In Defense of Michael Bay's Optimus Prime | Talon Discussions | Video Essay
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- Опубликовано: 1 июл 2024
- Here it is, my in-depth look at Michael Bay's Optimus Prime and why he isn't the bad character adaption that he is made out to be. I look at his various controversial actions and lines of dialogue from each movie, the war as presented in the Michael Bay films, accusations of war crimes, and more!
Any copyrighted material in this video is the property of it's respective owners and no copyright infringement is intended.
Chapters:
0:00 - Intro
3:02 - Backstory of the Bayverse
3:46 - The 2007 movie
5:13 - Revenge of The Fallen
14:47 - Dark of the Moon
33:28 - Age of Extinction
46:56 - The Last Knight
49:57 - Brutality, war, and how it relates to Optimus
55:03 - The portrayal of the Decepticons
56:53 - War crimes
01:01:11 - The character of Bayverse Optimus
01:07:25 - Comparisons between different versions
01:15:42 - The Peter Cullen of it all
01:19:53 - Conclusion
The music in this video is "Addict (Instrumental)", "Just Breathing (Instrumental)", "Go Down Swinging (Instrumental)" by NEFFEX, "Silent Partner" by The Wrong Way, "Traversing" by Godmode, "The Whole Other" by Valley of Spies, "It Was a Time" by TrackTribe, "Planetary Paths" Joel Cummins and Andy Farag, "Chasing the Dragons" by Joel Cummins, Kris Myers and Andy Farag, "Asleep With the Sun" by Unicorn heads, "Early Oceans" by Freedom Trail Studio, "Global" and "Tangled" by Emmit Fenn, and "scifi" and "newdawn" from Bensound and can be found here: www.bensound.com/royalty-free
All images used in this video were from Google searches, Hasbro Pulse and the TFW2005 boards.
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#Transformers #optimusprime #optimus #megatron #MichaelBay ##transformersriseofthebeasts #transformersrevengeofthefallen #Transformersdarkofthemoon #Transformersageofextinction #Transformersthelastknight #studioseries #Bumblebee #BacktoBaysics #videoessay
Any copyrighted material in this video is the property of it's respective owners and no copyright infringement is intended
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Развлечения
In response to Prime killing The Fallen, you also have to acknowledge that Prime JUST WOKE UP FROM BEING KILLED. Like dude had to fight 4v1, managed to bring it down to a 1v1, was still highly anxious and in fight or flight mode, gets impaled in the back, shot, and left to die all while the last thing he sees is watching Sam get surrounded and for all intense and purposes, humanity going to be wiped out. All because he didn’t kill the Decepicons when he had the chance. Prime died full of fear, anger, and the feeling that he’d failed. Dude gets woken up and finds out he didn’t fail, but things are not any better. The world is balancing on a knife’s edge and he’s the only person able to save them. Try going to sleep knowing you got a big ass test for school in the morning, and being forced to sleep, only to wake up and find out you didn’t miss the test, but it’s happening RIGHT NOW and you’re in class surrounded by everyone. You’re gonna be franzled lol
Correction 3v1 but agree with what you said.
@@mohammadhossain9608Unless you include Sam cause ya know...he's kinda the reason why Megatron was able to backstab him. 😂😅
@@kennythetrend3688 True prime was concerned about him which gave megs an opportunity to stab him and blast his chest, i feel like the forest battle should be like the animatics where after killing grindor megs use this chance to stab him as he wasn't fast enought to react.
For real last thing dude felt and saw was himself being killed after a jumping and desperately tryna survive next thing you know the moment he wakes up he sees a doomsday device about to blow up the sun, same enemy and another he has no clue about while his comrades are literally fighting for him, dying, yelling and struggling to win
About the "Give me your face" thing. Ive seen people say and believe that what was ripped off was a mask, and The Fallens real face is what was underneath. And since all the primes are shown having a similar looking mask, that mask represents being a prime. So Robo Jesus removing that mask was actually him removing the title of "Prime" from the Fallen. Pretty cool.
Bayverse complainers: „Bayverse Prime is a psychopath and a murderer."
Talon Productions: „Time to find out."
Oh I'm sure they won't like what I have to say lmao
@Talon_Productions bro honestly I'm so tired of these types of complaints bro like if any other Transformers is different bro do you know G1 show a lot of brutal stuff too right? Even at one point authors had his gun pointed his gun on Spike because he was in a Decepticons body and the thing was he knew about it but because Spike was having a temper tantrum he shot him and after he was down he still pointed his gun on him I don't know why we all just can't get along bro I don't have a problem with any Transformers bro I love all of them I hope you do my boy justice
I notice that a lot of fans just have these negative opinions about bayverse prime only because of RUclipsrs who hate this optimus
@Crazinator Yeah I'm tired of it too, which is part of why I decided to make this video lmao. I hope that you enjoy the video!
@@Talon_ProductionsSuperb Video You blew this out of the park, and the haters can blow it out their Asses!
Optimus Prime did something Thor couldn’t do go for the head
Lmao yes!
Hahaha
And Chris hemsworth played both of them 😂
Bayverse haters: “This is not your franchise to rule G1 shall rise again.”
Talon Productions: “Not today.”
I rise u fall
😭😭
All of those “Michael Bay must be stopped no matter the cost!” Comments and similar ones like “This is the end of the road Michael Bay!” Might actually be the cringiest posts I have ever seen online. (Edit: The 1986 Transformers movie was great but not a masterpiece. Fight me.)
Neither will rise at all, there's better alternatives like Animated or Prime.
@@rockettbennett i'm honestly not a fan of most of the tf movies, i like the 86 movie tf1, dotm and bumblebee but the rest are mid. (i agree with your point, the only masterpeice is bumblebee. That is the perfect TF movie)
War law arguments users when genociding a densely populated city like shanghai or chicago would get you the death penalty anyways: 😧
Exactly the cognitive dissonance is insane
Yeah they'll seemingly excuse the bad guys but give Prime grief for stopping these genocidal monsters that have shown that they won't stop. Crazy stuff!
¿What do you want me to tell you brother? Either people are very hypocritical sometimes or they are really stupid for not thinking about that 🤦♀️
@@Talon_Productions I just want you to at least have some answers to the Dotm bridge scene. Megatron did pull the trigger and tried to fire off a shot, the only problem is, he didn’t cock the gun prior to attacking Sentinel. So, when Optimus takes him by surprise, in his haste, he assumed the gun was in fact ready to fire, he was obviously, dead wrong. You can even see Optimus correctly cock it before firing. As for Sentinel, his woundings from Megatron may have just caused him to go blind.
@@Optimaloptimus Optimus killed Megatron because he didn't believe Megatron's offer was genuine, they'd been fighting for centuries. Honestly I'd have killed Megs. Sentinel's death was more like an execution, sure he was wounded and not a threat, but he killed innocents, or at least enabled the Cons to do it, clearly not concerned for Human lives at all aside from keeping them alive for slaves, he sided with Megatron in this plan and thus deserved death for all he'd done, he didn't even show remorse for it on the moment of his death, still tryign to justify his actions, maybe that was what finally set his fate, Optimus let Sentinel, his mentor, say his last words, but the attempt to justify his actions sealed his fate, as Optimus said before killing Sentinel, "You didn't betray me, you betrayed yourself." WHen you look into the IDW Movie comics and add them as "canon", this makes the scene so much sadder, as Sentinel had taught Optimus these lessons he take to heart, Sentinel was basically his father, or the closest he had to one, only to see Sentinel do all this, Sentinel betrayed the very ideals he taught Optimus, and in the end showed no remorse for his actions. Optimus also doesn't make the kill quick, he let's Sentinel speak, says he reply, then solemnly executes Sentinel with quick rather humane headshot, as going for the body would have likely caused more pain and suffering.
Most people who complain about Bayverse Prime probably know nothing about military or war.
clearly none of you saw the video or else you would understand that, with that being said good day
Yeah exactly they think it's rainbow n sh!t XD
No, its just that optimus is supposed to be a nice guy and you don't really get the benefit of the doubt when you say things like " give me your face"
@@leonrussell9607 everything already explained
did you even watch the video?
even in rotb he is beyond "nice guy"
@@DaVibeCreator I haven't finished the video but I wasn't talking about ROTB, the fallen should definitely be killed but saying "give me your face" for no reason is definitely a bit odd
After how many years of being belittled, trolled, bullied outcasted for being a fan of the Michael Bay’s Transformers’s movie, this video restored back my love for Transformers again. Thank you Talon for being the light on the tunnel❤
You give me hope❤
Men are still good.
Of course, and thank you for checking it out! Really glad that you enjoyed the video and that I could help!
Bayverse Prime is the most realistic version of Optimus we ever had. He just made more sense than his other iterations. Think about it, your best friend just betrayed you, enslaved and took the lives of all your friends and it has been happening for millions of years. Of course at some point in time, you would want to give your enemy a taste of their own medicine to demonstrate what happens when you cross the line. Megatron and his army have crossed many, many lines and all of them have paid the price. Optimus desires peace and sometimes diplomacy is no longer an option. There are always casualties in war and there are always consequences to the actions of everyone.
Another thing you have to realize is that a lot of the Decepticons Optimus killed, needed to be put down.
Boncrusher killed a bus full of humans = remove his head
Demolisher ran over innocent humans = pop his eye out
The Fallen attempted to blow up the sun = remove his face
Sentinel Prime betrayed the Autobots, killed Ironhide, and attempted to enslave humans. Not to mention he brought Cybertron to Earth = blow his brains out
Megatron would’ve been spared in 2007 if Sam didn’t use the Allspark on him. He was spared in ROTF but in DOTM after his true colors were revealed boom = off with his head
Lockdown would’ve been spared if he kept his eyes on his mission: capture Optimus. Instead, he went after humans and threatened to kill them = sliced in half
You can also tell nobody actually watched the movies because Optimus Prime’s lines literally tell you he’s not a psychopath at all. He’s just very strict and a bit blunt sometimes but he is still the same Optimus we always knew. Honest, wise, brave, compassionate, true, you name it. I recommend people watch the movies again before they criticize Bayverse Optimus.
❤❤❤❤❤❤
Bruh! You Said It, Not the Optimus we Wanted, But the Optimus We Needed. I can't agree with you more, everyone you said was dead on. Well Said! Till All Are One My friend!
@@TheSorcererAhrimanahsul I’m glad to know there are people out there who understand Bayverse Optimus and why he is the way he is.
It is nice to see more like-minded people since the ones that complain about Bay Prime are such a loud crowd.
@@GalvatronStudios Absolutely. I loved the Bayverse , not just the figures which I thought was an Adults Toy that we never got as children I was born in 78 i watched all the epicness of Saturday cartoons and toy lines. BUT My favorites aspect of the Bayverse story line was an Adult Oriented and gave us how it SHOULD have been. I thought several times he gave way too much room for trouble so it only made sense that he started realizing "Something's Never Change", and MUST BE DEALT WITH! NOW Megatron was blood thirsty if Anyone was blood thirsty.
It's insane people think Megatron, the dude who attempted genocide on Earth TWICE BEFORE, was being sincere about a truce. Why do people just forget he declared that Earth was his planet???
It's also insane people got mad at Optimus for reacting angrily to watching a video of one of his closest friends be melted down by the people he sacrificed Cybertron for and used for parts for man made frankenstein like abominations. Like, do you want him to just be like, "damn that sucks. oh well." He didn't even kill anyone at the KSI base, bro literally told Hound to stand down when Hound wanted to shoot the head of KSI.
People can not like the gritty and edge to the bayverse, that's fine, but to claim Prime was in the wrong in these situations is crazy.
Also Optimus hitting TJ Miller is objectively the most morally justified thing he's done in the franchise
Oh hey. Love your iceberg vids my dude.
Because in the novel, which was supposed to be the canon ending originally, he was being truthful
REALLY‼️, I mean Megatron LITERALLY committed genocide in the "battle of Chichago" along with the other Decepticons when they PULVERIZED humans, ¿and people believe that Optimus is going to accept a truce with him?
They are completely crazy, ¿who in their right mind would trust Megatron when he murdered humans and autobots? not to be trusted in any way.
¡¡¡EXACT!!! OPTIMUS HAS EVERY DAMN RIGHT TO BE ANNOYED!
What humans did with the dead pieces of their comrades is simply inhumane and unforgivable (in my opinion).
I'm surprised he even kept his "calm" because the poor guy looked like he was going to have a mental breakdown at that moment when Joshua said they were "his technology" (I would have loved for someone to punch Joshua).
Also, ¿do people forget that Hound was ready to kill Joshua and the other humans? He was simply saved because Optimus told him no.
Dude, people really hate Optimus Bayverse for behaving like a real damn person would if he were in their place 🤷♀️.
@@kinglycrimsonNot to mention that this ending was changed because it was leaked, not because the filmmakers wanted to improve it.
REALLY‼️, I mean Megatron LITERALLY committed genocide in the "battle of Chichago" along with the other Decepticons when they PULVERIZED humans, ¿and people believe that Optimus is going to accept a truce with him?
They are completely crazy, ¿who in their right mind would trust Megatron when he murdered humans and autobots? not to be trusted in any way 🤦♀️
¡¡¡EXACT!!! ¡OPTIMUS HAS EVERY DAMN RIGHT TO BE ANNOYED!
What humans did with the dead pieces of their comrades is simply inhumane and unforgivable (in my opinion).
I'm surprised he even kept his "calm" because the poor guy looked like he was going to have a mental breakdown at that moment when Joshua said they were "his technology" (I would have loved for someone to punch Joshua).
Also, ¿do people forget that Hound was ready to kill Joshua and the other humans?
He was simply saved because Optimus told him no 🤌
Dude, people really hate Optimus Bayverse for behaving like a real damn person would if he were in their place 🤷♀️
Yeah! Optimus Prime is becoming more aggressive towards The Decepticons for a good reason.
Shattered glass optimus definitely showed what frickin war criminal is
Facts lmao
The guy was literally absolutely crazy in the comic ☠️
@@SUGARSWEET-pz2wx What did he do? I know this is Autobots bad and Decepticons good but seriously what did prime do?
@@mohammadhossain9608 You Don't want to know…
@@You_Cannot_Beat_Us. I can handle it, so what did he did.
I feel like Optimus getting more violent is just, an understandable downfall due to the events of the movies. His friends are dying one by one, and every time decepticons show up, more civilians are killed, eventually coming to a head at the battle of Chicago. And after that, with cemetery wind, it just gets even worse from there
Yeah it all makes sense when you look at the movies themselves and everything that goes on. Unfortunately, some people love to ignore context to make dumb arguments.
The moment when Joshua tells Optimus that they are no longer needed is honestly spark crushing. All the friends he lost, his home had to be sacrificed ,half of it ,so as not to damn another world who is innocent, and after millions of years of conflict, what did Prime get in the end: his remaining comrades were hunted down like dogs and their corpses were used for science abominations, the good they did for Earth was literally watered down to"we needed you, but now we can make you better so f..k off". But what makes this a bit better is that in spite of all this in the end, when Shaghai was attacked, Optimus , the supposed war criminal and psychopath, still chose to protect and save the humans in the end.
Yeah that scene is rough, for so many reasons but you're right! Despite it all, Optimus still came to help, I really do love Prime's story in AOE.
@@Talon_Productionsi LOVE that movie too
They're not _your_ property!
_They were my friends..._
It’s funny how IDW Optimus decapitates Galvatron and drops his head near the White House but Bayverse Optimus quickly kills rampaging Decepticons and is called a war criminal.
See, it's okay for him to be a war criminal as long as he looks like a cartoony red box.
@@spongeboymebob771As long as he looks like a lunch box it's fine! Geez. Don't you get it?
@@Zodiac3107 Of course, how could I have been so blind?
It's okay to change things up every so often, as long as everything stays the exact same, forever.
@@Zodiac3107Christ, i hate thr Genwunner's favouritism, it's good as long as it looks like G1.
To be "fair", those same people complained about prime's decapitation of galvatron in IDW as well. People weren't happy that prime annexed earth into the cybertronian "universal peace-keeping council" without hesitation or consideration for "earth's opinion".
All hail optimus was a pretty critically divisive arc after all, as people didn't like the idea that prime's morality and ideals were so directly tied to him holding the matrix. After optimus lost the matrix at the end of phase 1, he became a lot more flawed as an individual which I personally loved because it led to more interesting character introspection on what it truly takes to be a prime.
TLDR; people won't happy with optimus decapitating galvatron in IDW, arguing otherwise is doing so in bad faith. Bayverse prime is a more realistic take of optimus in the real world. A real war leader wouldn't behave too dissimilar from optimus in these movies so I can 100% appreciate this version for what it is. But he isn't the most ideal take of optimus; in the same way injustice superman isn't the ideal superman for most.
Do I find bayverse prime hyper-violent at times? Yes. Is he my ideal version of optimus? No. Do I think it's an interesting take on the character? Sure. Do I want more of this uber-violent, face-taking rendition of prime now that we're done with the bayverse? Not really. My main issue with this prime is simply his lack of consistency when it comes to his ideals. It borders on hypocritical. "Freedom is the right of all sentient beings" until the beings do something to piss him off. It just doesn't sit right with me. If you're going to do this take of optimus, don't use THAT line because it just doesn't fit this rendition of the character.
Optimus Prime is the greatest fictional leader in movies. Behind him is Steve Rodgers and Ceasar the Chimpanzee lol
32:50 THANK YOU!!! People keep saying Optimus is a bloodthirsty monster, but after he killed Megatron and Sentinel, at no point is Optimus "Happy" about what he did. He looks between both their corpses, looking tired, depressed, even the score at that point is showing that something massive and terrible had happened, and was not celebrating it at all. Optimus did what he had to do, but only because he was pushed. He begged and pleaded, even when his arm was cut off, but in the end, he realized that no one was going to listen to him.
EXACTLY, Optimus literally BEGGED AND PLEADED with Sentinel, he tried at times to change Sentinel's mind, but the dude literally cut off Optimus's arm and was just abotu ready to kill Optimus, OP was like a son to Sentinel, look how brutally Sentinel beat Optimus, plus at the end when he was injured, Sentinel had a chance to convince Optimus not to kill him, Optimus didn't immediatly do the kill, he let Sentinel speak first, and what did he say? He still in the end tries to justify his actions, showing no remorse for anything he did, he still tried to convince Optimus he was in the right. Then, OP says "You didn't betray me, you betrayed yourself", Sentinel was made very clearly to have been OP's predecessor and likely mentor, throw in the comics and this is made more clearer, Sentinel taught OP his morals, or at least layed enough of a foundation for OP to find his own, thus the line of "You betrayed yourself", Sentinel had once ben a good man, or at least in OP's perspective, but this film he saw a different Sentinel.
I think Presentation is the main the issue over what the film did; the kill shots are framed like awesome Slasher killer kills, not like someone making a hard desision for the greater good.
That isn't really how it is framed at all. Optimus double taps Sentinel and he immediately drops his shoulders in a sigh and we see him looking around, clearly not okay with everything that went down, and tossing the shotgun away in disgust. While the moment may have been cathartic due to Sentinel getting what he deserved, it was hardly framed as "awesome".
Another argument that can be made in favor of the fact that Optimus killed Attinger not out of revenge, but purely in order to save Cade, is that Optimus, when he saw them both, anxiously shouted out Cade's name, not Attinger's
For sure!
on the topic of war crimes, it's probably worth noting that there's a good chance that if those exist in Cybertronian law, they are entire different from how we define war crimes
problem with g1 fans is, they allways think optimus got to be allways positive, even its sooo unreal to be true. Optimus went the worst of worst of worst in his life. And NOONE would react positivelly at his possition. And by wishing and complaining about him not being nice, positive, hold his cool, they are hurting him,cause its not healthy to keep that all in himselve, and very hypocratic. Everyone could have total mental breakdown,but optimus? You realise how unhealthy that is? Even though it is JUST A FICTIONAL character to sell toys, but if you see him as character, he must have emotions, good and bad emotions,otherwise he would be just a machine without a soul. G1 FANS think of optimus like someone from humans. Everyone can feel sad had breakdowns, cry, scream, get angry, exept this one person. Do you realise how that person feel, to realise he got to hold it in himselve, because if he wouldn't, all those who are calling themselve the OG FANS of him, would abandon him, and leave him be. Here you can see the TRUE LOAYALITY. Those of use who go away if someone is changed, are not true fans, not true friends. You can put it in real life. How many times happend to you that people were happy by what you are doin, but right when you decide to do it your own and diferent way, they would turn against you, those who you called your fans, closest friends? THE TRUE FAN AND FRIEND WILL STAND BY YOU NO MATTER WHAT, he would even help you with what you are doin.
And the thing is if everyone around you likes you, you are doin something wrong, and you are not being yourselve, just someone they want you to be.
I admit bayverese its not the best of transformers, those movies got their flaws, but Im never leaving this continuity. BAYVERSE FOREVER.
Also I appologise if I made some grammar misstakes, Im not from english speaking country.
Also transformers are more than g1, so please if you dont like a certain continuity, dont be rude about it, just dont watch it.
And what would WE be if we all got the same taste of movies, music, food, etc... Just sooulles beings and nothing more. That is why its.allright to have diferent tastes.
Agreed af
This should be applied to Superman and DC comics in general.
Love it when actual detailed analysis videos on how the war crimes claims are really a stretch are put out
It’s difficult to sneak around liking this iteration of prime…
Yeah nobody should have to sneak around to like this character. The people that dislike this version take it too far.
@@Talon_Productions it went as far as my home address being doxxed-
@@gravitywithoutcontext wait really? what happened?
@@Talon_ProductionsI (mostly) dislike this version of the character, but everyone has the right to like or dislike this and all versions of the character for their own objectove or subjective reasons.
@@gravitywithoutcontextWait, people actually did that? What the hell is wrong with them?
I literally promised myself this morning that I wouldn't just binge random video essays. Well, guess I lied.
This video nails it. I e always considered Bay OP to be G1 OP but liberated from kiddy cartoon restrictions.
I've made a similar video like this a couple months back called "Bayverse Optimus Prime is not a psycho", not trying to toot my own horn, mines wasn't the best video but what I wanted say is that, I love that more people like you apprenticed these movies that I grew up on. This video honestly puts a smile on my face because it shows that people like yourself actually have time and effort to put into actually learning about these movies and look a them from a new perspective, instead of being annoying jerks on the internet, as a whole thank you for such a great video.
I think I remember seeing your video pop up in my recommended but I wanted to wait to watch it until I was done with my video so that I wouldn't be influenced by it! Definitely gotta check it out now! I, too, love that more people are saying positive things about these movies. Part of what I wanted to do with this channel was spread positivity about the Bay movies and make a sort of community for Bay fans so it is nice to see! I'm glad that you enjoyed the video, I've been passionate about this for a long time so I'm extremely happy to put it out there. Thank you for watching!
Bay gang
@@Talon_ProductionsThat's certainly very nice of you and despite me having more and more issues with the Bayverse as I think more of these movies and massively disagree with both of your takes on the subject, I definitely relate with the idea of wanting a place for people with hot takes to feel free to express them.
Despite me having already uploaded several comments as responses to what I believe are flawed defenses of Bayverse Prime, I would never want to take anyone's enjoyment of any piece of media away from them.
I wouldn't mind getting responses to them. I believe I know what responses I'll mostly get and I'm expecting to disagree with most of them at least, but this shouldn't discourage you from defending your stance if you so desire.
If you're curious about my overall stance towards Bayverse Prime and the Bayverse in general, I am (or at least hope I am) one of the reasonable dislikers/haters (my more objective critisisms are pretty stable, but my subjective feelings may vary depending on the movie and other factors).
I love how ROTB shamelessly ripped-off AOE's Prime arc yet never seem to mention it
Remember it's only a problem when Michael Bay does it but if others does it, no problem at all.
Yep! AOE did it better too in my opinion.
@IAmSleekZ12 Yeah some out there really do seem to give things done similarly to the Bay movies a pass just because it isn't Michael Bay doing it.
Optimus Prime: *Kills*
Fans: OMG HE’S DISRESPECTING OPTIMUS PRIME
Bumblebee: *Kills Ravage in a brutal way*
Fans: YYYYEEEEEEEESSSS GET HIM BEE
Am I wrong?
Ironhide rip a decepticon in half in WFC, does that count too?
Yep
Sideswipe cuts a decepticons in half
YES
❤😂😂😂😂
FINALLY someone gets it.
I NEVER understood why everyone said Optimus in Bayverse was a "psychopath" when hes just doing whats necessary. Like the Decepticons are going on a rampage killing hundreds of thousands if not MILLIONS of innocent people, cant be reasoned with peacefully so Optimus is resorting to what he has to. Sure him saying "you die!/give me your face" sounds a little sadistic but most other then that hes just doing what he has to.
Not to mention Optimus does brutal things in other franchises and nobody ever gives a damn.
Also in the Bayverse anytime Optimus does try to show mercy to his enemies they end up backstabbing him. He tried to do the honorable thing but look what i cost him.
I pretty much agree with everything here! Glad you enjoyed the video too.
I feel like a big reason why people hate the bay verse films (the first 4, not the last one) is that the movies are somewhat dark and the deaths of the robots are more gory and is the complete opposite of the source material. I love the fact that it’s so different from every other transformers content and it’s unique in that way and plus the designs of the robots are also really cool and more “realistic” of how they would actually look like.
I'm sure that plays some sort of part to it. I, too, love how different it is and I feel like Transformers could use more of that lately since so much new stuff feel so same-y.
I honestly think bayverse Prime is actually the most realistic version of him and, arguably, the best depiction of his character. I love the OG cartoon and that version of Prime will always be my favorite and iconic, but the bayverse Prime is more in line what Prime is relative to his situation: a true pacifist and scholar forced into commanding a brutal war with an overwhelming enemy for millions of years, along the way having to keep his head high as millions of his closest friends and comrades died and his home planet consumed into darkness. That fact that it took his own death to finally snap him is miraculous in itself, and even when Optimus did snap, I never felt like he became some monster, rather he became a true veteran general who was just tired of playing nice. Not to mention that if all of his villains were taken to court, they would instantly get the death sentence for unspeakable war crimes on an otherworldy scale.
I think the people who call him a psycho dont understand or take into account that most people in his shoes would instantly do the exact same thing without thought, if not worse. You try being in the middle of constant bloodshed, war, and betrayals and see if you still are the paragon of virtue like in the cartoon.
You have NO IDEA how much i appreciate this video. Bayverse prime was my first and favourite version of the character and its so nice to see some one seeing that hes not a monster and even if he was its not like its his fault. But of course hes not a monster at all and i see him in these movies as one of the best examples of a hero , despite everything thats happened to him he never fully lost it.
I also really love the fact you acknowledge that megatron didn’t deserve mercy, id like to add the fact that even if megatron wanted a truce he doesnt deserve one hes killed so many people and hurt so many more. Not everyone deserves redemption and i dont think any amount of honesty in megatrons words would make him deserve to be spared.
One more thing i really appreciate the fact you didnt take any time to crap on age of extinction, so many people ive seen hate the film so much which just hurts because it has the best character growth for Optimus i feel out of any of the bay films…. And definitely better then rise of the beasts ( not saying that film is objectively bad i just dont like it that much but i dont have issues with others liking it)
Its also my favourite film , yes it has its problems but i still love the film
I really loved the effort put into this video and i dont comment on videos often but i really just wanted to show my appreciation for this.
Also sorry for making this such a long comment
No apologies necessary for the long comment, I like getting them! I am glad to see that you enjoyed the video. I put a lot of work into it and it is awesome to see responses like this. If it helps, I love AOE so I'm glad to see another fan of it! Can't wait to talk about it in a retrospective video here soon, it is way underrated and over hated.
Thank you again, I appreciate it!
@@Talon_Productions can’t wait to see that then. Theres only two small issues i have with AOE the whole Romeo Juliet laws thing and some of the designs. Im fine with human looking designs but drifts face is a bit weird if you ask me, the others are fine tho. Also i feel Optimus could have used a tiny bit more vehicle parts visible on his design and a bit more blue and red. Other then that i love the knight look he gets.
38:46 hound literally asks to end "baldy" right here and there twice but prime's reaction is priceless lmao, i wonder why people don't mention that part of optimus
42:50 to be fair the dinobots no matter which continuity (aside from cyberverse) will only listen to the strongest, it isn't a fan theory to think that it's the same for the crew in AOE. In the G1 grimlock outright rebelled against that autobots and helped the decepticons just cuz he saw prime "weak" until prime had to save him from death to prove him wrong, but grimlock and bay prime wasn't put in that easy situation in AOE... Bay optimus simply communicating to grimlock in the only language grimlock knows, and before you say that other grimlock version's aren't relevant here, this grimlock literally screams at prime and attempts to squash him just cuz prime asked him for help.. Nuf said
Don’t forget that when Optimus yells out “I’ll kill you” to the KSI drones, he can actually get away with that because none of those drones are sentient except Galvatron.
@@GalvatronStudiosyour right.there soulless
I don’t care what anyone says but, Big Robot Fight Big Robot go BRRRRRRRRR
I like the bayverse prime btw
I mean hey, can't argue with that!
wwooooooooooo
Thank you bro. Haters are just too loud. They are trying to make a villain out of this heroic character
@@korruptor9777Watch the video.
I like Bayverse Prime. If you ask me, he's a more realistic take on the character and, if the Bayverse movies had better writing, he would have been in my top 5 versions of Optimus Prime.
Let's not forget when Sentinel was about to kill Optimus he actually said "Please" as Sentinel kicked him down and raised his blade further adding to the point that Sentinel was a real son of a bitch willing to kill his own pseudo son and student even when he actually begs for mercy on not only himself and humanity
“Prime is war criminal “ and megatron, the fallen, lockdown, and sentinel were pillars of virtue right?…..sure
I literally saw people trying to say prime was wrong for putting a bullet in sentinel like literally.
Doesn't make any sense lmao
@@Talon_Productions True
Just like People Blaming Superman for everything when Zod is actually the blueprint lmao
People who complain about bayverse prime are so annoying. Nobody except G1 fans want Optimus to be this soft ass protag that lets megatron escape every movie.
The biggest problem I have with the movies is the Decepticons. NONE of them are focused on enough as characters or given enough screentime to develop their personalities and dynamics between themselves and the Autobots. I understand what the films were going for with them, it's just a creative choice I disagree with on a whole.
Totally fair!
I’m just glad there are others out there defending my childhood Optimus. People would always say how he’s a murder and sycophantic character. But when you really pay attention and observe what he has been through he’s just tired and broken. It is easy for most of us to sit and judge his actions while Optimus is making tough choices and decisions not just for our planet but for his loved ones. Thank you for this amazing video❤️❤️❤️👍👍👍
Thank you for the kind words, I truly appreciate it!
@@Talon_Productions No no man, Thank you. You saved my childhood👍 for that I am forever grateful🙏
I believe Alfred from The Dark Knight once said something that I think can best summarize the Bayverse decepticons
“Some men just want to watch the world burn”
I'd say it is very accurate! All they want to do is either enslave on a planetary scale or commit genocide on a planetary scale.
G1 fans: "Who would you be without me?" Bayverse: "Time to find out."
DAMN THATS A GOOD ONE!
I never understood the war criminal argument. It’s like any sort of violence is a war crime to these people. Optimus is fighting a war. Transformers has always been a story about war. Trash talking and saying violent things doesn’t equate to sociopathic behavior or else everyone in a COD lobby is a sociopath/war criminal. This Optimus is very humane as he doesn’t do anything more than necessary to his enemies. I agree that they could of done it more likely Prime where we get to see more of his moral decision making but this Optimus is a soldier through and through. He fights to protect and he a great role model because he has flaws where even he can be pushed to far but still comes back to his noble senses.
It is a freaking dumb argument and doesn't make a whole lot of sense and nor does it hold up under scrutiny.
Out of all the Optimus Primes out there bayverse is the most realistic version
Didnt G1 Optimus ran over Decepticons in top speed and then shot the ones that got ran over?
Also lets not forget that he beat Megatron so badly that he couldnt even move without Soundwave carrying him
Him running over the cons didn’t knock them out of the fight, they aren’t humans, there other giant robots, so him running into them is pretty much like another human running another human at full speed
Megatron was still able to fight Optimus that entire fight, it took Optimus the last of his strength just to take Megatron down, and it didn’t even kill him
@@wsmstudio3329 if we can apply different rules to cybertronians then Bay prime should be called a monster just because he kills his enemies in the most efficient way by dismembering them since it was shown that simple gunshot wounds dont kill them biggest example being Brawl and Shockwave
@@orhandalegend I’m not applying different rules, I’m using human rules on how they would work with giant robots fighting each other.
Like I said, running over a giant metal robot with a truck is going to be like a human raming into another human with they’re body
@@wsmstudio3329 relax im not talking about you spcifically
@@orhandalegendAnd yet those dismemberments are pretty damn lengthy if you ask me.
Also, headshots seem to get the job done just fine in the Bayverse based on what the movies show us, especially since the extended media lore seems to support it as well.
You sure that "dismemberment" is the most efficient way to go about it?
Especially since this year marks 40 YEARS OF THIS FRANCHISE!!!
About time to see someone stand up for Bayverse prime.
Prime in this universe is an autobot that lost so much…
Witnessed wars and witnessed death a lot of his comrades…
Betrayed by his brother Megatron
Betrayed by mentor Sentinel Prime
And betrayed by humanity itself.
Boy this Prime can’t catch a break.
And the reason he killed that many decepticons in revenge of the fallen and dark of the Moon was because he’s going sick and tired of the amount of collateral damage the decepticons cause and human casualties. And he had every reason to kill every single one of them in dark of the moon because they brutally executed wheeljack.
Because after they executed Wheeljack there’s no denying that these deceptions did those acts before.
Another thing that I think how I view “give me your face” thing was because in Optimus eyes, the fallen doesn’t deserve the prime name and since he looks so much like his brothers, he decided to remove that face.
I think the Main characteristic of Optimus is that during his time is Cybertron I don’t think he learned much Because he spent so much his entire life battling with the decepticons.
Like for example with his talk with Cade of him being done defending humans. Let him know about what was it like us making mistakes,
And how these mistakes can lead to greater things. And also having faith.
And people say he doesn’t have much character and he’s a psycho. Well, they clearly haven’t paying close attention to him.
I feel like the give me your face is like prime giving him a taste of his medicine and was pi$$ed when the fallen was trying to blow up the sun.
Great points, finally someone puts everthing into perspective, Bayverse prime will forever be my Prime
Mine too! Glad that I could help provide something that sort of helps set everything straight with Bayverse Prime.
It's just context, prime never enjoyed killing, he just needs to do it, killing enemies is apart of war.
I'm glad I'm not the only one who loves Bayverse Optimus since he's my favorite version of the character
Also will there be a video on why Bayverse Megatron is underrated?
Always nice to see people enjoy this version of the character!
I don't have concrete plans for a video like that at the moment but I'd love to do it!
@@Talon_Productions Is it just hypocrisy that fans are saying Optimus Prime from ROTB is justified in killing Scourge Mortal Kombat style because he killed Bumblebee? And that's ridiculous considering the fact that Bumblebee was resurrected later in the movie lol
Its interesting you mention rotb because when hes fighting scourge at the end, my first thought was "bayverse prime is back". And some counter this with "oh he turned his head away when stabbing scourge bc he doesnt want to kill!!!" But i find it to be easily more forgiven due to "he looks g1!" And i love g1, i love transformers in general, i recognize that g1 is a core part of the franchise and will always be around. But from a design standpoint, i love how fresh bayverse optimus looks. I wish they did something new more often. Keep the core parts of the design (chest windows, head design, wheels on the legs) while not being a rehash of the g1 design
I've never felt that him looking away was him not liking the violence, there is lava flying around, plus he may have been looking at Elena. The thing that ends that argument for me is that he looks Scourge directly in the eyes while stabbing him through the mouth and ripping off his head. He didn't have a problem looking at violence lmao. I'm with you on the Bay design, it is so good.
you know what no one calls out as a war crime sentinel primes cosmic rust cannon which is essentially a black plague gun poor ironhide witnessed his own body crumble to dust
lmao those who say that Optimus commits war crimes really enjoy the heroes die
People only seem to want to acknowledge that kind of stuff if it is to criticize a hero.
@@Melkorsolostheverse No. In fact, the opposite is actually the case given how the Decepticons are very ruthless in the films, killing humans and without a care for collateral damage in their conquest. Sure the Autobots were brutal in the later films, but are no where near the utter malice and carnage the Decepticons unleashed upon humanity. It says something about you when you enjoy the heroes die in the films despite how often they save the day, all because of the over the top kills Optimus preforms.
Optimus' character arc and development is one of the main reasons why Age of Extinction is the best Transformers movie for me. I did not at all expect that the day would come when Optimus would lose faith in humanity and would even be ready to leave them at the mercy of Galvatron. Age of Extinction showed Optimus to be an even more complex character that I actually felt sorry for. He could not bear to be stabbed in the back by a race whose freedom he defended and believed in its great potential. He's just tired and now only cares about the Autobots, who have suffered enough from the war and its consequences. But by the end of the film, Optimus proved that he is a truly wonderful and noble person who cannot turn his back on those who need help, and he simply, like all normal persons, needed support in order to gain strength again for further struggle
There are certainly interesting doscussions that can be held about Bayverse Optimus. Certainly more interesting than the mivies that he is in. But both sides on every occassion, whether by ignorance of the Genova Accords or any other military law, ignorance of some details in the movies or even intended manipulation of the discussion, jeep omitting to mention a specific war crime of his. The most heinous of them all.
Bayverse Prime and his Autobots...
...they...
...they...
...they murdered Oreo-bot.
Those bastards.
I might’ve been living under a rock but I didn’t know people hated bayverse prime until recently like the last 2-3 years. It blows my mind cuz as a kid growing up watching the original trilogy I thought this was as good as it gets and it still is
Prime is no murderer, Prime is a soldier.
I also appreciates you don’t come off as snobbish and making fun of the people complaining. You give a valid reason and honest opinion.
Bayverse Prime > ROTB Prime
Agreed!
Forever
Look i love bayverse prime but please don't hate the other some people may like rotb as me.
@@mohammadhossain9608bro we all respect your opinion
Theirs no need to feel uncomfortable
@@Dudeaids78 Bayverse prime is my childhood and i love him and i appreciate rotb prime, i'm just saying just don't spew hate to the opposite.
Michael bay did say he is close to the military, so maybe that's how bv optimus prime was based off of, bay must heard many stories from veterans that's how the impression
And yet Lorenzo also actually said that Optimus' mannerisms were based on action-hero movie star Liam Neeson.
We have actual statenents vs mere possibilities, and I think we both know where your statement lies.
@@vaggos2003 maybe you should just stop talking except the fact that you’re wrong
@@dylanhudec979 1. Wow, you butchered the word "accept". Congratulations. I'm not an English speaker as a mother language and I'm correcting you on something like this.
2. Why should I "accept that I'm wrong"? You gave no counterarguments to prove me wrong, you're just whining because I'm not falling head over heels over a version of Optimus that I don't like. Learn to use actual arguments and accept that not everyone will agree with you.
I think people like to forget/ignore the fact that war crimes as we understand them don't really apply to the Transfomers. At least with the Bayformers. The Autobots wouldn't nor shouldn't be surprised when or if one of their is captured & tortured, or anything that defines human equivalent to war crimes.
I also want to add. G1 fans will just try to find anything to cry about in the bayfilms to the point it's a dead horse. It's so annoying. If you like the bayfilms and grew up with them, You're "not a real TF fan" like omg shush.
The most annoying bunch "bay ruined transformers" give me a break
Yeah that type of gate keeping is so freaking lame.
I love bayverse prime so much and its the honor of a lifetime for me to voice him in several fan series and the fan made sequel rise of unicron coming out in the near future. He's complex, hurt, and despite it all a strong refuge for justice in a dark universe.
Unpopular Opinion: I’m never bothered by Optimus Prime’s Killing in these movies tbh
I remember I listed off EVERYTHING Sentinal did before Optimus killed him, and someone still told me Optimus was wrong to kill him. EXCUSE ME?!?!?!?!
Yeah it is ridiculous. I think some people just want to view Optimus as wrong and will ignore anything that says otherwise.
Bayverse haters just hate Optimus without knowing why and ignore EVERYTHING that other characters or Decepticons have done (who have clearly done MUCH WORSE things than Optimus 🤌)
Killing Ironhide was a good enough reason to gank Sentinel from the get go.
@@SUGARSWEET-pz2wx Right. If someone betrays my trust, kills my best friend, commits genocide on a whole city, and tries enslave people, I'd want him to have a fate worse than death. Optimus was being merciful if anything.
@@bookdragon369 It still hurts 13 years later. Ironhide is my favorite Transformer.
Honestly I'm surprised that my favorite franchise franchise that I grew up with is content nowadays despite it was being criticized and slandered by geewuner elitist, film bros and bloggers for not being "cArtOoN aCCuRaTE". Keep going bro, these kind of contents made me cry watching knowing how much I suffered being bullied from the toxic transformers fandom just because I enjoyed these Michael Bay's movies.😭😭
No, I personally always interpreted the "give me your face" scene as Optimus taking away Fallen's remnants of being a Prime, Primes' likeness because he doesn't deserve to be considered one as he had desecrated their lineage with his crimes and I think that this WAS the idea. As such, I was never sure why people complained about this scene so much as some still do.
I always found that to be a cool take on the scene as well!
I love these in depth lore breakdown videos and character studies Ive found on YT. Its interesting to see just how deep the lore for the Transformers Franchise actually goes. I've considered even compiling the information shown within the Bayverse into a book similar to that of World War Z where a character in the aftermath of all five Bayverse films interviews and collects facts and first-hand accounts from the events of these films. Basically the 9/11 Report for the Transformers War.
But here's the thing...I *wouldn't* focus on telling the story of the transformers war, but the human's actions and reactions to the conflict as a whole. Innocent bystanders and government agents who survived to tell their stories of the Transformers.
I don't know if I'll ever do it but it would be cool.
Glad to hear that you enjoyed it!
Bayverse Prime (or rather Optimus Prime in general) is what you get when the kind, silent person in the class who is bullied, starts fighting back (not just for himself, but for the others who are bullied as well). And from most accounts that I've read from regarding how American schools go about punishing the bullied kid instead of the bully, it's not surprising to see where this cognitively challenged mindset comes from. Prime has been my hero and like a father figure since I were a kid. As far as I'm concerned, the Bayverse Decepticons need to be charred and obliterated out of existence. He is being merciful. :/
Optimus Prime from the Bayverse is the best version of himself. I have a hard time understanding why some complained about him. He still was/is the great leader that gives us hope and also gives phenomenal speeches. When it comes to his fighting style, he is amazing; i don’t care in the slightest if he is tearing off decepticon jaws or limbs in a very disturbing manor; mainly due to the fact that he has to defend his comrades and the humans. These are the same people who cheer on some of your MCU/ DCEU heros (majority of which are psychos themselves in battle, but always get the job done). So the conclusion is OP from Bayformers= 🐐
I agree with pretty much everything here! This version is unfairly hated.
Ngl I always enjoyed the alternate takes in relative terms of like, the timeline of Optimus’s character.
In the beginning with animated he’s hopeful, naive, but still wise beyond his years. Aka like a young father trying his best.
Then in g1 he’s still hopeful but much more put together and fully embracing the strong enough to be kind attitude. Aka an old dad who makes sure to take care of everything while things start going down hill.
Then in bayverse it’s when the war has basically destroyed everything he and his spEcies ever lived and cared for and has become admittedly a little jaded and is doing everything possible to just end the war without anything else going down the drain (especially earth). Aka stressed veteran grandpa who still fights but not strictly because of choice.
It’s not necessarily all the same (not the aligned continuity agAin lmfaoo) character, but the portrayals can all influence and build off of one another to keep making interesting stories.
spit YOUR SHIT MAN. you were 20000% on the fucking money with this one i've been saying all of this for years now bro! this is a great video that everyone needs to see. what else is there to even say, you're correct. its easy to miss a lot of these bc the bay movies are the type of films to turn your brain off so when people see some of the shit he does they take it without any context but if you actually look into it, its beyond justified. Bravo, Talon. Bravo.
in fact, after the ROU fan project releases, i might do a full rewatch of this universe
THANK GOD someone else gets it
I keep seeing the “joke” that Bayverse Prime is a war criminal, and I’m gonna have to disagree.
Buckle up, cause this is gonna be a long one.
Here’s why the complaint of Bayverse Prime being a war criminal or psychopath doesn’t hold up at all:
1. Demolishor: Literally ran over hundreds if not thousands of people during the Shanghai opening. Actively destroyed a helicopter and flung vehicles off the road. Still attempted to flee even after being injured instead of surrendering.
2. Fallen: Was going to blow up our Sun, killing all life on Earth. Apprehending him would do nothing since he can teleport. Was the OG Decepticon and influenced Megatron to betray his own kind, igniting the civil war.
3. Megatron: Betrayed his own people that led to the decline of his own planet. Killed Optimus in ROTF, and did more heinous crimes that would’ve killed off humanity in multiple occasions.
4. Sentinel: Betrayed the Autobots. Executed Ironhide in a cowardly manner and fled with the Pillars, which were locked up under military jurisdiction. Joined up with the Decepticons to enslave all of humanity. Was going to actually kill Optimus if Megatron didn’t intervene.
5. Attinger: Formed Cemetery Wind and hunted down Autobots. Was actively going to shoot Cade when Prime shot him first. That’s acting in defense.
6. They’re aliens and Prime executed mostly other Cybertronians. Geneva convention doesn’t apply or mean anything to non-humans.
Other than that, Optimus always killed in the heat of battle or when lives were in immediate danger.
You wanna know who the real war criminals are though? Cemetery Wind straight up murdering Ratchet, a medic, begging for his life. Plus, any other Autobots they killed.
Also, people say that “G1 Optimus would never kill!”
That’s missing the point. He’s not G1 Optimus. He’s a more human, relatable, realistic portrayal of Optimus. An Optimus that wasn’t in stasis for millions of years, but fought for all that time. An Optimus who’s suffered countless losses and friends for thousands if not millions of years.
Stuff like that’s bound to make someone crack no matter how noble they are. And Bayverse Prime IS kind and noble. Everyone loves to point out his flaws, but no one ever points out his virtues.
Throughout the Bayfilms Optimus has shown us time and time again that he’s always willing to put his life on the line to protect those he cares about. Sometimes literally using his own body as a shield to protect the human characters. And can we also not ignore that he and his Autobots saved humanity multiple times? Especially in AoE when he was betrayed by the race he swore to protect. He still came through.
He kills. So what? No one was complaining when Beewun Prime brutally massacred a whole squad of seekers in the Cybertron opening. In fact, people loved it. Or ROTB and his bloodlust for Scourge which people seem to say that he had a REASON. Those cognitively impaired people don't seem to have watched the previous films at all because if they did, they'd know that was false. Y’all seem to forget that this is war. Not everything is going to go to plan and ideals aren’t always ideal.
End of the day, you can like or not like Bayverse, but at least try to attempt some actual proper and valid criticisms founded on actual evidence and facts rather than prejudice and bias.
We Bayverse fans KNOW it’s not perfect and has flaws. We know that already. It’s just that we still love it DESPITE that. We just wanna be left alone to enjoy it without haters dog piling on it and us every time it comes up. It’s been more than a decade now.
The haters should move on already. It’s 2024 and they started ever since 2007 and never stopped whining.
Haters will never moved on since they’re still obsessed with their precious outdated 80s cartoon😂
@@TRSleekZ12 align continuity was able to keep his sanity.
I don’t think the core of Optimus’ character is preserved well in the Bayverse. Optimus in the movies is exactly what Larry Cullen and by extension Peter Cullen didn’t want him to be: a gritty action hero. Were all of the villains terrible and deserve what they got? Sure, but Optimus didn’t have to tear off the face of a defeated opponent. I think it’s a tad unnecessary at that point.
If you like this version of Optimus, that’s fine, I respect that. I do think he’s cool, it’s just the Bay movies are what the general public think of Transformers, and I want them to see more of Optimus than what the movies portray.
Lmao Geewuners are a bunch of hypocrites😂
They’ll tell you to move on from the Michael Bay’s Transformers and “Embrace” the newer one for respecting the source material while they’re still stuck in the past obsessed with the cartoon and still talking trash about the Michael Bay’’s film😂
So pathetic😂
@@fegreninja7197 stop talking, please. No one wants a pacifist.
The problem really is that it started as a kids show and the fans of that Optimus just can't seperate the two characters. Bayverse Prime is an adult war hero pushed to the brink.
Exactly. This isn't meant to be the same character as G1 or any other version.
I loved Bayverse Optimus Prime the same way I loved Snyderverse / DCEU Superman, it’s sucks that the Elitist, “Film Expert” Gatekeepers, rEaL fAns & so called jOurNaLiSt trashing on my favorite iteration of these two.
I’m glad I found this video, I thought I was so alone on this universe.😂
Snyderverse Superman 🤝 Bayverse Superman = Being a victim of Media Illiterate People on Twitter
Glad that you enjoyed it!
Wasn't g1 prime about to execute megatron in the 86 movie before Hotshot showed up...in a similar fashion to Bay Prime killing Sentinel no less. Also with the exception of Grimlock and Demolisher(which could've been fixed by removing dialogue), Prime being violent makes sense considering its mostly aimed towards genocidal/evil bad guys. The Megatron truce ending of dotm is such a dumb ending since he's partially responsible for millions dead...that's not comeuppance.
In my opinion, yes he was! Some will argue that Prime wouldn't have shot Megatron there but I think that he would have. I'm also with you on the DOTM novel / comic ending, it isn't the better ending that many think that it is and doesn't really fit this version of Megatron.
Think of prime as like a solider from Vietnam from Afghanistan or Iraq going through like PTSD lost a lot of friends couldn't do anything about it think of him like that he's that soldier and all the people that you couldn't save on Earth and a Cybertron He's going through rough time so yeah it makes sense for him to be violent and towards like the other later movies for like extinction and last knight
@@Pete_thegoldfox AOE needed better writing and more focus on prime....tlk needed an entire rewrite.
@@cyberneticgeek true
@@cyberneticgeek AOE already focused more on Prime
Personally I don’t consider myself a fan of the Bayverse but I am a massive fan of everything that series has done for transformers. I think Bayverse Optimus is a little too aggressive, I prefer if he kills in a more clean way, but I think he added a whole new dimension to Optimus that we’ve been able to enjoy in TF prime and more recently the Skybound comics. So cheers to you Bayverse prime, you may not be MY Optimus but you’re still a great one
I think it says a lot about Bayverse Prime when a major trend of the Aligned Prime's character arc was a slow but steady adoption of Bayverse Prime's mindset. While he never gets as brutal, Aligned Prime steadily becomes more willing to put Megatron down for good, despite their past relationship, as well as going to such extremes as employing the Spark Extractor and destroying the Omega Lock. And then there's the way he reacted following Bumblebee's supposed death at Megatron's hands, or the actions taken by MECH, an equivalent to Cemetery Wind. And remember, Aligned Prime was intended to be the definitive version of the character, so for this version to adopt so much from Bayverse Prime shows that Hasbro approved of at least some of what the Bay films did with Optimus.
Damn I hate that I forgot to bring up using the Spark Extractor! But yeah it is very interesting how Prime Optimus did seem to go along a similar path.
Hell, the haters who dislikes Bay’s Optimus despite how much sacrifice he made for humanity are just like Cemetery Wind in Age of Extinction😂 They also hate the Autobots, despite the fact that they, on the contrary, fought for humanity
What people who complain about this Prime don’t get is that war can’t be won with hugs and plushies
Decisions need to be made
G1 Optimus never killed anyone and was way too kind with his enemies, still if you like that version it is ok
Just saying that his kindness brought him his own death
The situation in DOTM where Optimus killed Megatron because he had enought also happend in the Unicron l Trilogy.
I mean, Unicron Trilogy Megatron was a Megatron who was evil through and through and enjoyed it. He saw himself as a god over the course of the three shows, culminating in Cybertron when he became Gelvatron.
He was willing to wipe out everything with the black hold, even his most loyal people.
He is basicly a genocidal negalomabiac just like Bayverse Megatron, if not even worse.
So both Optimus Primes (Bayverse and Unicron Trilogy) had enought of their Megatrons and killed them, and both Megatrons are pure evil monsters. And the fans who conplained about the Bayverse ignoring it. 😂
This was no hate against the Unicron Trilogy. I love the Unicron Trilogy. I just wanted to add this to your Optimus comparisions.
I just want to say thank you for the rest of the video.
Bayverse Prime will allways be my favourite version of Optimus.
Lmao I remember back then the criticism for these movie were all “too sexual, too much humor, too much action and explosion, Too much product placement and blah blah blah, too much American propaganda and too much racism and too much blah blah blah blah”
And here we are right now, they’re complaining about a fictional character doing something “heinous” or whatever they called.
It’s crazy that they would rather blamed the main character than the actual villains. It’s almost like the movies reflect on that aswell that they rather blamed the Autobots and kill them all than the deception in the movie.
P.S I know this isn’t related but don’t ever go on Twitter nor Reddit when it comes to meeting with new people on the fandom, too much media illiterates, miserable people and pure hate brain rot.
Yeah it is crazy to me that people seem to give the villains that commit actual heinous acts a pass but not the hero who is doing everything to protect a planet and it's inhabitants.
I avoid Twitter so it is all good!
@@Talon_Productions Exactly! Optimus isn’t really the only protagonist that get all the blame doe.
Tbh without the Live Action Movies the Transformers would have been a dead franchise so G1 Fans if your here you should thank the movies not blame them even I didn't know of Transformers before until I saw T2 and I like it and they should not compare the movies to the cartoon just think of the movies as a different universe it's like they think the movies retcon everything about Transformers but nope they are wrong this it's own universe it's own story and it's own logic and rules and also if this were to happen in irl it's not going to be kid friendly like the cartoon no it will be realistic and u guys need to accept reality that war isn't a good to have in your world obviously so G1 fans u should just thank the movies even though it has flaws it still has alot of good moments and a interesting story and also if it weren't for the movies Transformers Prime would never exist nor other transformer shows or the bumblebee movie but tbh the rise of the beast is not a great movie the action is forgettable and optimus there hates humans literally unlike Bayverse optimus who would defend earth and humanity and he does care even though they killed his friends and betrayed him he would sacrifice himself to protect it more then the Rotb optimus and that's a fact tbh oof lol
I love Bayverse Optimus and I will not apologize for it.
Good, you have no reason to apologize!
Murray: Do you Think that Bayverse Optimus Prime is the best Optimus Prime of all time?
Joker: I do and I’m tired of pretending he is not
Murray: Well, you have the worst taste and opinion ever.
Joker: Wanna hear another Joke Murray?
Always love his design,personality and his speeches in the end of each movies.
While there’s a new transformers coming out, I'm glad that people still talk about Michael Bay’s transformers movie despite the hate and criticism it's get. This video is 100x entertaining than Bumblebee and Rise of the beast, I said what I said🤷♂️
Bay's Transformers definitely deserves more love and recognition from Transformers fans. I get into arguments with bayhaters quite often. And sometimes their arguments about why Bay's Transformers are bad are SO SТUРID that sometimes my patience runs out and I'm rude and insulting even those who were polite to me and actually have nothing against the Bayverse, for which I'm very ashamed, sorry😣 I just want Bayverse fans to have their own place on the internet, without toxic haters, where they can just share their love for these films and discuss different topics
Personally, I think Optimus Prime might have been holding back in the first movie, due to fighting in a heavy populated area, while the second films' forest fight, he only had Sam to worry about. And even while he was handing the Decepticons their collective asses, he still was careful and remember to step over the fallen tree, Sam was hiding under.
It's also because he was still conflicted on his feelings about Megatron. He still called Megatron his Brother when he died, so he clearly was still somewhat attached in some way. But as soon as Megatron killed him in ROTF and he came back to life, he realized that Megatron is too much of a threat to hold onto those feelings when he and The Fallen almost destroyed Earth. Then in DOTM, when Megatron sarcastically said he wanted a Truce, and he IMMEDIATELY said "All I wanted was to be back in charge." Then became the Joker to Prime's Batman when he said "Besides, who would you be without me, Prime?" That's the moment Prime completely gave up on Megatron because even after he lost, he STILL was saying he and the Decepticons are continuing the War. So he finally went "Time to find out". But I guess because the scene went so fast, unfortunately most people don't stop and think about what Megatron actually said because all that's ringing through their ears is the "Truce" part.
FINALLY SOMEONE UNDERSTANDS WHY I LOVE THE BAY VERSE OPTIMUS
49:25 - You made such a clever point with Sentinel
The whole thing with Cybertronions being different beings than humans and them being able to survive and dish out more(so in turn “war crimes” aren’t really crimes) is so true and I have been saying this for years.
Great video i enjoyed the watch, I always felt like the hate directed to these movies was never fully justified, its more appropriate for people to just say its not their style or taste rather than calling these works "bad".
This is one of the most best insightful and informative video of Optimus prime’s action. Sadly Optimus is not the only fictional character that is a victim of Media illiterate. Live Zack Snyder’s Superman also suffers from it too.
Can I ask you a question? What did Zack Snyder's Superman do that he's being condemned?
@@user-lk6ye5bl1o Zack Snyder wanted to test Superman as a character by deconstructing it but the 'fanboys' didn't like that
@@user-lk6ye5bl1o
Here’s a list of condemnation
-Zack Snyder’s Superman shouldn’t have killed Zod because it’s not the right way (Even doe Superman has actually Killed Zod in the comic and it’s way worse than the movie) and he made it clear that he won’t stop until everyone he cares about is killed
-Superman is a “fascist” for killing Zod (Similar complaint to Optimus being accused of “War Criminal” for killing Genocidal Robots)
-Superman isn’t supposed to be an “edgy depressed superhero” (Have they heard of characters having emotions or Character Arc? Even Superman has doubt and uncertain in the comic)
-Superman should always have trunk /Classic Superman Suit Not alien like suit(Similar complains to Transformers Fans complaining about why does that one particular does not look like my G1 cartoon favorite?)
-Zack Snyder’s Superman is actually Homelander (THAT IS A COMPLETE LIE)
-Zack Snyder’s Superman became evil after Lois died by choice (THAT IS ALSO A LIE, SUPERMAN DIDN’T BECAME EVIL BY CHOICE, HE WAS BRAINWAHSED BY DARKSEID)
-Superman doesn’t smile a lot (Have they seen the animated series? Superman look really serious and stoic)
-Superman Causes a lot of destruction in Metropolis (Superman in the animated series also causes destruction in the animated series and comic
-Superman should have never said “Nobody stays good in this world”
Superman never gaved up, he is always hopeful and optimistic.
(DUDE LITERALLY SAVED BATMAN FROM BECOMING EVIL, SAVED LEX EVEN HE WAS THE ONE THAT KIDNAPPED LOIS AND MARTHA, SACRIFICED HIMSELF FOR THE PEOPLE OF EARTH THAT REJECTED HIM & INSPIRED BATMAN TO BECOME BETTER AND FORM THE JUSTICE LEAGUE)
THE LIST GOES ON AND ON
Off topic but remember when Michael Bay got a lot of death threats and hate when Optimis prime was gonna have a flame livery on his truck? Pretty ironic and hypocritical that Transfomers fanboys always complains about Bay’s prime being a “Violent Criminal” when they themselves have been violence since the 2007 movie dropped just because it’s not a copy paste of their outdated 80s cartoon😂
You definitely deserve an Oscar for this video which you undoubtedly put so much effort in it
Thank you, I really appreciate it! Wish I kept track of the time spent on this video because it had to be a lot, especially counting the time spent on the script.
@@Talon_Productions I'm so sick of these dumb hypocrites who literally say that Bayverse Optimus commits war crimes when they forget that G1 not only also committed war crimes but also he did those for fun. Also he acted like a school bully in the scene where Optimus fights Megatron and calls him junk, whereas Bayverse Optimus called him only out of anger seeing his evil brother alive
Yeah it is odd how people get so upset with Bay Prime. I can understand not liking him but being so upsetti spaghetti is crazy to me.
Sentinel showed the world that the Autobots were no better than the Decepticons and were as tribal, if not, more of a violent race than anything. Optimus rewritten the Autobot protocols for good.
I can't make sense of this.
I'm saying Optimus made sure Autobots aren't freaking maniacs anymore
I've genuinely never heard anyone dislike Optimus in the Bayverse. I've heard plenty of old Trnasformer fans not like the verse as a whole but not Optimus. If anything he's the one I've heard most people like him the best. He feels like the perfect adult version of Prime. He's an incredible leader, great fighter, good person and he fits the universe perfectly. The worst part of the series is the humans turning on them nearly every movie.
Oh wow really? It is in a lot of places like FB groups, forums, RUclips videos and comments, etc. Heck, just search "Optimus Prime war crimes" or "Optimus Prime psycho" here in RUclips and you'll see a good bit of video criticizing Bayverse Optimus. I'm with you on everything though, this version of Prime is great!
One more thing bro, Optimus did keep his word about giving the dinobots freedom in age of extinction he tells there free after the final battle
Very true!
And he called them brave warriors
I mean, Bayverse Optimus is a more REALISTIC approach to him. That’s kinda the aim of the Bayverse as a whole. In my eyes at least anyway.
I'd say it is, or at least it started out that way.
Something to note, on the "Freedom is the right of all Sentient Beings." part, then Optimus is exercising his own 'freedom' to take down the decepticons. Is this not enough leeway for you, you biased haters?
Dark of the moon would not have been a good ending to the series. Its a great film but it ends abruptly without any real resolution as to what's supposed to happen now.
Thats why age of extinction is the perfect sequel
That makes sense I guess but age of extinction as a film seems like a downgrade even if it does continue on dark of the moon because it "ends abruptly". I've definitely seen more people say it's worse than dark of the moon but if you enjoy age of extinction then that's fine.
I kinda like age of extinction but definitely not for plot reasons.
@@THGMR-ox7sd the plot was great. It focused on the bots, did a lot of new things and made it feel like there's actually a wider universe out there beyond earth and just cybertron.
In defence of prime also in the second movie, the only reason he died was because he wanted to make sure Sam was safe, he wasn't worried about killing Megatron or starscream. He let down his guard. That doesn't sound like a crazy leader who enjoys violence. Also great video. I don't see enough people making all these points to justify Optimus. Especially in the universe he's in. I always thought about most of these points but you put in a great and well thought-out video.
That is a good point and one that I wish that I would have emphasized more! And thank you, I am glad that you enjoyed the video. There are other great videos tackling By Prime but I really wanted to put out an in-depth look at him since I've been passionate about the subject for a while now.
If Optimus prime is a war criminal, what does that make the deception?