Cessna 152 & Piper COLLIDED MID-AIR at Farmingdale, NY
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- Опубликовано: 7 май 2024
- On October 21, 2007, at about 1753 eastern daylight time, a Piper PA-32R-301, N43450, registered to a private owner, operating as a 14 Code of Federal Regulations (CFR) Part 91 personal flight, and a Cessna 152, N4672M, registered to AADH Inc., operating as a 14 CFR Part 91 instructional flight, collided in flight at about 1,150 feet, in the vicinity of Republic Airport (FRG), Farmingdale, New York. Visual meteorological conditions prevailed and neither pilot filed a flight plan. Both airplanes received substantial damage and landed without further incident at FRG. The Piper commercial pilot and one passenger reported no injuries. The Piper flight originated from Poughkeepsie, New York, on October 21, 2007, at 1715. The Cessna student pilot reported no injuries and the flight originated from Groton, Connecticut, on October 21, 2007, at 1700.
• Cessna 152 & Piper COL...
Full Story:
planecrashmap.com/plane/ny/N4...
NEWS:
www.aero-news.net/index.cfm?d...
NTSB Probable Cause
The failure of both pilots to see and avoid while maneuvering in VFR conditions resulting in a midair collision. Contributing to the accident was the local controller's failure to properly identify conflicting traffic.
The ATC audio is downloaded from Liveatc.net
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#midair #aircrash #cessna #aviation 
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The controller seemed to be doing a good job with lots of traffic. I don't know the procedure, but it seems that a slow airplane was to report left downwind and then a fast airplane was to report left downwind. The traffic warning given the 152 at 11:00 and a half mile, if the PA-32, would have put the PA-32 ahead still going west (if turning downwind). Yet, they came together? Was the angle such that the controller didn't see that the PA-32 was actually overtaking the 152? Was the PA-132 in a right turn with his belly up toward the 152? Did the 152 right wing block the student's view of the higher PA-32? The controller communicated as required after the MAYDAY. The PA-32 was fine with his communications after the MAYDAY, but communication by him was not required. The student in the 152 did fine with his no communication after the collision. He was aviating, which is a much higher priority than communicating. Good job after the collision all around. Poor job seeing and avoiding all around, but an overly busy tower controller was a major factor. This was dense traffic. Tower has worked my pipeline patrol 172 around major airports and across parallel runways at 200' AGL in heavy airline traffic, but 200' is only traffic very near the threshold.
1. N43450
2. N4672M
3. N76076
4. N302AV
5. N 4317D
6. N12730
7. 15340 , Learjet and more.
Undoubtedly a busy day for him to work.
❤
that pattern seemed rather a mess though.... not a comfortable piece of airspace to be in for sure!
Usually in a plane vs plane scenario we end up with no winners. Just incredible that we had two winners here.
That controller should get a medal (or at least a steak dinner) for how well he handled that, and the pilots of both planes need to avoid any risky behavior for a long time cause their guardian angels are hella tired right now and need to recover.
I have flown at most of the high volume and mixed use airports in the country and can easily say that the controllers at FRG are amazing and do an incredible job of herding cats. Kudos to you guys, and the beer is always on me when I see you.
Both those pilots should buy a lottery ticket.
It was in 2007, so perhaps their luck has averaged out by now.
That controller did great work in a complex situation! 👍🏻
Woo! It's rare you hear everyone make it after a collision. Poor student having their first solo scrubbed too.
After all, it was a good decision not to go for solo. I think 💭
@@Flight_Follower oh 100%. Just felt bad for the student (in addition of the folks involved with the collision).
The student pilot was not seen at the flight school ever again! 😜
I did my pilot licence training at FRG. I had a very close encounter with another aircraft as I was entering the 45 deg to a right down wind. With my instructor on board. As we turned left, checking and was surprised that there was a Cessna about 50 yards away to my left. He had apparently come behind and was now turning inside my turn to the right downwind. I do not recall the ATV conversation. I banked right and called the tower, did a 360 and rejoined the pattern.
Well done to the ATC 👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾excellent job
Damn fine controller it’s pretty obvious
Agree 👍
NO! Controller failed miserably to point out an obvious traffic conflict.
@@HeadTesterSerperation services may or may not be provided. Collision avoidance in VFR ultimatly is the responbility of the pilots.
@@HeadTesterhe did point it out. Go back and listen!
Extremely good air traffic control. What went wrong?
That Piper pilot identified himself as a Cessna at least until the mayday call. If his situational awareness was that poor, I can see how that likely would throw everyone off. Everyone would be looking for a high wing.
NTSB official transcript censored the word “Cessna” as “[unintelligible]” and threw the controller under the bus.
Great job by the controller.
Used to fly in there daily with a D-328, often got RA's, it's a bee hive... hate flying into Republic... don't miss it one bit.
Great job by the tower controller! Glad everyone was ok!
Can you do visuals like VAS aviation? The coms are fine but it’s also nice to see where planes are in the sky.
Wow, so they gave partial fault to the controller? I thought the controller did a fine job considering the traffic.
I also think that. Controller did excellent
Atc is there to help separate traffic. It’s his airspace and he’s definitely in part responsible just because it’s his airspace. I still see it as on the pilots to have good situational awareness and use see and avoid.
Always good to be listening carefully to all the other radio calls when on an approach to an airport. This way you can paint the big picture of who and what is where
Everything is the controller’s fault. It’s the controller’s fault if he didn’t call weather for the 5th time, it’s the controller’s fault if a VFR squawking 1200 makes a 180 on someone, it’s the controller’s fault if you crash into an obstruction where the light has been NOTAM’d out for 90 days but didn’t tell you about it. I’ve told all my trainees that it isn’t an airliner that is going to get you in court and that it is going to be a little guy. I don’t have problems with Cessnas - but most are not professional pilots and that’s fine - we all started somewhere. But it’s going to be the little guy that is going to get himself in trouble and then you’re going to be blamed because you told him the altimeter was .91 instead of .93 or didn’t mention that the altimeter was more than an hour old.
Why do you call it „fatal“ and why does the piper pilot call himself a cessna constantly?
To get more clicks
It's a mistake on our side. We have corrected it. Thank you for pointing that out
@Sniperbou551 corrected
yea, him calling Cessna (as a piper) is confusing to everyone--WTH?
I used to fly from that airport all the time, traffic control is confusing and downwind extends for many miles sometimes.
I'm a controller at FRG (not then 😂) and I might have photos of these aircraft after the accident.
Pls share us 😀
notify.flightfollower@gmail.com
What a great ATC comms
I saw the P.S.A. # 182 crash smoke from their 25 Sept., 1978 crash in San Diego, CA. I've been trying to knock some sense into people involved in aviation. Someday someone will actually listen to me in order to make aviation safer! Have a nice day! * Cav *
I’ve flown 302AV I got chills hearing.
That ATC was busy but keep this head on straight.
Low wing vs high wing. High wing couldn’t see above and low wing couldn’t see below. I bet you it’s gear of the Hershey bar clipping the wing of the 150. No chance they could have seen each other. That’s how the fuel tank ruptured in the Cessna
The 152 grew up....per your thumbnail. Looks like a Cessna 185 skywagon
Typical pattern mayhem. Inbound I align for tight base or long straight in depending on approach angle and traffic.
“A mile and a half” is a little over a runway’s-worth.
If I was that Piper, I’d have slowed way down with early flaps,
and if I was in the 152 I’d have landed long and with no flaps after hearing that radio call.
If the low-wing Piper was coming from the north to join a right downwind, he’d need to descend to pattern altitude well before trying to join the pattern on a left downwind for 19., just for visibility purposes. Or he’d be better off doing a midfield overhead and left descending teardrop to join a right downwind at pattern altitude. If I was coming from the south in that downwind and heard someone else joining the downwind, I’d have my head on a swivel. It seems weird to clear a plane that’s 10 miles north and above pattern altitude to join an opposing downwind 12 miles away, while others are on that downwind or turning onto it already. Seems safer to have him report a checkpoint or position nearing downwind, with some guidance on when to descent to pattern altitude. There was just too much trust and assumptions here, and not great SA on the part of those two pilots. Stuff happens, I guess, but often avoidable.
The ATC’s NY accent became obvious after the MAYDAY call. I can’t stand NYC and its surrounds , but I do have very good memories from KFRG.
Guy going out on his first solo 89D I'll bet he is going to keep his eyes active looking around when he flies from now on.
This is my home airport, it's absolute insanity to have any student solo in this pattern, KFrg has to be one of the busiest GA airports in the country
That’s a miracle! Poor first solo but maybe it wasn’t the right time for him to solo. He should have gave a read back on his taxi instructions tho.
Probably a good thing the solo didn’t go. I don’t think I would be comfortable doing a first solo right after that incident. I don’t think my mind would be clear enough and my nerves would be heightened.
Poor guy on his first solo!
Great controller.
This was in 2007, dug up an old video and rebooted it as his own.
Great job controller.
Mid-air collision is always an “accident” as per FAR
Not the first one at FRG.
ATC: "OK fellas, I got this " :)
Why are you calling it a Fatal ??????? Click bait :(
Corrected. Extremely sorry
This is why I use ADSB tracking…
After scanning through all of the comments below all I saw was most everyone congratulating ATC BUT NO ONE EVEN NOTICED THAT THE CESSNA WAS "NOT" A 152?????? The C-152 is a TWO place aircraft mainly used for training In fact the Cessna in the thumbnail is actually a Cessna 180, a 4 place aircraft with a Continental engine O-470 producing 225 to 230 horsepower depending on the year it was made as opposed to the Cessna 152 having a Lycoming O-235 engine producing115 horsepower. Reason for this information is the poster did NOT do his dew diligence in locating the correct aircraft. First thing that is quite obvious is the C-180 has a tail wheel and NOT a nose wheel and the C-152 has a NOSE wheel both are very visible in the photos. Bottom line, make sure your story is right and most important make sure your PHOTOS match that you have in writing. BTW, I have well over 12,800 hours of flying time and taught people how to fly retired airline pilot and also a aircraft mechanic. When it comes to aviation, there is not much I have NOT DONE ! ! ! ! ! ! !
Good for you.
You are the man!!! It’s an honor to have you commenting here!! Orville, Wilbur, Lindy, Yeager, Doolittle, Crossfield, Neil and Buzz, Lovell, all of their achievements pale in comparison to pilot with “well over 12,800 hours” and that has done (almost) everything...
My life is complete - thank you.
P.S. “DUE diligence” - not to be confused with dew diligence….as in the “temperature due point spread.” You’ll learn that when you break 13,000 hours.
89D: tool of the day. Trying to get takeoff clearance in the middle of an emergency response. Where do they find these goofballs?
If he was just up on frequency, he might not have known.
Wasn’t he the student on his first solo ?..if so I think calling him a goofball a bit harsh ..my guess he was absorbed preparing for his flight and missed the radio traffic..I recall my first solo being pretty intense .🤔
FRG controllers are the best❤️
they really are. that guys' voice is very familiar.
Any photos?
I couldn’t find any in open source. Link in the description of News and details of the incident
Probably texting and flying
Good part, he is alive!
this occurred pre texting i think.
But it wasn't a fatal collision..
Corrected
Flight Follower: you are runner up for Tool of the Day, using a 185 instead of a 152 for the thumbnail. Be better.
This is Cessna 4672, permission to land and request numerous rolls of toilet paper. Roger that.
Stop with the clickbait.
Corrected.
@@Flight_Follower no its not...
@HeadTester please recommend me a TITLE so that i can put it there.
@@Flight_FollowerI like the title
@chris56456 I think the title is okey with the content. Just wanted to make sure from @HeadTester