CHRISTIAN REACTS TO SHINY HAPPY PEOPLE | Discussing the Duggars, IBLP, and the Dangers of Extremism
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- Опубликовано: 12 июн 2023
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Just jumping in to say I love your analogy of Bill Gothard being the hemorrhoid on the butt hole of Christianity! I cackled and had to pause!
I thought it was fitting so I’m glad you enjoyed that lol.
went to the comments immediately once I heard it. Glad this is the top comment. Made me giggle :)
🤣🤣💀💀👏👏👏
I haven't gotten there yet, but I can't wait. That is top tier! 😂
Jill repeating how the news of her trauma should never have been public really stood out to me, too. I’ve had similar trauma in my past. But I got to control who I told, how and when. If my trauma was publicly exposed without my knowledge or consent, and then been forced to relive it and have the public define me by it…that is utter torture and unimaginable. It goes beyond being retraumatized.
As a newly married couple with a baby, my parents converted to Christianity (they called it evangelical). They proceeded to have 8 children, having kids even when neither one of them had a job, until finally they couldn’t successfully have any more kids. I didn’t know at the time this was part of a “quiver-full movement”. I remember them saying all of us kids voting conservative/republican would outnumber our relatives who were voting any other way… I don’t ever remember talking about what I wanted to be when I grew up, just that being a mother was the most important job a woman could have (and being a working mom would be a terrible sin). My siblings and I were all homeschooled to prevent us from learning things like evaluation or being around “worldly” peers (aka non Christians).
My family wasn’t part of the IBLP in any way, but the same rules and beliefs were very much instilled in my family. Many of our friends from homeschool co-op were in the IBLP, only I had no idea that’s what it was called at the time. I’m so glad this documentary Shiny Happy People is giving a voice to the survivors. It needs to be talked about, whether it’s the IBLP or other harmful religious groups. It wasn’t (and still isn’t) ok.
Wow, thank you so much for sharing some of your experience! It seems like you haven’t followed that same fundamentalist lifestyle as an adult. Was there a particular thing that caused you to distance yourself from it or was it more gradual?
Thanks for sharing. So glad you were able to get out!
Wow. Looking at your kids as not much more than future Republican voters is so messed up. I'm sorry.
I really appreciate your point of view as a religious person, as I tend to watch more atheists-leaning channels. I am an atheist and I am happy to stand besides religious people and condemn the horrible actions of horrible monsters, i don’t care which God they pray, these people are monsters that use religion as a cover for their actions and they should be condemned by everyone
I personally wish they had gone more into the Joshua generation stuff. As much as the Duggar stuff fascinates me (in a train wreck kinda way) - the Joshua generation stuff has more impact on every day life and explains sooooo much about the state of politics and government in the US right now. My extended family is one step away from IBLP style of fundamentalism and is most definitely on what I would consider the extreme side of religion. The documentary was triggering to me in the way it was for many victims of religion based abuse, but the extremism working its way into US government and politics is much more important I think.
What is it they're doing that makes some extreme? Because they're against abortion?
You are SUCH a real Christian. Your channel is my favourite voice in the progressive Christian space. Your commentary is so nuanced, compassionate, and deliberate. Thank you ❤
I don’t understand why there hasn’t been a class action lawsuit against IBLP and ATI. When I think of the abuse, cover-ups, sexual exploitation and oppression that goes on, I don’t understand why they haven’t been sued into oblivion. And why isn’t Gothard in jail?
There was an attempt at one from a bunch of people who had been abused, but Gothard has a lot of money and managed to wriggle out of it. He then attempted to counter sue, thankfully he lost. They talk about it in SHP, very worth watching!
@@DimaRakesah Yes. That’s right. As I recall, a bunch of women who were victims of Gothard as girls attempted to sue Gothard but he threatened to counter sue. Since Gothard had all the money and an army of lawyers, they didn’t stand a chance so they were bullied by Gothard to drop the lawsuit. Those poor women were victims of that sick perv and deserved every red cent of that greedy, narcissist’s money. And the Gothard had the nerve to say the suit was dropped because he was “innocent.” Are you serious??? They were bullied into dropping the suit.
On your aside about how people say you're not a real Christian for crititicizing stuff like this: I think if the Bible spends the most time condemning anything, it's the evil within. False prophets, false teachers, the pharasees, hypocrisy, etc., are the things that get the most negative attention and condemnation in the Bible. As Christians, we should be taking the log out of our own eye before we criticize the secular world of anything, as Jesus would have it!
Yes!! B is one of the few Christian RUclipsrs I have seen calling this stuff out; most of the commentary I see about it is from people who are non-religious. So I was so happy when I found this channel a few months ago. 😊
It's nice to see your reaction. There have been a number of statements saying "Christians hate this documentary," or "It's anti christian", No. It's anti extremism.
It all made sense when they showed Madison Cawthorn was apart of the Joshua Movement. I find it disgusting that Morgan and Paul shifted the blame onto the victims and made it seem like because the documentary was made by "non-believers", that everything that was said was invalid.
I never heard of Paul and Morgan until Shiny Happy People. This Paul and Morgan seem to be one of those angry, finger pointing, judging self-proclaimed “Christians.” They seem to have no empathy or concern for anyone they don’t approve of…..very un-Christian.
right? i was like “oh, yes. of course he is part of the joshua generation.”
I never heard of Is paul and morgan until this documentary came out. I have to say what you are saying is not true. Never once did they discredit the victims. They pointed out what the documentary was doing. They weren't wrong there. The documentary attack christianity is a whole and acted as if all of us are part of this. It even Is mocked home schooling and young earth people. I never heard of this bill guy and I grew up in the church. So to Lump us all together is completely ridiculous.
Maybe this sounds weird but I really appreciate you for being a rational, compassionate and progressive Christian! I grew up atheist with progressive Dutch parents who had to break away from a religious environment. So although I try to be openminded, my views on religion are pretty biased. It's so nice to see a way of being Christian that I can not only respect but actually really understand and appreciate:).
Exactly. ❤️
Jen of Fundie Fridays put up her SHP recap video and put all the socials links for people in the doc in the description!
That’s so cool! I put a link to an article in my description that shows what each ex-iblp member is up to these days for anyone who wants to check that out but I love that Jen listed each of their socials!
Your Morgan impression is spot on! They were interviewed for like 4 hours, so I get that they were disappointed in their tiny bit in the series, but I felt like they must've watched a different series than I did. Yes, do a reaction to their reaction!! The way they talk about Jill vs. Jinger blew my mind. Go watch it ASAP! 😊
My win for the week is that my older brother and sister-in-law are expecting their first child. This is the first grandchild in the family, so we’re all excited.
That’s amazing! I am wishing them a safe and healthy pregnancy 💛
Good video!
I'm the oldest daughter from a Christian fundamentalist quiverfull family. It takes a lot of painful introspection and deconstruction to untangle this worldview when you've been raised in it. I have plenty of friends in the movement whose CSA has been minimized and covered over. I'm learning to use my voice to advocate for the oppressed. This is not easy as it means reworking all of the formative indoctrination in my brain that would have me silenced. Thank you for supporting survivors telling their stories.
I am so sorry for what your friends have experienced as well as the hurtful things I am sure you’ve been through as well. Keep learning to use your voice, it is important and it matters!!
I’m a survivor as well - didn’t escape until my late 50’s - the trauma never ends. My primary abuser was my mother - all in the name of Jesus and IFB - no words to describe what I escaped.
@JC C I'm sorry it's been a tough journey. I believe you and I understand the pain. Much love to you. ❤️🩹
I would LOVE to see your reaction on the response videos posted by Paul and Morgan and by girl defined, definitely some problematic points and comments made by them.
It’s very telling they took the docuseries so personally. They’re clearly seeing the similarities of their beliefs with aspects of the IBLP
Ditto! They are all very self-centered and apparently thought the docuseries was all about them....??!? Whiny babies. 😑
All these people should be thrown in jail for child abuse. What monsters.
I’d love to give these “parents” a “free taekwondo lesson” on behalf of those poor kids.
You are a real and great Christian! Anyone who says otherwise needs to just reevaluate themselves.
The "Joshua Generation" thing terrifies me.
Same here. I was HOOKED the whole time they talked about it on the doc. I hope they do a follow up series and cover that more.
I agree with you 100 on the kids thing. They expect everyone to give them handouts and in same breath call single working moms feminist jezabels who are feeding off the system. They are the most judgemental people yet expect the rest of the world to just support them while they women refuse to work and live on their husbands income that is screwed up
I loved your take on this docu-series. You have made a new subscriber out of me! :)
I do believe that Jen from Fundie Fridays in a recent video of hers has talked about how the producer talked about in a q&a that they did how they left out a lot of Paul and Morgan’s interview to actually help make them look better because apparently a lot of what they said was very problematic. I wish I remember what video she said that in, but it’s one of her ones where she was reacting to Shiny Happy People. I hope this helps in your research about their pov.
I was so upset to find out how manipulative RimJob really is with his children-- the adult married children-- it's disgusting and disturbing 😳.
The whole other contract in order to get that 10 bucks an hour is such bullshit.
I am so happy Jill has gotten away from all the toxicity and I'm glad she has such a great supportive husband in Derrick. I wish them the best!
That is a much much better name for that zit of a person. I cackled at it, so thank you 😊
Exactly. Technically JBD was breaking his own convoluted rules. According to their ridiculous beliefs, the women become the husband's responsibility once they are married. The transfer from the father's ownership of the daughter to the husband takes place. It doesn't look like the transfer took place in the duggars world. Jbd had complete control over them even after marriage. Disgusting.
I’m wondering if this whole docuseries was a set up for a sequel that focuses on the Joshua generation. Paul and Morgan did a response video and said they interviewed with them for 4 hours, so maybe they’ll be using that footage in a later release?
I have been waiting for this video 🎉
The fact that these people are so isolated that they don’t know that you’re supposed to call the police if you see someone hit a child is insane. Like… I can’t imagine not knowing that. I can’t remember a time when I didn’t know that. I can understand why a sheltered person might be confused about sexual abuse because they may not understand consent or what’s really going on, and they might be tricked into thinking they are “consenting” despite being underage. But hitting someone is such obvious violence, how could they be confused about that?
You're talking about a group of ppl for who are raised getting hit as six month old babies (and if you look even deeper into the Pearls, for instance, you'll also see that they advocate for hurting newborn babies if they do things like bite during breastfeeding as well), and it never ends. It's completely normalized, that's how.
I agree with you one hundred percent. That was one of my big problems with this documentary.
I am in no way Sauing Sexual assault didn't happen. Some of these girls stories don't add up. Considering it Contradicts this crazy teaching at they are taught.
What I see that happened Is this documentary found some victims and then painted a False narrative behind some of them. No one stopped them from going to the police. When a friend of mine got assaulted at work, we didn't get permission from her boss To go to the police we just went.
They call it discipline and it's part of their raise the child religion. So of course no one brings police in
Win for the week is I've been working out without triggering my chronic pain
So glad to hear that! 💛
Yeah. The Joshua generation sounds insane, and I didn’t know it had a name, but even though I was never in thr IBLP, I totally knew about and was definitely on board with the agenda.
Thankfully I moved away, gained perspective, deconstructed, and grew up into a much better, saner person. I hate to think who I could be if I hadn’t.
Thanks for covering this!
All my favorite ppl are speaking on this and i love it 🙌🙌🙌💜 here for it!
I always appreciate your commentary thank you for the video
Thank you 💛
You were referring to the Coogan Law, where guardians/parents of child actors have to set a certain percentage of their earnings into a trust for when they are adults. I’m not sure if there is an exception in this case because they are technically not acting or maybe the duggar kids would have to initiate a court proceeding for Jim non to be held accountable for not paying them.
Coogan's law is recognized in 10 states, Arkansas isn't one of th;em. Since it is "reality TV" it may not apply.
HERE FOR THIS! Was hoping you would react to it. I’ll probably end up editing this with more thoughts, but was so excited to see this pop up when I got home ❤️
So I’m a 18 year old woman and i have pedophiliac disorder and let me tell you it’s incredibly difficult to live with among the other paraphiliac disorders that I have. It’s been hard living with these desires and feelings and the constant paranoia of doing something that will land me in prison. I’ve tried to commit suicide many times over the 10 years I’ve had these feelings and I am aware that it is getting worse everyday. My psychiatrist and I are working together to help me not end up in prison or a hospital. I am disgusted by the way Josh Dugger parents handed his disorder and they failed him. They enabled his desires and didn’t stop him further committing crimes the first time they knew about it. I am unfortunately well aware that pedophilia runs in my family among many other mental disorders that I have accumulated. Life’s been a living hell for me. I have to constantly be around my triggers and I can’t escape it. I can’t have friends and relationships. Most psychiatrists and psychologists think people with my disorder will inevitably endanger others and commit crimes. It’s hard living with that fact. I’m sorry about my rant I just don’t have anyone to talk to about this.
Came to say I'm really proud of you for going to a therapist and trying to work with someone to help you. There isn't a lot of help or sympathy out there for people like you, and having the awareness and not wanting to hurt others makes you a compassionate person, despite your urges.
I'm so sorry. That sounds horrible. I don't know much about the disorder and how it works, though I'd imagine it has different iterations and different reasons for being present in a person's life. Do you also have a therapist trained in this disorder and things like EMDR and other physical exercises (so not jUst talk therapy)? I know psychiatrists can be essential but my understanding is that they aren't as equipped for helping people form healthy coping mechanisms and sift through their day to day troubles and past trauma. Not trying to say your psychiatrist is bad or isn't doing those things for you, just saying that's my understanding of one of the differences between a psychiatrist and a therapist and I'm wondering if maybe that might be helpful for you to know if you didn't know that already.
@@lucydiamond123 oh thank you so much for the nice words. Yes unfortunately there is not much sympathy for people like me and despite that I still try to be understanding towards people who don’t really understand how it effects us. I’m trying now to live as happy life as I can but even if I fail I can say at least I tried.
@@emmadasilva1794 thank you for replying! I have a therapist and we are working on it but I haven’t told her much about it because it’s so hard. My psychiatrist is looking into treatment options for me and when I came to her with my concerns she said I knew more then her about my condition and the treatment options. I want to see a specialist In Baltimore but unfortunately I do not have the money and even if I did there is still no guarantee that it would be of any help and I can’t afford for it not to be effective so I’m trying to just do it with my local doctor and therapist.
I cannot imagine the difficulty and weight of dealing with these struggles but I think it is great you are working with a psychiatrist and I want to encourage you to stay the course. I have no idea what words are helpful to you and I know I’m just a stranger on the internet but it sounds like you are working very hard to do the right things. I’m sorry that this life has been so difficult for you, please know that I am wishing you strength.
My win: I got a new job. Hopefully, I can deal well with it because it pays very well compared to what I am used to.
Congrats and good luck to you! 🎉🎉
@@AmandaPaige71 Thank you!!! I appreciate that!!!
Various denominations appeal to different personality types based upon felt needs. Jim Bob needs to be in charge and found a perceived societally acceptable avenue for that need. Michelle was very young and groomed by Jim Bob. She was new to conservative Christianity and Jim Bob "love bombed" her with his four hour conversation showing off his superior knowledge of Scripture, thereby overwhelming her impressionability.
I think you hit the nail on the head…different denominations appeal to different people based on what a person needs. Exactly!
I knew a girl who grew up quiverfull at my high school. I had no idea what that means at the time, but we were in the Catholic private school community so her parents’ fundie beliefs were something I’d seen before, albeit extreme.
She was the oldest female sibling, so of course she was pushed into being the parent for her little siblings. I felt bad for her because she couldn’t really hang out with us outside of school, but we found ways to have fun and do things during study halls and stuff. I knew her in our senior year (her parents let her go to a ‘real school’ in her senior year so she could get accepted into a good university and study politics) and she was soooo over all of it. She was great despite her upbringing, I haven’t heard from her in years but I hope she’s doing well.
So I'm an ex-cultist (LDS), and I really appreciate your critical breakdowns of the fundies. Since you're familiar with GD & P&M, I'd be interested in what you have to say about their unhinged reactions to Shiny Happy People.
I don't even think Girl Defined watched the doc. They just seemed to want to defend P&M, and try to distance themselves from IBLP ( even though Bethany says they've gone to conferences! Lol)
My win for the week: i got my planner all set up & hopefully I'll keep it up!
Yay! Planners are the best…even if you don’t stick to it super strictly they’re still fun lol
If you look at the episode of Derick and Jill trying wedding cake flavors, you can see Michelle smack Josie's hand when she reaches to grab some.
That is so sad 😔
I haven't watched it yet but am going to. You are the third content creator whose video I have watched on this topic. Each video had a completely different perspective. I am not religious, but was particularly interested in hearing your views on it.
can't remember which of the other youtubers said it, but apparently in an AMA, the director? creator? producer? someone, involved in the documentary said that they did P&M a favor by only putting in the clip that they did because apparently the other 4 hours (if I remember correctly) of footage from the rest of their interview with P&M had a lot WORSE and more incriminating/indicative things said that they chose not to release, so that's very intriguing and I would LOVE to know what else they said during that interview
My win for the week is getting everything I need for making my favorite dessert cheesecake! I'm going to make it tomorrow and I can't wait. As an ex-christian I love hearing from level headed Christians. This was such a refreshing talk on the docu series with legitimate criticisms(every media should be criticized). with P&M's response and Girl Defined response they really aren't helping the toxic Christian image that this doc highlighted. I hope they do decide to look inward and reflect on their personal beliefs and figure out if they actually believe those things or if they were told to believe them so they do. Hopefully they do that work and release content expressing how they are different from IBLP because from the outside looking in its pretty damn similar.
Exactly… I told you were in for it on instagram. Wild… five seconds of absolute strangeness
Would definitely watch more videos of you discussing SHP!
The name thing, yes! Also, a quick reference of who they are as it pertains to the show. Especially because it’s a series and not a movie.
Exactly, it would have been super helpful!
My win for the week (or my life really) is that my parents were apart of IBLP before I was born, and I'm so glad they left that cult before I was born!
Just started watching but already grateful to get a perspective from a “regular” Christian (not saying there’s a regular way to be Christian, but you’re not an extremist like P&M, etc). It is v refreshing to see a rational take from a Christian after all the backlash that is devoid of self reflection.
P&m are very extreme and brainwashed by their purity culture
Honestly, don’t even give credence to P&M’s reaction video. Morgan straight up makes fun of the survivors in the doc. It’s awful. None of their arguments add up or make sense. They are willingly dodging the point to further their persecution complex.
Also worthy of note, Bill Gothard never married and never had children 🙃
Sadly, every time it’s pointed out that Gothard never married (or had kids), his defenders always throw back, “neither did the Apostle Paul.” So we have to have a solid but concise argument to address that. That being said, Paul speaks of being called to singleness and wishes everyone could be so they didn’t have to be pulled in two directions. In that passage, Paul makes it clear that not everyone is meant to marry and have children. So that’s a start.
@@rivendells_shona unfortunately I am a non-Christian so I cannot help add to this argument! I appreciate the insight though as these nuances in Christianity are really important and interesting. I guess one thing I can say is that being “called to singleness” is one thing, being “called to singleness and spending your life telling others how to have families” is quiiiiiite another.
@@collagepodge understandable. Just thought I would offer the head’s up. The Bible (including all of Paul’s writings) are frequently misunderstood and abused by people of all walks due to lack of context, unfortunately.
A lot of Gothard’s teachings are a great example. And sadly, much of the problems in Christendom are a result of people not understanding both linguistic and historical (or narrative) contexts. It inevitably turns into interpretive brawls on social media. 😕
@@rivendells_shona i’ve noticed this! The more literal the interpretation, the uglier it gets. That’s why I follow B. I love that she cares about understanding the bible from a historical, contextual perspective, because you can’t just take an old book, throw it into today’s terms and call it good.
@@collagepodge absolutely!
i'm not the first person to bring this up, but one thing that really stood out to me was the story about how, when the word 'molest' was used to describe what Josh did as a teenager, Michelle supposedly said something like "don't you use that word!"
it's little comments like this that show how women in this culture can be just as complicit in upholding the patriarchal standards that enable abusers like Josh, even while being victims themselves. even denying the correct words be used in situations like this helps in the manipulation tactics that keep victims in line, so to speak. it's such a small thing, but it left such a gross taste in my mouth.
(thank you, btw, for showing that good Christians still exist. i'm not Christian myself, but i still plan on watching more of your content! ^^)
If you admit it happened, then you have to admit you, as the parent, let it happen. It becomes a reflection on you, not the predator, plus What Will The Neighbors Think!
Grew up Mormon and there were a lot of crossovers with how women as supposed to behave. Scary stuff. I left the church at 18 and do not consider myself religious. My siblings however have ended up in their own fundi semi-cult. I worry about them.
Looking back, I think Project 2025 is the Joshua Generation with a new name.
Leaving is hard. Just as a kid, there was huge backlash with even minor infractions, much less something that big. And no one outside your home believes you.
I think because there were so many that came forward, it could have been broken up differently.
It was soooo fragmented and left so many questions unanswered.
Mike Huckabee was with that group. I wonder if his daughter Sarah Sanders who is now the governor of Arkansas is in that group.
My win for the week was that I was a guest on a education podcast on Monday!! A definite bucket list item crossed of my list 😆😁
Shiny Happy People was a hard watch, but it was a really good documentary. It’s scary to see how many parallels that the IBLP has across mainstream evangelicalism. Anytime I see someone share the “umbrella of authority” on social media, I shutter and cringe.
100% we were taught cabbage patch dolls were evil. My siblings n I were separated and in foster care. We were ultimately adopted together. My little sister was 6 she was not potty trained, was s.a and was like a wild feral child. After attending our 1st seminar they were convinced the reason she was throwing temper tantrums was bc of our cabbage patch dolls. They were all thrown out. This is also when the spare the rod was introduced. Im 37 and to this day I can't stand to hear the sound of a slap. I literally feel like a child in a corner all over again. My will was too strong. I was 7 and could hold my hot tears inside until I got to my room n would burst into my pillow. My sister couldn't. I felt I was going insane listening to them hit her over n over n over again. Tell her to stop crying, then hitting her more. I finally had had enough and burst in the door yelling how can she stop if you don't stop. Please let me take her punishment. Our dad said she wouldn't learn if I took her spanking .. I, at 7 rebutted isn't that what Jesus did on the cross. Many times after that I would step in to take her punishment. The abuse we experienced was too much. We were already damaged from csa n neglect... Maybe counseling n true compassion would've gone a long way. I still have PTSD from my childhood. Bill gothard always gave me the creeps. The way he'd compliment us and run his hands in my hair. I'm so glad I'm out of that environment now. I still remember when the duggars were guest speakers and Jessa was my fav bc my name was close to hers. It's sickening to think abt all the thousands of children n women hurt in the organization. I'm glad ppl are finally speaking out. I'm so proud of the Duggar girls. Os in also so happy without a crystal ball was no where in this. I hate listening to her spout out in such a non compassionate way... She's victimized the girls as much as the secular media has... NE way ty for covering ❤
8:25 I agree that it would have been super helpful having the names of the interviewees more often.
Yes, more research on IBLP and commentary!!
Great video! It’s interesting to hear your take as a Christian - I have seen a lot of anti-religious takes so this was a little different!
Ummmm…. share that sauce recipe! 😂
I got it from this video! ruclips.net/video/uCQvpRnqYxM/видео.html
I swapped the stick of butter for vegan butter and I was worried it wouldn’t turn out great but it was delicious 😋
I agree with you about keeping nàmes up every timr. Ive noticed this before in documentaries, and it makes no sensr. Try watching with close captions, it can help keep information more clear
Cabbage Patch: I was allowed one before that rumor came out.
My mom had a sister who was a white witch, so this was a huge issue for her.
These are the same folks who put a list out to remove 65% of the books in a children's library section because they claim the books have sex and witchcraft. I'll give them the magic because of course it's kids books. 😅
Please, please do a reaction vid to Paul & Morgan’s reaction! I would love to hear your deconstruction of them again!
Theres no child labor laws for reality shows. Its very similar to social media, where family channels exploit the kids
Some states have them. Even for reality shows, so it depends where it is filmed. Based on the Coogan law, a trust account is required for kids until 18. That would be directly related to a TV show paying the family, then where they are. John and Kate plus 8 didn't get stung with this until the show visited new York, and it became a thing.
Episode by episode pls!
My win for the week is my toddler is finally sleeping through the night in her own room!
As someone who had the wolf in their home, yeah it wasn’t surprising.
My win for the week is that I went to the opticians and got my retinas checked. There's a great book called God's Harvard that goes into the Joshua Generation stuff.
My first thought after the restaurant comment was this is why most require you to buy at least one adult meal for each free kids meal lol
i read the title before seeing the thumbnail and at first i was like, wait, who's Christian? 😅
I'll check to see if you covered that materials, but if you haven't, please do?
There are those of us looking for resources who can show us these docs.
I'm so curious if you're willing to tell us what church you attend. Maybe you've said elsewhere?
Your Morgan impression made me think your editing was seamlessly playing a clip 😅
I also always feel like I'm saying IBLP wrong, I think for me it just sounds a bit clunky and would sound better with the "in" replaced with an "of".
This is my first time watching you, I'm not religious but I really appreciate getting another less extreme perspective from someone who thinks differently to me.
It was very interesting to listen to how Paul and Morgan framed the whole series, them saying it was demonizing Christianity, when it was actually just showing the dangers of fundamentalism and how people can use it to exert their own will; and they just assumed that most of the people who appeared were atheist crusaders or something, because the producers thought their stories were the most important thing, not whether they are still believers.
I'm a big fan of Fundie Fridays so of course it was really cool to see Jen's appearances, and I appreciate that you appreciate her 💜
I have so many more thoughts, but I don't want to make this comment any longer 😅
Anyone who watched the doc and felt attacked has some serious soul searching to do. A "good people on both sides" approach wasn't going to happen. It was a platform for the people who have been hurt by this disgusting cult.
My win for the week is that I found out today that I am not having 2 of my teeth pulled out under general anaesthesia 🥳 Root Canal for me baybee (I know it’s sad when a root canal is a good thing but I take my silver linings where I can get them)
This is actually such a win! It took me years (in my 30s) to get all my teeth fixed and then I got braces at 35 and lost a tooth that cracked and was soo devastated. My mom, brother and sister got dentures by 33 or earlier and I am desperate to save my teeth. I am happy for you ❤
thank you for this video. I am atheist, so was wondering how actual Christians felt. I am warmed to know there is still good in religion.
I went to Patrick Henry College, graduated from there. Was involved a little with Generation Joshua. I knew Madison (shitty person). Gothard's teachings are horrific. The way this documentary conflated PHC and GenJ with Gothard was completely incorrect inappropriate. GenJ was just about giving kids who had an interest in politics a path into politics. It isn't this evil plot to plant people. There are organizations like this on both sides of the political aisle and also in every major industry. It's just like science camp for kids who like science and acting camp for kids who like acting. PHC and GenJ people who succeeded in politics succeeded because they worked super hard and took advantage of networking opportunities through those organizations. Nothing abnormal or nefarious. Madison was not affiliated with Generation Joshua at all. He went to PHC for one whole year and got kicked out for vandalizing property of other students. Pretty much everyone at the school has disavowed him. I was really sad to see my school conflated with this awful cult and awful teachings. PHC physically and psychologically helped a lot of Gothard cult people get free. It was a place we could go that our parents thought was appropriate, but it gave us an amazing education and equipped us to get free.
The one that got me was the "crying out policy" if you don't scream while being raped you wanted it 😠
First of all Josh should have received counseling and extensive counseling. It happens in these families all the time. Because you are not allowed to be a kid. The boy lashes out. Second of all. all fathers need to talk to their sons about pornography about the dangers of it about what happens if you look at illegal pornography or get caught with it. The conversation is a must and he should have been talked to long before this but when there is no privacy in life. And viewed as over women it will keep happening
I made my first successful cheesecake plus my hubby never had cheesecake now he loves it
I'm told it freezes well sp you don't need to eat it all at once, or only on special occasions lol
@45:22 reminds me of a story my mom tells about spanking my older sister when she was breastfeeding for biting her. She brags about it and goes, "Yeah, she wailed, but she didn't do it again!"
So funny that’s what Scientology says about what they learn NOT going to traditional school too. How funny. That it’s ‘basically a PhD.’ Except it’s not in anyyyy sense of the letters.
As an atheist, seeing this documentary just made me believe MORE strongly that ALL religion is just man-made. People deciding how to make the Bible work for their needs. It is so ridiculous to me. It’s like believing in Santa Claus. (In my opinion) …However, you are so intelligent; and I couldn’t wait to hear your response to it. And you delivered. I really respect you and your point of view. Thank you for responding to this. ❤
What kinda church you go to that sounds fascinating on how to read the Bible
👍✌️🙏❤️✨
Spoiler alert when you watch Paul and Morgan's video they claim they didn't know anything about the subject of the series but still agreed to go on the show anyway 😅
So I am no longer a Christian, but not that long ago I was a progressive Christian (after being raised fundamentalist) and I feel like for people who aren't extremist/fundamentalist the doc isn't offensive or attacking. I have heard Christians saying that it felt attacking to them, but I am certain I would not have felt attacked if I was still a progressive/mainline Christian. So that being said, I'm really grateful that you spoke up saying that it didn't feel like an attack on all Christianity. I would not see you as being lumped in with extremists (just from the videos I have watched of yours) so I think it's good to have your voice added to this.
See that isn't true because they lumped everybody into one group.
There was no reason for them to show the creation museum And say almost all churches were buying this guy's doctrine. Those of us who are saying it was attack on christianity are saying that because we never heard of this guy.
I’ve got a sweet watermelon for the first time this year. Simple but sweet.
ETA - I’m curious to see your impression of Paul and Morgan’s video. Yikes imo! // My mom threw my cabbage patch doll away.😕 When I saw the toddler spanking their doll in the show I knew they were getting beaten, because I did the same thing as a child. 😔
Oh that’s so sad to hear. When I was doing kinship foster care I loved seeing baby girl give her favorite doll kisses and feeding her gently because I knew that’s what she experienced from her former foster family and us so it was sweet to see that learned behavior. But it’s so devastating to hear about the other side of that 😔 I hope you’re doing ok 💛
Okay....your Morgan voice is a dead ringer. It's uncanny.
That’s both a wonderful and awful compliment to receive 😂
Gothard was getting more in "tithings" than they paid their own kids. 😢
The thing is: if Paul and Morgan feel like they haven't been portrayed in the best light, maybe they should take a second look at either their beliefs or what they share online. The clips that were chosen made their position extremely clear. If that's "a bad light" to them, then I guess their beliefs are too 🤷♀️ (which, I personally believe they are harmful)
I lost 19.4 pounds over the past two weeks. I am a little closer to my goal.
That’s a lot! You didn’t ask for my advice but I say Congrats and please make sure you listen to your body. You didn’t gain the weight in a few months, so don’t put unrealistic expectations on yourself to lose it soo fast! Your overall health is more important then your weight loss. I’m rooting for you! Good luck on your journey (just remember it’s a journey and not a sprint).
@@cortney3798 I am well aware, and I am actually doing it healthy and long term. I have made sure that I don't check too often, and that I give myself grace in the process. This will not change overnight., but i am learning to listen to my body cues, which has helped a great deal. It's gonig to take time, but I am not broken or wrong, and this process is possible.
Karate for Christ
Paul and Morgan's reaction to their part and the documentary as a whole is really embarrassing
For them. Their reaction did not make them look good.
My win for the week is having therapy. I'm currently with a therapist who's helping me with my religious deconstruction/reconstruction. I feel like I'm getting a lot of good perspectives about.
I think my only critiques about the documentary series are two things: 1) They didn't go into how exactly Josh went to the dark side. With all the stuff that they were indoctrinating Josh with, how exactly did he develop a porn addiction and have enough smarts to work around the Covenant Eyes app?
2) I am not sure if inviting Paul and Morgan to be in the documentary is such a good idea. It's kinda giving them a platform, even if they were misrepresented.
It happens because sex is a taboo subject so there is no one to talk to about it & no healthy outlet to explore it (remember masturbation is considered a terrible sin to these people & regular dating is a no no). So it finds other outlets & on top of that boys are taught that they are above women & it’s the woman’s fault if they do anything.
I’m so glad you’re going to therapy to work through that. Deconstruction can be such a long, confusing process and I am wishing you the best! 💛
As far as Josh goes, I do think it would be interesting to hear more about who else enabled him to get away with this but he’s definitely not a rare case. In the doc, so many people talked about how common sexual abuse was in their experience being raised in homes with the same beliefs as the duggars. It’s not just ignored, it’s an open secret that the adults allow to happen and participate in 😔
God willl take care of you, but he took advantage of resturants where kids ate free for hrs
What really grates me is that you just KNOW that the people saying that "you should trust god to provide" and keep having kids would absolutely NOT say that for poor POC families and immigrants. Suddenly it would become about "personal responsibility". The thing about groups like this is that they are not really about protecting women and children, they are about creating a power structure that protects men. When you look at everything IBLP and similar groups/people do, then it makes perfect sense. That's why Josh only confessed to looking at pron in front of his church, because admitting to molestation could have ruined his future. It's why they favor protecting Josh over the girls, even when Josh is abusing them. It's why JimBob feels totally fine exploiting the labor of his daughters. It's why people kept looking the other way when Gothard's brother abused women. It's why the IBLP keeps going even though their founder is a s3x offender. It's why the women Gothard abused were shamed for coming forward. It's why women are blamed when men abuse them. It's why women are trained to practically worship their husband and never question him, no matter what he does. It's all about making men into untouchable cult leaders in their own homes. ALSO your Michelle voice is amazing and terrifying 😂