VW says EV Market has TANKED. Plus 2yr old ID3 vs Golf £££ Comparison.
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- Опубликовано: 19 июл 2024
- Is the electric dream over? Yes. Yes it is.
In this video we look at Volkswagen putting a stop to Electric Car production because no one wants the finished product, then we take a look at 2x two year old cars - a Volkswagen ID3 and a Golf 1.5 TSI Petrol, both showing just under 40,000 miles.
How does the maths stack up against them, and which one was the financial disaster...?
#ElectricCar #EV #ULEZ #News 
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I hear AutoAlex has tagged this video… I mean I knew he was a fan but come on Alex let’s have a race to Southern Spain 😂
Who remembers when the government said Diesel cars were the future ?
I do! That experience allowed me to see through the EV scam from the beginning. I switched my diesel for petrol over 6 years ago and glad I did 👍🏻
Well they are
@@Bruce4lmighty I bought a 3 year old 29k 1.5 diesel auto last year and its probably the last new ish car I will ever buy its been absolutely 100% reliable and easily does 44mpg around town and 55mpg on a run, once I discovered diesels that was it I was sold and will never go back to a petrol car (unless its an old classic).
Mazda have literally just launched an Automatic 3.8 litre V6 diesel suv to the market as a luxury car and even it boasts 50mpg. yes I know a lot of petrol cars these days can do better on MPG but not the luxury onces with big engines and a very long bonnet you can see out in front of you. even a big range rover diesel gives you about 22mpg in return for your hard earned cash. The Mazda is 50k new but id rather be forced to make the decision to buy that than an EV any day of the week.
They still are to be fair.
That was a conspiracy theory......😅
"Have an old car and look after it" - I completely agree. That's environmentally friendly in my opinion.
Exactly. Apart from fuel, servicing and tyres the future environmental impact is negligible.
I’ve got a 16 yr old 190 k Freelander 2 and a 10 yr old Fiat 500 with 120k
Both are in excellent condition, drive well and return 40 and 60 mpg.
I spent a bit on them both last mot but it’s still cheaper than a monthly pcp.
Only trouble is with older cars is parts especially engine components like alternators injectors etc soon become obsolete like i have found out with my old 2000 Honda civic, crankshaft harmonic damper pulley has decided to give up, part is obsolete and no aftermarket version available, also none used in the country but i have located one in Hungary so waiting for delivery, but what a nightmare!!!
Looking after an oldie is the best thing you can do nowadays.
buying a new ev is the worst thing you can do, it will never be as green as a small
gas guzzler driven with a light foot.
@@fidsey2scrap yards are your friend. Plus one of my cars is almost a decade older than that and i've never had trouble finding parts for it.
In Canada you get up to 10 grand off when buying an EV which helps. It's amazing how much more appealing things are to buy when you can force other people to pay for your expensive toys.
Very stupid decision. You are basically supporting the rich people to buy expensive toys. Plus ev are terrible for the environment.
The forest fires in Canada are a greater cost to everyone as a result of climate change induced in part by the internal combustion engine. How much did it cost to clean up the Exxon Valdez and the oil well disaster in the Carribean a few years back? How much are the lives worth of the three Canadian fire fighters who died and the young boy who died of asthma complications from forest fire smoke? What is the cost of the houses burnt in these fires and the cost of the inconvenience to the home owners? Then, there's the suffering of countless forest animals and the loss of trees for lumber. Visibility due to smoke was not more than 2Km near Toronto a few hundred miles from the fires. An area of the size of Newfoundland has been burnt so far this year. And you complain about the cost of a switchover to EV's. Suddenly, that cost isn't so significant, is it?
What's it worth to you to have the burnt trees producing oxygen so your ICE can even function? The Canadian forests are only so large, you know, and it requires at least a half human lifetime to produce a mature tree. I've planted trees 40 years ago and they are now just reaching a decent size. Red oaks, for example, take 40 years to produce acorns. It takes omly 5 minutes to burn them down. I wouldn't complain about the cost of an EV.
@Pimpernicholas Prove that ANY of those incidents were due to climate change.
@@Pimpernicholaswell said 😊👍
@@r33gts Thank you.
My little polo GTblue over the 5 years I have had it has increased in value by 2000 to 3000 quid. It also only costs me £20 a year in road tax and I get 50 plus mpg. Interesting video, thanks.
That's not a car
@@andreasschweizer4572 This not a reply...dsclaimer no where in my comment do I say, it is a car.
My daughter bought a brand new polo in 2013 having qualified as a teacher and needing something reliable. The car was a nightmare, leaving her stranded by the roadside 5 times, the dealer could never fix the problem of the engine cutting out and refusing to restart. In the end she swapped it out for a Fiesta which has been faultless. My experience with a VW Passat company car back in the 1990s wasn't too good either, the windscreen wiper motor packed up in the first year of having it and I've heard so many other VW nightmares, it's a brand I wouldn't touch. Their reputation was trashed over the diesel cheating scandal and their current crop of EVs are poor, the software is hopeless. Put the ID4 up against the Kia EV6, Hyundai Ioniq 5 or Tesla Model Y...everyone one of those superior cars to the VW. The German car industry needs to adapt to the reality where 'we make the best ICE cars in the world'.. gets the reply 'who cares!?'
@@andreasschweizer4572 Let me guess ...you drive an ID. 3😂
@@kiae-nirodiariesencore4270 my tip would be to not buy cheap old sh1t cars. Any one trying to sell you and EV is an idiot who hasn't thought this through🤣
One of the bigger issues with electric cars is, they don’t make budget versions. It’s top of the range and filled with tonnes of crap you don’t need, or nothing. With a petrol car you can buy a lower spec model and pay a more realistic price for ordinary people.
That's a standard marketing technique when something CAN'T be built cheap. They load it with bells and whistles to make it look better value - which it isn't unless you're a fan of bells or whistles. TBF it has worked on the EV crowd. The two families I know are both Apple families.
Apple Macs are way better than PCs just buy a few years old when some muppet upgrades, they last for years with far less stress than windows. Wouldnt touch their overpriced phones with a barge pole though.
Batteries make up 50-70% of the cost of manufacturing, so you're not saving much by making a "budget" version - it will be a similar price without any bells and whistles.
@@DigiDriftZone it would be nice to have the option and to be able to make the choice though
@@lumpyfishgravy must be nice to have that kinda Wonga
When I bought my 2006 Kia 8 years ago, my mates ribbed me that it must be nice to drive a car made in the same century that we are living in. I call myself an end user when it comes to cars. My nightmare is that I will be legislated out of doing something I love by control freaks with a fallacious agenda.
I bought a 1 year old Kia Rio in 2012, Kia topped the warranty up to
7 years again, not that I needed it in 80,000 mls. sold it a couple of
months ago, after a good look round settled on another Kia, a 2019
Xceed it still has three and a half years warranty left ( more than you
get on a lot of new cars, my fingers are crossed.
What are you talking about?
I bought a Rover, so I *did* buy a car built in the country we live.
@@rayfordham9230 Nice one.
@@dcarbs2979 I had one too.
It used to be that most cars lost around 50% of their value every 3 years. It’s only recently that many diesel and petrol cars have held their value to the point that it takes 5-6 years to lose half their value.
And that is directly down to the covid shutdown. My wife has a mot ability contract that had to be extended from 3 to 6 years due to production bottle necks. Once ice production spins up fully watch out for sliding values in the 2nd hand market
You have any evidence for this deluded statement? 😂
@@maxflight777 oh dear lord an aerosexual gibbers!! OK ok go buy all the cars your money can buy. Just make sure you find a bigger fool ASAP🤑🤑
@@maxflight777 Well the value of my used Corolla dropped £3k in a month back in april into may, so I suspect there is some truth there. However it's also the case for EVs, so it's probably irrelevant.
My Toyota Tacoma is still very valuable after 9 years ! Try that with your electric car bucco !
First time I've watched you Geoff. Very amusing style, but more to the point, absolutely correct. Would have been interesting to see how a modern Diesel would have stacked up, with even better fuel consumption and great midrange driveability. Electric cars might be ok for short town journeys, as long as you don't live in a terrace house or in a flat, but they are most definitely not the answer and of course they are going to have to pay road tax in the near future, apparently.
I can't charge at home and still drive 30.000km per year. Nothingburger for many people. They just don't know cause they never looked up charging infrastructure.
I bought a 2010 530d earlier this year for £8k. Mint condition. 90k miles. Full BMW service history etc etc... I can't for the life of me work out why I would need anything else. 540Nm, 250odd bhp, 600 miles to a tank regardless of how you drive it.... And if I sell it tomorrow I'd get the full £8k back. Maybe slightly more!
The owner of a 2000 BMW 530d probably said exactly the same !
This has always been the case with used cars. What you forget is that someone had to buy it new or you wouldn’t be able to enjoy it now. 😊
@@silverghini2629 yes you are right. I was referring to the point about depreciation and I'm trying to show how well some cars hold their value. I should add that this particular car is a 2 owner car so it's been used really well by all it's owners (including me!)
Wait till things start breaking. Then you'll understand.
@@pd1596
So you've found the perfect car for your situation and your £8k, depreciation and resale is totally irrelevant. Your 8k is gone, so enjoy your life with your car. My situation is that I don't need my perfect car spending most of its life on the driveway getting worn down with UV and lack of lubrication/rotation. If I was to go back to my pre covid long road trip days, the max stints I want to drive is 3 hours, which more often than not is an average of 55 miles per hour. I'd be interested in your cost per mile including insurance ved etc
I've got a brand new Audi A3 Tfsi e (Plug-in Hybrid) as a loaner while my car is in getting a few bits sorted. It's a horrible thing to drive, probably because it's a small car with an extra battery, a load of electrical gubbins, an electric motor AND a 1.4 petrol engine to lug about. So I thought I'd have look at the specs of the petrol only equivalent A3. The petrol only version costs about £6.5k less new and weighs over 200 kgs less. The battery, electrical gubbins and the electric motor will give you.......wait for it.........around 25/30 miles of electric only driving. 200kgs of weight and £6.5K to be able to drive 25/30 miles without using any petrol. Just ridiculous.
Oh, and the boot is smaller because of the electric motor and it's full of various charging cables!
And its like driving a go cart as well. And has the shittest gear box that i have ever seen.
See people like you are “dangerous” to the cause. You can think for yourself.
Plug-in hybrids are fools Gold. It’s just a tax fiddle.
You bought an Audi... and a hybrid at that. You have my deepest and most profound sympathies. In the mould of a certain optician chain "Should have gone to Tesla..."
Maybe the plug-in may not be the worst concept for the future. I can recommand to drive the A250e. It achieves realistical e drive of 40 miles (summer condition). I’m allowed to charge it at my office. So I drive from Monday till friday purely electric. At the Weekend for long journies the combustion engine kicks in. With empty battery i achieve 39 mpg.
And I love to have to comfort to just sit in the car and drive without planing charging stops
I’d agree with this wholeheartedly. Had an ID3 and now have and ID5. I lucked out with the 3 and the 5 regarding OTR costs and offsets so am still in a half decent place with the 5, regarding equity but this last 6 months it has dropped like a stone. Ultimately the government incentives and VW contributions, plus a few other things (like VW giving me £6k more used than I paid for the 3 new), have soaked up the depreciation. I expect others aren’t so lucky.
Significantly…at those mileages the EV still needs to do approximately £62,000 before it has a carbon footprint advantage over the other car… EVs are a con, both environmentally and commercially
Great video 👍🏻
And "environmentally" itself is a con.
As with fossil fuel based recharging. This entire EV crap is a ruse to sell MORE cars. At twice the price. With less utility.
What data are you using?
Seriously, 60K kilometers, that is your bad take? That is less than 3 years of driving, then it is all gravy after that. The cars will last 500K kilometers or longer. Not to mention not dousing everyone behind you in traffic in toxic fumes. They save the average user 10K or more over 5 years, how is this an commercial con?
I think you mean 62,000 miles. Without opening the box on your numbers and translating.... EVs do indeed have a lower lifecycle carbon footprint. Further, increasing sustainable improvement to the grid and to EVs means. Better now and getting better!!
EV sales are dropping because people who rushed to buy them in the last couple of years are now warning friends and family not to make the same mistake as they did, i.e. buy a car which is a nightmare to own.
I think two thirds of EV sales are fleet cars anyway, so their drivers don't have to worry about depreciation.
Yes, benefit in kind tax BIK is horrendous on everything except EVs.
@@tonywoodhouse6988ut these cars are company assets or the hire company they have from won’t like the depreciation value or company’s will want normal petrol and diesel cars much more easier too live with , instead I’m late for the meeting because this heap of shit needs charging again and again
Sales are dropping as we’re in a recession. When people can barely cope with mortgage hikes the last thing they’ll be doing is buying a new car.
My BMW I3 is the most satisfactory vehicle I've yet owned, even better than my Porsche 928S. It costs one-fourth as much to operate as the vehicle it replaced and avoids the heavy maintenance burden of the complicated oil-fired engine. Quiet, superior performance, what else do ya want?
Great comparison Geoff. What I would like to know is, that in the 70''s diesel's were dirty but dirt cheap to run. In the 90's the turbo diesel came along & we were all persuaded that this was the way to go & diesel was always cheaper to run than petrol. Then we are told that diesel car manufacturers were fraudulently using software to disguise the true economy of diesels & now we are fraudulently being pursuaded that EV's are the most economical but for the past few weeks petrol & diesel prices are exactly the same price in our local garage. Surely we are being taken for a massive ride & being lied to just like they have lied to us about everything else
Well...my old golf TDI diesel got 50mpg mate. Yeah it's NoX emissions were faked, but the MPG was real.
@@timothyblazer1749 it was only a certain engine number within a certain time frame... they got caught. It wouldn't surprise me if all manufacturers are doing it.. Vw sales too good? little bit of grassing up to slow things down maybe?
I've said all along that it never happened. It was a scam between the governments and the car manufacturers. No better way to shift the market than the way they did it. But the market is buying.
@@loonaticsrunningtheassylum They weren't 'caught'. They were chosen to be the scapegoat. Yes they all do it. But the 'consequences' are all about politics.
For donkets yrs, diesel was always cheaper. After a run of some years, we were skanked and diesel much high. Now at last they're roughly same price
I drive an ID3 occasionally, nice enough to drive but they were never really 'worth' £37K - this was just a way of getting some grants from government and a symptom of car financing when interest rates were practically 0%. The scariest thing about the ID3 is tyre wear, it will kill off any fuel savings you might be making, unless they solve this somehow the second hand market for them will be poor.
EV´s from Volkswagen are completely overpriced from the price-performance ratio... and I say this as a German. Here also the people buy more and more Skoda, Cupra, Hyundai when it comes to EV or Hybrid cars.
Terrible tyres wear because EVs are almost twice the weight of petrol cars. Roads and bridges will suffer too.
We'll just ignore the human rights violations it takes to build them and be massive amount of pollution and toxic chemicals created during the construction process and after the car is no longer usable. It's not like they can recycle most of that stuff. We'll also ignore that coal generally powers these things lol
My Tesla weighs 25kg less than the SUV it replaced.
Audi and VW are the same company.@anglovirtual
So would it not be fair to say that buying a used EV is an excellent choice? This is what I have done. An MG5 costs £28000 new. I got mine for £19000 with 11k miles on clock. I do 650 miles a wk as a taxi. I am on edf 8p a kw price plan for charging at night. Works out that I save £3500 a yr on fuel. Not all EV examples are bad ones.
The moment I saw the manufacturer can lock the performance levels and features in your car until you pay more money or a subscription I was “ NOT FOR ME THANKYOU “
KTM motorbikes have the same policy, as the full performance of a bike is held back in the software until you pay through the teeth.
Needless to say, like you I boycott KTM and any manufacturer who use this business model.
@@fortyfour1654 i currently have a ktm and like the brand. the thing that does piss me off is that you get the features that you are talking about for the first 1500 miles or so and then they are switched off unless you pay the moolah....that is cheeky
@@pmr01 KTM have real build issue qualities, poor network coverage, try anything to get out of a warranty claim
Great bikes when they work mind
Ready To Repair
..that's what my riding buddies say!
@@pmr01 I've always had the opinion that all KTM have is an excellent marketing strategy
What geoffs missed is the ID3 will never make a classic! And a collector’s item 🤔
Good point
..the first gen ID3 will be at least as much a collector’s item as a gen x Golf.
Yes it will - scrap metal collectors
Or a loud throaty rowdy exhaust tone
@@Mondeoman Just plug in a hi-fi with throaty car noises. FFS MAN use your imagination!
Very happy owner of a Nissan Leaf outright here. Bought as a second car for 11k 3.5 years ago and worth around 7-8k now. We plan to run it as long as it goes, very reliable and cheap to run charged at home only. I think a huge part of the depreciation we have seen this year is the reduction in price of new EVs. It's bad luck if you happened to buy at inflated prices. It will settle out over time since the batteries are holding up really well. More so than a combustion engine in many cases.
If you live in the country as we do they are useless, city car for sure
The Leaf is under-appreciated IMO, especially as a second car. If EVs are to be successful, cars like the Leaf will be what brings it, and they will be more "up market". Very few people will be able to afford cars like the Tesla.
What Geoff failed to bring up are the various incentives and dis-incentives were all being forced to cover for new EV buyers.
If Geoff were to load onto the new EVs the cost of all the credits, tax incentives and dis-incentives, cost-sharing and other machinations that force all of us to help new EV buyers, we'd learn that most manufacturers couldn't profit from building/selling EVs, and the full net loss on the EV he covered would be absolutely horrendous, more like 90%.
@@DHW256 So get an EV, and take advantage of the incentives you're bitching about.......
With EVs you also need to take into consideration the cost of wasted/dead time waiting to charge the vehicle. Time is money....so that needs to be factored in. I can fill up my 1.9 Golf TDi in around 5 minutes and I'll get 500 miles or so of range. My neighbours Mercedes SUV EV takes around 3 hours or so to "fast charge" or 24hrs if on the house mains and he can barely get 200 miles out of it. He can't even use the AC on a hot day as it drains the battery so much.
He should get a 7kWh EVSE installed, why would he try to charge it from a 3 pin plug? No car takes 24 hours on the right supply.
A decent EV with a heat pump won't care about hot or cold days, it's about 1kWh per hour to run it, that's pretty negligible. What is often misinterpreted is that when first turned on, the range figure will suddenly drop based on the current load but once the cabin is at temp, it will dramatically reduce. Different EVs will display that differently.
On a 500 mile round trip recently I wasted less time than fueling a gas car. First leg I was fully charged at home...for the next week I charged for free twice right outside the door at my hotel, then drove home with one charge stop which was done by the time I went to the restroom and grabbed a drink. Total cost: $3.50 for the public charging and probably $5 electric at home to start. Compare to the gasser I replaced which would have cost $80-90 for that same trip and required just as much time to stop and use the restroom (actually longer because I can't leave the gas car fueling and walk away).
@@mr3745 That sucks when that happens. On my trip to the office, it's 266 miles round trip. The charge time on the way back is 6 to 9 mins and I don't get time for the pee and coffee stop that I actually want. Have to hold it and go without. Damn EVs, useless!
I am asleep when i refuel my car no wasted dead time there then,and i get 190miles out of a 45kw , your friend must be charging on a granny charger, if not the car must have a 180kw battery by your mathematics which i very much doubt do some investigation as you are talking what comes out of the back of a bull.
i charge my car while im asleep and my 200 miles range only cost £4 :) if your friends car is charging that slow then theres something wrong with it :/
In my early 20s I did a similar calculation on the cost of car ownership. The major cost of owning a new car has always been depreciation. Based on that knowledge I have almost always bought 10yr old car and run them for about 5-7 years. The only reason for not keeping them longer is structural body rust.
Ditto. Had my last car, a Volvo S60, for 8 years, and a Passat for 6 years prior to that. I haven't had to spend fortunes on them in maintenance and between them, in 14 years the two cars cost me less than £10k to buy - probably less than you would pay for a single year's lease for a small EV, especially if you take the deposit into account.
I do similar with older cars in good condition nowadays. I used to treat cars that cost less than a week's wages as disposable items.
I've been driving since 1975.
I purchased my first, and probably only, new vehicle in 2020, on the back of a government tax incentive in my country (Australia) and heavy discounting. I almost felt guilty driving it out of the showroom, it was that cheap. I felt even more guilty when tax time came around. I'm over the guilt, now. Every other vehicle that I've purchased has been second hand. Some well used, some not so bad. Converted for your benefit, I've spent as little as 200 Euro on a vehicle, and beside my new vehicle, never more than 4500 Euro. Yes, I've had a few cars. And yes, a few of them I've driven to the wreckers when it's all over. But after 35 years of driving, I've spent very little on motoring, at all. No car finance, no real depreciation, and motor vehicles that you can do most of the maintenance on, yourself, make a huge difference to your bottom line. I'd be surprised if my total expenditure on motor vehicles and associated costs were much more than $100k in 34 years. I'm not kidding. And, by the way, I'm not poor. I just hate throwing money down the plug hole. And shiny new cars are the best way to do that.
Just spray/paint some bar chain oil under the car each year, and it will last for 10-14 more years. That's all it takes. A little bit of bar chain oil each year, and you can have your cars for twice as long.
In the future a 10 year old car with the modern anti rust body and paint is going to last us even longer. There's just no point getting a new car. Excited for it to be honest.
Well he's basically said the same thing I've been saying since they started pushing for us all to go electric.
Well done for bringing this gem to the light of day. EV’s are not green and we all know it, and now we know they are not worth it financially.
And you know all this, despite never having owned, driven or even sat in one? Amazing........
It must be bad if even the Germans are not following orders that must be obeyed and not buying their EVs
The Germans only built EVs in reaction to Tesla's Model 3 selling 1/4 million in 3 days to geeks in the US.
@@richy69ify You missed the point of the comment.
EV drivers are very smug because they have done what they were told. Jabbed and triple-boosted too.
@@James-gf9jl And they "support Ukraine."
Germans buying Teslas made in Germany.
Also the £0 running costs will be charges by 2025
I think you mean the £0 VED, there are already running costs but the VED isn't going to put anyone off.
@@djtaylorutube Oh dear. There is a bit of a surprise coming Haha
@@djtaylorutube it will do because the government are not going to let ev drivers off they are going to cop it big time when 2025 comes as for they are already saying that ev,s will be taxed like many petrol and diesel cars if not more! As they are realising that weight on the roads and pot holes are to do with ev,s NOT petrol and diesel cars also insurance companies are taking them as a much higher risk to a claim due to parts and electrical problems can only been done by a qualified professional which there isn’t many to repair a ev
@@noelward8047 For whom?
@@noelward8047- the surprise will be owners of fuel cars - the tax costs on those is going to be sky high. You won’t be drive them any where without paying city entry fees 🤣
I have a 2016 honda civic diesel. Free road tax and easily get 65 miles per gallon. Definitely staying away from the electric hype.
Average charging cost per Kwh is 30p at present, so a full charge on the ID3 77Kwh battery costs £23.10. 37,700 at 4m/Kwh therefore equates to a charging cost of £2827.50 on top of the 51% depreciation so overall the difference in cost between the two is more accurately £13000 over two years.
In todays economic climate I dont believe there are too many people with that amount to waste.
I pay 15 pence per kW for my electricity overnight so you can halve that figure.
The ID.3 isn't losing half it's value in two years either, and it's depreciation is in line with petrol and diesel cars now which makes sense.
And don't forget, most privately owned new cars are financed on silly finance plans so in fact the loss is nowhere near as much as you claim.
Given how the market has now aligned this is the best time to start looking at 2 year old ex lease EV's. They make a great bargain and of course you know that the motor hasn't been trashed!
7.5p overnight. Costs us £7 a week to run our EV.
So the cost to do, if we are being generous, 200 miles costs £23.10, even with the extortionate fuel prices in the UK, I can fill my diesel for roughly double that but can do 600 miles, so much for being cheaper, so much for saving the environment.
@@kurtrumble440 Yes it can certainly be done on an economy tariff on the domestic supply. However that economy tariff is only between midnight and 5am and there is no guarantee that it will charge at the full domestic rate of 2.4kw.
In fact, experience with my b-in-laws car, he charges on Economy 7 and has a 7kw wall charger, shows his typical charge is only 1.4kw, so he can only expect 7kwh at the cheap rate, which gives him approx 28 miles range.
@@GSD-hd1yh, There's an issue there then. Our Tesla charges at 7.8Kw until it hits the charge limit. Normally it's around 1-2 hours of charging a night with our daily commute. Keeping the battery at around 70% means we can also fully charge in one night for a long journey.
"get an old car and look after it", I do. My partner and I have 3 with a combined age of nearly 60 years. I totally agree. 👍
Thing is the golf will still be running in 10 years the ID won't be anything but scrap metal so the cost rises even more . My 1987 Jeep Yj I bought for 1500.00 ( 12yr ago) is now worth 10k and going up yearly now. That a good ROI you will never see with any EV.
Why would it be scrap ?. There’s 10 year old teslas with 95% battery health remaining
@@tastytechaddictsmtb
because it doesnt make vroom vroom noises they dont like Evs
@@richy69ify pretty accurate !
@@tastytechaddictsmtb Only ones that have rarley been fast charged.
@@mickcooper8605 Not really, the degradation is pretty minimal from fast charging and will not even be noticeable unless you do it all the time. I have seen statistics indicating that cars primarily using fast chargers degrade by 0.2% more in 4 years than those who do not. If you don't look after a petrol engine it will lose power too.
Informative AND humorous. Bangernomics has always worked for me. Great channel - Thanks!
Be nice to compare the service costs and a full change of tyres also
My Tesla Model-3 (2020 edition) has never been serviced, and is unlikely to need s service - ever. Tyres are expensive however... and I will need new tyres in about 18-24 months time. I will be looking at around £600-£700 for tyres - which will be the only big expense in 5 years' ownership.
Tesla's drivertrain has only 22 moving parts, compared to over 2000 in a combustion engine vehicle. These 22 parts are robust and efficient. I hardly use the brakes... The car slows down on regenerative braking (the electric motors do the braking - and at the same time put electricity back into the battery). I have driven from London to Edinborough and had to lightly touch the brakes only 2 or 3 times for the entire journey of 300 miles - so no need to change brake pads for the lifetime of the car.
The car does not have oil (no engine) and the cooling system (which is also a heating system) is fully sealed... no need to "top-up" a coolant bottle or radiator.
Tesla updates the car's software over-the-air, and does this automatically. My car is as "current" as one that's just coming off the factory floor. There is not cost to these updates. The software constantly improves efficiency, safety features and overall performance. My car IMPROVES over time, with almost no wear-and-tear.
Over 95% of my charging is done overnight at home, and as my daily average drive is around 30 miles, the battery is fully charged almost every morning. The cost in fuel savings is around 75% to 80% compared to my Kia's fuel cost.
Other EV brands will differ from the above - but that's why I chose Tesla as it is the proven market leader in the EV space.
@@brunosmith6925 Good luck with that.
@@brunosmith6925 tesla is not classed as an EV in my opinion. It's in It's own class. EV to me is all these others that run on electric.
The last service on my Kia EV cost me £68. I just bought 2 tyres for mine a few weeks back. The originals did 27k miles, and were around £40 each more than the equivalent ICE tyres.... I'm good with that, as I'm saving £3k a year by no longer buying petrol.
I have an oldish 2011 Volvo v70 d5. It runs beautifully I can get over 700 miles to a tankful which I can fill anywhere in roughly 10 mins. I love it. I look after it and it looks after me. I smile every time I drive it.
How much does a tank of diesel cost? 700 miles costs me a max of £9.60 in my EV. It charges while I sleep which is handy. Had a d5 Volvo previously and it felt like a ticking time bomb of injector issues swirl flaps dpf problems. Always had at least 4 messages on the dash.
@@Japnut And how much has your EV cost you to buy? What about depreciation? How much are things like tyres? How much will it cost to replace the batteries, the motors, the touchscreens when they eventually fail? And don't forget a lot of what you are saving is because the rest of us are subsidising you.
@@-A-lm5xb no subsidies. Tyres are cheaper than the xc. Just has normal tyres that are apt for the weight which is comparable to a diesel of similar size. No subsidies or grants on mine so nothing there just normal purchase and drive. Car cost 20k so will pay for itself in about 7 years. Maintenance is minimal as no oil filters gaskets turbos dpfs. Screens etc are under warranty for next 5 years. Shouldn't be an issue after that. My old leaf has 100k miles on it and the battery was pretty much the same health as new and the newer ones have better thermal management so can't see it needing new batteries for 20 years or so.
@@Japnut You're missing the point, which is that when they get to 15 years old or so people won't buy them because they will be worried about the potential cost of new batteries, motors, screens etc. You can buy a decent car now that's 15 years old very cheaply, sure you might have to spend a bit on it but that won't happen with EVS because of the potential risk of a four figure bill if anything goes wrong.
They're no good for people who don't have home charging, work out far more expensive to run than a diesel car if using public charging. As for tyres I did a quick comparison on BlackCircles. Cost for Pirelli P-Zero, 17" for a Tesla was over £500. I just had to replace a tyre for my car, far larger at 19", same brand, £179. I'm only quoting what I found online at one of the UK's largest retailers. For my car, turbos are known to be practically bullet proof, you only need gaskets if you need major engine work and an oil filter is a tenner. EV fans always talk about the cost of replacement major parts but that's rare on most well kept cars, most parts needed are exactly the same parts as an EV would use, tyres, wipers, suspension and so on. If the engine goes on a 15 year old runabout you just go and buy another one. My car will never cost me anywhere near £20k, and I have a 3 litre luxury saloon.
@@-A-lm5xb what do you run it on if it isn't going to cost you 20k. How many miles a year do you do? I said in my earlier comment that EVs only work if you have off street parking with the capacity to charge at home. So I've not missed that point. I drive a kia e niro which has normal tyres in it that are the same cost as any other vehicle. It doesn't have crazy levels of tech but yes it does have a screen in it. TFT screens with touch control are old tech now though and many cars have them too. I still have buttons like any other car to operate heating etc etc so no issue there. You are missing the point however that EVs are much more simple and will be more reliable in the future. The oil companies are paying media outlets massive figures to publish negative publications about EVs because they want to keep people oil dependent. Finally why would peiple not want to buy an ev when they are 15 years old and have deprecated like a petrol/diesel car and are affordable and cheap to run. Modern petrol/diesel cars are aweful things due to manufactures having to try and make them clean and efficient. O2 sensors swirl flaps variable vain turbos dpfs catalytic converters high pressure fuel rails. All this stuff is crazy complex and will be a nightmare to own once worn. All the plastic components manufacturers are now using where heat is present baffles me. People think EVs are more complex but in actuality they are far more simple.
Brilliant, hope your covid change gets better. I’ll stick with my Peugeot 206; 2005 diesel. It’s only done 50k. Gordon Brown advised us at the time to buy diesel as it was better for the environment. Great video 😃👍
And Gordon Brown and his mate Tony Blair have a proven track record of good advice…. WMD springs to mind…..only now Brown is trying to back track.
@@AH-is7be Politicians don’t live in the real world that we have to day by day. Thanks for the comment. 😎✌️
@@rogerhargreaves2272 They do their job as usual. The problem is idiotic citizens believing the politicians work for them. Talk about delusion.
I drive a ten yr old Mazda 323. I don’t need a v8 or a people mover or have a status symbol. We have one family car. I am humbly and quietly saving the planet
Yeah ,I'd rather stick with my old diesel car anyway,take that Klaus.
When will people in charge realise, that the majority of the people don't want them and when this bs is forced on people, they rebell and don't want the EV cars..
Nothing better than a nice EV car fire to warm the cockles of my heart with this winter.
There are still a lot of ignorant morons out there who will buy them you know.
They know, they don't work for the voting plebs...see!
@@brianlopez8855 How many electric cars have caught fire in UK?
Although these fires do present a real danger, fortunately for us they remain very rare. Data obtained by Air Quality News through a Freedom of Information (FOI) request revealed that in 2019 the London Fire Brigade dealt with just 54 electric vehicle fires compared to 1,898 petrol and diesel fires.
@brianlopez8855 in 2019 there were probably 10000 Ev’s if that on the road as apposed to millions of combustion engines…..
Its not all bad, high depreciation is great for those of us who buy old cars and fix them ourselves. I suspect the heaviest depreciation will be when the cars are too old for the dealer network. Many garages are not geared up for EVs and many mechanics are frightened to touch the big orange fuse. This will be great for adventurous DIYers. An 8 year old Kia Niro for the price of a bag of crisps will be nice :o)
when they get to an age that they need new batteries,who is gonna buy?
@@raymondadams7570 Not if they are liquid cooled. I will buy ... but only the right car at the right price
I’m not exactly confident that I would be able to do that. I know exactly what you mean in relation to a three-year-old performance saloon that depreciates heavily, but an electric vehicle? How do you replace the battery on one of those things?
I’m actually too scared to buy one for that very reason.
Again, I know what you mean, and I’m not picking an argument with you, I’m just saying that I wouldn’t touch one with a bargepole because I wouldn’t expect to be able to go to an independent and get it in a better than roadworthy condition.
@@stephenwright8703 as with an ICE car, before buying anything, research your chosen model carefully. Find out what is likley to break and how to fix it. Certain modles attract enthusiast buyers who are preapred to do all sorts of repairs and put them on yourtube. It makes fascinating watching. For example a Tesla battery that had minor damage to an ancilliary part. Teslas official solution was 20 grand for a new battery. The actual solution was drop battery , fix it for nothing and put it back. With my own had a problem for which the official solution was to pay 4 grand but I flipped the orange fuse and fixed it myself at zero cost and this was the first time I have ever worked on an EV. It was also a repair nobody else had done. Just make sure you take electrical precautions before working on an EV. It has enough voltage to kill but shouldnt be a problem for anyone reasonably intelligent.
I remember in the 70's when mechanics were picking up rotor Wankel engined car for £100 and fitting Cortina engines in them.
You can kind of feel the air escaping the EV hysteria bubble.
Do you?
More EVs were sold in the first half of 2023 than in the whole year of 2022.
Yep that sound u hear is a EV fart…
There was a spike in EV sales and a few years ago they were doing very well, but of course eventually the people who bought them realised how rubbish they were, and so word got spread and interest has been lost. The government hasn't exactly helped. By now we should see great swathes of land being developed into charging car parks, but instead you might find a few chargers working in the motorway services if you're lucky. . Also I've heard that insurers are cottoning onto how fragile they are. I've heard stories of them being written off going into a pot hole due to unrepairable damage to the batteries. The final nail in the coffin is that production of EVs is not environmentally friendly.
Yeah, no, all rubbish. None of what you said is true. In every part of the world EV sales are still growing. People that drive EVs love them. Funny but the people that hate EVs are the ones that don't drive them, makes no sense to me. Why do people that don't drive EVs have any opinion on EVs? EVs are not more fragile than other cars, all cars are fragile, and that is intentional. They have crumple zones for passenger safety.
As for the environmental argument, yes manufacturing anything is not environmentally friendly. We mine things, refine them, pump noxious fumes into the air, leach them into the ground, and that is just ICE cars and their fuel. Comparably over the life of an EV it is much more environmentally sound than ICE cars. Every peer reviewed study on the subject has come to that conclusion. Some garbage scientists paid to lie by oil companies say otherwise and are regularly debunked. You don't want one, don't buy one, but spreading lies about them is pathetic.
@@mikereinhardt1244
True I don't own an EV but I know several people who have. Four of them sold them after a year. One of those got his car written off after going down a pot hole which wrote off the car due to damage to the battery. Others I know use ice for long journeys. The biggest issue is lithium. It cannot be incinerated and so ultimately will go into landfill in countries like Africa where its out of sight out of mind for hypocrites like you who have no problem turning 3rd world counties into refuse sites. I never said that evs are more fragile, but the batteries definitely are. Wait till you get a minor dent near the floor pan or get a minor rear end that would be easily repairable with a conventional car. Yours will be written off
@@pokie6087 I think you are the hypocrite, and probably a liar too. I doubt that you have several friends that own EVs, you probably just made that up but let's assume you are being honest. What your friends experience with EVs is not what everyone else's is. If we are using anecdotal evidence then I have at least 20 friends with EVs, and they all love them. Now most of them are smart enough to buy a Tesla, and we can't buy cheap crappy Chinese EVs in the US like you can in Australia. One of my friends was rear-ended in his model Y. It had some pretty serious damage. They repaired it, didn't write it off, and then he drove it from Seattle to Scottsdale Arizona. I asked him how the trip went and he said it was fine. The range typically exceeded his bladder and after going to the restroom he had maybe 8-10 minutes before the battery was charged. That is fairly typical here in the US. I don't know what your story is in Australia, but because your country can't build out EV charging stations is not a knock on EVs, it is a knock on your country. Figure it out or keep driving polluting ICE cars.
Statistics in the US show that 87% of people that buy a Tesla will buy another one. 96% of them will buy another EV. So the statistics don't bear out the story you are making up. Again, I don't know what crappy EVs your imaginary friends are buying that get ruined by driving over a pothole. I am also not ignoring the Fosters ad and assuming your "pothole" was 5 foot hole in the ground.
As for the destruction of third world countries from mining, I have several things to say about that, but one thing I never did was point at you for that, if I had done that while minimizing the impact of battery production on those countries then I would be a hypocrite. Which you did, pointed at me (and I don't even own an EV, yet), while the things you consume (including oil and gas, including their use of cobalt), quarts countertops, cement, diamonds, and even food we export from there that are destroying large swaths of rainforest and destroying their soil. Those countries made their own decisions to do that. No one brought a military in there and forced them to, they decided to do that, and it is their choice to stop if they want. You are the hypocrite here for only calling out the destruction of 3rd world countries for EV mining. BTW the only thing that must be mined for EVs now is lithium and graphite. Nickel does not come from third world countries either. Lithium comes predominantly from Australia, are you living in a third world country? Is your country incapable of deciding for itself if it should export its lithium?
In the US and the EU lithium ion batteries are being recycled. This is happening, it is a fact. In every state you can have an EV lithium ion battery picked up for free by these recycling facilities and they recycle them. They don't incinerate them. But they could. Lithium can be incinerated as can most everything with plasma. That is how some small island nations take care of pretty much all their trash. Why you would want to incinerate a valuable material like lithium is beyond me though, and further shows you don't know what you are talking about.
@@pokie6087 I think you are the hypocrite, and probably a liar too. I doubt that you have several friends that own EVs, you probably just made that up but let's assume you are being honest. What your friends experience with EVs is not what everyone else's is. If we are using anecdotal evidence then I have at least 20 friends with EVs, and they all love them. Now most of them are smart enough to buy a Tesla, and we can't buy cheap crappy Chinese EVs in the US like you can in Australia. One of my friends was rear-ended in his model Y. It had some pretty serious damage. They repaired it, didn't write it off, and then he drove it from Seattle to Scottsdale Arizona. I asked him how the trip went and he said it was fine. The range typically exceeded his bladder and after going to the restroom he had maybe 8-10 minutes before the battery was charged. That is fairly typical here in the US. I don't know what your story is in Australia, but because your country can't build out EV charging stations is not a knock on EVs, it is a knock on your country. Figure it out or keep driving polluting ICE cars.
Statistics in the US show that 87% of people that buy a Tesla will buy another one. 96% of them will buy another EV. So the statistics don't bear out the story you are making up. Again, I don't know what crappy EVs your imaginary friends are buying that get ruined by driving over a pothole. I am also not ignoring the Fosters ad and assuming your "pothole" was 5 foot hole in the ground.
As for the destruction of third world countries from mining, I have several things to say about that, but one thing I never did was point at you for that, if I had done that while minimizing the impact of battery production on those countries then I would be a hypocrite. Which you did, pointed at me (and I don't even own an EV, yet), while the things you consume (including oil and gas, including their use of cobalt), quarts countertops, cement, diamonds, and even food we export from there that are destroying large swaths of rainforest and destroying their soil. Those countries made their own decisions to do that. No one brought a military in there and forced them to, they decided to do that, and it is their choice to stop if they want. You are the hypocrite here for only calling out the destruction of 3rd world countries for EV mining. BTW the only thing that must be mined for EVs now is lithium and graphite. Nickel does not come from third world countries either. Lithium comes predominantly from Australia, are you living in a third world country? Is your country incapable of deciding for itself if it should export its lithium?
In the US and the EU lithium ion batteries are being recycled. This is happening, it is a fact. In every state you can have an EV lithium ion battery picked up for free by these recycling facilities and they recycle them. They don't incinerate them. But they could. Lithium can be incinerated as can most everything with plasma. That is how some small island nations take care of pretty much all their trash. Why you would want to incinerate a valuable material like lithium is beyond me though, and further shows you don't know what you are talking about.
@@pokie6087 I think you are the hypocrite, and probably a liar too. I doubt that you have several friends that own EVs, you probably just made that up but let's assume you are being honest. What your friends experience with EVs is not what everyone else's is. If we are using anecdotal evidence then I have at least 20 friends with EVs, and they all love them. Now most of them are smart enough to buy a Tesla, and we can't buy cheap crappy Chinese EVs in the US like you can in Australia. One of my friends was rear-ended in his model Y. It had some pretty serious damage. They repaired it, didn't write it off, and then he drove it from Seattle to Scottsdale Arizona. I asked him how the trip went, and he said it was fine. The range typically exceeded his bladder and after going to the restroom he had maybe 8-10 minutes before the battery was charged. That is fairly typical here in the US. I don't know what your story is in Australia, but because your country can't build out EV charging stations is not a knock on EVs, it is a knock on your country. Figure it out or keep driving polluting ICE cars.
Statistics in the US show that 87% of people that buy a Tesla will buy another one. 96% of them will buy another EV. So, the statistics don't bear out the story you are making up. Again, I don't know what crappy EVs your imaginary friends are buying that get ruined by driving over a pothole. I am also not ignoring the Fosters ad and assuming your "pothole" was 5 foot hole in the ground.
As for the destruction of third world countries from mining, I have several things to say about that, but one thing I never did was point at you for that, if I had done that while minimizing the impact of battery production on those countries then I would be a hypocrite. Which you did, pointed at me (and I don't even own an EV, yet), while the things you consume (including oil and gas, including their use of cobalt), quarts countertops, cement, diamonds, and even food we export from there that are destroying large swaths of rainforest and destroying their soil. Those countries made their own decisions to do that. No one brought a military in there and forced them to, they decided to do that, and it is their choice to stop if they want. You are the hypocrite here for only calling out the destruction of 3rd world countries for EV mining. BTW the only thing that must be mined for EVs now is lithium and graphite. Nickel does not come from third world countries either. Lithium comes predominantly from Australia, are you living in a third world country? Is your country incapable of deciding for itself if it should export its lithium?
In the US and the EU lithium-ion batteries are being recycled. This is happening, it is a fact. In every state you can have an EV lithium-ion battery picked up for free by these recycling facilities and they recycle them. They don't incinerate them. But they could. Lithium can be incinerated as can most everything with plasma. That is how some small island nations take care of pretty much all their trash. Why you would want to incinerate a valuable material like lithium is beyond me though, and further shows you don't know what you are talking about.
I looked at this two years ago when looking for a new car and used exactly bthe same type of cars for comparison. I realised that dispite all the "savings" I kept getting told about, when you include depreciation you could have included free electricity for the EV and it would still cost me more than running a diesel. Exactly the same conclusion you came to.
I got a diesel.
ICE will dramatically depreciate in value.
@@CYBER-EV Almost everything does
I'm charging my Kia eNiro at home for around a 7th of the cost of using petrol on my off-peak rate. And diesel costs more than petrol, so I don't get how you arrive at your cost conclusion. Even my local charge network only charges 38p per kwh if you subscribe, which isn't much more than the daytime rate......
@@Brian-om2hh now do the calculations including miles-per-pound and depreciation of both the electric vehicles and non-electric vehicle of the same type. Literally the point of both the video and my post.
I run a 1999 volvo v70. Cost me £1600 12 years ago. Runs like a dream. Serviced every year. Parts replaced as and when. Passes mot each year no problem. I'll be running it to the end of my days.
Just found this channel, Geoff a European opinion that makes complete sense. Keep up the great work. Time to ban these EV blow torches on ships, tunnels and garages...
Just how much does it cost to charge an electric vehicle?
Nobody in Australia wants to talk about it.
Petrol and Diesel cars will only go up in value....
The value of all cars will go down. Thats the way it works...
They have been for a while, buy a 18 plate 2.0tdci car in 2020 for £13500 , now selling for £19k on the forecourt in 2023.
I read a Article by AutoCar recently about EV depreciation and it is eye watering. I do like the corporate speak for “we can’t sell the bloody things “ 😂
It does bring a smile to my face.
I think it's the batteries that cause this issue, the closer you get to 10 years old the more useless the batteries become, It would be the same if they made a petrol car that everyone excepted that the engine would stop working after 10 year very few people would buy them or want them as it's age got closer to 10 years
@@SlimTortoise Wrong. At 2% per year degradation that is only 20%. Actually there is evidence that degradation levels off to almost nothing after a few years.
I once read an article about the moon being made of cheese. I didn't really believe it..... Autocar have a vested interest in pushing ICE cars, so what else could they say?
Trouble is Geoff. Governments will raise fuel costs, increase parking charges, Road charges for Petrol and Diesel cars. Unfortunately, if everyone switched they would move those charges on to EV's. This has always been about taking the common man off roads. LTN's other ULEZ schemes etc.
EV's were about prior to ICE cars. They failed due to range and charging issues. In the 150 years since then, Range and charging issues remain about the same.
That is why it is so perfect to buy used EV :-) I bought classic Ioniq of 20 000 Eur that has just 19 800km on Odo (3 years old car). It was as new for almost a half price when it was sold for 38 000 Eur originally :D Today after 2,5 years of owning this EV, the same car still cost 19 000 Eur at used german market, so only 1 000 Eur down in 2,5 years !
I wouldn't give £185 for the ID3, let alone £18,500!
I wouldn’t accept one as a gift.
You have no business mind, mate😮😂
I can beat you guys. I wouldn't take extra cash payment and a free ID3.
@@th5841 we're not all money grabbing materialistic things either and realize money or "more shiney shit to impress people i don't know" doesn't equal happiness
@@Notme-tq4xslol
I disagree that they don't work or they're "a nightmare to own", mines is a company car and in the past 20 months I've had zero issues, never been stuck for charge, I've done 48k miles as a mobile engineer in that time and no complaints. they are however ridiculously expensive to buy, and charging on the road is sometimes dearer than diesel. the cars themselves are great to drive, infrastructure not the best but it is very usable if you plan correctly. they aint perfect, but they're far from terrible, as some other comments suggest
Buy one for yourself, then you might think differently
@@lolorick5885 I will be buying one for my wife. No reason not to.
I drive a 1986 bmw e28. 320,000kms on the clock, never misses a beat and I can fix it myself. I wouldn’t even consider an EV as a replacement. I’d rather ride a bicycle.
I had my Jeep GC for 20 years. Take care of your car and it will last. Traded it in for $600 last month. I am looking forward to my next 20 years in my new Tesla Model Y!
My son loves his. Enjoy.
Have you ever thought reduced demand may be because…….we’re in a recession and interest rates are making mortgages practically unaffordable….so people can’t afford to buy them.
So why are ice VW's on the same production facility unaffected by layoffs or reduced time working and production of those cars is normal ?
I bought a 2004 Corsa 1.4 SXi 3 years ago for £500. It's cost me around £300 on 3 MOT tests in total, a full tank of unleaded is around £40 even now, and that will do me over 500 miles. No way will I ever sell it while It doesn't need massive welding.Not had any at all yet so looking good. Keep the video's coming, you make very good points mate.
Sounds a bit like ours on the drive. Bought for £700 because my son insisted but it was a bit of a shitbox. Since then most of it has been changed, should probably be re-registered as a new car! Tailgate from a CDTi, still waiting for someone to spot the badge and say we're putting the wrong fuel in when sticking the petrol nozzle in. After he decided to move out, it then went to daughter to learn to drive and now is about to go back to son for his second car runabout. I finally fixed the obligatory drivers footwell water ingress the other week, how's yours?
I've told my son, look after it this time, he won't get much cheaper and it's running well now.
My daughter has a 2018 1.4 Sri and would never get 500 miles to a tank maybe 390 max
@@djtaylorutube I have the same water ingress, but no idea where it's comiing from, any ideas?
Even massive welding would be worth it. Even though EVs suck, new petrol cars suck too. There's too much 'environmental' tech in them that goes bad and makes the car disposable. The smart thing is to keep older cars on the road even if it costs some money to do. It will still be much cheaper than being forced to buy a new car every five years.
@@varmastiko2908 I budget £500 a year in my head to keep our old Volvo going. Given that it only does about 1000 miles a year, sounds disproportion but in reality, I get nowhere near that figure, usually no more than £100 tops and usually no more than oil plus filters.
Charging stations, broken, vandalized, closed, and costing a fortune as well as restricting not allow fast/full charges
I drive a perfectly maintained Mercedes Station Wagon e320, 23 years old.
Still gets same mpg at 264,000 miles, no signs of quitting.
I have 0% interest in EVs - none - zilch - nada
If they really wanted to get everyone into EVs they would build charging points everywhere; the fact they haven't tells me they have other motives and plans
With the government net zero agenda with ridiculous targets to get rid of all petrol/diesel by 2030. The message its given out to car makers is to stop production of petrol cars thereby making it difficult to get parts soon. The dangers is when EV's get completely shafted as white elephants. Car parts will be difficult to come buy or even more expensive which is what the governments want through the WEF plans - No cars on the road. ....Just to save the planet.
Yes make it so expensive the masses can't afford it.
The way the grid is set up, especially in the US, it couldn't possibly handle so many cars being charged at the same time. And who is going to spend the money to upgrade the grid? The whole thing is absurd.
There is not enough coal production in the world to operate all the power stations needed to charge these cars . Even if there were enough coal , we would need to start building power stations now , at a great rate .
@@mikemoore5929 There are other means of generating electricity, but you are right. EVs may be an option for places like Norway or Russia that have cheap hydro power, but not for the US or Australia, for that matter. China has gone all out with EVs, which means they probably have plenty of disposable power. I can see it on their buildings and public spaces.
Here in the US they’re doubling down on Evs. I really hope they go away.
I can't see how and why the oil companies are taking this lying down.
The US is actually behind many important markets globally, in terms of EV adoption. In markets that really matter (China being the most important), EV adoption is growing exponentially (ie: getting faster and faster). Germans are avoiding VW's EV offerings because the cars are technologically inferior and very expensive. People vote with their wallets. VW is throwing out red herrings - the demand for EV is rising fast - just not for VW whose cars are expensive and crap. VW is trying to put the blame on their incompetence elsewhere. Interesting to see that sales of the German-made Tesla Model-Y are rapidly increasing - and Tesla is struggling to meet demand. The Tesla Model-Y is now the world's best-selling passenger car, knocking Toyota's Corolla off top spot - even though the Corolla is HALF the price of a Model-Y.
EV adoption will happen NOT because of government interventions, but because EV's are increasingly making economic sense to new-car buyers. (Not VW however - as the market also knows how to recognise crap - particularly expensive crap).
Model Y is also an expensive crap.
@@vinlondon8904 They all are. It's a cult.
Hilarious, I watched this video and immediately afterwards an ad for the VW ID4 came up. Yeah I'm convinced! I'll buy one. 😂😂😂😂
V70 D5 - 500.000 km Still going on strong. Thanks for the video.
“VW says *OUR* EV market has TANKED” “Strong customer reluctance for *OUR* EVs”
You are broadly right although there was also reference to the fact that demand for EV's in general has dipped. There can be many reasons for this so I wouldn't draw too many conclusions.... and there will always be some manufacturers bucking the trend, but just watch out for future taxation policies - fossil fuels are currently a "cash cow" for the exchequer an EV's are a cost - this WILL change
@@alexmonroe613 Absolutely it will. It would be interesting to see how many people switch to EVs if it was a level playing field re. taxation, freedom of movement (re. ULEZ etc) and so on.
@@-A-lm5xb 100% currently the running costs of an EV that covers 3 miles per KWH (if you charge at home via the national grid) is comparable to running an ICE car that does circa 60mpg he difference is, for every £20 of diesel or petrol you buy £17 - £18 is TAX. if you ran both cars on a totally level playing field £20 of range on an EV would be the same as £2 - £3 of range on an ICE. This is a circle governments haven't "squared"... yet... watch out for road pricing. AKA they will have to double the cost of running an EV in order to regain the 27BN of lost petrochemical taxes... but they will never allow an EV to cost twice as much to run as an ICE car so Diesel and petrol prices will also have to double... or all cars have to become subject to road pricing(cost per mile)... either way it looks as though once EV's become fully mainstream the cost of running any car will likely double. Aaah B*olox 🤑
@@alexmonroe613good point. Remove the tax component from both costings. In NZ you get a "clean car" tax rebate for buying an EV and a dirty tax for buying a petrol or diesel. You pay no road tax. No fuel tax and there are free charge points everywhere. How to sponge off others? Buy an EV
What happened is that the very generous subsidy / incentive in Germany was reduced
Yes, but people who buy these battery powered cars don't mind losing out on a few thousand pounds, they're saving the planet🙃
They like to think they are, but they're not really....are they
Wankers. I have 2 v6 and fill them for 25 USD you Brit’s are idiots tolerating this giant scam. Come to the M East
Are you for real ??
That's enough internet for you.
On Radio 4 lunchtime on Tuesday owners of modern cars (EV and ICE) were phoning in with multiple tales of woe; spare parts unobtainable, software going berserk etc. I nearly choked when a woman said she had bought an EV "because they're sustainable". My two petrol cars are 20 and 18 years old respectively, reliable and cheap to run, and MoT passes every year. No way would I change them unless they had terminal problems.
Don't think so, the planet is already wrecked natural progression nothing lasts forever 😂
My 2005 Chevy blazer is still rocking and rolling after all these years. At 73 , no EV in the years I have left….
The extraction of lithium from ores involves crushing , roasting , grinding and acid leaching , the brine extraction involves use of large amounts of water and chemicals. In South America 2.2 million liters of water is used to produce 1 ton of lithium, that's a lot of diesel to pump it ! Hydrogen ICE or fuel cells are more logical , could be produced by solar in North Africa and bulk shipped to Europe!
I really didn’t think I would be shocked by this..but this genuinely is shocking
Having owned an EV (volvo) it causes nothing but stress, especially on long journeys. Plus waiting an hour to charge at services, then charging for an hour. It is not only frustrating, but many services can fine you for more than a 2hr stay. (great!)
Would never buy a second hand EV because of the high price if anything goes wrong with the batteries.
Can you demonstrate some cars that have issues with batteries?
@@Matttski £17,000 for replacement on a tesla..
My nephew has leased a high end 4 wheel drive EV Audi costs him £600 a month, he had to drive from Liverpool to Ipswich to attend a funeral he wasn't confident with the journey in the Audi so he borrowed his sisters Renault clio ICE , whats the point in these milk floats ?
@@alanjones6359 Exactly, plus garages on the motorways have admitted to not even being able to turn on the charging stations (in some areas) due to the strain on the local power grid.
so what is the point of electric!
Which EV's are you aware of that have "gone wrong" with the batteries?
What a joke this electric cars. Wait a few more years they will pay you to buy one. Who is going to buy a 8 years old electric car with no warranty on the battery? Some of this batteries cost 15000 pounds.
A scientific study has been done on the most eco-friendly personal vehicle. It's a well-maintained old petrol car.
Glad to say I'm as eco-friendly as ever!
Also that Golf, if properly maintained, should be perfectly usable car for the next 15-20 years, whereas the ID3 will need its batteries replaced in perhaps five year’s time, by which point doing so will cost more than the car is worth so its then owner will likely scrap it.
My Zoe is almost 10...
Why would an ID3 need it's battery replaced, when a battery pack refurbishment would cost just a fraction of replacing it?
The ID3 will be needing a new set of tyres at that mileage since many battery cars fail the MOT on tyres given the owners were not expecting them to be worn out by the first test. The German TUV were also finding a lot of steering, suspension and brake problems. The brake one is interesting as it seems to be down to lack of use not keeping the pads and discs in good condition as drivers use the regenerative braking.
Great comment
There is definitely a problem with disc corrosion because infrequent braking allows crud to build up which apparently creats a foothold for water to linger. This should be a very straightforward problemd for the manufacturers to sort out. All it takes is a change to a more suitable disc material, just as brakes had to change when asbestos was banned.
I have a 2017 Ioniq with a 28kWh battery, but with a different driving style resulting in an average mileage of 100-110watt/km over 130000km. Hence I hardly ever accelerate fast, I hardly ever brake fast, I look ahead a lot, mostly drive 92km/hr on the high way and preferably behind trucks. Not because of the aerodynamic, but I know others have to trespass the trucks anyway so I am not keeping up anybody.
I had my first tires changed at 90000km. Had no complaints about the breaks and often I only brake to come to a complete stillstand. We are very happy with this particular car. It also has features like lane support and adaptive cruisecontrol… just brilliant feature btw.
Well done Geoff.Great presentation........none of the above pronouncements will appear on MSM and the many other failings of EVs will also be kept hidden from the hapless punter.Keep up the good work.
It’s over for whom can’t sell profitably like VW. For others it’s beginning of the beginning
I used to be one of those people, changing my car all the time, however I used to buy 6 month old ones so didn't cost as much on the old pcp. Now I own both my cars, ones 4 years old the other is 8, can't see me changing either any time soon. It's encouraging to see that some of the sheep are waking up to the reality of the big ev con.
Basically an ID3life is really a car for life because you cannot afford to sell it on.
😂😂
Yes you are right, with the battery degredation of my 30kwhr leaf now at 30% after just over 7 years and 34k milesfrom new, who would buy it. I fully expect to use it around town until the battery degrades to an unusable percentage and then scrap it. Lesson learnt !
E got a 4.5 diesel V8 toyota landcruiser and would never buy electric.
I also have a golf that will run for EVer...
Totaly ridiculous to think so many sheep were gonna buy electric. Its a gimmic.
Volkswagen will be history in 5 years. They have missed the boat, just like Toyota. This is them just appealing to the people who want to agree with them. Congratulations.
I got my 2012 VW golf TDI for 7000 back in 2018 with 112,000 miles on it. I get 32mpg city and 50 highway. I’ve had no issues since I bought the thing. My daughter will be driving this car in 16 years.
I just did a comparison with my Jaguar e pace 180d and an i pace with very similar conclusions. Bought my e pace new 3yrs ago for £39,500 and today from webuyanycar and motorway, they both offer £30,090 and £30,500 respectively. A depreciation of £3,350 per annum. For a 3yr old i pace today on autotrader, you’ll pay around £29,000 and new, back in 2020, they were £73,000. A depreciation of £14,700 per annum. In addition to this, to drive the 12k miles I’ve covered, I’ve saved 48 recharge stops and approximately 42hrs sitting around drinking coffee. This versus 30 diesel filling up stops which is approximately 2hrs so saving 40hrs sitting around drinking coffee or if you prefer 1.7days. EVs? No thanks 😊 BTW, can’t charge an EV at home as I live on the 5th floor.
Did you not see that field in China with 1000's of pre registered BYD EV's so they could claim sales where going well.
I’d take any photos from China with a pinch of salt . Remember during covid with the dead people laid on the streets. Can’t say I saw that anywhere else in the years after.
Been driving my 2015 E-Golf been the best car ever 100k miles. Still smokes em all off the line and still not a dollar spent on maintenance, shorty.
You couldn't give me a combustion car shorty. 😂
The e-Golf cost almost nothing to 🔌 in 😂.
A friend works in a local garage, a guy came in & bought a new electric 3008 for 38k five weeks later he came back saying he didnt like it & wanted a petrol version………he was offered 20k for a trade in on a five week old car it cost him 18k plus what ever he put in to buy the petrol version.
My Renault EV kept going wrong and after just a year I tried to sell it. We buy any wreck offered just 50% of its original cost. Eventually I managed to sell it but lost nearly £5000 at a time when all the experts were stating there was a huge demand for EVs both old and new. No there was not. Instead the market was flooded with similar cars to mine all offered for 20% below the new price.
I'm still rattling around in my 2005 VW Polo which, amazingly, get me to where I need to go. If anything goes wrong, it's about £100 to fix or DIY as the engine is so simple. Good for the planet and light on the pocket.
1997 Polo, 530 000 km's - still perfect with minimal maintenance costs. Only wear items replaced at 400 000 (aircon compressor, clutch plate, alternator & minor suspension parts, wheel bearings, water pump & good to go for a million km's with original engine and untouched power steering unit & perfect interior). What's not to simply love?.
Yeah it is all true in case you don't have to do anything on your old Volvo, (or you do it yourself) but buy an old volvo and end up with a repair bill (in England) you pretty sure ending up worse financially. I have a 25yrs old VW and I repair it myself but not everyone can afford the time to do that. Many ppl who buy EV better off working on their job rather than spend their time working on their old clunker. Also, you can't compare and old Volvo from the 90ies what runs forever and a 10yrs old Volvo what will brake down much more often/can't repair yourself. So this isn't that simple of a topic as you portray it to be based on behind the desk numbers. No insult! Cheers
I was able to buy an old lovely Rolls-Royce but will never be able to afford to buy an EV, not and pay the rent, bills, food.
I jumped on the old Volvo wagon 6 years ago Geoff and I am smiling all the way to the bank! S80s are my choice and petrol ones at that - no diesel rubbish! LPG conversions saves me some cash as well. Thanks for the update on VW! No surprise there!
Have you noticed that EV drivers are the sorts who are very pleased with themselves generally?
Why shouldn't they be? They are wholly justified.
No.
You’re delusional. Virtue signalling does not make a good decision. I just don’t understand why people buy EVs. Is it the massive depreciation hit and the tedium of the drive? Or is it the lousy range and the stupidity of having to hire an ICE car for the long journeys? They’re very damaging to the planet to produce; don’t you understand that? And there’s insufficient charging structure in the UK and putting extra stress on the grid. Totally stupid purchase.
@@rogerphelps9939I have a ferrari, McLaren and Taycan, but I don't go around acting like some douche. As per usual, ppl who fake it are the most obnoxious
Good information! Today I was in a VW car showroom in Elmshorn near Hamburg. I saw a brand new ID5 in metallic red. It looked great, workmanship great, but the price tag at 65,000 Euros shocked me.
No normal German worker can afford such a car! VW unfortunately is no longer a Volkswagen, a car for the ordinary people. German workmanship and skill is still excellent, but I wonder what has gone wrong with the CEOs responsible for wrong decisions and policies.
I know someone that bought a Ford Lightning... Paid stupid money, had the top of the line charger installed in the new starter castle's garage... He is still driving his old gas pickup, due to the fact, when he plugs in the Lightning to charge, it crashes his house. The humorous part, the man is an electrical engineer! They can have them.
At my age I get range anxiety walking to the bathroom in the early hours! 😬
Flipside is if EV's depreciate fast it makes them a used bargain
Except you are then only 4 to 5 years away from spending a fortune on replacing the battery pack, or you have to sell it for nothing.
correct Michael. Not long ago the EV haters were screaming " EV's cost way too much, nobody can afford them". Now we're seeing depreciation bring them within reach it's " EV's lose money".. Which way do they want it?
Bought a new ICE VW (2022) and bought it specifically to have an ICE. Don't want an EV, and I love my car.
WHO would ever buy an overpriced baterry box?
- low km range
- full loss of the independence a fuel car gives
- baterries fail over time and cost a FORTUNE to replace
- public are wiser and no one wants a second hand ev
Yes the most environmentally friendly cars is the one you own, which has already been made & still being used, The least 'green' car is one that has to be manufactured from scratch, using all those raw materials.
You make a good point. My 25 year old Honda Civic is green. I mean, literally, it's green. Impossible to keep clean, green!
Nobody is talking here about the effective life of a battery
I have four cars the oldest is sixty four the youngest is twenty two - all run just fine and I can fix them myself.
Get a Mercedes W126 if you can. Best car ever.
What a way to throttle production, one thing to be sure is that they will not be firing up the ICE production. The intention is to remove all those who do not "need" cars in the near future, to meet the 2030 target agenda.
The Emden plant will carry on making normal cars as I guess they are in demand.
Same BIG agenda with all UK high street banks closing and the few remaining (at present) won't give you your own cash out! I had to take four car journeys on successive days to draw a low four figure sum out last week! I'm at present bank with the one notorious for being bankers to the world's drug lords - not for much longer. I have told them twice that I'm leaving!
The "Agenda" is the problem, we as customers, should be setting the "Agenda" based on our needs and wants, Not the government.
@@willswomble7274 only twice, so why haven't you left yet !!?? 🤔
I was recently asked whether I would purchase an Electric Vehicle to help the environment. My answer was that I might consider it when slave labor and children were no longer used in the mining of the components for the batteries (lithium, cobalt etc). My questions to you Geoff are, what happens when we run out of easily obtainable rare earths? We are told 2030. By 2030, the world will be awash with useless EV batteries. What happens to them? We know that they are not recyclable, even the EV lobby knows that. I was in our local underground supermarket car park today and noticed an EV there. Should it be there? For people with less (obviously much less) scruples than me, would a used EV be a good buy? Does the warranty extend to the next owner? How many miles (Kms) before the batteries start to deteriorate? Do we really know the cost of a new battery? What warranty would it have? Would you agree that no government could afford not to tax EV's?
I live in Australia and our distances are vast. A friend of mine owns an electric Kia. How would this vehicle fare on bumpy dirt roads? When he travels to the country for work, he takes an older 4 wheel drive petrol car. What a joke! My view is that EV owners need to take a long hard look at their own moral compass.
I bought my Tesla Model 3 Long Range over 5 years ago for about 47 grand after tax rebates, and it's still worth 32-37 grand (It's got premium wheels, interior, paint, and AutoPilot. 10 grand of depreciation over 5 years and 64K miles is not bad at all.
I just bought an old Volvo V70 estate for a 6-week road trip, hoping to sell it and get my money back. Unfortunately, I already have spent £1300 on repairs lol and paid the trade price, but I'd rather do that, than lose £3500 hiring a large family car for 6 weeks :) Great Video I enjoyed your content
02:30, There are too few electric vehicles being sold thus indicating strong customer 'reluctance'.
Interestingly, reluctance is resistance to magnetism. 😆😁
Didn’t a container ship from Germany with 500 cars aboard catch fire????… you can’t even ship electric cars