KelTec Sub 2000 VS Smith & Wesson FPC
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- Опубликовано: 1 июн 2024
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In this video, Eric compares two generations of @KelTecWeapons Sub 2000s to the new @SmithAndWessonInc FPC.
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Eric was too modest to mention that he used the KelTec Sub 2000 to hit two targets at 440 yards with iron sights (in "How Far Will a 9mm Kill?").
Now it all makes sense why I remembered the name Keltec Sub 2000… lol
Fun fact: If you shoot Underwood’s .40 S&W 135 GR JHP in the Sub-2000, it hits 935 foot pounds of energy 😱
They just released a Gen 3 Sub2K that has a rotating front stock to address the folding issue. For Gen2 there were folding and angled optics to get out of the way of folding mechanism.
@@BoopSnoot Or you can buy a cheap offset mount for under $10. Either way works
I love the ket-tec because it is skinny. It hides in a very full backpack without adding extra bulk.
This. The flat form factor when folded allows the sub 2k to slide easily into and out of the laptop sleeve of a daypack.
The M*Carbo sight mount takes a red dot, and easily flips out of the way when you need for fold the rifle. Very well done piece. They make a bunch of S2K accessories that are almost essential.
I believe midwest industries also makes such a mount
I got my father the mcarbo mount, and it is awesome.
Is it worth the 200 dollars though ?
@@youngsmitty2325 Mine was only 99.95, got it when they first came out. They are $150 now. Steep, but that's the cost of quality.
MCarbo should make a butstock replacement that holds a spare mag or two. Not sure if it would work with how the charging handle works, though
Hope you know how appreciated all your hard work is, Eric. Your dedication to 2A makes a huge difference. I even joined GOA because of you! Just wanted to say thanks.
Love my KelTec! Super fun gun.
Heck yeah! Love my gen1
You can't beat the 4.5 pound empty weight.
I got sad and nostalgic at the same time watching Barry Rock out with the gen 1 ❤ nice review Eric keep the great videos coming!
Same I miss his stories and wisdom
If you own Glocks - get a Kel Tec. If you own a lot of MP series pistols get the S&W. I picked up my Kel Tech G2 with Glock mag compatibility for 300 beans and did a bunch of MCarbo upgrades on it and its a blast to shoot.
What if you have both?
Then you get the power of free choice :)
There's a multi-mag version that can be adapted to several different mag brands.
I have the FPC, Ruger PCC, and the Sub-2000.
I enjoy all of them but don't detail strip the sub. That interior is Nerf gun quality.
I actually got a notification for once.
Same! Actually 2 from this channel at once!
Same. Doesn't usually happen.
Didn't, but this is much better than expected
Never get one
I'm not getting any notifications from any gun channels. Weirdly I get notifications from Garand Thumb?..
Thanks for the content Eric. Been watching the channel since I first got into guns 10 years ago!
That old barry footage got me right in the feels.
I like how you said you’d do this and actually did it. Really enjoyed the video Erik you have a great day 👍🏼
Thank you for your time and effort posting this very interesting and informative video.
I own multiple keltec’s and they all work quite well.
any experience with the RBD?
Thank you Eric honestly done as usual.
really well done... appreciate
the pros/cons of both
Solid review like usual! 👍🏾
Giving this a thumbs up before I even watch it. I already know it's going to be good info.
I'm a big fan of the Sub2k. I have a gen2. Looking forward to checking out the S&W offering some time soon
Now a 10MM would be awesome
I want one in a 44 magnum! I love my sub2k in 9mm but imagine it in 44 magnum 😎
It would blow up, mostly plastic😊
This is by far the best comparison video🙌👏
I'm a Smith guy anyway. Works well for me and my wife loves shooting it.
I have both and love them both! My sub 2000 is set up for M&P mags , so I can bring both to the range and interchange the mags.
I have a .40 sub2000, I absolutely LOVE mine - very compact and very accurate
The MCARBO optic actually resolved the folding issue regarding the optics for the Keltec sub 2000. Honestly I can't believe that both you and Honest Outlaw, have never reviewed a MCARBO Keltec sub 2000.
For sure. I picked up my sub2k and upgraded with all mcarbo parts. It's night and day. From the buffer upgrades, feed ramp, rear sight post, trigger, muzzle break, steel internals, mag release, etc... I and it's probably comparable in price to the SW now. I picked my gen2 up a couple years back for $350. Completely different, and very reliable pcc.
There needs to be an mcarbo/keltec v SW side by side review. Iraq won't do it though.
I picked up an aftermarket swinging optic mount for $99. Feels rock solid, solves the problem but does hurt the poverty tier value proposition
Dang I haven’t seen your videos in years, RUclips just stopped putting them in my feed. I went thru and liked a few to get you back in my play list
The Keltec 2000 with the Mcarbo package is amazing.
Just got my S&W FPC last friday. Haven't shot it yet, can't wait.
I been running the FPC for a couple of months and love it! The only down is the bolt release. Almost impossible to use but easily overcome through using the charging handle!
I have always been a S&W man. I have a M&P AR-15 Sport 2, which I absolutely love.
Being an old man I have the M&P EZ in 9mm and .380 for cc. , and a 40 caliber for nightstand defense.
I’m thinking the FPC is going to be a birthday present this year.
I had to have one...
I don't like the S&W FPC at all. While I will say that out of the box the FPC is a better gun, modifications can make the sub2K better than the FPC will even be. Also, the FPC is just clunkier IMHO.
You wont regret buying the FPC.
I feel you brother...turn 60 in july...and I basically have the same setup...45 instead of 40...rock on.
Thanks for the video Eric. Very informative. If it were only for me I might try the KelTech, but as I am older my guns will go to family members eventually. They are not as gun savvy, so not able to quickly fix a problem. So I think the Smith & Wesson would be my choice even though initial cost is higher.
One point about the KelTec Sub 2000 gen2 is a Glock 17 round mag fits flush and you get a smaller folded profile than he showed using a larger mag. Carry folded with a 17 round mag in it for the minimum profile and larger mags can be brought along in case needed.
Solid information, Thank You very much.
Always good to see ya
I have the Sub 2000. MCarbo sells an optic mount that folds out of the way for $125. Kel-tec has $100 off until about 4/24. PSA has the Keltec for $375. Suppressors make the Sub 2000 cycle too fast. Flow-through work fine.
I did put a red dot on an extended picatinny on my Keltec with a quick detach. Then I got me the FPC and just because of the ergonomics, I know I'll be putting more rounds through the FPC. It is my opinion that a shooter will have better results if he/she is more comfortable with using a firearm... Great comparison! Thanks
I mounted a 45 deg offset for a pistol dot near the front site post on my sub2k. Use a holosun 507c on it and it still folds and locks. I love the set up.
..where did you get that offset sight...and is there one available for the rear sight???
@@cbroz7492 it’s a 45 deg offset for a pistol red dot. So no rear sight
@NoahMudge ...thanks. where'd you get that base???
@@cbroz7492 My local gun shop ordered a good quality one for me but sorry, can’t remember the brand. A cheap one from Amazon bent as I tightened it down on the rail- a waste of money. Edit- I think the good one was Tru-Glo.
I can happily say i own and love both! That being said, i absolutely give the edge to the Smith and Wesson on several levels. Not the least of which it points and shoots much more naturally. Okay, i will shut up and actually watch the video now. Lol
Always great to see Barry!
Probably good to point out the Midwest Industries rotatable optic mount for the gen 2 Sub 2000 that lets you fold the rifle with an optic that has the Aimpoint micro thread pattern. I've ran one for awhile and while I haven't done any hardcore testing on return to zero repeatability, it easily hits steel at 300.
EDIT: Midwest also has a picatinny version. MCarbo also has a plate that mounts to the frame of the sub 2000 that lets you mount an optic that flips to the side similar to Eotech or other manufacturer magnifiers
Your summary of the utilitarian nature of Kel-Tecs is spot on. I had a P11. It served it's purpose, but I didn't enjoy shooting it.
The FPC is the clear winner, its just a better in every way
I concur. The FPC also doesn't have plastic trigger linkage components like the Kel-Tec.
@Sirgromulus not to mention the subpar plastics and no folding optic. I think the charging handle is the only thing the keltec has above it.
Gen 3 changes all that. And if you are already rocking Glock mags?
@@steveh9714This.
I have FPC in last couple months ago . I love that
Really good review.
There is a gen 3 Sub-2000 now, do you have a video on it? It was nice to see Barry again in this video, RIP.
Love the homage to Barry! Good times!
I own the 9mm Keltec Sub 2000 gen 2, then added a laser sight to the bottom rail... with a pressure switch. I use Glock 19's 15 round magazines so it doesn't extend below the pistol grip. Handy truck gun.... and very accurate.
The fact you can keep your optic on the S&W makes it head and shoulders a better design than the keltec, but if you already shoot glocks the sub2k is an easy choice.
That advantage disappears with the Kel-Tec Sub 2000 Gen3, which has a rotating barrel, and is still twice as skinny in a pack.
You can keep an optic on the Kel Tec...
@@maxwelledison03 Wow you’re a genius, thanks for letting us all finally know Maxwell!
Thank you for the awesome gun video brother I have a keltec sub 2000 gen 2 the one that takes glock 17 magazines and I bought the mcarbo stainless steel feed ramp for my kel tec sub 2000 gen 2 I think these carbines are awesome and I am in sdi and I can't wait till I build an ar9 that will be awesome.
Had Sub 2000 first gen in 40 S&W. Hated it and not because of being in 40S&W. When out and got a Ruger PC carbine in 40 S&W. Love it it!! Sure is was more $$$$ but worth it.
Hi Eric , I didn’t recognize you at first lol, but anyway thanks for reviewing this gun
you all should do a part 2 with the keltec sub2000 gen 3 vs sw fpc would be a 🔥 video
I just wanted to say Semper Fi. Thank you. Remember we are all family us Americans. So that would make you my brother and my family is yours too.
I bought a Gen 2 KelTec Sub 2000 and put a side mount with a top swivel optic adapter on it. I believe at the time it cost around $75. I put a Sig Romeo 5 red dot optic on it and it has kept zero every time I take it out & shoot it. Overall I am pleased with the way it shoots, and is very accurate. I also put on MCarbo's sleeve over the tubular frame as well as the spongy washer in the back of the bolt carrier to lessen recoil. Glad to see other manufacturers coming out with their own models. The more the merrier!
Ive got a 2nd Gen Sub2K in 40. Its a perfect backpack/truck gun. You definitely need a super low cheek weld to use the factory sites, but it is very easy to point shoot at 25 yards and consistently hit A/B zone
A company does make an optic mount for the Kel Tec which folds out of the way so that it closes, but it is expensive.
I’ve had my S2K for over a year. I carry it on my 4wheeler and it doesn’t take any room at all. A great and easy gun to shoot. This video was a nice comparison for both. Some people just like a single brand of gun. This video showed there is more than one chicken in the coop.😊
Red Lion Forend for the Sub2K allows you to rotate the forend so the optic is on the side or bottom when you fold it. Best accessory for the Sub2K
But $179? Way too expensive for an accessory.
The gen 3 sub2000 is going to be awesome 👏
What would they even improve?
Have it fold sideways like the FPC so optics can stay mounted ,give it a last shot bolt hold open feature, and strengthen the fragile rear sight that too easily snaps off.
@@tommccormick9290 yes! Or side folding with no iron sights so users can pick their own flip up sights. Maybe a buffer tube adapter that lets you use any milspec AR stock
That gen 1 that you painted looks amazing. It has the same look as toy guns from the 50s and 60s. I'm jealous, how many rounds do you think you have through that thing?
I like that the fpc has a non reciprocating charging handle since I shoot left handed. It's more convenient
For us M&P guys the FPC is a no-brainer. I threw a Sig green dot on mine and added a 3-lug and it’s a tac driver. Very accurate.
Yeah I only own two guns . Both S&W. So the FPC is a my only real option
that sig green dot with ar flip up sights makes it bad ass i love my fpc its great back pack gun
Me and my brother in law wad debating this just the other day glad you made this video!
The GEN 3 sub 2000 allows it to be turned and folded side ways allowing you to keep optics mounted.
Nice video, as always! I'm being picky, but to truly compare weight, a set of "iron sights" should've been added to the S&W. Also, for my opinion, I think the deciding factor is what pistol you have. If you're running a Glock, the Sub2000 all the way. If you have a Smith, then Smith. If you have both, then what you said although I prefer the slimmer profile of the Sub2000.
Glad I found this my friend wanted me to look at the smith before I bought the sub2k . I still am opting for the simplistic design of the Kel-Tec and they do come out with pretty cool designs gotta give respect when it’s due. When I heard they were giving them away to Ukraine I was a little disappointed and sent a email asking if they would send me a free one in which today is an unanswered email lol.
One thing to consider about the cost: I have two Sub2ks, really like them, but by the time I beefed them up with M*Carbo upgrades (which are great), I could have gotten the more expensive S&W (several key pins and parts in the Kel Tec probably won't hold up well over time and heavy use. The plastic feed ramp was one of the first changes). We don't know yet how durable and reliable the S&W will be, but I am very happy with my Sub2ks.
I know that John Lovett at Warrior Poet really doesn't get the point of the Sub2ks, but I love that I can easily stow it in a backpack, it's really quiet when suppressed (another thing he's not keen about on ARs, but to me, if you have to use it in your home, and you blow out your ears, wreck your hearing - that's not optimal), it's something that a brand new shooter can pick up and shoot reasonably well without a lot of training. Anything with a stock is much easier to shoot well than a pistol. I get his preference for ARs, but I think there's a viable niche for the Sub2ks.
Lovell*
I think he actually changed his opinion on suppressors for home defense use
@@CheeseBurgerXJ He doesn’t really care one way or another, he just doesn’t use one on his personal home defense gun.
@@CheeseBurgerXJThat was always kind of an odd opinion. Suppressed 5.56 inside a house is still loud AF. Especially on a short boi and a K can.
Great content.
Mention Eric you can run a optic on the sub-2000 and still folded up there's a company that makes them out for it and it's actually a really robust malament very nice that you can fold your optic over almost like what a magnifier mounting option
Something I am surprised I don't see more often: I favor riveting a couple of metal spring clips to the fore and aft on the Keltec forend to hold a spare 33-round magazine either side, and attach a short section of Picatinney 1913 rail to the side of the recoil tube to store a QD mounted Red Dot sight for storage. I favor keeping a sling with a magazine pouch on it, and taping a single round to the receiver by the ejection port, providing a cheap and handy travel and storage package with one hundred rounds of ready ammunition. Because a good QD mounted sight doesn't lose zero in storage and is only a few seconds to move, it gives a good alternative to the factory sights. Adding a flashlight under the barrel is a very practical finishing addition, and all pretty inexpensive.
The butt storage for M&P magazines gives the S&W carbine a similar ability, and it doesn't require relocating the sight for storage. Bulk ends up being similar.
I think the S&W recoil spring is even heavier, but I don't see much difference practically between the two.
The real questions are accuracy, and price, and availability.
Of course an integral suppressor is the dream!
I have and like both guns as they are both as accurate. However I did purchase the MCarbo model Sub2000 which was custom setup to me with all their upgrades and their folding scope mount which work great and holds zero.
..
Great seeing that short clip of Barry at the beginning..R I P Barry
Nice non bias review. Very good explanations of both guns with pros and cons. I like both guns and like you, I think both have their place depending on what you're doing with them. Both make great truck guns. I am a smith and Wesson fan, however I do really like the keltec! I also believe that not every gun needs an optic to be an effective self defense or pinker. Everyone has different options and that's mine. Thanks again for the great comparison. Looking forward to more videos.
I don't care what anybody says. sub 2000's are so fun to shoot! I'd love to try out the Smith.
I have the bell rung and I haven't seen a post from you in weeks. I have a lot of videos to catch up on now.
Gen 3 just fixed the optics issue on the Keltec.
Love You Eric Sir 😇😎✌
Firearms dont have to be shiny and expensive to work well.
I was skeptical of Keltec at first. My Sub2K works great. Not one jam. I did install the Mcarbo trigger and and trigger guard. I dont think the upgrade is mandatory. I just enjoy taking stuff a part.
I def love my S2K and keep it as a truck gun.
Very nice! Get one.
Where did you buy the m carbo I’m from Canada toronto
If you really like the sub 2000, you can get a swing adapter for your red dot. Someone from my club added that to his. Swing it out of the way to close and lock it in place went open. However, I got a great deal on my S&W FPC.
Good review
I love my KT gen. II ! One of my cheapest guns but my kids love it & I’ll never get rid of it.
I’m seeing Sub 2000s under 300.00 (296.00 after a 100.00 rebate). When they came out, they were unicorns that sold for twice MSRP.
I'm curious about the trigger pull on each carbine. Did you happen to measure the trigger pull? Which trigger was smoother? Which trigger did you prefer?
a keltec sub 2000 is a good affordable backup to keep in a vehicles to backup your handgun. And easy to hide and lower cost in case of theft .
That’s what I do.. keep it right in the front floorboard under the seat with a full 30rnd mag laying beside it. Plus my Glock on my side and an extra mag of hollow points that I can also shove into my sub2k if needed!
Couldn't you put a folding sight mount on the keltec so it can still fold with a sight on it?
I am fully on board with s&w continuing to copy keltec guns and make them not suck. I'd like to see their take on the su16
You should do a top 5 keltec firearms video
Buds Gun Shop has been selling the gen2 Keltec for $299. Much cheaper than the S&W. I got the Ruger PCC at a great price, and like it more than the S&W, because the folding ability doesn’t impress me. Shoots fantastic with a Sig Romeo dot.
Kel tecs i looked at were all in the 5 to 6 hundred dollar range. never have seen one as cheap as this guy says they are
@@stanleygerard4319Got my Gen 2 , a box of HPs and 3 magazines for $275 out the door. They dropped the Gen 3 a while ago, so Gen 2s are getting objectively cheaper.
Small/flush fitting magazine for storage and 33-round fun stick as a reload. Pretty unlikely that you'll ever need to reload it in a defensive scenario, but it's a good option.
Eric, Look up McCarbo’s video on their Sub2000 modifications including their fabulous optic mount. Their mods make the gun more robust and a better platform all around.
Had the opportunity to shoot the sub 2000 once. It's a good compliment to a side arm and gives a little more accuracy for longer shots I think it would make a great truck or backpack gun. Do wish they would have offered it in 10mm though. Does the M&P come in other calibers like the KelTec?
Not yet. It seems as though the FPC has proven successful, so I'm hoping they will do some other calibers. But they probably have their hands full just cranking out the 9mm........
Now we need a gen 3 sub 2000 comparison
Thanks!
You can find 45 degree pic rail adapters that look like a ladder (they fit between the rail slots and sit flush)
This makes it easy to slap a pistol dot on a sub2k and still fold it.
Might of missed the question/comment, is the S&W almost all composite like the S2k?
I've been thinking of upgrading to it because I'm not a real big fan of how much plastics KelTec uses in their tools...
It’s heavier than the sub2k. It still has polymer on it but it’s definitely built with a little more steel!
M-carbo makes a nice flip to side optic mount for the sub 2k.
I see the Kel Tec sub 2000 as a blank canvas, the buyer can customize it to fit the user desired use case.
Eric.. How are those Taran Tactical mag extensions working out on the FPC?? Assuming you put it on the 17 round mag vs 23??
MCarbo makes an excellent adaptor for red dot sights for the Sub 2000. I have one on mine and it holds zero and is very durable.
I have the FPC and it’s a great gun couple hundred rounds threw it and no problems and shoots damn good. I like it better than the ruger carbine
You forgot to mention the S&W comes with its bag and you can also pack a 22lr pistol.
Annnnnnnnd now you have the Gen3 folding and pivoting fore stock where you can leave your red dots and tactical lights on it and still fold it.