafted the aforementioned Brandon Weeden with the 2012 1st
- Use the 2012 4th (along with picks 139 and 211) to move up from pick 4 to pick 3
- Drafted Trent Richardson with pick 3
- Saw the Vikings select pro-bowler Matt Kalil at pick 4
- Saw the Vikings select Jarius Wright with the 2012 4th
- Saw the Vikings select Robert Blanton at pick 139
- Saw the Vikings trade pick 211 to the Titans for a 2013 6th, which turned into like four trades... which was highlighted by being involved in the Carson Palmer trade from Oakland to Arizona (here's your shoutout of incompetence, Raiders fans!)
Ok, maybe it fizzled a bit at the end, but it's save to say the Browns somehow turned "good draft capital" into draft disaster after disaster while two HOFers, a Pro Bowler and two more solid guys (Smith, Wright) went elsewhere with those direct picks.
*Raiders players keep getting DUIs*
Mark Davis: "We need to move this team to Las Vegas. That'll fix it"
Unfortunately, it had the opposite effect, as a law was passed in CA decriminalizing DUIs for BACs less than 0.950. Too bad the Raiders didn't stick around
@@ROB-cj4kq I hope you realize this was a joke, based on the real law involving thefts of property worth less than $950
@@dfp_01 To be fair, it is California we're talking about here
The Raiders are so bad at drafting that they had the pick just before a future Hall of Famer 4 times in a span of 5 years: Ed Reed, Larry Fitzgerald, Aaron Rodgers and Calvin Johnson. That is just unbelievable to imagine all those players being on the same team.
That's why I think the draft is scripted because no one can be that dumb...that's like someone giving you the winning numbers to the lottery ticket and saying nah I'm going with my numbers.
That's the worst thing you can do, could've should've would've. So if Marino went to the Steelers, would he have been as good? Rodgers to the Raiders or Calvin Johnson? Jerome Bettis doesn't get traded to the Steelers and the Rams don't pick Lawrence Phillips? Smh, so if you did marry and divorce your first wife but met your 2nd to have kids, would you be crying about that to?
@gwareb8842 there's the simple fact that almost no one is a solid choice or has a known outcome for their career development coming into the draft.
gwareb8842 everything about the NFL is scripted
I went to Gustavus Adolphus College and I never knew that a NFL team was dumb enough to draft one of our players. It's a division three school
Please tell me the team name is the Lions.
@@skillganon606 Sadly they apparently are named the Gusties
Let's not forget that the Browns were so smitten with 34 year old QB Jeff Garcia that they felt no need to draft Findlay, Ohio (about 2 hours out of Cleveland) native and Miami of Ohio star QB Ben Roethlisberger who only went to have a 26-2-1 record against said Browns
And Big Ben became the most winningest QB in firstsynergy stadium before Mayfield managed to win more games. And yet they still get rid of Mayfield. This is why Brown would never succeed unless they change owner.
@@youcantseelim1751 Mayfield gave them a great season, tore him to shreds, and then tossed him to the side.
The Panthers, with three QBs, utterly wasted the guy.
Mayfield is an average QB, so treat him like that instead of putting him under your heel
@youcantseelim1751 they did change owners tho
considering how much better garcia was outside of the browns I'm not convinced big ben wouldn't just have been wasted in cleveland though
The year Kansas City beat the 49ers in the Super Bowl, both teams combined had about 10 former browns players, just to show our incompetence as a team.
It really just become comical doesn't it?
Remember when Jim Brown was like "Trent Richardson fucking sucks" and we drafted him anyway?
Good times.
I miss having Al Davis drafting for the Raiders, he brought such unbridled chaos to Draft Night, you never knew what was going to happen
It was all about who had the fastest 40 time 😂
That guy has been dead for decades.... time to move on
@@bluepuma12As much as they're just saying that Al Davis was funny to watch draft, you do know he died in like the 2010s right?
@@bluepuma12decades? Nope
What about Browns traded their 12th overall to Texans in 2017 which picked Watson and then 4 years later traded a farm for him
Pretty sure he mentioned all that in the video though I don't think he mentioned they were able to get Denzel Ward in that first trade
To be fair, the GM in charge of the draft in 2017 was absolute garbage. On the other hand, the current Browns GM was an assistant at the time and wanted to take him.
All you have to know about how bad the GM of the time was, Sashi Brown, is that he drafted god damn DeShone Kizer in the 2nd round when the roster sucked so much ass that it was very obvious that the team would be at the top of the draft next year and in position to draft a QB.
@@bigbearkat2010Denzel Ward was mentioned in the video.
We were playing the long game.
Loving the more Balls Deep content you’ve been posting recently! I like your normal breakdowns but I feel like with these you get to show your individuality more. Keep up the good work!
I noticed you neglected to mention Jacobs and Crosby
It doesn’t make up for everything but they are good enough to be mentioned
They may be fine players, but if the Raiders "knew" they would be good they should have drafted them higher. It says more about their development of players than draft skills.
Crosby us their best pick for sure
🤦 Well....I guess you could kinda have something almost resembling a valid point there when you consider that list is so short it would only take 7 syllables to mention it [but you do realize that other (decent) teams can routinely hit on nearly half their picks in a good year, no? And to them, two players in one draft wouldn't be considered that much of a reason to celebrate, let alone a generational happening that's this exceptionally awesome windfall of talent and cause to throw a week long, 24-7 block party compared to their normal draft results?].
@@justinmix143 Did you miss the part where I said it doesn’t make up for everything else?
@@EmmaBonn96 nope
You forgot Maxx Crosby for the Raiders' late round gems. Dude is an animal.
The Browns worst decision ever was when they passed on Big Ben and took Winslow in 2004. That was their biggest mistake ever. I never count any team passing on Brady because every team, including NE, passed on him 6-7 times. But Ben was right there, an Ohio kid no less, and they decided TE was the better route. And he then went on to make their life awful for almost 2 decades.
ya and for years he had more wins than any browns qb in cleveland up til 2021 if im right
Winslow Jr was considered a great pick at the time, super athletic with good blocking, and had a decent year but it was completely understandable they passed on him.
WTF is a Brown? The Cleveland Poopmen
As an LA based Ram and recovering Raider fan, I shouldn't like this channel, but I do. In fact, I like it a whole lot. Keep up the great work!
Pfft, bandwagon. I bet you switched teams again. Probably a Lions or Dolphins "fan."
It's actually a subtle question: do players suck because bad teams draft them, or do bad teams draft players who suck?
As a Steelers fan thank you Browns for letting us have TJ, much appreciated and check is in the mail.
see yall in da playoffs
Also for skipping on Big Ben
As a Bengals fan, I have really grown to love and appreciate all the football teams in our wonderful AFC North. The Ravens and the Steelers are time honored winners with grit. No I don't think it is weird that we have a 3 team division.
and the browns who for some reason own the bengals
@@UserName-ts3sp its pity, like giving alms to the starving tykes.
To be fair, a lot of the draft busts might have fared significantly better if they weren't in completely dysfunctional franchises like the Raiders and Browns. And all of those HoF players they could have drafted quite likely could have been ruined by the surrounding incompetence.
I think it's possible to tack the Bears on there for all their draft whiffs
I was about to say lol
That Mitch Trubisky move is going to be peak dumbassery for a loooong time.
@@ELIJAHNUBOYD you smoking on that bhutanese shadow garden pack my boy, take a look at any of my sports related shorts and you'd know I've been slated with the miserable fate of being a Bears fan my whole life
You put out my favorite sports content to consume, going through a tough time right now and watching your videos brings light to my day, I appreciate ya
22:19
Let be honest: Pat Mahomes, Deshaun Watson, Josh Allen, Lamar Jackson... All those guys had holes in their game and needed to work and develop into who they are today. If either team had drafted, they probably would not have put the right support and coaching around them to help them develop. Case in point: Jon Gruden, Josh McDaniels, Hue Jackson, Freddie Kitchens. Yeah, they could've drafted those guys, but it's likely they would've just ruined them.
Is odd how Raiders can sweep Denver after drafting poorly.
Broncos have never beat the Las Vegas Raiders
@@dbcoffman22 it's always a home game whenever the raiders play at mile high. ☠️ ☠️ ☠️
True, Brandon has failed to mention that
@@ben-manvibing162 And when they play in San Diego/Los Angeles.
Honestly the Lions are also up there in terms of worst drafters if you exclude the last couple of years. Brad Holmes has turned it around, but it was really bad for a while (but they have certainly hit on some picks too)
Before watching this video, I’m gonna say the Browns are worse at drafting. Despite the Raiders drafting Jamarcus Russel at one point, they did draft some sort of QB stability in the form of Derek Carr. This is compared to the Browns and their infamously long list of failed QBs.
I’ll edit this after watching the vid
as much as I agree on the utter incompetence of my Raiders during nearly every year's first round, I think you shorted us REALLY hard when you mentioned "later round gems". Including Kirk Morrison means the 3rd round was in play, but no mention of Maxx Crosby?? That was probably our best pick in the entire timeframe this video covered lol. AND Nate Hobbs was a 5th rd pick!!
In nooo way do I want to come off as defending the Raiders as some sort of paragon of great drafting. Faaaar from it. I just think our ability to pick the good players of any given class where they *should be* taken is completely FUBAR and has been for decades now. But on the flipside, I'd argue we can, and do, find gems/late round talent at an average-to-above-average rate compared to the rest of the league. The draft is a complete gamble, especially after those first couple rounds, and we have actually won that bet more than I'd expect to. But that gamble is supposed to pay off huge if/when you do hit because, in theory, the first pick or two should be near guaranteed to be pieces that truly build your team. Since we've made a tradition of whiffing on those rounds, our late gems dont actually end up paying off very well, as they just end up needing to fill in for the gaps that should have been stepping stones filled by our early rd guys.
Maxx ends up just being what our #4 pick shouldve gotten us, but they picked Cle Ferrel instead
Hobbs ends up just being the ONLY good DB on the roster, despite the prior 5(at least) straight high rd picks on DBs like Arnnette, Mullen, Conley, Abram, Joseph, etc.
Because he's a Broncos fan 😂 Maxx and Josh Jacobs gives him nightmares and I can't blame him. Broncos with the #1 run defense? Don't worry. They'll look like a high school defense by the time JJ is done raw dawning Denver. And Mad Maxx? Constantly harassing the QB.
You know why the raiders never win because any defensive player the raiders draft by mid season every year the raiders have half their team injured and by the time they get back from injury another round of starters get hurt and with no elite QB the raiders never overcome the injuries just watch what happens this year they will be depleted on defense again and the average QB who can't elevate the injuries will win 7 games and here we go again the dense fans will blame the defense but the raiders are smart they keep watching every team in the league slowly but surely get their 1 rd QB and the raiders keep crying defense defense..were stuck as average for many more years to come that obvious.
Being a Raiders fan is hard 😮💨
Until broncos week
@@curbdoggsports Trueeeee lmao
Oh trust me I feel your pain but I also laughed my ass off because I've been a die-hard CHIEFS fan for 50 years. And that was a rough 50-years let me tell you. Now if you guys suck for another 20 then I'll start feeling bad for you
The Browns are worse. The Davises have always had a priority on Keeping the Owner Happy & being too hands-on under Al to having Mark be a too-hands-off figurehead, with winning as a distant 14th priority. The _Browns_ are _TRYING_ to succeed & as such are hilarious.
@@choosecarefully408 oh the Browns are definitely worse. no question. As far as Mark I've liked his approach the last few years. He knows he doesn't know ball like his dad so he just hires people that do know ball and let them work. We just gotta find people that can actually get it done 😅
the browns suffer from a total lack of expertise at the ownership, GM, and head coach level for most of the years since 1999. that is simply too much to overcome. they had ONE guy that actually knew football in all of those years, GM john dorsey. im not saying dorsey was perfect, but the overall talent level of the browns was rapidly rising while he was GM. but the rest of the organization didnt know football, and so they ganged up on him and fired him. then they hired yet another rookie GM in berry and yet another rookie coach in stefanski, and the talent level is now in full decline.
"Trent. Fucking. Richardson. It is TRULY a sight to behold. Like a horrific car crash." Tree, 2017
another point is that this was in the era where teams knew RBs were not worth very high picks, late 1st at best.
It's funny since an old clip has been going around about Merrill Hoge talking with Stephen A Smith and Skip Bayliss about Johnny Manziel. Hoge said he would be bust and anyone who took him in the first round would regret it heavily, while Skip trumped up Manziel as eventually being better than Brady.
Skipper with a bad take? Just another day ending with a "Y".
15:10 There's Gabe Jackson again after his accidental cameo on GPS yesterday ;-)
Great episode everyone :-)
To be fair Phil the Power Taylor has more world titles than Tom Brady.
Good work from Tom's assistant.
I actually played against Ryan hoag when he played at gustavas adolphus. He was a burner for a d3 player
Lifelong raiders fan here: Crosby, Jacobs, Hobbs, Renfrow are literally the only four even halfway decent draft picks we have had in the last 4 years, with two of those years having multiple first round picks from the Mack/Cooper trades(2019 and 2020). Moral of the story: In the last 4 years, it’s not up for debate. No team has even sniffed being as atrocious at drafting and developing players. I hate it here.
Don't forget the Browns not taking Big Ben, grew up a Browns fan. And then Ben having more wins in Cleveland than any Browns QB until Baker
I love these Balls Deep episodes, really awesome work!
i''m really enjoying these balls deep uploads, keep em coming boss!
9:15 Russell isn’t the only QB mentioned in the video who didn’t watch any tape
Brandon 'These two teams are never ON the clock but rather off it' Perna
I mean, I know it isn't enough to really tip the scales in any way, but Maxx Crosby (4th) not making it to your late round gems for the Raiders seems strange.
He's a bronco fan, can't expect him to offer real analysis.
Never thought I'd hear this channel mention Gustavus Adolphus College for any reason, but here we are (it's a D3 school in southern MN).
Especially at quarterback, Drafting in the first round is way different than later rounds. The natural desire to acquire the best available talent can easily turn your attention (as a team with a pick) from aspects of fitting in the scheme and potential to develop, as well as personality. And it looks like some gms know how to deal with this pressure, and some will prefer to get some assets for it. Because a lot of the teams who fail their 1ts rounders still were quite successful with picks from later rounds. Again, i refer to qb's
The problem is those idiot dont know how to develop the talents they drafted with high picks. In another universe, I believe if Brown ever draft Mahome, he will be just another mediocre shit. And Mayfield could have win a Super Bowl if he were drafted by the Chief.
The sad thing is these two teams have die hard fanbases that will show up to their games no matter what they do. These owners make a ton of money without having to put anything back into the teams
I'm pretty sure the statistics say my jets are the worst. We're only not in the conversation right now is because we're only a year removed from probably our best draft in franchise history and followed it up with what looks like a decent draft this year
Moral of the story, quit using the Cleveland Browns as reason Lamar should get paid
Truth, you could just say Lamar deserves it.
Right off the bat I would go with the Browns. I don't know of any team to get as many high picks that don't live up to expectations.
I legit don't get excited about watching the draft anymore as a Browns fan.
We've had 2 good picks since about the year 2000.
The Browns' playoff game was in Pittsburgh, not Cleveland. They have never had a playoff game in Cleveland
As a life long Steelers fan, born and raised in the Steel City - I loved every second of this video..
No matter which was declared “worst” out of these two teams, I knew it was going to end with one of them… and that makes me happy…
Minor nitpick: William Green. Another Browns first round pick who underperformed on the field and ended up in all kinds of legal trouble. As a lifelong Browns fan, I enjoyed this trip down misery lane. Thanks Perna.
7:00 It was disgusting how Stillers fans tried to defend that cheap shot. Just as bad was the Browns sending McCoy back in the game when he was clearly out of it.
If you include the Matt Millen Era, the Lions have to be the worst.
The Browns and Raiders are two very dysfunctional teams with bad ownership, bad coaching, and bad management. Everything starts at the top. This has led to decades of bad drafting. Everything rests on ownership and coaching. If both are bad, the team as a whole will reflect that.
I laugh so hard as a kid when the brownies drafted Brandon Weeden it was so hilarious
25 year old rookie 😂
I gotta say for the browns in 2018 lamar and allen needed a lot of work and shaping which I dont think the browns were equipped to do
Two major names you failed to mention for the Raiders. Josh Jacobs and Max Crosby.
2 good picks since 2014. Stunning.
Bro Khalil Mack 😢
@Luis Castaneda I know. I eas bummed when we lost him. But at the same time, when Carr went down and the season spiraled, he didn't win us anything alone. So to trade him to end up with a franchise record setting RB and to get Maxx out of that domino effect, worth it.
After all these years of duds why don’t these teams almost exclusively just trade away their first round picks for proven good players
Looking back on some of Cleveland's draft picks:
Tim Couch lasted five seasons in the league.
Courtney Brown was always injured.
Gerard Warren started for a decade but was never a star.
Kellen Winslow is in prison.
Joe Thomas is in the Hall of Fame for playing over 10,000 consecutive snaps.
Alex Mack was an All-Pro lineman.
Joe Haden was also a good cornerback.
Johnny Manziel crashed and burned.
Miles Garrett is an elite edge rusher.
Baker Mayfield has one last chance to prove himself in Tampa Bay.
Joel Bitonio is definitely the better pick over those bums like Jimmy Garoppolo lol. Joel is an AllPro guard while Jimmy is a bottom 5 QB
There is no chance my college got mentioned @ 4:03 !! I had no idea anyone from here went to the nfl, so cool!
relatively new to the channel. the drawn logos crack me up every time
Raiders fan here and I approve of this message.
4:03 okay but they give out the best pens out of any college fair
Robert Mays and Bill Barnwell just did a great episode of the Athletic Football Show about this
Bottom 5 team that yours hasn't beaten in three years 😉
I think getting Johnny Football despite the red flags gets the Browns the win. I am a Browns fan as well.
Also thank goodness we did draft Tim Couch over Donovan McNabb, we would have destroyed his career earlier.
That is balls deep research to pull that off. Well done.
How are the Bears not at the top of this list with their QB draft picks ?
This…. Is premium content sir 🔥
Enjoyed the hell out of it
Brandon is right about Sebastian Janikowski. A lot of people talk about how great he was but I don't remember him hitting any big kicks. I do however remember him missing a lot of big kicks. He had a lot of power but no accuracy.
Point of clarification: since you talked about the stockpiling of picks the Browns did and showed John Dorsey at the same time, that’s not entirely an accurate fact. Sashi Brown and Podesta were the ones that led the front office to tanking seasons while acquiring draft capital. It wasn’t until they were fired and Dorsey came along that they finally reaped the rewards of that stockpile…. If Sashi were still in charge during the 2018 draft, I think CLE would have drafted Allen or Lamar instead of picking first overall. IMO, Dorsey made solid choices as GM, but in hindsight I think the Browns would have looked a lot more different had Sashi overlooked the 18 draft.
I don't know what is more impressive. Browns and Raiders consistently missing on draft picks, or Lions drafting much better comparatively yet still as bad of a team
The Lions late round selections would be where the problems really went wrong as unless it was the top 2-3 rounds the barrel was dry for the most part of 20 years of any productivity.
And remember is coming from a Broncos fan . The team that sold their soul to get Russell Wilson and now John Elway left
My friend goes to Gustavus and I was not expecting to hear a player from a D3 school in this video lmao
Texans also played 32 less games than the raiders. So not sure if they should count as "more wins side 2000"
Akili Smith. Bengals passed on trading with the Saints for 9 picks for Ricky Williams. Smith had a grand total of 461 attempts in his career
You've neglected one very real possibility. It may be that these many players who were drafted before Hall-of-Fame-level talent had the same potential as those drafted after them. It may be that the Browns and Raiders do recognize talent just fine, but they also squander it. It may be that some of these draft busts would have had legendary careers if they had only landed on a team that wasn't a dumpster fire.
As a Raider fan, we are the worst with 1st round picks
I live in Cleveland and yea y’all worse than us
They both are hands down worst qb drafting franchises ever. Baker was not horrible but way over drafted.
I'm a die hard Raiders fan, we can't draft and we don't know how to evaluate talent. We got lucky with Maxx Crosby. But our entire 2020 draft class was a failure, our 2021 draft isn't looking great, it's just insane how bad Las Vegas/Oakland is at drafting. I feel you could throw a dart on a board and do just as well
The Browns are worse, and it isn't even close. At least the Raiders nailed it with Khalil Mack and Derek Carr was also a good pick and they hadn't taken any sociopaths (which in the Al Davis era would have been a feature rather than a bug)...and let's face it, on paper, JaMarcus Russell was no-brainer. The dude was a GOD at LSU, how were they to know he'd be lazier than a cut dog?
As a Cowboys fan we have drafted awesome and have zero f****** super bowl appearances since then
As a Browns fan, I'm not really sure how rookie Watson or Mahomes would've done in 2017 with the team they had. Sure the O line would've been fine, but Terrell Pryor and Corey Coleman as their top 2 WR's and Isaiah Crowell as RB1 wouldn't have helped much.
same thing with the idea of taking Josh Allen over Baker Mayfield the year after. Josh Allen now is one of the best in the league, but he was rough coming out of the draft. He's only ascended to become the absolute monster he is because of McDermott and the rest of the coaching staff's work with him. Do we really think Hugh Jackson was gonna get that kind of play out of Josh Allen?
Factory of sadness. No fan base can hold a candle to the misery and devotion the brown and orange have been through and display. And yet, we still show up. Great clip. Happy to hear we won another award. Bwahaha
You didn’t mention the Raiders taking Fabian Washington in 2005 1 pick before Green Bay took Aaron Rodgers
If we are talking recently, the jets have been pretty bad at drafting. Just gave a 1st round pick a 2nd contract for the first time in 8 years lol, plus like 5 or 6 2nd round receivers that were all busts.
Alright even though this is basically a roast of the browns and raiders, I really like the fact that you went back in time and gave some real facts about both but specifically my browns! Now I see why we're so bad lol thank you the more you know 😂
I imagine Perna yelling at the bathroom mirror a lot for reflecting incompetence.
Love ya Perna!
Hair is looking great in this video Brandon 👍🏻
Like I get that they could have had Josh Allen and Lamar Jackson but I don’t think you can say that either player would have been near as good as they have been with either team
Baker won a playoff game there. Given that, had he gone anywhere else he probably is a perennial super bowl champ.
@@cemarz I think if baker went anywhere else his career wouldn’t have been ruined like it has been tbh
Actually, the Browns defense won a playoff game. Mayfield happened to not lose it.
@@marcomcdowell8861 I mean mayfield had 263 yards and 3 touchdowns the browns defense let up 37 points I mean yes the Steelers had 4 turnovers but but I think baker had a solid enough game to say that he was a reason they won that game
Lawrence Vickers was a damn fine FB. Great blocker and good hands. That line let a lot of guys through and Vickers gave them a few ways to compensate.
There's a lot of embarrassing facts here, but i think Cleveland taking 3 QBs in the first round over 7 seasons and getting a 10-30 record out of them is incredible.
No it’s shows how hard it is to draft and deal wit a player for so long and how soft these qbs are
I had forgotten about Gallery. It's not the same level, but that's almost as bad as 89 with Green Bay. Aikman, Barry Sanders, Deon Sanders, and Derrick Thomas and they get Tony Mandarich
they also passed on big ben at #11. so did cleveland
I have watched you for years and this is the first video of yours that I have ever watched that I would consider not that great
I surprisingly know of Gustavus, they tried to recruit me back in highschool.
Do not disrespect my man Spergon “The Surgeon” Wynn
To be fair... It's really hard to draft players... We have seen people who were Heisman trophies ended up being a draft level... Sometimes you really seems that you can do all the formwork to who you going to draft and yet still be wrong and it could basically be a coin flip to see if this player is going to be the right choice
With the Sebastian Janikowski comment...
DUI?
::Enters Matt Prater::
When he was a Bronco, funny how Perna didn't mention that chaos lmao