i love this raid but getting people to play it is a nightmare because if you're not doing a div run for someone, there's no reason to play it because there isn't any desirable loot. good video!
Yes, I agree. If you are not posting a sub run, there are little to no interest and Div runs are soooo long unless you have several experienced players with only one or two newbies.
Well theres is a 50/50 chance that Garden or VoG get craftable weapons next season. Apex Predator went from zero to hero in a single perk refresh so the same can happen with the garden ones.
Recently fully crafted Age-Old Bond from LW, it feels good but a high-impact AR can only do so well. If they reprise GOS loot to be craftable, I'm getting Reckless Oracle crafted day 1.
A friend pointed me here, and I agree. Garden is a perfectly fine raid but it could be that Year-3 burnout or the PTSD of Blueberry Div runs and mechanical complexity.
I wouldn’t even say the mechanics are overly complex. 1st encounter is leapfrog, then you play buses (bus stop method), then you have gambit with target practice, and lastly is more gambit. I think people really struggle with finding the flow of the raid on top of its’ bugs in some areas.
@@Blub_blubbyMain problem… especially with LFGs at times is you just find people that want to coast and do absolutely nothing but add clear. This is one of those few raids where as far as I can think that everyone has to touch some part of the mechanics in every encounter.
If I had an enhancement core for every time I heard someone say "I ran garden once to get div, and I'm never touching it again" I'd have a full inventory. It's inevitable that garden weapons are going to be reissued eventually, and if they're anywhere near as good as the DSC and LW reissues, there's gonna be a ton of people *suddenly wanting to run garden*, and there's gonna be like, 10 Sherpas who actually know how to run the raid 🙃
The real reason why they hate the raid is because they do a blind div run so the only experience they have is a much longer and chore filled raid. Some people actually think you HAVE to do div puzzles just to do the raid..
I have a group of friends and we play D2 fairly often. We first met and started playing together shortly after DSC released and we’ve done every raid on contest mode together ever since. I’m bringing this up because before witch queen we were looking for something to do and my oldest friend among us said we should do garden flawless, it took a few tries but we eventually got it and then we realized that all of our individual gripes about garden were mostly LFG related. We all had stories of how we were stuck for hours because of different reasons, mostly because players unable to stay alive after one damage phase and causing several wipes only to leave. When we realized this it sort of allowed us to become closer, we trusted each other to know mechanics and be reliable when it comes to raiding. Shortly after our flawless we decided to get the title and seal for GoS. It took several weeks but we got it, and I still use it to this day over all my other titles. It was a beautifully fun raid to do with friends that brought me closer to them.
I did this raid for the first time, maybe a year ago, just lfging. My post was help me get divinity. Found 5 other guys who didnt know how to do the raid either. We muddled through with YT help since we were way overpowered. Took us 8 hrs but was such an awesome time.
Garden is aesthetically my favourite raid, but some issues that I find when carrying people through it: Edit: This is what I see new players struggle with. 1) The tether is disorienting. 2) The jumping puzzles take a lot longer than other raids since you have to shoot the leaves & time your jumps before the leaves close. Most people already have a hard time with jumping puzzles (seriously, the amount of people that can't tell depth perception in a game is actually higher than you think) so the minor complexity added to it makes it unbearable to a lot of people. 3) The pits in Consecrated Mind's boss fight kill a lot of players. People just cant quite get around it since the platforms are spinning and thus disorients a lot of players. 4) The sanctified mind fight can get screwed over easily because of the amount of moving parts + the need to NOT be close to the tethers if you're not a builder.
After 2000 clears I’m glad someone finally appreciates my madness, this video is really well put together and a lot of the things you mentioned about people not fully learning or appreciating the raid because they only do a Sherpa run once for div is entirely true, I don’t expect people to do the raid as much as I do but it’s really nice to see a video like this giving the raid a good light
I always describe Garden as the raid that smacks the player and “you aren’t getting carried through me. Pull your weight or drown”. This is why imo people don’t like the raid. Every other raid doesn’t really have that same mindset sans certain challenges.
Garden is a Raid I hold dear, especially because it becomes better when you have an experienced team and it‘s actually not that bad of a raid. People are just mad at it and I don‘t really get why. It may not be my favourite raid, since that honor belongs to SotP but it is in the top 3 On the loot I agree, except the pulse. It is soooo gooood The visuals are always something that stuck with me. I love themlocation and Eden is my favourite trackin the entire Destiny OST. It has so much emotion behind it, especially in the version without the vex remix in the background Btw I love that you also use frenzy on the ikelos smg. And absolutely agree, i will always run this raid when someone asks me, because the music is that good and I love chilling in the garden. Even if I wont get any loot I will do it Also I am happy to have the Enlightened title. While I am still missing the flawless, I already have some flawless raids and I hope once the loot gets craftable people will be motivated to do that as well I say this deserved a sub
Love the atmosphere of the raid...only issue was teaching new people through the raid. I have heard some people say it's like an updated version of Vault of Glass. The 2nd encounter with the relay is a new fresh raid encounter, I always like going through the vex teleporters. The final encounter with the portals, some say it's an updated version on Atheon's teleport, where your fireteam is able to select who goes in instead random chance. When Garden gets it's crafted weapons update, I would love to run it again.
Just completed it tonight and got divinity. It was beautiful and I enjoyed most tether puzzles. Really a great way for a team to get to know one another because you have to all work together so closely
Garden is by far my favorite raid it's the first raid I ever did in what introduced me to the idea of playing end game content. it's fun to go back every so often and see how much I've grown as a player whether it's dealing more damage during a boss fight for being able to do the mechanics faster. the scenery is absolutely amazing and the whole vibe of the entire raid amazing. I remeber being intrigued by the black garden ever since the Forsaken campaign. Up till i actually comitted to destiny I had only put in around 250 hours into the game including the original campaign on the blizzard launcher and ive loved catching up on lore and exploring and the black gardne remains the place i want to explore the most
This raid is my favourite, and I’m happy to say I’ve done 23 divinity Sherpas purely because of that. I love seeing new player’s reactions to how beautiful everything is, and just how awesome the environment design is. Plus divinity is the best exotic mission in the game right now imo, it isn’t just “complete patrols” or “get pvp kills”, but actually requires you to just…explore. Like the hidden dot in Adventure, you just find the things in the lost sectors and in the raid by just exploring the area, and I love it.
The solution is simple. The raid itself doesn't need to be tweaked or altered. Make the weapons craftable and the exotic a low chance to drop as well as complete the puzzle
Wonderful video, especially the part about this soundtrack. Another link it make with the narrative is the inclusion of the witch queen leitmotif to link it to the witness. It’s a shame that so many people seem to have some unresolved trauma with this raid as even some of my friends refuse to try to 3-man it with me despite it not being that hard.
My favorite aspect of GoS is how you don’t have to worry about DPS meta for the first half. The first two encounters are more about mechanics, ad management, and survivability. It’s also a pretty solid gateway raid since most of the mechanics directly translate to other parts of the game.
I agree with this video. When I got back into Destiny, Garden of Salvation was the first raid I cleared; the music, scenery, and atmosphere of the raid was the most beautiful piece of art I have ever seen and heard in Destiny. The callback to the Black Garden was a nice touch for me since I've played a whole lot of Destiny 1. Although I only played this raid twice for Divinity, it's still a nice raid and it's a shame that it's hard to find others to play the raid unless it's a Div run.
If I Sherpa the raid, I refuse to do a div run if it’s the majority’s first time. 7.5 hours of pain taught me many things. After one run I did, I did speak to a guy a week after sherparing his first time and said he got Div on his second. He thanked me for teaching the mechanics first because it was less confusing than learning on the go and said it was a fun raid. This really helped me feel like an accomplished Sherpa honestly
This raid is amazing. Back before beyond light i used to do speedruns of this raid with my clan, Fools (They take us for fools... heh) and it gave me a special love for this raid that no other raid has been able to replicate. This was a really enjoyable video.
This raid has always been in my top 3 (Garden, Leviathan, Wrath) and I think it'll always be there. People hate on this raid because "it's gambit the raid" but they totally disregard how dunking items to progress a mechanic is a staple of Destiny. They also complain about the bugginess of the motes, which was fixed a long while back. The Sol Inherent fight is the best-designed boss in Destiny history, I love how some people run to grab motes, others fight continuous waves of enemies, and some rebuild the arena, it makes sure that everyone has a role and every role is just as important as every other. Really a fantastic raid.
Garden is awesome! I just did it for the first time. It's just the final encounter that sucks ass. There's just no room for error. But, I do really like the rest of the raid. It's possibly the most beautiful raid in the games history.
what "no room of error" is there? lfg strats allow for 4 individual portal opens, 2 left, then 2 right, even if youre slow opening the portals, going in one at a time, the game allows you to go in 6 times before sanctified starts his pre damage tether, and even then you can go in again. Also even in lfgs it is easy to 1 phase, but sanctified is more generous than other bosses and allows you to 4 phase.
This raids a blast. Mechanics are straightforward & fun to complete. Boss battle is one of the most unique in the game & pretty challenging even if you’ve done it a few times.
I did this raid over the summer, and had fun, the only problem I had wasn't due to the raid, the weekend we did it, the servers were kicking us (it wasn't the ddos week though), it caused so much problems, but we worked through it, and it kind of made it more fun
Great video! I’ve been saying all your points to LFG teams for years lol. Hopefully next season we’ll get craftable garden weapons and have some life breathed into Garden
I remember my first encounter with this raid was Sanctified and by god, we were clueless. Didn’t touch it again for a month or so, then ended up doing it again in full when I got my PC and started playing Destiny 2 there instead. Did it with my mates again, and an at the time new connection, and ended up doing rather easily. Since that point, the raid has gone from one of my least favourite, to a top three choice for me. As of yet, the only thing keeping me from getting the title is the Stop Hitting Yourself extra triumph, which is largely RNG-based.
Immamu was right, guardians are only motivated by loot, with the weapons being crafted next season, hopefully you get so many people raiding with you. Great video
i started playing just after shadowkeep so garden was my first raid. i really have a soft spot for it and i have some funny horror stories about sherpa runs gone wrong and flawless run attempts. overall it's second only to vow imo
GoS is my fave! I did TONs of sherpa runs, particularly for Divinity. If I look it up on raid report I have 38 sherpas to 52 clears :) Really hope it’s the next reprised raid. And I agree that it has one of the best soundtrack and sky box of any raid.
If Bungie added weekly obtainable loot to the Div puzzles post-obtaining Div (preferably per character instead of per account), I feel it'll help ease people getting upset/annoyed at those needing a Div run and help the people who still need one find one.
Agree with the commenters saying how much they love this raid, but it’s tough to get people to run it. I find for a lot of people, not wanting to run it comes down to 3 reasons: 1. They burned out on the raid 2. They believe the raid is harder than it actually is 3. Glitches that crept their way into the raid after VoG came out This raid easily has some of the prettiest sky boxes in all of Destiny. Also, I’m quite fond of the mechanics… even the puzzles found in a Div run. A lot of the guns are excellent (the shotty with one-two punch is prized among people who do shorthanded content, the fusion is a favorite among people in PvP who prefer the archetype, and the hand cannon makes for a very solid choice in GMs when HC’s have an anti-champion attached). Hoping the ability to craft them with enhanced perks brings people back to this raid, even if only for a short time
Definitely an underrated raid. It probably is second only to Last Wish for me because I love the theme of the raid that much (DSC being a close third). Although I feel like one of the things holding it back is the lack of readily accessible information on this raid (last time I saw an updated guide to this was probably Season of the Lost). And as someone who’s gotten the title associated with this raid, I still feel like I don’t understand nearly as much of this one as I do others. Every time I do 3rd or final encounter with a competent team, there’s almost always a new strat I’m trying to learn while they more-or-less 4-man it with me and another random as LFG fodder.
@@darqshw2778 that's.... a bit ironic to say the least. I'll check it out, thanks for the tip. Edit: Watched the video and it's probably the best one in terms of explanation given while being concise that I've seen to date.
I really like this Raid with my friends, but I hate it on LFG. Every time I get people on LFG there’s always one asshole speedrunner that if you don’t get the first encounter done in 30 seconds they just leave. And if they don’t leave they just whine about not knowing THEIR mechanics and then proceed to complain the entire time about having to do Normal mechanics that aren’t difficult. The other people I hate are the “Must have 200+ Raid Clears” people like dude I’m not a 15 year old that has all the time in the world to play all day. The last people I hate are the ones that are too shy to talk. Like it’s okay if you don’t want to talk but at least communicate the mechanics when the time comes. Truly an underrated raid imo but yet another piece of content that gets ruined by shitty players.
Even though it's one of my favorite raids too, my biggest issues with it are the crazy power creep that has lead to barely any ads spawning particularly on 2nd encounter not being enough anymore, the final boss just not being fun IMO, and too many issues with the extension mechanic bugging out on the final boss. I did a trio a few weeks ago and we tried extending but the majority of times we either had the damage phase immediately end upon extension, the damage phase was extended but the boss remained immune anyways, or the boss had a successful extended damage phase but all subsequent phases the boss was stuck immune.
This is my favorite raid of all time. I have over 60 runs. Funnily, I think that power creep has made it way more fun because one phases are reasonably achievable now. Luckily i have 5 friends who also like it, but everyone should really give it another go
The only gripe my group ever has about doing this raid is the final boss. Motes falling through the floor or off the edge always throws us off and it's a pain to recover
great assessment of GoS but for most people including myself the dealbreaker is that there are no sought after items from the raid so there isn't much reason to return and play it
This is one of my favorite raids I love how the black garden looks and how fun it actually is. It's just sad because no one wants to run it unless you are getting div :(
I personally prefer the windmill section over spacewalk. I find Deep Stone very overrated and i love the theme of nature overgrowing vex structure. The theme playing during the windmill section is called Eden and Eden refers to multiple meanings as as paradise,the garden in Genesis where Adam and Eva first lived and Eden is also refered to as a place of natural beauty. And that suits the area very well. Despite the entire area being terraformed by the Vex like it has been on Mercury or Nessus,you can still see that nature still on top manages to overgrow their structures and spread life. The way to the Sanctified Mind even shows it more that the Vex are industrial,cold and dead which is why the jumping puzzle goes from green and beautiful to white-greyish and dark once you reach the final boss. Bungie really nailed it with the soundtrack and environment and people don't give them enough compliments for that raids.
I definitely agree with a majority of your points. Good soundtrack, lore and encounters. Nothing more to add since it was well explained by you already. The biggest problem with the raid is the new player friendliness, major past bugs after a year of release, the fixes to good bugs and current bugs. TL;DR - Clunky feeling raid and probably the hardest to learn for newcomers. I encountered a lot of major bugs during my multiple times running Garden. Some bugs were fixed, both good and bad, and there still exists some frustrating bugs. BUT it is still a good raid and I'll be running it once the weapon refresh comes out. New player friendliness: Out of the current raids still available to play in the game, I would argue this is the hardest raid for newcomers. (If Crown of Sorrow was still playable then it would definitely be that instead). It has one of weirdest jumping puzzles. The first section is not hard, but it's not very direct and thus a lot of newcomers often take a long time. The second section usually requires newcomers to shoot leaves to jump across and you'd be surprised on the amount of people that just don't get it. If they don't understand how to deal with champions efficiently then they usually die to the ones in second encounter. You really need to know the ranges to the tether mechanic or it'll annoy your team (Too close when you're not needed and you'll become part of the tether. Too far when you are needed and you either not get connected or break the line). The raid itself if very clunky and that's a whole paragraph of stuff I could get into, but this is enough for now. All of the stuff I mentioned right now are the big ones, imo Major bugs: I have done garden specifically 20 times in my life. (A low amount of Garden runs, but I have 280 more runs on other raids). 8 of those were probably Divinity runs which in all of them I was the guy in the group with the best knowledge of the raid and how to efficiently get Div with the least time wasted. In at least 10 of my 20 runs I have encountered a bug that we had to work around or had to wipe for. Two of the bugged runs were Div runs. A majority of these bugged runs involved the tether box in which it would not activate with regular shooting. It would activate with a Warlock Chaos Reach. Another bug in the final encounter is when a mote tower was filled all the way (We saw confirmation text at the bottom left), yet the tether would not connect to the boss. Which meant we could not activate Damage Phase. Other bug things: I very much dislike that they fixed the method to get 30 motes in a single area run by running up a tree branch and everyone jumping down at the same time. Current bugs that have exist for a long time. The harpy boss sometimes moving wildly during damage depending on the weapon you are using (Levi's Breath usually). If a bubble is placed down the hall for later use in Harpy DPS and is not placed great, then the Harpy may sometimes fly into the sky or take a very unconventional path. The motes in both third and final encounter falling into the floor and being unable to be picked up unless using the Powerful Attraction mod. But even with all this, it is still a good raid and once the weapon refresh is out for Garden. Then I will be running it probably for the pulse rifle and the bow
The raid not being new player friendly at all is pretty much the main reason why I steer far far away from the raid. I've had to stay in Sanctified Mind encounter for I shit you not, 5 fucking hours total to kill him all because I decided to sherpa 5 new players put a permanent dent in my experience and opinion with that raid.
I got the title for this raid, and can safely say it's my least favorite raid in the whole franchise. Its a nightmare to sherpa, tether mechanic can be an inconsistent headache, loot (besides div) was never great, etc. I wouldn't say I hate it, but no part of this raid is exciting to me, or more fun than encounter in any other raid that I can think of. The mechanics are bad to boring at best. I often hear people hype up the visuals and music but personally none of it is that much more standout than the rest of the game. This is all my opinion and I actually really respect that you see it all in a positive way, and I'm happy that others find more joy in it than I do. Every time I run GoS I give it another chance, only to be more sure by the end that it's my least favorite. This was a great video, despite disagreeing with you. Subbed!
I can save the whole raid option on why its disliked 1. When it came out it was the only raid for the entire year 2. Back when we needed to power level it was the only raid in the game that you could not max your power as the raid has no heavey weapon 3. The raid while has simple encounters doesn't fully explain the theather mechanics which leads to massive frustration in the boss arena with the platforms
GoS is the only raid I have yet to do that is still available. I want to do it to get Divinity but almost everyone I play with absolutely despises it, but I'm over here like never disliking any part of a raid, and actively wanting to do it and will probably end up enjoying it. I do not really like playing with a full team that I do not know, but I might have to at this rate.
I like this raid on paper but oh my god is it annoying. First off, I love the tether mechanic. I think it is super interesting and requires so much coordination, but it is extremely buggy. If you are even remotely close(which isn't a lot), it'll tether to you and you have to travel so far in order to break the line. Plus, the harpy is such a weird boss to fight because of how sporadic it behaves. We had the mind in the same spot on every attempt at our runs of it and it completely ruined the damage phase because it kept on playing the hokey pokey around a pillar and then when it started to move away, it would put up the vex wall and we couldn't do anything about it. Then the final boss, you cannot use any explosive damage or use any grenades whatsoever, because then you'll pull your team mates too early and mess up the encounter. Then bridge building is a nightmare because of the previous statement mentioned. It's the worst here because of how panicked everyone gets with the floors and the area is so small to work with. Plus, if you try to help build, you get trash talked because you didn't build right, but if you don't help, you get trash talked because you didn't help. It's a never ending cycle with the raid. It looks beautiful and I LOVE the weapons but tbh, it's just not good because of those reasons. I love that everyone has to do something but the problem arises when the mechanics or the AI do not want to cooperate. A div run is super fun though and requires people to cooperate with each other. On paper, it is super cool but when it is in action, it just doesn't work out. Love the video, keep grinding
I think that this raid, more than any other, would benefit from a loot refresh (which is all but guaranteed going into this next season). A lot of destiny players are very loot-minded and don't do things that won't give good loot. I think having the incentive for old and new players to play garden for some sweet sweet craftable weapons would give the raid a good diversity of players and maybe show more people that the raid isn't as bad as they think it is. :)
Great video. Im a new player, and I don't have a raid group. Of the raids in the game, Garden is the one im least interested in, primarily because of the loot situation. Last Wish, Vow of the Disciple, and Root of Nightmares all have great loot which i would be excited to get my hands on, and without some extra incentive, garden's compelling aesthetic is not enough motivation for me. Even last wish, a raid which seems much more boring to me, at least has Apex Predator, a Rocket which is borderline required for the current meta
Honestly GoS is a really good raid imo. The one good part of shadowkeep. Tbh most of the complaints people make boil down to “I’m bad and got mad at it because it requires slight precision and my brain doesn’t feel like it”
HARD disagree, the hype for the storyline was immense, and it let down pretty much everyone (just like the entirety of the expansion though), the mechanic, while original and crazy, was a pain in the ass bc of bugs, the second boss was super lame, a tone down Atheon with less cool everything Loot was not good as well, so why underrated ?
Sanctified mind song gives me nightmares after day 1 and a few 3+ hr sherpa runs. The raid is gorgeous and yes the music is great but I think my life expectancy drops everytime I hear that final boss song. Bungie had better make the origin trait freaking phenomenal if they want people back in there. That being said I still run the Provenance/accrued redemption + zealots as my EDC. The weapons look phenomenal.
My first run, it was me and five friends, only one of which had ever set foot in the raid before. We went for Div. It took 9 hours. Not sure it was worth it. I love the first 3 encounters. But the boss, if there’s even one person for who it’s their first time there, you’re going to be there for 2 hours. Which is why my rule now is I won’t sherpa for Div unless everyone has a clear already; we’ll get you Div on your second run. (But ~no one wants that.)
I have a single completion of Garden of Salvation. One week post raid launch, it was my Div run. I like Garden, it’s music, it atmosphere, even its weapons. But I cannot stand Sanctified Mind. In the years since release, I have help a few with Div puzzles, but I have not completed a Sanctified Mind since my first run. I used to bail after an hour of wipes, but soon that turned to bailing upon reaching the boss. I just do not think it is fun, at all. Cut just one mechanic from that fight (imo: the platform destruction) to reduce the gameplay noise and I’d be much happier.
I was jumping through lfg the other day farming commendations and saw a 5/6 for GoS final boss. So I jumped I'm and had an absolute blast. Forgot how good this raid was, just needs better loot.
I personally say this raid is hard next to last wish and Vow for an avg player. This raid requires everyone to know what their doing. You can go "ad clear" but you are constantly moving, shifting and rotating in this raid. Your never really staying in one place. GOS in my opinion is a raid that is challenging and doesnt use symbols that you must remember. I place this raid on the difficulty level of Expert next to Last wish and Vow. I do think that if this raid got its loot refreshed would rise in popularity again. It is in my opinion a fun raid but can last 2+ hours if everyone doesn't know what to do its heavily mechanic and its boss dps are brutal.
Having to connect the tether is what kills the raid for me. Having to stand still for like 5 seconds and sometimes longer (doesn't seem like a lot, but it is in a always active run and gun game) and not do anything else incase you need to shimmy like 2 cm forward or back is just unfun to me.
Last wish got lot of slack until it came back with reworked craft able weapons and its a pretty straight forward raid but the more I play it the more I like it. I started grinding last wish about 7 or 8 weeks ago and almost have every weapon Craftable... I think when garden salvation gets red borders people will enjoy it again and I think raids end up growing on you the more you do it
did you read my mind? I don’t think you said a single thing I disagreed with and I adore garden (and am the black sheep of my friend group for thinking it’s fun
Garden is certainly beautiful and interesting mechanics-wise, but the loot is meh, mechanics are a nightmare if it's not done perfectly, and I still have no idea how the final fight works. If these problems are fixed, then I will potentially go back into the raid. Also half of the Consecrated mind fight is literally just Gambit. This wouldn't be such a big deal if so many in-game mechanics weren't just the motes mechanic from Gambit.
6 man garden absolutely sucks but 3 man gos and 2 harpy and sanc are a blast. Most people hate garden since they do it 6 man but if you do 3 man garden then it's really fun.
As the people in these comments seem to like Garden as much as i do, why don't we all make a server with only people who likes garden. Then there will always be people to find when doing it
The Tether mechanics are predictable. Motes falling through the ground is the only busted part of the mechanics. The Sacred Provenance, for over a year was the only Aggressive Frame (4 Burst) Pulse that wasn’t sunset in the game. Not only that but it also rolled Kill Clip and Rapid Hit. It already 2 burst in PvP, but you get KC and you’re destroying warlocks in rifts without issue. Now it’s even more killer with Headseeker rolls. Still a valid weapon in todays PVP sandbox and solid PVE. Also one of the best Void Autorifles. And Zealot’s Reward Rapid frame fusion rolls Underpressure and Back Up Plan also deadly in PVP. The Armour set was the first Armour I Transmogged too. This was such a legendary raid that simply isn’t simple but highly predictable and requires skill/dexterity and knowledge. There’s a reason 1 person can practically Sherpa an entire team. Absolutely underrated raid. Great video.
Have never done this raid. What is best way to find a Sherpa and team that doesn’t mind someone that does not know what to do….of course I want the divinity
It’s complex sure, but I’d consider kingsfall pretty close just in how hard it is to survive the mechanics. At least GOS is also entertaining to be in and look at.
I see babysitting as more of a pain than a fun gameplay experience. Jumping puzzles on top of constant attrition, and sometimes slow gambit teams are not fun to deal with.
The theme of the raid is nice but I hate the flow of combat. Encounter 1 is fine encounter 2 is a snore encounter 3 is mid and honestly the final boss encounter blows. Div quest makes me hate myself. The loot isn't good enough for the time investment (still not craftable prob will be better soon). The extra chest only gives armor. Lastly I hate you need to have the full armor set for a damage buff that's almost required to do good damage to final boss
Really a majority of the hate comes from the terrible loot pool. Even when it first came out all the weapons were outclassed by things we already had with the exception of the Bow.
On the one hand, id love to craft VoG weapons, but on the other Garden needs a better reason to actually do the raid. other than div. Its not bad but even i can tell everything else is kinda better and i started with beyond light
If the tether mechanic wasn't buggy and if the bonus chests dropped weapons... also if the weapons were good... But yes people got burnt out on it REALLY fast. You also have to realize when DSC finally launched we only had Last Wish, GoS, and DSC because of sunsetting. So there is a lot more going on there than this video explains. Also no RNG raid exotic REALLY sucks. Bungie I know people complain about RNG but at the same time we secretly love it and having a reason to replay something. Also its gambit... but a raid.... BUT dont get me wrong it is one of the prettiest raids. And will be a lot better once its weapons are reworked. Ancient gospel will be meta, the shotgun will be meta, and the fusion will probably be meta. But my favorite raid is also a weird choice being DSC. I just love everything about the raid except the sparrow part, i mean its better than Vow's opening but still annoying. But back when DSC came out we had glitches to get around the frostbite mechanic which made that raid better. Second favorite is Vow. Last Wish is overrated.
Garden of Salvation is a good raid. People are just bad at it also imo the handcannon & pulse are decent in pvp The shotgun is also a personal favourite Also I see that LMG with Ancient Defender on it I love the GoS flawless shader
i love this raid but getting people to play it is a nightmare because if you're not doing a div run for someone, there's no reason to play it because there isn't any desirable loot. good video!
Yes, I agree. If you are not posting a sub run, there are little to no interest and Div runs are soooo long unless you have several experienced players with only one or two newbies.
I mean the guns and armor look good in my opinion. I do hope they do a raid loot refresh for it and VOG soon.
Well theres is a 50/50 chance that Garden or VoG get craftable weapons next season.
Apex Predator went from zero to hero in a single perk refresh so the same can happen with the garden ones.
Recently fully crafted Age-Old Bond from LW, it feels good but a high-impact AR can only do so well.
If they reprise GOS loot to be craftable, I'm getting Reckless Oracle crafted day 1.
Vex and vex related mechanics are annoying ad to me. Ill suffer a lot tò get those Red borders
This is legit my favorite raid, I think it’s the atmosphere that draws me in the most
A friend pointed me here, and I agree. Garden is a perfectly fine raid but it could be that Year-3 burnout or the PTSD of Blueberry Div runs and mechanical complexity.
I wouldn’t even say the mechanics are overly complex. 1st encounter is leapfrog, then you play buses (bus stop method), then you have gambit with target practice, and lastly is more gambit. I think people really struggle with finding the flow of the raid on top of its’ bugs in some areas.
@@Blub_blubbyMain problem… especially with LFGs at times is you just find people that want to coast and do absolutely nothing but add clear.
This is one of those few raids where as far as I can think that everyone has to touch some part of the mechanics in every encounter.
If I had an enhancement core for every time I heard someone say "I ran garden once to get div, and I'm never touching it again" I'd have a full inventory. It's inevitable that garden weapons are going to be reissued eventually, and if they're anywhere near as good as the DSC and LW reissues, there's gonna be a ton of people *suddenly wanting to run garden*, and there's gonna be like, 10 Sherpas who actually know how to run the raid 🙃
I hope it does get a reprisal, the weapons look so good
By the time they get to it, most people won’t even be playing anymore. Drip feed everything is cancer.
The real reason why they hate the raid is because they do a blind div run so the only experience they have is a much longer and chore filled raid. Some people actually think you HAVE to do div puzzles just to do the raid..
I have a group of friends and we play D2 fairly often. We first met and started playing together shortly after DSC released and we’ve done every raid on contest mode together ever since. I’m bringing this up because before witch queen we were looking for something to do and my oldest friend among us said we should do garden flawless, it took a few tries but we eventually got it and then we realized that all of our individual gripes about garden were mostly LFG related. We all had stories of how we were stuck for hours because of different reasons, mostly because players unable to stay alive after one damage phase and causing several wipes only to leave. When we realized this it sort of allowed us to become closer, we trusted each other to know mechanics and be reliable when it comes to raiding. Shortly after our flawless we decided to get the title and seal for GoS. It took several weeks but we got it, and I still use it to this day over all my other titles. It was a beautifully fun raid to do with friends that brought me closer to them.
I did this raid for the first time, maybe a year ago, just lfging. My post was help me get divinity. Found 5 other guys who didnt know how to do the raid either. We muddled through with YT help since we were way overpowered. Took us 8 hrs but was such an awesome time.
Garden is aesthetically my favourite raid, but some issues that I find when carrying people through it:
Edit: This is what I see new players struggle with.
1) The tether is disorienting.
2) The jumping puzzles take a lot longer than other raids since you have to shoot the leaves & time your jumps before the leaves close. Most people already have a hard time with jumping puzzles (seriously, the amount of people that can't tell depth perception in a game is actually higher than you think) so the minor complexity added to it makes it unbearable to a lot of people.
3) The pits in Consecrated Mind's boss fight kill a lot of players. People just cant quite get around it since the platforms are spinning and thus disorients a lot of players.
4) The sanctified mind fight can get screwed over easily because of the amount of moving parts + the need to NOT be close to the tethers if you're not a builder.
It makes it so much easier if you just don’t build platforms
literally just don't build, you don't need to shoot any leaves
RoN and VoW parkour sections are way longer 💀
After 2000 clears I’m glad someone finally appreciates my madness, this video is really well put together and a lot of the things you mentioned about people not fully learning or appreciating the raid because they only do a Sherpa run once for div is entirely true, I don’t expect people to do the raid as much as I do but it’s really nice to see a video like this giving the raid a good light
Awesome video!
My favorite raid! Absolutely beautiful and such fascinating lore (that all the Veil stuff from Lightfall kind of messes with a bit)
I always describe Garden as the raid that smacks the player and “you aren’t getting carried through me. Pull your weight or drown”. This is why imo people don’t like the raid. Every other raid doesn’t really have that same mindset sans certain challenges.
Garden is a Raid I hold dear, especially because it becomes better when you have an experienced team and it‘s actually not that bad of a raid. People are just mad at it and I don‘t really get why. It may not be my favourite raid, since that honor belongs to SotP but it is in the top 3
On the loot I agree, except the pulse. It is soooo gooood
The visuals are always something that stuck with me. I love themlocation and Eden is my favourite trackin the entire Destiny OST. It has so much emotion behind it, especially in the version without the vex remix in the background
Btw I love that you also use frenzy on the ikelos smg.
And absolutely agree, i will always run this raid when someone asks me, because the music is that good and I love chilling in the garden. Even if I wont get any loot I will do it
Also I am happy to have the Enlightened title. While I am still missing the flawless, I already have some flawless raids and I hope once the loot gets craftable people will be motivated to do that as well
I say this deserved a sub
Love the atmosphere of the raid...only issue was teaching new people through the raid. I have heard some people say it's like an updated version of Vault of Glass. The 2nd encounter with the relay is a new fresh raid encounter, I always like going through the vex teleporters. The final encounter with the portals, some say it's an updated version on Atheon's teleport, where your fireteam is able to select who goes in instead random chance. When Garden gets it's crafted weapons update, I would love to run it again.
Same dude. I really hope they do the perk rolls for the reprised/craftable weapons justice.
Just completed it tonight and got divinity. It was beautiful and I enjoyed most tether puzzles. Really a great way for a team to get to know one another because you have to all work together so closely
Garden is by far my favorite raid it's the first raid I ever did in what introduced me to the idea of playing end game content. it's fun to go back every so often and see how much I've grown as a player whether it's dealing more damage during a boss fight for being able to do the mechanics faster. the scenery is absolutely amazing and the whole vibe of the entire raid amazing. I remeber being intrigued by the black garden ever since the Forsaken campaign. Up till i actually comitted to destiny I had only put in around 250 hours into the game including the original campaign on the blizzard launcher and ive loved catching up on lore and exploring and the black gardne remains the place i want to explore the most
This raid is my favourite, and I’m happy to say I’ve done 23 divinity Sherpas purely because of that. I love seeing new player’s reactions to how beautiful everything is, and just how awesome the environment design is. Plus divinity is the best exotic mission in the game right now imo, it isn’t just “complete patrols” or “get pvp kills”, but actually requires you to just…explore. Like the hidden dot in Adventure, you just find the things in the lost sectors and in the raid by just exploring the area, and I love it.
The solution is simple. The raid itself doesn't need to be tweaked or altered. Make the weapons craftable and the exotic a low chance to drop as well as complete the puzzle
Wonderful video, especially the part about this soundtrack. Another link it make with the narrative is the inclusion of the witch queen leitmotif to link it to the witness.
It’s a shame that so many people seem to have some unresolved trauma with this raid as even some of my friends refuse to try to 3-man it with me despite it not being that hard.
My favorite aspect of GoS is how you don’t have to worry about DPS meta for the first half. The first two encounters are more about mechanics, ad management, and survivability.
It’s also a pretty solid gateway raid since most of the mechanics directly translate to other parts of the game.
I agree with this video. When I got back into Destiny, Garden of Salvation was the first raid I cleared; the music, scenery, and atmosphere of the raid was the most beautiful piece of art I have ever seen and heard in Destiny. The callback to the Black Garden was a nice touch for me since I've played a whole lot of Destiny 1. Although I only played this raid twice for Divinity, it's still a nice raid and it's a shame that it's hard to find others to play the raid unless it's a Div run.
Aesthetic of guns and the final boss looks cool, i also like the enviroment
If I Sherpa the raid, I refuse to do a div run if it’s the majority’s first time. 7.5 hours of pain taught me many things. After one run I did, I did speak to a guy a week after sherparing his first time and said he got Div on his second. He thanked me for teaching the mechanics first because it was less confusing than learning on the go and said it was a fun raid.
This really helped me feel like an accomplished Sherpa honestly
This raid is amazing.
Back before beyond light i used to do speedruns of this raid with my clan, Fools (They take us for fools... heh) and it gave me a special love for this raid that no other raid has been able to replicate. This was a really enjoyable video.
This raid has always been in my top 3 (Garden, Leviathan, Wrath) and I think it'll always be there. People hate on this raid because "it's gambit the raid" but they totally disregard how dunking items to progress a mechanic is a staple of Destiny. They also complain about the bugginess of the motes, which was fixed a long while back. The Sol Inherent fight is the best-designed boss in Destiny history, I love how some people run to grab motes, others fight continuous waves of enemies, and some rebuild the arena, it makes sure that everyone has a role and every role is just as important as every other. Really a fantastic raid.
The fusion rifle is one of the best pvp fusions of you get the correct roll
Garden is awesome! I just did it for the first time. It's just the final encounter that sucks ass. There's just no room for error. But, I do really like the rest of the raid. It's possibly the most beautiful raid in the games history.
No room for error? Its just gambit lmao. Any random LFG can 2-Phase it, you don’t even need to rebuild the platforms. Just ad clear and build towers.
what "no room of error" is there? lfg strats allow for 4 individual portal opens, 2 left, then 2 right, even if youre slow opening the portals, going in one at a time, the game allows you to go in 6 times before sanctified starts his pre damage tether, and even then you can go in again. Also even in lfgs it is easy to 1 phase, but sanctified is more generous than other bosses and allows you to 4 phase.
no room for error lol
This raids a blast. Mechanics are straightforward & fun to complete. Boss battle is one of the most unique in the game & pretty challenging even if you’ve done it a few times.
I did this raid over the summer, and had fun, the only problem I had wasn't due to the raid, the weekend we did it, the servers were kicking us (it wasn't the ddos week though), it caused so much problems, but we worked through it, and it kind of made it more fun
Great video! I’ve been saying all your points to LFG teams for years lol. Hopefully next season we’ll get craftable garden weapons and have some life breathed into Garden
I remember my first encounter with this raid was Sanctified and by god, we were clueless. Didn’t touch it again for a month or so, then ended up doing it again in full when I got my PC and started playing Destiny 2 there instead. Did it with my mates again, and an at the time new connection, and ended up doing rather easily.
Since that point, the raid has gone from one of my least favourite, to a top three choice for me.
As of yet, the only thing keeping me from getting the title is the Stop Hitting Yourself extra triumph, which is largely RNG-based.
Immamu was right, guardians are only motivated by loot, with the weapons being crafted next season, hopefully you get so many people raiding with you. Great video
i started playing just after shadowkeep so garden was my first raid. i really have a soft spot for it and i have some funny horror stories about sherpa runs gone wrong and flawless run attempts. overall it's second only to vow imo
GoS is my fave! I did TONs of sherpa runs, particularly for Divinity. If I look it up on raid report I have 38 sherpas to 52 clears :)
Really hope it’s the next reprised raid. And I agree that it has one of the best soundtrack and sky box of any raid.
If Bungie added weekly obtainable loot to the Div puzzles post-obtaining Div (preferably per character instead of per account), I feel it'll help ease people getting upset/annoyed at those needing a Div run and help the people who still need one find one.
Agree with the commenters saying how much they love this raid, but it’s tough to get people to run it.
I find for a lot of people, not wanting to run it comes down to 3 reasons:
1. They burned out on the raid
2. They believe the raid is harder than it actually is
3. Glitches that crept their way into the raid after VoG came out
This raid easily has some of the prettiest sky boxes in all of Destiny. Also, I’m quite fond of the mechanics… even the puzzles found in a Div run.
A lot of the guns are excellent (the shotty with one-two punch is prized among people who do shorthanded content, the fusion is a favorite among people in PvP who prefer the archetype, and the hand cannon makes for a very solid choice in GMs when HC’s have an anti-champion attached). Hoping the ability to craft them with enhanced perks brings people back to this raid, even if only for a short time
Definitely an underrated raid. It probably is second only to Last Wish for me because I love the theme of the raid that much (DSC being a close third).
Although I feel like one of the things holding it back is the lack of readily accessible information on this raid (last time I saw an updated guide to this was probably Season of the Lost). And as someone who’s gotten the title associated with this raid, I still feel like I don’t understand nearly as much of this one as I do others. Every time I do 3rd or final encounter with a competent team, there’s almost always a new strat I’m trying to learn while they more-or-less 4-man it with me and another random as LFG fodder.
llama made a video in his Raid Mastery Series about GoS just last week. Shows pretty much all of the optimized starts for each encounter
@@darqshw2778 that's.... a bit ironic to say the least. I'll check it out, thanks for the tip.
Edit: Watched the video and it's probably the best one in terms of explanation given while being concise that I've seen to date.
I really like this Raid with my friends, but I hate it on LFG. Every time I get people on LFG there’s always one asshole speedrunner that if you don’t get the first encounter done in 30 seconds they just leave. And if they don’t leave they just whine about not knowing THEIR mechanics and then proceed to complain the entire time about having to do Normal mechanics that aren’t difficult. The other people I hate are the “Must have 200+ Raid Clears” people like dude I’m not a 15 year old that has all the time in the world to play all day. The last people I hate are the ones that are too shy to talk. Like it’s okay if you don’t want to talk but at least communicate the mechanics when the time comes. Truly an underrated raid imo but yet another piece of content that gets ruined by shitty players.
Even though it's one of my favorite raids too, my biggest issues with it are the crazy power creep that has lead to barely any ads spawning particularly on 2nd encounter not being enough anymore, the final boss just not being fun IMO, and too many issues with the extension mechanic bugging out on the final boss. I did a trio a few weeks ago and we tried extending but the majority of times we either had the damage phase immediately end upon extension, the damage phase was extended but the boss remained immune anyways, or the boss had a successful extended damage phase but all subsequent phases the boss was stuck immune.
This is my favorite raid of all time. I have over 60 runs. Funnily, I think that power creep has made it way more fun because one phases are reasonably achievable now. Luckily i have 5 friends who also like it, but everyone should really give it another go
The only gripe my group ever has about doing this raid is the final boss. Motes falling through the floor or off the edge always throws us off and it's a pain to recover
great assessment of GoS but for most people including myself the dealbreaker is that there are no sought after items from the raid so there isn't much reason to return and play it
This is one of my favorite raids I love how the black garden looks and how fun it actually is. It's just sad because no one wants to run it unless you are getting div :(
I personally prefer the windmill section over spacewalk. I find Deep Stone very overrated and i love the theme of nature overgrowing vex structure. The theme playing during the windmill section is called Eden and Eden refers to multiple meanings as as paradise,the garden in Genesis where Adam and Eva first lived and Eden is also refered to as a place of natural beauty. And that suits the area very well. Despite the entire area being terraformed by the Vex like it has been on Mercury or Nessus,you can still see that nature still on top manages to overgrow their structures and spread life. The way to the Sanctified Mind even shows it more that the Vex are industrial,cold and dead which is why the jumping puzzle goes from green and beautiful to white-greyish and dark once you reach the final boss. Bungie really nailed it with the soundtrack and environment and people don't give them enough compliments for that raids.
I definitely agree with a majority of your points. Good soundtrack, lore and encounters. Nothing more to add since it was well explained by you already.
The biggest problem with the raid is the new player friendliness, major past bugs after a year of release, the fixes to good bugs and current bugs.
TL;DR - Clunky feeling raid and probably the hardest to learn for newcomers. I encountered a lot of major bugs during my multiple times running Garden. Some bugs were fixed, both good and bad, and there still exists some frustrating bugs. BUT it is still a good raid and I'll be running it once the weapon refresh comes out.
New player friendliness: Out of the current raids still available to play in the game, I would argue this is the hardest raid for newcomers. (If Crown of Sorrow was still playable then it would definitely be that instead). It has one of weirdest jumping puzzles. The first section is not hard, but it's not very direct and thus a lot of newcomers often take a long time. The second section usually requires newcomers to shoot leaves to jump across and you'd be surprised on the amount of people that just don't get it. If they don't understand how to deal with champions efficiently then they usually die to the ones in second encounter. You really need to know the ranges to the tether mechanic or it'll annoy your team (Too close when you're not needed and you'll become part of the tether. Too far when you are needed and you either not get connected or break the line). The raid itself if very clunky and that's a whole paragraph of stuff I could get into, but this is enough for now. All of the stuff I mentioned right now are the big ones, imo
Major bugs: I have done garden specifically 20 times in my life. (A low amount of Garden runs, but I have 280 more runs on other raids). 8 of those were probably Divinity runs which in all of them I was the guy in the group with the best knowledge of the raid and how to efficiently get Div with the least time wasted. In at least 10 of my 20 runs I have encountered a bug that we had to work around or had to wipe for. Two of the bugged runs were Div runs. A majority of these bugged runs involved the tether box in which it would not activate with regular shooting. It would activate with a Warlock Chaos Reach. Another bug in the final encounter is when a mote tower was filled all the way (We saw confirmation text at the bottom left), yet the tether would not connect to the boss. Which meant we could not activate Damage Phase.
Other bug things: I very much dislike that they fixed the method to get 30 motes in a single area run by running up a tree branch and everyone jumping down at the same time. Current bugs that have exist for a long time. The harpy boss sometimes moving wildly during damage depending on the weapon you are using (Levi's Breath usually). If a bubble is placed down the hall for later use in Harpy DPS and is not placed great, then the Harpy may sometimes fly into the sky or take a very unconventional path. The motes in both third and final encounter falling into the floor and being unable to be picked up unless using the Powerful Attraction mod.
But even with all this, it is still a good raid and once the weapon refresh is out for Garden. Then I will be running it probably for the pulse rifle and the bow
The raid not being new player friendly at all is pretty much the main reason why I steer far far away from the raid.
I've had to stay in Sanctified Mind encounter for I shit you not, 5 fucking hours total to kill him all because I decided to sherpa 5 new players put a permanent dent in my experience and opinion with that raid.
Spot on review - beautiful raid. Just can’t complete that final boss. It haunts our clans nightmares
I got the title for this raid, and can safely say it's my least favorite raid in the whole franchise. Its a nightmare to sherpa, tether mechanic can be an inconsistent headache, loot (besides div) was never great, etc. I wouldn't say I hate it, but no part of this raid is exciting to me, or more fun than encounter in any other raid that I can think of. The mechanics are bad to boring at best. I often hear people hype up the visuals and music but personally none of it is that much more standout than the rest of the game. This is all my opinion and I actually really respect that you see it all in a positive way, and I'm happy that others find more joy in it than I do. Every time I run GoS I give it another chance, only to be more sure by the end that it's my least favorite. This was a great video, despite disagreeing with you. Subbed!
i hope you make more raid videos. the deep stone crypt one was so awesome.
There’s a Vault of Glass video coming very soon :)
I can save the whole raid option on why its disliked
1. When it came out it was the only raid for the entire year
2. Back when we needed to power level it was the only raid in the game that you could not max your power as the raid has no heavey weapon
3. The raid while has simple encounters doesn't fully explain the theather mechanics which leads to massive frustration in the boss arena with the platforms
GoS is the only raid I have yet to do that is still available. I want to do it to get Divinity but almost everyone I play with absolutely despises it, but I'm over here like never disliking any part of a raid, and actively wanting to do it and will probably end up enjoying it. I do not really like playing with a full team that I do not know, but I might have to at this rate.
Absolutely goated raid. The atmosphere, the music, and the lore-It’s all immaculate.
Great video, thank you for showing some much needed love to gos
I’m so excited for the garden weapons to be reprised next season!
I like this raid on paper but oh my god is it annoying. First off, I love the tether mechanic. I think it is super interesting and requires so much coordination, but it is extremely buggy. If you are even remotely close(which isn't a lot), it'll tether to you and you have to travel so far in order to break the line. Plus, the harpy is such a weird boss to fight because of how sporadic it behaves. We had the mind in the same spot on every attempt at our runs of it and it completely ruined the damage phase because it kept on playing the hokey pokey around a pillar and then when it started to move away, it would put up the vex wall and we couldn't do anything about it. Then the final boss, you cannot use any explosive damage or use any grenades whatsoever, because then you'll pull your team mates too early and mess up the encounter. Then bridge building is a nightmare because of the previous statement mentioned. It's the worst here because of how panicked everyone gets with the floors and the area is so small to work with. Plus, if you try to help build, you get trash talked because you didn't build right, but if you don't help, you get trash talked because you didn't help. It's a never ending cycle with the raid. It looks beautiful and I LOVE the weapons but tbh, it's just not good because of those reasons. I love that everyone has to do something but the problem arises when the mechanics or the AI do not want to cooperate. A div run is super fun though and requires people to cooperate with each other. On paper, it is super cool but when it is in action, it just doesn't work out. Love the video, keep grinding
I think that this raid, more than any other, would benefit from a loot refresh (which is all but guaranteed going into this next season). A lot of destiny players are very loot-minded and don't do things that won't give good loot. I think having the incentive for old and new players to play garden for some sweet sweet craftable weapons would give the raid a good diversity of players and maybe show more people that the raid isn't as bad as they think it is. :)
One of my favourite themes is the biblical parallels (immediately obvious by the names of the soundtrack like temptation and eden)
Great video. Im a new player, and I don't have a raid group. Of the raids in the game, Garden is the one im least interested in, primarily because of the loot situation. Last Wish, Vow of the Disciple, and Root of Nightmares all have great loot which i would be excited to get my hands on, and without some extra incentive, garden's compelling aesthetic is not enough motivation for me. Even last wish, a raid which seems much more boring to me, at least has Apex Predator, a Rocket which is borderline required for the current meta
I wanna pretend LFG can help you with that but last I checked the Garden scene is not very active
@@inoob26yea the only groups you find are clear farmers who kick for stupid shit
Honestly GoS is a really good raid imo. The one good part of shadowkeep. Tbh most of the complaints people make boil down to “I’m bad and got mad at it because it requires slight precision and my brain doesn’t feel like it”
one of the reason why people hate this raid is the bugs you encounter at the boss when it first came out and wasn't fixed for a while
HARD disagree, the hype for the storyline was immense, and it let down pretty much everyone (just like the entirety of the expansion though), the mechanic, while original and crazy, was a pain in the ass bc of bugs, the second boss was super lame, a tone down Atheon with less cool everything
Loot was not good as well, so why underrated ?
Sanctified mind song gives me nightmares after day 1 and a few 3+ hr sherpa runs.
The raid is gorgeous and yes the music is great but I think my life expectancy drops everytime I hear that final boss song.
Bungie had better make the origin trait freaking phenomenal if they want people back in there. That being said I still run the Provenance/accrued redemption + zealots as my EDC. The weapons look phenomenal.
My first run, it was me and five friends, only one of which had ever set foot in the raid before. We went for Div. It took 9 hours. Not sure it was worth it.
I love the first 3 encounters. But the boss, if there’s even one person for who it’s their first time there, you’re going to be there for 2 hours.
Which is why my rule now is I won’t sherpa for Div unless everyone has a clear already; we’ll get you Div on your second run. (But ~no one wants that.)
Why people do not like this raid: They can't stand still.
This raid has the most amazing music in destiny and also this raid is amazing
I have a single completion of Garden of Salvation. One week post raid launch, it was my Div run.
I like Garden, it’s music, it atmosphere, even its weapons.
But I cannot stand Sanctified Mind.
In the years since release, I have help a few with Div puzzles, but I have not completed a Sanctified Mind since my first run.
I used to bail after an hour of wipes, but soon that turned to bailing upon reaching the boss. I just do not think it is fun, at all. Cut just one mechanic from that fight (imo: the platform destruction) to reduce the gameplay noise and I’d be much happier.
I was jumping through lfg the other day farming commendations and saw a 5/6 for GoS final boss. So I jumped I'm and had an absolute blast. Forgot how good this raid was, just needs better loot.
It was my first raid i ever did with divinity puzzle and to this day it is my faovurite raid and i have done every raid at least once
i wish this raid was more loved because I have a soft spot for the vex and the black garden in particular
Your voice is very soothing/peaceful : )
I personally say this raid is hard next to last wish and Vow for an avg player. This raid requires everyone to know what their doing. You can go "ad clear" but you are constantly moving, shifting and rotating in this raid. Your never really staying in one place. GOS in my opinion is a raid that is challenging and doesnt use symbols that you must remember. I place this raid on the difficulty level of Expert next to Last wish and Vow. I do think that if this raid got its loot refreshed would rise in popularity again. It is in my opinion a fun raid but can last 2+ hours if everyone doesn't know what to do its heavily mechanic and its boss dps are brutal.
Having to connect the tether is what kills the raid for me. Having to stand still for like 5 seconds and sometimes longer (doesn't seem like a lot, but it is in a always active run and gun game) and not do anything else incase you need to shimmy like 2 cm forward or back is just unfun to me.
yea ive never understood why people dislike this raid cool mechanic beautiful design only bad thing is loot honestly
Last wish got lot of slack until it came back with reworked craft able weapons and its a pretty straight forward raid but the more I play it the more I like it. I started grinding last wish about 7 or 8 weeks ago and almost have every weapon Craftable... I think when garden salvation gets red borders people will enjoy it again and I think raids end up growing on you the more you do it
Great video. Just found your channel. Keep it up
A fellow enjoyer of Garden, hats off
I hope next season this raid gets the same treatment as last wish did.
all the music from this raid goes hard
Honestly you can trio this raid pretty easily. And I bet this gets the last wish/dsc treatment with craftable weapons next season.
did you read my mind? I don’t think you said a single thing I disagreed with and I adore garden (and am the black sheep of my friend group for thinking it’s fun
Garden is certainly beautiful and interesting mechanics-wise, but the loot is meh, mechanics are a nightmare if it's not done perfectly, and I still have no idea how the final fight works. If these problems are fixed, then I will potentially go back into the raid.
Also half of the Consecrated mind fight is literally just Gambit. This wouldn't be such a big deal if so many in-game mechanics weren't just the motes mechanic from Gambit.
Thank you for making this video. Just thank you.
6 man garden absolutely sucks but 3 man gos and 2 harpy and sanc are a blast. Most people hate garden since they do it 6 man but if you do 3 man garden then it's really fun.
As the people in these comments seem to like Garden as much as i do, why don't we all make a server with only people who likes garden. Then there will always be people to find when doing it
The Tether mechanics are predictable. Motes falling through the ground is the only busted part of the mechanics.
The Sacred Provenance, for over a year was the only Aggressive Frame (4 Burst) Pulse that wasn’t sunset in the game. Not only that but it also rolled Kill Clip and Rapid Hit. It already 2 burst in PvP, but you get KC and you’re destroying warlocks in rifts without issue. Now it’s even more killer with Headseeker rolls. Still a valid weapon in todays PVP sandbox and solid PVE. Also one of the best Void Autorifles.
And Zealot’s Reward Rapid frame fusion rolls Underpressure and Back Up Plan also deadly in PVP.
The Armour set was the first Armour I Transmogged too. This was such a legendary raid that simply isn’t simple but highly predictable and requires skill/dexterity and knowledge. There’s a reason 1 person can practically Sherpa an entire team.
Absolutely underrated raid. Great video.
I have never done garden I've always wanted to do it but I can never find a team to do it with
Have never done this raid. What is best way to find a Sherpa and team that doesn’t mind someone that does not know what to do….of course I want the divinity
It’s complex sure, but I’d consider kingsfall pretty close just in how hard it is to survive the mechanics. At least GOS is also entertaining to be in and look at.
I see babysitting as more of a pain than a fun gameplay experience. Jumping puzzles on top of constant attrition, and sometimes slow gambit teams are not fun to deal with.
The theme of the raid is nice but I hate the flow of combat. Encounter 1 is fine encounter 2 is a snore encounter 3 is mid and honestly the final boss encounter blows. Div quest makes me hate myself. The loot isn't good enough for the time investment (still not craftable prob will be better soon). The extra chest only gives armor. Lastly I hate you need to have the full armor set for a damage buff that's almost required to do good damage to final boss
Not sure why but ever since Beyond Light the audio cue for tethering was gone and hasnt been back since
Really a majority of the hate comes from the terrible loot pool. Even when it first came out all the weapons were outclassed by things we already had with the exception of the Bow.
On the one hand, id love to craft VoG weapons, but on the other Garden needs a better reason to actually do the raid. other than div. Its not bad but even i can tell everything else is kinda better and i started with beyond light
Just need a team of 5 to carry me through it. Never done a raid ever!!
FANTASTIC VIDEO! EARNED A SUB
Interesting video, I like the raid myself and sherpaing it, but the part about music was a bit too fanatic'y I'd say. Otherwise all good ngl.
If the tether mechanic wasn't buggy and if the bonus chests dropped weapons... also if the weapons were good... But yes people got burnt out on it REALLY fast. You also have to realize when DSC finally launched we only had Last Wish, GoS, and DSC because of sunsetting. So there is a lot more going on there than this video explains. Also no RNG raid exotic REALLY sucks. Bungie I know people complain about RNG but at the same time we secretly love it and having a reason to replay something. Also its gambit... but a raid....
BUT dont get me wrong it is one of the prettiest raids. And will be a lot better once its weapons are reworked. Ancient gospel will be meta, the shotgun will be meta, and the fusion will probably be meta.
But my favorite raid is also a weird choice being DSC. I just love everything about the raid except the sparrow part, i mean its better than Vow's opening but still annoying. But back when DSC came out we had glitches to get around the frostbite mechanic which made that raid better. Second favorite is Vow. Last Wish is overrated.
Garden of Salvation is a good raid. People are just bad at it
also imo the handcannon & pulse are decent in pvp
The shotgun is also a personal favourite
Also I see that LMG with Ancient Defender on it
I love the GoS flawless shader
It's always been glitchy when we try it. We done it but it ruined the experience.
"Players will have learned very well how to tether in the previous encounters so it becomes seemless in the boss fight." Ummm.... yeahhhh totally.....
its such a meachanic heavy raid with little good loot...I hope they rework the weapons for it next season like they did with last wish