Ppl called me crazy because i agreed about the unliving of the child. She didn't want her children to suffer on this earth so they had freedom in the after life.
plus, we(the viewers and Sethe herself) do not know what was awaiting them. it couldve been hell on earth as we see how bad things were before she left. those evil ppl couldve killed her children themselves. what she did was drastic and intense, but in her mind, she was giving her children what she thought was the better ending
@@ettamae05 I like the comparison, pain, sorrow, and cruelty experienced by the Mother can definitely affect the children...*SPOILER* But, I do not have the same compassion for Medea, to use her children to get back at a man is too much revenge for me. LOL
I saw this as a teenager and wasn’t confused and never read the book🤷🏾♀️ I think you have to pay close attention but the story isn’t that hard to follow in my opinion.
The book is about the manifestation of trauma…. Beloved was that manifestation. Her physical age representing that time had passed but her mental development showing the freshness of the pain. The problem is the literal interpretation.
@@HeitCheri I think most people who watch the film without actually reading the book tend to be overwhelmed by the imagery and perspective of the story telling. Those who are confused are confused because they are watching from a literal standpoint. This is a horror story but not in the typical sense. The villain is the experience of slavery. And each character is a victim carrying trauma that requires acknowledgement and ultimately excorcism. Beloved symbolizes Sethes inability to heal from doing what would typically be considered unforgivable. I think anyone who experiences trauma understands the load it makes you carry and how it haunts you especially when it goes unaddressed. There’s so much symbolism in the book and film, I dont think I could start to break it down without writing a thesis . But Beloved is just the manifestation of fear, trauma and pain.
Btw love that you covered this film. Toni Morrison is one of my favorite authors. The anthology of the bluest eye, beloved, and paradise are so layered and deep. All described as stories ultimately about love and pain and how we are defined by those experiences. Sethe loved all of her children so much that she could not imagine them experiencing the trauma and humiliation she experienced in slavery. Her love for beloved is also what creates the haunting. She let go in the physical but never let go of the spirit. At the end the exorcism of the manifested being is acceptance of act she committed in fear but out of love.ultimately her PTSD is whats haunting her and impacting her relationships with her children with paul d, and with herself.
Thanks for explaining what you meant. 😊 I agree about the layered meanings. I believe that Toni Morrison deliberately left room for the reader's interpretation as well. She understood that the ability to interpret her words are directly related to the reader's experiences and perspectives. For this reason, I would be hesitant to assign a definitive interpretation to things that she does not specifically spell out. We will be discussing all of this in great detail in our series. This video was really an introduction to the story. We haven't begun to peel back and examine all the layers yet 😊
I agree. That's how I feel about it, too. *Beloved* and *The Passion of the Christ* are the two movies I LOVED, but will never, ever, EVER watch either of them again. It stayed with me.
The best part of the film was Baby Suggs sermon. Imagine, a prisoner of war, the victims of war crimes and the world sympathizing with their pain and providing support while they heal but that never happened after slavery ended. There was no acknowledgment of what they experienced, no reckoning for the ones who committed atrocities during slavery. Their trauma was not worthy of sympathy. Baby Suggs’ sermons acted as therapy for her people who were still suffering from PTSD in hopes that their trauma would not pass onto their children and their children’s children. But, we still feel it to this day. And what Baby Suggs preached spoke to that trauma within those recently freed men and women but it was also meant to speak to us, their decendents. We must love ourselves and each other.
Her sermon always moved me but one day as adult it had me in tears because Baby Suggs despite her seeing the harshness of slavery and lost she wanted to liberate them there children and so forth. But as one mentioned she was envied and that liberation died when she died but by the end of the novel and movie gold kept her words close.
Fun fact: I was in high school when this film was made. They shot a lot in the Greater Philadelphia area. I was an extra in the final scene (so was my aunt who drove me to set). Even more awesome, months later, they had the premiere in Philly at the movie theater I worked at, guess who showed up? OPRAH! I actually stood behind her on the escalator and got nervous and hopped off to let her go down to the lobby in peace. When she got to the bottom, I yelled “I love you!” And she yelled back “I love you too!” Best story of my teenage life! Will forever cherish this film for that reason 🤎
My Granny had read the novel when the movie came out and we all went to see it as a family. I was in high school when it came out. I’ve always loved our history so I was never put off by it being a “slave” movie. I read the book after I saw the movie and yes, the book was much better. I never thought of it as a horror movie although slavery was horrific. I also took Beloved being in an adult body as an infant as her trauma age. She never grew (psychologically, emotionally) past the age of her trauma.
I forget how I found out about the movie but me, my mom and my sister sat down and watched it (back in the day). It was weird, and kinda confusing. So I went and got the book and read it, hoping for some clarity. Didn't really get any, but it WAS easier to follow than the movie.
124. This is just my opinion. I went to the theater to see this movie with my ex. After the movie he asked me to explain what we saw. That wasnt an issue for me because I had read the novel. This movie might not be appreciated by men. Ms. Morrison's novels focused on black life. However, her novels also had a matriarchal tone. I appreciate that because a lot of black writers didn't do that at the time. Another thing is that we can't look at Beloved from today's view. We can always say what we wouldn't do. I couldn't imagine the horrors that our ancestors faced.
I always saw Beloved as the embodiment of trauma… frozen in time, sad, scared, always hungry, and filled with rage. To me, the ghost becoming Beloved the woman embodied the trauma of slavery, of the past, and what those who survived could not escape.
most two year olds are psychos..i don't think vengeance was her objective, she was just merely a baby who never had a chance to develop mentally. most toddlers are psychos in my opinion.
@kenyahogan2399 😂You've got a point about toddlers. I agree with you that she just never got to evolve beyond a base psyche and urges due to her emotional age. When you add her trauma and loss, you get a nightmare. Even though it is my prayer that in such a situation, a healing would take place on a spiritual level 🙏🏽.
@@aya9af truth. It also occured to me that beloved is sethe and they both are her mother going all the way back. Sethe felt abandoned just as Beloved felt absndoned. This story is multi layered
The novel makes me realize how deep jealousy and envy runs. This all started because the people were envious of the healing powers of the grandmother (baby Sugs) so they turned their backs on her. This led to the domino effects of the events of Setha unaliving her child.
I don't think the snooty women and their envy led to Sethe's actions. I believe that was separate, although it may have affected how they treated her after she took out Beloved. Please explain more on this because I love these discussions and hearing different perspectives. 🙂
@@HeitCheri It wasn’t the snooty women, it was the entire community. They had turned their backs on Baby Sugs before the slave catchers came. Baby Sugs would have “church” in the woods. One evening it got so good she had performed a miracle like Jesus fed the multitude of people . After that one amazing event, the black people started talking bad about her saying “who does she think she is”. Baby Sugs noticed their energy had changed towards her, but couldn’t put her finger on it. They were so envious of her that when the slave catchers came, they basically let them through. They had systems in place to protect themselves (whistles, codes, etc). Basically they chose not to warn Baby Sugs and Setha what was about to happen so when Setha did what she did, they were completely shunned by the community. That’s why Baby Sugs just shut down after that, she had given so much to the community taught them to love themselves showed them by example that you too can perform miracles and look what happened. That’s what I got from it. The movie doesn’t touch on this, but the book does.
@@HeitCheri I think it’s an important layer to the story, but the movie left that out. With that being said, I enjoyed the movie and the book respectfully.
And with all this cancer, HIV, Covid, Ebola, and burning-itching-privates pandemics popping up today, Baby Sugs would be one of, if not THE richest person on the planet.
I’ve read the book 3x and watched beloved a lot I learn something each time. It was a beautiful movie with an assemble cast. It was 98 and the media was not ready to talk about the traumatic psrts of slavery. Beloved compared to other “slave/reconstruction” movies was it showed some of that hard parts that history books watered down. White fragility is what caused the “bad” reviews. Blacks that weren’t familiar with Toni Morrison weren’t prepared or “woke” so it caused confusion. Beloved is layered and isn’t an easy read but each time I read it I fell in love with it.
I loved the movie, but agree the film makes more sense after reading the book. Toni Morrison's books never give you all the answers. My favorite author.
I agree that her books don't give you all the answers, and that's what I love! Her works of art demand that the reader contemplate all that she has laid bare.
My Gullah southern elders told me growing up and watching this film that at the beginning of the movie that the evil spirit aka “haint” was a jealous spirit with unfinished business. Bringing terror to Sethe and the siblings that survived and getting the attention from the mother. When I see red presence seen when Paul D arrives he temporarily shows dominance and sent away. But like you said Beloved said hold my mule and came in the flesh. 😂 But when Sethe see her feeling she’s getting a second chance she goes all out but her actions is not enough. Beloved is reclaiming her Mother and wants to rid all those that is getting in her way with Sethe. Draining Sethe, pushing Denver out the picture and trying to even the pleasure connection that Sethe & Paul D have. Seducing him in the same red evil presence. My observations but I can’t wait to finish the book and come back. You guys are amazing!!! Sorry for the essay 🫠🤭 I agree a series like Roots would’ve been better to fully understand it. 124
I read this book in high school for AP English literature, and one thing that my teacher taught me that I wouldn’t have caught on my own is that beloved was Setha’s mother and her mother loved her so much that her spirit came back as her child and then she came back again after she was killed by her. This leads to the line in a part of the book where Setha and Beloved say to each other, “you are mine”. I watched the movie after I read the book which I think in a lot of instances reading the book before watching movie is always better.
124🙌🏾 So I saw this movie WAY too young, they used to show it on public access tv on Sundays where I live and it scared the living hell out of me. But as I grew up and read the book and applied it; it all made sense. I could identify and empathize with the women of the story. It’s definitely heavy and needs to be viewed from all artistic perspectives as it is available. I often feel there is a greater symbolism behind it; and at 27 years old I still have yet to figure it out. Maybe y’all will help me really understand what it is! 🥹I look forward to the next video from you guys!
@@HeitCheri I was thinking toward the ghosts of our past deeds or past life always find a way to materialize and cause destruction in our current life.
Did you all know there’s an opera that is loosely based on the book? It’s called Margaret Garner, and Toni Morrison wrote the libretto. Michigan Opera Theatre, now known as Detroit Opera, debuted the show.
Toni was quoted saying the book is about the ghost of slavery. Beloved was a figment of their imagination. If you go back and read what Beloved describes as hell, it is a slave ship. I think the pregnancy represents the spirit of slavery living on from generation to generation and the turmoil of it.
Talking as a Black French girl who never stepped foot in the US and who never read the book, I always understood the implications and nonskid of the movie. It is one of my favorites, and yeah, for instance, the fact that Paul D was not the first Paul of the plantation he worked at, or the fact that it is unclear if Beloved really existed, or that Setha didn't have enough money for the tombstone, I always understood it. That being said, I always spent a lot of time reading up about that part of US history, so maybe my brain filled the blanks. I hope that in the next video, you will talk about Denver and how Beloved impacted her because that was always my favorite part of the movie. (Also, yeah, I always found it weird that grown *ass Paul D joined Beloved in the bed when he knew she had the mind of the child, but then again, what do you expect from the guy who played Mister XD)
Thank you so much for weighing in on this from a different perspective! 😊Regarding Paul D and Beloved sleeping together, one of the commenters on this brought up the idea (based in part on content from the book) that these encounters were actually Against Paul D's will.... That it is implied that he was R-worded. Any thoughts on that. I have to agree that there is evidence that he seemed not to be able to resist or say no and that he didn't want it--almost as if Beloved has some supernatural power over him to force this to happen.
@@HeitCheriBeloved was trying to get rid of Paul D so that she could have Sethe all to herself. She was steady pushing him out of the house. By the time that scene happens he’s already been sleeping in the shed because for some reason he can’t get comfortable in the main house. Beloved knows that if she forces him to do this to her he will feel ashamed and be shamed by Sethe and will leave on his own.
@@HeitCheri I saw a TT that said Beloved hypnotized him earlier that night. She was sitting across from him as he fell asleep and she was just staring at him. He was so spooked that he went outside to sleep in the barn. She came out there and he kept telling her no and she did what she did anyway.
Kimberly Elise was the best thing about the movie. This is my favorite book my Toni Morrison. Oprah didn't capture Sethe at all. I think Sethe was brave for doing what she started to do. Remember, she was planning to kill herself as well so she could be with her children. She was already broken at seeing her mother hanged when she was a child, then the violation of her body/motherhood at the hands of the schoolteachers nephews. Sethe didn't know her huband 's mind broke, Paul D had to tell her why he didn't show up when they were supposed to run.
The film was a cult classic I remember everybody black in my junior high school used to run around saying lines from the movie we were just kids trying to find some comedy out of such a tragic story, but I remember watching the bootleg VHS over and over trying to understand the story. It was deep. God rest the ancestors souls. 🙏🏿
I remember watching just the opening of this movie when I was way too young, gave me nightmares. But watching the film when I was old enough was a totally different vibe than what I expected. I agree the film has similarity with The Color Purple & Their Eyes Were Watching God, & it also crosses over outside the genre conventions of those works as well. I honestly want to call it a unique take on gothic horror as it actually fits many conventions of the genre. The setting of the house & nearby swamp is very gloomy & haunting atmosphere at times, women are in distress A LOT, obvious supernatural elements, & especially because those supernatural elements serve as obvious metaphor. Sethe also fits the bill for being a gothic anti-hero, she is a flawed person with arguably monstrous elements due to what she did to her children (albeit for understandable reasons, but that’s usually also the case with the gothic anti hero). That & the slow reveal of Sethe’s secret of what she did is also an element. What makes it so unique as a gothic horror is the anti hero is both black & a woman, it centers around a poorer black family, & the house isn’t a whole mansion or castle like in many of the gothic horror genre’s origins. Now take in mind I’m talking about the film, I can’t say anything about the book as I’ve yet to read it myself (though I definitely will get to it). Though I’d bet the book still has elements of gothic horror if it doesn’t fit into the genre quite as well as the film does.
Ohhh you've gotta at least listen to the book! I'd love to hear whether you think it gits gothic horror. 😊 I think that the book gives you even more of the hints you see in the film. I wasn't joking when I said that not a word was wasted in creating the story we read in the novel.
I had it on DVD growing up, and I think I was able to understand it better bc I watched it several times. Wasn't aware of the book, but I'm gonna buy it now! I already like the movie, so I'd love it read it fleshed out more.
One of the parts that brought me to tears reading the book was "SEVEN-O....SEVEN-O" (If you know, you know) The film had me cry more because now those haunting desperate bitter depictions were there and the beauty, wonder, love, spirit, and the power of ADOS Souls also had me wailing from its feeling of home, dancing with them, worshipping with them...Toni Morrison can drop you directly in these somewhat familiar experiences, and fantastic at the same time...Whew carried away, thank you!
I choose to believe that the Thirty-Mile Woman got away, and her daughter Seven-O grew up to be a great healer and wisewoman, every bit as upright and spiritual as her father.
124 ❤✨👑🙌🏾🙏🏾💖💯✨ Superb! Cheri just confirmed that I did comprehended this movie well. I saw this when I was around 11 or 13. I did not read the book until I was 17. There was a lot of scenes in this movie I did appreciate like Baby Suggs prayer circle, the sounds of Sethe cooking and serving her girls, spending time with her girls, the beginning relationship between Denver and Crawling Already/Beloved, the family visit to the State Fair, Denver standing on the porch finding the courage to go out in the world and make a way to take care of herself and her mother with Baby Suggs encouraging her from beyond the grave. I appreciated how beautiful all the sisters looked in the wardrobe and natural form. The no makeup and natural hair really changed my standards beauty as an adolescent Black girl in the late 90s and early 2000s. The scenes of trauma inflicted on Sethe, Paul D, Sethe's Mother, the children, and off-screen Halle ( who we later see trying to cleanse by smearing butter all over himself) gave me new levels of respect for our people. Knowing that I'm here on present day Earth after people in my bloodline went through horrific events like this gave me good sense to honor my ancestors.🙏🏾✨💖 If you do have time to do full breakdowns on the novel and movie I would greatly appreciate it just let me know what I got to send y'all way. Love, Nikh 🙏🏾💝
❤️❤️❤️ Guess what? I'm dropping the link for Part 2 in this series for members like you on early release TONIGHT. I know it's not often that we get two videos on the same day, but the quick follow-up is NECESSARY! 😊
I agree about the scenes in the film that really enhanced the viewing experience. It was also so refreshing to see those faces without a bunch of caked on makeup! 😊
I love Toni Morrison’s (rip) books. I read Beloved in middle school and was “shook.” Then to find out the book was loosely based on a true story from an article about a slave name Margaret Gainer. It was all too much for me. I was in High School when the movie came out and was extremely surprised that they even made a movie out of it. I still went to watch it with a friend. I left the movie extremely overwhelmed. The film left no room to have sympathy for the mother aka “Oprah” at all. It seemed like a “slave shock” film. People who didn’t read the book or know the story it was based on would not get it. I mean you could get the connection between beloved and the ghost but like you mentioned all the filler as to why are left out. My friend just left straight up confused and not because she was young. The acting was great I’ll give them that but too little time and not enough story didn’t make for a great film but a decent film.
I love you Heit! Love ya Cheri! Beloved scared the everlasting bejeezus out of me when I was 3 years old!! I was damn near 30 before I watched it again. But Thank You for the review!
I thought this was a regular slave movie. Until i watched it. It's more like a historical horror movie, in my opinion. Thandie Newton's character was so creepy. Distrubing images flashes on the screen throughout the movie. Scared the hell out of me when I first saw it. I love it. I think the marketing was off because they marketed the as a historical movie. They didn't tell you about all the spooky stuff in the movie.
I read The Bluest Eye a year ago and that was a very heavy book, emotionally. Amoungst the culture you here the term beloved referenced to somebody in conversation as if they are naive to a topic and that's very surface level compared to the source of the book. Now I haven't read Beloved yet and after this I certainly will but it seems to me that beloved was like the physical manifestation of the trauma her mother experienced so young. Basically a forever young curse born from a river(ususally with bodies of water symbolizing the feminine). Her mother being 13 and still expected to do something so adult as get married and have children as well as grown men lusting after her and forced in a dehumanzing experience like slavery let alone expelling their urges onto animals the same way they are regarded as by the slave owners. There so many layers to peel back in this story a beloved carries a lot of the themes and it makes it very evident why that's the title.
I remember having to read Beloved in high school. I saw the movie years earlier. At the time I djdnt understand the movie or the book but as an adult with kids and understanding the story it was inappropriate for that to be required reading for my HS English class. When I finally understood it as an adult i remember thinking I can’t believe we read that in class.
Oh that is so wild because I have more trouble understanding the book then the movie I actually saw the movie to clarify some of the stuff I was reading in the books. I absolutely love Toni Morrison
The book is pretty ambiguous too. The rear has to do a lot of mental work to understand what is actually happening. I know I had to read it a couple of times to really get what was at play. I may just be slower than your average person though lol
😆 Your comment alone convinces me that you are absolutely NOT one of the slowest... That said, this film and book require the reader to do some work. When people suggest that they understood everything with a single viewing or read, and with little reflection, I become immediately doubtful that they have considered the full breadth of this masterpiece. 😊
I love this movie so much, I read the book then saw the movie. I had to see the movie multiple times to get a better understanding of the story. Baby suggs looked just like my grandmother and when she was in the woods preaching I would always cry
I agree that the physical Beloved was not the spirit of Baby Beloved, it was a manifestation of Setha's guilt and grief? She couldn't simply cast those feelings away, she had to deal with, live with, and work through her feelings before the terror could subside. No mistake that her living daughter and boyfriend had to assist in raising the manifestation of Setha's trauma also.
This was probably my least favorite Toni Morrison book, and I couldn't rewatch the movie. It's just so relentlessly depressing, disturbing, and hopeless. It seeps into your spirit. I just can't. Love hearing your thoughts on it, though.
124 - I love this channel. I watch a lot of movie reviews but it really is all surface level talking points and very little critical thinking and discussion although the giggling on such serious topics is a bit off putting but it's fine. so here's my pov: I watched this movie several times and once I understood that the woman was supposed to be Setha's daughters spirit come back as a woman my mind was blown. However after listening to y'all comments I feel like the ghost wasn't actually real and was Setha's grief and trauma manifested. The "supernatural" aspect of it is also great because Black people were spiritual before religious and it was almost like she conjured up this second chance at having her baby back. That's why things were good and happy for a while when Beloved showed up she thought she could be happy and take care of her baby. But plot twist this is a spirit who remembers its own trauma. The scene when Beloved describes like her death or the grave/underworld is heartbreaking. As a mother what do you do with that information especially knowing that you were the one who took their life out of fear for their future as a slave. I was so happy that Denver was finally able to leave the house as well. It was almost like Beloved gave her the strength too but draining Setha of her strength. Remember as Setha fell weaker Denver grew stronger. what if the boys weren't running from a sad spirit but the grief stricken controlling and heartbroken energy of their mother.
They should’ve done it in multiple parts or did a series because I struggled with this movie and everybody just said it was a horror film but it’s much more than that.
124 This was one of my first and fav books back in middle school and put me on the Toni Morrison train. I’ve only read 3 of her books so far and they each take me about 3-4months to finish because the material is so heavy that I need time to process after so many chapters. Toni Morrison books suck you in and make you think, imagine, and think about what you would do if you were there during those times or just in her characters shoes. The Bluest Eye made me flat out cry when I finished it; it hurt reading that story and the same with Beloved. Her books stick with you.
Toni Morrison is one of my favorite authors. Her books are so good and thought provoking that they can leave you emotionally drained. I have to take several months or even years before reading one of her books. All of her characters are so realistically well written and she never idolizes the matriachs or patriachs of the family. She is a lean writer like Octavia Butler and both are truly missed.
I never read the book but followed the movie in all its layers well. I'm normally confused with flashbacks. I really like this film even though it's technically not enjoyable because of the events. The acting was so good. Love Toni Morrison 🕊✨️ I was born & raised in Louisiana & didn’t know that. However, im from a small town called Cheneyville & my schools were raggedy and white. 😒
I remember having to read Beloved in high school. I saw the movie years earlier. At the time I djdnt understand the movie or the book but as an adult with kids and understanding the story it was inappropriate for that to be required reading for my HS English class.
Never read the book. I would love to now though. I first watched this as a kid, and somehow I understood exactly what was happening. I’m from Savannah, GA. So Im used to hearing the old salve tales. It also didn’t hurt that the actress who played beloved is absolutely gorgeous. And the acting from all the characters were amazing.
The box office said it flopped and Oprah discussed it being one of her failures that she felt bad about... But that's not really the point. It was a great novel and probably the best attempt at a movie that could have been made.
32:20 I agree!! I never thought of it that way and to be honest that’s really horrifying if you think about it. How are we questioning the mother acceptance of the spirit ( her child) when we did as well! And it’s physical at that 😭😭It just makes me think about how we are so accepting of certain individuals, knowing they’re not right.
_...i❤the movie "Beloved"...my favorite scene is when the church ladies were discussing what to do about Sethe being "beaten like batter" by the resurrected Beloved..._ ✊🏿...
124 11:32 Yes, I always say this. Beloved should have definitely been adapted into a miniseries. I think the filmmakers were honestly trying to create the next “The Color Purple” when they should have been trying to make the next roots. Especially with all the flashbacks that take place and the amount of characters they had to remove from the film. 34:28 When it comes to Paul D and Beloved people have made the argument that it was not consensual and Paul D was r worded. As in the book it states, “Then would you come in here for?” “I want you to touch me on the inside part.” “Go back in that house and get to bed.” “You have to touch me. On the inside part. And you have to call me my name.” As long as his eyes were locked on the silver of the lard can he was safe. If he trembled like Lot’s wife and felt some womanish need to see the nature of the sin behind him; feel a sympathy, perhaps, for the cursing cursed, or want to hold it in his arms out of respect for the connection between them, he too would be lost. “Call me my name.” “No.” “Please call it. I’ll go if you call it.” “Please call it. I’ll go if you call it.” “Beloved.” he said it, but she did not go. She moved closer with a foot football. He didn’t hear if he didn’t hear the whisper that the flakes of him either as they fell away from the seams of his tobacco tin. So when the lid gave, he didn’t know it. What he knew was that when he reached the insight part, he was saying, Red heart. Red heart,” over and over again. Softly and then so loud it woke Denver, then Paul D himself. Red heart. Red heart. Red heart.” (Beloved, pg. 137-138). Many people consider this a r-word scene as Paul D never verbally consented to the encounter. In fact, Beloveds actions can be seen as an example of sexual coercion. As according to the Office of Women’s health, “Sexual coercion is unwanted sexual activity that happens when you are pressured, tricked, threatened, or forced in a nonphysical way.” As we seen from the excerpt Paul D tells her to leave multiple times. She tricks him when she tells him well I’ll go but if you have to call my name first. Even when he finally does she still does not leave. She continues on until he finally relents but that does not mean she had his consent. Now I know we are more so talking about the adaption of the story but, I just dropped the quotes to show that at least in the novel it can be argued that Beloved r-worded Paul D. 43:17 You see, I think the fact that a question like this can be asked shows the filmmakers made a mistake in how they adapted the material. As based on what you saw in the film it is a valid question to ask. But you see although the most common interpretation of Beloved is that she is the reincarnation of Sethe’s dead child the book allows for other interpretations. See the below “ Denver is a little closer. “ what’s it like over there, where you were before? Can you tell me?” “Dark,” said Beloved. “I’m small in that place. I’m like this here.” She ring her head off the bed, lay down on her side and curled up. Denver covered her lips with her fingers. “ where are you cold?” Beloved curled tighter and shook her head. “Hot. Nothing to breathe down there and no room to move in.” “You see anybody?” “Heaps. A lot of people is down there. Some is dead.” “You see Jesus? Baby Suggs?” “I don’t know. I don’t know the names.” She sat up. (Beloved, pg. 88) When reading this you could very well interpret this as Beloved describing what it was like in Hell. However, this could also be interpreted as her describing what life was like during the middle passage. As we know when the slaves were being brought over from Africa they were put into rooms on ships. These ships were filled to maximum capacity with slaves often being chained to people they didn’t know. It was often really hot and dirty in those rooms because the slave catchers did not maintenance on them. Slaves were often forced to sit in feces, spit, etc. I say this to say, that I believe when making the film the filmmakers were under the interpretation that Beloved was indeed a ghost. However, them sticking to that exact interpretation and not showing any other way that Beloved could be interpreted cause problems for the film. 44:54 I’d say that when comes to what is easier between to get through, the book or the novel it is kind of like cheating on an exam versus studying and getting an A that you earned. The film is pretty much a PowerPoint Presentation of the novel. If that’s all you know is the film version of Beloved you will probably have a general understanding of the story. However, if you read the novel you will actually LEARN something and it will change your understanding of how you see emotions like love and hatred. Or at least that is what is happened to me. The fact that when it comes to the film the thing that most people remember is the “touch me on the inside” line to me is proof that the filmmakers failed at properly adapting the novel. Nonetheless, I do think the film is probably easier to digest just because of how much the filmmakers watered down the story. However, if you read the novel it truly is a reward. I’m not sure what audiobook Cheri listened to but, I bought audiobook and just followed along in the physical copy I had. The audiobook that I had actually was narrated by Toni Morrison herself, which I think is the best way to experience Beloved as she did a great job narrating and you get to hear how the author herself wanted the story to be told. She was actually motivated to do this because she was listening to an audio of Beloved back in the day and said that it was wrong. So she decided to narrate it herself. Also, the film removed much of Baby Suggs, Paul D, Ella, and Stamp Paid’s backstories. There were even some characters that were completely cut out of the film all together. So to anybody that may see this comment I’d definitely recommend reading the book. It’s not an easy read but it is worth it. 49:03 Well here I would have to disagree. One thing that Toni Morrison is known for is frequently incorporating the Supernatural into her novel. Now if you plan on reading Toni Morrison’s novels and do not want any spoilers please skip ahead to the next paragraph. However, Remember in Sula the character Ajax’s mother is a “conjure woman” and in addition this when Hannah dies there are certain visions that her mother Eve had that were signs about her daughter’s impending doom. Then in Song of Solomon Toni Morrison incorporates the flying Africans folktale into the novel. Where the character Milkman Dead learns that one of his ancestors was able to escape slavery by flying back to Africa. So I would say the Supernatural played a pivotal role in Toni Morrison’s novels. 50:45 It’s interesting that you bring up Alice Walker and The Color Purple. As Toni Morrison and Alice Walker were actually in a Black women’s writing group together. The group was called The Sisterhood I believe and it featured Nana Maynard, Ntozake Shange, Audreen Ballard, Vertamae Grosvenor, Alice Walker, Lori Sharpe, Toni Morrison, and June Jordan. They would meet in a New York apartment and share literary ideas from 1977 to 1979. So just a few final words. I had a strange way of discovering Beloved. I remember watching an edited version of on BET when I was a child but I didn’t really remember much from the film. When I was in elementary school our class took a trip to The National Underground Railroad Freedom Center (at the time we called it the Cincinnati Slave Museum). As in the story of Beloved many slaves would escape from Slavery by traveling through Ohio and so a museum was built right in front of the body of water the slaves would have to swim through in order to make it to Ohio. At this museums they have (or least did have) a big memoriam on the wall about Margaret Garner. However, I didn’t really understand the significance of it at the time. Nonetheless, It wasn’t until I was on TikTok and people were mad because there was this Jamaican man on Twitter saying African Americans don’t have any culture. And a Jamaican tiktoker responded saying that he had some nerve as he didn’t know his culture. And she asked him to name five Jamaican novelists. And I thought to myself could I name five Black American novelists. I could but all were male. So I googled Black American novelists and Toni Morrison popped up. I did some digging and found out that me and were from the same state of Ohio. I learned about her literary accomplishments and decided to purchase a few of her books. Beloved was the first book I ever read by Toni Morrison and I still think about it almost every day. Since reading Beloved I have gone on to read The Bluest Eye, Sula, Jazz, Song of Solomon, and I’m currently reading Paradise. As Cheri is right the story does make you evaluate yourself as a black person in America. But for me it also showed me Love and Hatred are not always binaries. As in the novel it is made clear that Sethe loved her children so much that she could not bear to see them as slaves which is part of the reason why she killed Beloved. The second part (which she admits to Beloved herself) is that she wanted to “out hurt the hurter” so killing Beloved wasn’t just an act of love it was also an act of hatred. Sethe is not the only character to exhibit such complex feelings either. Toni Morrison in an interview had once said that she asked a friend about whether Margaret was right or not and he said. “She made the right choice. But she had no right to make it.” Which I always thought was pretty interesting. I can’t wait for the next video on Beloved. Keep up the great work.
I'm gonna respond in a few comments so my thoughts don't get lost... Thanks so much for such an in-depth response to this video. 1) On the subject of Paul D possibly being R-worded by Beloved, this deserves more discussion for sure. 2) I edited my original comment out because I realize I misunderstood what you were saying there...
4) "he character Ajax’s mother is a “conjure woman” and in addition this when Hannah dies there are certain visions that her mother Eve had that were signs about her daughter’s impending doom. Then in Song of Solomon Toni Morrison incorporates the flying Africans folktale into the novel. Where the character Milkman Dead learns that one of his ancestors was able to escape slavery by flying back to Africa. So I would say the Supernatural played a pivotal role in Toni Morrison’s novels. "
5) "it’s interesting that you bring up Alice Walker and The Color Purple. As Toni Morrison and Alice Walker were actually in a Black women’s writing group together. The group was called The Sisterhood I believe and it featured Nana Maynard, Ntozake Shange, Audreen Ballard, Vertamae Grosvenor, Alice Walker, Lori Sharpe, Toni Morrison, and June Jordan. They would meet in a New York apartment and share literary ideas from 1977 to 1979. " ,
6) "As Cheri is right the story does make you evaluate yourself as a black person in America. But for me it also showed me Love and Hatred are not always binaries. "
I agree. It would have been groundbreaking if told in the form of a series. I love this movie and the book but the movie made it palatable which shocked my core and reminded me that this is based on a true story. The tragedy of it all.
23:57 Also, remember that Sethe paid for the headstone by having s÷x with the man in the cemetery bc she couldn't afford the carving. Always loved the novel & the book, even have the beautiful book Oprah released about the making of the movie. Thanks for covering this underrated movie! 124❤
I love the variety of films you all cover. I watched this years ago and have since read a few of Toni’s phenomenal works (Sula, Jazz). I’m still so afraid to read this one lol. You two are G’s and are inspiring me to maybe finally pick it up 😩💜
I remember watching this for the very first time in an adult classroom setting, believe it or not, because someone thought it would be a great idea to bring it from home and dump this on a group of 80+ random, bored adults. I was mostly all, "wtf", but I was most confused of all just because of the cast, because after seeing the Color Purple, my mind refused to go along with the set up. It just refused. It didn't take too long, but there was that, uhhh, scene (in fact, lots of scenes) that happened and that's when the instructor ran up to the big screen TV and shut it off. I just ended up renting it, because I wanted to see the rest. But it got me to read the book which is way better. This movie could have worked, but there's just something about it that doesn't all the way.
124 You all did a great job breaking this movie down (as usual). However, I am definitely one of the people who didn’t enjoy watching it. I also had/have not read the book. Another aspect for me is, I don’t mind having to “think” about a movie but if it becomes too much, I’m out. I still don’t have a desire to watch it again; however, I will listen to the audible.
I watched this movie when I was about 11 or 12 and I understood what was going on. I remember crying at so much of it. I can’t believe it wasn’t well received it. I really like this movie it equally saddened and terrified me!
Powerful movie and book. The younger generation needs to read, learn and see everything that the ancestors went through all while trying to build a dream and life for them 😢
124 first time here. Great breakdown. I know about PBS Pinchback because I am from Louisiana also. Going to watch listen to another vid. Glad I found you all, immediate sub
I was 17 when it came out and I'm the type of person that watch films like this and have to watch it twice to gather everything but it want confusing and I LOVE IT 💕💕
I read the novel before the movie and I agree that you can understand the story better if you already know the details that were left out. I shared the book & movie with my children also (when they were of an appropriate age) so they could understand that the real horror of the movie was not the spirit or what Sethe did, but WHY she did it. History teaches us that the atrocities of slavery happened, but it's impersonal to most. A story like this sort of forces people to think about the human beings that suffered through it.
Im from Louisiana and it depends on what age you are and what school you went to and the parish you lived in, that you would have learned about Governor PB S. Pinchback. Im almost 40 and learned about him in middle school.
124 I would totally love to see an analytical breakdown of this movie, because I think that a lot of people could benefit from seeing you guys break down the movie and include or clarify some of the parts that audiences over the years didn’t understand because of the left out contents from the book. I don’t think that anyone else could actually do the breakdown that this movie would need in order for it to make the movie makes sense for people who haven’t read the novel, but you guys. I think that the way you guys do your breakdowns incorporates context not only from a personal perspective, but from the originators of the work and the perception of audience, who have watched it over the years. And I think that that’s invaluable.
I’ve never read the book, I did understand that she was a manifestation or “ghost” I just think the flash backs for filler info at different points kind of grapevined and led to a lil confusion. It’s a story where you discover more things the more you watch.
I loved the book and the movie. The story is more about how slavery took away the humanity of the characters and the literal physical manifestion (beloved) of generations of truama and grief
When I saw this when I was much younger it scared the heck out of me and gave me nightmares. Watching it later as a adult now it made more sense and wasn’t as scary
124 I may be biased because I read the book first (I am obsessed with the works of Toni Morrison), and I LOVE sci fi. I think the lack of understanding comes from a basic lack of knowledge/education about this period of time in American history. There is SO much symbolism in both the book and the movie. Spoilers ahead: The first thing that happens when Seethe sees Beloved is, she pees (symbolizing water breaking before birth). The chokecherry tree Seethe got through brutalization could be analogous to the "Tree of Life" in Christianity" opening Seethe's eyes to the cruelty and evil in her world after the Bodwins hired school teacher. Beloved shows up when she does because it seems that Seethe has finally learned to ignore the neighbours that are looking down on her, live happily with Denver and has reconnected with Paul D. At a moment of semi contentment, she is reminded of why she was ostracized by her neighbours and silently suffering, ONLY then does the physical manifestation of her guilt, regret and sorrow reappear. Beloved's pregnancy is a reminder to Seethe of her deed, she works herself into a frenzy, doesn't leave the house and caters to Beloved's every need to assuage her guilt for her deed. These are but a few examples. PS I also blame the US education system not only for eliding over the horrors of slavery but also for not teaching critical thinking skills, simile and metaphor and how to recognize symbolism
I recalled it being a success. I remember we went to the theaters to see it. It was different but I understood it. I think I watched it once again outside of the theater. Not one of those I would watch over and over again. It was too heavy. Good acting and script.
124…. I think in the movie Beloved was almost like a succubus for Paul D. We know she wanted Sethe to herself, and to get him away, she knew that she would be successful in THAT manner because of the type of man Paul D was and him and Sethe’s real relationship
Ppl called me crazy because i agreed about the unliving of the child. She didn't want her children to suffer on this earth so they had freedom in the after life.
I definitely understood why she made her choice
Madea
plus, we(the viewers and Sethe herself) do not know what was awaiting them. it couldve been hell on earth as we see how bad things were before she left. those evil ppl couldve killed her children themselves. what she did was drastic and intense, but in her mind, she was giving her children what she thought was the better ending
@ettamae05 Nah, that was about Madea's toxic baby-daddy, this is much more serious.
@@ettamae05 I like the comparison, pain, sorrow, and cruelty experienced by the Mother can definitely affect the children...*SPOILER* But, I do not have the same compassion for Medea, to use her children to get back at a man is too much revenge for me. LOL
I saw this as a teenager and wasn’t confused and never read the book🤷🏾♀️ I think you have to pay close attention but the story isn’t that hard to follow in my opinion.
I think the basics of the story may have been clear, but perhaps it was the backstory that was unclear to some people.
@@HeitCheri that makes sense.
Exactly! I definitely understood it at a young age and never read the book.
I watched it as a teen too but took me a couple of watches to figure it out. I enjoyed it tho
Agreed!!
The book is about the manifestation of trauma…. Beloved was that manifestation. Her physical age representing that time had passed but her mental development showing the freshness of the pain. The problem is the literal interpretation.
Please explain more what you mean by the literal interpretation and by whom? 🙂
@@HeitCheri I think most people who watch the film without actually reading the book tend to be overwhelmed by the imagery and perspective of the story telling. Those who are confused are confused because they are watching from a literal standpoint. This is a horror story but not in the typical sense. The villain is the experience of slavery. And each character is a victim carrying trauma that requires acknowledgement and ultimately excorcism. Beloved symbolizes Sethes inability to heal from doing what would typically be considered unforgivable. I think anyone who experiences trauma understands the load it makes you carry and how it haunts you especially when it goes unaddressed. There’s so much symbolism in the book and film, I dont think I could start to break it down without writing a thesis . But Beloved is just the manifestation of fear, trauma and pain.
Btw love that you covered this film. Toni Morrison is one of my favorite authors. The anthology of the bluest eye, beloved, and paradise are so layered and deep. All described as stories ultimately about love and pain and how we are defined by those experiences. Sethe loved all of her children so much that she could not imagine them experiencing the trauma and humiliation she experienced in slavery. Her love for beloved is also what creates the haunting. She let go in the physical but never let go of the spirit. At the end the exorcism of the manifested being is acceptance of act she committed in fear but out of love.ultimately her PTSD is whats haunting her and impacting her relationships with her children with paul d, and with herself.
@jengsma9913 I agree. A lot gets lost when people try to make literal interpretations of art that is layered with symbolism and allegory.
Thanks for explaining what you meant. 😊 I agree about the layered meanings. I believe that Toni Morrison deliberately left room for the reader's interpretation as well. She understood that the ability to interpret her words are directly related to the reader's experiences and perspectives. For this reason, I would be hesitant to assign a definitive interpretation to things that she does not specifically spell out. We will be discussing all of this in great detail in our series. This video was really an introduction to the story. We haven't begun to peel back and examine all the layers yet 😊
This was a movie I could only watch once. The trauma was too much to bear. Much love to the ancestors.
Same here 😂💯🙏🏽☝🏾❤️
SAME! I might read the book again, though. Toni Morrison is as good as everybody says she is. The Bluest Eye might my favorite (and the shortest) 💕
I agree. That's how I feel about it, too. *Beloved* and *The Passion of the Christ* are the two movies I LOVED, but will never, ever, EVER watch either of them again. It stayed with me.
The book is worse btw
@@cherylmaden5989 big facts 😮💨
Beloved and There Eyes were Watching God. Should have been a mini series. So many things was passed over to convince emotion. I love both by the way❤
I love that idea. It is much to impact
The best part of the film was Baby Suggs sermon. Imagine, a prisoner of war, the victims of war crimes and the world sympathizing with their pain and providing support while they heal but that never happened after slavery ended. There was no acknowledgment of what they experienced, no reckoning for the ones who committed atrocities during slavery. Their trauma was not worthy of sympathy. Baby Suggs’ sermons acted as therapy for her people who were still suffering from PTSD in hopes that their trauma would not pass onto their children and their children’s children. But, we still feel it to this day. And what Baby Suggs preached spoke to that trauma within those recently freed men and women but it was also meant to speak to us, their decendents. We must love ourselves and each other.
Her sermon always moved me but one day as adult it had me in tears because Baby Suggs despite her seeing the harshness of slavery and lost she wanted to liberate them there children and so forth. But as one mentioned she was envied and that liberation died when she died but by the end of the novel and movie gold kept her words close.
Toni Morrison (and that actress 🙌🏾) is SO fucking good 😭!
The whole "yonder, they do not love your flesh" part haunts me in the most beautiful way.
Fun fact: I was in high school when this film was made. They shot a lot in the Greater Philadelphia area. I was an extra in the final scene (so was my aunt who drove me to set). Even more awesome, months later, they had the premiere in Philly at the movie theater I worked at, guess who showed up? OPRAH! I actually stood behind her on the escalator and got nervous and hopped off to let her go down to the lobby in peace. When she got to the bottom, I yelled “I love you!” And she yelled back “I love you too!” Best story of my teenage life! Will forever cherish this film for that reason 🤎
OMG what an amazing memory!!!! 😊❤️❤️❤️
My sister Ex was an extra as well!
#PHILLY
My Granny had read the novel when the movie came out and we all went to see it as a family. I was in high school when it came out. I’ve always loved our history so I was never put off by it being a “slave” movie. I read the book after I saw the movie and yes, the book was much better. I never thought of it as a horror movie although slavery was horrific. I also took Beloved being in an adult body as an infant as her trauma age. She never grew (psychologically, emotionally) past the age of her trauma.
I love this take
I forget how I found out about the movie but me, my mom and my sister sat down and watched it (back in the day). It was weird, and kinda confusing. So I went and got the book and read it, hoping for some clarity. Didn't really get any, but it WAS easier to follow than the movie.
124. This is just my opinion. I went to the theater to see this movie with my ex. After the movie he asked me to explain what we saw. That wasnt an issue for me because I had read the novel. This movie might not be appreciated by men. Ms. Morrison's novels focused on black life. However, her novels also had a matriarchal tone. I appreciate that because a lot of black writers didn't do that at the time. Another thing is that we can't look at Beloved from today's view. We can always say what we wouldn't do. I couldn't imagine the horrors that our ancestors faced.
37:25 Beloved wasn’t necessarily a child or even human. She was a vessel for a malevolent, vengeful spirit
I always saw Beloved as the embodiment of trauma… frozen in time, sad, scared, always hungry, and filled with rage.
To me, the ghost becoming Beloved the woman embodied the trauma of slavery, of the past, and what those who survived could not escape.
most two year olds are psychos..i don't think vengeance was her objective, she was just merely a baby who never had a chance to develop mentally. most toddlers are psychos in my opinion.
@kenyahogan2399 😂You've got a point about toddlers. I agree with you that she just never got to evolve beyond a base psyche and urges due to her emotional age. When you add her trauma and loss, you get a nightmare. Even though it is my prayer that in such a situation, a healing would take place on a spiritual level 🙏🏽.
@@aya9af truth. It also occured to me that beloved is sethe and they both are her mother going all the way back. Sethe felt abandoned just as Beloved felt absndoned. This story is multi layered
@@aya9af i also dont think beloved was pregnant her belly was a metaphor of the lifeforce she was suck8ng out of sethe.
The novel makes me realize how deep jealousy and envy runs. This all started because the people were envious of the healing powers of the grandmother (baby Sugs) so they turned their backs on her. This led to the domino effects of the events of Setha unaliving her child.
I don't think the snooty women and their envy led to Sethe's actions. I believe that was separate, although it may have affected how they treated her after she took out Beloved.
Please explain more on this because I love these discussions and hearing different perspectives. 🙂
@@HeitCheri It wasn’t the snooty women, it was the entire community. They had turned their backs on Baby Sugs before the slave catchers came. Baby Sugs would have “church” in the woods. One evening it got so good she had performed a miracle like Jesus fed the multitude of people . After that one amazing event, the black people started talking bad about her saying “who does she think she is”. Baby Sugs noticed their energy had changed towards her, but couldn’t put her finger on it. They were so envious of her that when the slave catchers came, they basically let them through. They had systems in place to protect themselves (whistles, codes, etc). Basically they chose not to warn Baby Sugs and Setha what was about to happen so when Setha did what she did, they were completely shunned by the community. That’s why Baby Sugs just shut down after that, she had given so much to the community taught them to love themselves showed them by example that you too can perform miracles and look what happened. That’s what I got from it.
The movie doesn’t touch on this, but the book does.
Okay, I see what you mean. I thought you were talking about the women specifically. 😊
@@HeitCheri I think it’s an important layer to the story, but the movie left that out. With that being said, I enjoyed the movie and the book respectfully.
And with all this cancer, HIV, Covid, Ebola, and burning-itching-privates pandemics popping up today, Baby Sugs would be one of, if not THE richest person on the planet.
I’ve read the book 3x and watched beloved a lot I learn something each time. It was a beautiful movie with an assemble cast. It was 98 and the media was not ready to talk about the traumatic psrts of slavery. Beloved compared to other “slave/reconstruction” movies was it showed some of that hard parts that history books watered down. White fragility is what caused the “bad” reviews. Blacks that weren’t familiar with Toni Morrison weren’t prepared or “woke” so it caused confusion. Beloved is layered and isn’t an easy read but each time I read it I fell in love with it.
I loved the movie, but agree the film makes more sense after reading the book. Toni Morrison's books never give you all the answers. My favorite author.
I agree that her books don't give you all the answers, and that's what I love! Her works of art demand that the reader contemplate all that she has laid bare.
Exactly!!!
My Gullah southern elders told me growing up and watching this film that at the beginning of the movie that the evil spirit aka “haint” was a jealous spirit with unfinished business. Bringing terror to Sethe and the siblings that survived and getting the attention from the mother. When I see red presence seen when Paul D arrives he temporarily shows dominance and sent away. But like you said Beloved said hold my mule and came in the flesh. 😂 But when Sethe see her feeling she’s getting a second chance she goes all out but her actions is not enough. Beloved is reclaiming her Mother and wants to rid all those that is getting in her way with Sethe. Draining Sethe, pushing Denver out the picture and trying to even the pleasure connection that Sethe & Paul D have. Seducing him in the same red evil presence. My observations but I can’t wait to finish the book and come back. You guys are amazing!!! Sorry for the essay 🫠🤭 I agree a series like Roots would’ve been better to fully understand it. 124
I read this book in high school for AP English literature, and one thing that my teacher taught me that I wouldn’t have caught on my own is that beloved was Setha’s mother and her mother loved her so much that her spirit came back as her child and then she came back again after she was killed by her. This leads to the line in a part of the book where Setha and Beloved say to each other, “you are mine”. I watched the movie after I read the book which I think in a lot of instances reading the book before watching movie is always better.
"Your woman she never fix up your hair?" Certainly does hit different in that light.
"It's like A Tribe Called Quest, you say the whole thing!"😂😂
124🙌🏾 So I saw this movie WAY too young, they used to show it on public access tv on Sundays where I live and it scared the living hell out of me. But as I grew up and read the book and applied it; it all made sense. I could identify and empathize with the women of the story. It’s definitely heavy and needs to be viewed from all artistic perspectives as it is available. I often feel there is a greater symbolism behind it; and at 27 years old I still have yet to figure it out. Maybe y’all will help me really understand what it is! 🥹I look forward to the next video from you guys!
Yeah this one is really heavy on me too. If you had to guess, what would be the greater symbolism from your view?
@@HeitCheri I was thinking toward the ghosts of our past deeds or past life always find a way to materialize and cause destruction in our current life.
Man yall are some really critical and deep thinkers.
❤️
Did you all know there’s an opera that is loosely based on the book? It’s called Margaret Garner, and Toni Morrison wrote the libretto.
Michigan Opera Theatre, now known as Detroit Opera, debuted the show.
I had no idea! Now I have to go look that up. Thanks! 😊
Toni was quoted saying the book is about the ghost of slavery. Beloved was a figment of their imagination. If you go back and read what Beloved describes as hell, it is a slave ship. I think the pregnancy represents the spirit of slavery living on from generation to generation and the turmoil of it.
Talking as a Black French girl who never stepped foot in the US and who never read the book, I always understood the implications and nonskid of the movie. It is one of my favorites, and yeah, for instance, the fact that Paul D was not the first Paul of the plantation he worked at, or the fact that it is unclear if Beloved really existed, or that Setha didn't have enough money for the tombstone, I always understood it. That being said, I always spent a lot of time reading up about that part of US history, so maybe my brain filled the blanks. I hope that in the next video, you will talk about Denver and how Beloved impacted her because that was always my favorite part of the movie.
(Also, yeah, I always found it weird that grown *ass Paul D joined Beloved in the bed when he knew she had the mind of the child, but then again, what do you expect from the guy who played Mister XD)
Thank you so much for weighing in on this from a different perspective! 😊Regarding Paul D and Beloved sleeping together, one of the commenters on this brought up the idea (based in part on content from the book) that these encounters were actually Against Paul D's will.... That it is implied that he was R-worded. Any thoughts on that. I have to agree that there is evidence that he seemed not to be able to resist or say no and that he didn't want it--almost as if Beloved has some supernatural power over him to force this to happen.
@@HeitCheriBeloved was trying to get rid of Paul D so that she could have Sethe all to herself. She was steady pushing him out of the house. By the time that scene happens he’s already been sleeping in the shed because for some reason he can’t get comfortable in the main house. Beloved knows that if she forces him to do this to her he will feel ashamed and be shamed by Sethe and will leave on his own.
@@HeitCheri I saw a TT that said Beloved hypnotized him earlier that night. She was sitting across from him as he fell asleep and she was just staring at him. He was so spooked that he went outside to sleep in the barn. She came out there and he kept telling her no and she did what she did anyway.
Kimberly Elise was the best thing about the movie. This is my favorite book my Toni Morrison. Oprah didn't capture Sethe at all. I think Sethe was brave for doing what she started to do. Remember, she was planning to kill herself as well so she could be with her children. She was already broken at seeing her mother hanged when she was a child, then the violation of her body/motherhood at the hands of the schoolteachers nephews. Sethe didn't know her huband 's mind broke, Paul D had to tell her why he didn't show up when they were supposed to run.
The film was a cult classic I remember everybody black in my junior high school used to run around saying lines from the movie we were just kids trying to find some comedy out of such a tragic story, but I remember watching the bootleg VHS over and over trying to understand the story. It was deep. God rest the ancestors souls. 🙏🏿
I remember watching just the opening of this movie when I was way too young, gave me nightmares. But watching the film when I was old enough was a totally different vibe than what I expected.
I agree the film has similarity with The Color Purple & Their Eyes Were Watching God, & it also crosses over outside the genre conventions of those works as well. I honestly want to call it a unique take on gothic horror as it actually fits many conventions of the genre. The setting of the house & nearby swamp is very gloomy & haunting atmosphere at times, women are in distress A LOT, obvious supernatural elements, & especially because those supernatural elements serve as obvious metaphor. Sethe also fits the bill for being a gothic anti-hero, she is a flawed person with arguably monstrous elements due to what she did to her children (albeit for understandable reasons, but that’s usually also the case with the gothic anti hero). That & the slow reveal of Sethe’s secret of what she did is also an element.
What makes it so unique as a gothic horror is the anti hero is both black & a woman, it centers around a poorer black family, & the house isn’t a whole mansion or castle like in many of the gothic horror genre’s origins. Now take in mind I’m talking about the film, I can’t say anything about the book as I’ve yet to read it myself (though I definitely will get to it). Though I’d bet the book still has elements of gothic horror if it doesn’t fit into the genre quite as well as the film does.
Ohhh you've gotta at least listen to the book! I'd love to hear whether you think it gits gothic horror. 😊 I think that the book gives you even more of the hints you see in the film. I wasn't joking when I said that not a word was wasted in creating the story we read in the novel.
@@HeitCheriSeriously, this person needs the book in their life. 😂❤
So glad yall covered this! I was so confused watching the movie. I appreciate it.
I had it on DVD growing up, and I think I was able to understand it better bc I watched it several times. Wasn't aware of the book, but I'm gonna buy it now! I already like the movie, so I'd love it read it fleshed out more.
Oh yeah, the book is a must read!
Please do a deep dive. I love these breakdowns and theories.
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This movie opened on my birthday and I still have the ticket stub! I always felt it was a gift to me. Love this book and movie!💗
Oh wow! ❤️
One of the parts that brought me to tears reading the book was "SEVEN-O....SEVEN-O" (If you know, you know) The film had me cry more because now those haunting desperate bitter depictions were there and the beauty, wonder, love, spirit, and the power of ADOS Souls also had me wailing from its feeling of home, dancing with them, worshipping with them...Toni Morrison can drop you directly in these somewhat familiar experiences, and fantastic at the same time...Whew carried away, thank you!
I choose to believe that the Thirty-Mile Woman got away, and her daughter Seven-O grew up to be a great healer and wisewoman, every bit as upright and spiritual as her father.
@@janerecluse4344 Now that is my belief as well! Thank you!
I’m from New Orleans and NEVER knew about Gov. Pinchback…thanks for that info
124
❤✨👑🙌🏾🙏🏾💖💯✨
Superb! Cheri just confirmed that I did comprehended this movie well. I saw this when I was around 11 or 13. I did not read the book until I was 17. There was a lot of scenes in this movie I did appreciate like Baby Suggs prayer circle, the sounds of Sethe cooking and serving her girls, spending time with her girls, the beginning relationship between Denver and Crawling Already/Beloved, the family visit to the State Fair, Denver standing on the porch finding the courage to go out in the world and make a way to take care of herself and her mother with Baby Suggs encouraging her from beyond the grave. I appreciated how beautiful all the sisters looked in the wardrobe and natural form. The no makeup and natural hair really changed my standards beauty as an adolescent Black girl in the late 90s and early 2000s. The scenes of trauma inflicted on Sethe, Paul D, Sethe's Mother, the children, and off-screen Halle ( who we later see trying to cleanse by smearing butter all over himself) gave me new levels of respect for our people. Knowing that I'm here on present day Earth after people in my bloodline went through horrific events like this gave me good sense to honor my ancestors.🙏🏾✨💖
If you do have time to do full breakdowns on the novel and movie I would greatly appreciate it just let me know what I got to send y'all way.
Love, Nikh 🙏🏾💝
❤️❤️❤️ Guess what? I'm dropping the link for Part 2 in this series for members like you on early release TONIGHT. I know it's not often that we get two videos on the same day, but the quick follow-up is NECESSARY! 😊
I agree about the scenes in the film that really enhanced the viewing experience. It was also so refreshing to see those faces without a bunch of caked on makeup! 😊
@@HeitCheri 💖💝💯✨🙏🏾🙌🏾
I love Toni Morrison’s (rip) books. I read Beloved in middle school and was “shook.” Then to find out the book was loosely based on a true story from an article about a slave name Margaret Gainer. It was all too much for me. I was in High School when the movie came out and was extremely surprised that they even made a movie out of it. I still went to watch it with a friend. I left the movie extremely overwhelmed. The film left no room to have sympathy for the mother aka “Oprah” at all. It seemed like a “slave shock” film. People who didn’t read the book or know the story it was based on would not get it. I mean you could get the connection between beloved and the ghost but like you mentioned all the filler as to why are left out. My friend just left straight up confused and not because she was young. The acting was great I’ll give them that but too little time and not enough story didn’t make for a great film but a decent film.
I love you Heit! Love ya Cheri! Beloved scared the everlasting bejeezus out of me when I was 3 years old!! I was damn near 30 before I watched it again. But Thank You for the review!
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I thought this was a regular slave movie. Until i watched it. It's more like a historical horror movie, in my opinion. Thandie Newton's character was so creepy. Distrubing images flashes on the screen throughout the movie. Scared the hell out of me when I first saw it. I love it.
I think the marketing was off because they marketed the as a historical movie. They didn't tell you about all the spooky stuff in the movie.
I read The Bluest Eye a year ago and that was a very heavy book, emotionally. Amoungst the culture you here the term beloved referenced to somebody in conversation as if they are naive to a topic and that's very surface level compared to the source of the book. Now I haven't read Beloved yet and after this I certainly will but it seems to me that beloved was like the physical manifestation of the trauma her mother experienced so young. Basically a forever young curse born from a river(ususally with bodies of water symbolizing the feminine). Her mother being 13 and still expected to do something so adult as get married and have children as well as grown men lusting after her and forced in a dehumanzing experience like slavery let alone expelling their urges onto animals the same way they are regarded as by the slave owners. There so many layers to peel back in this story a beloved carries a lot of the themes and it makes it very evident why that's the title.
124. This is one of my FAVORITE movies. Sethe and Paul D conversation about Thick vs Thin love sticks with me
I remember having to read Beloved in high school. I saw the movie years earlier. At the time I djdnt understand the movie or the book but as an adult with kids and understanding the story it was inappropriate for that to be required reading for my HS English class. When I finally understood it as an adult i remember thinking I can’t believe we read that in class.
I think this is an eerie ghost story..and I wasn't disappointed or confused about it at all
Oh that is so wild because I have more trouble understanding the book then the movie I actually saw the movie to clarify some of the stuff I was reading in the books. I absolutely love Toni Morrison
Same here. I look like books and movies but prefer movie and mini series
18:35 “it’s like A Tribe Called Quest. You gotta say the whole thing” 😂
The book is pretty ambiguous too. The rear has to do a lot of mental work to understand what is actually happening. I know I had to read it a couple of times to really get what was at play. I may just be slower than your average person though lol
😆 Your comment alone convinces me that you are absolutely NOT one of the slowest... That said, this film and book require the reader to do some work. When people suggest that they understood everything with a single viewing or read, and with little reflection, I become immediately doubtful that they have considered the full breadth of this masterpiece. 😊
I love this movie so much, I read the book then saw the movie. I had to see the movie multiple times to get a better understanding of the story. Baby suggs looked just like my grandmother and when she was in the woods preaching I would always cry
I agree that the physical Beloved was not the spirit of Baby Beloved, it was a manifestation of Setha's guilt and grief? She couldn't simply cast those feelings away, she had to deal with, live with, and work through her feelings before the terror could subside. No mistake that her living daughter and boyfriend had to assist in raising the manifestation of Setha's trauma also.
Excellent book. Complicated. Morrison is a master.
The film did it justice.
This was probably my least favorite Toni Morrison book, and I couldn't rewatch the movie. It's just so relentlessly depressing, disturbing, and hopeless. It seeps into your spirit. I just can't. Love hearing your thoughts on it, though.
I loved this book and agree that the movie was not written well enough to give the audience a better understanding of the ghost aspect.
124 - I love this channel. I watch a lot of movie reviews but it really is all surface level talking points and very little critical thinking and discussion although the giggling on such serious topics is a bit off putting but it's fine. so here's my pov: I watched this movie several times and once I understood that the woman was supposed to be Setha's daughters spirit come back as a woman my mind was blown. However after listening to y'all comments I feel like the ghost wasn't actually real and was Setha's grief and trauma manifested. The "supernatural" aspect of it is also great because Black people were spiritual before religious and it was almost like she conjured up this second chance at having her baby back. That's why things were good and happy for a while when Beloved showed up she thought she could be happy and take care of her baby. But plot twist this is a spirit who remembers its own trauma. The scene when Beloved describes like her death or the grave/underworld is heartbreaking. As a mother what do you do with that information especially knowing that you were the one who took their life out of fear for their future as a slave.
I was so happy that Denver was finally able to leave the house as well. It was almost like Beloved gave her the strength too but draining Setha of her strength. Remember as Setha fell weaker Denver grew stronger. what if the boys weren't running from a sad spirit but the grief stricken controlling and heartbroken energy of their mother.
All that you just said... 😔
They should’ve done it in multiple parts or did a series because I struggled with this movie and everybody just said it was a horror film but it’s much more than that.
124
This was one of my first and fav books back in middle school and put me on the Toni Morrison train. I’ve only read 3 of her books so far and they each take me about 3-4months to finish because the material is so heavy that I need time to process after so many chapters. Toni Morrison books suck you in and make you think, imagine, and think about what you would do if you were there during those times or just in her characters shoes. The Bluest Eye made me flat out cry when I finished it; it hurt reading that story and the same with Beloved. Her books stick with you.
Toni Morrison is one of my favorite authors. Her books are so good and thought provoking that they can leave you emotionally drained. I have to take several months or even years before reading one of her books. All of her characters are so realistically well written and she never idolizes the matriachs or patriachs of the family. She is a lean writer like Octavia Butler and both are truly missed.
I never read the book but followed the movie in all its layers well. I'm normally confused with flashbacks.
I really like this film even though it's technically not enjoyable because of the events.
The acting was so good. Love Toni Morrison 🕊✨️
I was born & raised in Louisiana & didn’t know that. However, im from a small town called Cheneyville & my schools were raggedy and white. 😒
I remember having to read Beloved in high school. I saw the movie years earlier. At the time I djdnt understand the movie or the book but as an adult with kids and understanding the story it was inappropriate for that to be required reading for my HS English class.
Never read the book. I would love to now though. I first watched this as a kid, and somehow I understood exactly what was happening. I’m from Savannah, GA. So Im used to hearing the old salve tales. It also didn’t hurt that the actress who played beloved is absolutely gorgeous. And the acting from all the characters were amazing.
I was a child I think when I saw this movie. I understood it completely.
The acting was phenomenal in the movie. I think word of mouth killed people interest in viewing the movie.
124. I'm wanting a second video. Toni is in my Mt. Rushmore of authors.
Beloved is a classic WHO SAID IT FLOPPED 🧐
The box office said it flopped and Oprah discussed it being one of her failures that she felt bad about... But that's not really the point. It was a great novel and probably the best attempt at a movie that could have been made.
This was a good movie, I watched multiple times, that what did in our era. I don’t remember it being a book, now I want the Audiobook.
Yeah, get the audiobook. It's on Audible with the author actually reading it
32:20 I agree!! I never thought of it that way and to be honest that’s really horrifying if you think about it. How are we questioning the mother acceptance of the spirit ( her child) when we did as well! And it’s physical at that 😭😭It just makes me think about how we are so accepting of certain individuals, knowing they’re not right.
Im 27 i remember this movie never understood it until you guys breakdown thank you
I was waiting on you to hear what you thought. FYI, there is a second video that's been released early for members like you! ❤️
_...i❤the movie "Beloved"...my favorite scene is when the church ladies were discussing what to do about Sethe being "beaten like batter" by the resurrected Beloved..._ ✊🏿...
Greetings 🙏 from Raleigh, North Carolina 🙏 😀
Hello there!
@@HeitCheri Hi 👋 ☺️
124
11:32
Yes, I always say this. Beloved should have definitely been adapted into a miniseries. I think the filmmakers were honestly trying to create the next “The Color Purple” when they should have been trying to make the next roots. Especially with all the flashbacks that take place and the amount of characters they had to remove from the film.
34:28
When it comes to Paul D and Beloved people have made the argument that it was not consensual and Paul D was r worded.
As in the book it states,
“Then would you come in here for?”
“I want you to touch me on the inside part.”
“Go back in that house and get to bed.”
“You have to touch me. On the inside part. And you have to call me my name.”
As long as his eyes were locked on the silver of the lard can he was safe. If he trembled like Lot’s wife and felt some womanish need to see the nature of the sin behind him; feel a sympathy, perhaps, for the cursing cursed, or want to hold it in his arms out of respect for the connection between them, he too would be lost.
“Call me my name.”
“No.”
“Please call it. I’ll go if you call it.”
“Please call it. I’ll go if you call it.”
“Beloved.” he said it, but she did not go. She moved closer with a foot football. He didn’t hear if he didn’t hear the whisper that the flakes of him either as they fell away from the seams of his tobacco tin. So when the lid gave, he didn’t know it. What he knew was that when he reached the insight part, he was saying, Red heart. Red heart,” over and over again. Softly and then so loud it woke Denver, then Paul D himself. Red heart. Red heart. Red heart.” (Beloved, pg. 137-138).
Many people consider this a r-word scene as Paul D never verbally consented to the encounter. In fact, Beloveds actions can be seen as an example of sexual coercion. As according to the Office of Women’s health, “Sexual coercion is unwanted sexual activity that happens when you are pressured, tricked, threatened, or forced in a nonphysical way.” As we seen from the excerpt Paul D tells her to leave multiple times. She tricks him when she tells him well I’ll go but if you have to call my name first. Even when he finally does she still does not leave. She continues on until he finally relents but that does not mean she had his consent.
Now I know we are more so talking about the adaption of the story but, I just dropped the quotes to show that at least in the novel it can be argued that Beloved r-worded Paul D.
43:17
You see, I think the fact that a question like this can be asked shows the filmmakers made a mistake in how they adapted the material. As based on what you saw in the film it is a valid question to ask. But you see although the most common interpretation of Beloved is that she is the reincarnation of Sethe’s dead child the book allows for other interpretations. See the below
“ Denver is a little closer. “ what’s it like over there, where you were before? Can you tell me?”
“Dark,” said Beloved. “I’m small in that place. I’m like this here.” She ring her head off the bed, lay down on her side and curled up.
Denver covered her lips with her fingers. “ where are you cold?”
Beloved curled tighter and shook her head. “Hot. Nothing to breathe down there and no room to move in.”
“You see anybody?”
“Heaps. A lot of people is down there. Some is dead.”
“You see Jesus? Baby Suggs?”
“I don’t know. I don’t know the names.” She sat up. (Beloved, pg. 88)
When reading this you could very well interpret this as Beloved describing what it was like in Hell. However, this could also be interpreted as
her describing what life was like during the middle passage. As we know when the slaves were being brought over from Africa they were put into rooms on ships. These ships were filled to maximum capacity with slaves often being chained to people they didn’t know. It was often really hot and dirty in those rooms because the slave catchers did not maintenance on them. Slaves were often forced to sit in feces, spit, etc.
I say this to say, that I believe when making the film the filmmakers were under the interpretation that Beloved was indeed a ghost. However, them sticking to that exact interpretation and not showing any other way that Beloved could be interpreted cause problems for the film.
44:54
I’d say that when comes to what is easier between to get through, the book or the novel it is kind of like cheating on an exam versus studying and getting an A that you earned. The film is pretty much a PowerPoint Presentation of the novel. If that’s all you know is the film version of Beloved you will probably have a general understanding of the story. However, if you read the novel you will actually LEARN something and it will change your understanding of how you see emotions like love and hatred. Or at least that is what is happened to me. The fact that when it comes to the film the thing that most people remember is the “touch me on the inside” line to me is proof that the filmmakers failed at properly adapting the novel. Nonetheless, I do think the film is probably easier to digest just because of how much the filmmakers watered down the story. However, if you read the novel it truly is a reward. I’m not sure what audiobook Cheri listened to but, I bought audiobook and just followed along in the physical copy I had. The audiobook that I had actually was narrated by Toni Morrison herself, which I think is the best way to experience Beloved as she did a great job narrating and you get to hear how the author herself wanted the story to be told. She was actually motivated to do this because she was listening to an audio of Beloved back in the day and said that it was wrong. So she decided to narrate it herself.
Also, the film removed much of Baby Suggs, Paul D, Ella, and Stamp Paid’s backstories. There were even some characters that were completely cut out of the film all together. So to anybody that may see this comment I’d definitely recommend reading the book. It’s not an easy read but it is worth it.
49:03
Well here I would have to disagree. One thing that Toni Morrison is known for is frequently incorporating the Supernatural into her novel. Now if you plan on reading Toni Morrison’s novels and do not want any spoilers please skip ahead to the next paragraph. However, Remember in Sula the character Ajax’s mother is a “conjure woman” and in addition this when Hannah dies there are certain visions that her mother Eve had that were signs about her daughter’s impending doom. Then in Song of Solomon Toni Morrison incorporates the flying Africans folktale into the novel. Where the character Milkman Dead learns that one of his ancestors was able to escape slavery by flying back to Africa. So I would say the Supernatural played a pivotal role in Toni Morrison’s novels.
50:45
It’s interesting that you bring up Alice Walker and The Color Purple. As Toni Morrison and Alice Walker were actually in a Black women’s writing group together. The group was called The Sisterhood I believe and it featured Nana Maynard, Ntozake Shange, Audreen Ballard, Vertamae Grosvenor, Alice Walker, Lori Sharpe, Toni Morrison, and June Jordan. They would meet in a New York apartment and share literary ideas from 1977 to 1979.
So just a few final words. I had a strange way of discovering Beloved. I remember watching an edited version of on BET when I was a child but I didn’t really remember much from the film. When I was in elementary school our class took a trip to The National Underground Railroad Freedom Center (at the time we called it the Cincinnati Slave Museum). As in the story of Beloved many slaves would escape from Slavery by traveling through Ohio and so a museum was built right in front of the body of water the slaves would have to swim through in order to make it to Ohio. At this museums they have (or least did have) a big memoriam on the wall about Margaret Garner. However, I didn’t really understand the significance of it at the time. Nonetheless, It wasn’t until I was on TikTok and people were mad because there was this Jamaican man on Twitter saying African Americans don’t have any culture. And a Jamaican tiktoker responded saying that he had some nerve as he didn’t know his culture. And she asked him to name five Jamaican novelists. And I thought to myself could I name five Black American novelists. I could but all were male. So I googled Black American novelists and Toni Morrison popped up. I did some digging and found out that me and were from the same state of Ohio. I learned about her literary accomplishments and decided to purchase a few of her books. Beloved was the first book I ever read by Toni Morrison and I still think about it almost every day. Since reading Beloved I have gone on to read The Bluest Eye, Sula, Jazz, Song of Solomon, and I’m currently reading Paradise. As Cheri is right the story does make you evaluate yourself as a black person in America. But for me it also showed me Love and Hatred are not always binaries. As in the novel it is made clear that Sethe loved her children so much that she could not bear to see them as slaves which is part of the reason why she killed Beloved. The second part (which she admits to Beloved herself) is that she wanted to “out hurt the hurter” so killing Beloved wasn’t just an act of love it was also an act of hatred. Sethe is not the only character to exhibit such complex feelings either. Toni Morrison in an interview had once said that she asked a friend about whether Margaret was right or not and he said. “She made the right choice. But she had no right to make it.” Which I always thought was pretty interesting.
I can’t wait for the next video on Beloved. Keep up the great work.
I'm gonna respond in a few comments so my thoughts don't get lost... Thanks so much for such an in-depth response to this video.
1) On the subject of Paul D possibly being R-worded by Beloved, this deserves more discussion for sure.
2) I edited my original comment out because I realize I misunderstood what you were saying there...
3) I agree that reading the book is best. The audiobook I listened to was the unabridged version narrated by Toni Morrison and it was an experience!
4) "he character Ajax’s mother is a “conjure woman” and in addition this when Hannah dies there are certain visions that her mother Eve had that were signs about her daughter’s impending doom. Then in Song of Solomon Toni Morrison incorporates the flying Africans folktale into the novel. Where the character Milkman Dead learns that one of his ancestors was able to escape slavery by flying back to Africa. So I would say the Supernatural played a pivotal role in Toni Morrison’s novels. "
5) "it’s interesting that you bring up Alice Walker and The Color Purple. As Toni Morrison and Alice Walker were actually in a Black women’s writing group together. The group was called The Sisterhood I believe and it featured Nana Maynard, Ntozake Shange, Audreen Ballard, Vertamae Grosvenor, Alice Walker, Lori Sharpe, Toni Morrison, and June Jordan. They would meet in a New York apartment and share literary ideas from 1977 to 1979. " ,
6) "As Cheri is right the story does make you evaluate yourself as a black person in America. But for me it also showed me Love and Hatred are not always binaries. "
This definitely should've been a series
Well now I'm scared to read the book, the movie is already disturbing. But I was never confused even as a kid.
I agree. It would have been groundbreaking if told in the form of a series. I love this movie and the book but the movie made it palatable which shocked my core and reminded me that this is based on a true story. The tragedy of it all.
I love love this film. Went it first came out i watched it over and over again.
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23:57 Also, remember that Sethe paid for the headstone by having s÷x with the man in the cemetery bc she couldn't afford the carving. Always loved the novel & the book, even have the beautiful book Oprah released about the making of the movie. Thanks for covering this underrated movie! 124❤
There is just SO MUCH to unpack with this story.... The discussions could be ENDLESS. i can't wait for us all to talk more about this movie.
I love the variety of films you all cover. I watched this years ago and have since read a few of Toni’s phenomenal works (Sula, Jazz). I’m still so afraid to read this one lol. You two are G’s and are inspiring me to maybe finally pick it up 😩💜
We can all take this journey together. 🙂
@@HeitCheri 💜💪🏾
This is the movie Oprah should have had remade vs the classic COLOR PURPLE. Beloved would make an incredible animated movie for PRIME. IJS.
The book was brilliant and heartbreaking.
I remember watching this for the very first time in an adult classroom setting, believe it or not, because someone thought it would be a great idea to bring it from home and dump this on a group of 80+ random, bored adults. I was mostly all, "wtf", but I was most confused of all just because of the cast, because after seeing the Color Purple, my mind refused to go along with the set up. It just refused.
It didn't take too long, but there was that, uhhh, scene (in fact, lots of scenes) that happened and that's when the instructor ran up to the big screen TV and shut it off. I just ended up renting it, because I wanted to see the rest.
But it got me to read the book which is way better. This movie could have worked, but there's just something about it that doesn't all the way.
This movie had THE BEST quotes! I randomly recite lines still! "Thin love ain't no love at all'
124
You all did a great job breaking this movie down (as usual). However, I am definitely one of the people who didn’t enjoy watching it. I also had/have not read the book. Another aspect for me is, I don’t mind having to “think” about a movie but if it becomes too much, I’m out. I still don’t have a desire to watch it again; however, I will listen to the audible.
Fair enough!
I watched this movie when I was about 11 or 12 and I understood what was going on. I remember crying at so much of it. I can’t believe it wasn’t well received it. I really like this movie it equally saddened and terrified me!
I'm going to make sure I watch this when I get off because I truly don't know what beloved is about😂😂
124! Enjoyed the commentary and differing perspectives! Well done.
❤️
Thank you for this! I was always lost trying to watch this movie!
Maybe because I watched this as a teen (too young)💜
Powerful movie and book. The younger generation needs to read, learn and see everything that the ancestors went through all while trying to build a dream and life for them 😢
I've loved this movie and book since it was released! The movie was great to me, but the BOOK.... MY GOD
124 first time here. Great breakdown. I know about PBS Pinchback because I am from Louisiana also. Going to watch listen to another vid. Glad I found you all, immediate sub
I got it and I never read the book. I have read several of Toni's book. She was a amazing writer.
As a 6yr old watching this at my granny house I WAS CONFUSED AF! 😂
I was 17 when it came out and I'm the type of person that watch films like this and have to watch it twice to gather everything but it want confusing and I LOVE IT 💕💕
I read the novel before the movie and I agree that you can understand the story better if you already know the details that were left out. I shared the book & movie with my children also (when they were of an appropriate age) so they could understand that the real horror of the movie was not the spirit or what Sethe did, but WHY she did it. History teaches us that the atrocities of slavery happened, but it's impersonal to most. A story like this sort of forces people to think about the human beings that suffered through it.
Im from Louisiana and it depends on what age you are and what school you went to and the parish you lived in, that you would have learned about Governor PB S. Pinchback. Im almost 40 and learned about him in middle school.
Thanks for weighing in on this! 😊
@@HeitCheri no problem 😉 i enjoy watching these reviews and weighing in from time to time 😊
124
I would totally love to see an analytical breakdown of this movie, because I think that a lot of people could benefit from seeing you guys break down the movie and include or clarify some of the parts that audiences over the years didn’t understand because of the left out contents from the book.
I don’t think that anyone else could actually do the breakdown that this movie would need in order for it to make the movie makes sense for people who haven’t read the novel, but you guys. I think that the way you guys do your breakdowns incorporates context not only from a personal perspective, but from the originators of the work and the perception of audience, who have watched it over the years. And I think that that’s invaluable.
I think we will offer something like this. 😊
@@HeitCheri I can’t wait. I’m on here and Patreon waiting! LoL
124. I enjoyed the movie. It’s not the book, but it’s not a bad movie.
No, it's not a bad movie at all. The box office often makes the wrong call! 😊
About to start part 2
Great book and film. People slept and are still sleeping on this classic!
This part!!!
I’ve never read the book, I did understand that she was a manifestation or “ghost” I just think the flash backs for filler info at different points kind of grapevined and led to a lil confusion. It’s a story where you discover more things the more you watch.
I loved the book and the movie. The story is more about how slavery took away the humanity of the characters and the literal physical manifestion (beloved) of generations of truama and grief
124. Yall really helped me get a better understanding of the movie. I plan to read the book soon now.
When i first saw beloved i didn't understand why she unalived the children. Still gut wrenching.
124 Great analysis. My wife and I listened. I subbed.
Welcome 🤗
When I saw this when I was much younger it scared the heck out of me and gave me nightmares. Watching it later as a adult now it made more sense and wasn’t as scary
124
I may be biased because I read the book first (I am obsessed with the works of Toni Morrison), and I LOVE sci fi.
I think the lack of understanding comes from a basic lack of knowledge/education about this period of time in American history.
There is SO much symbolism in both the book and the movie. Spoilers ahead:
The first thing that happens when Seethe sees Beloved is, she pees (symbolizing water breaking before birth).
The chokecherry tree Seethe got through brutalization could be analogous to the "Tree of Life" in Christianity" opening Seethe's eyes to the cruelty and evil in her world after the Bodwins hired school teacher.
Beloved shows up when she does because it seems that Seethe has finally learned to ignore the neighbours that are looking down on her, live happily with Denver and has reconnected with Paul D. At a moment of semi contentment, she is reminded of why she was ostracized by her neighbours and silently suffering, ONLY then does the physical manifestation of her guilt, regret and sorrow reappear.
Beloved's pregnancy is a reminder to Seethe of her deed, she works herself into a frenzy, doesn't leave the house and caters to Beloved's every need to assuage her guilt for her deed.
These are but a few examples.
PS I also blame the US education system not only for eliding over the horrors of slavery but also for not teaching critical thinking skills, simile and metaphor and how to recognize symbolism
I recalled it being a success. I remember we went to the theaters to see it. It was different but I understood it. I think I watched it once again outside of the theater. Not one of those I would watch over and over again. It was too heavy. Good acting and script.
Do you recall the budget and revenue?
124…. I think in the movie Beloved was almost like a succubus for Paul D. We know she wanted Sethe to herself, and to get him away, she knew that she would be successful in THAT manner because of the type of man Paul D was and him and Sethe’s real relationship
Been waiting for this video
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