Car users: "We don't want everything on the touch screen, we want separate controls!" VW: "Say no more fam. We gave you capacitive buttons that you still have to look at in order to know what you are pushing." Car users: "WTF"
@@Vicobop yes there are talks inside Volkswagen, they have received the feedback from y'all. The guy who gave the green light for this definitely isn't working for Volkswagen AG anymore!
@@dragospahontu that's pretty crazy if it's a result of public feedback instead of customers only. :O Considering they implemented this on the new Golfs.
Testament to these guys: I'm not going to buy a car anytime soon, and I would never buy this, but now I am watching this video and amazed. The biggest problem with Tesla is that they somehow managed to infect the entire industry with touchscreens and horrible non-buttons. Tactile analog knobs literally save lives, guys.
I'm legit scared for a time where most cars have these screen only systems and how road safety will change. Heck I don't trust myself enough. Mercedes' hyperscreen is just... Scary.
Audio question. Would it make a major difference if you replaced all the stock speakers with basic aftermarket JBLs or Pinoners and left the head unit and existing amp (if there is one) as-is?
@@SamPolland why would you replace components on a new car just because the automaker used sh*tty components? Unless the automaker pays for it, just get another car. Don’t reward incompetence.
@@SamPolland One problem that he talked about is the poor placement of the speakers. They're different than most cars with good audio performance, and replacing the speakers won't do anything to fix that problem. There is also often very limited space to put a better speaker in. This whole system sucks and would need replacement, and even then the poor speaker positioning would be an issue. I can't imagine why they put the tweeters where they did on the doors. That's really weird.
Just reserved one, there's a hidden option to upgrade the audio. When you speak with your dealer ask for Ignacio. He'll put a phone-fitting ceramic coffee mug in the cup holder, perfect harmonic balance.
the difference is you don't get the less reliable stuff, you only get the most reliable version, europe gets more unreliable versions bc europeans don't care about reliability...
That’s often the case and it’s simple; price. The US market has historically demanded cheap cars, and the only way to do that these days is to remove features or reduce the quality of some components. The Europeans are accustomed to and happy to pay higher prices for their cars. Even the American car companies do it - a Ford Escape built in North America for the US market uses far lower grade interior plastics than the Kuga, built in Spain for the European markets and beyond, despite them being almost the same cars
I just bought a new leftover 2020 SEL FWD. window sticker was 42k, paid 30k. Nice thing about the 2020s is I still have physical buttons on the steering wheel and climate control . I absolutely love the car.
You’ll love it until the warranty ends and EVERYTHING breaks. It’s just the punishment we VW owners endure... what’s wrong with us? (I’ve owned 06 VW JETTA 2.5l, 06 VW JETTA TDI, currently a 2014 Passat TDI)
@@dcarts5616 I’ve been in the same spot, had several VWs including the last CC and get rid of each one just before the warranty expires but....I’ve loved every single one. Now, I’m thinking...hmm, ARTEON would look good in my garage...someone...call a therapist, I need help 🤨
I have the top trim and the harman/kardon is actually pretty good once you tune the system to your liking. These cars also aren’t selling pretty much at all so you can find a top of the line for about $40,000 right now. I paid just a little over that.
@@android2364 how much did you pay vs what they asked? I'm looking at 2020 r line premium with the dynaudio speakers, actual buttons and knobs and no piano gloss. The dealer has it listed for $49,049. I'm thinking 30% to 40% off sounds about right.
I bought a 2018. It's one of few cars ever made where the inside and outside design are integrated. Amazing attention to detail, great build quality, tech that works, and in Sports + Mode is very fast with 0-100 in 4.9 - faster than most 'sports' cars. I sold my Benz to get it.
@@bobbyaustralia8509 So? That's pretty much all most Americans ever buy. Even almost all those common CUVs are fwd or fwd+, as you nicely put it. Only luxury cars are commonly rwd.
I honestly can’t even explain how much I enjoy these reviews! I’m not into Volkswagen but the comprehensive review and honest opinions make these video amazing! The whole audio testing is on another level! All the facts and details you gather and show the viewers really is astounding
Probably the best objective car review I’ve seen on RUclips and I’ve seen too many. Great balance of input about mechanical, performance, utility practicality, and comfort all with a sense of “I don’t give a damn what people think of this review”. I’m weighing a purchase decision between this car and the Audi A5 Sportback and this was very helpful in that process. Subscribed. Thx.
Before watching Savage Geese I was told I would do nothing with my life. Now I only quote from your videos and my hair flows in the wind like a Spanish soap opera show opening.
Yeah these weren't out when I got my gt. They have a great motor but they really held it back performance wise with the 8 speed trans. Plus the incentives on the stinger were huge
That gearshift lever looks like a complete afterthought - it's obvious by how much it block the climate control panel in "park" that the car was supposed to get the buttons like new Golf. I imagine some beancounter has decided that they've got a warehouse full of levers to use. It's the same in EU version too.
Had a brand new 2019 Arteon fully loaded for about a year. Amazing experience, it’s virtually an A5 prestige for like 20 grand less. Highly recommend it.
It’s been obvious for a few years that Hyundai/Kia has been competing with Volkswagen head-to-head (car-to-car) I wouldn’t have believed it ten years ago had I been told of their success against the German giant, today. Hyundai is no longer just “killing it” in their own right, they’re straight murdering Volkswagen.
Picked up my top of the line 2021 SEL Premium R-Line on Saturday in black. It's absolutely beautiful. Came straight here to watch everybody's opinions. The gloss black and the touch buttons don't bother me at all. It's easy when you get used to how it works. It drives like a dream especially on the highway (Where I spend most of my time) Don't pay too much attention to the price, even in this crazy car market I paid far less than MSRP.
I have a 2021 Arteon SEL Premium R Line and I don't mind them honestly. Yes the fingerprints bother me to a certain degree but in all honesty they work perfectly every time and I have the upgraded Harman kardon sound that sounds fabulous. Beautifully done inside and out couldn't be happier
@@jasonlewis9255 ok, as a new buyer you will have some confirmation bias. Maybe a better question; would you prefer if they were last gen VW and/or physical? Or are you ok "dealing" with it.
@@cwx8 honestly I love the tech part of it. It's something different something new and I commend them for trying to be different in a segment where everybody does the same thing. My OCD with fingerprints on the other hand is hard LOL but all in all I like the fact that they went out and did something different and like I said it works perfectly. The interior itself is a huge leap from the previous gen in materials and fit and finish. So I gladly take this over the previous gen
I also have the sel premium r line and I like the car. The controls are a little meh but I haven’t really had too many problems with them. The HK Audio I don’t think is bad, sounds better than the Sony premium system in my 2019 fusion sport but I definitely get better gas mileage. It’s not as fast but it’s ride great. If it wasn’t for fords crammed engine design and over heating uses with the awd system I woyluld have kept that
Drove an Arteon SEL R-Line from my local dealer for several hours yesterday. I'll readily admit I'm no audiophile but I think such a harsh judgement regarding the base audio system is simply not warranted. Given Mark's condemnation I was on the lookout for how bad it was and tested it with the local classical music station. Programs featuring Chopin, Beethoven, and Gershwin were quite enjoyable to my plebian ears. :)
I'm sorry, did you describe listening to a "station" (presumably radio or satellite radio channel) when talking about audio quality? It sounds like your standards are far (FAR) too low to discuss this intelligently.
Very few reviewers seem to talk about what should be most important for all cars. Is it reliable and how long will it last? There's a huge difference between spending 50k for a car that starts having serious problems at 80k miles and a car that starts having serious problems at 280k miles. A person might not have a problem with spending 50k on a car that last 250k miles plus.
@japanwatchconnection I'm still driving around a 2009. Every time I get the itch to buy another one I think of my wallet and say nope. I haven't had car payments since 2012. More than makes up for any money that I might lose in gas mileage.
@@tobiaswittwer9398 I do, too. The styling of this is better than the cheaper Audis, and it's in a completely different size class than they are. The hatchback is a nice plus. The hatchback Audis are theoretically sold in the US, but they're very rare, so getting one that you like can be hard. This looks to be somewhere in size between the A5 Sportback and the A7, but much cheaper than either, without giving up all that much.
Loved the review. I just bought a 2020 Arteon because of this review and loving it. I made sure to get a 2020 because it was before the 2021 refresh like in your tester. The 2021 refresh brought all the horrible steering wheel and climate touch controls. Also the 2020's Dynaudio stereo is pretty solid, I'm very happy with it. Coming from 10 years of base model 5-speed Golfs!
To me, this is a good thing...because I buy second hand cars. In terms of amount of car you get for your money, a 2017 Arteon is a great buy. I know americans think German cars are expensive to repair, and need a lot of maintenance, but as I understand it, these have been pretty reliable.
They fixed a few things with the 2022. 300 hp/295 tq, 7 speed DSG too. As far as the stereo, I'm sure you could get some new speakers installed that would make it sound much better.
I don’t know why but I really like this review better then any other review of VW Arteon. It’s just feels good to watch this video. I seriously don’t know why.
As soon as he started talking about touch controls and screens, the car lost me. I despise not having buttons. I despise touch controls on a car. I was interested but VW failed me.
Yeah it’s super frustrating. I hate having to take my eyes off the road to guide my finger to a touch screen “button” when a physical button and muscle memory is far less distracting. I love my older VW, but I’ll be looking elsewhere until they reintroduce physical buttons for the most commonly used functions. Again as someone who loves his Volkswagen, it pains me to say this..... but give me an Accord instead.
@@povertyspec9651 good for them I guess, they're saving money building a car I don't want to buy because of cost cutting techniques. I'd rather have a "less nice" car that is easier to use.
@@davect01 most makers are hiding obscure functions you don't need to simply operate the car behind touch screens. Most makers still have basic functions tied to physical buttons, and it's not even close.
Looking at the engine bay, it gave me flashback to the years when I owned one. For 10 years. The torture I went through at replacing ignition coils, window regulators, rebuild ABS control modules, rotting vacuum lines/valves, and unending CEL troubleshooting, deteriorating interior materials, etc.... Never again.
@@wigletron2846 Mine was a 1.8T Passat. I've learned to never buy a car with turbo engine. The heat simply destroyed everything that was not metal in the engine bay. That and the "legendary reliability" of VW was a nightmare for sure.
I've driven the 2020 and now the 2021 Arteon for contrast. I actually prefer the 2021 despite the missing analog clock (I love that shit). It's serene, super comfortable and I loved driving it. Piano black sucked for fingerprints on the wheel, but the touch controls were perfectly fine and responsive for me. The physical wheel felt better in hand than the older model too. I'm trying to get my boss to get me one as a company car, hah.
If you can find one the 1st gen CC vr6 4motion is a fantastic used car. You can still buy leftover brand new 2.0Ts CCs. They are out there and it’s kinda hilarious.
Yes they are great. A guy I know has one and let me drive it on a backroad. Absolute rocket. Sad thing there are very few available still and they will set you back 20k Euros for a 20 year old car.
@@fabianherrmann6398 where I live in the US I've been finding some decent 2.0L FWD models for around 10k or so, but I would prefer AWD and a VR6 would be even better
The best part about the older ones is the 2.0T was available with a 6spd manual. I had one for about 3 years. Great car and a lot of fun for a slower car.
I love this car. While there are some quirks that need to be worked out, I think it gives prestige and individuality for the right price. I think Lexus should redesign the GS and make it a competitor against the Stinger GT and Arteon.
They can't fit a ZF in a transverse engine, and the reason you guys get an AISIN8 is because that's what most Americans want. In Europe we have the DSG7 because of fuel economy and less CO2, I've noticed that the programming is weird on the AISIN unit in VW's probably because the engines are meant to be paired with a dual clutch.
Same with Ford and it is mind boggling they just started to do that with their cars as if they'd never seen how those companies had moved away from these interfaces for a reason. They just don't learn.
I love your video man, they’re truly a work of art, from the high quality footage, to the cinematic, the sound clips, the in depth beauty with no bullshit you about every single vehicle, I love it. You can literally make me want any car that I’ve never ever heard of or even one I never ever desired because of how strangely elegant your videos are man. One of my fav car in depth review channels out there. Truly unmatched
I think he might have given up on even mentioning orange peel paint because it seems to be everywhere, including very expensive cars. It would be worth mentioning a car that doesn't have it. Every now and then you can see a shot of it, though, when the light falls on it in the right angle.
So unless they radically changed the stereo components for the 2021 model, then I think there was a problem with the stereo or source. I have a 2019 Arteon SE with the base stereo and it’s quite good IMO, way better than my 2018 Tacoma or the stereo in my wife’s 2019 CRV. As for others who always seem to mention a lack of reliability with VW cars, my Arteon has 18,000 miles on it and has had zero issues. I paid $6000 less than sticker, and I’ve seen cars equipped like the one reviewed here marked down $7k.
We've had the Arteon in Europe since the very first generation, with a multitude of engines, like any other VAG car. I would definitely compare it with the Passat, the cheapest Arteon is kind of at the same price as a Passat with the same optional features to match the Arteon, so it pretty much boils down to looks and personal preference.
I have a ‘21 GTI, and I had a ‘09 Passat wagon. What mark said about the speakers is so accurate. The speakers in my GTI are fine. Not amazing, but fine. But in comparison to my Passat... night and day. The didn’t even have the Dynaudio system, and it still blew the doors off of my GTI speakers. VW used to have some truly fantastic speaker systems even without upgrading to the premium stuff.
Now reaching my mid-thirties, I’ve started to feel sluggish. I have been diagnosed with low testosterone, so my doctor prescribed me a subscription to Mr. Goose and his Korean Gander.
Excellent and fair review as usual, gentlemen. The Arteon's most obvious rival is the KIA Stinger (GT-line) with its 2.5L turbo and AWD. They're nearly the same size and share the liftback sedan design. Here in the Seattle area VW dealers are offering discounts of $6K to $7K on the mid level (SEL R-Line) and top trim (SEL Premium R-Line) versions that brings the SEL-R line transaction price down to the Stinger GT-Line 2.5L turbo engine with AWD and nearly the same as a Honda Accord 2.0L Touring or a Camry V6 XSE model neither of which offers AWD. There's little to distinguish the Arteon and the Stinger in terms of specs. For those who care about Americans' narrow measure of performance, acceleration to 60 mph, each does the job in around 6 seconds. The Arteon's overall passenger space is slightly greater than the Stinger, a result that stems mainly from the especially generous rear seat legroom in the Arteon (nearly 4" more than the Stinger.) The Arteon uses VW's corporate 2.0L EA888 engine. Having had that engine in a couple of GTIs it's a favorite of mine. The KIA, on the other hand, has the new 2.5L turbo that's being offered in a variety of KIA, Hyundai, and Genesis models. On paper the KIA is a stronger engine. But that ignores the fact that (a) VW engines are notoriously underrated in terms of HP and torque and (b) a 30 minute ECU tune from APR (that contrary to claims does not invalidate the VW warranty) erases the differences. Both vehicles utilize a conventional 8 speed torque converter automatic in US spec models. I'd personally prefer the superb dual clutch found in my GTI and fitted in the Euro spec version of the Arteon but VW believes Americans are leery of dual clutch transmissions' behavior so they opted for a conventional eight speed. Same with the Stinger. What it comes down to is a choice of "grand touring" sedans at affordable prices. One in the mold of classic GTs from Europe and the other a Korean interpretation of a European GT tailored for American tastes. As an owner of both a VW and a KIA I'd be hard pressed to choose between them especially given the Stinger's new 4 cylinder base engine, but I think the nod might go to the Arteon.
It’s been obvious for a few years that Hyundai/Kia has been competing with Volkswagen head-to-head (car-to-car) and I wouldn’t have believed it ten years ago had I been told of their success against the German giant, today. Hyundai is no longer just “killing it” in their own right, they’re straight murdering Volkswagen.
@@bobbyaustralia8509 That analysis applies most directly to SUVs. Though cases can be made for the Atlas vs the Telluride/Palisade twins, the CrossSport vs the Hyundai Santa Fe, and the Tiguan vs the Hyundai Tucson mainly in terms of interior space. Nevertheless, you're correct that the Korean brands have more widespread appeal than the VWs. In the case of the Stinger vs the Arteon, however, events since this video and comments first appeared have changed the picture. KIA has apparently decided to kill the Stinger, altogether, with production ending in mid-2022. The reasons aren't clear and the decision may not be firm but it appears that KIA has opted to put their performance "eggs" in the basket of a pure EV coupe style EV6 crossover, much as Ford has done with the Mach-E. It's probably a smart move driven in part by available production capacity and the overall trend toward EVs in the high performance category but it's a shame to lose the Stinger. So for those who would choose the KIA, especially the turbo 4 that makes a strong value play given its price and performance, it's probably time to pull the trigger. Having driven one recently, I was sorely tempted. On the other hand, VW has apparently decided to send the Arteon R GT with the engine and superb dual clutch DSG transmission from the Golf R to North America in 2022. That's a surprise given the limited sales of the Arteon. And it means that it may well be virtually identical to the Eurospec version, something that is rare for VW. That news put a hold on my potential purchase of a discounted 20221 mid-trim Arteons available in the Puget Sound area. I'll wait to see what emerges in the next six months to a year from VW. In the meantime, though, I needed to buy a car for my 17 y/o daughter so she'd stop begging to borrow my beloved GTI. As it happened, I came across a remarkably cherry 2012 VW R-Line CC (manual transmission) with only 46K miles on the clock for sale from an original owner who treated it like his first born. The price was about $3K-$4K less than I saw anywhere else so now my daughter has a car I can pester her to borrow when the itch to drive a stick strikes me. 😁
After testing the Arteon a year ago, I stuck with my Volkswagen CC. The DSG I have is much better and while the CC has a few gremlins, once they are sorted out, you're mechanically and electrically safe for quite awhile. Also, the Arteon's steering felt awful in comparison. I'd say anyone looking for an arteon that doesn't need the hatchback, should look at a used 2016-2017 volkswagen CC first.
This is hands down the best car review channel on RUclips! I would have a suggestion. I would really like to see you explain the some of the terms you use when talking about how the vehicles drive. Nothing to in depth. An overview would be cool. Thanks for the great videos.
Even though not as large, but there are sooo much better interior options for the price, I have no idea how can someone end up wasting 45k on this, it's ridiculous...
@@Nickeltoe77 created by tyrants in nazi Germany durning world war 2. Fast forward to now, and they cheated the world with an emissions scandal! They’re toxic and disgusting
This car is VERY appealing among the sedans in its class. I love the design inside and out. Fantastic that it's a liftback. Beyond that initial appeal, it's a big nope from me. VW reliability in the US is below average. Repair costs are above average. That's a losing scenario. The capacitive touch buttons belong on a microwave, not in a car. The stereo sucks. It's priced in the luxury brand territory. For the money, I'd prefer a luxury-branded car with a V6 and better long-term reliability, like the Lexus ES.
Except that the mid and upper trim Arteons are being offered here in the Seattle area with discounts of $6K to $7K. That brings the SEL R-Line AWD into the price range of a Honda Accord 2.0L Touring model or a Camry V6 XSE that lack AWD.
@@stephenhendricks103 The Arteon is certainly more appealing than the Accord or Camry, but being the pragmatist that I am, I'd probably choose a Camry V6 XSE as the no-brainer for running costs and long-term reliability. You're still getting a nice car, albeit not as cool and unique as the Arteon. FWD is sufficient for most people.
@@stephenhendricks103 a set of winter tires on a Camry V6 or Accord 2.0T will make up 80% of the difference of the AWD Arteon. And no check engine lights.
@@matthelms4167 You're right that good winter tires make a huge difference in a FWD car for those in especially challenging snowy climates. It's a lesson I learned many years ago when I lived in upstate New York and owned a Saab 96, one of the few FWD vehicles available at the time. On the other hand I live in the Pacific NW where snow is an occasional challenge that doesn't warrant a set of winter tires that inhibit handling in most situations. And even when winter tires make a major difference putting them on an AWD vehicle is an even better strategy. As for AWD being a source of engine problems, that's something I've never experienced on any AWD vehicle over about 50 years of driving them.
Thank you for calling out the incredibly dumb steering wheel touch system! Along with the center stack. The pre refresh was way better. One of the reasons I wouldn't consider it anymore. :(
I think about 2 years ago right when this released, its main competition was the Stinger turbo 4 and the Buick Regal. Those were the only hatch sedan's in that price segment. After that you are jumping up more than a few thousand for an A5 or 5 series Granturismo.
I own a 2019 Version of this car and I can attest the review of this car as very accurate. I have so far over 21000 miles on mine in 10 months of problem free driving. Savagegeese is right the sound system is a level below okay. Okay for me but I'm not a music fanatic. My steering wheel and climate control is NOT touch screen so I don't have to deal with that issue. My ONLY complaint is the 20 inch rims. After 2 blow outs and one bent rim I went to 18s. It made the car even better.
I have a 2020 Arteon. It has physical buttons for the climate control and steering wheel. Still have digital dash and the same infotainment. I am so glad I didn't get a 2021.
It’s been obvious for a few years that Hyundai/Kia has been competing with Volkswagen head-to-head (car-to-car) I wouldn’t have believed it ten years ago had I been told of their success against the German giant, today. Hyundai is no longer just “killing it” in their own right, they’re straight murdering Volkswagen.
Mark: "As far as the sound system is concerned; at no point did it even come close to anything that resembled music. Everyone in this car is deafer for having listened to it. I award it no points, and may God have mercy on it's soul."
The base model of the bigger Passat R-line starts at 46k € over here. And it comes with a 150 or 200 PS TDI, as all VW-AG products do. It is literally *the* engine that VW is known for. Only the full R spec lets you have a petrol engine with 320 PS but you can also shell out 76k€€€ for it. And i think there are much better products for that price. The Arteon ended VW's expensive (to produce) Phaeton, which was a true high end luxury cruiser. It's W12 and W8 and V6 made place for le 4-popper TDI.
@@TassieLorenzo Because this looks better? I know it's heretical, but I think the Giulia is pretty, but no masterpiece. It's also _much_ smaller, and not a hatchback. For many of us that matters.
For 44k you can get a GT1 3.3 tt v6 stinger AWD. And I’ve heard the new 2022 stinger is a lot more solid then pre facelift. Plus you get 10 inch infotainment. And the performance has always been stingers strong point. I guess it just depends on what you want. Arteon is more of a luxury cruiser stinger is more fun dynamic car. It would be nice if they put DSG and new golf R motor in American arteon like Europe but oh well lol
It’s been obvious for a few years that Hyundai/Kia has been competing with Volkswagen head-to-head (car-to-car) I wouldn’t have believed it ten years ago had I been told of their success against the German giant, today. Hyundai is no longer just “killing it” in their own right, they’re straight murdering Volkswagen.
Man O man, .. VW AG fumbles, make that can't manage, outsourcing to Samsung (Harmon Kardon) the Arteon HiFi system. .. Remember the fully active VW/Dynaudio in the '2000s era Passat? .. It was a stand-out..
The speakers are the same they just change the branding to something that's more recognizable to people especially the younger crowd. They did the same thing with the Jetta from switching it from Fender audio to Beats when in reality the speakers themselves are the same. Just to appeal to younger crowds.
I've harped on about this a billion times, but anyone considering a non-SUV VW with AWD should take a look at a lightly used Golf Alltrack. Wagon with tons of room? Check. Manual trans? Yep you can get one. Automatic your preference? You'll get a real deal DSG! Interior? Quite nice, especially in the SE and SEL trims. Physical controls for everything! Plus they look good and have just enough ground clearance to be useful on lumpy forest service roads or deeper snow. Only drawback is that they're really undertuned stock - about 170HP. If you're willing to do a tune though, even the simplest stage 1 software only tune will get you to about 240HP with a near 100ft/lb torque increase. I absolutely love mine and plan on keeping it for a decade.
I had this car as my rental for a 700 mile trip to Dallas and back last week. At first I was impressed by the looks and performance. Economy was so-so. Got around 29 MPGs driving south into the wind. Driving north the wind pushed us and we got around 30-31. We found the seats hard and uncomfortable regardless as to where they were set. The only other letdown (that we didn’t know about until we had to top off on the way out), was that the engine requires 91 Premium which made for a few pricey fill ups.
I do a bit of Uber, but mostly conventional (pre booked) limo work - the Arteon doesn't have enough rear head room IMHO. The two vehicles at the top of my list for my next vehicle are the Audi A6 and Q7.
@@mezzb it's called "Uber Premiere" now, here in Sydney, and I see that Uber have removed the list of specific models - all they have now is a list of requirements, and IMHO the Arteon meets the requirements. Just as an aside, Uber seem not to really care much about the premium end of the market here any more - it used to be possible to to request an SUV, but it's no longer the case - now, if you request Premiere, you could get anything from a little A5, up to a Rolls. I get the feeling they've realised that the premium end is best served by traditional limo companies, which can provide a more personalised service. (i.e, the customer can actually talk to a HUMAN, and explain their exact requirements)
@@wigletron2846 the problem resides in the EGR valve principle. Clogging is less, yes but not as we expect it was before with port injection. And dont ask how it looks before the first injector.... :( at least VW.
I'm debating getting a methanol injection kit for my dad's golf, so I I can dump valve cleaner into the methanol/water tank and try to make the valves last.
Probably the best value in its segment along with the Stinger but everyone who leases these will want a badge that has more prestige. Discounts are insane on these right now and its a steal.
It’s been obvious for a few years that Hyundai/Kia has been competing with Volkswagen head-to-head (car-to-car) and I wouldn’t have believed it ten years ago had I been told of their success against the German giant, today. Hyundai is no longer just “killing it” in their own right, they’re straight murdering Volkswagen.
@@bobbyaustralia8509 Well directly in the US yeah probably. Part of that is VW selling us lower trims of all their cars. The Arteon and Tiguan are much better cars in the EU. But worldwide VW probably has some of the highest brand loyalty there is. Dieselgate would have probably killed any other company. Never mind the fact of all the other manufacturers they own.
This was my ‘realistic’ dream car but after hearing how bad the audio system is, I don’t think I want one anymore, and I love, love the exterior design. I think the only other hatchback sedans in this category are the Stinger and A5.
![Tee Grizzley - Robbery 8 [Official Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/34_vkNV6wrU/mqdefault.jpg)
I had a physical reaction to those buttons
I think I might have a rash
Wow Mark liked your comment so much he pinned it with 3 upvotes (one being from me). But I agree, horrible design
VW engineers: _See? They still give feedback!_
I farted
@@FFFFFFF-FFFFFFFUUUUCCCC You vwarteod?
I invested in Piano Gloss Plastic™ in 2014, and I no longer have to flee the law due to unpaid child support. Thanks PGP™! 👍
I like this comment.
Lol
Type of comment I want to see!
Child support? I think you mean ransom. We all know if you don’t pay the X you don’t get to see your kids
@@m176r3 so I can be rid of both?
By subscribing to Savage Geese, my bodily emissions improved and avoided a multi-million dollar scandal
The reason why taco bell bathrooms smell horrendous can be traced back to Volkswagen tampering with my bodily emissions
Should've been top comment!
Car users: "We don't want everything on the touch screen, we want separate controls!"
VW: "Say no more fam. We gave you capacitive buttons that you still have to look at in order to know what you are pushing."
Car users: "WTF"
It’s like my Ford touch all over again.
Volkswagen said they will not introduce this system anymore
@@dragospahontu seriously?
@@Vicobop yes there are talks inside Volkswagen, they have received the feedback from y'all.
The guy who gave the green light for this definitely isn't working for Volkswagen AG anymore!
@@dragospahontu that's pretty crazy if it's a result of public feedback instead of customers only. :O
Considering they implemented this on the new Golfs.
Testament to these guys: I'm not going to buy a car anytime soon, and I would never buy this, but now I am watching this video and amazed. The biggest problem with Tesla is that they somehow managed to infect the entire industry with touchscreens and horrible non-buttons. Tactile analog knobs literally save lives, guys.
I'm legit scared for a time where most cars have these screen only systems and how road safety will change.
Heck I don't trust myself enough. Mercedes' hyperscreen is just... Scary.
How do you guys feel now? Because we're at that point with a lot of cars in 2024.
The audio system descriptions / analogies alone are worth it subscribing to Savagegeese XD
Why would you subscribe when you could commit blood sacrifice in thy name of Los Gansos.
Audio question. Would it make a major difference if you replaced all the stock speakers with basic aftermarket JBLs or Pinoners and left the head unit and existing amp (if there is one) as-is?
@@SamPolland why would you replace components on a new car just because the automaker used sh*tty components? Unless the automaker pays for it, just get another car. Don’t reward incompetence.
@@SamPolland One problem that he talked about is the poor placement of the speakers. They're different than most cars with good audio performance, and replacing the speakers won't do anything to fix that problem. There is also often very limited space to put a better speaker in. This whole system sucks and would need replacement, and even then the poor speaker positioning would be an issue. I can't imagine why they put the tweeters where they did on the doors. That's really weird.
@itsadubsession I come for the finger banging, e.g. @2:47.
Just reserved one, there's a hidden option to upgrade the audio. When you speak with your dealer ask for Ignacio.
He'll put a phone-fitting ceramic coffee mug in the cup holder, perfect harmonic balance.
Whenever I see car that is offered in both US and Europe, I cannot stop feeling that Europe trims are better quality...
that’s true because the US doesn’t get the 315hp R version, Shooting break, PHEV version, cooler taillights, the 9,2 inch screeen
the difference is you don't get the less reliable stuff, you only get the most reliable version, europe gets more unreliable versions bc europeans don't care about reliability...
@@Mgoblagulkablong ummmmm; no.
That’s often the case and it’s simple; price. The US market has historically demanded cheap cars, and the only way to do that these days is to remove features or reduce the quality of some components. The Europeans are accustomed to and happy to pay higher prices for their cars. Even the American car companies do it - a Ford Escape built in North America for the US market uses far lower grade interior plastics than the Kuga, built in Spain for the European markets and beyond, despite them being almost the same cars
@@Mgoblagulkablong do you have stupid?
I just bought a new leftover 2020 SEL FWD. window sticker was 42k, paid 30k. Nice thing about the 2020s is I still have physical buttons on the steering wheel and climate control . I absolutely love the car.
You’ll love it until the warranty ends and EVERYTHING breaks. It’s just the punishment we VW owners endure... what’s wrong with us? (I’ve owned 06 VW JETTA 2.5l, 06 VW JETTA TDI, currently a 2014 Passat TDI)
Looking at a top trim 2020. Good to know $25 percentage+ is doable.
12+ g’s off? Is that possible?
@@IsitReallyrealreally i got the 2020 base for 30k. Sticker 37k. But this was back in december 2020.
@@dcarts5616 I’ve been in the same spot, had several VWs including the last CC and get rid of each one just before the warranty expires but....I’ve loved every single one. Now, I’m thinking...hmm, ARTEON would look good in my garage...someone...call a therapist, I need help 🤨
Forty-seven THOUSAND for the premium audio?! That thing better move me to tears for more reasons than just the bill!
Im just sitting here thinking of the different options for this price point... 45k plus is a lot for this...
Nope, just barely passable, lol
I've heard the Harman Kardon unit isn't great either...It's weird, because the base units on Audis are great for the most part.
I have the top trim and the harman/kardon is actually pretty good once you tune the system to your liking. These cars also aren’t selling pretty much at all so you can find a top of the line for about $40,000 right now. I paid just a little over that.
@@android2364 how much did you pay vs what they asked?
I'm looking at 2020 r line premium with the dynaudio speakers, actual buttons and knobs and no piano gloss.
The dealer has it listed for $49,049.
I'm thinking 30% to 40% off sounds about right.
This comment section is wild. I love it. This is the right place.
So sofisticated and snarky at the same time. Mindblowing.
I bought a 2018. It's one of few cars ever made where the inside and outside design are integrated. Amazing attention to detail, great build quality, tech that works, and in Sports + Mode is very fast with 0-100 in 4.9 - faster than most 'sports' cars. I sold my Benz to get it.
I don't know why the American public doesn't like hatchbacks. They are imminently practical and give the car additional style. Great review!
Americans DO love hatchbacks. They just buy them in the form of CUV's and SUV's.
@Yirlani sportback is a marketing term. Technically, it’s a liftback.....which is a type of hatchback.
Because theyre almost entirely fwd or fwd+ 😒
@@bobbyaustralia8509 So? That's pretty much all most Americans ever buy. Even almost all those common CUVs are fwd or fwd+, as you nicely put it. Only luxury cars are commonly rwd.
I honestly can’t even explain how much I enjoy these reviews! I’m not into Volkswagen but the comprehensive review and honest opinions make these video amazing! The whole audio testing is on another level! All the facts and details you gather and show the viewers really is astounding
Probably the best objective car review I’ve seen on RUclips and I’ve seen too many. Great balance of input about mechanical, performance, utility practicality, and comfort all with a sense of “I don’t give a damn what people think of this review”. I’m weighing a purchase decision between this car and the Audi A5 Sportback and this was very helpful in that process. Subscribed. Thx.
What did you end up deciding on?
Before watching Savage Geese I was told I would do nothing with my life. Now I only quote from your videos and my hair flows in the wind like a Spanish soap opera show opening.
One of those cars that looks 100x better in person. Hope this brings in some more hatch sedan reviews from mr goose man.
I love that the back opens up like that. I can already tell it's big enough to hold my light bright spare bulb inventory.
Light bright - right in the feels
Thanks to Savagegeese, i purchased a Patagonia vest and have now a 12 inch hog with a model on each arm.
I pictured a 12 inch hog with a model on each arm and it broke something in my head.
Dam Son
Dam Son
I cross shopped this with a Kia Stinger GT Limited but went with the Stinger because of the looks, ergonomics, performance and value.
Yeah these weren't out when I got my gt. They have a great motor but they really held it back performance wise with the 8 speed trans. Plus the incentives on the stinger were huge
I would say you made the right choice
These will probably depreciate worse than the stinger too.
yeah it’s sad that the US doesn’t get the R model with 315 hp or the Shooting Break
Imo the Shooting Break R looks way better and more grown up than the Stinger
VW marketing dept: Americans like trucks more than big cars
VW design: fine then, we'll give them a big car with the stereo system of a ford ranger
That gearshift lever looks like a complete afterthought - it's obvious by how much it block the climate control panel in "park" that the car was supposed to get the buttons like new Golf. I imagine some beancounter has decided that they've got a warehouse full of levers to use. It's the same in EU version too.
Had a brand new 2019 Arteon fully loaded for about a year. Amazing experience, it’s virtually an A5 prestige for like 20 grand less. Highly recommend it.
Why only a year?
The A5 suspension and all underbody parts are very much different than in the arteon
20k difference in price? Are You sure?
@@jareknowak8712 ofc not based on suspenion only. Seem to forget that most of engines in the audi are not available in the arteon.
It’s been obvious for a few years that Hyundai/Kia has been competing with Volkswagen head-to-head (car-to-car) I wouldn’t have believed it ten years ago had I been told of their success against the German giant, today. Hyundai is no longer just “killing it” in their own right, they’re straight murdering Volkswagen.
Picked up my top of the line 2021 SEL Premium R-Line on Saturday in black. It's absolutely beautiful. Came straight here to watch everybody's opinions. The gloss black and the touch buttons don't bother me at all. It's easy when you get used to how it works. It drives like a dream especially on the highway (Where I spend most of my time)
Don't pay too much attention to the price, even in this crazy car market I paid far less than MSRP.
Forget the piano black itself, the haptic controls are completely insane. If anyone likes these, I would like to hear from them as to why.
I have a 2021 Arteon SEL Premium R Line and I don't mind them honestly. Yes the fingerprints bother me to a certain degree but in all honesty they work perfectly every time and I have the upgraded Harman kardon sound that sounds fabulous. Beautifully done inside and out couldn't be happier
@@jasonlewis9255 ok, as a new buyer you will have some confirmation bias. Maybe a better question; would you prefer if they were last gen VW and/or physical? Or are you ok "dealing" with it.
@@cwx8 honestly I love the tech part of it. It's something different something new and I commend them for trying to be different in a segment where everybody does the same thing. My OCD with fingerprints on the other hand is hard LOL but all in all I like the fact that they went out and did something different and like I said it works perfectly. The interior itself is a huge leap from the previous gen in materials and fit and finish. So I gladly take this over the previous gen
I also have the sel premium r line and I like the car. The controls are a little meh but I haven’t really had too many problems with them. The HK Audio I don’t think is bad, sounds better than the Sony premium system in my 2019 fusion sport but I definitely get better gas mileage. It’s not as fast but it’s ride great. If it wasn’t for fords crammed engine design and over heating uses with the awd system I woyluld have kept that
@@jasonlewis9255 yeah without the gloss black the interior would be perfect. It looks super upscale. Blurring the lines between Audi and VW.
Drove an Arteon SEL R-Line from my local dealer for several hours yesterday. I'll readily admit I'm no audiophile but I think such a harsh judgement regarding the base audio system is simply not warranted. Given Mark's condemnation I was on the lookout for how bad it was and tested it with the local classical music station. Programs featuring Chopin, Beethoven, and Gershwin were quite enjoyable to my plebian ears. :)
Mark drives a Volvo with B&O, anything below that is shit.
The old dynaudio systems were better
I'm sorry, did you describe listening to a "station" (presumably radio or satellite radio channel) when talking about audio quality?
It sounds like your standards are far (FAR) too low to discuss this intelligently.
@@tim3172 Sorry, I can't hear you. And don't want to try.
@@tim3172 Give it a rest, buddy. Vehicles aren't concert halls.
I wish the technical part was longer and more detailed. You guys do that great.
They already covered the Golf R, Atlas and Tiguan IIRC. They are all basically the same mechanically. :)
Very few reviewers seem to talk about what should be most important for all cars. Is it reliable and how long will it last? There's a huge difference between spending 50k for a car that starts having serious problems at 80k miles and a car that starts having serious problems at 280k miles. A person might not have a problem with spending 50k on a car that last 250k miles plus.
@japanwatchconnection I'm still driving around a 2009. Every time I get the itch to buy another one I think of my wallet and say nope. I haven't had car payments since 2012. More than makes up for any money that I might lose in gas mileage.
These VW's are so high end and so expensive, at what point do you switch to an audi and say "Yea this is an upgrade over a VW"?
Ridiculous to pay that price for this. Even a new es350 is cheaper and way better.
I prefer the design of the Arteon above any Audi, and a hatchback is really useful.
@@pnourani it's not a hatchback, you can get this same car for 35,000$.
For that much it's unbeatable
@@tobiaswittwer9398 I do, too. The styling of this is better than the cheaper Audis, and it's in a completely different size class than they are. The hatchback is a nice plus. The hatchback Audis are theoretically sold in the US, but they're very rare, so getting one that you like can be hard. This looks to be somewhere in size between the A5 Sportback and the A7, but much cheaper than either, without giving up all that much.
@@tobiaswittwer9398 Ok but the A5 sportback is way nicer inside, better quality martials, better sound system and it's a hatch.
Loved the review. I just bought a 2020 Arteon because of this review and loving it. I made sure to get a 2020 because it was before the 2021 refresh like in your tester. The 2021 refresh brought all the horrible steering wheel and climate touch controls. Also the 2020's Dynaudio stereo is pretty solid, I'm very happy with it. Coming from 10 years of base model 5-speed Golfs!
Do you know which tricks of the '19-'20 come with the Dynaudio?
@@almostremembered I believe it is just the SEL Premium trims
The depreciation curve on this car will break your foot if your foot gets in the way.
It'll be a great used car in five years when it costs less than ten grand
@@tominglis9690 then you'll have a year to drive it before you have to sell it again to avoid the crippling Euro repair bills
To me, this is a good thing...because I buy second hand cars. In terms of amount of car you get for your money, a 2017 Arteon is a great buy. I know americans think German cars are expensive to repair, and need a lot of maintenance, but as I understand it, these have been pretty reliable.
@@theBatmanGoeth2 it's pretty reliable, but parts are expensive in America
@@dragospahontu compare it to a camry and think again.
I met Jack at the Chicago Auto Pros Rise and Shine meet yesterday! Great review and great chatting with Jack about my GTI!
It's Mr. Singapore.
@@YasssStitch I heard that smooth smooth voice of his before I saw him and was in a fan girl panic! LOL
They fixed a few things with the 2022. 300 hp/295 tq, 7 speed DSG too. As far as the stereo, I'm sure you could get some new speakers installed that would make it sound much better.
As a 90’s and early 2000’s car audio but I really appreciate how they spend as much as they do on the audio systems on these cars.
2:58 The fingerprints shot, marvelous. :)
Booger smears.....
2:17 is the stuff nightmares are made of :D
I don’t know why but I really like this review better then any other review of VW Arteon.
It’s just feels good to watch this video.
I seriously don’t know why.
As soon as he started talking about touch controls and screens, the car lost me. I despise not having buttons. I despise touch controls on a car. I was interested but VW failed me.
Yeah it’s super frustrating. I hate having to take my eyes off the road to guide my finger to a touch screen “button” when a physical button and muscle memory is far less distracting. I love my older VW, but I’ll be looking elsewhere until they reintroduce physical buttons for the most commonly used functions.
Again as someone who loves his Volkswagen, it pains me to say this..... but give me an Accord instead.
It's cheaper to build (much less wiring harnesses and switches). That's why they are doing it.
@@povertyspec9651 good for them I guess, they're saving money building a car I don't want to buy because of cost cutting techniques. I'd rather have a "less nice" car that is easier to use.
Get used to it. Most of the makers are going that way
@@davect01 most makers are hiding obscure functions you don't need to simply operate the car behind touch screens. Most makers still have basic functions tied to physical buttons, and it's not even close.
great production quality as always. thanks for all you guys do!
Looking at the engine bay, it gave me flashback to the years when I owned one. For 10 years. The torture I went through at replacing ignition coils, window regulators, rebuild ABS control modules, rotting vacuum lines/valves, and unending CEL troubleshooting, deteriorating interior materials, etc.... Never again.
It reminded me of a 1.8t Jetta. And I had all the headaches you just listed lol. That car was a nightmare
@@wigletron2846 Mine was a 1.8T Passat. I've learned to never buy a car with turbo engine. The heat simply destroyed everything that was not metal in the engine bay. That and the "legendary reliability" of VW was a nightmare for sure.
@@twogenders it's crazy how much the car resembles the 1.8t under the hood. That car gave me PTSD
Lots of VW enthusiast seem to enjoy that work though, similarly BMW enthusiasts. :)
I've driven the 2020 and now the 2021 Arteon for contrast. I actually prefer the 2021 despite the missing analog clock (I love that shit). It's serene, super comfortable and I loved driving it. Piano black sucked for fingerprints on the wheel, but the touch controls were perfectly fine and responsive for me. The physical wheel felt better in hand than the older model too. I'm trying to get my boss to get me one as a company car, hah.
Love your videos, this is no exception! Transistor radios didn't come out until the 1950s ;)
Prototypes in covert black ops used them in 1740, for raiding piano black plastic mines.
If you can find one the 1st gen CC vr6 4motion is a fantastic used car. You can still buy leftover brand new 2.0Ts CCs. They are out there and it’s kinda hilarious.
I've been looking at those, very nice cars for the price
Yes they are great. A guy I know has one and let me drive it on a backroad. Absolute rocket. Sad thing there are very few available still and they will set you back 20k Euros for a 20 year old car.
@@fabianherrmann6398 where I live in the US I've been finding some decent 2.0L FWD models for around 10k or so, but I would prefer AWD and a VR6 would be even better
The best part about the older ones is the 2.0T was available with a 6spd manual. I had one for about 3 years. Great car and a lot of fun for a slower car.
I love this car. While there are some quirks that need to be worked out, I think it gives prestige and individuality for the right price. I think Lexus should redesign the GS and make it a competitor against the Stinger GT and Arteon.
They can't fit a ZF in a transverse engine, and the reason you guys get an AISIN8 is because that's what most Americans want.
In Europe we have the DSG7 because of fuel economy and less CO2, I've noticed that the programming is weird on the AISIN unit in VW's probably because the engines are meant to be paired with a dual clutch.
Great looking, sporty and the amount of space in the back is great, also frameless windows are so satisfying to look at...
How often do you pay attention to how your windows look lol
I drove this car a few years ago as a Test Driver and it was everyone's favorite car on the lot besides the Golf R.
There was a reason Cadillac moved away from the glossy black touch sensitive buttons. Everyone hated it.
Same with Ford and it is mind boggling they just started to do that with their cars as if they'd never seen how those companies had moved away from these interfaces for a reason. They just don't learn.
I love your video man, they’re truly a work of art, from the high quality footage, to the cinematic, the sound clips, the in depth beauty with no bullshit you about every single vehicle, I love it. You can literally make me want any car that I’ve never ever heard of or even one I never ever desired because of how strangely elegant your videos are man. One of my fav car in depth review channels out there. Truly unmatched
U should include paint review also in the reviews , like hows the paint job panels and orange peal or finish about it !
He gets pushback from manufacturers if he harps on that too much.
I think he might have given up on even mentioning orange peel paint because it seems to be everywhere, including very expensive cars. It would be worth mentioning a car that doesn't have it.
Every now and then you can see a shot of it, though, when the light falls on it in the right angle.
@@povertyspec9651 yes hes mentioned that a couple of years back , that the reps have told him they wont provide cars if harping is at a max level !
@@Dowlphin Not on a Lexus haha. Flawless paint there.
@@Jordan-ql8pv Absolutely not.
Mark - you and your team have outdone yourselves. This space is incredible.
Can’t wait to check it out!
Excellent review. It’s so refreshing to see a car review that does not sound like a sales pitch from a marketing department.
Every single Hyundai reviewed tbh 😂
Every Savagegeese video makes me think I'm watching a Silence Of the Lamb movie. It's informative and creepy as Hell at the same time.
So unless they radically changed the stereo components for the 2021 model, then I think there was a problem with the stereo or source. I have a 2019 Arteon SE with the base stereo and it’s quite good IMO, way better than my 2018 Tacoma or the stereo in my wife’s 2019 CRV. As for others who always seem to mention a lack of reliability with VW cars, my Arteon has 18,000 miles on it and has had zero issues. I paid $6000 less than sticker, and I’ve seen cars equipped like the one reviewed here marked down $7k.
We've had the Arteon in Europe since the very first generation, with a multitude of engines, like any other VAG car. I would definitely compare it with the Passat, the cheapest Arteon is kind of at the same price as a Passat with the same optional features to match the Arteon, so it pretty much boils down to looks and personal
preference.
I subscribed to SavageGeese and no longer worry about the glovebox being felt--lined or damped.
I have a ‘21 GTI, and I had a ‘09 Passat wagon. What mark said about the speakers is so accurate. The speakers in my GTI are fine. Not amazing, but fine. But in comparison to my Passat... night and day. The didn’t even have the Dynaudio system, and it still blew the doors off of my GTI speakers. VW used to have some truly fantastic speaker systems even without upgrading to the premium stuff.
Loved our B6 wagon. That thing would burn miles over the road like nothing else. It was a sad day when it left the driveway.
@@jondiaz3475 yep. Fantastic car. I miss it all the time. I’d give anything to have that same exact chassis but with a modern DSG & updated interior.
Now reaching my mid-thirties, I’ve started to feel sluggish. I have been diagnosed with low testosterone, so my doctor prescribed me a subscription to Mr. Goose and his Korean Gander.
🥱🥱🥱
Excellent and fair review as usual, gentlemen. The Arteon's most obvious rival is the KIA Stinger (GT-line) with its 2.5L turbo and AWD. They're nearly the same size and share the liftback sedan design. Here in the Seattle area VW dealers are offering discounts of $6K to $7K on the mid level (SEL R-Line) and top trim (SEL Premium R-Line) versions that brings the SEL-R line transaction price down to the Stinger GT-Line 2.5L turbo engine with AWD and nearly the same as a Honda Accord 2.0L Touring or a Camry V6 XSE model neither of which offers AWD.
There's little to distinguish the Arteon and the Stinger in terms of specs. For those who care about Americans' narrow measure of performance, acceleration to 60 mph, each does the job in around 6 seconds. The Arteon's overall passenger space is slightly greater than the Stinger, a result that stems mainly from the especially generous rear seat legroom in the Arteon (nearly 4" more than the Stinger.)
The Arteon uses VW's corporate 2.0L EA888 engine. Having had that engine in a couple of GTIs it's a favorite of mine. The KIA, on the other hand, has the new 2.5L turbo that's being offered in a variety of KIA, Hyundai, and Genesis models. On paper the KIA is a stronger engine. But that ignores the fact that (a) VW engines are notoriously underrated in terms of HP and torque and (b) a 30 minute ECU tune from APR (that contrary to claims does not invalidate the VW warranty) erases the differences. Both vehicles utilize a conventional 8 speed torque converter automatic in US spec models. I'd personally prefer the superb dual clutch found in my GTI and fitted in the Euro spec version of the Arteon but VW believes Americans are leery of dual clutch transmissions' behavior so they opted for a conventional eight speed. Same with the Stinger.
What it comes down to is a choice of "grand touring" sedans at affordable prices. One in the mold of classic GTs from Europe and the other a Korean interpretation of a European GT tailored for American tastes. As an owner of both a VW and a KIA I'd be hard pressed to choose between them especially given the Stinger's new 4 cylinder base engine, but I think the nod might go to the Arteon.
It’s been obvious for a few years that Hyundai/Kia has been competing with Volkswagen head-to-head (car-to-car) and I wouldn’t have believed it ten years ago had I been told of their success against the German giant, today. Hyundai is no longer just “killing it” in their own right, they’re straight murdering Volkswagen.
@@bobbyaustralia8509 That analysis applies most directly to SUVs. Though cases can be made for the Atlas vs the Telluride/Palisade twins, the CrossSport vs the Hyundai Santa Fe, and the Tiguan vs the Hyundai Tucson mainly in terms of interior space. Nevertheless, you're correct that the Korean brands have more widespread appeal than the VWs.
In the case of the Stinger vs the Arteon, however, events since this video and comments first appeared have changed the picture. KIA has apparently decided to kill the Stinger, altogether, with production ending in mid-2022. The reasons aren't clear and the decision may not be firm but it appears that KIA has opted to put their performance "eggs" in the basket of a pure EV coupe style EV6 crossover, much as Ford has done with the Mach-E. It's probably a smart move driven in part by available production capacity and the overall trend toward EVs in the high performance category but it's a shame to lose the Stinger. So for those who would choose the KIA, especially the turbo 4 that makes a strong value play given its price and performance, it's probably time to pull the trigger. Having driven one recently, I was sorely tempted.
On the other hand, VW has apparently decided to send the Arteon R GT with the engine and superb dual clutch DSG transmission from the Golf R to North America in 2022. That's a surprise given the limited sales of the Arteon. And it means that it may well be virtually identical to the Eurospec version, something that is rare for VW.
That news put a hold on my potential purchase of a discounted 20221 mid-trim Arteons available in the Puget Sound area. I'll wait to see what emerges in the next six months to a year from VW. In the meantime, though, I needed to buy a car for my 17 y/o daughter so she'd stop begging to borrow my beloved GTI. As it happened, I came across a remarkably cherry 2012 VW R-Line CC (manual transmission) with only 46K miles on the clock for sale from an original owner who treated it like his first born. The price was about $3K-$4K less than I saw anywhere else so now my daughter has a car I can pester her to borrow when the itch to drive a stick strikes me. 😁
After testing the Arteon a year ago, I stuck with my Volkswagen CC. The DSG I have is much better and while the CC has a few gremlins, once they are sorted out, you're mechanically and electrically safe for quite awhile. Also, the Arteon's steering felt awful in comparison. I'd say anyone looking for an arteon that doesn't need the hatchback, should look at a used 2016-2017 volkswagen CC first.
This is hands down the best car review channel on RUclips!
I would have a suggestion. I would really like to see you explain the some of the terms you use when talking about how the vehicles drive. Nothing to in depth. An overview would be cool.
Thanks for the great videos.
Even though not as large, but there are sooo much better interior options for the price, I have no idea how can someone end up wasting 45k on this, it's ridiculous...
Some people think VW is cool and they’re blind to their history
I'd get a Stinger before an Arteon, for sure
@@chocolatewheelchair blind to their history??
@@Nickeltoe77 created by tyrants in nazi Germany durning world war 2. Fast forward to now, and they cheated the world with an emissions scandal! They’re toxic and disgusting
@@graavy absolutely! Without a doubt. If even consider an Infiniti Q50 awd. Same price
I subscribed to SavageGeese and now paino gloss plastic no longer shows up in my nightmares.
This car is VERY appealing among the sedans in its class. I love the design inside and out. Fantastic that it's a liftback. Beyond that initial appeal, it's a big nope from me. VW reliability in the US is below average. Repair costs are above average. That's a losing scenario. The capacitive touch buttons belong on a microwave, not in a car. The stereo sucks. It's priced in the luxury brand territory. For the money, I'd prefer a luxury-branded car with a V6 and better long-term reliability, like the Lexus ES.
Except that the mid and upper trim Arteons are being offered here in the Seattle area with discounts of $6K to $7K. That brings the SEL R-Line AWD into the price range of a Honda Accord 2.0L Touring model or a Camry V6 XSE that lack AWD.
@@stephenhendricks103 The Arteon is certainly more appealing than the Accord or Camry, but being the pragmatist that I am, I'd probably choose a Camry V6 XSE as the no-brainer for running costs and long-term reliability. You're still getting a nice car, albeit not as cool and unique as the Arteon. FWD is sufficient for most people.
@@stephenhendricks103 a set of winter tires on a Camry V6 or Accord 2.0T will make up 80% of the difference of the AWD Arteon. And no check engine lights.
@@matthelms4167 You're right that good winter tires make a huge difference in a FWD car for those in especially challenging snowy climates. It's a lesson I learned many years ago when I lived in upstate New York and owned a Saab 96, one of the few FWD vehicles available at the time. On the other hand I live in the Pacific NW where snow is an occasional challenge that doesn't warrant a set of winter tires that inhibit handling in most situations. And even when winter tires make a major difference putting them on an AWD vehicle is an even better strategy.
As for AWD being a source of engine problems, that's something I've never experienced on any AWD vehicle over about 50 years of driving them.
A review from savagegeese is the only review that matters :P
wish the US got the proper R model, with the 300hp+dct from the golf r
also with the wagon version
Atreon R is not even in EU...only R design
@@chlpataLOPticKa there is a R model in Europe with 315hp AWD DSG
" When I heard this the first time, I thought it was broken." Love the candor. A Savagegeese trademark. :-)
Thank you for calling out the incredibly dumb steering wheel touch system!
Along with the center stack.
The pre refresh was way better.
One of the reasons I wouldn't consider it anymore. :(
I think about 2 years ago right when this released, its main competition was the Stinger turbo 4 and the Buick Regal. Those were the only hatch sedan's in that price segment. After that you are jumping up more than a few thousand for an A5 or 5 series Granturismo.
Do all of those touch controls work when wearing big winter gloves?
Thanks to SG, I came... came for the video, stayed for the comments!
I started watching savagegeese and my gasoline Honda Odyssey and Hyundai Santa Fe suddenly became drivers cars.
I own a 2019 Version of this car and I can attest the review of this car as very accurate. I have so far over 21000 miles on mine in 10 months of problem free driving. Savagegeese is right the sound system is a level below okay. Okay for me but I'm not a music fanatic. My steering wheel and climate control is NOT touch screen so I don't have to deal with that issue. My ONLY complaint is the 20 inch rims. After 2 blow outs and one bent rim I went to 18s. It made the car even better.
Hey, the Pheaton reborn.
Capacitive touch ANYTHING isn't premium, it's just dumb.
Edit: I love Becka, is she single?
I have a 2020 Arteon. It has physical buttons for the climate control and steering wheel. Still have digital dash and the same infotainment. I am so glad I didn't get a 2021.
Here we go again, Cinderella VW is jealous of her rich step sisters and wants to show them she can do luxury on a budget.
How the hell is a passat with different exterior styling "luxury"? The only luxury car VW has ever mad is the Phaeton.
To me, this is a car for middle management. Boss above you gets Audi and you're not allowed so you get the Arteon.
@@christopherneufeldt4035 lol who thinks like that
@@papa_pt Germans
@@christopherneufeldt4035 😂 I'll stick with the 12 year old BMW
Instead of Stinger, I think it's a Volvo V60 competitor. Large cargo space, clean lines, FWD-based turbo 4 cruiser.
It’s been obvious for a few years that Hyundai/Kia has been competing with Volkswagen head-to-head (car-to-car) I wouldn’t have believed it ten years ago had I been told of their success against the German giant, today. Hyundai is no longer just “killing it” in their own right, they’re straight murdering Volkswagen.
Guys, that was a very FAIR assessment of what this appears to be for a Volkswagen product. You both painted a clear picture, so thank you for that...👍
Mark:
"As far as the sound system is concerned; at no point did it even come close to anything that resembled music. Everyone in this car is deafer for having listened to it. I award it no points, and may God have mercy on it's soul."
Motorweek vibe with the steering wheel adjustment lol 😂
The base model of the bigger Passat R-line starts at 46k € over here. And it comes with a 150 or 200 PS TDI, as all VW-AG products do. It is literally *the* engine that VW is known for.
Only the full R spec lets you have a petrol engine with 320 PS but you can also shell out 76k€€€ for it.
And i think there are much better products for that price.
The Arteon ended VW's expensive (to produce) Phaeton, which was a true high end luxury cruiser. It's W12 and W8 and V6 made place for le 4-popper TDI.
It's in the name, art. The looks are what this thing does best.
But if you want art, why not an Alfa Romeo Giulia? :)
@@TassieLorenzo Because this looks better? I know it's heretical, but I think the Giulia is pretty, but no masterpiece. It's also _much_ smaller, and not a hatchback. For many of us that matters.
For 44k you can get a GT1 3.3 tt v6 stinger AWD. And I’ve heard the new 2022 stinger is a lot more solid then pre facelift. Plus you get 10 inch infotainment. And the performance has always been stingers strong point. I guess it just depends on what you want. Arteon is more of a luxury cruiser stinger is more fun dynamic car. It would be nice if they put DSG and new golf R motor in American arteon like Europe but oh well lol
It’s been obvious for a few years that Hyundai/Kia has been competing with Volkswagen head-to-head (car-to-car) I wouldn’t have believed it ten years ago had I been told of their success against the German giant, today. Hyundai is no longer just “killing it” in their own right, they’re straight murdering Volkswagen.
@@bobbyaustralia8509 gotta be all those German engineers and designers they poached....
@@bobbyaustralia8509 oh trust me I know I have a 2020 stinger GT
Man O man, .. VW AG fumbles, make that can't manage, outsourcing to Samsung (Harmon Kardon) the Arteon HiFi system. .. Remember the fully active VW/Dynaudio in the '2000s era Passat? .. It was a stand-out..
I had a 2002 Passat with the Monsoon system. It was pretty dope.
The speakers are the same they just change the branding to something that's more recognizable to people especially the younger crowd. They did the same thing with the Jetta from switching it from Fender audio to Beats when in reality the speakers themselves are the same. Just to appeal to younger crowds.
I've harped on about this a billion times, but anyone considering a non-SUV VW with AWD should take a look at a lightly used Golf Alltrack. Wagon with tons of room? Check. Manual trans? Yep you can get one. Automatic your preference? You'll get a real deal DSG! Interior? Quite nice, especially in the SE and SEL trims. Physical controls for everything! Plus they look good and have just enough ground clearance to be useful on lumpy forest service roads or deeper snow. Only drawback is that they're really undertuned stock - about 170HP. If you're willing to do a tune though, even the simplest stage 1 software only tune will get you to about 240HP with a near 100ft/lb torque increase. I absolutely love mine and plan on keeping it for a decade.
I wish they could give the Arteon a VR6 but then again it wouldn’t fit because the sloping hood line
Still a pretty nice car tho
I had a 3.6 4motion wagon. I was soo disapointed when this came out with the 4 banger only. Especially since they still produce that VR6..
I had the CC (version just prior to the Arteon) one of my favorite features was the DCT, sad to hear it’s gone.
I had this car as my rental for a 700 mile trip to Dallas and back last week. At first I was impressed by the looks and performance. Economy was so-so. Got around 29 MPGs driving south into the wind. Driving north the wind pushed us and we got around 30-31. We found the seats hard and uncomfortable regardless as to where they were set. The only other letdown (that we didn’t know about until we had to top off on the way out), was that the engine requires 91 Premium which made for a few pricey fill ups.
I’m tinting one of these next week
I see my next uber car!!! Well done as always savages
I do a bit of Uber, but mostly conventional (pre booked) limo work - the Arteon doesn't have enough rear head room IMHO. The two vehicles at the top of my list for my next vehicle are the Audi A6 and Q7.
@@mezzb it's called "Uber Premiere" now, here in Sydney, and I see that Uber have removed the list of specific models - all they have now is a list of requirements, and IMHO the Arteon meets the requirements. Just as an aside, Uber seem not to really care much about the premium end of the market here any more - it used to be possible to to request an SUV, but it's no longer the case - now, if you request Premiere, you could get anything from a little A5, up to a Rolls. I get the feeling they've realised that the premium end is best served by traditional limo companies, which can provide a more personalised service. (i.e, the customer can actually talk to a HUMAN, and explain their exact requirements)
Those touch buttons remind me of a phone called the LG Chocolate.
Dont worry, they have almost THE SAME issues with the dual injector like before with clogging, etc. It's depressing.
Do they really? They should just go back to port at this point
@@wigletron2846 the problem resides in the EGR valve principle. Clogging is less, yes but not as we expect it was before with port injection. And dont ask how it looks before the first injector.... :( at least VW.
I'm debating getting a methanol injection kit for my dad's golf, so I I can dump valve cleaner into the methanol/water tank and try to make the valves last.
Drink every time someone brings up turbowski
Probably the best value in its segment along with the Stinger but everyone who leases these will want a badge that has more prestige. Discounts are insane on these right now and its a steal.
It’s been obvious for a few years that Hyundai/Kia has been competing with Volkswagen head-to-head (car-to-car) and I wouldn’t have believed it ten years ago had I been told of their success against the German giant, today. Hyundai is no longer just “killing it” in their own right, they’re straight murdering Volkswagen.
@@bobbyaustralia8509 Well directly in the US yeah probably. Part of that is VW selling us lower trims of all their cars. The Arteon and Tiguan are much better cars in the EU. But worldwide VW probably has some of the highest brand loyalty there is. Dieselgate would have probably killed any other company. Never mind the fact of all the other manufacturers they own.
To be fair, I've seen some information on ECU tunes for the Arteon, for less than $1000 you can wake this thing up a bit.
at some point it will cost extra to get analog gauges. that is, if that option is even offered ever. i'd go for it every time.
Same here.
I doubt it would be an option, but maybe some aftermmarket, i hope.
This explains why there was a gofundme page for Arteon owners who were needing to purchase Bose headphones.
Hahahaha I love how brutally honest this channel gets!
Piano black guy had some left over speakers as well!
How can you review this car and not make a comparison to the Audi A5? At the Arteon's price point, you're clearly into A5 territory.
Well, not as Audis are almost always configured. As always with the Germans, the base price is fictional.
This was my ‘realistic’ dream car but after hearing how bad the audio system is, I don’t think I want one anymore, and I love, love the exterior design. I think the only other hatchback sedans in this category are the Stinger and A5.