I condemned my own boiler. Dangerous Worcester 28i junior combination boiler.
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- Опубликовано: 4 ноя 2022
- Derek in this video services his own gas boiler a Worcester 28i junior combination boiler and has to condemn it due to it being too dangerous to use.
As a gas engineer nearly 20 years I can honestly say worcester boilers are an absolute joke to install and service or repair, it's baffling to me why gas engineers fit them, great videos Tom CAT love em
When I was new at gas servicing I came across a Worcester Junior in a similar state of bad adjustment and poor readings. It was so far out I didn't quite know where to start..so I rang Worcester technical and I have to say they were brilliant. They told me exactly how many turns out the max and offset screws should be for a "default" reading and to take it from there...big sigh of relief from me as it all came together. In an ideal world I'd have known that, but you soon learn that every day in this job is a learning day, and in the early days you have so much more to learn.
Gas valve default settings should be in every boiler manual, makes life so much easier when some idiot has been playing at being a gas engineer!
Thanks for everything Derek, with your help by watching you I have managed to level up my knowledge and approach your academy for sure. My best wishes and look forward
Derek is best teacher ever !!! He extremely simple explaining what to do so is very easy to understand any job.Thank you Derek
Gotta admit love your videos but in the real world of a standard council contract you’d do one a job a day and get the sack for lack of productivity within a week..this is what’s wrong with our industry and I’ve been a gas engineer for 32 years
Bang on
You’d never do a full fit a day if your going to follow this
But as a training page I can see his reasoning for covering all basis
If you followed manufacturers instructions on servicing services would take a good hour on a domestic boiler, so in reality you can’t service more than 8 in an 8 hour shift. I did a stint for Robert heath heating I lasted 2 days when they gave me 12 services and 5 repairs a day . Most social housings are not serviced there just probe in print out and go nowadays with a quick tightness test, I stick to the commercials get 2 hours to service a boiler average and plod round Essex doing the schools, hospitals and leisure centres.
Great video Derek goes a long way to better the standards in our industry. Btw would love to see more lpg videos! Tightness testing etc 👍
Great video as ever pal. Think the high CO level you had the day before was most probably, your wife breathing down your neck telling you to sort it! 🤣
Just FYI Gas Safe said to me on inspection that your voltage stick should be from 50v now. Just bought a new one 100v. Load of rubbish. What the first thing the customer does when he's got no heating or hot water. Touch the boiler. He hasn't got a voltage stick lol
The gas tube on my one has the same issue and there is the ali oxide in all the same places...
Joy!
Thanks Derek great video 👍
Thanks Derek.
Thomas Bradwell
What a stupid design. An aluminium heat exchanger & a steel lower baffle that is bound to end up sticking due to debris. And worse a rubber tube for the gas!
What are you say. They are the best pile of cr## on the market.
Best overall package in the business. From a homeowner perspective, over the long warranty period. Worcester do stand by their promises.
Once you’ve cleaned a few out the idiosyncrasies don’t get in the way, you just wade in😅
Early versions of that plastic gas pipe can split and degrade, giving a low C02 reading as the gas is diluted by air.
No one bothers taking out the baffles ....drives me mad !
Great video once again, keep up the good work
Been there and feel your pain. Had the same on a customers job sometimes twisting the large baffle can turn the spring and it can move a bit but when they are that bad it is game over. Replacing the heat exchanger in a balancing act on cost with labour involved and the part a new boiler with warranty may be the better option.
Fan pressure should be done in service mode on maximum, plumber told me it needed cleaned fired boiler up and it was bang on 😂
a worcester engineer told me hot water a bicarb soda will loosen the baffles. never tried myself yet.
Really like the video it mate me smile quality as always 👌🏾
What a cheap nasty piece of kit. Why can't a gasket be made to work in this day and age? Also the rubber tube looks to be the wrong material for the job. Thanks for these vids. Before I buy my next boiler I will be asking guys like you which are the ones you never get called out to!
You really went in with that massive adjustable
🤣 13 mil socket does the job nicely
So did the adjustable
What did you clean the baffles etc with
Where’d you find that adjustable? The beach??😂
Sorry 😊
Where would the 3 PPM CO you got from the top of the heat ex come from? Small leak from the seal? I find if I do a flue integrity test on the air intake I sometimes get 1 or 2 co ppm and figured it is abit of CO sucked in back at the terminal end.
Hello.
When was this boiler installed?
Best practice I go by ideally is replace the gasket (LPG 2 yrs, NG 3 yrs (if it has not been disturbed)) as long as it passes the fan depression, and if the same person/company has been maintaining it. But on a first visit I would always replace it to be safe (you can get the seal on its own). the metal clip on the gasket acts as a heat shield too. A lot of people become complacent with the fan depression passing on any boiler and don't think the heat ex will need a check/clean. Nice video tho, very informative :)
seal and other stuff is a better deal you get the whole pack for something new you goto(you probably know that tho). agreed on seal change on first service as i said get the pack swap it all out. saying that they should be co sweeping the boiler anyway. i guess what im trying to say is for very little money you can swap out a lot more vunerable parts.
Would it have made sense to stick the analyser on first, seeing the readings are out and then working your way around the possible causes? Although i do appreciate you going through the whole thing great for training.
No point as if you clean burner and adjust gas valve readings my be different
Have seen co levels on LPG boilers well over 1000ppm usually down to offset mal adjustment. More often than not it's down to a failure to follow NG to LPG MI's. Your Worcester should have been a factory version, so you're right in thinking it's poor servicing procedures.
Whether you're on tank fed or cylinders, I would address the working pressure issue.
Internal flue way seals will need replacing, also you can take the heat exchanger out and remove baffles and clean out . Then replace with new style baffles. Seems a big expense to replace whole boiler when you need less than £150 parts to repair !
Is it normal to pick up 3-4 PPM inside the boiler case from a bit of recirculation at the terminal end?
Why did you use the hot water ,instead of putting it on the chimney sweep mode ,on max .
Surely after the work done it should be safe. Maybe not running at design efficiency but is that a reason to renew it.
I had this issue on a 28 once rang a mate he said try coke did it still didn’t shift it it made it looser so rang my old boss he said hot water and mc5 leave it for a little bit it worked to be fair both work obviously have to flush it through after you’ve done there a spring I find twisting them helps loosen them
My annually serviced by British Gas Worcester combi boiler, has just had heat exchange, electrodes, condense trap and fan changed because it was flooding my kitchen floor. After the engineer left I noticed a squirt of water coming from the bottom of the boiler around where the cold water pipe goes in at the bottom. I phoned British Gas and told them, another occasional squirt of water comes and I have a bowl under the boiler to catch the water. They are coming on Monday to see what is going on. I wonder if you know what might be causing the water leak. It is driving me nuts not knowing if there will be another flood on the kitchen floor.
Hi Derek, very informative, Time to switch to a Baxi 800
Funny you should say Baxi, I am looking into getting a Baxi, the Worcester combi is and has been a pain in the but. I would never advise anyone to get a Worcester speaking as a customer who knows nothing about boilers except the cost of repair.
@@juliabishop1968 extremely good boilers, stainless steel burner and brass internal parts, very easy to strip down, which will save on labour charges 10 years down the line. The 600 range has a 7 year warranty and the 800 has a 10 year warranty, exactly the same boilers, just different warranties.
Also that sweep test can’t you just do a flue integrity would that not pick up anything like ideals and new vokeras have a case plug where you can test the actual main case
Bit of a mare you had there.. but good video for us viewers.. Thanks
Put some bicarbonate of soda and warm water in it. Leave for half an hour. Should do the trick 👍🏽
If you do decide to replace your boiler,what do you think you will go too?.I have a 7 year old greenstar 34cdi,no problems at all yet, but i read comments saying anything but a worcester,As an old sparkie by trade dont really know a good one from a bad one.
Good luck.
Video of the boiler replacement coming soon
Get the new vokera vision plus or unica max in there..
I find people do this all the time... adjust the gas valve to cover up not servicing the boiler ,if that's done a few years in a row and adjusted every time and they " you" come to strip it down it can cause you to have a bad day .
Hate lazy engineers!
Gas is the very last thing that should be adjusted on these, but as you say they just adjust each time a little to pass emissions test.
Ah, so what you are saying is ignore the manufacturers instructions completely. Why do you blame the RGI and let Worcester Bosch off for instructing people not to dismantle the hex if the vacuum is OK. and to adjust the gas valve to achieve CO2 readings. Let's just remind ourselves that MIs over rule the gas regs when they conflict. That's heavy stuff .
Tim , what I mean is people do the adjustment rather than the full strip service. Always do the full strip service before any attempt to adjust the gas valve.
@@dinendale666 I agree with you, but Worcester tell you to do something different. Its not surprising they don't get stripped down if the manufacturer tells you not to. Thats the point I'm making. Also, some employers don't give employees enough time to do a strip down. In my case it was ( I'm retired now) eight services a day on social housing contracts (plus extra breakdowns added on at the end of the day ). We did strip down servicing in all cases...mostly Glow Worm and Vaillant combis and old Ideals plus BBUs of course.
In the MI’s WB tell you to check CO/CO2 ratio and if it fails you have to check air intake, Diaphram in fan(bearing plate) heat cell/clean as nessaccey , and clean check condensate path. And gas rate , only then should you attempt to adjust the gas valve settings.
depending in how recently you got the house you may have a claim against the seller (probably not worth it though). When I purchased there was some clause about faults in the first 7/14 days. I guess you could have asked for gas and electrical safety tests as a condition of purchase, but while good in theory can make you look like a none serious buyer
Physician, heal thyself.
screws at the bottom. they replaced with clips lol. that break
Derik any update on the new boiler or are you still stuck in part waiting cycle
Video coming soon 👍🏻
@@tomkatgastraining thank you, i went down the air source heat pump and here in buffalo NY as a brit its been a real nightmare this past week, i origonally ripped out the air and resistive floor heaters due to age and remodel, in its place I listened to the installer and ended up going down the 34c underfloor heating route, after last years winter and having to use the log burner most days to heat we went to another supplier who said what was installed wouldn't have covered the temps we had so was on direct electic mode 90% of the time, we put in a second multi split system air to air, and its been a real revelation i wish i had gone down that route from the beginning, the underfloor was reduced to 25c so we get a cop of just 2,2 at the moment but air to air pumps out 23c including to the new floor ducting using inline and we getting a cop of 3,1 on this side in -13c so far no back up heat. but now the kitchen is coming to gether im going to add a secondary loop system for this and 2 showers so would like to see some recommendations, right now all the installers are offering units of 55kwh one even said go duel bosch professional. its really an eye opener just how far behind us plummers are compared to competent uk there more likely to promote air to air because of the cooling aspect on some models than heat,
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I think can see daylight around the flue
Yep it’s not sealed
Hi Derek
I’ve heard rumours of a new yearly inspection for engineers from gas safe, was just wondering if you’ve heard anything similar??
No not heard that
Just had an inspection last month asked about this and he says next inspection will be about 3 years, could be looking at more regular virtual inspections though.
Great Video Deric
There’s no job like ours is there
Did you pre remove the gas tube off the top of the gas valve first 🤔 only about 1 in 10 I work on come off that easy first time! Normally spend 10 minutes trying to get the bloody thing out of the gas valve! 😂😂
Nope I filmed it as I took it apart
1st who's 2nd?
Great thumbnail. You could always go into acting in your next career 😀
Them gas valves go out of calibration evey year
Let's be honest, it's not the best designed and built boiler in the world is it. If It had a Biasi badge on it, nobody would have touched it, but it would have been £200 cheaper 😉 You could have tipped some hot water down the heat exchanger and cleared some of the muck out. That might have helped the vacuum figure until you can have a proper go at the baffle or change the Hex.
Did that but it made no difference
you can get a lot more in a service kit. inagine putting a rubber gas pipe in a boiler.
2nd 😮
firat thing id do is ripp that thing out and put a good boiler in perforble not a Worcester
Probably unpopular to point out, but the splash at the start of the vid is incorrect.
A competent person who is *not* gas safe registered *can* legally work on their boiler in the UK.
Competent if you can prove you have valid, in date qualifications from an approved body and calibrated testing equipment with certificates issued by the manufacturer. Claiming competence wouldn't be good enough in a court of law. Dodgy Daves will always believe otherwise though
When it is your boiler you can do what you like with it.
However I agree the consequences of an error are great.
It’s really difficult to preach this stuff when we know council and housing associations use firms that can get 20 ‘services’ a day done per man.
if you not gas safe registered, you are not a competent person in the eyes of the law,if things go wrong you will end up in jail
No idea where you got that info from but you a incorrect!
"A non-registered person may carry out 'wet work', ie install water pipes and radiators for a heating system, but any work on the gas boiler itself and the final connection of the water pipework to the boiler, must be done by a Gas Safe registered engineer."
As per hse.hov.uk
www.hse.gov.uk/gas/landlords/safetycheckswhocan.htm#:~:text=A%20non%2Dregistered%20person%20may,a%20Gas%20Safe%20registered%20engineer.
Also Gas Safe site.
www.gassaferegister.co.uk/media/1449/who-can-legally-work-on-a-gas-appliance-factsheet.pdf
You need to delete that dangerous comment!!!!!
@@gruhwch4876
Gas work is illegal if it has been carried out by someone who is not registered or qualified to do the work, any parts that you remove or install which are gas related must be done by a gas safe engineer.
"It’s really difficult to preach this stuff when we know council and housing associations use firms that can get 20 ‘services’ a day done per man."
Granted they are not undertaking a proper service, but are gas safe and ensuring those boilers are running safely which is the main thing.
Tell that to the biggest of all 🤷
I hate them Worcester Boilers, the kebab heat exchangers are a pain in the arse
Find it really disappointing so many plumbers are ripping out perfectly good boilers due to inability or willingness to repair and Even using the governments green agenda as a excuse to remove all these boilers . The emission cost to produce all these new boilers far outweighs continued use of older boiler . It far more green to extend the service life well beyond a few years . Boiler are now becoming disposable item with more emissions used to recycle the metals and plastic .
🤘😎🤘🫖☕️🍰
Click bait head in hands. Didn’t think you would need to aim so low, its a good channel.
3rd 😂
Typical plumber, An adjustable will do.
I am not a plumber. 😜
@@tomkatgastraining whatever you are don't use adjustable spanner.