16ah HEADWAY LITHIUM BATTERY vs 100ah AGM BATTERY who wins?
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- Опубликовано: 9 июл 2024
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This is an awesome comparo! Somebody needs to make a small case for those Headways so you can safely mount them in a trunk. I know Parker uses empty battery cases for his, but he's using more cells too.
LAF- Lange Audio Fabrication makes acrylic cases for any size headway bank and they're nice
Yep what Bobby said! Check out LAF
What safety does acrylic provide? Lithium fire burn right thru that.
@@h8h81 just safety from preventing a pos to negative arc on the non main bus bars
64ah will fit nicely into those battery boxes from walmart
As many people know, I ran 8 of the Duralast Platinum H8 (same battery in this video different label.) in The Audiopipe Blazer for a few years coupled with a group 34 AGM under hood. I never had any issues so to say with the batteries themselves, however even with dual 320 alternators I would see voltage drop into the low elevens at times. Adding a 3rd alternator did help with voltage, but still dropped into the mid to low 12's. this was on 18k watts by the way. Never had any issues, and the batteries recovered quickly for what they were, but you could notice a difference after a day of demoing at a show (would see a resting rate in the 11's alot). Only other con I can say for them is the weight and size, they are big heavy bastards especially running multiples. 1 more con I would say is hooking several of them up at a time kinda limits you on configurations. Over all though I can not complain, they did there job for what they are.
However switching to 2 Cyber 12k's which is Lipo4 cells with a cap bank is complete night and day difference! Voltage has never been lower than 13.4 when demoing! They recover almost instantaneously, equipment runs much cooler, and all 3 alternators don't have to work nearly as hard! Also saves me about 600lbs of weight and gives me much more room! If your on a budget, I'd recommend the AGM all day long, for the price, warranty, and free replacement you can not go wrong! When you have the opportunity to make the switch though, I'd highly recommend it! Your equipment and charging system will thank you later!
Great video! 10+ stars!!
I totally agree! If you’ve got a serious system lithium is the way of the future
18k watts? So what would you suggest I do for my little 2k system? Lol as far as battery and alt upgrade
@@nicolumens3311jag 35 battery lev60 for 150$
@@nicolumens3311320 alternater 3 agm one under the hood and 2 in back you Gucci more the enough power for a 5k just incase you decide that’s if you’re just a basic street beater but if you serious lithium!
I run 64 amp hours of Headway cells assembled in a empty battery case powering a Taramps Smart 5k and a Kicker ZX550.2 . Voltage never drops below 13.4 and keep in mind this is my main an only battery for starting and powering my audio equipment. I keep it in the trunk area. Running for 2 years strong an never looked back
mustang6035 did you assemble yours or purchase it ready to go & install? Asking because I'm wanting to switch from agm to lithium but do not know that much about it. I do not want to do anything wrong. When I first get my lithium I'll probably be running something slightly similar to you, a smart5 and a couple 110.4 channel amps. Then down the road I will more than likely switch out the Smart5 for either the 8k amp I have or purchase a 12k. Assuming I should probably give myself some headroom for later & just go with more ah than needed when I first get my lithium.
@@itdoesntmatterwhatyourname6128 The lithium chemistry you choose depends on where you live and the minimum temperatures in your area. If you live in a warm climate near the equator where it never gets to 0°C or 32°F, Lifepo4 (Lithium Iron Phosphate) cells, like Headway or other types of Lifepo4 cells are perfectly fine. If you live somewhere that gets cold in winter, then you should use Lithium Titanate cells. Yinlong 40Ah cells from China are probably your best choice for building a Lithium Titanate battery. You can use and charge Lifepo4 batteries from 1°C or 34°F up to something like 160°F or so. Every battery has a spec sheet that will tell you the operating range for temperature. The point of this is to say that you can't use or charge a Lifepo4 battery below freezing. You would have to set up a heating curcuit to keep the Lifepo4 cells over 32°F or 0°C. Some might be able to be used to -10°C or 25°F but you really shouldn't use or charge Lifepo4 cells below freezing. If you live in a place where the temperature goes down below freezing at night and during the winter, you are going to want to use Lithium Titanate Cells, like the 40ah Yinlong cells you can get from BatteryHookUp.com for $199 for a fully built and ready to use 12v replacement battery. Its only 6Ah for $199 though. It is however pre assembled with welded with thick aluminum bus bars. I believe XS Power also has rebranded 40Ah Yinlong cells. They are 2.3v each, so it takes 6 cells in series to make a 12v replacement battery vs the 4 cells in series you need with Lifepo4 cells. Building a Lithium Titanate battery for car audio is definitely going to be more expensive than building a Headway Lifepo4 battery. They can both do a great job keeping your voltage up higher, and they usually weigh about 70% less than lead acid batteries while being much more energy dense, and faster charging and discharging.
How many cells?
How many times have you had to charge it ?!??
@@burr7367 since it's in a vehicle, it would be charging every time he starts his car, from the alternator.
ive ran headways since 2017 or 2018. they work great finally had a cell fail out of the first bank i built all the rest seem fine but ive decided to totally rebuild that bank and use the old cells for a portable camping pack. other than that one cell ever pack ive made is still working
Vega thanks for the video, it helped me a lil bit. I'll take every bit of info I can & appreciate the help from your vids! I've been wanting to make the switch from my Northstar AGM to Lithium I've just had so many questions & still feel like I know very little about Lithium. Hoping to feel comfortable enough about my knowledge of Lithium within the next couple months so I can pull the trigger and buy my first Lithium setup.
I am very impressed with that small lithium setup. I've been thinking about upgrading my battery system
I made a 2p4s headway pack for my side by side. I 3d printed cwll spacers and a case out of flexible tpu. Provides plenty of starts and less voltage drop when using the winch.
Another straight up legit video from ya Boi Vega. Thanks for sharing buddy.
Loved the video! Yes, more plz.
Hell yeah nice! That’s some great info!! Thank you
Nice useful comparison video man 👍
Great video can I use that lithium battery in my room?
I have a audio system installed in my room.
And should I use a specific charger?
And also can I used it in float mode while listening music?
Thanks a lot .
Much appreciated! this is a great way to help put AGM and Lithium into perspective.
Plus the weight saving is huge!
I ran a 36ah lishen lithium bank and it was great..I like headway because they work well with stock charging.
I got a 64ah headway bank I made. Its just like 4× that size in a 4s configuration. It'll run my whole 5k rms system and my Mercedes. I just worry about cells failing, but you can get a nice bms to monitor all this. This is a great example comparison tho!
I'm running a couple hundred ah at this point. I REALLY wish I'd have sucked it up and got LTO cells. That being said even with a high end agm, the headway cells charge and discharge SO much faster. Great video thanks for sharing. I'm down with battery testing let's see it!
lto is good if youre going higher voltage headways are where its at for stock imho
Heck ya bro this is sick!!!!
Great stuff!!!
Great video bro thanks
I have the same h8 agm with a agm group 65 under the hood. I’m thinking of adding another. Would I be better off adding this lithium to the existing set up? How many watts can the 16ah lithium support? Thanks for the info
Nicely done bro
Can you use these Lifepo4 batteries that are selling all over the internet as a power bank for a large 10k watt boat audio system ? Interested in non engine running party cove setting. How do the lifepo4 batteries work vs these ? Also, some of the lifepo4 batteries have built in battery management, is this good for or not for this use ?
Hello im wondering if and how many of these headway i would need 2 run a 32pill amplifier for cb radio hoping somebody can help me
Do you have a video about how to balance and install the headway cells?
Nope not yet
Good video man i just got a 80ah lithium I can't wait to get in the car
AWSOME MAN! 🔥
If i don't have a battery charger could i still install the headway bank in the car?
is like to see the draw of the amp and see how fast power is returned to system in a running car with only the swap of the one battery . then after that test do a big 3 .
As always thank you for the videos, audio, tutorial, demo, comparison
great information & content.
Remember BASS in ya FACE
HiFi Vega
🚙📻🔈🔉🔊🔊🔊💨💨💨💨💨🎼🎵🎶🎵🎼🎶😁
Thanks for watching
Can you use this for hydraulic cars?
Can spmeone comment on the AH part of comparing AGM to Headway cells ?? I want to run three 96ah headway banks in a large boat build. We domt sit with the engine running so a large bank is needed. I will be approx 10k rms. I added a 270 amp alternator to charge back up in between party cove visits thru the day. Still trying to figure out if 300 ah of headway diy, is better then say 500 ah of agm..
I have 2 dead cells, the positive shows a negative sign in my tester. How do i fix this
Do you have link to the used battery cells
Which would be the best BMS for this array? (Speaking of quality - price)
Thanks for the awesome comparison.
Im not an SPL kind of listener. Im more of a SQ music in a moderate level of sound. Question, how long do you think that size of a lithium will last in minutes before it shuts of. +/-500w system in moderate volume level.
I just wanna have an idea of how long can I play my music while Im in the car. Thanks.
With a 16ah bank I’d say a couple of hours. If you built a bigger bank you’d be able to play longer
Tnx for the info
@hifivega if I have the same 16ah headway cells setup what charger to you recommend?
amzn.to/3NWFyxv
I would like to see how many agm batts would it take to equal one lithium battery
Just an fyi you don't have to use automotive style agm batteries. You can use sla agm batteries like what you find in wheel chairs and mobility scooters. They are way cheaper and they come in deep cycle agm gel too.
yea i have the xs power d3400 under my hood and 2 xp3000 in the cab of my yukon but im gona be swiching to lithium when the life cycle of the batts are up good vidoe
What are you thinking of getting? Im debating whether to add another D3400 or an D4S LTO 6. Which would you choose?
@@hippo-potamus THE d4s lot for the size and compact wight
Nice!
I’m about to drop a 100ah lifepo4 and the UltraCap in my ride.
Great stuff! Very interesting comparison indeed. I’d never really considered the headway bank, until now..i thought the headway bank would be cost prohibitive. Thank you sir. SUB’d peace out..:) Oh, please do run the AGM vs The flooded lead acid battery comparison
can I keep my new agm up front and run my superbeast in the rear because I live in Canada .....whats the best way. to do this?
You can run these in line with AGM. You can use a isolator if you want, but it’s not absolutely required.
I just picked up 80 headway cells for my scion xb build
2 banks of
Each bank with 40 cells and a set of ultra caps.
feeds a sfb-8000.1D feeds 2 avatar stu 15".
Was doing a normal compact c-piller wall but changed up for a bandpass with a 30-80hz range shifted some seat brackets around to gain apx 5 more inches of rear space (need to keep rear seats got kids)
Where u buy the buy the hardware for lithium ?
Sorry if I missed I’m driving lol
Project DB
I dig it!
#callback
Please compare the agm to the wet cell
What is the Make/Model of that charger? I bought a variable output DC power supply to charge mine. I can charge them individually @ 3.2v or assembled @ 12.8
This is a Schumacher can’t remember the model number, but I charge the lithium with a lil noco charger or my 100 amp power max usually
@@HifiVega I was curious about charging these headway cells with my Noco charger!
Deep cycle AGM batteries on hybrid cars, to drive ECM and cars, with alarm, and electronic key entry and startup fail with low milage . These Aux batteries are common on total electric vehicles also and are not part of off road charging cycle. I keep mine charged up each week, especially in the Winter. I added a charging connection to my Hybrid Lexus to AGM battery in the boot. Even Teslas fail due to this issue.
I keep a Hilti portable charge pack in the car also, very compact, just in case. I broke down once due to aux battery failure in the past, never again.
That’s a great way to extend the life of your batteries and almost no one does it
With a 350 alternator how many ah of headway do I need to run my Taramps Md8k?
ruclips.net/video/wf_tio5lk80/видео.html
Can I replace my regular car battery with a 16ah lithium bank as long as I relocate it to the trunk? I currently have a 64ah on my system and wouldn't mind having another lithium for the car to match it
I like the comparison. More so in terms of people using a dual battery system with an isolator. Seems like this would be far better as a second battery in the back since it is much smaller in size and doesn't take up the same space as a car battery. Plus the higher voltage is ideal. The only thing really required would be that isolator so there isnt a parasitic draw. Once activated you would have the alternator charging the system at what the baseline is for the lithium battery.
You just described the perfect set up imo
i use marine battery selectors and switch to front battery only when i park.
Do you think a D4S LTO 6 would be a better option than adding a second XS D3400 to a system?
You’d get more performance out of the LTO 6 than the agm in a much smaller and lighter package
the lithium is just so much more efficient with the current and isn't as stingy with it as the AGM. when done right/safe, there's no way you can overlook lithium.
Good video bro!
Thanks!
@@HifiVega ya buddy 🙂
Nice
Is lithium ok on a "smart charging" system? I have been warned not to do a big 3 on my GMC Canyon because of the smart alternator. The lowered resistance has been known to cause some issues with batteries overcharging and random electrical glitches/issues in the system. I am only running a JP8 @1ohm right now but am wanting a moderate 4 channel for up front and maybe a 5k-8k for the subs at some point but not sure if it is doable without a lot of headaches on this vehicle.
I wish I had some info for you on that, but unfortunately I don’t have any experience with any kind of smart charging systems.
@@HifiVega Yeah, it surprised me when I started reading warnings not to do the big 3 on it. I have an old 94 Ford Ranger that needs some minor mechanical work that I want to try my hand at a blowthrough with. I may have to stick to my JP8 in the Canyon and save the big system for the Ranger,
Anyway, love the channel and thanks for the reply.
My 2015 mustang has a smart system and has never had a prob running multiple agms. stock alt was 175 and simply adding a 4 gauge power wire to stock electrical resulted in noticeably better voltage and increased output from my amp/ subs to the point that even my girlfriend noticed a big difference. running mechman 240 alt now. i didnt run my additional charging wire through the "clamp" sensor that the factory power wire has around it. i believe that clamp sensor is how the vehicle's "smart" alternator charging works and may have something to do with me not having issues.perhaps you could research that
No hand gestures this time. I like it👌
Don’t worry I got you covered this week
Us agm folks need to get over the initial sticker shock of lithium I was sold on the fact that lithium out performs agm by every measure but for some reason it took a lot for me to get through my thick skull that lithium is actually cheaper all things considered that's because you need much less ah of lithium as u do agm and this vid proves it. 30ah of headway will put my 300+ah of agm to shame whilst taking up half the space and a quarter of the weight.
Question that i would prefer answered by you HiFi Vega, or an equally experienced car audio enthusiasts.
I'm running a stock 103 amp alternator. This alternator is powering a stetsom ex3000 black edition 1 ohm amplifier, pushing a Avatar SVL 1547D2 wired to 1 ohm. I have the ioxus 12v 375 Farad ultra capacitor wired in parallel to an xs power d3400 under the hood. Wiring has been upgraded. Big 4 under the hood done with quality 1/0 ofc and a 4/0 high quality pure copper welding cable ran from front battery to ioxus ultra capacitor.
I had to explain all of this to get a correct answer. My question is will a lithium bank such as this or another quality lithium bank make it possible to run my system without upgrading my alternator? I'm at the point now that i need to find a way to increase power.
Thanks man
Yes and No. first you would want a bigger bank than this. I’d say at minimum a 64ah headway bank. That would let you cheat the system a little bit depending on how much power you’d like to run. That being said at a certain amperage draw point you’d need to upgrade your alternator to keep up. So the answer boils down to how much power you want to run. 5k is attainable and reasonable with the upgrades you have already and a lithium bank, but when you start getting into the 8k territory I’d probably suggest a alt upgrade
@HifiVega THANK YOU!!! I really, really appreciate your response my friend. I think my car answered my question for me lol. I want to the store shortly after asking this question and my alternator is crapping out. So. High output it is. I am leaning towards 320amp. I do not plan on going much, if any, bigger than I have now. Maybe another svl-1547 down the road, but just the one does pretty good. I appreciate you my friend. Thank you.
Can you make a video showing how this would be installed in the trunk of your vehicle 🚗
Maybe in the future
Does a person make the headway bank or can you buy it assembled and for how much?? Good video. You know maybe a good video would be comparing different lithium batteries and current price. 🤛🥋🤛
I don’t know of anyone selling prebuilt headway banks, but surely they’re out there.
Can you do a similar comparison with an xs AGM battery instead?
If I buy one to use in my truck in the future probably, but I don’t wanna buy one just for the comparison video.
So I could safely run ???? Watts on a 24ah headway with my factory 150 amp alt paralleled to a 76ah headway (everstart platinum 80ah upfront)
ruclips.net/video/wf_tio5lk80/видео.html
Can u try starting a 4 cyl with that headway for every day use?
That’s a great idea man I def need to try that
What’s your take on running these together with an agm. Some say use an isolator, some say don’t???
As he shows the headway rest a volt higher that's why you need an isolater I'll just take the AGM out altogether do a battery delete.
Can you do this with the blue 10ah cells to make a 20ah bank with main battery or delete the battery completely.. was looking into it cuz lights dims on heavy bass drops! I will appreciate any input from any bass head's
I got a second battery too
The blue cells have a lower c rate (I can’t remember how much lower off the top of my head) the red headways are better for our application even with less AH
@@HifiVegahe is talking about the sandwich or bread slice dimension cells the chinese knock off of the Toshiba cells they are much better 30c constant and 75c burst
@@The505BassHeadget the 10ah scib lto cells big bro
Very nice 👍 I am going to highway lithium
it is said that an agm is much better than a flooded battery , would very much like to see the results .
Can you run a stock battery under the hood and run lithium in the trunk? Heard it's not good to mix and match.
With these cells yes, but it’s all about matching the charging voltages.
@@HifiVega sounds like I need to do some research 🤔
my major concern is the risk of fires
I built myself a 32amp hour lithium headway battery to run my cab 22 with an audison apf8.9 bit for mids and highs. I'm hoping with my stock 150amp alt it will hold good voltage. 😂
howd it go?
I'm already on my third alternator and have a stock 150 as well so curious how yours is doing?
Correct me if I'm wrong but each Headway battery is 8AH (@ 1C) so your battery is 64AH (8x8) and not 16AH.
Each headway cell is 8ah, but when you series them you get more voltage not ah. With that being said I have a 4s2p configuration meaning I have 4 in series to achieve a nominal voltage of 12.8 and 2 banks paralleled giving me the 16ah battery.
@@HifiVega ok, but not "2 banks paralleled" but each cell has a parallel cell which is in series with the other parallel cells. Thanks for the video.
You can't necessarily just plug a lifepo4 battery into a charger and take a capacity reading. The discharge curve is extremely flat and requires tracking of watt hours in and out to know what the capacity is at any given time.
How about Both lol ,that's what I'm going for , looking for the headway for a 3200 watt system
My Headways are set up in a 4s6p 48AH config they tie into both my 52ah agms when the system is on. I figure im pulling around over 3000 watts or more when full tilt even with the priuses 100 amp charging sys my voltage just doesnt drop. I even have a 4 cell pack to start my waverunner🤣👍
You got the sickness lol
I have 2 90ah agm batteries what cells would I need to tie them together?
@@neihausinthethreehaus You can tie as big of a pack of headways you will need to parallel the pack to your agms with a isolation relay
@@edud8452 so I should leave my 2nd agm in place and run an isolator between 8 cells in parallel off of my 2nd agm?
@@neihausinthethreehaus you can do that. Ive got my 2 agms tied together and isolator between them and the headways my isolator is tied into the amp turn on wire so my headways aren't tied in unless the radio is on.
Hey, is a 48ah headway cells enough for 7 to 8000 watt?
Absolutely not. My 40ah headway wont even keep up with a smart5K
Can I use the 16 cell for the primary battery to start my car?
These aren’t great for under the hood and even if you had it installed inside the vehicle I believe I’d want a much bigger bank
I really do not understand about how lithium battery banks cannot be placed inside the engine compartment when the average temperature in the summer in Arizona is around 105 degrees. And when in the vehicle with the Aircondioning going it's well above that,so the location of the battery shouldn't matter in an environment like Texas, Arizona and Southern California.
I meant to say that when the aircondioning is not running the vehicle's interior temp is well above outdoor temp.
Been watching your videos Man y'all are the best, I found u from big D videos... Can I use a small 55ah AGM battery for a cap or second battery im only running a old school MTX 2600
Thanks. You can use a second agm, but I would stay away from capacitors unless they are 200 or more farad
Yeah boi
I also have a mechman 320
Do you need a bms with this setup?
You could add a active balancer or bms, but it’s not 100% required if you check individual cell voltages somewhat regularly
HiFi how can I get in touch with you please let me know Thanks.
Hifivega@gmail.com
I'm not sure I need to get lithium. Im only going to be running 2500 to 5000 watts. I try to be budget friendly.
Would be awesome to see a enhanced flooded battery comparison I recently Ordered agm battery And was given a enhanced flooded battery Seems like they are just as good as AGM
I assume that’s the same as a high rate flooded battery?
Sounds like snake oil 🐍 🛢
wouldnt 13.1 be like 40% remaining for the headway?
Ok so adding this to your stock charging system. Is there an advantage using the AGM over the lithium
If you’re using headway or something with similar charging range you don’t gain much by going agm outside of just pure ah if you’re going to be running the system for super long periods of time
@@HifiVega so no issue hooking up either to a stock charging system??
@@CrazyWillification headway yes LTO and most other lithium no
I think it would be worth it to make a 96V lithium bank to see if it would perform better for a 4 pump hydraulic setup on a car I wonder if it would last as long as 8 group 31 batteries?
Be a good experiment for sure
If you're actually interested in doing this I can help out
The weight diffrence between AGM and cells is a big difffrence..help save a few bucks in gas
Lithum 🔥
I have same agm battery more or less just different brand
Can these be charged at 14.8?
Yea 14.8 is the max charging voltage
Can I install two lithium like this in parallel (to increase capacity), since that'd take about the same amount of space? What'd be the impact on the alternator? I need more juice to power multiple gadgets. Thank you so much in advance!
Yeah you could and adding another 16ah wouldn’t put a huge strain on the stock alt
@@HifiVega how big would the alternator have to be? Thanks for replying!
👍
Any position isn’t true.. most agm tell you not to invert them.. also where discharge rate really comes to play is lower notes.. this isn’t a typical 40hrz type test.. you should run more like a 30..
Even if for comparison this was apples to apples where the headway will really shine is extension of deeper notes.. the lower the nite the harder it will draw and faster it needs the power source to respond.. it makes a huge difference on how low something does or doesn’t get
Ok so where to buy
Battery hook up
You need the correct charger to charge a LiFePO4 Battery right. A standard auto charger won’t charge a LiFePO4 Battery correctly. 🔋
I love your vids, but definitely not how to compare these batteries. I build lithium ion and lifepo4 packs, and definitely know the sla and gels too.
Never meant it to be a fair comparison just a comparison folks are curious about
@@HifiVega fair, but as a guy that has felt the raw power from lithium ion battery bank vs from my alternator, the difference is wow. However the price difference can vary, and how to truly maintain lithium is much more complicated. I don't have the face for youtube, but hope in a later video you can get a better run down of switching to lithium ion or lithium iron phosphate
@@jamesvarner758 more lithium content to come way too much to cover in one video for sure
Do it for 1/2 hour