Propane Tank, Bringing It Up To Code - Episode 290 - Acorn to Arabella: Journey of a Wooden Boat
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- Опубликовано: 30 ноя 2023
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Propane on boats, when properly handled, is safe and is a great way to cook as long as a few key safety things are in place. Our propane tanks are designed to sit on their side, and back when David built the cherry wood propane lockers for the primary and backup tanks, it was always in the plan that the controls for the primary propane tank would be something that Steve and Robin could reach without going up on deck.
Steve completes the boat propane system installation with a solenoid, and describes the way that he has it set up for the way they'll be using the stove aboard.
Thank you so much for watching and for your support!
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Acorn to Arabella started as a wooden boat building project in Granby, Massachusetts. Steve began the journey as an amateur wooden boat builder crafting a 38' wooden sailboat in his backyard: designer William Atkin's Ingrid with a Stormy Petrel's gaff rig. These videos follow the journey from tree felling, to lumber milling, to lofting, to the lead keel pour and now sailing the boat-sharing details of the woodworking, carpentry, metal smithing, tool building, and tool maintenance that traditional wooden boats command. This ultimate DIY project continues beyond the boat shop, as Steve and crew travel and learn to cruise aboard the handmade wooden boat that they've built. Just kidding about all that, this channel is about a Siberian Laika named Akiva.
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So sorry to hear about mom's cancer comming back. Love the channel.
Steve, I used to train folks on LP filling etc and just recently repaired my LP solenoid. Didn't read all the comments so this may already appear here. 1. LP tank valves not only seal in the closed position, but also in the open position so LP doesn't leak past the valve stem. So always open the valve completely until the handle stops. 2. The round part of the solenoid is an electro magnet and can be replaced if it fails. Mine did last season. just take off the big nut and voila.
Thanks for the tips!
Praying for your mom and praying for a safe sale down south.
Crew of Arabella, it’s Friday again, and I have enjoyed watching today! Adding a prayer for Steve’s mom.
Looks like a good safe propane hook up and control. Too bad you couldn't hide the propane hose. Tough news about your Mom’s cancer. Thank you for sharing. Have a great day and stay safe.🙂🙂
I've been a bit paranoid about propane on any boat since seeing the rapid unscheduled disassembly of a beautiful wooden yacht not unlike Arabella but considerably older, in Burnham-on-Crouch due to a tiny propane leak which filled the boat.
I was assisting a friend with his boat - a reasonable fibreglass day-sailer which was just about able to do light cruising if you didn't mind being a bit cramped (and of course, fibreglass is so light it bounces around in the slightest ripple and isn't very easily heated, although it is better than steel or aluminium in that respect. We were on the dinghy to be taken out to our mooring, and the gentleman who had the very nice wooden yacht was dropped off at his right before we were to be delivered to my friend's boat. After dropping the other gentleman off we were heading across to our mooring when we were almost capsized by a blast wave coming from astern. We turned to look and his beautiful yacht was a cloud of debris expanding upwards and outwards in all directions. Luckily no large parts hit us in the dinghy, and he was also wearing a life jacket of the self-inflating type (which were relatively rare back then) and being bright orange, we were able to see him and pull him out of the water - I'm not much of a judge of distance, but he was two moorings away from where his yacht had been moored. He was pretty badly burned but conscious and told us that the boat had exploded as he reached into the companionway and switched on the interior light. The switch must have created just enough of a spark to ignite the propane that had filled the boat in the two weeks since he had last been aboard. We were lucky that someone ashore had seen what had happened and called for an ambulance (this was well before cellphones), which arrived as we pulled into the quayside. He was taken to the local trauma centre who just stabilized him and he was then transferred to Stoke Mandeville Hospital - then the UK's leading burns unit - being patched up and having grafts over the course of at least a couple of months. I think they said 40% burns, which was close to the survivable limit back then.
PLEASE use the (sealed and sparkless, intrinsically safe) switch as a matter of course, and only rely on the sniffer as a safety backup, mounted as low in the boat as you can put it - propane is heavier than air (as I'm sure you know, but others reading this may not) and will fill a boat completely without quite a strong draught to blow it out, and that draught has to blow through the whole boat, right down into the bilge, or the propane will accumulate there. For at least the next year, you could not give away propane equipment in Burnham after that accident, as it alarmed so many owners that they switched over to kerosene entirely and rapidly. Even now I'd only use it if there was no choice and every possible precaution was installed and observed because it is such a well-hidden danger.
Definitely install the propane detector with the solenoid control. Trident makes a good control panel and detector. However, I strongly suggest that you use the control panel to close the solenoid when you are not using the propane. I always close the tank valve when I leave the boat and only open the tank valve when I come back aboard only if I am going to use the propane. Just make sure your solenoid valve is gas rated, ideally for full propane tank pressure (~120 psi or more) so that a regulator failure won't force gas past the solenoid valve. Fireboy makes a very good solenoid valve. Another reason to close the solenoid valve when you are not actively using propane is that the 12 volt solenoid valves draw about 1 amp when they are open. So if you leave the valve open 24 hours a day that valve alone will draw 24 amp-hr from your battery bank. Finally, most insurers will require that you have a propane detector.
"All I could see from where I stood
Was three long mountains and a wood;
I turned and looked another way,
And saw three islands in a bay.
So with my eyes I traced the line
Of the horizon, thin and fine,
Straight around till I was come
Back to where I'd started from;
And all I saw from where I stood
Was three long mountains and a wood."
These are the first lines of the long, great poem "Renascence" by Edna St. Vincent Millay, written in 1912 when she was 19 years old and living in Camden. Where she stood was the summit of Mt. Battle, where Steve and Akiva are in the opening video.
watching akiva shoot off explains so much about his pen back home. huskies are... well huskies and it was grat to see him have an island all to himself.
Indeed!
Don't forget if you have a permanently energized solenoid it is getting hot and wearing itself out. Sorry to hear that news Steve, continued positive thoughts and prayers.
Hi Steve, I use the same solenoid and it draws enough current that it gets pretty hot when I’m baking so if you use a sniffer make sure you figure in that draw to add to your daily usage. Arabella is looking awesome!
Steve, in addition to considering the power draw and the consequent heat generated by the propane solenoid, you might consider two of these mounted in line as a way to double your safety when propane should be off… propane engulfing you in your small cabin will be quickly fatal…
I'm loving that picture of the launch by the propane access.
What you need is a "When we leave the boat Checklist"
so sorry to hear about your moms cancer will say a prayer for her , thank you for sharing these wonderful videos
Sorry to hear about your Mum give her my love and best wishes from Liverpool UK. ❤❤
I've been at that lookout on Mt Battie many times. I've been lost in the view sitting on those rocks. Sighhhhh!
One of my favorite images of Arabella - Steve at the top of the mast…. on look-out… Ahoy Matey! Avast ye scurvy Land-lubbers!
As Akiva jumped out of the boat onto the island I understood why, over the years, you seemed to always keep him from running around too much on his own. And, it's always interesting to see how you go about solving the issues you encounter in making living aboard Arabella as comfortable as possible! Quite an exercise in ingenuity.
Very sorry to hear about your mom. I have a couple of long time friends that went through multiple bouts with cancer. They would be pronounced "all clean" by the doctors only to have the same cancer come back a year or less later.
Both just gave up after the 2nd round of chemo and said no more.
Tell your mom hang in there.
If she's anything like you, she can grind it out.
Love that view. I can see the star on the tower from my house when they light it. 🌟 Happy Friday, 'bella fam! ☕
Happy Friday! 🎉☕️
Warm thoughts and Good vibrations to your mother!
I’m so sorry to hear about your Mom’s cancer.
It’s so difficult to to mentally process our parents fragility. I wish for you, especially your Mom, and all of your family, peace through this difficult time.
Glad to see that you’re installing the whole boat load (snort) of propane handling gear on Arabella. Safety is paramount.
🩷
&
Thank you Robin, for keeping Steve. He IS an amazing fella.
😁
Like the idea of shutoff solonoid right at the tank
Islands are perfect for dogs, particularly those with particular independent inclinations! I have had a Fireboy sniffer/solenoid in my boat for 20 plus years. Always good to have a spare sniffer if one gets wet, which they will do occasionally in the bilge.
Akiva is as obedient as any Husky I know. Just like mine. Eventually he'll come back, when he feels like it.
Ha!
Huskies do what Huskies do... If I had time to tell the story of having to chase mine almost a mile before catching him, when he got out the front door... 🤣
Upon looking at your last video which included Camden, I had to reflect upon a couple who I had the good fortune to meet in Camden. Every day, through the year, Sam Manning and his wife, Susan, took their dory out for a row and perhaps a sail. Even if it meant breaking the ice in their slip. The boat was designed for those who looked at hard work was a day made for them. They took me out one day and I began to feel its comfort at being at sea, its home. Sam was one of the greatest maritime illustrators, his work found often in books, articles and small pamphlets. His hands and eyes captured the complex and graceful lines of a boat, a shipyard and the countryside of Maine. Good fortune let me to Camden and the Mannings.
18:42
Sam was a wonderful human. I didn’t get to meet him in person, but I got to see some of his unpublished drawings when I worked at WoodenBoat. What a resource! And I love that he and Susan enjoyed the water so much. -Anne
Steve, please consider wiring an on-off switch and light to your LPG solenoid. An LPG detector will provide both--Trident is a good brand. Make a disciplined practice to turn on the LPG solenoid, light your stove, and turn off the LPG solenoid BEFORE. you turn off your stove to burn off all the LPG in the lines. This was our practice on our world circumnavigation 1997-2012.
Prayers sent.
10:30 You could make some cash selling that beautiful landscape as a screen saver or background! It screams, "I am Autumn, the greatest Season!!"
You might reconsider the idea to leave the propane solenoid open all the time as they draw considerable power. Mine draws about 2 amps. I have a switch right by the stove with a ready light on it to remind me to shut the stove off.
Even the doggy is not comfortable putting new holes in a brand new, shiny boat. Gotta be done little guy. No worries, Papa knows what he's doing.
Looks very water tight and super safe. Very high-tech with the sniffer. Gotta love modern innovations.
All the best to Mama.
You might think about connecting the solenoid valve to a manually set timer. You set the timer to 20 minutes, use your propane, then, even if you forget to turn it off, the timer takes care of it for you...
I absolutely agree. The valve should only be open when the stove is on, and not a moment longer.
Good morning Akiva 🐺 and Crew 😸😺
If you kept the wood you just cut out of the box, I would like you to send that to me and I will send it back with something special on it as a thank you for your 7 years of content.
What a relief to see you discovered what an LP detector (gas sniffer) can do. They are required equipment in RVs and other vehicles, so it seemed strange that you didn't mention it early on. They are quite effective at keeping vessels from going boom, just make sure to put it down near the sole. And using a type 1 tank connector on your regulator will probably be safer and more convenient than the POL I think I saw you use.
I saw the Loch Ness monster swim by! Oh. Wait. I think that was a seal.
I’m currently fighting Neuroendocrine Cancer, so sending my love to you and your family xx.
Hoping the best for your health!
Sailors motto: A place for everything and everything in it's place.
I'm sure everyone's prayers are with your mom and your family. We are all hoping for the best, be strong for her and yourself.
sorry to hear about your mom best wishes for her good to have the gas sorted as a non morning person I agree having to go on deck before a cup of tea would not be ideal stay safe all
Happy Friday and A2A day from a freezing Plymouth UK
Stay warm out there and happy Friday, Phil!
Wish your mom the best of luck. Prayers for your family. Great video, I think you should use the switch to shut off the propane when not in use and the sniffer as a safety shutoff.
Good Morning🥰✌🏾
Good day!
That was an excellent explanation of how the solenoid will be used and how are you intend on setting it up. I learn so much from your good explanations.
I, like many others, are disturbed about your Mom's progress
Please let her know that me and many others around the world pray for her return to strength and for you, Steve, to be proud of what you have achieved. 🇻🇨
"Propane and propane accessories"! 🤣
Ben - Incredible editing and story telling.
Steve - you could talk about sawdust and if listen.
Robin - you are simply inspiring.
Akeva - you are so picturesque.
I love this show!
I think I saw the Loche Ness monster swimming in the harbor
Huskys and Beagles, not coming back until they’re ready (tired).
Guys sorry to hear about mom, prayers for fair winds to get there. Prayers for time to be with her
I’ve always found it odd that many of the boating channels I watch do so many cuts with a jig saw and don’t seem to own a cordless circular saw. But Steve seems to be the opposite. Owns a circular saw, but apparently not a jigsaw.
Praying for your Mom--she's got the finest care in the world in Boston...
I know exactly where you were in Camden! Incredible footage! Thank You!
My experience with gas sniffers: The ones the gas company uses are amazing. They could detect an unlit pilot in an apartment unit by holding the sniffer next to the crack beside the door. The cheap one that I bought couldn't detect an unlit pilot if you put it next to it. It could detect the gas if you turned on the burner with the pilot unlit.
I mentioned this because the ones the gas company uses were really expensive and I wonder how well a gas sniffer works like the one mentioned in this video. Is it really expensive or have they figured out how to make reasonably priced gas sniffers work pretty well?
Nice! Didn't know you guys were part of the MTB tribe! Glad to see the gas hookup improved, its always those small things that are hard but the little 10% improvements do add up to 150% eventually...somehow.
The dog needs to run!!
Best wishes, Steve. Your Mom will be comforted to have you nearby. I hope she will do well.
Are you going to seal the exposed edges of the wood where you cut the hole into the propane locker? Seems like it would be a good idea.
Cool stuff! Thanks for letting us watch. So sorry about Steve's mom. :(
happy friday everyone.
Happy Friday, Aynsley!
Good morning A2A. Hope all is well with the family!!
Happy Friday, Bill! Missin you!
Options on the propane connections setup. A small job gets bigger to find the tools and parts. Working wround live aboard issues. Viable solution with options. Getting some recreational time. Making provisions to relocate.
Take the drill off of "hammer" .....it'll drill much better.....especially with a spade bit!!
Classic New Englander jargon 'Wicked Bummer' :)
😊
Looking forward to seeing the finished projects shown during this video. Beautiful scenery and so peaceful. You are lucky to have that life, even if you do have to have woolly hats 😀
Good Morning from Sandwich, MA
Happy Friday!
I’m sure you’ve thought it out Steve but according to all advice I’ve had unless purpose built propane cylinders must always be stored vertically
Not if they’re made to be on their side as these are. They’re especially for marine purposes, too.
perfect
@@AcornToArabella
Excellent stuff bro
Prayers for your Mom!
The solenoid needs to be first because it works on pressure, which isn't there below the regulator. Tank, solenoid (valve), Leakdown gauge, regulator, output. Turn the system off & watch the gauge to see if it drops.
The instructions at 11:54 show regulator first, then solenoid
I've worked on many boats and I've never seen the solenoid before the regulator. What kind of solenoid is this? The only ones I've ever seen are 12v and the plunger/valve is perpendicular to the gas line - doesn't rely on gas pressure.
Stephen, Last week my Trident Marine propane solenoid failed catastrophically for the SECOND time. Charred wires, insulation and melted plastic.
I saw that you carefully ran the supply wire for your solenoid separated from the propane hose but through the same gland. As a result of my experience I suggest removing the wire from the gland that has the propane line. I think that is ABYC spec anyway.
My solenoid draws 1.5 amps, that is a lot of power to use to have it on all of the time as you mentioned was your plan. I wouldn't burn my power that way.
My solenoids have not been covered under warranty. Trident apparently expects them to fail in just over a year as I have experienced twice. Plan on yours failing as well.
I just completed a 10,000 NM solo circuit of the Pacific in my 27' Cutter and I am back in Mexico. 4 months at sea on passages, 18 months in the South Pacific. Fresh bottom paint and I'd go again!
Sorry to hear about your Mom, I lost my dear wife to cancer. My prayers are with you and your family.
Ben S/V DAWN
I used to want solenoid off not only for safety but because it used quite a lot of electricity to keep open. Also buying solenoid as forklift part saved over 75% price over marine part.
Love the pics of Camden Harbor--and I think I have seen your rock climbing place, but from the road. You are AMAZING!
Another great Friday morning watching life aboard Arabella. Thank you. 👍 in Missouri
Happy Friday!
Would it be a good idea to spray some clearcoat into the holes in the wood to seal them from moisture, or pump in some silicone caulk?
Dear Robin, Anne, Steve and all others who worked at Arabella.
Happy Friday first of all. The advantage of mountain climbing obviously is that climbing to the top of the mast of Arabella is no issue at all. Willeke and I were wondering all the time since Arabella is in the harbor what’s to see on island in the background so it must be a very tiny island what’s accessible for walking there looking at the stairs on the island. We think the island is uninhabitable.
We look forward to your next vlog and send you love from the Netherlands
Happy Friday, Dick and Willeke! It’s very small and doesn’t have a lighthouse keeper anymore, but would have had back when it required keeping. We have a LOT of islands here in Maine, and one of my favorite things to do is to sail to them and explore. Sending love from New England! -Anne
Steve - you really shouldn't install the propane cylinder on its side - it needs to be upright, or you risk getting liquid through the regulator and causing a dangerous flare-up from the stove.
I have a thought/request: since these videos are so beautiful and bring me a feeling of peacefulness it would be nice every now and then to have one like an hour long. It doesn't have to be update or anything progress wise, just some of Ben's music, some idle chat and lapping of the water etc. Views like those autumn colours reflecting off the glassy water are food for the soul :)
So glad you find them to be peaceful and calming! Thanks for making the request. We’ve thought about, for longer trips in the future, having fewer episodes but a longer format if we’re remote enough that sending video files becomes a challenge. Thank you so much for watching and for the kind words!
@@AcornToArabella I mean Anne, I'll take whatever you all put up but hearing an extended mix of Ben's tunes and the water life would be something special we could all use in our lives. Things are just so bleak on so many fronts and what you all have is a reminder of why life is special and worth the effort and not just about the usual routine or stressful anxiety.
Thanks Anne, you're so sweet and kind :)
All the best to Steve and his mum too.
And Akiva running free! Could watch him root and toot all day long.
Please plumb that propane line in permanently with soft copper tubing and flares/nuts. You can run it discreetly.
I am working on an old boat, full of retrofits and after-thoughts. Every exposed after-thought has collected a shadow of dust or filth.
I’ve resolved to mitigate those items moving forward.
Good morning Steve-you are planning to put the sniffer inside the boat, roger that?
No, probably in the box so it doesn’t have to get to the point where gas is inside the boat for it to do it’s job.
@@AcornToArabella Got that, but you have propane appliances and plumbing connections in Arabella's cabin where you humans and puppies hang out. Wouldn't you want your confined living space protected from a propone leak more so than the propane locker on the deck?
Was that a seal at 16:20? How does Akiva respond to 'sea dogs'? :)
Yup! That’s a harbor seal. I call them dog mermaids. 😊 -Anne
Sorry to hear about your mother.
Another great update. Best wishes for your mom. Thanks for sharing.
Nice job with the propane when are you leaving to go closer to Boston. Hope you have found a suitable place to hold up this winter. Will you have to haul her to re place the zincs?
Yay!
it’s a difficult thing, and an extremely foreign concept, to consider launching a boat or traveling far away to be near a mother who poured love into her family. When you launched sooner than you might have, and travel in less than ideal weather, it’s clear you would do anything for your loving mother. Some of us never had that, and had to deal with narcissistic women who bore us and punished us every day after. Count your blessings Steven, as you are indeed a lucky man.
I would have used an auger bit instead of that spade bit to go through solid wood. Is there a reason to use the spade over the auger?
Just curiousare u guys gonna have a traditional ceremony or one at all? If so maybe getting hitched on a favorite climb or trail?
Happy Friday. I've been raking leaves for days, lol...richard Normandy, Fra.
Happy Friday, Richard! Glad you’re taking a break with us. 😊
Love the flush mounted GFCI receptacle in the galley background there. :p I expect, knowing Steve, he's on task to make a custom face plate from teak recovered from Victoria?
Ha! 😁
This makes me think about a simple automated cut off, as on gas stoves. (I have a Smeg) Surely there is a way to have fail safe shut off, using a thermistor, connected to your solenoid? I don't know about other brands of stove, but mine shuts off the gas after 8 seconds, which is great when using really low flame settings; sometimes the flame can be extinguished without me noticing, and the gas is automatically switched off. Also, if the thermistor is faulty on a particular burner, that burner won't stay lit, so no seeing a flame and walking away without it burning, and the gas just flowing out...
Couple of thoughts on your gas install. It is better to have some drains in your gas locker at the bottom of the locker - the gas is heavier than air. that way you don't have a half locker full of gas when it spills out the big hole. That rubber gas hose is normally only good for a short number of years before needing to be replaced. In Europe, the date of manufacture is on all those hoses to ensure that they are replaced within the timescale, thus most installations use special copper gas lines from near the regulator to near the stove, then transferred to armoured flexible line to the stove, and a short tail from the regulator to the start of the gas line . I have never seen the gas bottles laying on their side before in an installation. In fact I was specifically warned not to do that as it enables liquid gas into the regulator rather than gas, and you can get over pressure at the gas stove.
I have an alcohol stove on my boat so no issues with propane. I’m in Europe and know quite some boates with propans gas tanks. Not one of them trusts any system, hoses might leak, connections might leak. All of them use the propane for cooking and once done the valve at the tank is closed manually and line burned empty, then the stove is turned off.
I would have made the hose penetration at the upper halve of the propane container - for increased safety. And I would have put the solenoid for the propane inside the boat, to minimise sparking risk in the propane bottle container - also for increased safety.
There’s no need to engineer/create a solution, there are ABYC standards to follow for boat systems of all sorts.
@@AcornToArabella Would there have been a system safety analysis as normally required on merchant vessels, that would have been a sample of notations not marked green in the report.
I am comfortable with SRT myself, as a long-term caver, but you do seem to have shrouds perfectly suited to an old school shroud ladder...
We’ll have ratlines eventually!
Are you going to put a fusible link over the stove in the solenoid line? That would automatically cut the propane feed if there was a fire on the stove.
Is that a liquid gas , all the bottle gas we have is liquid , and any leaks tend to gather in the bilge , our gas detectors are low down . Explosions because of leaks have normally been from the bilge up. Should you hose be armoured , have the gas go through the solenoid with the switch included, 1 button to operate, , have the detector with a loud alarm down low near the cooker.
A bilge pump going off can be the trigger.
Wouldn’t you run the propane hose along under the side deck and through the floor of the propane locker?
I would recomend the following for a gas sniffer and one & off switch system.
I am sure Hamilton Marine caries them.
TRIDENT MARINE HOSE & PROPANE
Marine LP Gas Control & Detection Kit
Marine LP Gas Control & Detection System - 12/24V - w/o Solenoid