Horizontal Boring Mill Restoration - Step Scraping the Saddle to Coplanar
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- Опубликовано: 26 май 2022
- Horizontal Boring Mill Restoration - Step Scraping the Saddle to Coplanar
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A trick I learned in printmaking class: if you lift the roller instead of going back and forth, a given area on the roller contacts a new area on the plate each stroke, greatly improving how evenly the ink is spread. Only really saves a few seconds, but the difference is satisfyingly noticeable when you try it.
Same when painting a wall too!
Keith, I just wanted to say that it's always a pleasure to see you doing the machine restorations. I closed my machine-shop last year to move to the woods and start a sawmill business. It's the first year in 22 (!!!)that I haven't had a metal shop, so it's a nice feeling watching you plug away at projects. PS I get a kick out of knowing that the Bijur oiler I sent for the planer is getting put to good use. Be well. -Andy
Thanks for this, Keith. Best wishes for your surgery.
I really enjoy watching the care and attention to projects like this. It's amazing what humans can do in terms of precision.
I hope the surgery goes well and you are all better soon
Best of luck with your medical procedure, see you when you are able to get back in the shop. I, for one, enjoy all your scraping videos and envy your Bi-Ax. All my little projects are done by hand with homemade brazed carbide tools but it is a pleasure bringing things into absolute precision.
Learned to do this out of a book, thirty years ago, have rebuilt several lathes and a milling machine, revisiting, getting professional experience on the finer points. I never knew there was a power scraper available.
Man, this is just fascinating to me. I'd never even heard of a tool like that scraper. Fabulous series, here, and I've become a huge fan of your channel. Thank you.
Same here. I’ve always had a picture of ultra-smooth flat surfaces rubbing (and sticking). No room for oil. Lots to learn.
@@robertbamford8266 Google stiction, and gauge block wringing. Both are effects of no space between two flat surfaces. Cold welding is another phrase I've heard but know nothing about.
Go look at Keith's planer series, early on during disassembly. He takes it out for surface grinding to make it 'perfect,' then scrapes it. Extremely informative, the whole process A to Z.
Wishing you a speedy recovery
This is so interesting even to me who has never done any precision work. Good luck with your medical issues and make sure you take care of yourself after. Keen as I am to have the series resume I am even more keen that you should be able to continue it for many years.
please take it easy with your recovery, when i had my gall bladder removal after about 3 weeks i was feeling well and good until we drove down a bumpy road and wow did that NOT feel good like somebody was punching me in the mid section a lot and hard, i know everybody is different, take care and rest up.
Very nice work.
Your a real artist and craftsman Keith.
Thank you for the lesson.
I wish you the best on your upcoming surgery Keith.
Great and useful content.
Thanks for sharing, EM.
Thanks Kieth ...be well.
Wow, even at $15.00/hour you are adding giant value to this antique iron. But it is good to know that the tools in your shop are tuned up this nicely. May the future be good to you, Mr. Rucker, and thanks for the lessons in precision. All your viewers benefit from these videos.
Speedy recovery Sir.
Nice work m.Rucker.
I am happy to watch.
From Greece
John Grizopoulos retired machinist. 😊
Hope you’re recuperating ok Keith. Thanks for this fill in episode.
Thanks for sharing 👍
Hope you are back on your feet soon, Big Guy. Love your channel.
Looking forward to seeing you return, happy and healthy, after your procedure. Best of luck!
Good luck with the knife. Propofol is a friend of mine. Remember Keith, Gettin Old Ain't for Sissies!
Hello ,
Hope you feel better after your surgury. The more humans age the more they fall apart. The best part is they regain wisdom to share. Be Blessed
I'm really enjoying this particular resto. Thanks Keith.
Get well soon. Very interesting content.
Best wishes and Prayers for a successful surgery and a quick an full recovery!
I know it's been said in lots of videos about scraping but I thought it would be interesting to some new viewers about the benefits of oil capture after such a nice scraping as this. Oil capture being important to the ease of operation of the horizontal boring mill. The scraping providing a wave like surface for oil to live and make lubrication. Thanks for having this video up for us! It's a really nice restoration you have going there. Try to enjoy your RRR!
Ah, this is a step back in time from your last video. I can imagine how you will set up the side that went from 0 to +40. Eagerly waiting to see how it’s actually done. (As you mentioned, in unskilled hands this has the potential to turn into a W C Fields Mohawk haircut. On a much finer scale.). Hope the healing is going well.
Excellent video! Thank you and best wishes to you on your upcoming surgery.
Good luck Keith. See you in a while crocodile. 🇬🇧
Wishing you a speedy recovery.
Off to a good start, thats a lot of scraping.. Wishing a speedy recovery.
I am always fascinated by the minor variations in the language from one region to another. Where I grew up in the upper mid-west, oil is pronounced in 2 distinct sounds stuck together... oye-ill, out west is has a much softer oye first part, more of just an o-followed by ill oill with no emphasis in the middle of the word.. Down in Keiths area its a smooth o with the ll, just oll
To me this is fun... just a neat side trip to Keith's project in the video. The process of measuring and gauging and scraping is fascinating.. bringing the machine back to a collection of accurate planar motions. Wish my dad was alive to see Keith's video. He loved mechanical engineering and machine processes... it was his career. He also loved antiques... and restoring.
I'm sensitive to what I consider the mispronunciation of the word "height" as if it were spelled "heighth". Many elderly carpenters & machinists add the "h", for no reason that I can understand, although it replicates words that also invoke dimensions : "depth", "width", "length", etc. Is it just a cutesy flourish or a real misunderstanding of the spelling?
Thanks for sharing! Great work! My hands would be tingling numb.
Great video Keith! Back in late 60's I watched 2 maintenance men across the isle from my machine rebuild a huge Libby turret lathe. It took about 4 weeks on the scraping. Really appreciated the patience of these 2! I had run that machine a few times and I couldn't believe how smoothly and easily everything operated after they were finished! I was 18 at the time and knew there was no way I could ever do that! I'm 72 now and I think I could do it now. Lol! Thanks for your time and sharing and good luck with your medical procedures.
Isn't it funny how life works. One day your looking up at the mountain and many years later your looking down from the mountain.
Hi Keith, very interesting how you approached the scraping of these ways - I was wondering how you were going to accomplish it but, as usual you came up with a most precise solution. All the best with the medical procedure and hope to see you back at the work bench very soon!
WooooHoooo BEEN waiting on this one. Good sh*t Keith. Love it ☝️🌎✌️
You could drop your straight edge on both ways and indicate from the plate to the bottom of both ends, and both sides of both ends.
Excellent job!
KEITH, GOOD LUCK WITH YOUR DEAL, GET WELL SOON, SEE YOU WHEN, GREAT JOB, GREAT VIDEO...
I had no idea how you were going to do that inside the grooves. Thanks for explaining.
Great work Keith. Definitely a game of patience. Thanks very much for sharing.
Excellent presentation.
Well done as usual.
very informative! thanks for teaching us!
Not sure if it would have fit, but would it have been worth while to set it up on the Planer and level it out prior to scraping? Nice work!
Thanks for the video, Keith. Hope this next surgery goes well. Also hope to see you at the Bar-Z. Jon
Might as well go ahead and do the base too now that you have this done. Do the job right the first time and avoid frustration later. 😎
Keith, that's super interesting! I love your explanations! Thanks for making such high quality videos on that topic!
Hi Keith, being that you needed to remove so much material, why did you not use the planer to remove the .004" and then start scraping?
Great video Keith, keep'um coming..
Fantastic work , I love following your restorations. Wish the very best.
This was a very educational video to watch on this process.... answered a lot of questions I had regarding how you get these surfaces planar to one another...Thanks Keith.
Hiya Keith
good job keith
Nice, as usual! Hope you're allright! Good luck! 👍
H,i I'm Miguel from south of Brasil, thanks for all knowledge shared
hope you're back soon from this surgery , get this time to do a little rest and get back to this fabulous shop running fast
thanks again , we're all waiting for all this amazing content
Scraping is a fascinating method to make plane areas I am impresed over the prescion in this way and i have sen Lance"s Scraping schol too Have a nice weekend Keith.
Good luck on your procedure!
I was very curious how you were going to this. much more simple than i thought it would be. best of luck with surgery. see you when you are able to get back to the shop.
....."Simple"??!!
@@paulcopeland9035 wel compared to what i was imagining, yes. very simple. easy? not so much, but simple, yes.
Seems like you're almost rebuilding it now anyway :D
Are you also going to scrape the side walls of the guides? Will you be checking them for being square to another?
Get well soon ❤️
Hope your mending well. Take care.
Take it easy for at least a week. I know it’s tempting to get right back at it, but we want to have you for a while more.
Good luck Keith.
Nice video see you sone take care and dont hurry 👍👍
Good luck
You need a second HBM to fuzz those surfaces flat and parallel save you a lot of scraping.
Keith, seems a perfect case for a precision grinder rather than scraping. I know your grinders may not be able to handle a piece of that size but I suspect folks like Lance would have a big enough grinder.
Scraping is traditional! Countless machines have been built in the past 100+ years and scraped in by craftsman to these amazing tolerances. This is the way it should be done!
@@paulcopeland9035 It was traditional to go to town in a horse and buggy but few do that any more, because it is faster and more convenient to use motorised transport. Even Keith sent the bed of his planer and Monarch away to be ground. I just suspect folks who are a lot less competent than Keith, will try scraping in their worn machined surfaces, only to make them worse than they were originally.
@@wilsonlaidlaw Okay sure, but efficiency is not the issue here. The Monarch and planer were large pieces that were well out of spec. This piece is something he can handle in his shop in the traditional way. Sure, there are laser guided grinding systems that would correct this part to optical accuracy but that is not the point. Check the title of this channel.
Can you give some details on the "blade" of your scraper, please? Like what kind of metal, how long will a blade last, etc.
p.s. Watching you scrape isn't boring!
Keith, what are your thoughts about using a cast-iron straight edge vs a granite straight edge to mark the piece. Thanks.
metal scraping and metal grinding are two different things he explain that in previous videos
Joyeux anniversaire !!!
I got stoned and I missed it!
Is there any reason why not scrap the ways on the granite surface plate?
I am thinking about the ability to continuously check the progress. Or maybe I have OCD? 😁😁😁
4 thousands is a lot to remove by scraping and you must have the patience of a saint - what other options are there? Balancing it on the mill table seems risky, a big shaper might reach, or would a surface grinder with a large wheel reach? Asking because I have no idea
As I recall a couple of videos back you said you weren't going to work on the bed ways at this time. I was wondering about putting newly scraped saddle on a worn bed. I had always heard repairing/replacing one half of a pair of mating surfaces causes accelerated wear of both. Is this true?
Always scrape deeper around hole boring spots cause they elongate outwards. 🙃
Patience, thy name is Keith.
Just curious Keith... Would it be easier to remove say half of your variation off of the other side since those ways are flat? Seems like it would be faster in the long run since you won't have to scrape into the corner of the way you are working on here. Additionally, that would leave the very top surface closer to the plane of the inset way you are showing here.
You mean take 2 thousandths of tilt off the underside, and 2 thousandths off the top side? I'm not sure I entirely understand what you're thinking about, but I *think* you mean flip it over, take off 2 thousandths taper, and flip it back here. Consider all the details... Every time he makes a rough "stock removal" pass, it's going to introduce non-flatness and tilts and so on for that particular surface. So this would mean flipping it over, and starting with roughing passes, doing finer passes, finishing passes -- lots and lots of work that mostly got edited out of the previous video! And then that has to be done for both of the slides on that side, with special attention to making them parallel again, which is a big challenge in itself. Since all of that work has already been done, it would mean throwing away all of that previous effort and time and doing it again. And then flip it back over again, and do that on this side for the other 2 thousandths.
Now, consider... he removed 2 thousandths on that side by scraping, and 2 thousandths on this side by scraping, which, if I'm not mistaken, is *still 4 thousandths, which is a lot of scraping no matter how you slice it! So in the end, there's no noticeable benefit, but quite a bit of cost. Unless, of course, I misunderstood what you where thinking about, in which case I apologize! :)
Scraping is one of those things you really have to just work through one step at a time. Make a game plan -- choose what you're going to use for reference surfaces and how to test them, and get the order of steps right, before you even start. Then as you go, just work the plan patiently, be careful, don't cut corners, and finish nicely!
There is a small machined pad in the center of the saddle. It has an oil groove, so it rides on something, seems like. Doesn't it have to be taken into account? Thanks for a great channel, hope your surgery goes uneventfully.
Is there a reason you don’t just put the whole saddle on a mill and use a facing tool to cut the entire face perfectly flat and parallel? Set a repeatable plunge so you know both ways are coplanar to the saddle top ways?
Could you have used the metal planner to do the bulk of the work and then just fine tuned with scraping?
Yes and no.
What is the point using "precision grund flatstone" just to remove burrs?
because there are burrs.
why didn't you measure the height in the center of the groves and assume linearity in between ends ? thank you I really enjoy your restorations
With both sides being a known height from the granite block, placing the calibrated straight edge across the points and bluing it in tells you that the center is in the same plane. It can only be ooff by the margin of error your tools have (granite block, straight edge, mics, etc).
I thought he'd use the indicator on the arm to move along the entire length; seeing how many times the needle spun around as he put it on the surface, it seems like if one end is different in height from the other by more than once around the face, you might easily end up mistaking a negative for a positive difference.
He marked the work piece. I believe when you do this type of process, it is important to pay attention!!
... concentrate on getting your health levelled out first Keith ... good luck and best wishes ...
You kept saying that you want these ways to be in the same plane as the "bottom". That is incorrect. I believe you meant coplaner.
Would it not have saved a lot of time and effort, to have had it surface ground first?
Well sure, but what fun is that? Also, he has all of the tools and know-how!. Why would he pay for what he is set up to do?
Successful people don't become that way overnight. What most people see at a glance wealth, a great career and purpose is the result of hard work and hustle over time. I pray that anyone who reads this will be successful in life
Too bad there isn't a precision surface grinder near your shop
Why? He doesn't need it. The scraping went perfectly!
Around 20:00 you speak about touching up the straight edge as needed... I don't understand. What's going on with a straightedge that it needs to be touched up?
Have you never had to tune anything up? God bless you my son. You are a blessed individual!!
@@paulcopeland9035 - Nope, I've never had to 'tune up' a straightedge. I don't use any of them so much that they get wear. Given how long it takes for scraped ways to wear down their scraping marks with machine tool use, I don't really understand how that could happen without being used all day every day for years.
15:41 I don't understand why this couldn't just be done on a surface grinder. Is it because the piece is too large?
The major correction could be done on a very large and accurate surface grinder with flood coolant to prevent distortion. Turn around for shipping, ways ground and heavy part returned would take months and still need to be inspected, possibly scraped again, and oil retention grooves added. Considering the time and huge expense involved it’s easy to see why Keith choose to do this job in house.
@@ellieprice363 But he has a surface grinder...
@@jimthesoundman8641 Yes but probably not large enough to grind that huge part. Surface grinders wear like any other machine. A new one would not be as accurate as a surface plate and his is not new.
@@ellieprice363 But he shows how he zeroes out his surface grinder every time he uses it.
@@jimthesoundman8641 yes I know you dress the wheel and grind the table true and stone it but it still has to be big enough. I’ve had a Kent in my shop for many years and use it often.
It's too bad you can't just load this up on the surface grinder. It would have saved you hours I suspect.
Scraping is an art. This project is perfect for the process.
I READ THIS AS YOUR SCRAPING AS TO SCRAP NOT SCRAPE
I believe scrapping as in scrap has two p’s, scrape has a single p.
BUY POWERED SCRAP
Huh?
Is it imperative that you repeat everything - literally every piece of information - two and three times?
If a picture is a thousand words, why so much talking?
Because that’s what it takes to fully present the highly skilled and time consuming process.
@@ellieprice363,Thank you for explaining that so well, I don’t understand why people want to be so rude.