Why Blue Hunters LOST Their PURPOSE - Elden Ring
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 1 июл 2024
- Elden Ring has many ways to play PvP: one of them being getting summoned as a BLUE HUNTER. Your role is to help the poor host that didn't want to PvP against the invader... or did he? Today Ranni the witch tells you all about it!
If you enjoyed, feel free to leave a like and comment! Subscribe and hit that bell if you want more content 🔔
Become a member 🤓
/ @onlywaifuyt
Consider supporting me on PATREON! 💕
/ onlywaifu
Merch store ☕:
streamlabs.com/onlywaifu1/merch
Discord server 🎩:
/ discord
#eldenring #ai #eldenringpvp 
Игры
Covenants in DLC? Yes or no?
P.S: Blues' actual purpose is Estus Refill.
Would really love it
Covenants would be awsome
Would be funny to have an elden ring equivalent of spear of the church. But they should scale the defensive stats the more players the host has.
YES please mommy that would be great
Yes?
How is that even a topic under discussion? Only people who say "NO" to Covenants are those who claim it was a chore to get for the Platinum Trophy. While I agree that perhaps Trophies should not be tied to Covenant Rewards, those people can simply f^ck off or tell Fromsoftware to do it 😂😂
I don't care for your trophies - sort it out with the devs, mate
The main problem I face, as a blue summon, is that almost always when transported to aid in a fight I get spawned far away from the invader and in a weird spot that is oftentimes in a valley or steep hill, so by the time I run to the main fighting spot the host or the invader is already dead xD
That’s another reason why invasions are trash in this game. The vast open world, can make it sometimes impossible to even find the bloody host
@@ZaddyGohan Maybe, but I think it could be easily fixed with changing the digit of how far you spawn from the host
The other day I had on two separate occasions the host way up on a cliff with me on the bottom... both hosts jumped to their deaths to get to me.🥲
This is so true. Majority of the time I’m way too far to help so I just leave lol
Had a spawn yesterday where i spawned in by the Giant Jar, while the host was up near the Dragons
Sadly we didnt get covenants to justify them invasions or blues.
This is actually the #1 thing the DLC needs to unlock in the vanilla game and new DLC
Honestly, there are so many factions in Elden Ring which would make for very cool covenants. I could easily imagine the Recusants would be the classic red invaders (i.e. darkwraiths) and I can definitely see a Haligtree based covenant kinda like the Blades of the Darkmoon.
What about Bloody Fingers or Recusants?
@@SuperDragonBlader they act more of a game play mechanic to attract souls veterans
@weatherman1504 In cut content, we had an excuse for blues, they served the God of Revenge, like you hunted sinners and whatnot
In DS2 you could actually burn a Human Effigy to block invasions for a certain amount of time. As well as the standard timer that blocks invasions if you've recently been invaded. If I remember correctly killing a boss also gives you the effect a burnt Human Effigy does.
Yes, I still play ds2 and it's 30 minutes safe zone.
@@UtubeH8trpeople still invade in DS2? I've played it in 2020 and seldom got actually invaded
Yeah and Elden Ring is like the first game that really borked the invasion timer system.
Instead of starting the time AFTER the invader has left (either by victory or defeat) it starts the literal second they spawn into your world. And because levels are SO massive in Elden Ring, its not uncommon for invasions to take anywhere from 5-10 minutes to resolve, which is like 30%-60% of your cooldown WHICH ISNT DOING ITS JOB and thats to PACE the invasions so that you can actually make progress.
Between the lack of solo host invasions, wex dust and spirit ashes, AND the increased boss HP by 60% (It WAS 30% in prior games) this effectively makes co-op obsolete WHICH ALSO HURTS INVADERS.
Theres no reason to co-op which means Invaders have LESS potential hosts to invade.
Its like they literally broke the system in the most deliberately aggressive way possible to KILL online activity in its entirety.
@@LightWavess I am in the invader
And when I stop invading, I become a rat and make you invade ME
@@sasaki999proi don't think that's actually true, the cooldown timer of about 8m starts after your invader is defeated, otherwise I could reinvade and get the same host again, but that's not the case
Honestly, Elden Ring has so many different factions that would make for cool covenants. I can easily see the Recusants being kinda like the Darkwraiths and definitely can see a Blades of the Darkmoon-like covenant for a place like Elphael. Maybe a Spears of the Church-like covenant for Fia's summons would be lols. It would be cool to see stuff like that in the game.
I could see a faction centered around dragons.
Your job is dependent on the zone.
If you're in a dragon zone, you need to get everyone to leave, if you're in an area with things dragons don't like, your job is to get those things dead.
Factions with agendas are interesting in this context, because your relationship with them is going to change over a playthrough, and there may be occasions where they're wildcards.
Imo that should be the default ‘blue’ mechanic. Gold phantoms are already enough to help babysit hosts. Blues right now are just gankers without friends.
@@aprinnyonbreak1290 A coventant relating to the really big dragon in Caelid would be neat like that.
@@DaPerfecto57 What are you saying should be the default mechanic for blues?
Darkmoon covenant should be the default mechanic for blues.
Now that you mentioned covenants. As weird as it is, I miss invading/co-oping as a purple phantom.
I even remember switching sides the moment a lone host gave me a siegbrau.
I feel like purple invaders were a good idea executed horribly. As you have to get the last hit for their alternate win condition which means most of the time the alternate win condition is impossible and you have to attack the host anyways.
I also wish they'd redo pinks entirely to make them work as a host never has a reason to summon a pink phantoms.
I think if/when we see covenants again that they'd be completely reworked as a lot didn't really work in every game or had major issues that hurt their gimmick like Mound Makers did.
@@Warcrafter4 Absolutely agree with that. I really love the idea behind it, you being a wildcard in a multiplayer session but yeah, that alternate win condition is why most purples I've seen act like regular invaders, or when summoned as a phantom simply look for duels. Which is fine, I guess. But that kind of defeats the whole purpose of the covenant.
I always wished you could use the White Soap Stone to help your host fight the boss, and if you won you got more shin bone, but if the host died you got less shin bones. Ya someone would probably "Optimize it", but still would be cool
My first _"Souls"_ was Darksouls2 in which the *'Blue Sentinels'* had massive purpose.
I earned myself the fancy neon-glow in my blue phantom and it was a blast the entire journey. Good times. Good times. So missed. 😌👌
I know, best souls 2 was such a good experience. It was such a massive shock going into DS3 and seeing the wonderful community rot like year-old milk.
I had the best PVP experience bar none in DS2. Was it perfect? hell no, it was jank as fuck, but it was pretty diverse.
You had regular invasions and duels, blue sentinel invasions, the arenas, Rat and Bellkeepers invasions (the best imo) and the Looking Glass Knight invasions.
You mean you actually found blue combatants in the arena? XD it was almost always dead when I played.
@@Scriffer You clearly came too late to the party and for that my condolences.
I remember fighting in the arena and protecting as a Blue *AND* invading as a Blue to rise my rank in the covenant.
The last match in which I noticed I now have the neon-blue glow, I gave away my last +50 cracked blue eye orbs to my opponent for free.
*AND* I jumped to my death so that he wins the match even, so that means +1 more orb.
Which could all used to invade and possibly rise one's rank even more.
That guy was superhappy I did it.
He did the cheering jump emote even.
Wierd isn't it?
How those moment just stick with you.
Doing something good.
Something almost _"selfless"._
Nothing is truly selfless in my opinion but it felt so damn good to do it.
Hence why I did it.
The game was pure love.
Until players started having enough of it sadly and I cannot fault them for it.
Even the best movie, liqour & game cannot keep one hyped forever.
@LawfulBased yeah I was busy getting the red glow doing the blood arena. By the time I went over to blue, nobody was at that arena any more. And I don't like being a blue sentinel. So i never got it.
As a honourable Blue, it saddens me how disregarded that side of multiplayer is. Not only it's completely useless, it also lacks balancing compared to invaders. There's no phantom blue finger to get closer to action, you're just another summon that has to run a marathon to get to the fight (admitting he's not already dead or just camping out of reach), nor initial I-frames on spawn (from what I remember, I may be wrong). And the purpose is, again, quite confusing, as Ranni said in the video. Multiplayer as a whole doesn't offer any reward, so the only thing that'd bring me to be a blue is my love for co-op and helping others. But I sincerely sympathise with invaders way more often than not. I may be the only blue to hate gankers tbh. I may not be good at PvP (I admittedly enjoy PvE more), but I do respect players and their attempt at having a fun time. Love y'all~ 🗿✨
👍
Personally i think coop and invasions should have been tied to using rune arcs instead. Sort of allowing a differently flavored ember. It even makes sense since thats the main reward from invading.
I'm not positive on this, I might be completely wrong. But I wonder if having a rune arc activated prioritises you to be invaded when summoning a phantom. I swear when I'm summoned by rune active host we're almost always emmediatly invaded. But after being summoned by a now rune active host, it seem to take a while
I was so confused as to why they didn´t tie invasions to rune arcs, as you also get it when defeating a boss IIRC.
It was RIGHT THERE, they could´ve just made it the Ember of Elden Ring, it has the exact same effects only different in the exchangeable effects of your Great Rune of choice instead of purely more HP.
A lot of people forget they have the rune arcs and just don’t use them though. I have to remind myself to use of the 200+ arcs I have.
I heard a rumor that the rune arcs were originally going to do that but got changed by Bandai. I really hope that rumor isn't true
I mean these are the same people who thought max 4 players was a good idea so wouldn’t doubt Bandai Scamco were the ones to f up the system
It feels like covenants were originally meant to be implemented in the game as a lot of the npcs had roles; Varre>Servant of Mohg, Yuria>Hunter, Vyke> Dragon Cultist, Corhyn> Golden Order, etc. That little feature would make the lore and gameplay much more profound, it’s a shame it’s missing when the foundation is there.
As a blue guy I'd like to say thanks to gank squads and AFK farmers I gave up trying.
Many of us did.
Several times I was summoned to be a sacrifice to a red who's buddy was the host. I can take out reds pretty easy with my Solaire build but sadly the previous reasons are why it is pointless. We need a forset defenders covenant in the DLC. That would make being blue cool again.
Oh and praise the sun and such...
🙏 ☀ 🙏
Agreed, but as an og blue under Gwyndolyn i'd say "Praise The Moon" 😏🤣😉
This must be what has happened to me way too much.
I mean, sure, my co-op partner could be some high, overleveled character... But honestly my wife and I used summoning to play together, and we have no idea how to PvP, so any time we are invaded, we just die. In DS3, it got so bad in the swamp we quit playing the game together entirely. Thankfully invasions seemed more rare in Elden Ring. Though there, due to the open world restrictions, we ended up downloading a mod just so we could play together without all the strange limitations on what we could do together.
Co-op and invasions have become a lot less jolly. The guys who still bother invading have had the joy beaten out of them and are cutthroat, the gankers they are invading have probably been killed by invaders and come to really hate them to the point of spite. Ironically people seem to hate invading taunters tongue worlds at all, a lot of times when I get a taunters tongue invader they finger out after the second or third invasion because they are (presumably) sick of invading the same guy. It doesn't seem to have a cooldown for individual people at all.
Really, REALLY hating invaders covers my stance on them pretty well. I have no interest in doing the invading, I don't want to be invaded, I hate the mechanic and play the Elden Souls games in spite of it.
I never play particularly focused or planned builds in favor of a stat spread that lets me try most every piece of equipment as I get it because, call me crazy, I actually want to engage with all the game's content BEFORE deciding what to actually use. On top of that, I just plain have a steep personal learning curve in most all games. This means I spend at least the first 2/3rd of every Souls game getting flattened every single time I'm invaded. Just absolutely destroyed. So yeah, by the time I hit Elden Ring, I already had a deeply engrained loathing of all Invasions period. Even if I've had my late game victories eventually, when I've finally gotten good and levels are high enough that build focus doesn't matter as much anymore, those victories are always too late and too few, historically the bad has overall far, far outweighed the good. The accumulated bitterness of countless deaths at their collective hands means invaders cannot suffer enough, and my usual preference for fair play and sportsmanship is completely drowned out by SHEER VENEMOUS HATRED. Gank squads are the least they deserve.
And I doubt that will ever change unless the in-game matchmaking ever finds a way to guarantee that players like me get matched with invaders with equally trash builds and/or poor PvP skills. Not that I think I'd love invasions even then, but I probably wouldn't hate them nearly as much if they were a consistently evenly matched 50/50 shot against invaders with similarly unfocused, unoptimized builds and underwhelming PvP skills rather than a 99% likely execution from someone who's laser optimized build and outsized PvP focus means they're kind of playing a different game entirely. The series is gradually getting closer to the ideal of matching players equally with each entry, but it's still got a long way to go.
@@Alloveck I also lost like 100 times in a row before I started winning in PvP. Why would you get yourself invaded so many times if you don't like it, dude? All you have to do in DS3 to NOT get invaded ever is to use ember just before the boss fight. That's ALL. Same with Elden Ring - summon before the boss fight. Seems like you're having troubles understanding the rules more than a skill issue.
@@justaquietpeacefuldance because they want to have a companion for the rest of the level up-to the boss room.
this isn't a hard thing to get.
@@TheDoc_K oh, I get it. I also get why you would want to walk around with a buddy in Elden Ring, it's a beautiful first time exploration - blasting through PvE with a buddy in DS3 isn't the same thing really, as far as I remember invasions. I'm just saying it's possible to avoid in all Souls games. Once Miyazaki attached old mechanics on a new Map on which they throw in an old bonfire system in their departure from Souls that sells 20mln, is when I started scratching my head, bud. 😅
@@justaquietpeacefuldance fair.
Whenever I feel burned out on dealing with gank invasions I’ll occasionally toggle on my blue ring. Not because I want to help gankers mind you, no no. I do it with the express purpose of either helping genuine pve players trying to progress or being a professional saboteur for gankers. If I spawn in and it’s a first step or haligtree church gank squad I just start dropping warming and frenzy stones for the invader where possible, maybe some greatbolts and crab if I can find the red alone and they aren’t using a cheese setup and don’t immediately try to take my head off. In the case of the haligtree since most gankers are too chickenshit to try and kill the clean rot knights while purging the NPC mobs I slap on shabriri’s woe and get them to follow me up to the host and his pal,I try to body block in narrow hallways to keep the host and phantom in place. I just generally make myself a nuisance. If the invader looks like they desperately need a top off on flasks then out comes the seppuku and I disembowel myself or simply hop off a high ledge and hope they can finish the job with the juice they get. Since ER denied me my right to play as a purple phantom I’ve decided to take matters into my own hands until from brings back covenants.
Unfortunately not every red gets my intent and tries to kill me, and as of late gank hosts seem to be catching on that some blues want to ruin their fun and try to sever us once it’s obvious we aren’t there to help them crush reds for their amusement. But every now again the stars align and I get that one red that gets what I’m trying to do and ramps up their aggression just enough that the host can’t find the time to boot me out to get a proper blue patsy for their crusade.
Blue invaders for life!
as we can see Blues are such a shitty covenant that player needs to find his own purpose while participating...
I learned to kite mobs on DS3's Black Knights, never thought it will get useful as a Blue.
I've considered making a character that acts as a blue named "Not overly bright" and just be literally useless when summoned, and act like an absolute idiot. Just to take up a blue slot for gankers. Wear the albanauric head and just do stuff like blow the envoy horn with no fp and such
I think the only time when a blue spirit was helpful to me was in the sewer pipe maze where the person I summoned to help me navigate died. The blue spirit came in and helped me the rest of the way.
That's probably one of my favourite areas to help hosts get through, both as a furled finger and blue. It's pretty easy once you spend hours studying the map while helping others get through multiple runs, so unless the Ng scaling makes enemies too tanky due to the high level, it's pretty easy to get them through nowadays... ✨
@@brickch.6502 A demanding Area that incentives organic Co-op (and enables invasions, ffs!). Sounds like u r having a cool time, gg
Fricking imagine, Miyazaki... They're not taking the advantage of having online in ANY way. Instead of making it interesting, they've made an easy open world and hard bosses to appease to Sunday players and those who "wAnT mOar" difficulty 'cause they're autistic an can "no-hit" the game. In result game "for everyone" is pretty much for no one, except for peeps that noticed there is "no markers on a map?! Shocking, 10/10"
@@justaquietpeacefuldancewhat
That guy is based
I stopped being blue because I got tired of spawning on the other side of the continent. Like I'd rather them just half my health instead if it means I can actually be in a reasonable distance to the host or invader.
In my experience, whenever I was summoned as a blue summon... 9 times out of 10 times, it was a fucking fight club, with the host standing by.
Played on all sides of the issue, and all I have to say is: Invasions are not supossed to be fair, you know you can get ganked and you still went in for the lols of killing someone. Want a fair match? duel or Arena
I really liked the "hunter of hunters" rune in bloodborne and how they handled it. In lore those people would hunt hunters who had gone mad so it makes sense that when you get invaded anyone with that rune would be the enemy of that person. Really like it when the pve makes sense is accurate to the lore.
I miss invading the guilty.
The only time Blues made sense was in OG Dark Souls, where people who got invaded indicted people who succeeded in invading them.
It was a HUGE dopamine hit to the invaders to see "YOU WERE INDICTED."
The Blues had a place in the lore, as Blades of the Darkmoon; servants of Gwyndolin. Gwyndolin, being the last remaining living god in the area and doing his best to make sure the Chosen Undead links the flame, has AMPLE motive behind the creation of the Blues.
Dark Souls II actually took this one step further and allowed you to use the Blue Sentinels covenant to INVADE the invaders which was a good step in the right direction. However, everything else just felt like a form of 'excuse' to add it.
Every other Souls game has lost it's 'feel' with the Blue Covenant, shifting it from a "Spirit of Justice" into a "Police Summon." Instead of getting retribution and following a pursuit of vengeance, Blues are now forced to be the game's Nannies and dollars to donuts you don't even get to HELP the people who need it (newbies or bad players) because chances are THEY'RE ALREADY DEAD BEFORE YOU GET TO THEM. This means that Blue summons are notorious for being tagalongs in gank squads now. This is why people honestly see blues as only Estus Refill.
Bring back Mad covenant (seriously we have Flame of @#$%ing Frenzy and now Purple summons? BS BS BS BS BS *BS* )
Make Blues justiciars again (seriously we have the old lore of Volcano Manor and no spirits of justice/vengeance? FLAVOR FAIL)
For Blue Sentinals being in DS2:Judging from the DS2 lore on Blue Sentinels they seem to be the direct descendants of the Blades of the DarkMoon. This is backed up by DS3 treating them as the same covenant.
So story wise DS2 Blues are what Blade of the Darkmoon became without Gwyndolin to lead them as they are considered an "undeveloped" faction. Which make sense as they are split between Way of Blue and Blue Sentinels meaning they are a fractured faction without a clear leader.
That being said I completely agree with what you said that they were and what they have become. Also you missed that in ER there is no real reward for defeating blues as unlike in the DS games. So they aren't even worth fighting anymore as an invader unless they are being annoying or you need an Estus Refill.
👍👍👍 to both you and op
Blue hunters are currently used for: a) AFK rune farmers; b) when host and invader partner so that blues are lured into a trap, so the invader gains runes. 😢
Invaders don't kill blues for runes.
They kill them because they are blues >:)
@@Chicanery_ArtificeRAciSm
Invaders kills blues for estus to survive longer and kill the host.
I just use blues to try and get a second invader in. It doesn’t work too often but when it does the chaos is magical
I think there is one case where a hunter serves a great purpose. When the host doesn't know what they are doing, and they summon a random phantom who doesn't know what he is doing. That is not such a rare occurrence. There are more people summoning randoms than using password. But from the invader's point of view he doesn't see this because it's the ones using passwords that suck in invaders with taunter's tongue. I do a lot of random coop. The amount of people summoning like this is quite large. And it's not easy since these are true pve folks, and the mobs assist invaders. I think I'll have to respectfully disagree with you considering that your pov is based on someone who is a victim of gankers which pull in the bad red man by forcing invasions with the tongue.
Blues can serve a purpose. It's just that the tongue has so much priority over not using tongue, an invader has to experience ganks more than genuine pve players. And genuine pve players are typically not very good at pvp which makes them easy targets in a 2v1 scenario, and even in a 3v1 scenario. I know because I invade too, and 3 genuine pve players are pretty easy to take down unless they get lucky.
The true problem is that password summons nerfing is a diaper full of turds in effectiveness.
If you choose to summon, you choose to be invaded. It’s that simple. You don’t need the help from a blue when you already have your friends you coop with, esp as passwords. If you’re pulling extra numbers to help you when you already have that then it’s gone from coop to ganking. Sorry but there is no pass for that. You don’t get your cake and eat it too.
I think waifu is definitely biased toward the PvP viewpoint. It’s so true that the vast majority of people playing are PvE Andy’s that are just not equipped to handle PvP strats (often literally). The invader only has to kill the host, is usually decked out for that exclusive purpose, and can simply wait out the host until they are in a compromising position to sabotage them and get the kill even if they die right after.
INVADERS ARENT SUPPOSED TO WIN MOST FIGHTS
@@StoicScape219 I was exclusively talking about random summons, and not password summons. I was exclusively talking about people who are bad at the game, but still want to enjoy it. That being said, I have no problem taking out a team of 3 if the 2 summons are randoms. It's like taking candy from a group of babies. I'm sorry, but I'm not really invested in your discontent in that regard.
As for overleveled phantoms I agree that is a problem, but the problem isn't that people use it. A player who invades uses the argument that it's a part of the game therefore it is okay to be an invader. Same argument works for password summons. The real problem is that nerfing phantoms was designed badly as in nerfing doesn't really nerf effectively.
I have a feeling you have no idea just how bad most players are. Even in groups they are not doing well. They get maybe a little benefit from summoning, but they are truly terrible at playing the game. Maybe they get lucky, and summon me. I am very good. I doubt you would win in a 1v1 fight against me. Based on your bellyaching I wouldn't guess you are that good. Maybe you are above average. But with random summons there are likely mostly players who would be much worse than you.
I have never survived an invasion in any souls game. Even when I play Co-Op with my wife who is at the same level, I have never won once. I'm not sure you understand the skill difference between players looking to have fun playing with a friend, and those that are out there to invade and ruin other peoples day. I am a fan of Invaders having the most miserable time possible. It means fewer invaders, and that means that my wife and I don't get killed all the time.
@@jakinbandw I understand.
Yeah I really miss the blue eyed orb, never really played as blue, but it did improve pvp in general... maybe during the DLC? xx
Agree on the "by the time you get summoned to help, the fight has already ended" every time I was summoned as a blue hunter, I was always so far away from the host / fight, by the time I arrive either someone is dead, or they are already ganking red so I have no purpose lmao
i had to wait half an hour to have someone in need of help, then finds out he's either a maidenless little shit afk farming (whom i refused to aid) or the fight is over
so far i only had 3 chances to square up with the invader in honorable duel
Blue Summons serve as a free estus refill for us overworked Invaders
I just wanted to cosplay as bloody finger hunter yura :( he would've been so much cooler if he has a covenant where if you join you hunt bloody finger players
Another thing is the notification of blues entering the world for Elden Ring. As in ds3 you got a siren noise and a visual cue in the direction the blue was summon. In Elden Ring you just get a notification box that is easy to not notice especially mid fight. You would think with a world as big as Elden Ring this system would have been implemented. As least blues make some hosts get cocky, leading to fun and cheeky kills.
Gankers can get bent. They might as well use their taunters tongue in the process.
Usually i nope out of these situations. But it gets really annoying when on some days only one out of 15 invasions is actually a genuine co-op. Not a bunch of dudes waiting to stomp me. What makes this even worse is the fact that you go in with half the flasks you usually have. Which is fine in a 1v1 against a guy with a pve build. But makes ganking even worse.
i have like 1200 hours in pvp(mostly invasions) and tried lvl 30 co op to help hosts. man i did not knew how difficult is to keep host alive.
A method I've used against gankers as an invader is using the conceiling veil to wait for another invader to come help as it hides your location and you can dual team with them, the phantom fingers can be used to re-locate if youre spotted
the few times I used the ring to be a blue summon I was summoned into someone being afk in a spot that noone could reach without torrent, so we just messed around in the world and waited for more ppl to chill with ... it just is not worth playing blue summon when this is what you are getting most of the time
I have a strongest move against the Red Man than the blue ring: turning-off the router xD
The difference between a dedicated blue phantom and a yellow one is that a blue phantom has a pvp build and a yellow one generally has a pve build. The whole squad can die to a single invader when none of them have the capability to fight said invader. Blue phantoms however are designed to dispatch said invader. It doesn't mean blues can solo the invader, since the invader can hide under a fieldboss' balls or pull other shenanigans and punish everyone for attempting to cleave through the mobs. Or in some cases the invader just shows up with double bleed spears, which generally just requires multiple players to deal with. The biggest problem with blues is that they don't get summoned. I can have a blue ring active for hours and simply not get called upon. And then the times I do the host dies before I finish my spawning animation.
I remember getting summoned as a blue hunter in Liurnia, only to find out I was catfished by an AFK farmer, who was tucked up high on a cliff side out of reach
I was so pissed and after (Frantically) managing to establish a truce with the Red Man, I was able to point out the hosts location and dropped him some rotbone arrows to take him out. If you're out there Sir Invader and you remember an interaction like this, I just want to say GG! that was awesome 😂
In DS2, you could temporarily block invasions for 30mins at a time by burning a human effigy at the Majula bonfire.
I'm an offline pve player and everything you said was valid. I don't understand why online co-op Mt. Dew barrels complain about what boils down to a skill issue.
When people that literally started playing the game suddenly gets invaded by a red asshole with equipment FAR too advanced and starts abusing new players. "skill isue" isn't really what the problem is here.
Now, when you and your friend (and the convenient blue boy that just joined) have far more experience AND equipment inevitably end up destroying that red cancer person is considered unfair? Well there is literally a coliseum dedicated for pvp so red invaders deserve to be ganged.
I still use the ring to be summoned as a Blue from time to time, but as i said before i will not, or rather refuse to, gang up on someone.
If i see the host has a summoned ally and they are trying to gang up on an invader i'll stay back or just leave.
Honor is hard to come by in the game, but i do what i can.
There was a way though to temporily block invaders in DS2 (at least in SotFS) by burning an effigy at a bonfire (or beating an area boss). This would give a cooldown that could also be prematurely deactivated. Maye rune arcs should have given a similar extra purpose, would certainly give the pile of rune arcs some more use.
There were also the giant seeds that could really turn the tables in sticky situations (or even make the invader into an unlikely ally).
Elden Ring really does cries out for some special areas with covenants where you could get invaded regardless of status, something like "Tomb wardens", "hunters of the forest/swamp" or "Miquella's faitfull".
DS2 = Best souls
One time, a very annoying invader killed all my co op party, so I got hope when a hunter appeared that they would help me but instead they kept chasing me and throwing pots at me lol
There is a use for the blue peenring: occasional, organic pvp that you didn't specifically select and wait for. It's not the intended use, nor should it be needed for that with better game design, but it's the band-aid we got. The only thing between "only constant PVP" and "no PVP at all, ever".
Amazing job in your video man! Props to you and please never stop making videos. You are one of them gems innit 💎
Oh. Didn’t expect the Silent Hill music at the start. Nice!
I kind of disagree on the co-op point. Sure they have help... but the red is still a pest. And having additional help to get rid of that pest is nice.
But yeah the covenants would be a good return to form, allowing reds (among other things) to choose whether they invade those who want to be invaded or if they want to ruin some group's fun.
Bad design? You can't say those forbidden words. You'll anger those that won't hear anything about Elden Ring being anything other than perfect. I can already hear them now....
"...You just want another Dark Souls 1. Hissss..."
Do I want current games to be more like universally praised goat games in their categories? Well yes, I would like another DS1, actually pls 😂🖕Dude, whoever says ER is 10/10 is a faken NPC
@@justaquietpeacefuldance Honestly, a lot of people I've chatted with that praise ER are those who have played it as their first Souls game. It makes more sense to me why they think it's a completely different game than any of the Dark Souls and don't notice that its just DS with Sekiro bosses on a map that's stretched a bit to thin for content. I just wish they more open for discussion. I see more ER players complaining about Soulsborne elitists than actual elitists in comments.
"DS with Sekiro bosses on a big map with no markers" 👌@@13JackDiamond
There are at least three things I would like to mention about the hunter mechanic in Elden Ring from my experience.
1) Most recently, I was summoned as a hunter to another player’s world when I was immediately sent back to my own. Turns out from what I observed, the host set up a “duel” and there was no way of me knowing it.
2) Hunters often are spawned very far away from the host so it is literally impossible for me to save the host if I was trying to reach the confrontation on foot.
3) One time I actually summoned as a hunter in an area in the Altus Plateau where there was absolutely no way for me to reach the host or the invader on foot. The area was a ruined church (in the Altus Plateau) where you find Bloody finger hunter Yura and Eleonora.
Don't forget, Elden Ring is not a co-op game it's a multiplayer game, and there's a difference.
Reddit Hosts take note.
Elden ring was made for the filthy causals and they are L2 spamming away on the pvp gravestone.
I tried to use reddit for the first time and made a post talking about the state of invasions/pvp and before you knew it, the thread turned into a massive circlejerk about why Invaders are bad and the equivalent of actual burglars or something and that's the first and last time I've used reddit lol.
@@Pinyaps Yeah, Redditors are weird.
yep love to gank the multiplayers that invite themselves
@nathannavarro1177 You got it all wrong... 🤦♂️
Invaders are unwanted, it's as simple as that. Doesn't matter if it is unfair for the red, doesn't matter if the red gets curb stomped the first 20 seconds, what is unwanted is unwanted and as such reds deserve every shit that comes to them. it's really simple. If you want PvP go play in the Arena where people go to actually do PvP.
arena/duels are boring. same place, same people, same meta setups. i don't want to fight rapier + halberd all day.
y'all scrubs for whom "reds are unwanted" are being destroyed in a 1v3 anyways.Its the people who are actively ganking with TT where the blu mechanic becomes cancer
In ds2, if you burn an effigy at a bonfire or kill a boss it prevents invaders temporarily in the area (it also prevents summoning)
"if invasions are consensual"
. . . that's not how consent works . . .
If I want to play with my friend, it doesn't mean I want to play with the bad red man!
I am extra irritated because they LITERALLY HAD A EASY SOLUTION for how to balance summoning and invasion make it so once someone uses a rune arch they are in the multi-player pool (Invasion, hunters, summons, etc...). They could also give the great runes an actual fucking purpose and potentially separate recusants from bloody fingers in some way.
0:50 waiting for host to gank and running with an L1 block - say what u will but buddy clearly knows his PvP 😂😂
At the end of the day, Elden Ring PVP and the community and attitudes around it has been the worst of all the games, Invaders think they’re chosen by god and they’re solely allowed to “interrupt for a few minutes” a co-opers playthrough, but the second a wretched horrible “”ganker”” decides to fight back the host in the wrong. There’s always been whiney man children in the souls community but it has worsened 10 fold in elden ring.
Blue summons serve ZERO purpose. YOU SHOULD SEVER YOUR FINGER NOW !
Instructions unclear I am bleeding out
It’s actually hilarious how terrible and totally inept blues always are. They truly are estus delivery. 😂
On blue phantoms specifically, ooh boy, yeah. They were poorly implemented in ER, but then PvP feels like it got shafted in general. The only practical use I can see to blue phantoms in ER (and this is why my other comment was relevant, but I also feel it's its own thing) is for player groups who plainly do not want to deal with PvP and so need an actual PvP player to save them. Here's an idea, what if the way blue phantoms worked somehow hardlocked themself and the invading player(s) into a duel scenario?
I'm a pve player so i don't really have investment in the system. Forced would be annoying for me but i can appreciate wanting a more balanced system.
These videos are all very well thought out and offer great insights into the game, but Idk what it says about me that those dumb ass fart sound effects make me cry laughing. The reversed fart at 3:55 is killing me right now
Thank you for this, I am new(ish) to souls, my only other experience is Bloodborne. The other experience I run into is when I get summoned as fodder(?) where everyone watches as I get killed and then they go back to their duel? Its hard to explain but this has happened way too much to me. I will be turning my ring off after this.
Honestly if the system was with great tunes instead everything would fall into place. Co op scrubs can explore the open world while opting out of invasions by having the host get rid of the great rune. Invaders can’t invade at low levels where the host haven’t even acquired necessary gear upgrades to fight people who smuggle end game items early and finally gives blue a purpose because hosts who use great runes would be solo invaded too.
I remember getting invaded while making my way to the Ulcerated Tree Spirit boss in Mt. Gelmir. The invader died before the hunter could get to him because he kept on fat rolling.
I wish I still have the footage but I’ve been invaded when un-embered in DS3. Super Rare to happen.
I have used blues to get 2v2 invasions (because the sighned up for pvp unlike yellows, who often leave if tt turns on), but its a really annoying process in which you have to turn off the ring after one blue is summoned.
Yeah, I think the reduced player limit really screwed things up and put everything in favor of the host where now people have to force the point if they want an even matchup with the 4-player limit.
I used to be a blue hunter 90% of the time in the older games, Elden Ring, however, there really is no justification for them being there. The most truly useful they can be is turning 2 noobs vs 1 invader into a 3v1…and imma be honest…even if you’re a noob, losing a 2v1 is a skill issue.
👍👍👍👍👍
PvP at this point is just to see who can stop the others from having fun the fastest
I get what you’re saying. And I definitely miss covenants. But I feel like you have this impression that invasions are supposed to be this fair 1v1 or even be weighted in favor of the invader when Miyazaki himself said he wasn’t happy with how invasions worked in souls games (I think you even mention it in a past video). Invaders are supposed to be this surprising extra hard enemy. They were supposed to be more about roleplay and using human intelligence to amp up the level’s difficulty here and there with invaders winning only occasionally and not the majority of the time. Instead it became pvp dueling and griefing. I think they definitely went heavy handed against invasions but not by that much. The fact that invaders can and do spec specifically for pvp while the host is likely on a pve build is advantage enough.
Anyway, I wonder why they didn’t simply opt for being able to control some of the stronger NPCs instead. Probably would have been closer to the original vision that way.
Never guessed id watch an 8 minute video of ranni explaining how PvP works in elden ring. Happy either way
3:27 Ranni, there is literally no way you aren’t involved with that in some way.
I learned the other day that summoning a npc before a boss activates invasions if you take too long to challenge the boss.
Just to add a little bit extra to this there's also the issue that, usually as a Blue Phantom if someone does want to go through that stuff, most of the time you get spawned so many bloody miles away from whoever's hosting that half the time a blue doesn't even get to see the invader or the host until one of them has already killed the other. Had this happen so many times it's not even remotely funny.
The lack of covenants to better justify the multiplayer mechanics in-universe does suck, but DS3 pretty much was guiding us towards this direction with how arbitrary covenants became in that game too because summoning an overleveled phantom was usually better than chancing it on a blue who dies to the pve before making it to you or they too, sucking at combat. Cracked red eye orb also became redundant with how early and easier it was to acquire the full red eye orb. And that red eye orb no longer required a covenant to use. The next title of these series of games might drop the charade altogether split the online and offline features to different game modes.
I greatly mourne covenants in Elden Ring, especially since there are SO MANY factions one could choose from. Golden Order Fundamentalism, Golden Order, Children of the Formless Mother (Mohg´s Outer God of blood), Stars Of Darkness (the cosmic menace crashing to earth in form of Astel and Fallingstar Beasts), Erdtree Servants, Dragon Cult, Dragon Eaters, Nokron and Nokstella, Prince Of Death, The Grafted, Cleanrot, Redmanes, Darkmoon, and that´s not even all of them!
blue summons could be knights of the roundtable who swore to protect tarnished from recusants/bloody fingers. the world building in this game really feels like it was designed with covenants in mind and they just didn’t add them or cut it last minute, doesn’t really make sense
SH3 music hits and suddenly brings me back to the good old days
Usually if I find myself being summoned as part of a gank squad, I'll wait until the invader is losing and kill myself so that he gets some extra heals.
Still love jumping on my raptor talon lvl 460 build as a blue boy. Never gets old
Please correct me if im wrong, in dark souls 2 you could just burn an effigie on the bonfire to not get invaded right?
Saying that coop invasions are consensual because you can have overleveled phantoms is a very flawed argument. it's comparable to saying getting run over by a car is your fault since you could drive pickup truck instead of walking.
You know some people just want to play with their friends...
I recently finished my first playthrough of DS3 and I think I was invaded by people three times, once in Irithyll, once in Archdragon Peak and once in Ariandel, and I was using embers all the time since 30% is just crazy.
In my experience of playing DS3 using a strength build using Vordt's Hammer felt pretty easy, no boss took more than 5 attempts, i beat Gael at lvl 99, SoF at 79 and Friede (taking 1st place in number of attempts at 5, because her having 3 phases is a lot) at 80-90, and this was done with an unoptimized build with no prior research and no summons, I didn't have max bonfire or estus either, I had 13 +7 estus flasks.
i really want covenants in the expansion but i actually dont think we will get that. i wouldnt be surprised if fromsoft will just keep the current system. maybe theyll make some adjustments but im not getting my hopes up for covenants even though i really want them back
Their purpose is to protect the host, whether it be a pve host who is already long dead or a ganking host, in which you'll join in where either the host or the invader is dead.
As a devoted blue hunter of faith and strength I’ve carried over 160 other players to surviving invasions and appreciate the bit at the end of the video 7:53
As someone who doesn't coop and who liked using blue-eye orbs I hated the changes in Elden ring. I liked occasionally getting invaded in Souls games, fucking around with an item to get invaded and ending up fighting against 2 reds often enough is tedious bullshit. All because the casual babies couldn't handle eating the occasional death to an invader every now and then in a series of games that is notorious for how often you die playing it...
You were able to prevent invasions in DS2. Just disable your internet connection while not in main menu and game puts you into offline mode until you quit. Messages, bloodstains and ghosts of other players appear again as soon as you enable your internet but there are no invasions or coop until you go back to main menu. Also you could burn an effigy to disable invasions from a single area for 30 minutes.
The fact you had to go out your way to "disable your internet connection" is one of the dumbest things DS2 could do. The effigy effect on the other hand was fine. So long as you didn't need to cure your hollowing...
I play PVE and in DS2 there was nothing like getting invaded knowing I had no chance of surviving only for some mad lad to run in and start swinging while I try my best to not get hit and take a few potshots when I could. There was something so cool about the covenants of DS2 that I wish they would recreate.
I’ve been getting summoned a few times so far in my return. Not much tho, I certainly miss DS2 bros in blue. Sweet menthol vapors as you level up the covanant was really cool too
i think that then equivalent of human form and ember form is the activated great rune state, using rune arcs. So if you use a rune arc then that must trigger the invaders to properly invade your world but, hey, we got colisseum... yay...
From really thought that would work
4:50, wrong, ds2 also had a way to prevent invasions, in a specific area you could burn a human effigy on a bonfire and it would stop all kind of summoning in the game for 30 minutes (no invasions no summoning), and that was also a good way to use this kind of consumable.
@2:37 "Summoned into battle against the Evil Red Man."
_General Custer has entered the chat._
I tried going blue a few times in ER, I somehow always spawned so far away that the invader already killed the host before I could get to him.
In Ds 3 the blue summons (covenants) are explained by the lore and its soo good. We have the blue sentinals that are against Rosarias Fingers because they are good bois/girls and we have the Darkmoon Blades that don't have to be good bois/girls but want the fire to be linked so they see it as their duty to protect an Ashen One from being hindered linking the flame. They don't care about that you might want to be invaded or not. They want you to potentially link the fire; thats just their goal.
I always thought the purpose of the fun police was to be an estus refill for the invader.
I think this is the reason why covenants don't exist in elden ring, the way PvP is designed kinda makes them redundant. They could still exist if they wanted them too, but I think they specifically wanted players that don't like PvP to be able to play without ever seeing an invader, so having a covenant that specifically revolves around invading people wouldn't have as much of a home in elden ring
I, for one, love that the cops aren’t on my ass every single invasion like in DS3 😂
playing as blue is fun but it does feel a little dry. i don’t like ganks so if by the time i get to the fight it’s a gank i just do the sitting sideways emote and watch😭 also yeah there’s no real use for blue summons if invasions are consensual. sometimes people forget they have the request hunter ring on and immediately send me back after i spawn in which is a little annoying
Invasions should be forced if you are playing in online mode, but if an invader is attempting to invade you, a blue can use the cipher ring and counter invade, preventing the invasion from happening and causing the red to get invaded by the blue. This would have a cooldown though so that you don’t always get counter invaded
This would bring back blues actually being something more than another summon.
Invading in DS3 was so much fun, I remember spending hours in gank city excited to either hunt down a lone host, engage in an all out war with the host and their summons with an Aldritch's Faithful and a crackhead Mound-Maker or even stumbling upon a fight club and seeing how many rounds I could go through. None of this is in Elden Ring and that's my biggest gripe with it, I just wanna cut out people's tongues for Mother Rosaria again
I got a lot of Rune Arc's by being a Hunter. But I sometimes get summoned, the invader is defeated by I get no Rune Arc, and that makes me mald a little.
I kind of wished you mentioned the Mad Hunters in DS3 who can go after anyone because my first experance with them the invader had the look like the host thing and the Mad Hunter went after him and killed them.
I was never a fan of pvp, but I'd take the possiblity of solo invasions over the definitiveness of co-op invasions. Really killed my desire to help people.
I am pretty sure in ds2 you could just burn an effigy at the bonfire to deactivate invaders for 30 minutes. Maybe it is a change that has been brought with SOTFS though