The New Honda Civic Si is a True Enthusiast Value Proposition - One Take
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- Опубликовано: 28 сен 2024
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The new Honda Civic Si may not look like much on paper, with only 200 HP to move around a big, 5-passenger sedan. But it’s more than just the numbers: the inputs are perfect and precise, the weight stays under 3,000 lbs, and the balance is perfect. Build quality, seat comfort, and space are all well thought out and stylish, and it turns out to be an excellent value all around - Possibly the best in sport sedans today.
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The New Honda Civic Si is a True Enthusiast Value Proposition - One Take
#hondacivic
#civicsi
A young driver with one of these will become a lifelong enthusiast. Not just of Hondas, but of driving in general. Cars like this are incredibly important to the community.
Well said
Agreed. Such a practical car and and fwd makes it accessible to everyone regardless of climate. As a young driver, I’m in between this and a GR86 or a Miata. GR86 seems a bit expensive for what it is honestly and lacks the practicality. But rwd is enticing.
@@normanparthiban4383 I bought a Lincoln ls when I was 20 n loved it, then had a 80 something 2 door ford escort lx for 250 bucks n then a zx3 focus n then an lx thunderbird, rwd is way more fun hands down. Now I'm working on building up my envoy so I can tear up service roads n sand dunes without breaking everything
A "young driver with one of these will" find the wall really quick..
Kids today drive too fast, don't know what to do when they get loose..
SLOW DOWN !!
@@racerx9931 young kids have always driven fast. Time and place for it.
I appreciate you banging it off the rev limiter. Really showing what most Honda drivers will put these through. ~A 30 year old Honda die hard
Specs wise it really seems like a modern day 4 door prelude/CL (I know they made the TL too). Similarish power/weight good manual trans decent sound. Sure both of those cars were based on the accord platform, but the accords have gotten bigger and heavier. I'm a fan.
@@mattriggs301 imma be honest. I need to drive it to decide. I've had ever gen Civic si except the ep3 and fg4. This one seems like a less sporty version of the 10th gen... But you never know till you give it a go.
@@garf117 I'm gonna be honest. I haven't followed much of the Civic generations and as much as I love the concept of the Type R. The most recent ones look kind of heinous to me(type R or just regular civic but I also really dislike hatches). Not BMW M3 front grille heinous but still not great. I'm sure they're great cars to drive and looks are subjective. Just not my personal taste so I'm rather uninformed as far as personal experience goes.
I know... and that's exactly how most enthusiasts enjoy their cars. I was really excited about this car until they announced engine specs. Going to be a pain in the butt to drive.
I like that it redlines in 2nd gear at 53! So many companies give their car long gearing so that they reach 60mph in fewer shifts for a better 0-60 time despite it making the car slower in reality. Thank you Honda for doing the right thing and giving it short gearing!
My car goes to 84 in second. I wish it went to 55 or 60 in second. Honda made a good choice here.
It was more emissions driven (CARB requirements) than an intentional design feature. The new TLX (and most other cars) are doing the same thing, out of necessity -- provide all the power and TQ up front before flat-lining. Gone are the days of a normal power curve.
@@NeightrixPrime lol yes I remember doing 85mph at like 5k in 5th in my buddys em1 Si
MY 2018 Si redlines at 58 in second.
For those who like to drive fast and with precision, Matt does the best RUclips reviews. He's an excellent driver, he communicates well, and he really puts the cars through their paces! I like his methodical approach in this review, especially. He notices and shares the kind of super specific but potentially deal-breaking details (gearing, pedal placement, rev hang, etc.) that I can usually only find on owners forums.
SavageGeese also shares these details.
I had forgotten how very well he drives. Mmmmf.
And he talks about it from the perspective of road driving, not just handling in ideal circumstances on a racetrack
I quite like it, a usable, affordable,and reliable sedan with a manual not bad on this one Honda
@hon solo i wonder how much power they would give the type R then? Cuz the last Ctr was rated at 320 crank but dyno'd at 295 whp
Affordable?? Come on man. Bought my 2017 GTI brand new for $23k. Would wipe this little Honda in every category.
@@JacesOwnWorld what are the gti's specs? Never realized they were so affordable
@hon solo you really are trying hard to push that complete bullshit for no reason, huh?
@@psalmco2425 They aren't that cheap expect $30k for a GTI
Love it when Honda tweaks their cars for fun factor.
My first car was a 1998 Civic Si and it’s crazy how much nicer the Civic Si has gotten in the past 20 years
Wow…. A manufacturer that prioritizes fun and engagement over outright speed and numbers. A rarity in this day and age, What a delight! Hopefully other manufacturers see the light (looking at you BMW)
Very true, too bad that's all so many Honda fanboys look at..
This is very much the formula behind my Forte GT. I can only assume this Civic is just more refined.
11th gen! FTW!!! This SI is rockin. Can’t wait to see the type R!
Redline at 6500, I remember when those Sis would get into vtec at that rpm! Looks fun though
My Si hits VTEC at 5k rpm haha
sure with worse gas mileage, a totally different torque curve/powerband etc. I miss the days of screamers too, but we gotta be reasonable about what we expect now :(
5600 rpm*
My 8th Gen Vtec 6-8k can’t beat that sound
@@non-fictionaltoughguy1208 bro vtec starts at 5600
I know this has a lot more torque, but I do miss the 8200rpm K20.
we all miss the k20
The sound is so special and so very Honda. Sure, the newest engines are more efficient and more powerful, but I still think I'd have fun with a high-revving engine. That said, I'd seriously consider this car if there was an easy way to get rid of the nasty rev-hang.
K20C lives in the Type R
I just Sold my 05 RSX Type S.... I was going to replace it with one of these, but after driving one i can honestly say that they are no replacement for a K series.. I wound up overpaying for a low mileage 2015 SI sedan just to get the old motor and avoid one of these.
Also..... To make any more power with these your basically looking to a buying a bigger turbo, intercooler, piping, etc.... Basically a whole turbo kit. And if your spending the money on a whole turbo kit you might as well apply it to a battle tested 2.4L engine, not a questionable 1.5L.
This is the 5th review I’ve seen of this car and the perspective I respect the most. You know if Matt likes the dynamics It must be a good drivers car.
The fact this thing only weighs a tad over what an s2000 does is amazing
I’ve had this car since before the press even got ahold of them and I love it. The handling is better than many luxury cars I’ve been in. I don’t think it would be anymore fun if it had more horsepower. It’s just so well balanced in every aspect.
You've never owned a fast car
@@goldentrucker7921 ha ha I had a tuned 300 hp Mini Cooper s. That was a fast car in my opinion. but I'm sure you haven't owned a tuned mini nor a si judge RUclips comment warrior
@@ryanfisher8597 I actually loved the older ones. I own 6 vehicles. 2 fast ones. Buying a new type r, or gr corolla when they land. I did own a rsx type s, and Integra gsr back in the day
@@goldentrucker7921 I'm excited for the gr corolla, disappointed on the new integra. it's basically a heavier uglier si.
@@ryanfisher8597 what do you think they're going to be priced at? I'm thinking $3k-10k mark ups. Well equipped core models around $43k
If I wasn’t about to pay for a house and a wedding I’d be on my way to the local Honda dealer to buy one. My 08 has more than served its DD purposes at 185k miles.
It sounds good! I was honestly surprised! It actually sounds similar to the old n/a civic si motors of the past just slightly more muffled. That’s 🔥
Isn't the sound piped in? I thought I heard a reviewer say it was.
something he didn't mention is that its simulated sound thru the speakers......rather he knew that or not well never know.....watch these with a grain of salt and drive one for yourself to really know if its any good
@@mikea5205 thru the speakers its a fake engine sound
@@JMB-gt6of - Thanks. I thought it sounded fake, just like the new BRZ/86. I hope this shit doesn't become a thing and stick around like burble tune.
@@mikea5205 indeed I have a brz and its intake noise is plumbed through into the cabin which I guess isn't as bad...but still not very cool at the end of the day
I'm not so sure I see the value in this at new higher price, and here's why:
Coupes: BRZ/GT86 start just a bit more expensive, and offer way more performance. Camaro, Mustang, and even the Challenger all start at 28K for much higher performance.
Hatchbacks: Golf GTI offers better performance for just a little bit more money. Hyundai Veloster N Smokes this for a bit more.
Sedans: Forte GT: $24,000 with 200hp and a 8 speed DCT. Buick Regal Sportback is a surprisingly quick sedan for the price. Subaru WRX is $28k.
Crossovers: Hyundai Kona
I'm not saying the civic SI is no good, as it has a nice interior and I'm sure it's comfortable, but IMO there are much better "Performance" bargains out there.
The Forte GT and the Elanta N-Line are a much better deal, despite missing the LSD you can sometimes find them closer to $21,000
Forte GT (and Elantra N-Line) are 7-speed dry DCT. They unfortunately are not available with the new 8-speed wet DCT. Both are also available with a 6MT.
Well said
I don't think you can compare coupes with this. They're completely different use cases and segments.
Agree the Veloster N would be a stronger pick if you're interested in pure performance per dollar, but there are lots of other compromises there -- from styling to interior quality to shift quality. (I'd buy the N over this, but I don't need a backseat and like the function over form element of the car in general).
The Forte GT falls on its face compared to this in component quality... it doesn't even live up to the previous gen Civic interior and build quality. The WRX is a pig (sorry I said it) and most every comparison will tell you it feels dead by comparison to this, with less steering, shifter, and road feel. Plus, boxer motors blow up long before a Honda will.
@@mattdock7346 the wrx weight is heavy but normal by 2021 standards. It Is much faster than the si and its AWD. The civic on the other hand is FWD and slow. The point being made here is that the civic is not really a performance bargain. If you want performance there are platforms that are actually fast at the same price point. If it was 15k it would make more sense. If you don't need a backseat why even mess with any of this garbage. A new 370z costs the same as well as the mustang and will destroy this in every category.
Best thing in this segment in last 15 years, im in love
I watch your reviews because I can see how I would fit in the cars.
He is a big boy
Jealous of those sexy Cali roads. Have only had the pleasure of experiencing them once and is a memory that sticks with me as someone from the northeast
This is a great car. I have a wrx and this is a really compelling car. It comes down to how much performance you want vs comfort and technology. The $30,000 price bracket for cars has gotten really good the last few years. This also seems to be a better overall value than the new golf gti.
Had mine for about 4 months I commute about 100 miles a day… always had cars with way more power but this thing is so ******* fun on backroads, I recommend it to anyone who wants a fuel efficient fun daily
I bought one of these after watching this review. It does not disappoint one bit. If you want a new 4 door car and BMW M's are out of reach, you really can't find a better drivers car in the category for $30k. Love sticking my kiddo in the back seat and going for some spirited drives.
I like how they went away with the crazy styling..it looks like an accord in a good way now
It's just a little to clean, now it looks like a regular Civic.
It is so clean now
I love mine, it’s a 2019. However I really miss the k24 vtec. Turbo is is nice but it’s just not the same.
A light, quick, practical, affordable car with a good manual transmission and a nice sounding engine. Get one while you still can!
Car is not a rocket ship but a dose of fun for daily driver
SO glad they actually made this a reasonable looking car. Not ridiculously over styled with fake vents and what not. This is much cleaner.
That’s one of Honda’s best looking dashboards since early 90’s. The honeycomb trim strip will be a nightmare to clean though.
Definitely the best sounding 1.5L I’ve heard recently. Very appealing car in this class.
I wish the integra looked half as good as this does
I still miss my CRX SI / 1986. Fun car, of course not even close to this sweet ride.
Genuinely shocked how well this new Si has turned out. And this is totally how I'd have mine. The only thing that makes me hesitate to pull the trigger is the somewhat questionable reliability of that 1.5T.
Same. Currently with an 8th gen. Kinda unsure how this 1.5 will hold up. There are some videos saying the engine has weak internals
@@ka124as I've seen that as well, but it does seem to [mostly] effect tuned engines.
Love how this Si looks, great color too
the sedan and the hatchback of the new civic look almost the same. just wondering why honda dont just kill the sedan and only sell the hatchback that has the more flexible cargo space? in the past the sedan and the hatch look totally different. so, there is a clear reason why they are selling 2 different versions
Americans hate hatchbacks. The answer to questions like this always comes down to money
Hence why the civic coupe got chopped.
Civic sedan still sells around 80% of total Civic sales vs hatchback 20%ish. Coupe was discontinued for almost no sales.
Doesn't make sense, especially when the Hatchback looks more like a fastback. I think the Americans would have been happy with just the fastback, if there was a lockable under storage for their guns.
Horsepower is under-rated by 22 and torque as well. HONDATA GOT 221hp on their dyno. Can't wait for their tune. A Hondata tune and bumping the limiter to say maybe 6800 or so, will make it complete along with a set of ENKEI RPF1 18x9.5's and 265/35/18 R888s!
I wouldn't mind seeing a proper DCT either because of it being a daily when you live in LA or some high traffic areas. I drove a 2017 Acura ILX and really liked the DCT and they way it rev matched on downshifts, if it had some better trans tuning to make it a little more deliberate, I would totally opt for it!
I was skeptical about this car on paper, but this review has made me excited.
Unfortunately Honda hasn't left much in that 1.5 and I dont see the aftermarket squeezing much more than 260hp out of it.
Correction* 230hp and 301ft/lbs.
Lol my 10th gen makes 285wheel and 320wtq
there's plenty left in it. it's actually more tuneable than the 2.0 in the Type R
@@ProdByAce that's good torque, I bet your civic rips!!!
I think it sounds better than my 2018 type R. Except no turbo release valve sound.
The Integra should be good based on the Si reviews so far......an Integra Type S.....or dare to dream a Type R?
Honda is saving Type R exclusively for Honda badges. Acura gets Type S.
@@RAZGR1Z Hence the dare to dream part.
I'm just jealous of you guys since this won't be sold in Europe. Seems perfect for our roads and speed limits. I see so many GTI's and Fiesta ST that it makes me think that this could actually sell here. I really like that you can actually see in the engine bay too.
I heard Europe just refuses to buy Japanese in general. Honda and Lexus get slaughtered there compared to the US
@@papa_pt True, people really like german stuff over here. Japanese was very popular here at one point but they seemed to just let go at some point, only Toyota and Nissan are still really prominent
@@jaimykok6533 even French cars lol. it's like Americans refusing to buy wagons
Dude the I20n blows this out of the water by a long shot, in terms of performance it's the car to get in Europe.
we have the toyota GR yaris, and we get the honda civic type R in europe. Nothing to complain.
2022 - Hondas look more like BMWs than BMWs.
Wow I like that interior more than I expected to. The seat design or at least color could be better but that's a cool little daily driver. It definitely looks like an Accord to me. I like the idea of this more than I like the Type R Civic.
the regular interior looks better imo. red stripe is no bueno
Great review! I have the 10th gen, and my largest grip is the heavy dual mass flywheel. Rev hang is atrocious, really have to granny shift to not lurch the car. But overall it's a really peppy car for 200hp. The one thing I will miss on the 11th gen is the dual mode suspension, it really tightens up nicely in sport mode. Add some PS4S and you're in for a riot in the corners.
Get a tune....rev hang Is lessened
GREAT tire. I liked the original PSS a bit better but the new 4s is right up with the best. You can virtually double any corner recommended speed limit.
I recall a time when $27k would get you a new Accord EX with all the options, the si of the same year was closer to $20k. I'm not sure we're heading in the right direction with "value", pricing buyers out of a car because you can make a few thousand extra off of somebody who can afford it seems like a losing proposition.
Adjusting for inflation, these MSRP for less than 90s Civic Sis. Dealer mark-ups right now though... but Honda itself is still putting out excellent value IMO.
You’re right, it does have a very pleasant sound! Plenty of power to weight!
Is that actually sound or sound piped in through speaker? It sounds genuinely pretty good
Per another review I watched, think it was savagegeese, it’s piped in.
Piped in. It does still sound nice from the outside when the windows are down.
That's the perfect car right there doesn't need to be any faster handles perfect sounds good. I have the 2020 Accord 2.0t touring 15k miles & think about trading it for that new Si
We now live in a world where a 1.5L Honda is $29k+. Just let that sink in
it costs $2k more and comes with less options. Nice car but no longer the killer bargain it used to be.. especially with GR86 and Elantra N breathing down its neck
Yeah but a Korean car vs Japanese lol? Obvious winner there, and the gr86 won’t take to mods as easy and you get almost no space. I think the SI is the all around best car
@@wazewaze8185 The GR is already lighter and faster. Plus it's aftermarket will be quite extensive.
@@wazewaze8185 what about it all the N cars get great reviews they hired Albert Biermann from M. I do wish there was a small sedan 86
@@papa_pt I know Korean cars are getting better and better. Still they just don’t have the long term reliability down yet. And if you check their resale value at least for older models, they’re pretty bad. I think they just need more time to build their rep imo
@@AlumarsX true but with the Honda’s you only need to spend 800$ to gain 20-30 more whp. The n/a 86 is gona cost a lot more to gain near that. It’s still a great car tho, I was looking at them too. But since I can only have 1 car now, I need all the room I can get
The stock sound is actually really nice. I enjoy listening to the engine as I drive, and it feels relieving to know I won't need to resort to aftermarket parts. Well done, Honda!
This! With most cars in this price range you're immediately thinking CAI and Exhaust mods so it sounds better but this car sounds amazing already. Looking forward to owning one.
Isn’t it audio enhancement? Not bashing. Just asking
Hondata just baselined one and it made 225hp and 233lbft
Hondata bolts the dyno to the car's wheel hub. The tires are not on the dyno rollers.
@@peterkwan6072 and Honda themselves Dyno the engine at the flywheel, not the wheels. It still made more power than advertised
The 10th gen has better 1/4 mile times. If the 11th gen has 225hp, 233tq, why is the 0 to 60 and 1/4 mile times so slow?????
Great daily driver material. Always wanted a sedan with a manual, not a big fan of the hatch. This fits the bill perfectly.
I was going to lambast the civic SI for not upping their power output from 200 for the last few generations but in the face of electrification and cars with too much nanny tech the SI is actually a breathe of fresh air.
the Si is a hard swallow. It's definitely for people who just want an affordable good handling sedan, but its hard to argue getting this over something like the new 86/brz for an enthusiast, unless you really have to have usable back seats.
86, BRZ > Si for sure
Think the Elantra N maybe more a competitor for this kind of sedan.
@@InsaneSupercars not even close lmaoo
At near 30k....insanity
@@ghostrida3 Exactly that's Veloster N money and you know that car gives a type r an extremely hard time everywhere.
im a long time sti owner and i am on the market for this really good car...
Too much cost cutting for me.
BMW, Porsche, Honda. My dream garage.
Mercedes, Toyota.
Audi, Hyundai/Kia.
Awesome review, I like the looks in & out, I saw the review of the SI on Ride Line Reviews, the best time 0-60 was 7.7 with many attempts, nice to know that I can Smoke this SI in my 14 Fiesta ST on Cobb stage two and sticky Michlin Pilot Sport tires, it has 95,000 + miles on it, it’s been Bullet Proof. The Fiesta Flash 🤙🏼🍺🍺🍺
I want one after getting in it and seeing it at the auto show. It’s hard to find one locally in Houston and they only have that gray pearl color. I want blue or orange, maybe black .
That first Prius was hauling ass!
As they usually are.
I think I'll stick with my Fiesta ST for another year... No idea why so many "sporty cars" are sticking with 200hp when your average car is getting much faster these days.
looking at hondas site you get fullspec car for 30 000 dollar. then you need flexifuel tune intercooler, intake and then you can run like 240-250 hp.
Not going to lie watching him wipe the car was satisfying 😂
This would have been a knock out of the park if they used a 1.8 - 2.0 L turbo. Keep it at 200ish HP, but bump up the torque. Still an awesome overall package for what you are getting. Hard to beat for a daily.
Sounds like they thoughtfully improved the 10th gen in just about every way. Good car.
How did they improve it? No more heated seats, dual climate control,adjustable dampers and less hp?
The only knock on this car is that it’s only offered in sedan form, a lift back would be nice. What a great daily car this would be if you don’t sit in heavy traffic. I would get this with the optional summer tires. Too bad that the only market for sport wagons are with the European makes because if it did, you wouldn’t need a CUV.
Would love to see an Accord Si
What a great all around car. Price isn't bad either. Great way for a new manual driver to be introduce to a stick. Honda manuals are excellent.
Wow 200hp again………after 15 years…..Honda is really stepping up there game. Come on man
not everything needs 400+ hp
@@slk1771 But 205 was too much so they had to dial it back 5 hp.
@@damienlee1165 I saw online somewhere that the HP went up by 20 actually once the reviewers put it on the dyno. Looks like Honda may be underrating the HP.
@@damienlee1165 peak power isn't everything. Area under the curve is much more important, which is something that was improved with this iteration
@@Briggsian I'm not knocking it on power, but I feel that if the miata and brz/86 could use more power, so can the SI. It's just kind of troll to say " hey we improved all these areas of the car so we can give you 5 less hp".
I like it a lot but Honda skimped in several areas. No power drivers seat, hard plastic on the upper door panels, no fog lights, no rear USB or power connections, and no engine temperature gauge in the instrument cluster.
6500rpm ain't a legend nor what Hondas were about from their glorious days. Keeping my rare neck breaker 8200rpm B16a EK. Hoping for a B18c5 in the future. 8400rpm pure symphony.
Honda has maybe the best interior design outside of Mazda for sub-$35k cars right now
Good thing they weren't a new Prius. Would have been a battle to keep up 😆
I can't get over the fact this car is the literal embodiment of "yeah you can copy my homework but don't make it obvious" meme with the MKVII Jetta.
good on honda to continue to make fun manual only cars
I like the civic but its basically a Accord at this point. i do not understand why it has to be so big? I miss the CRX and 90 civics sizes. I dont see the point of the Accord anymore.
Blame it on the buying Public. "We want more for the money! Bigger. Bigger! BIGGER!... What happened to the nice little cars we used to get?" ;)
Hondata is making a great tune for this already. 270 whp with just a ethanol tune so far. That’s plenty of power for this civic.
Great video and review! Fantastic update by Honda!
Idk why people are hating on the new integra. It's literally the sexist version of this chasis! And if it's anywhere near the Acura ILX pricing it will be a steal.
I don't think its about the looks, which I think is average BTW.
I think its more about there's no 2 door.
Bc they took what is clearly just an ILX replacement and called it Integra
@@papa_pt At one point, they took what would have been called an Integra and called it an ILX. An Integra, like the ILX, is just a fancy Civic. Always has been, always will be
@@Briggsian that's true. But to go back on the name should signify at least some kind of throwback. I'm interested to see if/what kind of awd the type s gets
Considering the Si is $27-28k, the Integra won't be any lower than $29,999.
Weirdly sounds better than the FK2/8 Type R lol, Still Doesn't sound as good as the old K20/24 we all know and love.
Why does Honda not like the U.S. and skimps out on all the good stuff that the Canadians get (i.e. fully virtual cockpit, seat heaters, etc...)??
Matt making reference to the cars drink holder capacity MID Canyon Drive..............nuff said Matt
i’ve been trying to talk my parents into buying this si than an ex, but they want an automatic, but still hoping
Fantastic daily driver
I'm curious to know if there's the typical rev hang found on so many modern standard transmission vehicles
Looks better than the incoming WRX.
Review the Elantra N manual please
9:58
that's a proper Civic test
I can hear the rev hang and it sounds terrible☹️, that being said when these are cheaper I’m getting one
I used to be a Honda fanboy but that died after 9th gen. The car performance wise should compete with a focus st and golf gti but is more on a performance level of a fiesta st.
Have you reviewed the Cadillac CT5 V BLACKWING already and if not will you be reviewing it soon? Good job on the video by the way. I still would prefer a rear wheel drive sports car over this but I can see fans of Honda(which there are a lot of) loving this car
Sounds way better than the new WRX! Curious which car is more fun to drive the WRX or Civic?
My first car was an 8th gen Si back in '07 and I freaking loved that thing. Took immaculate care of it, fun in the back seats, fun in the driver's seat. Quick enough to enjoy but not quick enough for really stupid shit. Moved to a '15 WRX which is an objectively better car and now a '21 Stinger GT.
lol I’m 38 and have been driving my SI since I was 25… just got an S2000 last year as my weekend car
The dealers are asking five ti fifteen thousand over
Dang! About time someone that knows how to drive. All the other driving reviews were little bittches .. 😅🤣🤣 wrx or si ? Which is more fun ? 🤔 The better car between the two ?
Well, that's Matt's playground. Most of the other reviewers aren't quite as familiar with the canyons.
They're definitely underrated. Folks are getting like 220 hp or so on the dyno.
Of all of the hot hatches, sport compacts, the Honda will outlast them all!!!
Matt just might be the best sales pitcher of all time 🐐
Another positive review... and another great drive where the rev limiter is a constant killjoy.