What most Christians don't know about the New Testament (feat. Dr Richard Carrier)
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- Опубликовано: 6 окт 2024
- In this illuminating discussion, Dr Richard Carrier explains some of the key gaps in basic Bible scholarship existing in most adherents of Christianity.
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Studying the bible is the best way to reject the bible
I absolutely agree.
That's why seminary is known for being the place faith goes to die.
I totally disagree. Studying the bible is the best way to be fascinated by these stories and living with some of its best principals.
@germanboy14: I am afraid that you are a member of the target group of Isaiah 6:9-10, which is reiterated in Mark 4:11-13. I wish you may be granted sight and hearing, and may turn around and be healed.
fantastic comment😂
This is a most thought provoking discussion given that as a Catholic convert (I had no choice I was 5) we had a very neatly packaged new testament (I believe it was called the new Jerusalem version) spoonfed to us. None of us would have had any idea what Richard carrier was talking about because the catholics don't like being questioned. On anything. Especially not their warped versions of the bible.
Love the larger biblical content. Definitely a good way to expand the audience.
Lloyd you are a sweetheart and you’re intelligent and funny. You make my day easier to get through. I wish you only happiness and healing and tons of glass blowing experiences before the apocalypse. Hope your stand up comedy is going well and thank you for just being you! I don’t care what anyone says about you. You helped me and so many in the ex jw community. Thanks for being a voice of moderation and reason and all the many informative interviews. Just be you slim shady. Thank you for continuing your activism and helping us use our brains again. All the best sir.
Love me some Richard Carrier.
Reifying scholarly professions,
Like A Boss!
Thanks Lloyd for providing this intellectually brilliant video. After watching the complete video, I felt like a victim that have suffered a second degree swindling. First from the hands of fake new testament "bible writers". Second from my former JW religion's Charlatans where time, money and health have been lost to them for absolutely NOTHING in return. Thanks Lloyd.
Great comment 👍 I am sorry 😞 that you had to go through *religious indoctrination* but am very glad that Dr. 3:41 Richard Carrier has led you to the truth
Great interview.... would enjoy more of these. Good Channel Lloyd. Thank you for all your work.
If it weren’t for scholars like Dr Carrier putting this information out there for laypeople then the only voice we would hear is the church.
Thanks for taking the time to answer my question ☺️
"People always expect more of you when you have naturally curly hair." -- Frida, Peanuts cartoon character.
Dr Richard Carrier certainly doesn't disappoint in that area.
This was GREAT. Very Interesting. Isn't it great to get to the Real Truth.
Love hearing from Bible scholars!
Hi Lloyd! I love your channel! But some ex Jehovah's witness with their channels said things that are not nice about you. I think they are jealous of you because you helped a lot of people my husband and included. I'm originally from Samoa. Please keep up the good work. Lv from Mike and Tava'e Christchurch New Zealand ❤
It to me was very short and the voice of Dr. Carrier seemed to have issues that might have been improved by first testing the connection before going on air.
I enjoyed the content never the less. I’m off now to see if I can find a good debate with Dr. Carrier. I am not an atheist and I’m not religious I’m just content with my heart and .attitude being totally open
So fascinating!
Love all the information
Thank you. Interesting. Lloyd, could you possibly do post-production work on your sound? Your voice is booming and loud, whilst your guest’s was soft and indistinct. I know you can’t do anything about the latter, but can’t you reduce your volume?
Man I’d love if you can get Trent Horn or InspiringPhilosophy on for a discussion on the channel!
@aaronjohnparsons this is great I think what gets me or anyone that's critical of the scripture is the fact that there is no grave sites or tombs for the Bible characters. From my view point the scriptures were written after the dark ages. Many people do use the Bible, Torah, and Quran as books of inspiration. But I don't believe they are the word of God. I am a believer in Science and the Evolution like the changes in different generations
These are my fav videos of Lloyd. I want to expand my knowledge of religions in general as I’m fascinated by human philosophy and the way we cleave to religion. Love mythvision channel too
I really enjoy hearing a Bible scholars take. It would be cool to see his viewpoints on JW literature and some of the teachings
Great interview, thanks!
Fr Stephen de Youngs podcast, The Whole Counsel of God, plus his cohosted podcast Lord of Spirits are very good, he is an Orthodox priest but is very nuanced and fair
There are numerous instances of apparent contradictions or inconsistencies in the New Testament. Here are a few examples:
Genealogy of Jesus: The Gospels of Matthew (Matthew 1:1-16) and Luke (Luke 3:23-38) both provide genealogies of Jesus, but they are different. Matthew traces Jesus' lineage through Joseph to King David's son Solomon, while Luke traces it through Joseph to David's son Nathan.
Last words of Jesus: The Gospels differ in their reporting of Jesus' last words on the cross. In Matthew (Matthew 27:46) and Mark (Mark 15:34), Jesus asks why God has forsaken him. In Luke (Luke 23:46), he commits his spirit into God's hands. In John (John 19:30), he declares, "It is finished."
The resurrection appearances: The accounts of who first saw the resurrected Jesus differ. Matthew (Matthew 28:1-10) reports that it was Mary Magdalene and the other Mary. Mark's shorter ending (Mark 16:1-8) has the women fleeing from the tomb and telling no one, while the longer ending (which is considered by many scholars to be a later addition) includes Jesus appearing to Mary Magdalene. Luke (Luke 24:1-12) mentions several women, without specifying who saw Jesus first. John (John 20:1-18) states that it was Mary Magdalene alone.
Details of Judas's death: Judas's death is reported in two different ways. In Matthew (Matthew 27:3-10), Judas hangs himself. In Acts (Acts 1:18), he falls headlong, and his body bursts open.
When Jesus was crucified: In Mark's Gospel (Mark 15:25), Jesus is crucified at the third hour (around 9 a.m.). However, in John's Gospel (John 19:14-16), Jesus is still before Pilate at the sixth hour (around noon), suggesting that the crucifixion happened later.
Peter's denial of Jesus: The Gospels all agree that Peter denied Jesus three times, but they disagree about who the questioners were, and even the setting of the denial.
Matthew ends at Abraham Luke ends at Adam the “Son of God”
John apparently never says it was Mary Magdalene just “Mary”
The bible is a fictional work of art based in metaphors of the human experience. It is the truth in that experience. Its is not FACT but it is TRUTH. That ( to me ) is the difference between a Christian and a church on sunday person. I dont think jeasus was real but i feel as though he lived in the best mannor a person could so why not aim toward that 🤷🏼♀️ while becoming very well read lol understanding the bible its the best mental work out u can do if u take it as a way to live rather than a literal happening. Sure does help understand mych of history too. Its fun if nothing else 🤘 i love listening and digging in. ♡ sending good vibes from Missouri or saying prayers lol depending on what u prefer
Interview would be great if i could hear dr Richard.
Audio matters. Especially when your content is almost completely about the words.
When the guest says that Bible texts are "full of errors" what exactly does he mean? Grammatical errors? Syntactical errors? Even theological errors?
I think he means that we really don't know many of the agendas the original authors had, what their intentions were, and how obscure and inconsistent renderings would make any sense in modern language
@@cygnustsp Do I know you from somewhere?
He is talking about transcription errors, interpolations and inventions.
@@rhecb I don't see why they are "errors". To justify calling them that, you would have to know what the "original" intent was - & you can't.
@@cygnustsp Those are confusions, granted. But not "errors".
“We are Mythvision!!”
CringeVision. This guy actually is way better than Derick
Question, the original from 200s, you had to be a someone to even been able to read…so they’re not quite normal people right? I think this is where I disagree
True. To read or write you were an elite.
Come on, Richard, invest in a decent microphone.
If it says R. Carrier I'm in 👍
Did he say the Allen and Allen edition Bible? I can’t find it on Google. Or am I miss hearing him?
He said ‘Aland and Aland.’
Kurt Aland was the great biblical text scholar of the 20th century. Barbara Aland (his wife) was a New Testament historian who worked with him extensively on producing that bible with known text variants.
It’s called ‘Novum Testamentum Graece.’
Can we get a link to that Bible edition richard mentioned?
Even amongst Atheists its fare to say Carrier is on the fringe. I love a good debate between Christians and Atheists like William Craig, Hitchens, Desouza, Harris , Bennett. But this fool talks utter crap although unlike Dawkins who pulled out of 3 separate debates against Craig he isnt a coward.
We can hardly hear Dr. Carrier, because the sound quality is very bad?!
Interesting data! Thank you. Can he focus on next time view of homosexuals and women in the Bible.
Recommending Wikipedia as a source was not a good recommendation.
what about Titus ? what happened to the original church ?
The buy bull is not a good book.
11:05 stutter has Carrier say 666
turn down the gain on your mic
Thank you, Lloyd, for having your guest. Very interesting.
But there's a complication. There was a group of 1st Century Christians who would not die, but live down to our day. Three of those people included Jesus' mother, Mary, Jesus' cousin John, and the apostle Paul. 1 Thessalonians 4:15-18 clearly shows Paul included himself among "the living who SURVIVE down to the Lord's day.."
So there were those from the 1st Century who never died shepherding the Bible. Thus there is an implied internal Bible Canon based on cross quoting by the NT Bible writers. Thus three books need to be excluded from the Bible canon:. The Book of Esther, Song of Solomon and Ecclesiastes.
Have a 👍 wonderful day.
Let's break this down into parts to address the points you've raised:
Surviving to the Lord's Day: The passage in 1 Thessalonians 4:15-18 speaks about those who will still be alive when Christ returns, what many refer to as the "Second Coming" or "Day of the Lord." It doesn't necessarily imply that Paul, or anyone from the 1st Century, would physically live for thousands of years until that day. Paul's assumption that he might be alive at the Second Coming is generally seen as a reflection of the early Christian belief that the end times were imminent.
Surviving Apostles: There is no definitive biblical or historical evidence that Mary, John, or Paul survived beyond a normal human lifespan. The Bible reports Paul's and John's deaths (though John's is reported more indirectly), and while the Bible doesn't mention Mary's death, it's generally assumed she died a natural death. Some legends and traditions say otherwise, but these are not widely accepted as historical fact.
Internal Bible Canon: While it's true that New Testament authors often quote or reference other biblical books, this doesn't necessarily mean that they recognized exactly the same canon of Scripture that later Christians did. The canon of the Bible was formed over centuries, and different communities had different collections of texts.
Excluding Certain Books: The exclusion of the Books of Esther, Song of Solomon, and Ecclesiastes from the canon has been a topic of debate among some groups, largely because these books don't directly mention God. However, the fact that they are included in the Jewish Tanakh, which forms the Christian Old Testament, has led to their acceptance in the Christian canon as well. Different Christian traditions do vary on this, however, with some canons including additional books.
You can read it that way if you wish; but the "we" is inclusive of, and doesn't discriminate between, the living and the dead, just as elsewhere Paul is inclusive and doesn't discriminate on grounds of sex, ethnicity, or social status. Don't let later commentary and the "fake" epistles used to bolster later misunderstanding of Paul, deliberate or otherwise, lead you astray.
All i hear is "the course".youre not selling a course are you😂
Most atheist know more about the Bible then Christians
That's a pretty low bar. If you know virtually anything about the Bible, you know more than most Christians.
oh god gods bollox
What about few pastors around the world healing deadly diseases, prophecies fulfilling, speaking in tongues, visions and many proofs physically. I am confused
charlatans
I'm shocked that you have Richard Carrier/God -hating/ Atheist on your livestream. I was of the impression you were an ex-JW who found the true Jesus and became a Christian, am I wrong, I await your reply.
Say goodnight, Gracie.
Why would he leave one lie for another?
LOL. 😂 That’s how u gonna dismiss all Carrier has researched? By dismissing him as a hater? 😂nah . That doesn’t work.
So, I've not seen this channel and this video is my first. Looking through the "about" of the channel, seems decent enough. But, to pull in Richard Carrier, of all people, to talk about all this is absolutely absurd. Regardless of his credentials, the man is a crank. He ascribes to theories and positions that are DEFINITIVELY false and non-academic. And then he uses statements like the manuscripts has "tons of errors" which is a completely motivated and disingenuous characterization. 99% of the "errors" are different spellings of words and names from various different areas. Of all the categorized "errors", there are approximately 6 that MIGHT make some impact in terms of doctrine or theology. Bart Ehrman used to try and lean on this concept and now, because he got embarrassed over it too many times, will no longer enter debates with Biblical scholars. Carrier is in the same crackpot camp of Ehrman.
If you expect to not just be another channel posting nonsense without any kind of real academic rigor, then get better sources and find somebody who at least backs up their claims rather than just arbitrarily standing on his own opinion. Carrier is a moron.
What position does he subscribe to that's definitively false and not academic?
@@TheMahayanist Start off with his insistence on spreading the theory that the person of Jesus from the New Testament did not exist at all. Regardless of belief in his divinity or mission or message, this concept has roundly debunked and proven entirely false by even secular historians. Yet, he still gets his books published because love nothing more than feeding their personal confirmation bias.
@@qb101 So there are 40 academic scholars who are mythicists. So that's neither non-academic nor "patently false".
Would you say the person Laozi who wrote the Tao Te Ching also existed?
@@TheMahayanist By 40, do you mean the 17 actual scholars, of whom, exactly two are alive today and have the benefit of modern research on the topic? The absolutely, unquestionably, and probably accurate consensus is that Jesus was a real person that lived in the early first century and was executed by crucifixion under Roman rule.
The only people that claim otherwise are cranks, idiots, people trying to pedal the theory for financial gain, or a combination of the three.
@@qb101where did carrier touch you?