Diablo 4 - We FINALLY KNOW How Attack Speed Works!
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- Опубликовано: 13 июл 2024
- #Diablo4 #Season4 #Boss #Guide #wudijo
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Timestamps:
00:00 How It Works
01:43 Category 1
03:03 Category 2
05:58 Breakpoints
10:26 Consequences
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Игры
What mechanic should I cover next?
Resource generation seems to have changed, how is that calculation currently working, doesn’t seem to be multiplicative anymore
Healing effect. what counts etc.
Barrier. Like there are spooky mechanics with sorc, esp. Barrier generation
@@Terracronz I may be wrong here but it might all go into the same way that CDR works so it goes into a curve so the more % u get the additional bonuses get lesser each time. I think resource cost reduction also seems to work that way when I was on Ice Shard sorc.
Do you by any chance know where tempers would go? My hypothesis is that it will be this split as well depending on what it is.
They really should make it simpler.
Cap the attack speed at 200% and put everything in one bucket; so this way you don't need to study rocket science to know exactly if your stat/paragon/gear is useful.
It's just ur mainstat damage that has a separate bucket in reality (and it's like 40% not rocketscience) Crit and vulnerable would not be possible to put in the same bucket as those have multipliers in themself?
That also makes it easy to remember what "buckets" exist.
If you have 600%+ in random dmg and 300% vulnerable dmg. Vulnerable is going to have twice the effect if you add any %. Not that hard.
It is as simple as.... Put attack speed and does it attack faster. Yes = use. No = do not use. LOL
@@vest0levs How can you see 5 or 10% speed increase clearly though? Some things arent obvious.
@@rustykettle123An increase is just that. Trying to see a 5%-10% is less possible the more you stack. Just know you're increasing your DPS with more of it based on the behavior of your attacks. Simply: Bigger numbers are generally better.
@@vest0levs This video is clearly not for you so don't really bother commenting lol. If you don't understand just move over.
Spaghetti code is how my brain feels now
I started playing Diablo 4 like a month ago coming from a looter like The Division and I am just AMAZED by the lack of info about caps and stats. In The Division you know what the caps are and you get to perfectly know every single stat very quickly.
Diablo is just a bunch of random stats but also has stuff that it is almost impossible to stack and when you stack the maximum amount of it it simply doesn't work as damage.
Dont know what your talking about? If you go to your character stats it tells you what the caps are for most stats
Blizzard needs to either make these more simple to understand or include a guide on how all stats are calculated
Sadly Blizzard don't know either x.x
So they should just release the equation? Think it's cool to figure it out ourselves how it's working at it's core.
Then content creators wouldn’t have a job.
as a game developer myself: these are the things that you will never get and should not get. Either you figure it out or ignore them (preferably). Doing math is not the game. If you give to much information everybody will feel compelled to do math instead of playing the game.
@@marsovac If I can't work out what is happening in the game though, Makes me less enthusiastic to keep playing it.
Got to get the balance right!
the general goal seemed to be having your talents, glyphs, legendary nodes, and aspects "just work" even while at +100% attack speed but then ran into collisions and the spaghetti took over.
tbh they should have just had a 200% attack speed cap and called it a day. So overcomplicated for no reason.
Thank you for the explanation and for the table Wud, really appreciate, was having trouble with Andariel setup and this will help a lot!
I was trying to work this out the other day, thank you!!
Wow, i've been cracking at it all week just for you to post this, haha good
Wow thank you man. I already had the calculator, didn't quite grasp the full concept before. Basically just realized that my double MW crits on attack speed, on my amulet was, not actually doing anything. And that stat was the only reason I was keeping the amulet over a better one I have. Helped me a lot thank you!
Hover for tool tip should a feature. The thing is, that they know exactly that they need to feed one convenience at a time to let people come back. The first season they calibrated on how little they can get away with.
I loved getting to attack speed breakpoints in d3 and kinda forgot about them in d4 so I’m happy to look out for them again
I might have an unpopular opinion but I like that we don't know everything in the game. It adds a certain flavor of finesse to it.
Thanks for this! I keep hearing this attack speed cap and breakpoint stuff from various creators not knowing what they mean.
bandaid fix that blizzard can do is to add labels to attack speed modifiers (like I, II) to indicate which attack speed bucket they fall into.
I also have found a ton of weird interactions with attacking and issuing force move commands to cancel backswings which allows me to attack faster than I could if I simply hold down the skill's button.
I've made macros to cast an ability followed by a force move immediately afterwards, allowing me to streamline this.
Thanks for sharing!
I'm doing an arc lash build. How do I calculate the ATS break point?
I dropped 11% lucky hit chance for 35% more attack speed and my heart seeker it's clearing 95 pit faster then I was farming them in 83. Killing bosses first stagger now instead of 2nd or 3rd stagger. Anyway you can tell us the perfect sweet spot to aim for in our main rogue stats. Like a certain amount of lucky hit to stack before you need to focus other stats? Love the content!
this is such a mass and not intuitive
The big question is how you guys can possibly count the base frame number of a skill ? If people can know that, they would probably help you build that spreadsheet.
I'm slowly putting together a max attack speed Necro. Acolyte's Hemorrage with Tyrael's Might as the main damage dealer with Hectic to reduce cooldown on Blood Wave. No idea if it will be good, but I think it will at least be interesting.
Very insightful. Was checking sheet and what does ATS stand for? I'm feeling stupid...lol. And why doesn't Kalan's Edict not show up on the stat sheet?
I dunno why, but I had ATS as attack speed when I made the sheet initially and I've been slow poke at changing it. I'll fix tonight 😅
Thanks to everyone testing all of these. But a point to note is sometimes there might be some weird 'disclosed' changes every Season like when Poison DOT used to scale with CORE skills% and now doesnt if im not wrong.
Hey! I generally quick spot check all my findings each season to check for inconsistencies with my previous findings. If stuff changes, I make sure to update as soon as possible :)
thanks alot for sharing this
The sheet doesn't seem to work when I pick sorc. Rogue seems to work?
I love these types of videos! Makes it easy for the casual player to understand aspects of the games that are not obvious, which probably should be.
Bruh! This game has zero complexity. Everything is based on elementary school maths which the devs fuck up at every point.
@@ryan_gaming_hub🤓☝️
Thank you so much for this video! I don't understand the difference between basic attack speed (gear affix) and attack speed (gear affix) what is considered 'basic' ?
its the first 4 skills on your skill tree
is "Minion AS% on amulet" the same as the Minion AS% temper mods on weapons?
If only the descriptive language used in tooltips was consistent across the entire game… sigh. I don’t need to know the minutia of a games mechanics but I would like to read a tooltip in game, execute the function described in said tooltip, and then see exactly what it describes happening in game. I don’t think that’s too much to ask. Season 5 “tooltips reborn”?
That being said, I love that there is a community dedicated to understanding and figuring out the details like this. Thank you for what you do Wudi!
Wait so my blizzard sorc that has ga attack speed and a few more attack speed affix are the useless?
Can you cover Lucky Hit next? In case you haven't already
Not confusing at all; gg Blizz😆
I love this. Makes me feel like I'm playing D2 again. Lmao.
where can I find attack speed od dodge ?
Now, this makes me wonder, if other mechanics work this way, such as movement speed [since there is a cap on MS and you gather it from differen sources, gear vs skills vs aspects, etc.]?
What’s the cap for pyromancy attack speed? What’s that magic number that it stops giving you more attack speed👀
I wonder if tempering stats also fall into the gear affix category, e.g Blood Attack Speed. Then there's the attack speed of minions, which work a bit differently. They don't seem to benefit from Rapid Aspect, for example, Even though they're supposed to inherit 100% of your stats.
So 1 hander instead of 2hander for faster attacks?
15% is the cap on Gear in category 1? Is that per slot? 15% gloves and 15% rings?
I think total which is why on some guides/builds youll see either gloves with atk speed(GA) or 2 rings with atk speed if your gloves dont have it.
edit: Im assuming they found that atk speed % on gear doesnt have a cap outside of the max 100% cap as they removed the 15% one and have left it blank. Guess well see if they change it again in time.
Useful :)
i didnt understand anything about cap 1 or cap 2. is one multi and the other addi or? i dont get it...
I'm confused, on bucked 2 there is basic attack speed but this is not a real affix anymore (just probably in legacy items)... witouth that specific affix, bucket 2 will never hit 100% since the max you can get is 90%. What am I missing?
I'm Asian and never thought i would EVER say this, but thanks to the way Diablo 4 is programmed, MATH IS HARD
Whoa whoa whoa don’t make me lose my faith in Asian math.
Thanks
When changing from Rogue to Sorc on Attack Speed Breakpoint Calculator, it then errors out the table. It seems to not access non Rogue Skills. Advice?
The calculator is extremely unfinished. I've barely even started it, so nothing on it is usable atm apart from rogue skills to a certain extent.
Attack Power should be changed to Damage Per Second, and there should be a line for each skill, and it should factor in your crit damage, lucky hit, attack speed, etc so it is an actually useful number where you could swap gear, test stats, and see your true damage output
That's not so easy cause you have so many different systems.
@christophluger793 not likely easy, but access to their damage formulas or something would be hugely beneficial. Main problem I see with my idea is the conditionals: damage to close, damage to distant, etc. Would be tricky to account for each of those, though it would be easy to assume all enemies are vulnerable... maybe some fan can make a build planner that calculates a more accurate damage stat since the devs most likely wont
@SKLLZTHATKILLZ yeah you're right though, attack power is very misleading. They should change it even if it's just an approximation as good as it can get.
Good, but Build Sorc Andariel?!? It's Crazy men 🎉
The calculator is showing 20% for the elixir. Advantage II is 15%. Am I missing a different elixir that can be used for attack speed?
You're missing Call of the Ancients (prime). Otherwise great work!
anyway you can basically show this same table of attack speed next to your heartseeker rogue while swapping attack speed in and out and showing how to calculate since the ingame tooltips are kinda wonky.
If I followed the formula correctly:
ApS = [100% + Cap 1 AS% (100%) + Cap 2 AS% (85%)] x [Weapon ApS (1.2)
3.42 = [1.00 + 1.00 + 0.85] x 1.2
Then I am in between the "approximate" frame caps of 9 and 8 for Puncture. Does this also account for the double-casting? Because even if not... that's alot of PpS (Puncture per Second). 😵💫
Looks correct yeah.
Was hoping to learn about the wolves attack speed buckets for companion but I guess that was a long shot as a Druid lol
I might end up doing it but it is very low priority atm.
@@KingShipton I can add shred to the backlog, but it is not high on the list. I am doing this alone atm so it takes a while :D
@@Avarilyn I tested the werewolf attack speed tempers and found they are Bucket 2 attack speed.
@KingShipton much appreciated!
@@Avarilyn is it possible tempers are a 3rd bucket? I am getting weird results. I max out bucket 1 and bucket 2 with 0 werewolf attack speed tempers and get a higher FPA compared to maxing out bucket 1 and bucket 2 and also having 53% werewolf attack speed tempers. Or potentally one of the bucket 2 attack speed buffs can go over 200% cap? Also the tempers act weird. I maxed bucket 1 and had 0 bucket 2. The tempers did lower the FPA slighlty, so I know they are bucket 2. However they didn't lower the FPA as much as an equivalent % bucket 2 attack speed buff did. Argh!
Did I miss the part where you mention the global cap of 5 casts per second no matter what skill you're using?
Does this mean if I play at 120fps then my attack speed break points will be closer together?
No its animation frames. Its how the game is coded not your system
I clicked this thinking "i'm never going to hit these caps anyway". Turns out I'm definitely over one of my caps
It seems to be that there is a corealating attack/movement speed break point that makes your basic attack not cause a stutter and just smoothly run at full speed, constantly attacking with a controller. Very useful for melee with hectic aspect like bash.
It seems to me that, of the attack is hitting anything, the character will stop moving completely. Would love to know how to keep moving, even with a stutter step (playing on controller).
The attack stutter from my Bash Barb is very bad and is even worse in couch co-op. The motion sickness is real…
Any info on the attack speed / movement speed break points to stop the screen stuttering?
Wait wait, so you only need 15% IAS on gear itself? Anything else is wasted?
Minion attack speed.... thats a good topic to cover
So go watch someone that plays Necro?
Even Rogues players are running a minion Necro 😂
@@Lagalpb tbh most d2 player would run minion this season....they made it way more then viable haha
And is stuff like temper "Pyromancy Attack speed" considered Cap 1?
I’d also like to know.
I would say it would go into type 2. Bc it seems 'skill-specific' atk spd bonuses goes to Cap 2. But if you are referring to burning DOT there is an internal timer for each tick which I do not know if atk spd would affect that or not.
Allegedly all tempers are cap 2. I've just not had access to it to test yet
@@Avarilyn i can do some testing for you. Just need to know the best way to do this. I have a shred build with werewolf attack speed tempered to 3 items. If tempers are bucket 1 it would get my bucket 1 attack speed up to 90%. If bucket 2, it would overcap me from 85-100 and I am wasting the temper slots.
@@KingShipton Would be super neat. Easiest way to check it is to see if your frame total from damage instance to damage instance is reduced when you equip the items with werewolf attack speed on when you have one cap maxed out.
Currently being at 240 fps feels like im a bit op?
How about the tempered attack speed (ex. pyro attack speed for sorc)? Is that cap1 or cap2?
Allegedly cap 2. I do not have access to it yet so cannot check for myself
why am i not surprised that AS is just over the top complicated... probably not easy to implement but probably there i a easier way to do it compared to how it actually is currently. i mean 1 year to get behind the breakpoints and stuff is crazy. still thanks for the work o7.
So... how would this change a Blizzard Sorc? Where is the attack speed being applied when I just spam blizzard?
You shouldn't spam blizzard
Casting blizzard has an animation, that animation time is reduced.
what about pyromancy attack speed? that temper not in the table. Edit: cap 1
As of Season 4, Aspect of the Unyielding Commander now provides damage to necro army minions, not attack speed anymore.
Indeed. It has been fixed long ago on the article and been fixed in the sheet now. I just hadn't updated the sheet for s4.
This is so beyond spaghetti, i cant believe it
Does anyone know which bucket Pyromancy Attack speed goes in?
Cap 2. Adding tempers this week hopefully
what about pyromancy attack speed?
Cap 2. Adding temper testing this week
"The finest spaghetti code" 💀
Maybe Blizzard could have made ur attack speed or whatever aspect players are trying to increase just grey out once maxed, instead of everyone trying to figure out how the math works imo
Cap 2: Electric Boogaloo
My take away is not worry about attack speed. This is ridiculous and I don't care that much, lol. For the super high tier players, totally get it. But I'm almost looking to not even adjust my attack speed at all since it seems like a nice to have more than a need.
Why some lines have a range like 30-60% ? i dont get it
My best guess is they're all either affixes or aspects so that's the range they could roll in.
@@pablothefable ahhhh ur actually right of course
It should be bc the aspect is on 2h or pendant so their % scales that way. 30% is base, 45% is pendant, 60% is on 2h.
Those are aspects you put on your gear, the range is because if you put them on a 2 handed weapon you get double the max value (for example accelerating has a 25% max value, if you put it on a 2 hand you get 50%)
@@H4kane yeah you're right actually, it's assuming perfect rolls
Anyone got Double Swing breakpoints? 😅 Been looking for those since season start.
It's on my to-do list. Likely done by end of week
@@Avarilyn awesome 🤩, ty!
idk why blizzard overcomplicates simple things, making them worse in the process
Because they don't understand their own sourcecode
I explain. Only 0.01% of people actually care for this. Wudi audience is not average diablo 4 player. Take your time to stand on world boss and inspect other's gear. Most people don't care about haveing relevant stats/aspects. Thinking about attack speed cap is universe away. This is complication that is not supposed to be observed by users at all.
Why do I get the feeling that blizzard doesn't know how attack speed works in d4?
It doesn't work like this for sorc with fire bolt. The whole build very depends on cd and attack speed and the difference is obvious between using elixir or playing without it. Even having more than 100% attack speed considering pyromance attack speed in focus + dagger.
Sorc works the same. Fire bolt has explicit breakpoints.
@@Avarilyn , maybe u're right and I see the difference because teleport has cast speed too.
@@user-xz4jx7mp8f we have extracted the breakpoints for fire bolt already, just haven't had a chance to upload them yet due to a separate bug for firebolt
@@Avarilyn thanks, really want to see how it works for sorc
What is the difference between 'attack speed (gear affix)' and 'basic attack speed (gear affix) listed on the spreadsheet?
attack speed (gear affix) is anything on your gear that just says '+X% Attack Speed%' basic attack speed (gear affix) is a specific affix that is on specific pieces (like on Condemnation)
@@The0ryz Yeah, figured that out not too long ago, but TY for the reply + confirming.
BIG
But how do I increase the attack speed of REAP?!?!?!
The more i play the more of a noob i feel like, I played the game never understanding that there were caps on things, sure it might say it but its really not very clear, i never understood it, just always thought more the better, I'm getting to old to figure shit like this out. Just want to play with out needing a degree to work it all out.
TLDR; if you increase your attack speed you hit faster💪🏻
Attack speed makes you attack faster
i put rapid, my atk speed is 59. I take off, my atk speed is 59. But i see i am faster with it. Why?
Because rapid is basic attack speed, and skill specific attack speed does not show in game on the sheet
Fun part that 1.2 attacks per second on one-handed weapons dont really 1.2 in real time in game even with basic attack. I mean not basic skill, but basic attack that u have without skills on level 1. So we can say, that all skills have own multiplier. Even basic attack. Why they put this numbers 0.9 - 1.2 on weapons its completly unclear for me. Logic?
Sorcerer gets screwed
Why?
@@DoubleYouRandyBe not as many sources to get to 100
Great now the new interns can use this data to nerf the attack speed of the different classes
I just want to play and have fun. I shouldn't need an advanced degree to kill demons 😂
I tested the rapid aspect on my bash barbarian and it goes into cap 1
It for sure does not.
@@Avarilyn have you tested it? I have video proof, I dual wield and I do the same hits with 155% attack speed without rapid vs "200%" with rapid.
The in-game attack speed also doesn't change, it stays at 155% with vs without.
@@xThexMasterxProx Yes I just verified it again. I did the following:
First I tested how many frames 0.99 APS resulted in which was 41 frames. I then calculated expected frames using (41/[target frame])/0.9-1 where 0.9 is due to using two handed weapon. This calculates the expected AS% for specific frames.
I then checked how many frames 70% Attack speed% would be, which was expected to be 27. I verified this with frame data and it was correct.
I then checked 85% (which should be roughly 25 frames). It was once again correct and 25 frames.
I could then extrapolate that the approximation is decently accurate, so I could calculate the expected results for Rapid. If Rapid was cap 1, I would only get 15% attack speed as I only have attack speed% sources from cap 1. This would result in roughly 23 frames. If Rapid was cap 2, I would get the full 60% attack speed and that results in roughly 19 frames.
I then tested it and got 19 frames across 30 data points. Rapid is Cap 2.
I think I understand attack speed less now ...
Unyielding commander no longer gives attack speed, and gives damage instead. Same with hulking monstrosity, inspiring leader. Some old info here.
You are correct, I've not updated the sheet as I migrated the information to the article and adjusted it for s4. I'll change when I get home.
for hulking at least, its not talking about the legendary node, its saying on this board there is attack speed.
Or...I could just go on living my life.
Basic attack speed on gear is rich lol poors sorcs got shit on here too lol
I play video games to shut my brain off and have a good time.
90% of the game is spaghetti code since launch not surprising after learning we have an bunch of GenZs at the helm (based on from the livestreams weve seen)
Black box damage/reduction algorithm is fundamentally why Blizzard isn’t in a position to fix PvP. Such a shame Diablo’s IP/design could easily be the king of MOBA should they came around to it.
Considering sorc doesn't get overpower, the fact that they are the one class that can't hard cap without basic skills iand that attack speed and cast speed are the same thing is just one more reason that sorcs are scuffed. No wonder damage is bad. Less legendary affixes. Less attack speed. No overpower synergy. Get some barrier synergy, but considering they share weapon affixes and we can't lose attack speed they are DOA. They should let sorcs carry a staff and make certain attacks require staff like how the barb switches weapons. Because that's about the amount that we're missing compared to everyone else.
So gear attack speed cap is 15%?? That's super low. The maxroll rogue heartseeker guide shows the gear attack speed being 39% though??
No. The bonus attack speed cap is 100%.
That's not the cap, that's the max of what this stat can roll on an item
@@MyN0N4M3that's not true. I have 17.9% attack speed on my amulet
@@steveochofrom master working it?
@@dcort100 yeah. My amulet
Seriously, Blizzard? I just want to play the dayam game. I shouldn’t need to get a PhD in Diablo Game Mechanics to know how Attack Speed actually works.
If it was communicated in game I wouldn't care... but ya what a mess.