Larry Holmes once said that he had taken single blows from many fighters much harder than Tyson. But, he had never known a boxer to hit him from so many different angles with such speed. And I think any boxer who has been KO’d it’s the one that you don’t see coming causes the most damage. That almost applies to everything in life doesn’t it? ha ha
I don't belive Holmes, it was a statement intended to deny the deserved honour to his opponent, who made him flat in the 4th Round. Physics is against Holmes. The kinetic energy 'E' of a body is proportional to its mass and proportional to the square (!) of its velocity. So you double the speed you have 4 times more energy (in the Punches thrown on opponents :-)
@@kidusgebretensay7228 I'm a big Tyson Fury fan, but I think prime Mike Tyson wins. He would bob and weave, use footwork to get inside and slowly break down Fury.
Talent by talent, I think Muhammand Ali had speed, could adapt, and could endure punishment and return flurries. But if Cus D Amato or Rhooney he would diminish his weaknesses and increase his strengths
Mike Tyson was frightening. How he fought was like nothing id seen. He was devastating. His presence in a ring instilled fear, not just in opponents but in TV viewers for what they were about to see.
BS. Yeah he was amazing but Razor Ruddock knocked the shit Out of prime Tyson in two fights. Granted neither were ever the same after but if you weren’t American you weren’t terrified of him. Same for Frank Bruno.
Tyson’s footwork and movement was second to none. Watch his early fights and watch how he steps just offline and just out of the way of punches to deliver Jack hammers. Incredible
When he abandoned what Cus and Rooney , taught him you could see how much it showed in his fights . He could still get away with his brutal offense vs. average fighters and win ! but he no longer had the great defense he did before . Smart fighters like Holyfield , could see and time his "one" punch attacks coming . King brainwashed and ruined him as a fighter .
Jimmy Jacobs was or is considered the greatest handball player of all time he also owned the largest collection of boxing film in the world. He owns and sought for the rarest boxing films of all time. They have boxing film from Thomas Edison
@@sal4856 and if your over 50 your biased and don’t understand modern fighters Tyson was easily the best heavyweight. Maybe not the best “boxer” be he was too strong and quick for anyone to stop when surrounded by ropes
Best description of how good Tyson was. When people say guys like Tyson Fury are better, it’s just rubbish. Prime Tyson was a different animal. He would be way too fast , elusive and powerful for Fury…no doubt!
Yeah Fury would find it hard to land his jab with a guy with Tyson's head movement. But there were a couple of fighters that went the distance with prime Mike by sticking and moving
Fury is like a foot taller, there is a reason why there are weight classes in boxing. They should really make a superheavy weight class for people like Tyson fury.
@@arlenvandersmagt5560 he fought guys that are like 6’3 or 6’4 fury is 6’9 that has way more skills then all the tall fighters mike Tyson fought. Listen I like Mike Tyson too but you have to be real, there is not much mike Tyson could do to beat fury
Cus used to have a term for standing in front of a fighter where he could hit you, "laying in the middle." Cus wanted his boxers to move to their opponents sides as they hit them. After Cus died you could see Mike laying in the middle too much. He got away with it for a while. He also left the neck conditioning Cus made him do to help his chin. Mike under Cus was undefeatable.
Agreed but I think if he stayed with Kevin Rooney he would have stayed on track. With Rooney he won the title and 88 when Rooney left, in my opinion that’s when Mike’s prime left him too.
@@Bobby.2000 I just mean his prime ended when Rooney left in 88. 89 think he had two more fights then lost to Buster, then went to Jail not long after. The slide was pretty fast once King took over. By the time he fought Holyfield he didn’t move anywhere near as well
The Ali that fought Ezra Cleveland was unbeatable. After feeling out Cleveland in round 1, watch Ali's immaculate footwork, use of range, and speed. Untouchable and superb.
@@DoggieNYC Prime tyson vs prime Ali i really do thing Tyson wins, dude was just so hungry and being able to shift all that anger from his childhood into movement, power, speed - truly unbeatable.
@@CommonG I'm not saying he couldn't beat Ali in his prime, I think he could have. But what do we base it on ? Ali was every bit as talented as Tyson, was a top fighter for longer and Ali's mental fortitude and gamesmanship surpassed anything Tyson offered. I could easily see Ali teaching Tyson a lesson as he did many other big punching fighters. Ali was never knocked out, so is Tyson that guy ? Tyson ain't winning a decision over Ali right ? So Tyson would have to do something to a fighter, every bit as fast as him, that noone else was able to do. Its an interesting debate.
I was born in 1988 , around 5 years old i heard this Tyson name around and see kids at school saying this name and copy all these moves , I discovered this man later on hes the best boxer I’ve ever seen and FIRST time ive seen human done what he did .
His autobiography is excellent. It’s great to see him become such a wise owl and find peace in himself and in his life. Ur an inspiration to anyone who has struggled.
When prime Mike Tyson entered the ring,you generally feared for the life of his opponent. You generally thought, is this the time that he’s going to kill somebody in the ring. Prime tyson was that frightening
@@babyjesus1056 Oh, yes I was. Watched Tyson on free TV. Saturday afternoons on "Wide World of Sports" before anyone knew who he was.. do you know what that show is ? Probably not right ? I was huge Tyson fan from jump, who wasn't. But when he let his corner go it was a rap, I knew it, anyone who knew a lick about boxing knew it...And yes there were plenty of fights that I hoped would just be over so we could get to the next one. If you didn't feel that way than you probably weren't alive. There was now garauntees. Hind sight is always 20/20.
It was the confidence he got from Cus too, that was the key. Makes me cry when I watch them together sometimes , you can see the reaction in Mikes face when Cus says “he gives me a reason to go on”
I do agree that if Tyson would’ve kept the right people in his life especially when he became the youngest heavyweight champion of all time, And if Don King would’ve never gotten close to Tyson, he most likely would have become the Michael Jordan or the Tiger Woods of boxing, not just in terms of God gifted ability, because that was already apparent, but in terms of the body of work. With that said, the fighters that gave Tyson the most issues, even in his early prime, we’re fighters that were bigger and weren’t intimidated or afraid of him. Most of the fights that Tyson won were already won before the bell rang for the first round. That’s how intimidating he was. I think prime Larry Holmes would’ve given Tyson problems. I think Lennox Lewis would have given Tyson problems even if Tyson was in his prime. Holyfield would’ve given Tyson all that he could handle. Tyson Fury would have had the physical and mental tools to deal with Mike, and Ali would have had the ability to outbox Mike and would have tried to play all type of mind games with Mike like he did Sonny Liston. Tyson was if anything the most gifted heavyweight of all time, but I don’t think he was the greatest nor unbeatable.
I love the analysis that's amazingly put...however, I'd still take that prime pitbull Tyson over anyone who ever boxed. His ferociousness was teriffying inside and outside the ring.
He was so complete in his prime that even if you throw him in a colosseum as a gladiator nobody would stop him. He break opponents in the staredown when ever the opponent shy away with his eyes he knew he got him.
Every now and again history throws out these incredible people ...from great musicians...poets ...scientists...painters ...whatever it may be ...and yeah most definitely Tyson was one of these incredible people ...its only when you watch his old fights we remember just how good he was...
100% correct -- at his prime; meaning while he was still with the Cus D'Amato camp/Kevin Rooney he was invincible -- and he would have remained invincible if he'd not left his boxing family for that snake Don King. His downfall began then.
I agree with alot of what Joe says. It's the old question, what would happen if a prime Tyson fought a prime Ali? We'll never know really, but I do know that the Tyson who beat Spinks in 88, very, very few heavyweights in history could have lived with him that night.
A 1967 Ali vs a 1987 Mike Tyson would be a sight to see. Either could win. But if they fought more than ounce, Tysons odds would decrease in the rematches IMO.
We will never see anyone like mike Tyson again. The 80s was insane if it was now a days everybody would be all over his social media 24/7 as he was popular in the news 24/7.
Damn Joe knows more about Mike on a personal level than most people. I recognize that when he spoke about how vulnerable he was as a child is very deep and there is truth that only a few people would know
What Joe is saying is very true. The Mike Tyson that went up against Evander Holyfield and Lennox Luis was a flat footed Tyson that took punches right on the chin without moving. Prime Mike constantly bobbed his head and shifted his feet moving off line for defense and to set up combos. At some point he stopped doing his drills and absolutely refused to do cardio (running, jogging, jump-rope) and only wanted to do bags and sparring, so he stopped moving his head around. I suspect he also stopped watching old film, and I strongly suspect he stopped scouting his opponents or watching film on them. There is a clear shift in his career where he was either very distracted, confused, or lost his passion, or all of the above.
Yeah I’m my opinion 86-88 is his prime. Once Rooney left in 88 there’s a really quick drop off in ability. Had like two more fights in 89 then lost to Buster then was off to jail not much longer after that. He was done at that point. Just a testament to how well trained and natural abilities that he was still one of the best in the world and really was only a shell of his former self
@@jameszbierski391 The Ali of 1973 was NOT the fleet footed, lightening fast boxing machine who beat Liston, Quarry, Ellis, Williams, etc., but he did go on to beat Frazier, Foreman, Norton, Shavers, Lyle, Quarry etc. So, please, stop with the Tyson excuse making!!
We'll never know, but personally I think prime Ali beats prime Tyson. Just think about who Ali fought and beat, and how he beat Liston and Foreman - both terrifying boxers - with a combination of speed, dexterity, timing, courage, and unbelievable fight IQ. Most of Tyson's opponents were beaten before they stepped in the ring, but Ali would not have been intimidated and I think he would have frustrated Tyson into making mistakes, and punished those.
In my opinion there would be very little chance Ali would survive the early rounds with Tyson in his prime.. just the difference between Mike and anyone Ali fought is so different.. absolutely love Ali tho 👍🏽
@@daveyboy_ Sonny liston was Mike tyson with George foremans arms and he beat the brakes off him people forget that the prime Ali was lost to the world
@@lancy9110 people forget that actually physical prime Ali is a hypothetical because he sat in jail during that, and people also under rate how ridiculous sonny liston was, although stylistically a much different match due to his once in a lifetime set of arms for someone his build but liston smashed everyone they through in front of him for the better part of 15 years and Ali tap danced around him and the rest is history.
@@user-dd7pq2to3o but his dominance was outstanding, greatest heavyweight is Mike Tyson but the greatest boxer is someone in different weight, Tyson's iQ was the goat no one like him Tyson will always be stopping on every other champion Smartest of em all cus RIP Joe Rogan is not a casual sir Sorry to counter you 🙏
Joe, NOBODY can compare with Mike. To be the best fighter you need power, speed, aggressiveness, and you need to defend. Mike had it all, show me any other fighter who had that special combination
Tyson in his prime gives anyone in history a hard time, but I still can’t call him the best ever. It’s way too hard to come up with a definite answer though.
I think styles are these weird damn things... Tyson is my favorite, but so is Foreman. Old guard? Marciano. Who wins? We do!!! We have the tapes, baby!!!
Joe: 3,5 minute speech full of passion naming different aspects of mike tyson's greatness, expaining in detail why he's (a) goat joey: *There's just some people*
I'm no fighter, but I used to spar a lot when I was younger, and one thing I learned that I always think about when I think of Tyson, is the advantage of being a little shorter than your opponent *if* you know how to use it. Everyone talks about range and arm length and all that comes with being a tall fighter, but with a trained shorter guy, just the tiniest dip and they disappear. Like they're in your line of sight one second, they dip, and for that brief moment they're gone. They can close the space, get some body shots in, get in your guard for a nice uppercut. And if they're stout on top of it like Tyson. Low center of gravity, good stance and posture. Head and body movement. They're hard to keep track of.
90s Tyson, post prison, was still amazing but a depletion of his former ring-self. Yet he could still destroy opponents, other than Evander. But by then he seemed to be doing it for others and not himself.
Copied and pasted from a previous reply. I actually re watched the Holyfield 2 fight a few days ago and he’s head movement and setting up punches was no where near the same as 86 to say 88 prime Tyson. Once Kevin Rooney left it was down hill from there. And like you said add three years in prison and drugs ect he was %75 at best of what he used to be.
@@jameszbierski391 right on, the Evander 2 fight was also a head butt match Tyson was losing. Evander kind of got what he deserved as far as I'm concerned.
@@chrisrutherfurd9338 yeah man he was fighting real dirty and I guess Mike had enough. Picked up a big framed bite fight poster with two signed 16 oz gloves from that fight. Looks epic up on the wall
Prime Mike was hands down one of the most skilled destructive forces in heavyweight boxing history! A true anomaly! When he was on, he could beat absolutely anyone! Rogan broke it down, perfectly!
It's a cliche but the Tyson that destroyed the great Michael Spinks would have had a good chance of beating Tyson Fury or whoever was put in front of him, didn't matter who.
If you have seen Mike at fights where he is 15 years old , did you ever questioned yourself ? how can person look like this at 15 the will you need to have to at that early age be the first at gym and last at gym
He’s right, no fighter in history can beat 80’s tyson. 90´s tyson wasn’t the same cause obviously when you spend 3 years not fighting and doing drugs it affects your reflexes, his defense wasn’t the same after prison he was getting hit a lot more
I actually re watched the Holyfield 2 fight a few days ago and he’s head movement and setting up punches was no where near the same as 86 to say 88 prime Tyson. Once Kevin Rooney left it was down hill from there. And like you said add three years in prison and drugs ect he was %75 at best of what he used to be.
@@jameszbierski391 for the record his conviction was bogus and Don King took advantage of him as well. When Domatto died he lost his guidance, and his father figure
In boxing yeah. But I’m confident that the modern heavyweight MMA would strategically avoid standing with Tyson and that fight would be more about grappling. We throw 80’s Tyson and Ngannou in a room and only one leaves alive, I simply can’t put my money on Tyson.
Wanting to fight someone and being able to beat them at their best is two different things I've even heard Holyfield and Lenox Luis say at certain points in there Career that they weren't ready for Tyson go back and watch the interviews
Agree completely with Joe here. In those years which he refers to as ‘prime Tyson’ I maintain there’s no heavyweight of any era that beats him. He was a wrecking ball of a fighter. Explosive power, incredible movement, iron will, impregnable defence and perhaps most importantly….speed. I’ve watched boxing for forty years and that version of Tyson is the best I’ve ever seen.
Except he looked that way vs fighters that were not all time HW greats except Holmes. There were far lesser fighters that went the distance with Mike in his prime. so how do we say a truly great fighter couldnt.
@@EyeTunz You completely missed the point Joe was making. The key words are “when Mike was in his prime”. Mike was NOT in his prime when he lost to those other great boxers.
True story....you've summed it up exactly, a wrecking ball that destroys all challengers. All the 'styles' people talk about, Mike Tyson blasts through them all, he was indomitable in his prime. I wouldn't even bet against him if he fought Tyson Fury right now, after watching him toy with Roy Jones jnr.
Tyson was a scary dude but I don't think he could have beat a Prime Ali. Ali had amazing footwork speed and stamina. I also think that Ali was a smarter fighter and had more heart. Tyson would have to win by the 5th round against Ali.
I still remember how special that time was and I was like 3 in 1988. Parents plop me in front or close to TV lol 🤦♂️ I could hear what the older ppl in the room would say about him and it imprinted on me.
Love Mike and interesting but don't completely agree. He was the most dominant fighter for a time but didn't match up well with long armed jabbers who weren't intimidated. He is a time period great but wouldn't have beaten Holyfied or Lewis even if they were all in their prime. Unfortunately we only got to see them matchup later in their careers.
Actually Holyfield himself said (I think in Mike's own interview) that he didn't really believe in his chances until Rooney was fired. After that, Holyfield said, Tyson would become much more predictable and he knew he could win the fight. It's no one else's fault really but it's true that Mike was his best self for a very short period of time.
I remember an interview where he was asked what his best asset was. He said my elusiveness. He said nothing about his power. Examples, Mitch Green, Reggie Gross, those guys unloaded combos with Mike standing right in front of them and he slipped them all. I'll say it till the day I die, Mike was the best there ever was. The only heavyweight I can think of that would give 86 Tyson problems is Sonny Liston.
Hey thanks man. Yeah I just uploaded it to basically archive it because I feel the same way when it comes to Tyson. Unfortunately once Kevin Rooney left it was the beginning of the end but them few years he was unreal. He’s ability to slip and make them pay as never been matched in the heavyweight division since.
For me Rocky Marciano was the greatest heavyweight champion of all time. It wasn’t just the punishment he could dish out, but the punishment he could take. He won every championship fight by knockout, and won 43 of his 49 fights by ko. Marciano is and always will be the greatest of all time
@@DoggieNYC nope marciano ducked young up coming fighters most of his life wins or against fighters not in their prime and for that era he never had a lot of fights
@@watermarginramsgate180 All legit criticism. I don't know about ducking young fighters, if that was the case everyone was ducking them because there isn't a guy of note that I know that people say Rocky should have fought. If Rocky not champ, who is ? But the fact remains that the strength of competition wasn't there to call Rocky the greatest just like Holmes and Tyson. Biggest hole in the resume.
What a joke! Marciano was a 5 foot 9 inch, 180 pound midget who would have been destroyed by all of the top 10 fighters that Ali destroyed!!! Marciano had stubby arms, and a style that was made to be massacred by many, Ali for sure.
From what I heard Cassius Clay brought in the big money to boxing. And that reminds me of his poem: I am the Greatest. In it he says, “Then someone with color and someone with dash, brought fight fans a-runnin’ with cash”. Although Floyd Patterson made more money than Cassius Clay in their careers.
Joe tries with boxing history and I appreciate the effort. But we are all guilty of mythologizing our youth. Super old guys who might remember Joe Louis think he's the best. People who grew up in the sixties and seventies think it was Ali. And now guys in their forties and fifties think it's Tyson. But it can't be Tyson. You can't by definition be the greatest when you lose every signature fight after Spinks. And this whole prime thing carries less water when the guys who beat Mike in all those big fights were all older than he was. And it's cute how all these people try to isolate Mike's prime, but won't afford that luxury to other fighters. When those guys lose, they just lose. With Mike, it's oh his head wasn't right, he went to Jail, Don King, Robin Givens, etc. And these Tyson apologists end up with this no-lose argument they think they have when it's all lose because saying he was the best is just stamping your forehead with forever casual status.
Not a prime Mike he was focused a student and I even would hear a young Mike talk about how important the mental aspect of the game was not just being physically dominant and strong and that why he tried to get into fighters Head by being so frightening and physically opposing in his prime facts
Mike Tyson clearly was amazing at KO-ing guys . But let's face it , he wasn't fighting the Top 5 or Top 10 Heavy Weight contenders from 1986 - 1991 . In his prime Tyson ducked Evander Holyfield and Lennox Lewis for awhile , before Tyson went to Prison . 🤔🙄😳🌟💫💥🔥🙊🙉🙈😂😒⭐🌠🎃
Man, all i can think about is that Marvis Frazier fight. He killed him dead with that second uppercut, then he fucking brought him back to life with that right hook. Man literally beat someone dead and resurrected them. What a beast. EDIT: If, IF the JP/Mike fight isn't scripted, I think Mike will rip the kid's head off.
When discussing who is the best it's important to clarify what you mean by that , in terms of a boxing career as great as Tyson's was there are guys who did better , Lennox Lewis being one of them , but who peaked higher even if it was quite brief ?My pick is Mike Tyson being the best heavyweight at his best , and Roy Jones Jnr probably peaked a little higher than Floyd on the pound for pound list , I've got a few other fighters that had good careers but peaked much higher in comparison to their career average at their best than did other fighter's, there are some fighter's who are overhyped and never were as good as they were thought to be and those guys nearly always run into a top fighter that shows that they weren't that good , and then there are other fighters like Mike and others that just lose some of the magic fairly early on in their careers , they didn't get exposed, they just slipped in ability
I’m currently reading “Iron Ambition:Lessons I’ve learned from the Man who made me a champion. What a great, page turning book. I am struggling to put it down. Mike and Cus’ stories are incredible 🥊
Larry Holmes once said that he had taken single blows from many fighters much harder than Tyson. But, he had never known a boxer to hit him from so many different angles with such speed. And I think any boxer who has been KO’d it’s the one that you don’t see coming causes the most damage. That almost applies to everything in life doesn’t it? ha ha
Yup it's the speed and accuracy of the punches along with the massive power. His defense and iron chin get over looked as well
@Samarjith Vikram 🤣..like the punch of the first knockdown...
@Samarjith Vikram 😆😆
Mike was a freak of nature
I don't belive Holmes, it was a statement intended to deny the deserved honour to his opponent, who made him flat in the 4th Round.
Physics is against Holmes.
The kinetic energy 'E' of a body is proportional to its mass and proportional to the square (!) of its velocity.
So you double the speed you have 4 times more energy (in the Punches thrown on opponents :-)
The passion Joe has whenever he talk about Tyson is insane. Can see in his eyes how much he appreciate and respect Mike Tyson..
Rogan said he had to make his table wider after his first interview with Tyson...I think he feared for his life, and I don't blame him.
I always thought that prime Mike Tyson could beat any heavyweight in any era.
Hard to bet agaisn't Fury
@@kidusgebretensay7228 I'm a big Tyson Fury fan, but I think prime Mike Tyson wins. He would bob and weave, use footwork to get inside and slowly break down Fury.
I'm with u there bro
Talent by talent, I think Muhammand Ali had speed, could adapt, and could endure punishment and return flurries. But if Cus D Amato or Rhooney he would diminish his weaknesses and increase his strengths
@@kidusgebretensay7228 havent seen Fury fight anyone close to Mikes Speed or intensity..
Mike Tyson was frightening. How he fought was like nothing id seen. He was devastating. His presence in a ring instilled fear, not just in opponents but in TV viewers for what they were about to see.
The crazy part of it to his he’s a really small heavyweight. I’m 5’8 and when I stood next to him he wasn’t much taller
Joe's knees got so dirty in this clip Ha !~
That's because you hadn't watched anything prior to 1970.
U dnt know wtf your talk about
BS. Yeah he was amazing but Razor Ruddock knocked the shit Out of prime Tyson in two fights. Granted neither were ever the same after but if you weren’t American you weren’t terrified of him. Same for Frank Bruno.
Tyson’s footwork and movement was second to none. Watch his early fights and watch how he steps just offline and just out of the way of punches to deliver Jack hammers. Incredible
💯
When he abandoned what Cus and Rooney , taught him you could see how much it showed in his fights . He could still get away with his brutal offense vs. average fighters and win ! but he no longer had the great defense he did before . Smart fighters like Holyfield , could see and time his "one" punch attacks coming . King brainwashed and ruined him as a fighter .
@@SJ-ty5rw now that you mention it less focused Tyson did turn into Wilder but without the height and length to help cover his weaknesses
Against nobodies
Ok, how many other fighters did you actually watch? His footwork and movement was great, but by no means "second to none".
Joe is so talented.
His way of articulating words and process it into his mind to deliver ideas is fascinating and interesting!
I love your sarcasm lol
Jimmy Jacobs was or is considered the greatest handball player of all time he also owned the largest collection of boxing film in the world. He owns and sought for the rarest boxing films of all time. They have boxing film from Thomas Edison
Oh.
Ivano Balic is goat of handball
played handball until 50,great workout and mind fixing game ,mano on mano,
Man, I loved hearing Joe's passion while he told Mike Tyson's story.
Absolutely love Tyson, no one will be remembered like him no matter what anyone thinks he was an is still is phenomenal
This gave me the chills listening to this , I remember watching those years of Mike in his prime .. What a beast 💪
I agree 100%, Tyson was the best heavyweight. His power was so devastating.
you must be under 50 lol
@@sal4856 Nah you’re just ignorant
@@sal4856 and if your over 50 your biased and don’t understand modern fighters Tyson was easily the best heavyweight. Maybe not the best “boxer” be he was too strong and quick for anyone to stop when surrounded by ropes
Technique
Conditioning
Physique
Boxing knowledge
Influences
The being that is Mike Tyson
Boxing's most ferocious champion ever.
Best description of how good Tyson was. When people say guys like Tyson Fury are better, it’s just rubbish. Prime Tyson was a different animal. He would be way too fast , elusive and powerful for Fury…no doubt!
Yeah Fury would find it hard to land his jab with a guy with Tyson's head movement. But there were a couple of fighters that went the distance with prime Mike by sticking and moving
There is a reason why Tyson Fury is named 'Tyson' Fury. 😅
Fury is like a foot taller, there is a reason why there are weight classes in boxing. They should really make a superheavy weight class for people like Tyson fury.
@@joshuajomy8921 yes , but Tyson fought taller guys and won…guys like him and Jlitsko and stuff are too slow
@@arlenvandersmagt5560 he fought guys that are like 6’3 or 6’4 fury is 6’9 that has way more skills then all the tall fighters mike Tyson fought. Listen I like Mike Tyson too but you have to be real, there is not much mike Tyson could do to beat fury
Mike was killing machine literally
Cus used to have a term for standing in front of a fighter where he could hit you, "laying in the middle." Cus wanted his boxers to move to their opponents sides as they hit them. After Cus died you could see Mike laying in the middle too much. He got away with it for a while. He also left the neck conditioning Cus made him do to help his chin. Mike under Cus was undefeatable.
Agreed but I think if he stayed with Kevin Rooney he would have stayed on track. With Rooney he won the title and 88 when Rooney left, in my opinion that’s when Mike’s prime left him too.
Did cus make any other great fighters?
@@jameszbierski391 Tyson won the title in 86. Then unified the title in 87. Do you mean became undisputed in 88?
@@paintballer13377 he trained floyd patterson who was the youngest heavyweight champion before iron mike
@@Bobby.2000 I just mean his prime ended when Rooney left in 88. 89 think he had two more fights then lost to Buster, then went to Jail not long after. The slide was pretty fast once King took over. By the time he fought Holyfield he didn’t move anywhere near as well
The Ali that fought Ezra Cleveland was unbeatable. After feeling out Cleveland in round 1, watch Ali's immaculate footwork, use of range, and speed. Untouchable and superb.
@@idkmyd Wishful thinking.
@@DoggieNYC Prime tyson vs prime Ali i really do thing Tyson wins, dude was just so hungry and being able to shift all that anger from his childhood into movement, power, speed - truly unbeatable.
@@CommonG I'm not saying he couldn't beat Ali in his prime, I think he could have. But what do we base it on ? Ali was every bit as talented as Tyson, was a top fighter for longer and Ali's mental fortitude and gamesmanship surpassed anything Tyson offered. I could easily see Ali teaching Tyson a lesson as he did many other big punching fighters. Ali was never knocked out, so is Tyson that guy ? Tyson ain't winning a decision over Ali right ? So Tyson would have to do something to a fighter, every bit as fast as him, that noone else was able to do. Its an interesting debate.
@@DoggieNYC Greatly worded, it really is a ‘what if’ debate - two boxing giants going at it in their prime, if only.
I think Tyson furry could beat either of them he's 6'9 280 lbs and can box he's a nightmare match up for any past heavyweight
I was born in 1988 , around 5 years old i heard this Tyson name around and see kids at school saying this name and copy all these moves , I discovered this man later on hes the best boxer I’ve ever seen and FIRST time ive seen human done what he did .
His autobiography is excellent.
It’s great to see him become such a wise owl and find peace in himself and in his life.
Ur an inspiration to anyone who has struggled.
I love how while Joe is talking we can hear Joey heavily breathimg 🤣🤣🤣
When prime Mike Tyson entered the ring,you generally feared for the life of his opponent. You generally thought, is this the time that he’s going to kill somebody in the ring. Prime tyson was that frightening
I didn't feel that way. I often was worried maybe this is the fight Mike gets beat before he gets to unify the title.
@@DoggieNYC you weren’t alive
@@babyjesus1056 Oh, yes I was. Watched Tyson on free TV. Saturday afternoons on "Wide World of Sports" before anyone knew who he was.. do you know what that show is ? Probably not right ? I was huge Tyson fan from jump, who wasn't. But when he let his corner go it was a rap, I knew it, anyone who knew a lick about boxing knew it...And yes there were plenty of fights that I hoped would just be over so we could get to the next one. If you didn't feel that way than you probably weren't alive. There was now garauntees. Hind sight is always 20/20.
I was impressed that Joey did not say a single word during Joe's monolog.
1:06 he said 1 😭
Strong... STROOONG
I’ve always said that about Tyson. An absolute beast in and out of the ring
I wish somebody would love me the way Joe loves Mike....
It was the confidence he got from Cus too, that was the key. Makes me cry when I watch them together sometimes , you can see the reaction in Mikes face when Cus says “he gives me a reason to go on”
Once he and Rooney left Mike was pretty much done
I do agree that if Tyson would’ve kept the right people in his life especially when he became the youngest heavyweight champion of all time, And if Don King would’ve never gotten close to Tyson, he most likely would have become the Michael Jordan or the Tiger Woods of boxing, not just in terms of God gifted ability, because that was already apparent, but in terms of the body of work. With that said, the fighters that gave Tyson the most issues, even in his early prime, we’re fighters that were bigger and weren’t intimidated or afraid of him. Most of the fights that Tyson won were already won before the bell rang for the first round. That’s how intimidating he was. I think prime Larry Holmes would’ve given Tyson problems. I think Lennox Lewis would have given Tyson problems even if Tyson was in his prime. Holyfield would’ve given Tyson all that he could handle. Tyson Fury would have had the physical and mental tools to deal with Mike, and Ali would have had the ability to outbox Mike and would have tried to play all type of mind games with Mike like he did Sonny Liston. Tyson was if anything the most gifted heavyweight of all time, but I don’t think he was the greatest nor unbeatable.
I love the analysis that's amazingly put...however, I'd still take that prime pitbull Tyson over anyone who ever boxed. His ferociousness was teriffying inside and outside the ring.
shoulda woulda coulda. never has there been a fighter in history that more excuses have been made for.
Tyson Fury? Really?
Tyson would have smashed Fury, decapitated him
@@sarezhsharif7564 nobody knows, great great fighters of yesteryear never get their respect ,when the game was way more brutal
He was so complete in his prime that even if you throw him in a colosseum as a gladiator nobody would stop him. He break opponents in the staredown when ever the opponent shy away with his eyes he knew he got him.
He told you that personally?
@@leerjet8784 yep
Every now and again history throws out these incredible people ...from great musicians...poets ...scientists...painters ...whatever it may be ...and yeah most definitely Tyson was one of these incredible people ...its only when you watch his old fights we remember just how good he was...
Absolutely. It's not even a 'once in a generation' thing. It's an ultra rarefied occurrence.
Most perfect fighter ever. 85-88. No one has ever had that combo of speed and POWER. Perfect fighter.
100% correct -- at his prime; meaning while he was still with the Cus D'Amato camp/Kevin Rooney he was invincible -- and he would have remained invincible if he'd not left his boxing family for that snake Don King. His downfall began then.
And Rhona rousey is the greatest boxer of all time.
Yeah man once Rooney left in 88 was all down hill
@@paintballer13377 could have beaten Mayweather sir, brings a tear to my eye *sniff
@@paintballer13377 nah mcgreggor was the greatest, he survived 10 rounds with the greatest boxer ever to live who is mayweather
nonsense. no fighter is invincible. when are people gonna learn this?
I agree with alot of what Joe says. It's the old question, what would happen if a prime Tyson fought a prime Ali? We'll never know really, but I do know that the Tyson who beat Spinks in 88, very, very few heavyweights in history could have lived with him that night.
A 1967 Ali vs a 1987 Mike Tyson would be a sight to see. Either could win. But if they fought more than ounce, Tysons odds would decrease in the rematches IMO.
@@DoggieNYC Best answer.
@@susiederkins6612 What fighter as good as Ali did Tyson ever beat ? None. And who ever stopped Ali ? Noone. Odss are against Mike.
@@susiederkins6612 Okay. Do you.
@@susiederkins6612 Have something to add ? 🤔
I agree with Joe, 86-88 Tyson would beat any heavyweight in their prime, even prime Ali.
We will never see anyone like mike Tyson again. The 80s was insane if it was now a days everybody would be all over his social media 24/7 as he was popular in the news 24/7.
I always remember being scared for the person he was fighting. I couldn’t believe someone would get in the ring with him.
rocky marciano would have motioned him to the center of the ring , afraid? lol lol
Damn Joe knows more about Mike on a personal level than most people. I recognize that when he spoke about how vulnerable he was as a child is very deep and there is truth that only a few people would know
Tyson was what every fighter deep inside wants to be,a god of war.
Hahaha. Hmmm hello. Most fighters don’t dream of getting their ads kicked over and over again.
Fun fact, Jim Jacobs was also a World Handball Champ multiple times.
Sports Illuatrated call him "the best athlete ever" haha
There will never be another
Mike Tyson Best ever
I get so fucking fired up listening to Joe talk about Prime Mike.
What Joe is saying is very true. The Mike Tyson that went up against Evander Holyfield and Lennox Luis was a flat footed Tyson that took punches right on the chin without moving. Prime Mike constantly bobbed his head and shifted his feet moving off line for defense and to set up combos. At some point he stopped doing his drills and absolutely refused to do cardio (running, jogging, jump-rope) and only wanted to do bags and sparring, so he stopped moving his head around. I suspect he also stopped watching old film, and I strongly suspect he stopped scouting his opponents or watching film on them. There is a clear shift in his career where he was either very distracted, confused, or lost his passion, or all of the above.
Yeah I’m my opinion 86-88 is his prime. Once Rooney left in 88 there’s a really quick drop off in ability. Had like two more fights in 89 then lost to Buster then was off to jail not much longer after that. He was done at that point. Just a testament to how well trained and natural abilities that he was still one of the best in the world and really was only a shell of his former self
@@jameszbierski391 The Ali of 1973 was NOT the fleet footed, lightening fast boxing machine who beat Liston, Quarry, Ellis, Williams, etc., but he did go on to beat Frazier, Foreman, Norton, Shavers, Lyle, Quarry etc. So, please, stop with the Tyson excuse making!!
Anyone who knows about boxing, knows that Prime Mike was the most dangerous boxer of all time. No boxer could handle that smoke
We'll never know, but personally I think prime Ali beats prime Tyson. Just think about who Ali fought and beat, and how he beat Liston and Foreman - both terrifying boxers - with a combination of speed, dexterity, timing, courage, and unbelievable fight IQ. Most of Tyson's opponents were beaten before they stepped in the ring, but Ali would not have been intimidated and I think he would have frustrated Tyson into making mistakes, and punished those.
Ali never fought anyone with Tysons speed , power and defense
In my opinion there would be very little chance Ali would survive the early rounds with Tyson in his prime.. just the difference between Mike and anyone Ali fought is so different.. absolutely love Ali tho 👍🏽
@@daveyboy_ Sonny liston was Mike tyson with George foremans arms and he beat the brakes off him people forget that the prime Ali was lost to the world
@@lancy9110 people forget that actually physical prime Ali is a hypothetical because he sat in jail during that, and people also under rate how ridiculous sonny liston was, although stylistically a much different match due to his once in a lifetime set of arms for someone his build but liston smashed everyone they through in front of him for the better part of 15 years and Ali tap danced around him and the rest is history.
@@coreygolphenee9633 Sonny Liston didnt have Tysons speed .
This man knows how to explain shit truthfully
I love when Joe rogan talks about tyson, lmao he really means it from the heart
Doesn't make any of it true
@@user-dd7pq2to3o that’s not what the comment said, but go ahead and enlighten us with the truth
@@ehseagle08 the truth is Rogan is casual. Tyson wasn't the best heavyweight of his era let alone all time
a fucking destrooooyer man!! DESTRUCTIVE, PRECISE
Joey Diaz: Strooooooong.... STROOOONG
@@user-dd7pq2to3o but his dominance was outstanding, greatest heavyweight is Mike Tyson but the greatest boxer is someone in different weight,
Tyson's iQ was the goat no one like him
Tyson will always be stopping on every other champion
Smartest of em all cus RIP
Joe Rogan is not a casual sir
Sorry to counter you 🙏
Joe, NOBODY can compare with Mike. To be the best fighter you need power, speed, aggressiveness, and you need to defend. Mike had it all, show me any other fighter who had that special combination
Tyson in his prime gives anyone in history a hard time, but I still can’t call him the best ever. It’s way too hard to come up with a definite answer though.
I think styles are these weird damn things... Tyson is my favorite, but so is Foreman. Old guard? Marciano. Who wins? We do!!! We have the tapes, baby!!!
Joe: 3,5 minute speech full of passion naming different aspects of mike tyson's greatness, expaining in detail why he's (a) goat
joey: *There's just some people*
I'm no fighter, but I used to spar a lot when I was younger, and one thing I learned that I always think about when I think of Tyson, is the advantage of being a little shorter than your opponent *if* you know how to use it. Everyone talks about range and arm length and all that comes with being a tall fighter, but with a trained shorter guy, just the tiniest dip and they disappear. Like they're in your line of sight one second, they dip, and for that brief moment they're gone. They can close the space, get some body shots in, get in your guard for a nice uppercut. And if they're stout on top of it like Tyson. Low center of gravity, good stance and posture. Head and body movement. They're hard to keep track of.
90s Tyson, post prison, was still amazing but a depletion of his former ring-self. Yet he could still destroy opponents, other than Evander. But by then he seemed to be doing it for others and not himself.
Copied and pasted from a previous reply.
I actually re watched the Holyfield 2 fight a few days ago and he’s head movement and setting up punches was no where near the same as 86 to say 88 prime Tyson. Once Kevin Rooney left it was down hill from there. And like you said add three years in prison and drugs ect he was %75 at best of what he used to be.
@@jameszbierski391 right on, the Evander 2 fight was also a head butt match Tyson was losing. Evander kind of got what he deserved as far as I'm concerned.
@@chrisrutherfurd9338 yeah man he was fighting real dirty and I guess Mike had enough. Picked up a big framed bite fight poster with two signed 16 oz gloves from that fight. Looks epic up on the wall
@@jameszbierski391 wow, very cool!
@@chrisrutherfurd9338 cheers mate 👍🏻👍🏻
What about Rocky Marciano? He always gets slept on.
Prime Mike was hands down one of the most skilled destructive forces in heavyweight boxing history! A true anomaly! When he was on, he could beat absolutely anyone! Rogan broke it down, perfectly!
Tyson Fury sparks them all. Dossers
It's a cliche but the Tyson that destroyed the great Michael Spinks would have had a good chance of beating Tyson Fury or whoever was put in front of him, didn't matter who.
He might have had a shot at beating Buster Douglas, but reality warps chance
@@dajosee Very true, which is why Tyson was really good but isn't one of the all time greats.
Totally agree with every word!He was a force of Nature!
If you have seen Mike at fights where he is 15 years old , did you ever questioned yourself ? how can person look like this at 15
the will you need to have to at that early age be the first at gym and last at gym
I totally agree, Mike Tyson was the most special boxer of ALL TIME !!!!!
He’s right, no fighter in history can beat 80’s tyson. 90´s tyson wasn’t the same cause obviously when you spend 3 years not fighting and doing drugs it affects your reflexes, his defense wasn’t the same after prison he was getting hit a lot more
I actually re watched the Holyfield 2 fight a few days ago and he’s head movement and setting up punches was no where near the same as 86 to say 88 prime Tyson. Once Kevin Rooney left it was down hill from there. And like you said add three years in prison and drugs ect he was %75 at best of what he used to be.
@@jameszbierski391 for the record his conviction was bogus and Don King took advantage of him as well. When Domatto died he lost his guidance, and his father figure
Lewis would of beaten him no doubt.
@@edwardhosmer5726 yeah I definitely agree with that. I mean she go’s to Mikes room in the middle of the night then cry’s rape. Just seams off.
In boxing yeah. But I’m confident that the modern heavyweight MMA would strategically avoid standing with Tyson and that fight would be more about grappling.
We throw 80’s Tyson and Ngannou in a room and only one leaves alive, I simply can’t put my money on Tyson.
Well said Joe I try and explain this to people Mike 1986-1990 NOBODY wanted none of Mike believe that 💯
Holyfield did.
Wanting to fight someone and being able to beat them at their best is two different things I've even heard Holyfield and Lenox Luis say at certain points in there Career that they weren't ready for Tyson go back and watch the interviews
Agree completely with Joe here. In those years which he refers to as ‘prime Tyson’ I maintain there’s no heavyweight of any era that beats him. He was a wrecking ball of a fighter. Explosive power, incredible movement, iron will, impregnable defence and perhaps most importantly….speed. I’ve watched boxing for forty years and that version of Tyson is the best I’ve ever seen.
Except for any other great from his era that he faced and got destroyed by. Haha. What the hell? Do people actually watch the fights??
Except he looked that way vs fighters that were not all time HW greats except Holmes. There were far lesser fighters that went the distance with Mike in his prime. so how do we say a truly great fighter couldnt.
Never even saw prime ali
@@EyeTunz You completely missed the point Joe was making. The key words are “when Mike was in his prime”. Mike was NOT in his prime when he lost to those other great boxers.
True story....you've summed it up exactly, a wrecking ball that destroys all challengers. All the 'styles' people talk about, Mike Tyson blasts through them all, he was indomitable in his prime. I wouldn't even bet against him if he fought Tyson Fury right now, after watching him toy with Roy Jones jnr.
tyson with kevin rooney was the all time great !
If it was a pure technical boxing match that went the distance - Ali
If it was a brawl lasting a few rounds - Tyson
What a beautiful ode to one of the greatest of all time if not The greatest of all time.
Tyson was a scary dude but I don't think he could have beat a Prime Ali. Ali had amazing footwork speed and stamina. I also think that Ali was a smarter fighter and had more heart. Tyson would have to win by the 5th round against Ali.
I still remember how special that time was and I was like 3 in 1988.
Parents plop me in front or close to TV lol 🤦♂️
I could hear what the older ppl in the room would say about him and it imprinted on me.
Love Mike and interesting but don't completely agree. He was the most dominant fighter for a time but didn't match up well with long armed jabbers who weren't intimidated. He is a time period great but wouldn't have beaten Holyfied or Lewis even if they were all in their prime. Unfortunately we only got to see them matchup later in their careers.
Facts.
Actually Holyfield himself said (I think in Mike's own interview) that he didn't really believe in his chances until Rooney was fired. After that, Holyfield said, Tyson would become much more predictable and he knew he could win the fight. It's no one else's fault really but it's true that Mike was his best self for a very short period of time.
Born and raised Brockton Ma, so unlike everyone else. I’ll never forget about the great Rocky Marciano.
I remember an interview where he was asked what his best asset was. He said my elusiveness. He said nothing about his power.
Examples, Mitch Green, Reggie Gross, those guys unloaded combos with Mike standing right in front of them and he slipped them all.
I'll say it till the day I die, Mike was the best there ever was. The only heavyweight I can think of that would give 86 Tyson problems is Sonny Liston.
Mike Tyson in his prime was a perfect fighting machine. A fuckin Gladiator!!!
If the two met at their peak, Ali was tailor made for Tyson. That fight would have been an easy night for Mike.
Joe knows his shit. He goes deep.. Thanks for the upload, an Uncle Joey fan is a mate of mine. Liked and subscribed
Hey thanks man. Yeah I just uploaded it to basically archive it because I feel the same way when it comes to Tyson. Unfortunately once Kevin Rooney left it was the beginning of the end but them few years he was unreal. He’s ability to slip and make them pay as never been matched in the heavyweight division since.
For me Rocky Marciano was the greatest heavyweight champion of all time.
It wasn’t just the punishment he could dish out, but the punishment he could take.
He won every championship fight by knockout, and won 43 of his 49 fights by ko.
Marciano is and always will be the greatest of all time
He’s definitely better than Tyson that’s for sure. Just like most others.
You can make a better case for Rock than Mike.
@@DoggieNYC nope marciano ducked young up coming fighters most of his life wins or against fighters not in their prime and for that era he never had a lot of fights
@@watermarginramsgate180 All legit criticism. I don't know about ducking young fighters, if that was the case everyone was ducking them because there isn't a guy of note that I know that people say Rocky should have fought. If Rocky not champ, who is ? But the fact remains that the strength of competition wasn't there to call Rocky the greatest just like Holmes and Tyson. Biggest hole in the resume.
What a joke! Marciano was a 5 foot 9 inch, 180 pound midget who would have been destroyed by all of the top 10 fighters that Ali destroyed!!! Marciano had stubby arms, and a style that was made to be massacred by many, Ali for sure.
Joe nailed it, it's about match-ups. Mike is n the convo 4 sho
💯
From what I heard Cassius Clay brought in the big money to boxing. And that reminds me of his poem: I am the Greatest. In it he says, “Then someone with color and someone with dash, brought fight fans a-runnin’ with cash”. Although Floyd Patterson made more money than Cassius Clay in their careers.
His name is Muhammad Ali.
At this point in 2022 is there any functional purpose except for trying to instigate conflict in using that name?
Why be disrespectful and call him by the name he clearly didn’t want? His name is Muhammad Ali
Bro do u not accept his real name Muhammad Ali he even publicly stated that he will never use his original name
Tyson was so amazing because he was “kinda” like a left handed, orthodox boxer.
Joe tries with boxing history and I appreciate the effort. But we are all guilty of mythologizing our youth. Super old guys who might remember Joe Louis think he's the best. People who grew up in the sixties and seventies think it was Ali. And now guys in their forties and fifties think it's Tyson. But it can't be Tyson. You can't by definition be the greatest when you lose every signature fight after Spinks. And this whole prime thing carries less water when the guys who beat Mike in all those big fights were all older than he was. And it's cute how all these people try to isolate Mike's prime, but won't afford that luxury to other fighters. When those guys lose, they just lose. With Mike, it's oh his head wasn't right, he went to Jail, Don King, Robin Givens, etc. And these Tyson apologists end up with this no-lose argument they think they have when it's all lose because saying he was the best is just stamping your forehead with forever casual status.
It's just Undeniable. There will be noone better.
Definitely not.
Tyson would come undone against a prime Ali.
Not a prime Mike he was focused a student and I even would hear a young Mike talk about how important the mental aspect of the game was not just being physically dominant and strong and that why he tried to get into fighters Head by being so frightening and physically opposing in his prime facts
Tyson in three, down goes Ali.
Mike Tyson is a walking boxing encyclopedia. He’s much more intelligent than any other heavyweight.
Mike Tyson clearly was amazing at KO-ing guys . But let's face it , he wasn't fighting the Top 5 or Top 10 Heavy Weight contenders from 1986 - 1991 . In his prime Tyson ducked Evander Holyfield and Lennox Lewis for awhile , before Tyson went to Prison . 🤔🙄😳🌟💫💥🔥🙊🙉🙈😂😒⭐🌠🎃
Finally someone said it! MT GOAT
Mike Tyson in 87 was a total machine he would have smashed any fighter past or current day and that's a fact
I was googling “custom motto” 🤦🏻♂️
He perfected the "peekaboo" fighting style. Which was very rare when he was on top.
I agree with everything Joe says here.
Love what Joey Diaz says!👌
Undisputed best knockout punch ever.
Tyson speed is so under rated. He was so quick and very dangerous
It’s unimaginable that there will be another person (Boxer) physically and both boxing ability at 20/21 yrs old, who will win the heavy weight belt 🤯🤯
Mike Tyson with Kevin Rooney was Nuclear.
💯
Joe is so enthusiastic......absolutely lovely to listen to.the man is such a fantastic host.
I’m 40
I remember being a kid (late 80’s) and the 2 most famous people on the planet were Michael Jackson and Mike Tyson
I’m not to far behind you, and yeah 💯. Probably could add Michael Jordan in there by 1990
Watching Mike fight was like watching a Predator maul it's Prey to death.
Man, all i can think about is that Marvis Frazier fight. He killed him dead with that second uppercut, then he fucking brought him back to life with that right hook. Man literally beat someone dead and resurrected them. What a beast.
EDIT: If, IF the JP/Mike fight isn't scripted, I think Mike will rip the kid's head off.
Don't recall seeing so many professional fighters with fear in their eyes when it was iron Mike staring them down
When discussing who is the best it's important to clarify what you mean by that , in terms of a boxing career as great as Tyson's was there are guys who did better , Lennox Lewis being one of them , but who peaked higher even if it was quite brief ?My pick is Mike Tyson being the best heavyweight at his best , and Roy Jones Jnr probably peaked a little higher than Floyd on the pound for pound list , I've got a few other fighters that had good careers but peaked much higher in comparison to their career average at their best than did other fighter's, there are some fighter's who are overhyped and never were as good as they were thought to be and those guys nearly always run into a top fighter that shows that they weren't that good , and then there are other fighters like Mike and others that just lose some of the magic fairly early on in their careers , they didn't get exposed, they just slipped in ability
Tyson and Frazier would of been cool to watch.
Tyson from 85 and 91 is the deadliest, most brutal death machine ever. Guy drank blood and chewed flesh. Baddest mdfk ever
I’m currently reading “Iron Ambition:Lessons I’ve learned from the Man who made me a champion. What a great, page turning book. I am struggling to put it down. Mike and Cus’ stories are incredible 🥊
I’ll have to check it out. Thanks for the suggestion
I actually thought Joe was talking to himself for 4 min straight. And then at the end, I heard 2 words from Joey Diaz! LOL!
I fully agree. Peak tyson was insane
Myke Tyson best boxer 🥊 now hopefully I'm next because I'm 6feet fast as a beast
Maybe you could but you need to be disciplined. Very disciplined. But best wishes from me man.
@@varaangsingh happy new year good health peace of mind and prosperity thank you + I also am skilled in Japanese martial arts