At this rate next week Wolfeys gonna roll up with "I ranked every double typing and terra combo in Scarlett and Violet" and we aint even gonna be surprised
A couple of thoughts: 1) Flying being immune to ground pulls an insane amount of weight in balancing the type chart. 2) I've found Tera grass to overperform. Grass perfectly covers the weaknesses of Fire, Water and Electric, while also hosing Amoongus & Breloom. 3) Psychic, Ice and Normal are all still paying for their Gen 1 sins. (Especially green's Blizzard with 90% accuracy and a 30% freeze chance.)
Yeah look at Zygarde Complete. It literally needs zero coverage move, because Thousand Arrows neuter Flying's advantage over Ground, and good Bug and Grass Pokemon typically have secondary typing that is weak to Ground, meaning Thousand Arrows alone hit almost the entire metagame with neutral damage, and hit a lot of great type for super effective damage
It’s unfortunate that psychic and normal got destroyed so badly for having been broken in gen 1. Hell, I’m guilty of still seeing psychic as the ultimate type because of the trauma of amnesia Mewtwo.
@hoanganphanle4584 Power creep on a 20yo franchise has to end up looking like that if they want to keep upping the hype with each release, though. It is what it is. Got many issues myself with the franchise and their owners more specifically, but not this one.
Never realized how great fire is defensively. That was genuinely a shock. It's not steel by any means but it unironically comes closer than most other types0⁰0
There's a few issues that make Fire not actually that great of a type defensively, despite its number of resistances. - A few of its resisted types are usually paired with another type that Fire is weak to. For example, most Steel types run a Ground move as coverage, so Fire fears them anyway. - All of its weaknesses are very significant, with Earth and Water being two of the most common offensive types, and Rock weakness resulting in large Stealth Rock damage. - Most fire Pokemon tend to have Glass Cannon stat spreads and movepools, so you rarely see fire types used defensively. - Fire doesn't pair too well with other types defensively, always leaving around important weaknesses. For the few types that do match nicely to a point, they're actually extremely uncommon pairs, one of them actually didn't exist until gen 9 (Fire/Grass with Scovillain) Looking quickly at the list of fire types, I can recognize these pokemon that have been good defensively: Incineroar, Heatran, Primal Groudon. Incineroar is good thanks to Intimidate and good defensive stats, but still has important weaknesses. Heatran is the one typically used in stall teams since it has a huge lot of resistances and its weaknesses are covered by other typical stall Pokemons, but being able to land an Earthquake on it still shuts it down instantly. Primal Groudon is a special case since the pair has only two weaknesses, one of them being double weak to Water, but its ability nullifies that huge weakness. For all of these cases, they don't have any recovery move, and value their offensive side. Without support from their allies (leech seed, Defog, etc.), you can easily wear them down over time and eventually take them down.
i think it’s important to note the immunity to Burn that fire types have. tera fire on physical attackers like garchomp and annihilape are pretty common because you can’t be burnt at all, and this makes fire such a good type defensively in more ways than just resistances.
Oh, I've actually thought about this. So there are a couple reasons Cyclizar was probably made Dragon/Normal - at surface value, it really is just a large lizard Pokemon. If anything, the Dragon type feels more tacked on than the Normal type does. - it helps distinguish it from Koraidon and Miraidon. Since they're both Dragon plus a secondary typing, it makes sense that it has a second typing of its own, but since it's a more basic version of the two legendaries, it's just Normal.
@@MorrisPXG I'm not sure what you're saying. Think of it as if you are a video game designer. Pokemon is mostly for kids and there are new players with every generation. Cyclizar is normal for the same reason the starter type Pokemon like Rattata and Pidgey are normal. They are tutorial mons with default attributes for the player to learn the game with. Cyclizar isn't amazing but he has STAB with Terra blast and is good with literally every Terra type. That's the point. It's a new player's first Terra blast user. You train up the cool dragon mon and it works in almost every situation with normal type moves and you don't have to worry about the details. I remember my Charizard in my Pokemon Red game I played as a kid had such bad moves his only good move was seismic toss. Pokemon is not a game you need to min max to enjoy. I didn't have flamethrower, but I still beat the elite 4!
Also, to be fair to the Ice Type, Freeze-Dry is super effective against water, so an offensive resist actually becomes a super effective move which is really nice.
Yeah, imagine other such moves: - A Fire move so hot, it's super effective against Water because it literally makes water evaporate. - A Grass or Bug move that involves sharp thorns/mandibles, severely hurting anything that tries to eat them - super effective against Flying - A Poison move that is actually not toxic but rather corrosive, becoming super effective against Rock, or maybe even Steel. The list could go on and on, you can imagine.
@@asmodeus58XX I don't think all of this would be a good idea, but I love the poison one. In order to make poison more viable/interesting as a type I think it would be awesome if they gave it a bunch of moves with some weird and wacky effects, rather than its entire type being so linked to the poison effect. Maybe an acid rain weather condition, or a status condition that decreases stats. Poison could become a really decent support type.
Kinda crazy that steel used to have 11 resistances and 1 immunity, if steel did not lose the resistences to ghost and dark steel would be beyonde broken
And it was with 17 types. Steel had resistences/immunities of 70% of the types. Steel is so good defensively that honestly, being a duo type steel is often worse than a solo type steel (often, not always).
@@M.W.2 We all know the real reason fairy was made was to add ANOTHER resistance to bug, because you know bug is simply so powerful it needed another type to wall it.
@@GKoopa Not right now though. Like the only times it truly comes in useful is against Flutter Mane, Valiant, and maaaaybee Slyveon but we'd be stretching it a bit. A lot of Fairies were cut this gen
The one type chart change I really wanted to happen this generation is making Bug resist Fairy instead of Fairy resisting Bug. Bug sorely needs to be resisted by less types, and having another resistance itself would really help it. Fairy wouldn't be hurt that much by this either. They could have even made Bug supereffective against Fairy. This would probably be too big of a change for them to ever make, but, Fairy already is only countered by two types that aren't known for offense, Bug being a counter to Fairy would balance both of those types better and I don't think it ever made sense for Fairy to resist Bug anyway.
I think it's very obvious at this point that Gamefreak /wants/ bug to be a bad type. They like using it as a type for when they want to make things intentionally worse. For example, early gym leaders, early pokemon, and strong attacks (see: Quiver Dance, First Impression, U-Turn). They probably won't change it because it makes designing things easier for them.
Personally, I'm campaigning for improvements to ice. Specifically, resisting Water & Fairy, as well as losing the steel weakness. Reason: Bug has really good type combos (Electric & Steel), and can use those attacks for more consistent damage. Ice on the other hand is just a Nerf to a pokemon, and basically only exists as a move type, not a pokemon type.
@@simonteesdale9752 Your first idea with Water and Fairy i'm completely on board with, but your second take is awful imo. Steel only hits 3 types for Super effective with a lot of common things resisting it, so you basically are just adding more pain to an already mid offensive type. Like you wouldn't even be nerfing steel, just a handful of pokemon for no reason.
@@i_like_chomp6382 Fair enough. My issue with Steel is that in addition to being an insane defensive type, it's also a decent offensive one. (Mainly thanks to hitting fairy). In my opinion, steel should be one of the worst offensive types in order to compensate for it's defensive capabilities.
@@simonteesdale9752 it already is. It's like a notch above Bug, Grass, and Poison. You don't need to compensate for anything, it's not like steel types are going to mow over your entire team, they won't. The only pokemon that run steel type moves are steel types themselves and they don't even have good moves to begin with (Iron Head and Flash Cannon aren't powerful enough) In fact the reason Fairy was created was to not only balance Dragon but to buff Steel and Poison offensivley as well. Steel doesn't need any nerf as of right now, it's not a problem. It's already weak to the three most common offensive types, that's what fundementally keeps it balanced and fair. Litterally every single offensive pokemon with access to Fire, Ground, and Fighting attacks will run them. That's part of the reason why even though on paper Steel is better defensivley than Fairy, it feels much harder to break through Fairies than it would Steels as they're weak to rarer attacks.
You and the team have single handedly gotten me into competitive Pokémon. I used to just play it casually but now you guys have come to help me realize how awesome it is from a competitive standpoint. Keep up the good work because it teaches us all so much while being very entertaining and thorough!
I feel like the steel psychic match-up should be flipped given the old trope of bending a spoon with telekinesis. Especially given that a bent spoon is literally the item that enhances psychic attacks
I’ve been playing Gen 1 lately on my old gameboy, and as a huge fan of psychic types, it was amazing having my favorite type actually feel strong and powerful. I completely agree with your comment. I’d honestly even say they should make psychic deal super effective damage to steel because of that idea, I think it would be fun, but I’m not a game designer and don’t know how that would play out
Having Fairy be weak to Bug or AT LEAST lose its resistance to it would be such an obvious and welcome change to the type chart that I can't imagine GameFreak haven't thought of it yet. Clearly, they prefer buffs that leave the chart alone, like what they did with Ice this gen.
@@EnriqueLaberintico interesting suggestion! I also had an interesting discussion once where I said Psychic types should be immune to confusion because of their steady mental constitution, but my friend said their reliance on mental power means confusion is actually extra risky for them. Idk what the right answer is, I can see both sides.
being rresistant to ghost and dark was so stupidly broken, and it didn't even made sense lol. I was playing sacred gold yesterday and when I pulled out spiritomb against a Steelix I remembered it and got obliterated.
Before Gen 6 Steel had resists against 11 types and an immunity to 1. It was weak to 3 types. That only leaves 2 types out of 17 that hit Steel for neutral: Water and Electric. Steel hit Water and Electric for only 1/2 damage. So all in all Steel had either an offensive or a defensive interaction with every single other type in the entire franchise. (Now Ghost and Dark have no special interaction with Steel. Neutral both ways.)
Dude, Ice had the greatest glow up of all time bruh. It didn’t get extremely good, but it went from literal garbage to pretty decent, and that’s pretty great
Surprised to see Wolfe have Guardian Tales for backup. That said, this wideo is finally able to correct the misconception of some types being better than they really are. For one, the only surprise to me about Dragon was that Wolfey didn't call them "another better Normal Type" for how many types it tries to hit for neutral.
Honestly the ice buff seems pretty good and the ice types we got this gen are cool. I like cetitan and I hope to see a team with him from you or cybertron soon.
Game Freak: We will take away steel’s resistances to Ghost and Dark. Metagross: No! Game Freak: But we’ll let you one shot every fairy type with super effective meteor mash and bullet punch, including the #1 gen 9 pokemon.
As an ice type fan, I'm enthralled. This is the best we've been since season 1. Seriously, back then it was one of the best types, but, since gen 2, it has been a downfall spiral. So glad to see ice 'mons doing much better. If only they could resist normal, flying and/or water... Gosh, that would be awesome.
Ice wasn't good in Gen 1 either lol. It's just Normal, Psychic, Ground, Water and then everyone else. People would apparently much rather use Snorlax Base 65 Special Blizzard than Articunos Base 125 Special STAB Blizzard. Although to be fair they weren't aasss bad so I guess it kinda was their best Generation in a way lol.
i think it would make sense to resist flying, not sure about water. i think having lots of good offensive ice mons is a pretty good buff, it's meant to be a glass cannon type anyway
This list is ridiculously good in my opinion. Back when the first list was released, I set out to mathematically form my own. I modeled types using an offensive and defensive value and recursively solved each using a dynamical system approach. It made some assumptions that were somewhat specific to singles, but nonetheless this is what popped out at the end of the day, in order of (offensive value, defensive value, overall value). - bug: 70, 88, 71 - grass: 79, 92, 80 - poison: 72, 101, 83 - ice: 105, 67, 83 - psychic: 96, 83, 85 - fighting: 97, 90, 90 - rock: 110, 80, 94 - normal: 88, 103, 95 - dragon: 92, 102, 95 - electric: 104, 103, 104 - flying: 108, 105, 108 - dark : 111, 105, 111 - ghost: 112, 106, 112 - fire: 116, 102, 112 - fairy: 106, 114, 114 - ground: 125, 99, 117 - water: 115, 114, 119 - steel: 93, 138, 124 Happy to share my methodology if anyone is interested. My main takeaway from this is how much better type is defensively than anything else. Multiple standard deviations above the mean.Also, give ground more love. It is by far the best offensive type and offensive types benefit the most from tera.
Hey! I'd love to talk about type interactions with you. I wonder how much weather, terrain, special immunities* and entry hazard interactions would do for evaluating types. It might be useful to add in something like an error bar to capture both the peak and the floor. Ghost doesn't have much to buff or hinder it specifically, whereas Fire can get destroyed by rain or rocks. (*Special immunities being things like Dark types being immune to Prankster, Fire types to burn and Flying types to terrain effects and hazards except for Stealth rocks)
As a psychic type lover I am in Pain! Maybe the abundance of steel types makes it so Psychic finally gets an attack that hits steel for super effective damage (because, y'know, bending spoons and stuff)
Since they made Telekinesis unusable since gen 8, they should just change it to be a variation of Freeze-Dry. (Special, 70 power, 100% accuracy, Steel super-effectiveness)
I am giving you a sub this video was so good. The editing made me laugh for almost 10 minutes straight. The part where you talk about the rock types is hilarious. And now I am slowly getting into competitive Pokémon thanks to you!
Finally the fire type is getting the recognition it deserves. Having the 2nd most amount of resistances and having all of its weakness covered by having one grass move
On the topic of Fire types, you also forgot to mention Paradox Pokemon and how their abilities activate under harsh sunlight (the ones exclusive to Scarlet at least). The fact that most Paradox Pokemon are so good competitively is an indirect buff to Fire types overall because it means more players will be running Sun teams
Yeah but that's about it. Imagine if other types get the pseudo treatment 600 BST. Most would probably break OU and goes to Uber especially if it's ghost or fairy.
The same reasoning could also be reasonably applied to Psychic, which would "force" Steel and Dark types to be present unless you wanted to do the Psychic mirror match. And yet Psychic is one of the underpowered types atm
As a fire type main, this is nice to see where it placed and the way Wolfey explained, it definitely made sense why it’s higher than it normally would be.
Steel is probably going to shape the game as it has in the past and in the future. Pokemon sometimes have their competitive viability live and die based on steel types, whether that's dealing with them offensively or defensively.
I'm curious about something for the flying type. You mentioned that flying type mons only tend to be good due to their secondary typing, which is definitely true. But, it might also be worth pointing out that apart from the two Tornadus forms, as well as Rookidee and Corvisquire (two unevolved mons), there are no other pure flying type pokemon. So flying alone as a type may not be super high up on this list, but since basically every flying type gets a secondary type, I think it's one of the more complex ones to truly rate. Not calling out Wolfey's placement for the type or anything, just thought it was something that might be worth considering.
It's also interesting because I remember reading somewhere that in gen 1 flying was created specifically to be a secondary type which is why there were no pure flying types until gen 5.
He is judging the types in a vacuum, so even though most os dragon types are really good, the dragon type itself isn't as good. The same logic applies to normal type.
@@Dr._is_sleepy If we are only considering monotype pokemon than Flying is probably the second best type you can be below Pure Fairy. It has the meta defining Ground immunity with an incredible resistence to fighting. All it really needs to worry about is Stab Electric type moves seeing as though Ice and Electric coverage is generally rare and coveted for, and Rock/Ice types are rare as a whole. From an offensive standpoint Flying is incredible, resisted by the already stated rare Rock types, Electric types which are usually frail. That leaves Steel types as Flying's biggest check but that's extremely managable. Being a Flying type means you already offer something of value, it's why Skarmory and Corviknight are incredible. They're immune to EQ and are not weak to fighting. Some of the best type combinations and pokemon have Flying in them: Electric/Flying - Zapdos, Thunderus Fire/Flying - Charizard, Moltres, Talonflame Ground/Flying- Landorus, Glisgor Steel/Flying - Skarmory, Corviknight Dark/Flying - Yveltal Fairy/Flying - Togekiss All meta defining mons from recent who mostly all have been dexited. Sorry if I'm ranting lol it's just that I really don't understand this Flying type slander lol.
Might have been an oversight to have steel have this many resistances when any pokemon can become a steel type. It was obviously made to be the defensive type for mostly non aggressive pokemon. Then Aegislash changed everything and dark got the pass. That might need to happen again in Ultra Scarlet & Violet 2, Isle of Tundra, Crystal version.
I think normal does have a place at least a little higher, as having only one weakness is pretty big, and only being resisted by 2 types means that you can basically hit everything for normal damage and get walled less easily
Poison is still useful as a defensive teratype (and alternative to steel, which will eventually get checked by fire tera). IIRC some of the meta mons do use poison as their main defensive tera.
I think what holds ghost type back in comparison to fairy is the abundance of pokemon that can viably run sucker punch. The strongest priority move besides extreme speed is on so many strong pokemon that it shuts down many ghost types entirely since a lot of them tend to be squishy thematically
I love that Wolfey can basically make a type better or worse. When he says it's worse, people will use it less, and when he says it's better, people will use it more. This goes even a step further. He's now placed fairy lower on the list, so steel is a slightly worse offensive type, and placed steel super high, so now fire, fighting, and ground are all gonna see more and more use, making them better types. These two changes might bring steel down a notch, but then the plethora of those 3 types will increase use Pokemon that beat them.
It's really cool how terastalization has allowed you to be able to evaluate each type independently of the pokemon attached to it. For example, Ghost Pokemon are generally terrible, but what if something like Garchomo was now Ghost? It's a cool twist for the type ranking charts.
Glad that Ice Type finally got buffed this generation and much higher on the list, let's hope future games give some mandatory buffs to types like Bug and Poison that they deserve!
Poison should resist and hit water super effectively. Yeah water can dilute poison but still, it’d be a small nerf to water but a massive buff to poison
@@MrCheeze While Ice definitely benefits the most from Terastallization, the Snow buff will presumably still persist, so while the type rankings will change next gen, Ice is undoubtedly better than it used to be.
I agree more with this ranking of the types over your previous video. The reason why is because you looked more at the type itself rather then what I felt was you associating like; dragons are strong thus fairy is better because fairy beats dragon or this type with this type equals a strong combo thus the two types are better because they work well together.
I’m just happy the ice type is getting better! Hopefully it can see more play now! Imagine the 50% boost to defense in snow and also setting up aurora veil!
I'm surprised by the low ranking of Flying. I understand why you put it so low. I think I would ranked Ground higher than Fairy. Fire has been lowkey getting better or at least getting recognized. I think a lot of the stigma Fire had was due to its Stealth Rock weakness in Singles. Great video world champ.
Fire also dislikes rain a lot of the time. Flying is immune to entry hazards (besides rocks) and terrain effects. Would be interesting to have these sorts of things considered. Taking into account how conditional and common a certain interaction is.
Fck, Guardian Tales needs to sponsor more of these youtubers, what are they doing!!! Awesome video Wolfey crazy how the competitive scene can change in a few years due to typings.
They really should add frost burn instead of frozen. It would be a way to deal with special attackers, ice would be immune, and frozen isn’t fair of a status effect, it’s rng to thaw or a fire move which your opponent wants you frozen so they won’t use fire. Also should electric be super effective vs steel? Metal/steel is a conductor something electricity takes advantage of
your explanation of putting my favorite type dragon was actually pretty good there’s actually some dragons that has other types to make them immune to their weakness that’s another reason why dragon types use plot armor to be the best type
I think a lot of people underestimate how powerful a type that hits most Pokémon neutrally can be offensively. Think about it a bit is it better to hit half the Pokémon super effectively or all the Pokémon neutrally. When you get down to brass tacks types like flying, normal, dragon, and steel are good offensively because they can hit a lot of Pokémon neutrally for decent damage which makes them hard to switch into especially if you’re defensive checks have already been dealt with.
And that's why I consider Wolfe the best Pokémon content creator in RUclips. I love his manneurisms, knowledge and overall video ideias. I would love to see more Nuzlock videos like kaizo, cause I laughed a lot. Keep on doing the great work. Hope you win Worlds this year
Game Freak really has to do something to keep steel types in check, but I don't know what they could do. The last time steel got nerfed (removing resistance to ghost and dark) it simultaneously got buffed (with the introduction of fairy type). If they get rid of its resistance to psychic, that would help slightly but it also undermines the original point of steel: the type that resists psychic. My best suggestion would be to make steel weak to electric. It uses the same logic as why water is weak to electric, and it helps buff electric (therefore ground, therefore grass and flying) types quite a bit.
Tbh I don't think Steel needs to resist psychic anymore. Dark and Steel were introduced partially to nerf psychic due to how dominant it was in Gen 1, but the type has just been getting worse and worse with each generation. Gen 1 benefited psychic the most due to mechanics (Special being one stat), bugs (Psychic being immune to ghost), and limited movepools (the only types it was weak to were Bug and Ghost neither of which had strong offensive moves to use) as well as the fact that the only ghost type in the game was weak to psychic and every bug type other than scyther and pinsir (who didn't even learn any bug type attacks) had horrendous stats. Now psychic as a type is actually really bad, nothing about the type itself is scary or useful, I've never looked at a pokemon and thought it would be better if it had psychic as a secondary type, or been worried about dealing with an offensive psychic type on the enemy team. Any psychic pokemon that happens to be strong isn't strong because of its type, it's strong because of its stats/ability/movepool.
Honestly as a life long pokemon fan since gen 3, its crazy how to see much the games changed. We never thought a lot of types would end up where they are
Balancing suggestions: >Steel is no longer resistant to Psychic. >Bug is now resistant to Psychic and Fairy, while hitting Fairy for neutral. They are also immune to confusion. >Psychic types are now immune to having their moves disabled. >Ice is now resistant to Water. Freeze is replaced with Frostbite. >Normal types now have built-in Early Bird.
@@Arcananine77 Wtf that doesn't even make sense. Psychic being super effective against steel would make more sense than it being super effective against Fairy. Make it make sense.
@@nathanieljohnson5908 Way I see it, Fairies are all about whimsy and mischief, which Psychics would be uninterested in because they're too cerebral. "I don't believe in fairies!" if you will.
@@Arcananine77 I feel like the mischief part is more dark types. But fairy to some degree. I would say that makes sense, but since it's pokemon we are talking about, where fairies are very clearly real, I don't think it makes sense
Honestly, ground types might be my favorite (mostly because I love Mudbray) They can be really powerful, most ground type Pokémon look really cool/cute, etc.
Bug needs to resist fairy instead of the other way around. Immediately making it better defensively and offensively while giving a tiny nerf to fairy. If you wana go a little farther I think bug should also resist dark and psychic. At least dark
I tried doing calculations on the type effectiveness of a pokemon with all eighteen types. Here's what I got: Immunities: Normal, Fighting, Ghost, Ground, Electric, Psychic, Dragon, Poison Quadruple resistant (0.125x dmg): Grass Doubly resistant: None Resistant: Ice, Bug, Dark, Steel Normal dmg: Fire, Water, Flying, Fairy Weak to: Rock Doubly weak: none
Its REALLY bizarre to me that Poison is such a good _defensive_ typing, despite poison itself being known for being really good at killing things... Its also strange that Rock sucks as a defensive type because of how many weaknesses it has, despite rocks being "rock solid" and known for being tough to break.
The biggest luxury for my predominantly Rock/Ground teams I always make every new game is that SV seems to really not like Water types this Gen. There is only one Pokemon with drizzle, who I never see when I'm online, and the water types who are here are either not dependent on Rain (Iron Bundle), other water-boosting Pokemon, or are scared of their now Top Tier counters (i.e. Meowscarada).
Dragón is actually good at offense because only 2 types resist it meaning dragón types usually hit very well the majority of the tier. Examples of this are Dragapult or latios spaming Draco meteor on the counter part steel and fairy are common types
Basically gets carried by high stats and high power Stab moves. It's not as good offensively as Ground, Ice and Water, because it doesn't threaten super effective damage while still often dealing neutral. Not many mons would use Stab Dragon Pulse, let alone use it as non-Stab coverage.
Steel: gets better Fire: gets better as a result Dragon and Fairy: "oh no steel's a lot better, we're bad now." Fairy: "Wait, I was only good because I hit Dragon types..." *perishes*
13:51 Ghosts are definitely good enough to land at sixth spot in this list anyways because every singles and doubles player is currently screaming Flutter Mane right now.
I’m glad to see Ghost getting some love. It’s my absolute favorite type, and its damage is super useful. It’s probably the best possible single coverage move you can have, and is a part of one of the few two type combos that can hit everything either neutrally or super effectively (fighting and ghost, ice and electric just to name two of those).
I think flying is a pretty good type because as you said many pokemon benefit from the ground immunity.Tornadus is the only flying type pokemon without a secondary type.
If it were in my power, I'd make changes to typing, not to fundamentally alter the power balances in the chart (e.g. make bug an A or S tier type), but to reduce some things that feel like edge cases of unapproachable. For example, I'd make Ice both resist Water and do super effective damage to it, which is a twofold buff to Ice and a nerf to water, which seems like a stable monster across the years. On the topic of Ice, I'd also make it super effective against Fire. To me, philosophically you could have made the argument since the beginning that Ice and Fire could have been mutually supereffective, and I think that's a really interesting dynamic that is a nerf to Fire and yet another bump for Ice. Ice is a type that suffers defensively, and the snow change while good doesn't fundamentally fix the problem because weathers are multipokemon strategies. Different to sun or rain, there is no cross-class benefit to snow. There is no Clorophyll, there is no Hurricane or Thunder that diversifies snow comps, so many pieces in your team tend to be vulnerable to the same things, which makes them hard to pilot and fairly onedimensional. Changes like this embrace that, Ice is going to be a poor defensive type, but improving its already decent offensive value to hit both fire and water (remove Freeze Dry, obviously) would make the type have an interesting tradeoff for bad defensive properties. I think Psychic should do super effective damage against Steel, with Kinesis being the philosophical proof of concept, although in Japanese the Psychic type is more the mentalist/occult/astral type than the psychokinetic relationship that prevails when saying Psychic in English and other languages. Still, it has played the line for too long that I don't feel like it's a leap. I think there should be a Corrosion attack for Poison similar to what Freeze Dry is for Ice and Water so that Poison types get to play the game. Kind of the Salazzle approach but directly valuable. And still on the subject of Steel, I straight up don't think that it should resist Dragon. Dragon's value has already been taken down by the existence of Fairy, and my proposed changes would increase the viability of standalone Ice type Pokemon which would further diminish the presence of Dragon types. I think Steel could take than nerf and overall Dragon would continue to lose standing. Bug type is the grand question. I tbink it obviously needs help, but I don't think there is much to be done that is philosophically sustainable by playing with the type chart. Frankly I think the issue with Bug type pokemon is historic, as they were designed as things that evolve soon but plateau quickly, an earlygame-y type. I think the answer is just better pokemon with better stats, better moves and better abilities. Kinda what Wolfe ascribes to the dragon type in this video. Or some kind of interactive mechanic, like a "weather" that improves Bug pokemon in specific ways. They need greater work than just type tinkering.
I would argue that Poison could be placed higher than Rock. Personally, poisoning is more annoying to me than sandstorm since there’s a lot more ways to deal with a sandstorm than there is to deal with being poisoned. Poison types get rid of toxic spikes just by being that type. But then again, I play singles more than doubles, so this could be why I think of it this way.
Changes I would make to the type chart (maybe add sound or cosmic types? Idk) Steel: loses resistance to flying and maybe grass, gains electric weakness Fire: maybe add a weakness to flying as it’s putting out the flames? Weakness and resisted by Cosmic if that’s ever a type Water: add weakness to ice and comic/sound if those become types Grass: resists sound (maybe immune?) Electric: sound would become immune to electric attacks due to amplification Ground: weak to sound because of vibrations Ice: resists cosmic and is super effective against water Rock: resists cosmic but probably weak to sound Fairy: weak to sound and resists dragon instead of being immune Dark: now resists psychic instead of being immune Psychic: MAYBE good against steel because of telekinesis Bug: immune to sound (also give it an immunity to confusion like Wolfe said) Flying: no longer resisted by steel and maybe deals super effective dmg on fire types Fighting: maybe weak to sound because of concentration? Ghost: N/A Normal: N/A Poison: good against sound because of a sore throat and resists it Dragon: fairy no longer is immune to it Feel free to make changes in replies
Wolfe comin' through again! Fantastic content as always. Thank you for the time and effort you always put into your work to bring us these amazing videos!
I started realizing the flaws of dragon about a weak ago just on a matchup level. Most of the great dragon pokemon are dual type which is why most of us put it higher but the addition of fairy definitely knocked it down a peg
Something you might find interesting: Normal type is really good in Pokémon go pvp. With only 3 slots for a team, having a type that is only weak to one other type is quite good.
This man is out here spitting the truth, The dragon type has been getting propped up by its common resistances and the fact that almost all pokemon that get it are absurd statstick. It hits a lot of stuff neutrally, But so do flying and physcic. Just like Flying is propped up by its ground immunity, Dragon its propped up by its resitance to 4 of the most common types around.
Imagine how bad Wolfey would wig out when he got to Steel if the resistance to Dark and Ghost never got removed....I shudder at the thought. Great video as always Wolfe!
Pretty much agree with everything said. However, I'd still knock fire down a couple of ranks. Water and ground types are extremely common and ground and rock are two of the most common move coverage types. That means there's a lot of things that can suitably deal with them. Immunity to burn is nice though, even if many fire types are more special attackers.
I feel like that aspect matters way less this generation because fire types usually tera to get rid of those problems similar to how ice types got bumped up as a type this generation for that very reason
As a fan of the physic type, it’s sad to see it go from the strongest type in the game, to insultingly mid. Removing steel’s resistance to it would be a good balance for both types and it even makes sense logically.
Great video. 👍🏻 Solid improvement to Ice Types. It still needs resistances to Flying, Water and Dragon, but it’s a start with the Snow Buff. This could finally give Pokémon like Articuno, Alolan Ninetales, Alolan Sandslash & Kyurem more competitive play. Let’s pray Ice gets more buffs.
Hey Wolfy thanks for putting consistently entertaining videos I've got a video idea for U where U rank a few of the competitive strategies that teams are built around keep up the great work
Fire is my absolute favourite type, to see it in 2nd place makes me ecstatic. And this video helped so much with organizing the gym order for my fake Pokemon region. Thanks a ton Wolfey, this video had to be made and I'm happy it was made by you!
I think another thing to note is that I feel like this tier list kind of changes up a bit from doubles vs singles Since in singles having immunities and resistances are more important compared to doubles While in doubles having good offensive types are more important compared to singles
Fire/Ghost is becoming one of my favorite types because of how much offensive and defensive coverage it has. It's kinda eye opening to show me how good these types are.
I think one major upside of the Psychic type is its coverage. A lot of Psychic types get Shadow Ball, Charge Beam, Dazzling Gleam, Energy Ball, you name em.
At this rate next week Wolfeys gonna roll up with "I ranked every double typing and terra combo in Scarlett and Violet" and we aint even gonna be surprised
Why do I think this is gonna happen.
He already did every double typing lol
I mean it's only 5832 combinations to go over.
@@hamdepaf6686 exactly, thats the spirit
18^3
Only 54!
A couple of thoughts:
1) Flying being immune to ground pulls an insane amount of weight in balancing the type chart.
2) I've found Tera grass to overperform. Grass perfectly covers the weaknesses of Fire, Water and Electric, while also hosing Amoongus & Breloom.
3) Psychic, Ice and Normal are all still paying for their Gen 1 sins. (Especially green's Blizzard with 90% accuracy and a 30% freeze chance.)
Yeah look at Zygarde Complete. It literally needs zero coverage move, because Thousand Arrows neuter Flying's advantage over Ground, and good Bug and Grass Pokemon typically have secondary typing that is weak to Ground, meaning Thousand Arrows alone hit almost the entire metagame with neutral damage, and hit a lot of great type for super effective damage
It’s unfortunate that psychic and normal got destroyed so badly for having been broken in gen 1.
Hell, I’m guilty of still seeing psychic as the ultimate type because of the trauma of amnesia Mewtwo.
@hoanganphanle4584 Power creep on a 20yo franchise has to end up looking like that if they want to keep upping the hype with each release, though.
It is what it is. Got many issues myself with the franchise and their owners more specifically, but not this one.
@@hoanganphanle Not my boi Shedinja, he's immune to that nonsense
And Dragon is still paying for Gen 5's Draco Meteor spam sins. Not only did it get nerfed but fairy types completely neutered it.
Never realized how great fire is defensively. That was genuinely a shock. It's not steel by any means but it unironically comes closer than most other types0⁰0
Same, I've been playing pokemon for over 10 years, even competitively sometimes, and I was surprised to see how many resistances fire had
It's probably because of how strong/common It's weaknesses are.
Poison be like: Am I a joke to you?
There's a few issues that make Fire not actually that great of a type defensively, despite its number of resistances.
- A few of its resisted types are usually paired with another type that Fire is weak to. For example, most Steel types run a Ground move as coverage, so Fire fears them anyway.
- All of its weaknesses are very significant, with Earth and Water being two of the most common offensive types, and Rock weakness resulting in large Stealth Rock damage.
- Most fire Pokemon tend to have Glass Cannon stat spreads and movepools, so you rarely see fire types used defensively.
- Fire doesn't pair too well with other types defensively, always leaving around important weaknesses. For the few types that do match nicely to a point, they're actually extremely uncommon pairs, one of them actually didn't exist until gen 9 (Fire/Grass with Scovillain)
Looking quickly at the list of fire types, I can recognize these pokemon that have been good defensively: Incineroar, Heatran, Primal Groudon. Incineroar is good thanks to Intimidate and good defensive stats, but still has important weaknesses. Heatran is the one typically used in stall teams since it has a huge lot of resistances and its weaknesses are covered by other typical stall Pokemons, but being able to land an Earthquake on it still shuts it down instantly. Primal Groudon is a special case since the pair has only two weaknesses, one of them being double weak to Water, but its ability nullifies that huge weakness. For all of these cases, they don't have any recovery move, and value their offensive side. Without support from their allies (leech seed, Defog, etc.), you can easily wear them down over time and eventually take them down.
@@DaikoruArtwin Defog is pretty trash in VGC tho.
i think it’s important to note the immunity to Burn that fire types have. tera fire on physical attackers like garchomp and annihilape are pretty common because you can’t be burnt at all, and this makes fire such a good type defensively in more ways than just resistances.
For garchomp specifically, it also turns his 4x weakness into a resistance, which is pretty nice to say the least
I’ve been an avid ice lover for quite a long time and my friends always bullied me for it, so I’m glad the type is slowly improving.
At a glacier's pace, you might say.
It's always been a great offensive type, defense however..
@@yamiookami nIce
Well, ice types' greatest buff is that they don't have to be ice types anymore...
Thematically, ice should have been resistant to normal and flying (as rock and steel) since day one. Water and dragon could also be discussed.
Oh, I've actually thought about this. So there are a couple reasons Cyclizar was probably made Dragon/Normal
- at surface value, it really is just a large lizard Pokemon. If anything, the Dragon type feels more tacked on than the Normal type does.
- it helps distinguish it from Koraidon and Miraidon. Since they're both Dragon plus a secondary typing, it makes sense that it has a second typing of its own, but since it's a more basic version of the two legendaries, it's just Normal.
It's the poster child for a tera blast user
@@omnomnom504Glimmora:
@@MorrisPXG I'm not sure what you're saying.
Think of it as if you are a video game designer. Pokemon is mostly for kids and there are new players with every generation. Cyclizar is normal for the same reason the starter type Pokemon like Rattata and Pidgey are normal. They are tutorial mons with default attributes for the player to learn the game with. Cyclizar isn't amazing but he has STAB with Terra blast and is good with literally every Terra type. That's the point. It's a new player's first Terra blast user.
You train up the cool dragon mon and it works in almost every situation with normal type moves and you don't have to worry about the details. I remember my Charizard in my Pokemon Red game I played as a kid had such bad moves his only good move was seismic toss. Pokemon is not a game you need to min max to enjoy. I didn't have flamethrower, but I still beat the elite 4!
Also, to be fair to the Ice Type, Freeze-Dry is super effective against water, so an offensive resist actually becomes a super effective move which is really nice.
Yeah, imagine other such moves:
- A Fire move so hot, it's super effective against Water because it literally makes water evaporate.
- A Grass or Bug move that involves sharp thorns/mandibles, severely hurting anything that tries to eat them - super effective against Flying
- A Poison move that is actually not toxic but rather corrosive, becoming super effective against Rock, or maybe even Steel.
The list could go on and on, you can imagine.
@@asmodeus58XX I don't think all of this would be a good idea, but I love the poison one. In order to make poison more viable/interesting as a type I think it would be awesome if they gave it a bunch of moves with some weird and wacky effects, rather than its entire type being so linked to the poison effect. Maybe an acid rain weather condition, or a status condition that decreases stats. Poison could become a really decent support type.
@@mattparnall4148acid rain, decreases the def and SP.def of steel types by 50%, there you go lol
Kinda crazy that steel used to have 11 resistances and 1 immunity, if steel did not lose the resistences to ghost and dark steel would be beyonde broken
Isn't that 12 resistances and 1 immunity?
@@eef99yy it resisted ghost and dark from gen 2-5 and then lost those resistences in gen 6 but gained a resistence to fairy in gen 6
I think it's still broken. They need to take away two more resistances, at least.
@@Seetiyan honestly taking away a grass resistance both makes sense and would be fair.
And it was with 17 types. Steel had resistences/immunities of 70% of the types. Steel is so good defensively that honestly, being a duo type steel is often worse than a solo type steel (often, not always).
Dark type is slowly getting amazing
yeah XD
It’s only gonna get better when fairy gets a nerf one day too
Dark and Ghost are like the new Dragon haha and what Normal wishes it was.
Getting amazing? In gen 5 it was absolutely dominant and it's the reason why fairy got made other than to counteract dragons
@@M.W.2 We all know the real reason fairy was made was to add ANOTHER resistance to bug, because you know bug is simply so powerful it needed another type to wall it.
Fun Fact: Before Gen 6, Steel was even more broken defensively as it also resisted ghost and dark.
Kinda, but the fairy resistance and offensive presence it gained in exchange is only getting better with each new game
@@GKoopa Not right now though. Like the only times it truly comes in useful is against Flutter Mane, Valiant, and maaaaybee Slyveon but we'd be stretching it a bit. A lot of Fairies were cut this gen
i realized this in my heartgold nuzlocke. HOW was this allowed
I'd hate to imagine a universe where Steel didn't get nerfed by the time Aegislash came into existence. That'd be terrifying.
Game Freak took away steel’s resistances to Ghost and Dark to prevent Aegislash from destroying the game.
Wolfey just became one of my go-to RUclipsrs to watch. I find myself waiting for his videos constantly
Same
Ye
great b-reel and no terrible youtuber humor while still conveying personality
Same
Ever since he got this new editor, his videos have all been amazing
The one type chart change I really wanted to happen this generation is making Bug resist Fairy instead of Fairy resisting Bug. Bug sorely needs to be resisted by less types, and having another resistance itself would really help it. Fairy wouldn't be hurt that much by this either. They could have even made Bug supereffective against Fairy. This would probably be too big of a change for them to ever make, but, Fairy already is only countered by two types that aren't known for offense, Bug being a counter to Fairy would balance both of those types better and I don't think it ever made sense for Fairy to resist Bug anyway.
I think it's very obvious at this point that Gamefreak /wants/ bug to be a bad type. They like using it as a type for when they want to make things intentionally worse. For example, early gym leaders, early pokemon, and strong attacks (see: Quiver Dance, First Impression, U-Turn). They probably won't change it because it makes designing things easier for them.
Personally, I'm campaigning for improvements to ice. Specifically, resisting Water & Fairy, as well as losing the steel weakness.
Reason: Bug has really good type combos (Electric & Steel), and can use those attacks for more consistent damage. Ice on the other hand is just a Nerf to a pokemon, and basically only exists as a move type, not a pokemon type.
@@simonteesdale9752 Your first idea with Water and Fairy i'm completely on board with, but your second take is awful imo. Steel only hits 3 types for Super effective with a lot of common things resisting it, so you basically are just adding more pain to an already mid offensive type. Like you wouldn't even be nerfing steel, just a handful of pokemon for no reason.
@@i_like_chomp6382 Fair enough. My issue with Steel is that in addition to being an insane defensive type, it's also a decent offensive one. (Mainly thanks to hitting fairy).
In my opinion, steel should be one of the worst offensive types in order to compensate for it's defensive capabilities.
@@simonteesdale9752 it already is. It's like a notch above Bug, Grass, and Poison. You don't need to compensate for anything, it's not like steel types are going to mow over your entire team, they won't. The only pokemon that run steel type moves are steel types themselves and they don't even have good moves to begin with (Iron Head and Flash Cannon aren't powerful enough)
In fact the reason Fairy was created was to not only balance Dragon but to buff Steel and Poison offensivley as well.
Steel doesn't need any nerf as of right now, it's not a problem. It's already weak to the three most common offensive types, that's what fundementally keeps it balanced and fair. Litterally every single offensive pokemon with access to Fire, Ground, and Fighting attacks will run them. That's part of the reason why even though on paper Steel is better defensivley than Fairy, it feels much harder to break through Fairies than it would Steels as they're weak to rarer attacks.
You and the team have single handedly gotten me into competitive Pokémon. I used to just play it casually but now you guys have come to help me realize how awesome it is from a competitive standpoint. Keep up the good work because it teaches us all so much while being very entertaining and thorough!
I feel like the steel psychic match-up should be flipped given the old trope of bending a spoon with telekinesis. Especially given that a bent spoon is literally the item that enhances psychic attacks
true
I’ve been playing Gen 1 lately on my old gameboy, and as a huge fan of psychic types, it was amazing having my favorite type actually feel strong and powerful. I completely agree with your comment. I’d honestly even say they should make psychic deal super effective damage to steel because of that idea, I think it would be fun, but I’m not a game designer and don’t know how that would play out
Mewtwo with a Spoon:a little spoonful
Having Fairy be weak to Bug or AT LEAST lose its resistance to it would be such an obvious and welcome change to the type chart that I can't imagine GameFreak haven't thought of it yet. Clearly, they prefer buffs that leave the chart alone, like what they did with Ice this gen.
I'd argue that having Bug and Psychic resist Fairy would go a long way towards making the balance a tiny bit better.
@@Arcananine77 I agree on Psychic too. It's weird that we've reached the point where Psychic needs a buff.
I don't see why Psychic should resist Fairy. They should be immune to having their moves disabled.
@@EnriqueLaberintico interesting suggestion! I also had an interesting discussion once where I said Psychic types should be immune to confusion because of their steady mental constitution, but my friend said their reliance on mental power means confusion is actually extra risky for them. Idk what the right answer is, I can see both sides.
@@BrianStorm742 bugs can't get dizzy, so it goes to them instead.
To know that Steel used to have more resistances in the past and yet still is one of the best types till this day shows how insane Steel is
being rresistant to ghost and dark was so stupidly broken, and it didn't even made sense lol. I was playing sacred gold yesterday and when I pulled out spiritomb against a Steelix I remembered it and got obliterated.
Before Gen 6 Steel had resists against 11 types and an immunity to 1. It was weak to 3 types. That only leaves 2 types out of 17 that hit Steel for neutral: Water and Electric.
Steel hit Water and Electric for only 1/2 damage. So all in all Steel had either an offensive or a defensive interaction with every single other type in the entire franchise.
(Now Ghost and Dark have no special interaction with Steel. Neutral both ways.)
Dude, Ice had the greatest glow up of all time bruh. It didn’t get extremely good, but it went from literal garbage to pretty decent, and that’s pretty great
The move Salt Cure seems like it was made just to knock tera Steel down a bit since it's a free Ghost-type Curse against Steel and Water types
Doesn't only one evolution line have access to that move?
@@dayandere2669 Yep, just the Nacli line, who are pure Rock types, but seem pretty good (at least in singles, which is what I play primarily)
OH I DIDN'T EVEN NOTICE IT WAS LIKE CURSE.
Garganacl is pretty much Regirock as a non-legendary, but he certainly is on another power level.
Surprised to see Wolfe have Guardian Tales for backup. That said, this wideo is finally able to correct the misconception of some types being better than they really are. For one, the only surprise to me about Dragon was that Wolfey didn't call them "another better Normal Type" for how many types it tries to hit for neutral.
Guardian Tales is so fun. One of my favorites.
Honestly the ice buff seems pretty good and the ice types we got this gen are cool. I like cetitan and I hope to see a team with him from you or cybertron soon.
He already uploaded a video with and ice team.
@@Aahir. oh he did nice
Also Wolfey already took a Cetitan team to rank #1
Every other type: "Noooo you can't just resist literally everything!"
Steel: "haha funny metal go brrr"
Every other type: "Haha, fairies! Steel so op you lose your top spot!"
Tinkaton: "Haha, Tinkaton _smash!"_
Game Freak: We will take away steel’s resistances to Ghost and Dark.
Metagross: No!
Game Freak: But we’ll let you one shot every fairy type with super effective meteor mash and bullet punch, including the #1 gen 9 pokemon.
As an ice type fan, I'm enthralled. This is the best we've been since season 1. Seriously, back then it was one of the best types, but, since gen 2, it has been a downfall spiral. So glad to see ice 'mons doing much better. If only they could resist normal, flying and/or water... Gosh, that would be awesome.
Ice wasn't good in Gen 1 either lol. It's just Normal, Psychic, Ground, Water and then everyone else. People would apparently much rather use Snorlax Base 65 Special Blizzard than Articunos Base 125 Special STAB Blizzard. Although to be fair they weren't aasss bad so I guess it kinda was their best Generation in a way lol.
only reason ice is good is since they can get the defensiive abilities of steel. lol
i think it would make sense to resist flying, not sure about water. i think having lots of good offensive ice mons is a pretty good buff, it's meant to be a glass cannon type anyway
As an ice type fan, this puts shive smile on my face. Hope to see more of my favorite type in the next few years of comp.
This list is ridiculously good in my opinion. Back when the first list was released, I set out to mathematically form my own. I modeled types using an offensive and defensive value and recursively solved each using a dynamical system approach. It made some assumptions that were somewhat specific to singles, but nonetheless this is what popped out at the end of the day, in order of (offensive value, defensive value, overall value).
- bug: 70, 88, 71
- grass: 79, 92, 80
- poison: 72, 101, 83
- ice: 105, 67, 83
- psychic: 96, 83, 85
- fighting: 97, 90, 90
- rock: 110, 80, 94
- normal: 88, 103, 95
- dragon: 92, 102, 95
- electric: 104, 103, 104
- flying: 108, 105, 108
- dark : 111, 105, 111
- ghost: 112, 106, 112
- fire: 116, 102, 112
- fairy: 106, 114, 114
- ground: 125, 99, 117
- water: 115, 114, 119
- steel: 93, 138, 124
Happy to share my methodology if anyone is interested. My main takeaway from this is how much better type is defensively than anything else. Multiple standard deviations above the mean.Also, give ground more love. It is by far the best offensive type and offensive types benefit the most from tera.
Hey! I'd love to talk about type interactions with you. I wonder how much weather, terrain, special immunities* and entry hazard interactions would do for evaluating types.
It might be useful to add in something like an error bar to capture both the peak and the floor. Ghost doesn't have much to buff or hinder it specifically, whereas Fire can get destroyed by rain or rocks.
(*Special immunities being things like Dark types being immune to Prankster, Fire types to burn and Flying types to terrain effects and hazards except for Stealth rocks)
As a psychic type lover I am in Pain! Maybe the abundance of steel types makes it so Psychic finally gets an attack that hits steel for super effective damage (because, y'know, bending spoons and stuff)
Since they made Telekinesis unusable since gen 8, they should just change it to be a variation of Freeze-Dry. (Special, 70 power, 100% accuracy, Steel super-effectiveness)
I am giving you a sub this video was so good. The editing made me laugh for almost 10 minutes straight. The part where you talk about the rock types is hilarious. And now I am slowly getting into competitive Pokémon thanks to you!
Finally the fire type is getting the recognition it deserves. Having the 2nd most amount of resistances and having all of its weakness covered by having one grass move
On the topic of Fire types, you also forgot to mention Paradox Pokemon and how their abilities activate under harsh sunlight (the ones exclusive to Scarlet at least). The fact that most Paradox Pokemon are so good competitively is an indirect buff to Fire types overall because it means more players will be running Sun teams
The reason dragon is good is because it hits most Pokémon for unresisted STAB moves. It forces Steel and Fairy to be present on teams
Yeah but that's about it. Imagine if other types get the pseudo treatment 600 BST. Most would probably break OU and goes to Uber especially if it's ghost or fairy.
The same reasoning could also be reasonably applied to Psychic, which would "force" Steel and Dark types to be present unless you wanted to do the Psychic mirror match. And yet Psychic is one of the underpowered types atm
Steel and fairy would be in every team without dragons though , both are great types
As a fire type main, this is nice to see where it placed and the way Wolfey explained, it definitely made sense why it’s higher than it normally would be.
"As a fire type main" What does that even mean?
@@paulsmith9786 It must mean they're a fire type gym leader...
Steel is probably going to shape the game as it has in the past and in the future. Pokemon sometimes have their competitive viability live and die based on steel types, whether that's dealing with them offensively or defensively.
I'm curious about something for the flying type. You mentioned that flying type mons only tend to be good due to their secondary typing, which is definitely true. But, it might also be worth pointing out that apart from the two Tornadus forms, as well as Rookidee and Corvisquire (two unevolved mons), there are no other pure flying type pokemon. So flying alone as a type may not be super high up on this list, but since basically every flying type gets a secondary type, I think it's one of the more complex ones to truly rate. Not calling out Wolfey's placement for the type or anything, just thought it was something that might be worth considering.
It's also interesting because I remember reading somewhere that in gen 1 flying was created specifically to be a secondary type which is why there were no pure flying types until gen 5.
He is judging the types in a vacuum, so even though most os dragon types are really good, the dragon type itself isn't as good. The same logic applies to normal type.
Flying is still carried by the secondary types and the flying types he mentioned are only as good as it's SECONDARY types can take them.
90% of the Flying type pokemon are Flying/Normal though, which adds very little to differentiate from pure Flying.
@@Dr._is_sleepy If we are only considering monotype pokemon than Flying is probably the second best type you can be below Pure Fairy. It has the meta defining Ground immunity with an incredible resistence to fighting. All it really needs to worry about is Stab Electric type moves seeing as though Ice and Electric coverage is generally rare and coveted for, and Rock/Ice types are rare as a whole.
From an offensive standpoint Flying is incredible, resisted by the already stated rare Rock types, Electric types which are usually frail. That leaves Steel types as Flying's biggest check but that's extremely managable.
Being a Flying type means you already offer something of value, it's why Skarmory and Corviknight are incredible. They're immune to EQ and are not weak to fighting. Some of the best type combinations and pokemon have Flying in them:
Electric/Flying - Zapdos, Thunderus
Fire/Flying - Charizard, Moltres, Talonflame
Ground/Flying- Landorus, Glisgor
Steel/Flying - Skarmory, Corviknight
Dark/Flying - Yveltal
Fairy/Flying - Togekiss
All meta defining mons from recent who mostly all have been dexited. Sorry if I'm ranting lol it's just that I really don't understand this Flying type slander lol.
Might have been an oversight to have steel have this many resistances when any pokemon can become a steel type. It was obviously made to be the defensive type for mostly non aggressive pokemon. Then Aegislash changed everything and dark got the pass. That might need to happen again in Ultra Scarlet & Violet 2, Isle of Tundra, Crystal version.
I think normal does have a place at least a little higher, as having only one weakness is pretty big, and only being resisted by 2 types means that you can basically hit everything for normal damage and get walled less easily
Thing is , steel is the best type and normal type can't safely switch into anything, they do have some good moves though
Poison is still useful as a defensive teratype (and alternative to steel, which will eventually get checked by fire tera). IIRC some of the meta mons do use poison as their main defensive tera.
I think what holds ghost type back in comparison to fairy is the abundance of pokemon that can viably run sucker punch. The strongest priority move besides extreme speed is on so many strong pokemon that it shuts down many ghost types entirely since a lot of them tend to be squishy thematically
I love that Wolfey can basically make a type better or worse. When he says it's worse, people will use it less, and when he says it's better, people will use it more.
This goes even a step further. He's now placed fairy lower on the list, so steel is a slightly worse offensive type, and placed steel super high, so now fire, fighting, and ground are all gonna see more and more use, making them better types. These two changes might bring steel down a notch, but then the plethora of those 3 types will increase use Pokemon that beat them.
It's really cool how terastalization has allowed you to be able to evaluate each type independently of the pokemon attached to it. For example, Ghost Pokemon are generally terrible, but what if something like Garchomo was now Ghost? It's a cool twist for the type ranking charts.
Glad that Ice Type finally got buffed this generation and much higher on the list, let's hope future games give some mandatory buffs to types like Bug and Poison that they deserve!
Poison should resist and hit water super effectively. Yeah water can dilute poison but still, it’d be a small nerf to water but a massive buff to poison
hell yeah
It's less of a buff, more of a "tera gimmick lets them ignore their downside". They'll be worse again in the next game.
@@MrCheeze hail buffed them too. They’ll still be B tier next game
@@MrCheeze While Ice definitely benefits the most from Terastallization, the Snow buff will presumably still persist, so while the type rankings will change next gen, Ice is undoubtedly better than it used to be.
I agree more with this ranking of the types over your previous video. The reason why is because you looked more at the type itself rather then what I felt was you associating like; dragons are strong thus fairy is better because fairy beats dragon or this type with this type equals a strong combo thus the two types are better because they work well together.
I gotta believe that steel is getting huge changes next Gen after how powerful it is being made clear(finally) due to Tera.
I still don't understand why ice is resisted by water.
I think cuz ice cant harm water in any way and in a mortal battle the ones that get damaged is the ice, idk thats my logic xd
Ice should resist water too because if you pour water in a very cold environment, it’s gonna eventually freeze.
I’m just happy the ice type is getting better! Hopefully it can see more play now! Imagine the 50% boost to defense in snow and also setting up aurora veil!
1. Steel
2. Fire
3. Water
4. Fairy
5. Ground
6. Ghost
7. Electric
8. Dark
9. Dragon
10. Fighting
11. Grass
12. Ice
13. Flying
14. Psychic
15. Rock
16. Poison
17. Normal
18. Bug
thanks mate
I'm surprised by the low ranking of Flying. I understand why you put it so low. I think I would ranked Ground higher than Fairy. Fire has been lowkey getting better or at least getting recognized. I think a lot of the stigma Fire had was due to its Stealth Rock weakness in Singles. Great video world champ.
Fire also dislikes rain a lot of the time. Flying is immune to entry hazards (besides rocks) and terrain effects.
Would be interesting to have these sorts of things considered. Taking into account how conditional and common a certain interaction is.
Fck, Guardian Tales needs to sponsor more of these youtubers, what are they doing!!! Awesome video Wolfey crazy how the competitive scene can change in a few years due to typings.
Wolfe: I wonder what counterplay people will find for steel?
Players: S A L T C U R E
To this day I have no idea what gamefreak was smoking when they gave Steel types 11 resistances on day 1.
ive been watching your videos FOREVER and they just keep getting better and better, keep up the good work!
Fun fact: before gen 6, steel was the only type to have some non-neutral interaction with every other type. Gen 6 made it neutral with dark and ghost
They really should add frost burn instead of frozen. It would be a way to deal with special attackers, ice would be immune, and frozen isn’t fair of a status effect, it’s rng to thaw or a fire move which your opponent wants you frozen so they won’t use fire.
Also should electric be super effective vs steel? Metal/steel is a conductor something electricity takes advantage of
your explanation of putting my favorite type dragon was actually pretty good
there’s actually some dragons that has other types to make them immune to their weakness that’s another reason why dragon types use plot armor to be the best type
I think a lot of people underestimate how powerful a type that hits most Pokémon neutrally can be offensively. Think about it a bit is it better to hit half the Pokémon super effectively or all the Pokémon neutrally. When you get down to brass tacks types like flying, normal, dragon, and steel are good offensively because they can hit a lot of Pokémon neutrally for decent damage which makes them hard to switch into especially if you’re defensive checks have already been dealt with.
And that's why I consider Wolfe the best Pokémon content creator in RUclips. I love his manneurisms, knowledge and overall video ideias.
I would love to see more Nuzlock videos like kaizo, cause I laughed a lot. Keep on doing the great work. Hope you win Worlds this year
Game Freak really has to do something to keep steel types in check, but I don't know what they could do.
The last time steel got nerfed (removing resistance to ghost and dark) it simultaneously got buffed (with the introduction of fairy type). If they get rid of its resistance to psychic, that would help slightly but it also undermines the original point of steel: the type that resists psychic.
My best suggestion would be to make steel weak to electric. It uses the same logic as why water is weak to electric, and it helps buff electric (therefore ground, therefore grass and flying) types quite a bit.
Tbh I'm pretty sure you could knock out two resistances out of their chart and Steel would still be a good defensive typing.
Tbh I don't think Steel needs to resist psychic anymore. Dark and Steel were introduced partially to nerf psychic due to how dominant it was in Gen 1, but the type has just been getting worse and worse with each generation. Gen 1 benefited psychic the most due to mechanics (Special being one stat), bugs (Psychic being immune to ghost), and limited movepools (the only types it was weak to were Bug and Ghost neither of which had strong offensive moves to use) as well as the fact that the only ghost type in the game was weak to psychic and every bug type other than scyther and pinsir (who didn't even learn any bug type attacks) had horrendous stats.
Now psychic as a type is actually really bad, nothing about the type itself is scary or useful, I've never looked at a pokemon and thought it would be better if it had psychic as a secondary type, or been worried about dealing with an offensive psychic type on the enemy team. Any psychic pokemon that happens to be strong isn't strong because of its type, it's strong because of its stats/ability/movepool.
@@Necromitzu1 This post was written by Tapu Lele
@@i_like_chomp6382 oh you mean ms psychic surge privilege spam?
@@yungmuney5903 Pschic does nkt need any offensive buff whatsoever lol
Honestly as a life long pokemon fan since gen 3, its crazy how to see much the games changed. We never thought a lot of types would end up where they are
Balancing suggestions:
>Steel is no longer resistant to Psychic.
>Bug is now resistant to Psychic and Fairy, while hitting Fairy for neutral. They are also immune to confusion.
>Psychic types are now immune to having their moves disabled.
>Ice is now resistant to Water. Freeze is replaced with Frostbite.
>Normal types now have built-in Early Bird.
These are some great suggestions; the only thing I'd add is having Psychic resist Fairy and be super effective against it.
@@Arcananine77 Wtf that doesn't even make sense. Psychic being super effective against steel would make more sense than it being super effective against Fairy. Make it make sense.
@@nathanieljohnson5908 fr. Steel bending with mind.
@@nathanieljohnson5908 Way I see it, Fairies are all about whimsy and mischief, which Psychics would be uninterested in because they're too cerebral. "I don't believe in fairies!" if you will.
@@Arcananine77 I feel like the mischief part is more dark types. But fairy to some degree. I would say that makes sense, but since it's pokemon we are talking about, where fairies are very clearly real, I don't think it makes sense
Honestly, ground types might be my favorite (mostly because I love Mudbray)
They can be really powerful, most ground type Pokémon look really cool/cute, etc.
Bug needs to resist fairy instead of the other way around. Immediately making it better defensively and offensively while giving a tiny nerf to fairy. If you wana go a little farther I think bug should also resist dark and psychic. At least dark
I tried doing calculations on the type effectiveness of a pokemon with all eighteen types. Here's what I got:
Immunities: Normal, Fighting, Ghost, Ground, Electric, Psychic, Dragon, Poison
Quadruple resistant (0.125x dmg): Grass
Doubly resistant: None
Resistant: Ice, Bug, Dark, Steel
Normal dmg: Fire, Water, Flying, Fairy
Weak to: Rock
Doubly weak: none
Dragon, Psychic and Normal, the “we’re only good because our members are good” trio. 🤣
"At least we're carried by enough Pokemon to make a full team."
Meanwhile Bug:
@@EnriqueLaberintico Drapion (not a Bug-type but evolves from one), Scolipede, Heracross, Pinsir, Vikavolt, Orbeetle, Rabsca, Scizor, Kleavor, Lokix, Centiscorch, Volcarona, etc.
Its REALLY bizarre to me that Poison is such a good _defensive_ typing, despite poison itself being known for being really good at killing things... Its also strange that Rock sucks as a defensive type because of how many weaknesses it has, despite rocks being "rock solid" and known for being tough to break.
Wow this channel slaps! I’m gonna subscribe, hit the like button, and ring that bell to never miss a video!
@HiILikePizza I don’t get paid, no 😢
The biggest luxury for my predominantly Rock/Ground teams I always make every new game is that SV seems to really not like Water types this Gen.
There is only one Pokemon with drizzle, who I never see when I'm online, and the water types who are here are either not dependent on Rain (Iron Bundle), other water-boosting Pokemon, or are scared of their now Top Tier counters (i.e. Meowscarada).
Dragón is actually good at offense because only 2 types resist it meaning dragón types usually hit very well the majority of the tier. Examples of this are Dragapult or latios spaming Draco meteor on the counter part steel and fairy are common types
Basically gets carried by high stats and high power Stab moves. It's not as good offensively as Ground, Ice and Water, because it doesn't threaten super effective damage while still often dealing neutral.
Not many mons would use Stab Dragon Pulse, let alone use it as non-Stab coverage.
Steel: gets better
Fire: gets better as a result
Dragon and Fairy: "oh no steel's a lot better, we're bad now."
Fairy: "Wait, I was only good because I hit Dragon types..." *perishes*
Once again Wolfe putting out heat. You deserve 1 mil
13:51 Ghosts are definitely good enough to land at sixth spot in this list anyways because every singles and doubles player is currently screaming Flutter Mane right now.
In Scarlet and Violet I feel like they are using a lot more Ghost types, and some are ACTUALLY good.
I’m glad to see Ghost getting some love. It’s my absolute favorite type, and its damage is super useful. It’s probably the best possible single coverage move you can have, and is a part of one of the few two type combos that can hit everything either neutrally or super effectively (fighting and ghost, ice and electric just to name two of those).
I think flying is a pretty good type because as you said many pokemon benefit from the ground immunity.Tornadus is the only flying type pokemon without a secondary type.
That's not true. Rookidee is also solo flying
@@oliversmithlawrence but rookidee is not the fully evolved form
If it were in my power, I'd make changes to typing, not to fundamentally alter the power balances in the chart (e.g. make bug an A or S tier type), but to reduce some things that feel like edge cases of unapproachable.
For example, I'd make Ice both resist Water and do super effective damage to it, which is a twofold buff to Ice and a nerf to water, which seems like a stable monster across the years. On the topic of Ice, I'd also make it super effective against Fire. To me, philosophically you could have made the argument since the beginning that Ice and Fire could have been mutually supereffective, and I think that's a really interesting dynamic that is a nerf to Fire and yet another bump for Ice. Ice is a type that suffers defensively, and the snow change while good doesn't fundamentally fix the problem because weathers are multipokemon strategies. Different to sun or rain, there is no cross-class benefit to snow. There is no Clorophyll, there is no Hurricane or Thunder that diversifies snow comps, so many pieces in your team tend to be vulnerable to the same things, which makes them hard to pilot and fairly onedimensional. Changes like this embrace that, Ice is going to be a poor defensive type, but improving its already decent offensive value to hit both fire and water (remove Freeze Dry, obviously) would make the type have an interesting tradeoff for bad defensive properties.
I think Psychic should do super effective damage against Steel, with Kinesis being the philosophical proof of concept, although in Japanese the Psychic type is more the mentalist/occult/astral type than the psychokinetic relationship that prevails when saying Psychic in English and other languages. Still, it has played the line for too long that I don't feel like it's a leap.
I think there should be a Corrosion attack for Poison similar to what Freeze Dry is for Ice and Water so that Poison types get to play the game. Kind of the Salazzle approach but directly valuable. And still on the subject of Steel, I straight up don't think that it should resist Dragon. Dragon's value has already been taken down by the existence of Fairy, and my proposed changes would increase the viability of standalone Ice type Pokemon which would further diminish the presence of Dragon types. I think Steel could take than nerf and overall Dragon would continue to lose standing.
Bug type is the grand question. I tbink it obviously needs help, but I don't think there is much to be done that is philosophically sustainable by playing with the type chart. Frankly I think the issue with Bug type pokemon is historic, as they were designed as things that evolve soon but plateau quickly, an earlygame-y type. I think the answer is just better pokemon with better stats, better moves and better abilities. Kinda what Wolfe ascribes to the dragon type in this video. Or some kind of interactive mechanic, like a "weather" that improves Bug pokemon in specific ways. They need greater work than just type tinkering.
Interestingly enough, Normal Tera is pretty good to get a ghost immunity when needed
Anything that kills gholdengo is good at this point. Also I appreciated the kazuya meme lol
I would argue that Poison could be placed higher than Rock. Personally, poisoning is more annoying to me than sandstorm since there’s a lot more ways to deal with a sandstorm than there is to deal with being poisoned. Poison types get rid of toxic spikes just by being that type. But then again, I play singles more than doubles, so this could be why I think of it this way.
Changes I would make to the type chart (maybe add sound or cosmic types? Idk)
Steel: loses resistance to flying and maybe grass, gains electric weakness
Fire: maybe add a weakness to flying as it’s putting out the flames? Weakness and resisted by Cosmic if that’s ever a type
Water: add weakness to ice and comic/sound if those become types
Grass: resists sound (maybe immune?)
Electric: sound would become immune to electric attacks due to amplification
Ground: weak to sound because of vibrations
Ice: resists cosmic and is super effective against water
Rock: resists cosmic but probably weak to sound
Fairy: weak to sound and resists dragon instead of being immune
Dark: now resists psychic instead of being immune
Psychic: MAYBE good against steel because of telekinesis
Bug: immune to sound (also give it an immunity to confusion like Wolfe said)
Flying: no longer resisted by steel and maybe deals super effective dmg on fire types
Fighting: maybe weak to sound because of concentration?
Ghost: N/A
Normal: N/A
Poison: good against sound because of a sore throat and resists it
Dragon: fairy no longer is immune to it
Feel free to make changes in replies
Wolfe comin' through again! Fantastic content as always. Thank you for the time and effort you always put into your work to bring us these amazing videos!
I started realizing the flaws of dragon about a weak ago just on a matchup level. Most of the great dragon pokemon are dual type which is why most of us put it higher but the addition of fairy definitely knocked it down a peg
Wolfey, could you do an in depth guide on how to use the new meta Pokémon (Goldhengo, Annihilape, Maushold, etc) for your next video?
he explains a lot of details in "How I became the #1 ranked player in Scarlet and Violet".
Do the opposite how to use the other gen 9 mons
Fire types in singles where stelf rox exist: only heatran is OU and talonflame when galewings wasnt nerfed.
Fire types in doubles format :
Dragon is very similar to ghost in that it hits so much for neutral damage and that’s why it is a good type
Something you might find interesting: Normal type is really good in Pokémon go pvp. With only 3 slots for a team, having a type that is only weak to one other type is quite good.
This man is out here spitting the truth, The dragon type has been getting propped up by its common resistances and the fact that almost all pokemon that get it are absurd statstick. It hits a lot of stuff neutrally, But so do flying and physcic. Just like Flying is propped up by its ground immunity, Dragon its propped up by its resitance to 4 of the most common types around.
We all knew Steel was gonna be GOATed the moment everyone realized they could just terastalize into steel for its resistances.
Every single Gen Dark only becomes stronger with buffs
Imagine how bad Wolfey would wig out when he got to Steel if the resistance to Dark and Ghost never got removed....I shudder at the thought. Great video as always Wolfe!
Pretty much agree with everything said. However, I'd still knock fire down a couple of ranks. Water and ground types are extremely common and ground and rock are two of the most common move coverage types. That means there's a lot of things that can suitably deal with them. Immunity to burn is nice though, even if many fire types are more special attackers.
I feel like that aspect matters way less this generation because fire types usually tera to get rid of those problems similar to how ice types got bumped up as a type this generation for that very reason
Fire is better than some people give it credit for. I'm glad it's ranked so high.
As a fan of the physic type, it’s sad to see it go from the strongest type in the game, to insultingly mid. Removing steel’s resistance to it would be a good balance for both types and it even makes sense logically.
Tapu Lele would go crazy, better make Bug resist Psychic meanwhile!
Great video. 👍🏻
Solid improvement to Ice Types. It still needs resistances to Flying, Water and Dragon, but it’s a start with the Snow Buff.
This could finally give Pokémon like Articuno, Alolan Ninetales, Alolan Sandslash & Kyurem more competitive play.
Let’s pray Ice gets more buffs.
Hey Wolfy thanks for putting consistently entertaining videos I've got a video idea for U where U rank a few of the competitive strategies that teams are built around keep up the great work
Thats a great idea
Fire is my absolute favourite type, to see it in 2nd place makes me ecstatic. And this video helped so much with organizing the gym order for my fake Pokemon region. Thanks a ton Wolfey, this video had to be made and I'm happy it was made by you!
I think another thing to note is that I feel like this tier list kind of changes up a bit from doubles vs singles
Since in singles having immunities and resistances are more important compared to doubles
While in doubles having good offensive types are more important compared to singles
4:14 the only case I see using it in is if they switched into a faster ghost type
Bug maybe the worst type but Bug takes the #1 spot for most realistic creatures, animals in the universe.
Which is probably why it’s the weakest. Pokémon is the stuff of fantasy.
Fire/Ghost is becoming one of my favorite types because of how much offensive and defensive coverage it has. It's kinda eye opening to show me how good these types are.
I think one major upside of the Psychic type is its coverage. A lot of Psychic types get Shadow Ball, Charge Beam, Dazzling Gleam, Energy Ball, you name em.
and occasionally Thunderbolt and Focus Blast
From the moment I understood the weakness of my ice type, it disgusted me. I craved the strength and certainty of steel.
People keep over rating Psychic types because of our collective trauma from them dominating Gen 1.
WOLFY F-IN LOVE YOU MY GUY FOR GETTING A SPONSOR LIKE THAT