angels in america - change
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- Опубликовано: 17 май 2008
- Harper: In your experience of the world. How do people change?
Mormon Mother: Well it has something to do with God so it's not very nice. God splits the skin with a jagged thumbnail from throat to belly and then plunges a huge filthy hand in, he grabs hold of your bloody tubes and they slip to evade his grasp but he squeezes hard, he insists, he pulls and pulls till all your innards are yanked out and the pain! We can't even talk about that. And then he stuffs them back, dirty, tangled and torn. It's up to you to do the stitching.
Harper: And then get up. And walk around.
Mormon Mother: Just mangled guts pretending. 
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Tony Kushner is a genius. So much of this play is pure poetry. He doesn't use just simple prose, but real poetic descriptions.
Man, it's scary how timeless this is.
I saw this live in Seattle.. it was the biggest roller coaster ride of emotions i had ever experienced..
One of the best moments in the show. I love that monologue.
This takes me out every time
1:27 eesh. I’m not even religious and that graphic, vulgar description makes me sick...then I feel sad. Because it’s true. That’s what a broken heart and mangled soul feels like...and you alone are the _only_ person who can mend your wounds and move on. _That’s_ how God (If you believe is there one, or life itself) makes us stronger. --From an agnostic perspective.
Beautifully written
What you're saying is cute but not really true, and tony kushner who wrote the play was a secular jew. He's not talking about broken hearts or torn Souls. He's saying that ppl basically don't change, or dont want to, unless it's forced on them from outside, and always because of theyre suffering. This is a very cynical scene, not a hopeful one.. and even after you've been violated and done the stitching, you're never whole. You're just "mangled guts pretending." Kushners saying people don't ever change, not voluntarily, not inside, and in the end they are worse off for it, not stronger.
Eclecticism really..that’s so pessimistic but makes more sense..humanity is a process of degradation
I’m an atheist but this play and all its spiritual imagery doesn’t put me off at all. Kusher did not mean it to be religious at all, I don’t even think he was- but Mormonism is used as a device, as are things like Judaism in the context of American migration, and Walt Whitman is in here too.
The metaphors are beautiful. Some represent truth, others just things we fear or wish for.
Like you, I think there is much truth to this: people don’t come easily to change and when they do, it’s through suffering.
Harper’s monologue at the end I think is Kusher himself, talking about everything he has conveyed in the play: “At least, I think that’s so.”
@@user-td3ut4tg3v There’s a video on youtube that talks about life on the context of entropy: “The mission of life is to continue the mission of the stars.” And by that they mean, to convert useful energy into entropy. Harper’s monologue at the end says “Nothing is lost forever” and wouldn’t it be nice if that were actually true- even if it’s not.
Brilliant scene, brilliant performance. Such a powerful scene to watch
some of the best writing i've ever noticed.
Totally... The writing is top-notch
that's how people change.
So cordial. So polite. A startling contrast to her performance as Calamity Jane, that's for sure!
I don't think it's coincidence that this sounds like the description of a C-section, only even more graphic. At least the surgeons have the decency to do the stitching for you.
Definitely not an accident. Kusher was incredibly deliberate with everything.
this is my favorite part of the movie ... and I loooooove the movie so that's saying something. it never fails to make me cry because it rings so true for some reason.
I love this so much.
i love this movie and that scene
I have memorized this scene and many of my other favorites. This might just be my favorite. "well, it has something to do with God, so it's not very nice". BRILLIANT!
Just mangled guts pretending.
I said this to my therapist.
I think this is my fav scene
You ain't stupid, so don't ask stupid ...
PAIN not happiness. That’s how people change.
Everything about this scene is RIGHT.
great , very well scipted awesome scene,.... so moving
So applicable to today.
And then 7 years later how much moreso. Hope you made it thru 2020 okay.
Feeling it, 2020.
It’s so wild to see comments from 2019 or early 2020, knowing what was coming for them. From the other side in 2024- how did you do?
@@joed180 waited it out, survived it, continued living with renewed vigour.
That's Robin Weigert. You know.. from Deadwood?
Harper: In your experience of the world. How do people change?
Mormon Mother: Well it has something to do with God so it's not very nice.
God splits the skin with a jagged thumbnail from throat to belly and then plunges a huge filthy hand in, he grabs hold of your bloody tubes and they slip to evade his grasp but he squeezes hard, he insists, he pulls and pulls till all your innards are yanked out and the pain... We can't even talk about that. And then he stuffs them back, dirty, tangled and torn. It's up to you to do the stitching.
Harper: And get up. And walk around.
Mormon Mother: Just mangled guts pretending.
Harper: That's how people change.
That is the best way I have heard of explaining grace. Aeschylus had one.
It was Robert F. Kennedy favorite
@spookybeast lol thats the point :-p she says it later in the scene
This is bizarre!!
Is it just me or does that puppet man look like her husband?
They specifically made it that way, it’s in the text.
It's kind of a feature in the play that because there's a limited cast, the actors are supposed to play multiple roles throughout the show and to give an idea: Emma Thompson plays the Angel, Prior Walter's Nurse, and a homeless woman. I remember reading it in college and one of my classmates pointed out there's lots of references to Wizard of Oz (another cornerstone in LGBT media) and how the actors had dual roles in the reality and fantasy parts. In the context of the scene here, the puppet really is played by the actor playing her husband, that's why the resemblance is uncanny.
Can anyone explain me whats going on in this scene? I really dont get it.
She's using God as a metaphor for life. Life opens you up and dirties you, turns you 'impure' and then makes you pick up the pieces. She's using a lot of metaphors, there's a birth metaphor here... being violated and having your insides turned inside out is like the change from virginity to losing virginity... you're never the same again. Childbirth: once your body has a child it's never the same again. these are all metaphors of change. People change when reality hits them, it messes them up and forces them to heal themself, and never again are they able to go back. change comes after pain.
Harper is married to a closeted gay man named Joe. They are both devout Mormons who understand that homosexuality & divorce are shunned by the church, so both of them are living in denial for the sake of keeping the marriage together. He works long hours at his law firm to avoid going home to Harper at night, while she becomes addicted to Valium to cope with the breakdown of their relationship and the gaslighting she receives anytime she tries to speak with him about their lack of intimacy. Throughout the course of the series, Harper in her Valium-induced state talks to several historical characters who are figments of her imagination. These conversations are her subconscious talking and giving her guidance to leave or stay - I.e. whether real change in Joe is feasible.
Nice sentence, but the truth,what its tells is almost impossible (az least how does it sounds, looks like).
It’s a metaphor :-)
Why, do you think, Mormon Mom says, “Well, it has something to do with God, so it’s not very nice…” I would expect a deeply religious person to have a positive view of God, instead of the morbid analogy she is drawing here.
As a woman she is subjugated by that religion, and even then her life would have been very, very hard. She probably did not have a lot of choices in her life practically, including religion.
And what someone truly thinks deep down is often different than what they profess to believe or are forced to say they do.
Of all the actors Nichols couldve cast- why this one?? So wrong and so lame.