3:06 Pressing the glyphs on the gate like buttons... now I'm imagining someone having to climb a ladder to push the glyphs near the top of the gate, and then trying to jump out of the way quickly to avoid the kawoosh...
Unfortunately, the Pegasus gates use a Unisymbol design for their symbols. Every symbol on the gate is the same. Just which parts light up varies depending on the glyph entered into whatever dialer is running the gate.
@@tyrannicpuppy Right, it's like the gate has a bunch of small "dot-matrix displays". When a gate is inactive, doesn't each segment still light up with a unique glyph though?
There is also the issue of a number of symbols being buried below ground so you'd not just need a ladder, you'd also need a good shovel and a couple days if your addressed used some of the symbols under the ground
I have no disagreement with the theorized technical reasoning behind the Ancients' design change. Going a bit deeper, I suppose, I think this also starts to betray the later Ancients gradual trend towards overconfidence/hubris/arrogance that led to their eventual defeat at the hands of the Wraith. The simple concept of manual dialing capability has obvious major advantages, yet the Ancients chose to eliminate it. Why? There wasn't any trade-off here. The lack of a mechanical inner ring is easily surmountable (such as a small hidden keypad somewhere on the device itself). In my opinion, this specific change reeks of arrogance, not improvement.
It could also be explained in reverse like this: After the defeat by the wraith the ancients left back to the milky way galaxy. They learned from their mistake of allowing just anyone to make dialers and created the mechanical gates that can have their DHDs removed at any time to render them useless to anyone who doesn’t know how to manually dial.
@@matthew8153 the milkyway gates are 50 million years old. Pegasus gates are 15 million years old, with the ancients only returning to Earth 10,000 years ago.
@@zethcader6478 That assumes the spinning ring mechanism is less robust than the whatever computerized system was required to take over the dialing function. Though tbh I doubt such a thing was even a concern to them. Afaik we've never seen a gate malfunction due to age, let alone fail completely even after the society's ascension. The Ancients probably knew the gates would last as long as they would need them.
@@justinthompson6364 I know this is sci-fi, but a race like the ancients surely see the logic in less mechanical designs. In modern day design the amount of moving parts is ideally 0, but this is not feasible for most applications obviously.
We saw in multiple episodes that the milkyway gates don’t even need to rotate to dial, connect, or establish a wormhole. There was Asgard tech and future human tech that could establish a wormhole in a flash
And Nox that could open a wormhole without a kawoosh from midway which was shocking honestly. Cassandra of future did the same with just a ring on her finger. Asgard too as you noted. Some gates like the opticran and bedrosian episode one lit up one by one without spinning which no gate does. And that’s not how it even works. You enter all symbols and press the red button or equivalent via the computer that then causes the gates with its naquadria in its construction to power up and connect to remote selected gate and open the wormhole which itself is separate from the slower subspace. Basically the concepts are terrific but unscientific people wrote the show and made a nasty mess as they didn’t know crap
@@fr9714 I haven't seen the actual series in a while, but I was told the the off-world Stargate prop was solid, and couldn't spin at all. While I don't know if off-world gates never ever spun (presuming they could have cut in studio prop footage), could that be the reason for your observation?
Kind of similar to how Earth Technology advances. Think of it like how old cars have the manual rotating swivels to move the windows up or down, but modern cars only have buttons to electronically move the windows up and down.
@@Gatetraveller1 please dont lump iphones in the same category as every other smartphone in the market, iphones are exceptionally inferior to samsung both functionally and technologically. to any iphone fanatics in the chat, i'm not sorry. stop inhaling your copium.
@@Gatetraveller1 please dont lump iphones on the same category as every other smartphone in the market, iphones are functionally and technologically inferior to smartphones like samsung. to any iphone fans in chat, i'm not sorry. stop huffing your copium so desperately while smashing your keyboard.
@@Gatetraveller1 and ruins listening to YT videos because bluetooth / etc introduces at least some audio delay. (some videos end up playing three or four words behind on the audio from where the video is, so I can be missing the first few seconds of a video on top of the seconds of a video because for some reason regardless of audio playback, the audio never starts exactly from 0:00 anyway, and I've known the video side to also be at lerast at 0:02 because the streaming has skipped ahead a tiny amount on load)
Could you imagine having a puddle jumper enter a Milkyway Stargate, extend its flight pods, and using them to manually turn the inner ring, by using rotational thrusters. Then retracting the pods and darting off before the wormhole forms.
My theory is that the Pegasus gates works more like a touch screen. You tap it, the glyphs light up, and then you can swipe up down like an inner track but with no effort. They would work like the Milky Way gates and the top chevron would lock the selected glyphs under it. There was also a time in Season 3, Episode: 9, Phantoms where the DHD was destroyed, Rodney brought up that if they could dial it manually but there was no way to power it. So my guess is manual dialling for the Pegasus stargates is possible. But it’s just the means of getting power to light up the gate, and swipe that touch glyph inner track.
@@Gatetraveller1 I know there are books out there. I’ve seen them at our local bookstore. But that was a while ago, back when the show was in itself golden years, before it was canceled.
I always imagined that the Ancient like the Nox, Asgard and even Ori priors don’t actually physically need to input to the DHD. They had a personal Dialing until they began ascending. The DHD was probably just a fall back interface. Even the Gou’ald seem to have some kind of portable dial device as not seen in children of the Gods but seen in Continuum.
Yeah, although the personal diallers were used by those with a great understanding of how gates work - the gate network is fundamentally a public network. Removing the manual dial feature is stupid, although understandable given how the Lanteans intended on using the Pegasus Network
@@terranempire2 sure, but what happens if/when the DHD is damaged? In the Milkyway, you manually dial. In Pegasus, you’re screwed. It’s best to have the option rather than assuming travellers have brought a back up themselves.
@@Gatetraveller1 You still need a power supply to operate the gate manually. The Early tests used generators or even the engine of a car to jumpstart the gate, SG1 used a lightning bolt, some kind of bio electric plants, We can assume the original scout team used the batteries of their MALP or a portable generator. As such the manual dial isn’t entirely manual. Unless you are magneto from the X men you need to charge the electromagnets in the gate. Even then this assumption is based on the idea that the gate symbols aren’t able to be operated by hand.
@@terranempire2 yeah I know a Stargate needs power, but they can be operated by hand, that’s the point of wanting to keep manual dialling an option as a Gate will need power regardless if a DHD is present or not. Taking the inner track away serves no purpose other than to eliminate a possible escape method. So if you have no technology with you that’s capable of running a dialling software, that makes the power source completely useless. You’d be sitting there thinking ‘why didn’t they add that inner track again’
one possible reason why the milky way gates have the ability to manually dial is that it was needed in older versions of the stargate system . what we see in the show is the stargate in its refined form, there had to be a time where the system had reliability issues. the fact that the stargate has the ability to temporally store enough energy to dial back? its a feature due to early dhds being more unreliable .
I personally headcanon that there were another two entire generations of stargate. Amelius's first design was basically what Orlin built in Carter's basement. Extremely basic prototype just to prove the concept and run initial tests. Then another generation between that and the Destiny era gates, which were entirely remote operated. And also cannot be manually dialled despite their rotating design. Then we get the Milky Way design with that feature built in as a backup. Sometime during their time in Milky Way the Ancients invented the DHD and thus made manual dialling usually unecessary. So when they moved to Pegasus, they did away with it all together.
It seems possible that the pegasus gates could in theory dial faster since they don't have to physically spin a giant metal ring, limited more by the person dialing, while milky way gates didn't matter how fast you dialed, the ring could only go back and forth so fast. I'm also wondering if the physical spin would be an issue for the space gates due to inertia in zero gravity.
I was under the impression that the spinning metal ring isn't even explicitly _required_ on Milky Way gates, either. Offworld gates where they dial via DHD don't spin even though they can, the chevrons light up as fast as the operator is able to push the buttons. The spinning ring is a _secondary_ input device... and with the SGC's lack of DHD, their _only_ input device by having rollers(?) push and pull the inner ring. I remember it being a plot point a few times that offworld travellers could dial Earth faster than Earth could dial out, simply because pushing buttons was faster than having to move the ring... and a later "dialing computer upgrade" made it a bit faster just by _speeding up the roller motors,_ but still slower than a DHD.
Making the gates plug and play so any one advanced enough to use is a pretty good idea due to having at the time no hostile threats to speak of. But then the Wraith evolved to what we saw on the show and the Asgardians being very busy trying to survive their own misfortune. I do see however not being able to manually dial as a bad move as it removes another way to lock a gate from being dialed by another gate.
Now I'm starting to think that Loki was on to something. Sorry your comment kind of derailed what I'm currently thinking. We know that the Asgard were dying because they have cloned themselves a billion times throughout their history, but they also have stored their minds within a program in order to download or upload into a new body, they could have survived as another species, they wouldn't necessarily be Asgard anymore, but they could have continued on within another body of another species. Now what Loki's mistake was, is he neglected to erasing the mind of the person he was cloning, and that's what he should have done, because I believe they would have been able to transfer an asgard's mind into a human body. Why he decided to choose o'neill, is beyond me, but apparently he's been doing this for decades on Earth. We don't know why Loki chose to do this with Earthlings and not do it on some other planet, but I do have my theories, that the earthlings brains are capable of holding an asgards mind with little to no issue, perhaps he knows something we didn't know at the time, and my theory is that he knew that the earthlings are direct descendants of the altaren who were not only the most advanced race in the galaxy, but they were also the smartest to a certain degree. I mean they were arrogant, and arrogance can make you overconfident.
Maybe the "upgrade" is more of a manufacturing improvement that makes mass production easier. The ancients seemed much less concerned about where they put up gates in Pegasus, literally building seed ships to spread them, so simplifying the design for easier production seems reasonable.
A year late to the party but here's my input. Another thing is that not /every/ "upgrade" always keeps all the functionality of what came before. I've seen this countless times in my life where they "upgrade" an OS or piece of software or even hardware and drop features that used to be there because they just don't see it as used that often so they either don't bother with it or replace it with something else that might actually be worse depending on what you need it to do. It actually seems somewhat common sometimes that the new version of something is actually a step down in some ways.
I honestly wonder what the hand-held devices from SGU would do if they were brought to the Milky Way or Pegasus. Would they be able to dial the gate nearby? And since they show all the gates that the present gate can connect to, would it show all the gates in the galaxy?
I don’t think they would work at all. Gate connections between different versions of stargates make sense, as all the opposite (different network) gates have to do it catch the wormhole i.e the wormhole is the same between the networks. The SGU diallers are only designed for Destiny gates, and were made well before the Milkyway by a few million years or so (could be less but still before). So if you brought the dialler to a Milkyway gate, my guess is nothing would happen as it hasn’t been formatted to work with those gates. Kind of like trying to connect an original Nokia to a Bluetooth speaker.
@@Gatetraveller1 the Pegasus gates AND Pegasus DHDs did work in the Milky Way... on the other hand, we never saw it the other way around. But from that i assume there is some backwards compatibility. Especially if they built the Milky Way gates with Destiny's gate in mind (having 9 chevrons and all that)
@@Domihork that’s what I’m getting at. You can easily connect a piece of technology no an older model by default (as they would include the backwards compatibly when building it) but you cannot include forward compatibility. Another good example is that PS3’s cannot play PS5 games, but PS3 games can be played on a PS5.
I like to think the inner ring spin was a relic of an older style of gate - perhaps from a time when all gates needed to be dialled this way. That would explain why the gates have the symbols so prominently featured when for most people dialling, they'll never move. Perhaps years later, this technology was improved and became much more straightforward - but the spinning wheel remained as a back up, just one that didn't get used very often. It stands to reason that by the time the Pegasus gates were developed, manual dialling seemed so old fashioned and unlikely that it wasn't incorporated.
I’m not sure, as the Beta Stargate (found in Antarctica) had a DHD and Stargate with an inner track that was dated at 50 million years old. The DHD still functions normally on the beta gate. If it was an older design, then when Sam was trying to dial home, the gate should have been spinning. So since that gate is the first we know off and by far the oldest one discovered, gates are presumably designed with two ways of dialling from the beginning.
why would you need to dial a stargate this way? the ring and symbols and locks are just an interface (that incidently looks cool and that's exactly the reason the writers chose it); and obviously a civilisation capable of making such a device would not need a mechanical interface like a rotary phone as they already had advanced computers.
@@Gatetraveller1 There's nothing to say the Ancients didn't upgrade or replace the old gates. Besides which, the SGU Destiny gates all spin. So in a sense, going from entirely spinning, to mostly spinning, to only spinning as a back up, to not spinning at all, is pretty much what we're told by the series.
@@LabradorIndependent yeah it’s possible that they replaced the gates, but what for? The amount of effort it would take to replace potentially millions of gates is just too much to justify speeding up the dialling process by a handful of seconds. The way I see it is this: SGU: whole gate spins SG1: crystal based interfacing introduced + inner track spins for back up dialling of DHD is unavailable SGA: moving parts removed entirely + added easier interfacing with alien technology
We don't have physical numeric keypads on our smartphones now. Someone from 50 years ago might think that seems foolish, but at a certain point things become redundant and unnecessary.
@@Gatetraveller1 lol! True enough. However when the ancients designed the Pegasus Stargate they probably didn't imagine civilizations as primitive as us using them. They would have lived in a Time when FTL ships, and FTL communication was commonplace. Probably even the least educated ancient could easily rig up a DHD if necessary.
Yeah that's pretty much what I was thinking. Puddle Jumpers have built-in DHD's so once the Ancients started building them, there was no need to manually dial. Most Ancients would be travelling by jumper, and if for some reason they went on foot and were stranded because of damaged DHD then Atlantis could send a jumper to get them when they didn't return as planned. Also worth mentioning is that the Asgard, Nox, and Goa'uld all had the ability to dial a gate without using the DHD. The Goa'uld probably worked out their dialing device in the same way as the Tauri, while the Asgard and Nox most likely were given the technology by the Ancients themselves during the time of the great alliance. I think the handheld device Thor used (white egg-shaped stone) even dialed the Asgard galaxy at one point, so it must have an extra power source built in. I'm not sure about the Nox though... they apparently can dial a gate with a wave of the hand (no device visible), but it kind of makes sense for them because a lot of their abilities (like turning stuff invisible) seem to have a mental component.
The non DHD dials in the Milkyway are impressive when you consider how difficult it is to adapt technology to those style of gates. It’s only really our human built devices that struggle with portable connectivity.
The Gou’ald are shown twice to dial within DHD, Children of the Gods when Apophis leaves the soon to be SGC and Continuum when Baal leaves the Hercules in the 1930s and later when Teal’c dials out on the Gate from a Russia under bombardment. How Apophis does it isn’t seen but Baal and Teal’c use a device they affix to the gate and punch in the address. This may be a sort of Gou’ald “Laptop dial”. Now this is my own head canon but I always imagined that the Gates had a remote dial option in all their forms. In particular I look at the Chevrons. I imagine that the reason they open and close is they are some form or solenoid. That activating that solenoid is the key. I figure perhaps if a laser was pulsed at the right frequency and modulation at the portion of the chevron crystals (the bits that light up on the chevron not the locking mechanism) they would respond. Activating the gate. Perhaps this laser system could even be added to a MALP or ATV vehicle allowing a probe to call home or a team to operate like we see in the cancelled SG:I.
@@Gatetraveller1 Considering the Earth dialing system is basically just automated manual dialing. When using a DHD the ring doesn't spin at all. The adresses are directly inputed to the gate and locked in which means the gas has that capability. Its just that the Earth deves havn't figured out how to just tell the gate which address markers to lock in. Course it was mentioned that the gate also outputs a great deal of information which gets ignored by the Earth system. What suprises me is that once they reach the point in the show where they are able to start altering the DHD programming, why the aren't able to then write an export protocol to have thier computer direct dial the gate which would be a lot faster than manual dial (even when done with automation).
@@Krahazik to directly input glyphs into the gate, you need to run the dialling program off of crystals. Which is something earth isn’t the best at, especially at the level of wormhole trajectory. Otherwise you have to use the less advanced sliding chevron spinning track input method, which is designed for other technology to be adapted to the gate.
I've always had the impression that manually dialing was never an actually intended feature. Just because its possible to dial manually doesn't mean it was ever an actual consideration or anything more than an unintended consequence of its mechanical nature. If it was actually designed intentionally I think it would be a lot more user friendly to do so. While it was a public network, I think it was designed with their own personal use case in mind. Which getting stranded and having to dial manually isnt a scenario the ancients would personally anticipate or plan for. So ultimately I don't think manually dialing was a feature left out of the pegasus gate designs, as it was never a feature to begin with. More of a somewhat fortunate accident the milky-way gates could dial manually . Since if it was a fully thought out feature, there would likely be more redundancies built into the gate itself for the event the dhd was lost.
That's an interesting idea, that the Peg-Gates are "plug and play," but they're also a reversal towards what the Destiny gates were shown to be like. It creates the question of why the first and third (known) iterations of the Stargate were limited, but the Milky Way gates were able to be manually dialed
I think with enough effort and people, you could manually dial a Destiny gate. Any gate that has moving parts can theoretically be manually dialled, it’s just that we’ve only seen it done on Milkyway gates.
I’m hoping that if we ever get some sort of new show, we get to see someone manually spin the Destiny gates. That will probably never happen, but would be cool to see
I think this is one of those tech developments that works but also becomes obsolete quickly. The destiny gate doesn't have it because it is the first, the idea wasn't really considered cause it was absolutely new. However the Milky way gates get them because the technology is heavily refined very quickly. It';s entirely possible that while the milky way are considered 'phase 2' this may be possibly ignoring a slew of updated one off gates, like, phase 1.2, 1.3, 1.5, 1.7, a bunch of quickly built improved gates that where designed but never put into serious production because the tech was rapidly innovating. This also means there might be a series of gate designs that would be phase 2.1, 2.2. 2.4, ect. that saw the evolution into the Phase 3 Pegasus gates. So why did the Manual dial become obsolete? It seems super useful. Well there are 2 theories, one being that the need for it became unneeded as ancient technology became wide spread and highly developed. It's possible that the phase 2 gates had it incase a DHD bugged out or became damaged, however with the phase 3 gates, i don't think we ever see a pegasus DHD damaged so they may be more durable, similarly puddle jumpers which where likely common place had built in DHDs and it's Very likely that other forms of DHD that could be carried around might of been fairly common place for those ancients who moved around a lot, much like how the asgaurd and Nox who had technology comparable had ways of dialing out. Additionally the milky way gates where bound to break down faster, moving parts, no matter how durable, no matter how well built, wear themselves out faster over time. Sure, that seems to be millions of years due to how durable the gates are, but it still would wear out, which might of been a cause for concern for the ancients due to the fact they where a very long and patient species given they eventually reached ascension as a race through natural evolution. The second theory is that Manual dialing might of been an accident. It may of been that the gate's ability to be manually dialed was 100% unintentional, a byproduct of it's aesthetics. Given that teh phase 1 gate rotates it's entire being around which can take awhile to dial out, the phase 2 gate only rotates it's inner ring which is a bit faster and of course the pegasus gate can dial out even faster sense it doesn't rotate anything and just powers up quickly. Thus it's entirely possible that the manual dialing ability wasn't even a planned feature Similarly we know puddle jumpers can dial out on milkyway gates meaning that the ancients could of used any number of other DHDs other then the ones that where assigned to the gates. So in essence, the manual dialing if it was intentional would of seemed like a logical technological leap but would of eventually become obsolete as the technology advanced and reached it's reasonable platue, or the ability to manually dial was entirely accidental.
It's possible that the Ancients added that feature after they first got to the Milky Way as a back up to answer problems they found during the Wraith War.
@@chrisdufresne9359 oldest gate in the network (Beta gate in Antarctica) had an inner track and was 50 million years old. Ancients arrived back on Earth 10,000 years ago
In the sgu comic the acients engeneers said they were competing with the techonoly design of atlantis, and that city ships were still in testing stages while destiny was proveen to be very robust.
I always figured the lack of manual dialing capability in the Pegasus stargates was a security feature, from before the Wraith built their own remote dialing devices, to try to limit the spread of the Wraith across the Pegasus galaxy. I imagine before that, the Ancients just used the Milky Way gate design with the Pegasus glyphs, or maybe some sort of in-between version that had features of both the Milky Way and Pegasus gates.
I’ve seen this idea before, but I’m always iffy about it. Just because of the amount of effort it would take to locate, remove, discard, and install the new gates would be
Something that really annoyed me about the Atlantis / Universe stargates is that they're partially in the ground, but the wormhole doesn't cut into the ground, but at the same time, things just get sliced off by the wormhole when it disconnects, or by the "swoosh".
I’ve always assumed that object (such as the ground) that are within the ring of the stargate when the event horizon forms, are kind of ignored by the dematerialisation. So only things that are placed into the gate (like Kawalsky’s head) are sliced off when it shuts down and the floor isn’t because it was never inside the buffer.
@@Gatetraveller1 We know when it's fully buried it doesn't activate at all and when there a space all around it digs out quite a huge hole so I guess the gates must just be designed for that.
It would've been interesting if the Stargate writers took the time to think about the common use cases in more detail. Like, "Should there be emergency controls on a Stargate for Ancients to use?", "How would Ancients debug a Stargate?", "How would Ancients repair a Stargate?" Although, a side problem there is "How would the Ancients defend against hacking of their Tech by un-authorized users?" The Ancient Gene is a very weak filter for who can use the Tech.
my only issue with stargates in the shows is how the VFX lot screwed up with them when it was a CG gate. MW gates have 39 symbols. This means that, when one symbol is lined up with the 'top' chevron, there are also two other symbols lining up with two chevrons - the one commonly considered chevron 3, and chevron 4 ( clockwise from the top with the top as '7' because Point of Origin, they go 7, 1, 2, 3, 8, 9, 4, 5, 6). Atlantis gates however have 36, which is a multiple of 9 so all 9 chevrons should in fact line up with one quarter of the total symbols. (36/4=9). The errors come from that, well, *9* chevrons. 360 / 9 : 40 so one every forty degrees. But sometimes they either haven't had the extra unused pair of chevrons on a space-gate in the way of still forty degrees between the 4-5, 5-6, 6-7, 7-1, 1-2, 2-3... but the 3-6 gap is 120 degrees). Or they have, EIGHT chevrons, equally spaced. aka... *45* degrees. putting chevron 2 and 5 at the middle point on the 'sides', rather than somewhat higher. Also, MW Gates have been shown with 36 symbols, just as the pictures pegasus space-gate in the picture having 39. I also vaguely recall that the "back" of the gates sometimes get modelled identical to the fronts, even though they're not.
Maybe the Pegasus gates have touch sensitive manual dialling. You can rotate the symbols by touch and drag like a modern smartphone, so long as there is power to the gate, or it has enough residual charge from a recent incoming wormhole.
A milky way laptop dialer could work with a long disconnected gate but it would have to have a recent, in astronomical terms, database of stellar drift for any destinations. See early SG-1 where they had to spend quite a while calculating stellar drift when they only had access to the Abydos cartouche. Also it's kind of a weird thing for the ancients to do if you think of it why have a location based system at all if you're just going to invalidate it like that? Also if that's the case the SGC shouldn't have been able to account for stellar drift from the Abydos cartouche since those addresses would be based on the positions when the gate system was first built not when the Goa'uld or Abydonions built that cartouche.
Personally I always imagined if they had to dial out that the stars on the Pegasus gate would just be touchpads and all they would need is an address and a power supply
Pressing the squares like buttons? That’s kind of dangerous, mainly because of the kawoosh. As in unstable vortex created when the gate turns on. So what I mean is, when it comes to pressing the top square under the top chevron, that would mean you would literally have be on top of it, or have to jump down before the Stargate kawooshes.
I think it's possible they did have a manual method. Possibly one where you simply touch the constellations in order. Even with Puddle Jumpers and other such technologies, a gate system traveler should always has to have a plan B.
Hmm...small logic problem with the possibility of the Pegasus gates' symbols being pressable buttons. There are what, maybe up to six symbols buried in the ground (or a floor) for most of them? How're ya gonna press _those?_ And the others are space gates, so...not exactly accessible, either. Odds are better there's some small panel on the side with a miniature DHD interface for emergency use, or something. Then again, given how often someone's popped them open to access the control crystals...you'd think someone would've found that by now.
good video but whats if the gate knows if its a spacegate an thus cant have an dhd on site but if its an planetary gat ans has no dhd simply wond alow an incoming travler with out say an special comand to tell the gate to exept the travler for lets say instaling an dhd just an random idea
This is like how Apple removed headphone jacks from their phones. Did they have to remove such a handy feature? No, but it made the phones kinda look cooler. I bet the real reason was so the Ancients could go around to all the worlds they put the old gates on and sell them their new Wireless DHDpods.
Great video! I'm rewatching Stargate Atlantis and I was wondering about this actually after John Shepard was sorry for shooting everyone. (Episode 9 season 3, phantoms.) The one Stargate Atlantis problem I've always had was with Trinity season 2 episode 6. The one where McKay blows up 5/6 of a solar system. While definitely not a viable power source, there's still military potential to destroying an entire star system. So why not weaponize it? I already have a name for this devastating weapon to use on enemies such as replicators. The McKataclysm...
The McKataclysm. Iconic name. To answer seriously though - it was too difficult to reproduce as they never really knew how to build such a device. They only found it.
@@Gatetraveller1 Well, the *real* reason is the writers didn't consider it at the time, or they didn't want to have the tau'ri overpowered. It'd make problems such as super-gates, replicator planets, and wraith fleets trivial aside for circumventing collateral damage, such as frying nearby solar systems. But, it would make for a interesting show promises: The SGA team steps out of a Stargate to a inhabited world and has to explain to them that a wraith threat headed for them has been neutralized one tenth of a light-year away. They have 36 days to evacuate the entire world before the supernova-like shockwave gets to them. Sprinkle in a touch of interplanetary politics, religious zelots going on about them being messengers of the end-times, and McKay looking humiliated everytime Shepherd brings up the most devastating weapon ever devised, which is named after him. 🤔 Man, I should turn that into a fanfiction...
It’s possible manual dialing is how the stargates were originally designed to function and the stationary DHDs were upgraded after the invention of the Pegasus gates with the ability to fast dial without turning the inner ring. We see in the show that the stargate on earth sometimes spins with incoming wormholes, I like to think this was a form of caller ID that only still functions if the off-world gate dialed slowly or had enough time after the coordinates were put into the DHD before the enter key (the big red button) is pressed.
I think they always functioned the same, as the Beta Stargate (found in Antarctica) had a DHD and Stargate with an inner track that was dated at 50 million years old. The DHD still functions normally on the beta gate. If it was an older design, then when Sam was trying to dial home, the gate should have been spinning. Instead, it locks in the glyphs instantly. Which is what a DHDs main purpose is. So since that gate is the first we know off and by far the oldest one discovered, gates are presumably designed with two ways of dialling from the beginning.
@@Gatetraveller1 Like I said, the DHDs could have gotten an update, and who’s to say that update wouldn’t also be how the regular location updates started?
@@matthew8153 sure, but rapid glyph input via a DHD is hardware based, not software. Which is why earth cannot rapid dial a Stargate. It requires crystal protocols that would have been in place since the networks creation.
I think the earth Stargate spinning with incoming wormholes is just an error. Either from reusing previous footage to save money, or by simply having someone on the production crew forget how it's actually supposed to work.
The original stargate wasn't nearing any "end of functional life" at 50 million years of age, no, it was eventually recovered and relocated to the Stargate Command, and as far as we know, it is still the main active stargate used by the SGC and IOA. However, it was not actually able to be dialled manually without an accompanied power-supply that would supply power in order to establish an outgoing wormhole, well, actually even just to lock in each cheveron it needed power. Lastly, the stargates was meant to be utilized by the ancients, the makers of the stargates, they made the gates for their own usage, as such they would likely always have back-ups and solutions to any problem where the gate on the other end lacked power or any other such, probably, the target stargate would communicate back to the dialed gate with information such as "is there a power supply connected?" "Is the DHD in working order" and so forth (through sub-space), lastly if the DHD was damaged for example, likely would it be that the ancients had hand-held devices that they could use to dial the gate as long as it had power)
My thinking: The Destiny Stargates required handheld control pads as a security feature to prevent hostiles accessing the system. The Milky Way Stargates were relatively user friendly because the Ancients pacified their new galaxy and built the Network as a mass public transport system. (They also re-established diplomatic relations with the Ori Galaxy at some point, requiring them to build massive drone weapons on the key planets Terra Atlantus and Teonas Proclarush as a precautionary measure). The Pegasus Galaxy Stargate Network was intended to support several hundred human colonies that the Ancients intended to shepherd towards becoming the Fifth Race of the Great Alliance. Space gates were intended as a security feature to protect key sites from casual human intrusions.
short answer is the set designers thought the new version looked cooler and in the era when atlantis was produced using a small portable computer for everything seemed more natural. still love how over the years they tried to explain the workings of everything; something the writers of the first movie probably never thought about. (like you can only go one way I think, and from the place you dial; but this rule is broken in the very first episode of the sg1 show).
The one way rule is never broken - I have a video on the subject. The video is an in universe explanation. It’s a given that the reason something is done within fiction is because of the writers/show crew. That’s not a fun answer, so I go for the in universe explanations :)
@@Gatetraveller1 of course I'm sorry; but it's also interesting to understand how the context influences the work; and how sometimes they work backward and find justifications later
@@JW-452 edit: ok I watched it back and I'm mistaken. the gate is closed then reopened. Still begs the question how since they don't seem to leave the room but that's a minor thing.
the idea of the Ancients about the Stargate Network was never to be just to be a method of interstellar or intergalactic travel though it was more symbolic than anything else, connecting the Galaxy thru roadways and reaching a hand out in peace, some differences might have no practical reason at all and are just because different Aesthetics of the Time Periods, a Puddle Jumper DHD can be used on Milkiway gates after all, that the Ancients decided on the (visually) more analog Dialing in the Milkiway could a lucky coincidence.
Don't know if it could be considered to be a goof but for all the milky way gates when there's an incoming wormhole, all the 7 chevrons should light up at the same time
That is a classic error in stargate. At first it was a ‘goof’ of the incoming gate becoming encoded alongside the dialling gate, but was later explained to simply be the incoming signal. We do see all 7 chevrons lighting up simultaneously in the 2nd Russian stargate water world episode. So my way of explaining it is that the incoming signal (long version or short version) depends on unknown gate connection variables.
Here's another thought: We know that when they update, the gates dial each other. Why is it that no race has ever re-discovered their stargate as a result of this? One for the amazon prime series perhaps?
For all we know thhat could have happened before in either galaxy, albeit it’s much more likely to have happened in the Milkyway Network. I’d love to see something like that if the new show gets made.
It feels also like part of their trend ... away from and abandoning ...the embodied, from the tangible...from the physical and mechanical...This eliminating such an obviously ‘carnal’ and ‘muscular idea,’ such as ‘manual dialing." A movement on their part towards that which is thoroughly sapient and purely mental--that finally culminates in them leaving their bodies behind ...by Ascension.
Probably better if it had more dialing computer components integrated into the gate itself, it probably prevents more primitive users from having to "jailbreak" the gate like the Tau'ri did, bypassing a lot of safety features along the way.
The SGC don’t use motors to turn the inner track. If they did you would see them on the face of the gate. The Macgyvered Dialling Computer interfaces with the gates systems, causing it to spin. Why would it take them 15 years to install software to spin an Earth set of motors? Manual dialling isn’t really meant to be used frequently as you could damage the inner track. You can hear it scraping and resisting movement when Vala and Cam do it off world. It’s spinning in the SGC is too smooth to be motor driven. If the dialling computer did not act as a replacement DHD, then the stargate would be running off of steller updates from before the Alpha Gate was buried, making dialling to anywhere but Abydos and Heliopolis impossible.
@@Gatetraveller1 The resistance to stellar updates is why it was the only gate _not_ affected by Baals modification of Avenger 2. Also, why does the inner ring spin during dailing, if they replaced the DHD completely?
@@christopherg2347 Yes, the Earth Gate was the only one not affected because their dialling system is completely unique to the rest of the galaxy (non crystal based). The gate itself didn’t do anything in that scenario. When they replaced the DHD, they did it to the best of their ability. Earth doesn’t have the technology to properly interface with gates, as that requires crystal based protocols (which they barley understand). The Gate runs off of two main ways of input. 1- Crystal based energy pulses (which directly inputs a chevron symbol without having to spin the inner track) 2- Slow dial symbol inputs (which utilise the less advanced ‘backup’ system of the sliding chevron at the top of the gate, that uses a simpler energy pulse system that can be interfaced with other types of technology given enough understanding of how gates work). The reason for two ways of input is to be better safe than sorry when travelling between planets. It’s better to have two ways to dial home than just one (which they removed on Pegasus Gates and made them much easier to adapt technology to) 3- Manual Dialling (this is the same as 2, but you are forcing the inner track to spin by hand, rather than using interfaced technology)
@@Gatetraveller1 That's a really good analysis. 1- Rotary dialing (#2- "Slow dial") must have been the first method the Ancients used. Destiny gates (all of them, including the ones on planets) have to spin even when using a remote. The Ancients were probably doing a lot of manual dialing early-on, so they just made the gates work that way for convenience. 2- Some time after Destiny was launched, they worked out how to encode chevrons directly (with a DHD) but kept the ability to rotary dial as a backup. 3- After they moved to Pegasus they went fully "digital" since their jumpers had built-in DHD's anyway so manual dialing wasn't important enough to include any more. However the glyphs still "spin" (lighting up on each segment of the inner ring in sequence) when dialing. This was probably just an aesthetic thing?
@@John73John the Pegasus Gate ‘spins’ as it performs the Stellar updates/calculations for wormholes, rather than the DHD. So I think it’s essentially a loading symbol. So the Gate has time to encode each chevron symbol properly.
i think its also more of an economic solution, since having computation crystals inside both the gate and the dhd as seen with the alteran gates were the result of the original stargate not requiring a dhd to begin with, and only received the dhd and software integration update thousands of years after they were first deployed in the milkyway, to a race like the ancients who didnt see the need for redundancy's (a purely human concept) would likely not have wasted valuable resources to replicate the same system with their newer atlantean gates. as we see with the asgardians, being very very smart also makes you kind of stupid since a super genius would never think to make their creation have redundancies in case of failure or unforeseen events.
I dont think manual dial is added on purpose as a feature. Its rather convenience from designe. Like when you have dead battery in a car and you can start engine by pushing it from the hill.
Pegause there is no mechanical ring that you can spin? Also, milky way stargates don't need to spin when you use the dialing device, this was seen on screen many-many times.
What I’m meaning is: why did they design it with no spinning ring. Or even some sort of keypad just in case the DHD broke. Milkyway gates only need to spin when using a third party dialling software. Like in the SGC.
Soooo if the ancients escaped Pegasus to Milky Way why were gates in Milky Way less advanced than Pegasus gates even the gate seeding ship Destiny had more advanced gates
Funny you should end the vid with a shot of Rodney and a lemon. Did you know in sg1 episode of möbius when Rodney meets librarian Carter he says lemon chicken is his favorite… that means he is lying about citrus being lethal.
That’s one of my favourite episodes. I like to think he wasn’t lying about it in the OG timeline, just that thought he had one after a bad experience with citrus based foods and convinced himself he had an allergy lol.
i think reason is much simplier, then intentional make SGA gate intentionaly "non manualy diable" i think is more like our cars, 50 years ago it was just engine, and you could repair it at home. now you need IT guy to repair car baceuse it is ful of compurers. it is just technology advancement
I had thought it to be part update and defense against the wraith. Take away the dhd and with no way to dial out, the enemy would be trapped on the world.
Wraith darts have built-in DHD same as puddle jumpers. So that might work against Wraith ground forces, but they could probably just call a dart to come pick them up.
@@John73John that's the joy of writing any story. Pegasus probably had analog gates, then the wraith happened. Ancients thinking, update to digital and the problem will disappear. The wraith evolved, figured out, stole, etc & figured their work around.
@@kpeeks That's not a realistic plan. You're talking about making a major modification to all the millions of gates in the galaxy, just so they could sometimes trap some Wraith on a planet. Probably what happened is the Ancients had figured out "fully digital" dialing while they were still in the Milky Way (it's basically the same as our DHD's use). But they never removed the rotary dialing mechanism because A) manual dialing is an added safety feature and B) it would take too much effort to modify every gate in the galaxy for no real benefit. Once they had moved to Pegasus, they were building a whole new gate network from scratch. That's the perfect time to implement the most modern technology, and since they had perfected portable dialing devices (like the Puddle Jumper DHD's) they didn't bother with manual dialing.
@@John73John Pegasus already had gen 1 gates via seed ships by the time they arrived, 10 to 5 million years ago. Maybe they started with gen 2 Milky Way gates. We don't know. We know the Wraith were made via Ancient experiments and kept evolving for 900 years, then fought the ancients in full on war for 100 years. Pegasus is solely gen 3 by the end of the war, so safe to assume that was completed before then. They were busy building replicators to fight, which didn't work. For some reason the ancients made gen 3 gates dominate gen 2, but I assume that also applies gen 1 vs 2.
@@kpeeks The Gen 1 gates from the seed ships would have only covered a "corridor" of planets that Destiny was going to fly through, and those all would have been replaced pretty quickly since they have such limited range and are less durable. By the time the Ancients were leaving Earth, they already knew how to make "digital" chevrons (MW gates that don't spin when you use a DHD) AND they had puddle jumpers to dial them remotely so the need for manual dialing was all but eliminated. Why would they build MILLIONS of already obsolete gates?
I've never been able to get the stellar constellation thing. Every planet has a different sky full of stars, so wouldn't each gate be different? Wouldn't each planet need its own unique symbol for the origin point? Or is there one unique symbol for origin with the other 38 symbols the same on all stargates. There's nothing in the show explaining it. It's not a telephone. It all just seems not fully thought out. If every gate has symbols based on constellations from it's planet's own sky, then every gate has 39 unique symbols and that would not make sense. Also, what kind of coordinate system is based on 39 possible axis lines anyway. The more I try to work out something logical, the logic breaks down further. I'm at a loss. Even trying to use models of the universe with more than four dimensions doesn't work. It gives me a headache.
atlantis tech was plug and play because they already knew that humans would come back my guess is weir had a laptop in the jumper with her when she went back in time lol
I love me some stargate but the whole science in it makes zero sense. the show made the change for the pegasus gates just to make it look different and cool.
Manual dial makes no sense honestly. How does the gate know which symbol is chosen now without the dhd? Because if it is just when spinning stops then what if you mistaken stop or does it consider the initial place it was at or what if you don’t stop it aligned etc.? Concept is great but execution and explanation in the show was poor and made no sense at all
Of course. And since TV shows are food for thought, people like to think about them. If you prefer to just watch something and then completely forget about it, go watch Marvell stuff, it's well suited for you.
3:06 Pressing the glyphs on the gate like buttons... now I'm imagining someone having to climb a ladder to push the glyphs near the top of the gate, and then trying to jump out of the way quickly to avoid the kawoosh...
I like to think one of the glyphs have a hidden keyhole or door to show a hidden override keypad on the pegasus gate.
Unfortunately, the Pegasus gates use a Unisymbol design for their symbols. Every symbol on the gate is the same. Just which parts light up varies depending on the glyph entered into whatever dialer is running the gate.
@@tyrannicpuppy Right, it's like the gate has a bunch of small "dot-matrix displays".
When a gate is inactive, doesn't each segment still light up with a unique glyph though?
There is also the issue of a number of symbols being buried below ground so you'd not just need a ladder, you'd also need a good shovel and a couple days if your addressed used some of the symbols under the ground
I have no disagreement with the theorized technical reasoning behind the Ancients' design change. Going a bit deeper, I suppose, I think this also starts to betray the later Ancients gradual trend towards overconfidence/hubris/arrogance that led to their eventual defeat at the hands of the Wraith. The simple concept of manual dialing capability has obvious major advantages, yet the Ancients chose to eliminate it. Why? There wasn't any trade-off here. The lack of a mechanical inner ring is easily surmountable (such as a small hidden keypad somewhere on the device itself). In my opinion, this specific change reeks of arrogance, not improvement.
It could also be explained in reverse like this:
After the defeat by the wraith the ancients left back to the milky way galaxy. They learned from their mistake of allowing just anyone to make dialers and created the mechanical gates that can have their DHDs removed at any time to render them useless to anyone who doesn’t know how to manually dial.
@@matthew8153 the milkyway gates are 50 million years old. Pegasus gates are 15 million years old, with the ancients only returning to Earth 10,000 years ago.
Don't forget simplicity, we know gates last seemingly forever. But a device that has no moving parts is still an improvement.
@@zethcader6478 That assumes the spinning ring mechanism is less robust than the whatever computerized system was required to take over the dialing function.
Though tbh I doubt such a thing was even a concern to them. Afaik we've never seen a gate malfunction due to age, let alone fail completely even after the society's ascension. The Ancients probably knew the gates would last as long as they would need them.
@@justinthompson6364 I know this is sci-fi, but a race like the ancients surely see the logic in less mechanical designs. In modern day design the amount of moving parts is ideally 0, but this is not feasible for most applications obviously.
We saw in multiple episodes that the milkyway gates don’t even need to rotate to dial, connect, or establish a wormhole. There was Asgard tech and future human tech that could establish a wormhole in a flash
And Nox that could open a wormhole without a kawoosh from midway which was shocking honestly.
Cassandra of future did the same with just a ring on her finger.
Asgard too as you noted.
Some gates like the opticran and bedrosian episode one lit up one by one without spinning which no gate does.
And that’s not how it even works. You enter all symbols and press the red button or equivalent via the computer that then causes the gates with its naquadria in its construction to power up and connect to remote selected gate and open the wormhole which itself is separate from the slower subspace.
Basically the concepts are terrific but unscientific people wrote the show and made a nasty mess as they didn’t know crap
@@fr9714 I haven't seen the actual series in a while, but I was told the the off-world Stargate prop was solid, and couldn't spin at all. While I don't know if off-world gates never ever spun (presuming they could have cut in studio prop footage), could that be the reason for your observation?
Subspace vpn
Kind of similar to how Earth Technology advances. Think of it like how old cars have the manual rotating swivels to move the windows up or down, but modern cars only have buttons to electronically move the windows up and down.
Or newer phones removing the headphone jack, even though keeping it would offer more options for listening to music
@@Gatetraveller1 please dont lump iphones in the same category as every other smartphone
in the market, iphones are exceptionally inferior to samsung both functionally and technologically.
to any iphone fanatics in the chat, i'm not sorry. stop inhaling your copium.
@@Gatetraveller1 please dont lump iphones on the same category as every other smartphone in the market, iphones are functionally and technologically
inferior to smartphones like samsung. to any iphone fans in chat, i'm not sorry. stop huffing your copium so desperately while smashing your keyboard.
@@Gatetraveller1 and ruins listening to YT videos because bluetooth / etc introduces at least some audio delay. (some videos end up playing three or four words behind on the audio from where the video is, so I can be missing the first few seconds of a video on top of the seconds of a video because for some reason regardless of audio playback, the audio never starts exactly from 0:00 anyway, and I've known the video side to also be at lerast at 0:02 because the streaming has skipped ahead a tiny amount on load)
Or physical keys to enter the car, and start the ignition…
Who the hell thought a key fob for entry and starting was a good idea?
Could you imagine having a puddle jumper enter a Milkyway Stargate, extend its flight pods, and using them to manually turn the inner ring, by using rotational thrusters. Then retracting the pods and darting off before the wormhole forms.
then again, they having dialing pads in them. Maybe thats why they all have them.
This is a lovely mental image I now have. a puddle jumper manual dialing.
You've made my day!
It's not possible. Inner part is not rotating. Only part where symbols are rotating.
have you ever rubbed your smartphones sides sooo hard, it dialed a number?
same unlikely thing!
@@mho... wut there's no machanism for a smartphone to do that. Unless you have a quick dial assigned to an extra button.
My theory is that the Pegasus gates works more like a touch screen. You tap it, the glyphs light up, and then you can swipe up down like an inner track but with no effort. They would work like the Milky Way gates and the top chevron would lock the selected glyphs under it.
There was also a time in Season 3, Episode: 9, Phantoms where the DHD was destroyed, Rodney brought up that if they could dial it manually but there was no way to power it. So my guess is manual dialling for the Pegasus stargates is possible. But it’s just the means of getting power to light up the gate, and swipe that touch glyph inner track.
I like that idea. Makes more sense than buttons as I didn’t consider the symbols below ground
@@Gatetraveller1 LOL I almost forgot that most of the gates are partially buried.
Would love to have seen them attempt a manual dial in the show. I wonder if it’s shown in a comic or novel?
@@Gatetraveller1 I know there are books out there. I’ve seen them at our local bookstore. But that was a while ago, back when the show was in itself golden years, before it was canceled.
I always imagined that the Ancient like the Nox, Asgard and even Ori priors don’t actually physically need to input to the DHD. They had a personal Dialing until they began ascending. The DHD was probably just a fall back interface. Even the Gou’ald seem to have some kind of portable dial device as not seen in children of the Gods but seen in Continuum.
Yeah, although the personal diallers were used by those with a great understanding of how gates work - the gate network is fundamentally a public network. Removing the manual dial feature is stupid, although understandable given how the Lanteans intended on using the Pegasus Network
@@Gatetraveller1 they did still have a DHD on planets and easily accessible by populations. It’s when the gates were left in orbit when they weren’t.
@@terranempire2 sure, but what happens if/when the DHD is damaged?
In the Milkyway, you manually dial.
In Pegasus, you’re screwed.
It’s best to have the option rather than assuming travellers have brought a back up themselves.
@@Gatetraveller1 You still need a power supply to operate the gate manually. The Early tests used generators or even the engine of a car to jumpstart the gate, SG1 used a lightning bolt, some kind of bio electric plants, We can assume the original scout team used the batteries of their MALP or a portable generator.
As such the manual dial isn’t entirely manual. Unless you are magneto from the X men you need to charge the electromagnets in the gate.
Even then this assumption is based on the idea that the gate symbols aren’t able to be operated by hand.
@@terranempire2 yeah I know a Stargate needs power, but they can be operated by hand, that’s the point of wanting to keep manual dialling an option as a Gate will need power regardless if a DHD is present or not.
Taking the inner track away serves no purpose other than to eliminate a possible escape method. So if you have no technology with you that’s capable of running a dialling software, that makes the power source completely useless. You’d be sitting there thinking ‘why didn’t they add that inner track again’
one possible reason why the milky way gates have the ability to manually dial is that it was needed in older versions of the stargate system . what we see in the show is the stargate in its refined form, there had to be a time where the system had reliability issues.
the fact that the stargate has the ability to temporally store enough energy to dial back? its a feature due to early dhds being more unreliable .
I personally headcanon that there were another two entire generations of stargate. Amelius's first design was basically what Orlin built in Carter's basement. Extremely basic prototype just to prove the concept and run initial tests. Then another generation between that and the Destiny era gates, which were entirely remote operated. And also cannot be manually dialled despite their rotating design. Then we get the Milky Way design with that feature built in as a backup. Sometime during their time in Milky Way the Ancients invented the DHD and thus made manual dialling usually unecessary. So when they moved to Pegasus, they did away with it all together.
It seems possible that the pegasus gates could in theory dial faster since they don't have to physically spin a giant metal ring, limited more by the person dialing, while milky way gates didn't matter how fast you dialed, the ring could only go back and forth so fast. I'm also wondering if the physical spin would be an issue for the space gates due to inertia in zero gravity.
I was under the impression that the spinning metal ring isn't even explicitly _required_ on Milky Way gates, either. Offworld gates where they dial via DHD don't spin even though they can, the chevrons light up as fast as the operator is able to push the buttons. The spinning ring is a _secondary_ input device... and with the SGC's lack of DHD, their _only_ input device by having rollers(?) push and pull the inner ring. I remember it being a plot point a few times that offworld travellers could dial Earth faster than Earth could dial out, simply because pushing buttons was faster than having to move the ring... and a later "dialing computer upgrade" made it a bit faster just by _speeding up the roller motors,_ but still slower than a DHD.
Making the gates plug and play so any one advanced enough to use is a pretty good idea due to having at the time no hostile threats to speak of. But then the Wraith evolved to what we saw on the show and the Asgardians being very busy trying to survive their own misfortune. I do see however not being able to manually dial as a bad move as it removes another way to lock a gate from being dialed by another gate.
Now I'm starting to think that Loki was on to something.
Sorry your comment kind of derailed what I'm currently thinking.
We know that the Asgard were dying because they have cloned themselves a billion times throughout their history, but they also have stored their minds within a program in order to download or upload into a new body, they could have survived as another species, they wouldn't necessarily be Asgard anymore, but they could have continued on within another body of another species.
Now what Loki's mistake was, is he neglected to erasing the mind of the person he was cloning, and that's what he should have done, because I believe they would have been able to transfer an asgard's mind into a human body.
Why he decided to choose o'neill, is beyond me, but apparently he's been doing this for decades on Earth.
We don't know why Loki chose to do this with Earthlings and not do it on some other planet, but I do have my theories, that the earthlings brains are capable of holding an asgards mind with little to no issue, perhaps he knows something we didn't know at the time, and my theory is that he knew that the earthlings are direct descendants of the altaren who were not only the most advanced race in the galaxy, but they were also the smartest to a certain degree.
I mean they were arrogant, and arrogance can make you overconfident.
Maybe the "upgrade" is more of a manufacturing improvement that makes mass production easier. The ancients seemed much less concerned about where they put up gates in Pegasus, literally building seed ships to spread them, so simplifying the design for easier production seems reasonable.
Since you have space gates in Atlantis you can’t have manual dialing. The ancients had puddle jumpers anyway.
A year late to the party but here's my input. Another thing is that not /every/ "upgrade" always keeps all the functionality of what came before. I've seen this countless times in my life where they "upgrade" an OS or piece of software or even hardware and drop features that used to be there because they just don't see it as used that often so they either don't bother with it or replace it with something else that might actually be worse depending on what you need it to do. It actually seems somewhat common sometimes that the new version of something is actually a step down in some ways.
I honestly wonder what the hand-held devices from SGU would do if they were brought to the Milky Way or Pegasus. Would they be able to dial the gate nearby? And since they show all the gates that the present gate can connect to, would it show all the gates in the galaxy?
I don’t think they would work at all. Gate connections between different versions of stargates make sense, as all the opposite (different network) gates have to do it catch the wormhole i.e the wormhole is the same between the networks.
The SGU diallers are only designed for Destiny gates, and were made well before the Milkyway by a few million years or so (could be less but still before). So if you brought the dialler to a Milkyway gate, my guess is nothing would happen as it hasn’t been formatted to work with those gates. Kind of like trying to connect an original Nokia to a Bluetooth speaker.
@@Gatetraveller1 the Pegasus gates AND Pegasus DHDs did work in the Milky Way... on the other hand, we never saw it the other way around. But from that i assume there is some backwards compatibility. Especially if they built the Milky Way gates with Destiny's gate in mind (having 9 chevrons and all that)
@@Domihork that’s what I’m getting at. You can easily connect a piece of technology no an older model by default (as they would include the backwards compatibly when building it) but you cannot include forward compatibility. Another good example is that PS3’s cannot play PS5 games, but PS3 games can be played on a PS5.
@@Domihork When did the Pegasus gates and DHD work in the Milky Way?
@@John73John The series finale (the end of 5th season)
I like to think the inner ring spin was a relic of an older style of gate - perhaps from a time when all gates needed to be dialled this way. That would explain why the gates have the symbols so prominently featured when for most people dialling, they'll never move.
Perhaps years later, this technology was improved and became much more straightforward - but the spinning wheel remained as a back up, just one that didn't get used very often.
It stands to reason that by the time the Pegasus gates were developed, manual dialling seemed so old fashioned and unlikely that it wasn't incorporated.
I’m not sure, as the Beta Stargate (found in Antarctica) had a DHD and Stargate with an inner track that was dated at 50 million years old.
The DHD still functions normally on the beta gate. If it was an older design, then when Sam was trying to dial home, the gate should have been spinning.
So since that gate is the first we know off and by far the oldest one discovered, gates are presumably designed with two ways of dialling from the beginning.
why would you need to dial a stargate this way? the ring and symbols and locks are just an interface (that incidently looks cool and that's exactly the reason the writers chose it); and obviously a civilisation capable of making such a device would not need a mechanical interface like a rotary phone as they already had advanced computers.
@@Gatetraveller1 There's nothing to say the Ancients didn't upgrade or replace the old gates.
Besides which, the SGU Destiny gates all spin. So in a sense, going from entirely spinning, to mostly spinning, to only spinning as a back up, to not spinning at all, is pretty much what we're told by the series.
@@valdir7426 this whole thread is pretty much finding in universe reasons for a cool special effect :D
@@LabradorIndependent yeah it’s possible that they replaced the gates, but what for? The amount of effort it would take to replace potentially millions of gates is just too much to justify speeding up the dialling process by a handful of seconds.
The way I see it is this:
SGU: whole gate spins
SG1: crystal based interfacing introduced + inner track spins for back up dialling of DHD is unavailable
SGA: moving parts removed entirely + added easier interfacing with alien technology
Original stargates are kind of like a rotary phone where the one on Atlantis is an iPhone. Would have been cool if it were “touch screen”. 😂
well explained video...never really thought about this feature in the pegasus galaxy
We don't have physical numeric keypads on our smartphones now. Someone from 50 years ago might think that seems foolish, but at a certain point things become redundant and unnecessary.
I’d say it’s a bit different when dealing with interplanetary travel though. Rather than making a phone call. Always best to have a backup.
@@Gatetraveller1 lol! True enough. However when the ancients designed the Pegasus Stargate they probably didn't imagine civilizations as primitive as us using them. They would have lived in a Time when FTL ships, and FTL communication was commonplace. Probably even the least educated ancient could easily rig up a DHD if necessary.
Or they seem to be redundant and unnecessary
Yeah that's pretty much what I was thinking. Puddle Jumpers have built-in DHD's so once the Ancients started building them, there was no need to manually dial. Most Ancients would be travelling by jumper, and if for some reason they went on foot and were stranded because of damaged DHD then Atlantis could send a jumper to get them when they didn't return as planned.
Also worth mentioning is that the Asgard, Nox, and Goa'uld all had the ability to dial a gate without using the DHD. The Goa'uld probably worked out their dialing device in the same way as the Tauri, while the Asgard and Nox most likely were given the technology by the Ancients themselves during the time of the great alliance. I think the handheld device Thor used (white egg-shaped stone) even dialed the Asgard galaxy at one point, so it must have an extra power source built in. I'm not sure about the Nox though... they apparently can dial a gate with a wave of the hand (no device visible), but it kind of makes sense for them because a lot of their abilities (like turning stuff invisible) seem to have a mental component.
The non DHD dials in the Milkyway are impressive when you consider how difficult it is to adapt technology to those style of gates. It’s only really our human built devices that struggle with portable connectivity.
The Gou’ald are shown twice to dial within DHD, Children of the Gods when Apophis leaves the soon to be SGC and Continuum when Baal leaves the Hercules in the 1930s and later when Teal’c dials out on the Gate from a Russia under bombardment. How Apophis does it isn’t seen but Baal and Teal’c use a device they affix to the gate and punch in the address. This may be a sort of Gou’ald “Laptop dial”.
Now this is my own head canon but I always imagined that the Gates had a remote dial option in all their forms. In particular I look at the Chevrons. I imagine that the reason they open and close is they are some form or solenoid. That activating that solenoid is the key. I figure perhaps if a laser was pulsed at the right frequency and modulation at the portion of the chevron crystals (the bits that light up on the chevron not the locking mechanism) they would respond. Activating the gate. Perhaps this laser system could even be added to a MALP or ATV vehicle allowing a probe to call home or a team to operate like we see in the cancelled SG:I.
@@Gatetraveller1 Considering the Earth dialing system is basically just automated manual dialing. When using a DHD the ring doesn't spin at all. The adresses are directly inputed to the gate and locked in which means the gas has that capability. Its just that the Earth deves havn't figured out how to just tell the gate which address markers to lock in. Course it was mentioned that the gate also outputs a great deal of information which gets ignored by the Earth system.
What suprises me is that once they reach the point in the show where they are able to start altering the DHD programming, why the aren't able to then write an export protocol to have thier computer direct dial the gate which would be a lot faster than manual dial (even when done with automation).
@@Krahazik to directly input glyphs into the gate, you need to run the dialling program off of crystals. Which is something earth isn’t the best at, especially at the level of wormhole trajectory.
Otherwise you have to use the less advanced sliding chevron spinning track input method, which is designed for other technology to be adapted to the gate.
I've always had the impression that manually dialing was never an actually intended feature. Just because its possible to dial manually doesn't mean it was ever an actual consideration or anything more than an unintended consequence of its mechanical nature. If it was actually designed intentionally I think it would be a lot more user friendly to do so. While it was a public network, I think it was designed with their own personal use case in mind. Which getting stranded and having to dial manually isnt a scenario the ancients would personally anticipate or plan for.
So ultimately I don't think manually dialing was a feature left out of the pegasus gate designs, as it was never a feature to begin with. More of a somewhat fortunate accident the milky-way gates could dial manually . Since if it was a fully thought out feature, there would likely be more redundancies built into the gate itself for the event the dhd was lost.
I doubt this because, well, in standard function the inner ring never actually spins. It only does so whenever being used to dial without a DHD
theoretically, a handheld remote dialler could do the trick, we have seen it done before in the episode 1969 with future casandra
That's an interesting idea, that the Peg-Gates are "plug and play," but they're also a reversal towards what the Destiny gates were shown to be like. It creates the question of why the first and third (known) iterations of the Stargate were limited, but the Milky Way gates were able to be manually dialed
I think with enough effort and people, you could manually dial a Destiny gate. Any gate that has moving parts can theoretically be manually dialled, it’s just that we’ve only seen it done on Milkyway gates.
I’m hoping that if we ever get some sort of new show, we get to see someone manually spin the Destiny gates. That will probably never happen, but would be cool to see
I think this is one of those tech developments that works but also becomes obsolete quickly. The destiny gate doesn't have it because it is the first, the idea wasn't really considered cause it was absolutely new.
However the Milky way gates get them because the technology is heavily refined very quickly. It';s entirely possible that while the milky way are considered 'phase 2' this may be possibly ignoring a slew of updated one off gates, like, phase 1.2, 1.3, 1.5, 1.7, a bunch of quickly built improved gates that where designed but never put into serious production because the tech was rapidly innovating. This also means there might be a series of gate designs that would be phase 2.1, 2.2. 2.4, ect. that saw the evolution into the Phase 3 Pegasus gates.
So why did the Manual dial become obsolete? It seems super useful. Well there are 2 theories, one being that the need for it became unneeded as ancient technology became wide spread and highly developed. It's possible that the phase 2 gates had it incase a DHD bugged out or became damaged, however with the phase 3 gates, i don't think we ever see a pegasus DHD damaged so they may be more durable, similarly puddle jumpers which where likely common place had built in DHDs and it's Very likely that other forms of DHD that could be carried around might of been fairly common place for those ancients who moved around a lot, much like how the asgaurd and Nox who had technology comparable had ways of dialing out. Additionally the milky way gates where bound to break down faster, moving parts, no matter how durable, no matter how well built, wear themselves out faster over time. Sure, that seems to be millions of years due to how durable the gates are, but it still would wear out, which might of been a cause for concern for the ancients due to the fact they where a very long and patient species given they eventually reached ascension as a race through natural evolution.
The second theory is that Manual dialing might of been an accident. It may of been that the gate's ability to be manually dialed was 100% unintentional, a byproduct of it's aesthetics. Given that teh phase 1 gate rotates it's entire being around which can take awhile to dial out, the phase 2 gate only rotates it's inner ring which is a bit faster and of course the pegasus gate can dial out even faster sense it doesn't rotate anything and just powers up quickly. Thus it's entirely possible that the manual dialing ability wasn't even a planned feature Similarly we know puddle jumpers can dial out on milkyway gates meaning that the ancients could of used any number of other DHDs other then the ones that where assigned to the gates.
So in essence, the manual dialing if it was intentional would of seemed like a logical technological leap but would of eventually become obsolete as the technology advanced and reached it's reasonable platue, or the ability to manually dial was entirely accidental.
It's possible that the Ancients added that feature after they first got to the Milky Way as a back up to answer problems they found during the Wraith War.
@@chrisdufresne9359 oldest gate in the network (Beta gate in Antarctica) had an inner track and was 50 million years old. Ancients arrived back on Earth 10,000 years ago
If you walk through the tail drift of a Stephen Lee fart it’s like a warm wormhole
In the sgu comic the acients engeneers said they were competing with the techonoly design of atlantis, and that city ships were still in testing stages while destiny was proveen to be very robust.
‘Handy feature.’ Good word term for a concept/phrase like ‘MANUAL dialing,’ which means ‘dialing BY hand.’
I always figured the lack of manual dialing capability in the Pegasus stargates was a security feature, from before the Wraith built their own remote dialing devices, to try to limit the spread of the Wraith across the Pegasus galaxy. I imagine before that, the Ancients just used the Milky Way gate design with the Pegasus glyphs, or maybe some sort of in-between version that had features of both the Milky Way and Pegasus gates.
I’ve seen this idea before, but I’m always iffy about it. Just because of the amount of effort it would take to locate, remove, discard, and install the new gates would be
Something that really annoyed me about the Atlantis / Universe stargates is that they're partially in the ground, but the wormhole doesn't cut into the ground, but at the same time, things just get sliced off by the wormhole when it disconnects, or by the "swoosh".
I’ve always assumed that object (such as the ground) that are within the ring of the stargate when the event horizon forms, are kind of ignored by the dematerialisation.
So only things that are placed into the gate (like Kawalsky’s head) are sliced off when it shuts down and the floor isn’t because it was never inside the buffer.
The ramp of the earth gate is like that as well.
@@Gatetraveller1 We know when it's fully buried it doesn't activate at all and when there a space all around it digs out quite a huge hole so I guess the gates must just be designed for that.
It would've been interesting if the Stargate writers took the time to think about the common use cases in more detail.
Like, "Should there be emergency controls on a Stargate for Ancients to use?", "How would Ancients debug a Stargate?", "How would Ancients repair a Stargate?"
Although, a side problem there is "How would the Ancients defend against hacking of their Tech by un-authorized users?"
The Ancient Gene is a very weak filter for who can use the Tech.
my only issue with stargates in the shows is how the VFX lot screwed up with them when it was a CG gate.
MW gates have 39 symbols. This means that, when one symbol is lined up with the 'top' chevron, there are also two other symbols lining up with two chevrons - the one commonly considered chevron 3, and chevron 4 ( clockwise from the top with the top as '7' because Point of Origin, they go 7, 1, 2, 3, 8, 9, 4, 5, 6).
Atlantis gates however have 36, which is a multiple of 9 so all 9 chevrons should in fact line up with one quarter of the total symbols. (36/4=9).
The errors come from that, well, *9* chevrons. 360 / 9 : 40 so one every forty degrees. But sometimes they either haven't had the extra unused pair of chevrons on a space-gate in the way of still forty degrees between the 4-5, 5-6, 6-7, 7-1, 1-2, 2-3... but the 3-6 gap is 120 degrees). Or they have, EIGHT chevrons, equally spaced. aka... *45* degrees. putting chevron 2 and 5 at the middle point on the 'sides', rather than somewhat higher.
Also, MW Gates have been shown with 36 symbols, just as the pictures pegasus space-gate in the picture having 39.
I also vaguely recall that the "back" of the gates sometimes get modelled identical to the fronts, even though they're not.
Maybe the Pegasus gates have touch sensitive manual dialling. You can rotate the symbols by touch and drag like a modern smartphone, so long as there is power to the gate, or it has enough residual charge from a recent incoming wormhole.
I like that. Could be possible, wished they’d show if you can manual dial or not.
that would be pretty funny - nobody in SGA has bothered to "swipe" the side of the gate
A milky way laptop dialer could work with a long disconnected gate but it would have to have a recent, in astronomical terms, database of stellar drift for any destinations. See early SG-1 where they had to spend quite a while calculating stellar drift when they only had access to the Abydos cartouche. Also it's kind of a weird thing for the ancients to do if you think of it why have a location based system at all if you're just going to invalidate it like that? Also if that's the case the SGC shouldn't have been able to account for stellar drift from the Abydos cartouche since those addresses would be based on the positions when the gate system was first built not when the Goa'uld or Abydonions built that cartouche.
Personally I always imagined if they had to dial out that the stars on the Pegasus gate would just be touchpads and all they would need is an address and a power supply
Realistically the ancient would probably have had a system for it on the life sign detector or some kind of device
Pressing the squares like buttons? That’s kind of dangerous, mainly because of the kawoosh. As in unstable vortex created when the gate turns on.
So what I mean is, when it comes to pressing the top square under the top chevron, that would mean you would literally have be on top of it, or have to jump down before the Stargate kawooshes.
You have to do that when manually dialing as well, because you have to press the top chevron on the PoO to activate the gate.
@@jimskywaker4345 no I think you would have to swipe it.
Ya know, I could’a sworn there was at least one episode of SGA in which a character mentioned that they could just dial manually if needed. 🤔
it was in sgc not sga
I think it's possible they did have a manual method. Possibly one where you simply touch the constellations in order. Even with Puddle Jumpers and other such technologies, a gate system traveler should always has to have a plan B.
…the good stuff! Thanks, man :)
Hmm...small logic problem with the possibility of the Pegasus gates' symbols being pressable buttons. There are what, maybe up to six symbols buried in the ground (or a floor) for most of them? How're ya gonna press _those?_ And the others are space gates, so...not exactly accessible, either. Odds are better there's some small panel on the side with a miniature DHD interface for emergency use, or something. Then again, given how often someone's popped them open to access the control crystals...you'd think someone would've found that by now.
good video but whats if the gate knows if its a spacegate an thus cant have an dhd on site but if its an planetary gat ans has no dhd simply wond alow an incoming travler with out say an special comand to tell the gate to exept the travler for lets say instaling an dhd just an random idea
This is like how Apple removed headphone jacks from their phones. Did they have to remove such a handy feature? No, but it made the phones kinda look cooler. I bet the real reason was so the Ancients could go around to all the worlds they put the old gates on and sell them their new Wireless DHDpods.
Great video! I'm rewatching Stargate Atlantis and I was wondering about this actually after John Shepard was sorry for shooting everyone. (Episode 9 season 3, phantoms.)
The one Stargate Atlantis problem I've always had was with Trinity season 2 episode 6. The one where McKay blows up 5/6 of a solar system.
While definitely not a viable power source, there's still military potential to destroying an entire star system.
So why not weaponize it? I already have a name for this devastating weapon to use on enemies such as replicators. The McKataclysm...
The McKataclysm. Iconic name.
To answer seriously though - it was too difficult to reproduce as they never really knew how to build such a device. They only found it.
@@Gatetraveller1
Well, the *real* reason is the writers didn't consider it at the time, or they didn't want to have the tau'ri overpowered. It'd make problems such as super-gates, replicator planets, and wraith fleets trivial aside for circumventing collateral damage, such as frying nearby solar systems.
But, it would make for a interesting show promises:
The SGA team steps out of a Stargate to a inhabited world and has to explain to them that a wraith threat headed for them has been neutralized one tenth of a light-year away. They have 36 days to evacuate the entire world before the supernova-like shockwave gets to them.
Sprinkle in a touch of interplanetary politics, religious zelots going on about them being messengers of the end-times, and McKay looking humiliated everytime Shepherd brings up the most devastating weapon ever devised, which is named after him.
🤔
Man, I should turn that into a fanfiction...
Wasn't manual dialing mentioned as a possible option in a few episodes of Atlantis?
Yes, but we never seen it on screen. It’s also possible they were referring to a laptop dial.
It’s possible manual dialing is how the stargates were originally designed to function and the stationary DHDs were upgraded after the invention of the Pegasus gates with the ability to fast dial without turning the inner ring. We see in the show that the stargate on earth sometimes spins with incoming wormholes, I like to think this was a form of caller ID that only still functions if the off-world gate dialed slowly or had enough time after the coordinates were put into the DHD before the enter key (the big red button) is pressed.
I think they always functioned the same, as the Beta Stargate (found in Antarctica) had a DHD and Stargate with an inner track that was dated at 50 million years old.
The DHD still functions normally on the beta gate. If it was an older design, then when Sam was trying to dial home, the gate should have been spinning. Instead, it locks in the glyphs instantly. Which is what a DHDs main purpose is.
So since that gate is the first we know off and by far the oldest one discovered, gates are presumably designed with two ways of dialling from the beginning.
Also, it would be a monumental task to locate and alter each and every Stargate in the milkyway.
@@Gatetraveller1
Like I said, the DHDs could have gotten an update, and who’s to say that update wouldn’t also be how the regular location updates started?
@@matthew8153 sure, but rapid glyph input via a DHD is hardware based, not software. Which is why earth cannot rapid dial a Stargate. It requires crystal protocols that would have been in place since the networks creation.
I think the earth Stargate spinning with incoming wormholes is just an error. Either from reusing previous footage to save money, or by simply having someone on the production crew forget how it's actually supposed to work.
The original stargate wasn't nearing any "end of functional life" at 50 million years of age, no, it was eventually recovered and relocated to the Stargate Command, and as far as we know, it is still the main active stargate used by the SGC and IOA. However, it was not actually able to be dialled manually without an accompanied power-supply that would supply power in order to establish an outgoing wormhole, well, actually even just to lock in each cheveron it needed power. Lastly, the stargates was meant to be utilized by the ancients, the makers of the stargates, they made the gates for their own usage, as such they would likely always have back-ups and solutions to any problem where the gate on the other end lacked power or any other such, probably, the target stargate would communicate back to the dialed gate with information such as "is there a power supply connected?" "Is the DHD in working order" and so forth (through sub-space), lastly if the DHD was damaged for example, likely would it be that the ancients had hand-held devices that they could use to dial the gate as long as it had power)
My thinking:
The Destiny Stargates required handheld control pads as a security feature to prevent hostiles accessing the system.
The Milky Way Stargates were relatively user friendly because the Ancients pacified their new galaxy and built the Network as a mass public transport system. (They also re-established diplomatic relations with the Ori Galaxy at some point, requiring them to build massive drone weapons on the key planets Terra Atlantus and Teonas Proclarush as a precautionary measure).
The Pegasus Galaxy Stargate Network was intended to support several hundred human colonies that the Ancients intended to shepherd towards becoming the Fifth Race of the Great Alliance. Space gates were intended as a security feature to protect key sites from casual human intrusions.
short answer is the set designers thought the new version looked cooler and in the era when atlantis was produced using a small portable computer for everything seemed more natural. still love how over the years they tried to explain the workings of everything; something the writers of the first movie probably never thought about. (like you can only go one way I think, and from the place you dial; but this rule is broken in the very first episode of the sg1 show).
The one way rule is never broken - I have a video on the subject.
The video is an in universe explanation. It’s a given that the reason something is done within fiction is because of the writers/show crew. That’s not a fun answer, so I go for the in universe explanations :)
In what way was the one way rule broken. I don't remember anything like that from the 1st
@@Gatetraveller1 of course I'm sorry; but it's also interesting to understand how the context influences the work; and how sometimes they work backward and find justifications later
@@valdir7426 that’s a great point. I often think about that as well, but for my channel I tend to ignore it for the sake of the video
@@JW-452 edit: ok I watched it back and I'm mistaken. the gate is closed then reopened. Still begs the question how since they don't seem to leave the room but that's a minor thing.
the idea of the Ancients about the Stargate Network was never to be just to be a method of interstellar or intergalactic travel though it was more symbolic than anything else, connecting the Galaxy thru roadways and reaching a hand out in peace, some differences might have no practical reason at all and are just because different Aesthetics of the Time Periods, a Puddle Jumper DHD can be used on Milkiway gates after all, that the Ancients decided on the (visually) more analog Dialing in the Milkiway could a lucky coincidence.
think puddlejumper dhd could be used on all 3 gates. but unfortunate the puddle jumper is to big for the destiny gates to go thru
Don't know if it could be considered to be a goof but for all the milky way gates when there's an incoming wormhole, all the 7 chevrons should light up at the same time
That is a classic error in stargate. At first it was a ‘goof’ of the incoming gate becoming encoded alongside the dialling gate, but was later explained to simply be the incoming signal.
We do see all 7 chevrons lighting up simultaneously in the 2nd Russian stargate water world episode. So my way of explaining it is that the incoming signal (long version or short version) depends on unknown gate connection variables.
You think the Stargates would have controls directly on them. Preferably on the side.
Here's another thought: We know that when they update, the gates dial each other. Why is it that no race has ever re-discovered their stargate as a result of this? One for the amazon prime series perhaps?
For all we know thhat could have happened before in either galaxy, albeit it’s much more likely to have happened in the Milkyway Network.
I’d love to see something like that if the new show gets made.
It feels also like part of their trend ... away from and abandoning ...the embodied, from the tangible...from the physical and mechanical...This eliminating such an obviously ‘carnal’ and ‘muscular idea,’ such as ‘manual dialing." A movement on their part towards that which is thoroughly sapient and purely mental--that finally culminates in them leaving their bodies behind ...by Ascension.
No ‘elbow-grease’ for disembodied spirits! 😂
Probably better if it had more dialing computer components integrated into the gate itself, it probably prevents more primitive users from having to "jailbreak" the gate like the Tau'ri did, bypassing a lot of safety features along the way.
Simple answer, the Ancients decided to change over from analog to digital. Though I think the physical ring will always be superior to light up gates.
The SGC did not figure out how to replace a DHD.
They just put in motors for convenient manual dailing.
The SGC don’t use motors to turn the inner track. If they did you would see them on the face of the gate. The Macgyvered Dialling Computer interfaces with the gates systems, causing it to spin. Why would it take them 15 years to install software to spin an Earth set of motors?
Manual dialling isn’t really meant to be used frequently as you could damage the inner track. You can hear it scraping and resisting movement when Vala and Cam do it off world. It’s spinning in the SGC is too smooth to be motor driven.
If the dialling computer did not act as a replacement DHD, then the stargate would be running off of steller updates from before the Alpha Gate was buried, making dialling to anywhere but Abydos and Heliopolis impossible.
@@Gatetraveller1 The resistance to stellar updates is why it was the only gate _not_ affected by Baals modification of Avenger 2.
Also, why does the inner ring spin during dailing, if they replaced the DHD completely?
@@christopherg2347 Yes, the Earth Gate was the only one not affected because their dialling system is completely unique to the rest of the galaxy (non crystal based). The gate itself didn’t do anything in that scenario.
When they replaced the DHD, they did it to the best of their ability. Earth doesn’t have the technology to properly interface with gates, as that requires crystal based protocols (which they barley understand).
The Gate runs off of two main ways of input.
1- Crystal based energy pulses (which directly inputs a chevron symbol without having to spin the inner track)
2- Slow dial symbol inputs (which utilise the less advanced ‘backup’ system of the sliding chevron at the top of the gate, that uses a simpler energy pulse system that can be interfaced with other types of technology given enough understanding of how gates work).
The reason for two ways of input is to be better safe than sorry when travelling between planets. It’s better to have two ways to dial home than just one (which they removed on Pegasus Gates and made them much easier to adapt technology to)
3- Manual Dialling (this is the same as 2, but you are forcing the inner track to spin by hand, rather than using interfaced technology)
@@Gatetraveller1 That's a really good analysis.
1- Rotary dialing (#2- "Slow dial") must have been the first method the Ancients used. Destiny gates (all of them, including the ones on planets) have to spin even when using a remote. The Ancients were probably doing a lot of manual dialing early-on, so they just made the gates work that way for convenience.
2- Some time after Destiny was launched, they worked out how to encode chevrons directly (with a DHD) but kept the ability to rotary dial as a backup.
3- After they moved to Pegasus they went fully "digital" since their jumpers had built-in DHD's anyway so manual dialing wasn't important enough to include any more. However the glyphs still "spin" (lighting up on each segment of the inner ring in sequence) when dialing. This was probably just an aesthetic thing?
@@John73John the Pegasus Gate ‘spins’ as it performs the Stellar updates/calculations for wormholes, rather than the DHD.
So I think it’s essentially a loading symbol. So the Gate has time to encode each chevron symbol properly.
You mention the laptops, but a modern laptop is more powerful then multiple supercomputers from the time when the gate first had a dialing computer.
i think its also more of an economic solution, since having computation crystals inside both the gate and the dhd as seen with the alteran gates were the result of the original stargate not requiring a dhd to begin with, and only received the dhd and software integration update thousands of years after they were first deployed in the milkyway, to a race like the ancients who didnt see the need for redundancy's (a purely human concept) would likely not have wasted valuable resources to replicate the same system with their newer atlantean gates. as we see with the asgardians, being very very smart also makes you kind of stupid since a super genius would never think to make their creation have redundancies in case of failure or unforeseen events.
I dont think manual dial is added on purpose as a feature. Its rather convenience from designe. Like when you have dead battery in a car and you can start engine by pushing it from the hill.
Sure, but the inner track is still the ‘backup’ method of dialling, which was removed on the type 3 gates.
@@Gatetraveller1 of course its useful but Ancients are so advanced they probably dont find it useful enough.
Pegause there is no mechanical ring that you can spin? Also, milky way stargates don't need to spin when you use the dialing device, this was seen on screen many-many times.
What I’m meaning is: why did they design it with no spinning ring. Or even some sort of keypad just in case the DHD broke.
Milkyway gates only need to spin when using a third party dialling software. Like in the SGC.
Soooo if the ancients escaped Pegasus to Milky Way why were gates in Milky Way less advanced than Pegasus gates even the gate seeding ship Destiny had more advanced gates
It's a rotary phone vs a push-button phone.
You explain the various Alien Species like the Nox or Unas etc & the most intelligent civilizations in the galaxy.
Thought that's kind of an easy one. The Pegasus gate is digital, not analog.
It's an Apple style update when they actually remove features in new models.
The Ancient equivalent of the headphone jack
☎️ Just dial "0" for the Operator......📞👂🏻
《 Long distance rates may apply 💸》
🌌🔭
I choose to believe Pegasus stargate have touch screen esk buttons because-its funny
Funny you should end the vid with a shot of Rodney and a lemon. Did you know in sg1 episode of möbius when Rodney meets librarian Carter he says lemon chicken is his favorite… that means he is lying about citrus being lethal.
That’s one of my favourite episodes. I like to think he wasn’t lying about it in the OG timeline, just that thought he had one after a bad experience with citrus based foods and convinced himself he had an allergy lol.
i think reason is much simplier, then intentional make SGA gate intentionaly "non manualy diable"
i think is more like our cars, 50 years ago it was just engine, and you could repair it at home. now you need IT guy to repair car baceuse it is ful of compurers. it is just technology advancement
I had thought it to be part update and defense against the wraith. Take away the dhd and with no way to dial out, the enemy would be trapped on the world.
Wraith darts have built-in DHD same as puddle jumpers. So that might work against Wraith ground forces, but they could probably just call a dart to come pick them up.
@@John73John that's the joy of writing any story. Pegasus probably had analog gates, then the wraith happened. Ancients thinking, update to digital and the problem will disappear. The wraith evolved, figured out, stole, etc & figured their work around.
@@kpeeks That's not a realistic plan. You're talking about making a major modification to all the millions of gates in the galaxy, just so they could sometimes trap some Wraith on a planet.
Probably what happened is the Ancients had figured out "fully digital" dialing while they were still in the Milky Way (it's basically the same as our DHD's use). But they never removed the rotary dialing mechanism because A) manual dialing is an added safety feature and B) it would take too much effort to modify every gate in the galaxy for no real benefit.
Once they had moved to Pegasus, they were building a whole new gate network from scratch. That's the perfect time to implement the most modern technology, and since they had perfected portable dialing devices (like the Puddle Jumper DHD's) they didn't bother with manual dialing.
@@John73John Pegasus already had gen 1 gates via seed ships by the time they arrived, 10 to 5 million years ago. Maybe they started with gen 2 Milky Way gates. We don't know. We know the Wraith were made via Ancient experiments and kept evolving for 900 years, then fought the ancients in full on war for 100 years. Pegasus is solely gen 3 by the end of the war, so safe to assume that was completed before then. They were busy building replicators to fight, which didn't work.
For some reason the ancients made gen 3 gates dominate gen 2, but I assume that also applies gen 1 vs 2.
@@kpeeks The Gen 1 gates from the seed ships would have only covered a "corridor" of planets that Destiny was going to fly through, and those all would have been replaced pretty quickly since they have such limited range and are less durable.
By the time the Ancients were leaving Earth, they already knew how to make "digital" chevrons (MW gates that don't spin when you use a DHD) AND they had puddle jumpers to dial them remotely so the need for manual dialing was all but eliminated. Why would they build MILLIONS of already obsolete gates?
I've never been able to get the stellar constellation thing. Every planet has a different sky full of stars, so wouldn't each gate be different? Wouldn't each planet need its own unique symbol for the origin point? Or is there one unique symbol for origin with the other 38 symbols the same on all stargates. There's nothing in the show explaining it. It's not a telephone. It all just seems not fully thought out. If every gate has symbols based on constellations from it's planet's own sky, then every gate has 39 unique symbols and that would not make sense. Also, what kind of coordinate system is based on 39 possible axis lines anyway. The more I try to work out something logical, the logic breaks down further. I'm at a loss. Even trying to use models of the universe with more than four dimensions doesn't work. It gives me a headache.
atlantis tech was plug and play because they already knew that humans would come back my guess is weir had a laptop in the jumper with her when she went back in time lol
The gates were seeded long before alternate Dr Weir showed up. So I don’t think that’s the reason I’m my opinion
Weir literally met the ancients when they were leaving the pegasus galaxy.
I love me some stargate but the whole science in it makes zero sense. the show made the change for the pegasus gates just to make it look different and cool.
Manual dial makes no sense honestly. How does the gate know which symbol is chosen now without the dhd? Because if it is just when spinning stops then what if you mistaken stop or does it consider the initial place it was at or what if you don’t stop it aligned etc.? Concept is great but execution and explanation in the show was poor and made no sense at all
its the top mark on each gate that locks in the symbol.. and i think they had to wait 5 sec or something for it to lock the symbol in
Milky Way gates are analog and Pegasus Gates are Digital.
starting to think that stargate fandom skews scottish 🏴
rip og becket
easy answered....
have you ever tried to dial a digital phone, manually?!, its just not how that works!
The Gates were designed by Apple 🍎
...its not metric...its anperial
?
@@Gatetraveller1 metric, imperial, "ancient-imperial..." try hard joke
Because it's a friggin TV show. None of this is real. People understand that, right? 🤔
Of course. And since TV shows are food for thought, people like to think about them. If you prefer to just watch something and then completely forget about it, go watch Marvell stuff, it's well suited for you.