I personally believed that the reason the witness took so long to enact the final shape because the traveler was resisting as long as it could so we could stop it. In the opening cinematic of the final shape we see it finalized, but reverted after the traveler sends out a pulse of light followed by the witness declaring the traveler is still resisting. In my eyes that tells me that the struggle between the witness and the traveler is what caused the delay for as long as it did
that's a good perspective I had not considered. makes a bit more sense. still feels a little convenient but I guess it's hard to put a timeline on an elemental battle of godlike beings lol
@eforme it's also possible that every time we do the overthrow event during the campaign, that pulse of light every time we ascend a tier actively stops the witness.
playing thru the campaign i kept seeing connections and themes similar to the divine comedy; each of the 8 subregions on the map is a circle, culminating in the raid where we see the witness from the waist up, invoking satan trapped within the ice. and our ghosts are our virgil, our light in the dark, guiding us thru hell and back
@@eforme omg i cant recommend it enough. if you are struggling with the language used i'd suggest allen mandelbaum's translation into modern english, it helped me a LOT
"Great art" is a perfect summary - I know I felt that so much thought and craft went into all of the experiences they designed and in particular the Music team took some of the most emotional scenes to that next level - I get hyped everytime we pick up the traveler sword for some statue slaying!
The most interesting thing about this expansion to me is that while I was able to appreciate everything that had happened in the moments they were happening, with my friends I played the campaign with reacting along with me, I found the final cutscene to be the most key moment for me realizing just how incredible everything that had just happened was. I can literally pin down the second it happened in the cutscene. I was smiling and happy that the fireteam had peace, my guardian was interacting with the people of the last city, and truly sitting and having meaningful time with the Vanguard. Crow was not stressed for once, he’s telling the others to relax (love that). And then they started playing the hope. And I actually just broke down in tears. Still had a grin on my face but…10 years. I was 11 years old when I started this journey. I’m 21 in a month. It’s hard not to feel connected to this story, this game, this community, through all its ups and downs. And seeing the statue of Cayde (hammering home what his sacrifice did for us), the last city, the guardian, all of the vanguard, all set to a theme I’ve heard bits of countless times, in orbit, while listening to Destiny music, in the background of videos, fully playing in a cutscene? The full (well minus Paul McCartney) music of the spheres version? Everything clicked into place. I thought about every single moment leading up to this, and how all of these characters lived up to all of their potential. To see the players potential realized, the floodgates opened, the hardest raid beaten. And then there’s something I’ve grown to care about the older and more aware I got. Something that I’ve been able to see the seeds of even in Destiny 1. How the developers were able to live up to and exceed expectations, to realize their potential, to put out something that they are truly proud of, to feel the passion that went into it, from people still there or otherwise. To see so many characters from lore finally realized in game, to see a fully new faction (for the first time ever!) be incredibly fun and unique gameplay wise, to see a story that doesn’t just hinge on pre established lore to be really good, but be incredible on it’s own merit. To see environmental design unlike any I’ve ever seen fill me with wonder and excitement and shock, that I felt playing the first game as a kid. To see the forces at play in all parts of the story come together, to see incredible performances from the entire cast, to see exotic missions and quests and story missions and mechanics all be implemented so well into every aspect of the game, I still feel like I’m forgetting something even with all that listed. This expansion is stellar. It has emboldened me with so much hope, not just for Destiny, but for so many other parts of my life. That has NEVER happened in any piece of media other than Ghost in the Shell, which I have an EXTREMELY personal connection to. It feels somehow like they managed to cap off 10 years of my life with this expansion, and all I did was play it.
23:05 this can also not just refer to the Gardener but also to the Winnower (if it is to be believed). Since the Winnower's idea of TFS is like the Sword Logic of the Hive & that things will naturally go towards TFS, the Witness pokes fun at this in the campaign, calling it a "childish game", there's dialogue in Preservation of Rhulk where he speaks of himself & the Witness trying to steer the Hive away from it. While the TFS of the Witness is eternal calcification of perfection, a forced ending/pause which goes against what the Winnower believes. The raid title from the seal is also "Iconoclast"
My personal experience with the final mission is that it was incredibly laggy for me and I found I tended to not be able to do a whole lot as my team basically did everything for me before I could react. Still really fun and considering a second run through
Humerous sidenote, even Spider sent allies during Excision, SCUR-V and one of his Vandals were there too. Imagine if Al Capone sent two goons to a coalition against God. Had to be that guys worst day
Kind of a bittersweet feeling watching this after the 2nd round of layoffs and the news that The Final Shape sold poorly. On one hand we got the best possible send off to a 10 year story with lots of quality content and loose ends closed… on the other hand we’re now dealing with this awkward post TFS phase where the reception to Project Frontiers’ plans and Episodes have been met with indifference where the priority is a likely highly monetised mobile game for an audience that likely won’t ever get to understand the enjoyment or narrative the main games give by a company famous for such predatory business practices to the point they make even Bungie look good, hundreds of employees lost their job in the most chaotic way possible, and Marathon which seems to be more interested in chasing trends (Extraction Hero Shooter) than being what people liked about the original trilogy. Plus the reveals of just how bad and short sighted the upper management of the company is… but I will still hold a nostalgic feeling for this game, the memories and the friends it has created for me. Hopefully the talent for this game will continue to pour as much passion as they do in future projects in spite of it all at both Bungie and the ones now at different studios or working on indie projects.
For me, the time the Witness took is not only the struggle between them and the Traveler, but also that our Vanguard tried to get a safer and more reliable way to go through the portal than how we did. So when we realized we didn't have much time left, as the struggle bled out of the Traveler, we enacted the Operation Ahamkara, instead of delaying it further. For those reasons I feel like it was well written around, so that it would not seem as unnatural. On Zavala I agree that it seems so out of Place, but he got tipped over his breaking point, he always had that hollow facade (alot of lore mentions it, especially when Savathun hides in Shaxx's Ahamkara Skull) and now the mask is broken and cannot be repaired One more thing I wonder about is on the side of Politics. Who will be the new Titan Vanguard since Zavala cannot use his abilities anymore? Saint-14 again? Also I don't mean like Who will be the next leader, since Zavala is still alive and he is still doing a good job By the by, since Beyond Light there are only 2 Guardian VAs. A male and a female, with Exo just getting a sound filter on. I haven't heard the female version of the sacrificy cutscene, but the male is so gut wrenching at it always seems like our guardian never wants to say anything, but here he shows so much emotion. His pleas are so genuine And how do we know Cayde got back into unity within the Traveler? As far as we know he gave his own light, which would grand him access to the afterlife, to save our Ghost, that nod to his own Ghost Sundance could have been a final goodbye. While neither is confirmed, this one is so much more sad
Thanks for the very well thought review. You pointed out so many details I missed while in grind mode! I feel like I need 2 play the campaign again with everything I learned from this. GG bungie u cooked!
My favorite thing about the Witness is he has no interest in the flower game at all. He uses light and darkness as tools to bring about his ideal final shape. The Precursors saw the light in all of its bounty devoid of meaning, and the Witness saw purpose in removing the suffering caused by the sword logic.
I personally think Bungie been having good expansions since Beyond Light, sure Lightfall was a bit lack luster but compared to Shadowkeep and the seasons that followed it was miles ahead
just played thru witch queen, beyond light and final shape beyond light campaign still had bits of campaign stalling i.e. go kill falling in the ruin area witch queen story to me felt like the first time the campaign could stand up on its own and be recommended to no d2 ppl final shape is peak tho
In the campaign, the witness usually refers to themselves with plural pronouns (we/us etc.) while the vanguard tends to use singular it/its. I default to plural pronouns (they/them/themselves) because that acknowledges the Witness’ multiplicity. It is generally unclear to me based on the text which pronouns the witness prefers because they don’t exactly sit in a circle and share names and pronouns. Bungie and other characters have used a variety of different pronouns for the witness including it/its and they/them so it is generally unclear to me what is most correct.
@@eformeiirc, a Bungie writer on twitter confirmed the Witness's pronouns are It/It's, this was back around Lightfalls release. Although, the Witness using the singular male voice at the war table room in the Iconoclast mission when it was angered, to then keep using that voice when it was wounded all the way to its death, does make me curious if the Witness has a "Conductor" within it, or if it's own individual, despite being made up of souls/minds of its people. Idk what it could be, but it is interesting that it kept using that voice. It has also referred to itself as singular a couple of times
@@eformeIt also seems to break from referring to itself as “We” to “I” during it’s last words suggesting that the consensus in it’s mind is completely uniform in their lack of understanding of why we rebelled against it and it’s vision or how we even pulled it off. The use of “It” could be more in reference to its all-powerful apathetic eldritch monster-like nature rather than any specifics of what it prefers. Though typically I find myself referring to it as they/them as they seem to fit the compound being thing it has, at least in general conversation without realising.
It's literally the highest rated game of the year so far, and has a score that would put it in the top 5 of almost every year. As the other people in your replies pointed out, it is definitely a masterpiece. If you don't like it for some reason, then I feel sorry for you and it sucks that you didn't enjoy it, but even people who have been the biggest critics of Bungie/Destiny over the years have spoken about this release completely changing their opinion
I personally believed that the reason the witness took so long to enact the final shape because the traveler was resisting as long as it could so we could stop it. In the opening cinematic of the final shape we see it finalized, but reverted after the traveler sends out a pulse of light followed by the witness declaring the traveler is still resisting. In my eyes that tells me that the struggle between the witness and the traveler is what caused the delay for as long as it did
that's a good perspective I had not considered. makes a bit more sense. still feels a little convenient but I guess it's hard to put a timeline on an elemental battle of godlike beings lol
@eforme it's also possible that every time we do the overthrow event during the campaign, that pulse of light every time we ascend a tier actively stops the witness.
playing thru the campaign i kept seeing connections and themes similar to the divine comedy; each of the 8 subregions on the map is a circle, culminating in the raid where we see the witness from the waist up, invoking satan trapped within the ice. and our ghosts are our virgil, our light in the dark, guiding us thru hell and back
We are on the same wavelength! I am thinking about reading the divine comedy for my witness analysis research
@@eforme omg i cant recommend it enough. if you are struggling with the language used i'd suggest allen mandelbaum's translation into modern english, it helped me a LOT
"The Final Shape brought Hope for the Future-"
I see you
You got me lol
"Great art" is a perfect summary - I know I felt that so much thought and craft went into all of the experiences they designed and in particular the Music team took some of the most emotional scenes to that next level - I get hyped everytime we pick up the traveler sword for some statue slaying!
The witness took so long because the traveler was fighting back. You see that in the opening cutscene.
love seeing u try to close the unclosable hints, my favourite feature of the campaign honestly
The most interesting thing about this expansion to me is that while I was able to appreciate everything that had happened in the moments they were happening, with my friends I played the campaign with reacting along with me, I found the final cutscene to be the most key moment for me realizing just how incredible everything that had just happened was. I can literally pin down the second it happened in the cutscene. I was smiling and happy that the fireteam had peace, my guardian was interacting with the people of the last city, and truly sitting and having meaningful time with the Vanguard. Crow was not stressed for once, he’s telling the others to relax (love that). And then they started playing the hope. And I actually just broke down in tears. Still had a grin on my face but…10 years. I was 11 years old when I started this journey. I’m 21 in a month. It’s hard not to feel connected to this story, this game, this community, through all its ups and downs. And seeing the statue of Cayde (hammering home what his sacrifice did for us), the last city, the guardian, all of the vanguard, all set to a theme I’ve heard bits of countless times, in orbit, while listening to Destiny music, in the background of videos, fully playing in a cutscene? The full (well minus Paul McCartney) music of the spheres version? Everything clicked into place. I thought about every single moment leading up to this, and how all of these characters lived up to all of their potential. To see the players potential realized, the floodgates opened, the hardest raid beaten. And then there’s something I’ve grown to care about the older and more aware I got. Something that I’ve been able to see the seeds of even in Destiny 1. How the developers were able to live up to and exceed expectations, to realize their potential, to put out something that they are truly proud of, to feel the passion that went into it, from people still there or otherwise. To see so many characters from lore finally realized in game, to see a fully new faction (for the first time ever!) be incredibly fun and unique gameplay wise, to see a story that doesn’t just hinge on pre established lore to be really good, but be incredible on it’s own merit. To see environmental design unlike any I’ve ever seen fill me with wonder and excitement and shock, that I felt playing the first game as a kid. To see the forces at play in all parts of the story come together, to see incredible performances from the entire cast, to see exotic missions and quests and story missions and mechanics all be implemented so well into every aspect of the game, I still feel like I’m forgetting something even with all that listed. This expansion is stellar. It has emboldened me with so much hope, not just for Destiny, but for so many other parts of my life. That has NEVER happened in any piece of media other than Ghost in the Shell, which I have an EXTREMELY personal connection to. It feels somehow like they managed to cap off 10 years of my life with this expansion, and all I did was play it.
23:05 this can also not just refer to the Gardener but also to the Winnower (if it is to be believed). Since the Winnower's idea of TFS is like the Sword Logic of the Hive & that things will naturally go towards TFS, the Witness pokes fun at this in the campaign, calling it a "childish game", there's dialogue in Preservation of Rhulk where he speaks of himself & the Witness trying to steer the Hive away from it. While the TFS of the Witness is eternal calcification of perfection, a forced ending/pause which goes against what the Winnower believes. The raid title from the seal is also "Iconoclast"
I think we are the Iconoclasts. this word has roots in destroying statues/paintings in a religious context and thats what we do in the mission
My personal head cannon I love entertaining is that the Witness is in many ways the successor to the idea of Halos Gravemind
Your conclusion message was perfect
The one thing that Final Shape makes me say above all else, is that it was all worth it.
My personal experience with the final mission is that it was incredibly laggy for me and I found I tended to not be able to do a whole lot as my team basically did everything for me before I could react. Still really fun and considering a second run through
That was one of the best reviews on the final shape good job thank you
Humerous sidenote, even Spider sent allies during Excision, SCUR-V and one of his Vandals were there too. Imagine if Al Capone sent two goons to a coalition against God. Had to be that guys worst day
Great video, I would like to note that the 8th mission is evil lago land.
Kind of a bittersweet feeling watching this after the 2nd round of layoffs and the news that The Final Shape sold poorly. On one hand we got the best possible send off to a 10 year story with lots of quality content and loose ends closed… on the other hand we’re now dealing with this awkward post TFS phase where the reception to Project Frontiers’ plans and Episodes have been met with indifference where the priority is a likely highly monetised mobile game for an audience that likely won’t ever get to understand the enjoyment or narrative the main games give by a company famous for such predatory business practices to the point they make even Bungie look good, hundreds of employees lost their job in the most chaotic way possible, and Marathon which seems to be more interested in chasing trends (Extraction Hero Shooter) than being what people liked about the original trilogy. Plus the reveals of just how bad and short sighted the upper management of the company is… but I will still hold a nostalgic feeling for this game, the memories and the friends it has created for me.
Hopefully the talent for this game will continue to pour as much passion as they do in future projects in spite of it all at both Bungie and the ones now at different studios or working on indie projects.
Yay been looking forward to see your take on it
For me, the time the Witness took is not only the struggle between them and the Traveler, but also that our Vanguard tried to get a safer and more reliable way to go through the portal than how we did. So when we realized we didn't have much time left, as the struggle bled out of the Traveler, we enacted the Operation Ahamkara, instead of delaying it further. For those reasons I feel like it was well written around, so that it would not seem as unnatural.
On Zavala I agree that it seems so out of Place, but he got tipped over his breaking point, he always had that hollow facade (alot of lore mentions it, especially when Savathun hides in Shaxx's Ahamkara Skull) and now the mask is broken and cannot be repaired
One more thing I wonder about is on the side of Politics. Who will be the new Titan Vanguard since Zavala cannot use his abilities anymore? Saint-14 again? Also I don't mean like Who will be the next leader, since Zavala is still alive and he is still doing a good job
By the by, since Beyond Light there are only 2 Guardian VAs. A male and a female, with Exo just getting a sound filter on. I haven't heard the female version of the sacrificy cutscene, but the male is so gut wrenching at it always seems like our guardian never wants to say anything, but here he shows so much emotion. His pleas are so genuine
And how do we know Cayde got back into unity within the Traveler? As far as we know he gave his own light, which would grand him access to the afterlife, to save our Ghost, that nod to his own Ghost Sundance could have been a final goodbye. While neither is confirmed, this one is so much more sad
Your analysis, as always, is amazing. Absolutely loved this campaign
Thanks for the very well thought review. You pointed out so many details I missed while in grind mode! I feel like I need 2 play the campaign again with everything I learned from this. GG bungie u cooked!
NEW EFORME VIDEO THIS IS THE GREATEST OCCAISION SINCE [erased from history in the vault of glass]
The husk are made from the hive, three eyes, blades, and are "pileted" by a smaller creature like the worms
I also really enjoyed the body horror ish aspects of the campaign, they were really interesting
Hi house bread member
@@shying69 hello!
My favorite thing about the Witness is he has no interest in the flower game at all. He uses light and darkness as tools to bring about his ideal final shape. The Precursors saw the light in all of its bounty devoid of meaning, and the Witness saw purpose in removing the suffering caused by the sword logic.
Plus, the Witness would essentially be freezing/pausing the flower game eternally if it won
RUclips algorthm has to be bugged, it's actually giving me good content.
I personally think Bungie been having good expansions since Beyond Light, sure Lightfall was a bit lack luster but compared to Shadowkeep and the seasons that followed it was miles ahead
just played thru witch queen, beyond light and final shape
beyond light campaign still had bits of campaign stalling i.e. go kill falling in the ruin area
witch queen story to me felt like the first time the campaign could stand up on its own and be recommended to no d2 ppl
final shape is peak tho
I hate that im not good enough to beat the legendary campaign.
Final shape isnt the vest campaign in Destiny 2.
Its the best campaign Bungie has ever made, period.
Wonderful video! Always awesome seeing other trans people playing this game ♥️
The Witness is an it.
Not they, not he, it.
Idk why people struggle with this so much.
In the campaign, the witness usually refers to themselves with plural pronouns (we/us etc.) while the vanguard tends to use singular it/its. I default to plural pronouns (they/them/themselves) because that acknowledges the Witness’ multiplicity. It is generally unclear to me based on the text which pronouns the witness prefers because they don’t exactly sit in a circle and share names and pronouns. Bungie and other characters have used a variety of different pronouns for the witness including it/its and they/them so it is generally unclear to me what is most correct.
@@eformeiirc, a Bungie writer on twitter confirmed the Witness's pronouns are It/It's, this was back around Lightfalls release. Although, the Witness using the singular male voice at the war table room in the Iconoclast mission when it was angered, to then keep using that voice when it was wounded all the way to its death, does make me curious if the Witness has a "Conductor" within it, or if it's own individual, despite being made up of souls/minds of its people. Idk what it could be, but it is interesting that it kept using that voice. It has also referred to itself as singular a couple of times
@@eformeIt also seems to break from referring to itself as “We” to “I” during it’s last words suggesting that the consensus in it’s mind is completely uniform in their lack of understanding of why we rebelled against it and it’s vision or how we even pulled it off. The use of “It” could be more in reference to its all-powerful apathetic eldritch monster-like nature rather than any specifics of what it prefers. Though typically I find myself referring to it as they/them as they seem to fit the compound being thing it has, at least in general conversation without realising.
Masterpiece? Come on
Yes
It's fucking amazing dude
It is.
It’s a masterpiece.
It's literally the highest rated game of the year so far, and has a score that would put it in the top 5 of almost every year.
As the other people in your replies pointed out, it is definitely a masterpiece. If you don't like it for some reason, then I feel sorry for you and it sucks that you didn't enjoy it, but even people who have been the biggest critics of Bungie/Destiny over the years have spoken about this release completely changing their opinion