"Not doing a chance of a devastating hit on your target." I read a study of over 1500 defensive shooting situations and the only criterion was caliber and result. In 30% of defensive shootings involving a 22 the subject hit...DIED. Never think the 22 isn't a fatal round. But in 100% of the remaining cases, where the subject struck remained mobile...he ran away. NO ONE hung around to be shot twice. Your singular goal as a civilian is to stop an attack. Hit your attacker ONCE with a 22. Mission accomplished.I carry the Ruger SR22.
I disagree on the most part with this video. I've shot MANY rounds of 22, 9mm, 40, and 45 in numerous pistols. Many of thousands in 22. My take on this is, if the gun functions well or if it didn't, was corrected, I can't say I had any more issues with the 22 than all the other rounds. If any pistol I had couldn't be corrected, I got rid of it. I do agree that certain brands of 22 are rather dirty. For that ammo I clean the gun when I get home and even at that, it's rather quick. It's even hard for me to remember jams in my 22 semi auto pistols. What I may get in a few of them every once in a blue moon is a failure to fire because the primer edge just didn't ignite but it would on the 2nd attempt a huge majority of the time. For self defense I have NO issue carrying a 22lr or 22 mag and have been for many years. That being said, I don't carry any round that does not go at least 10" in calibrated jell. This has been looked at in detail as far as the statistics go, and it was concluded.... "So, in short, what’s the answer? Is a .22 a good self defense round? According to the numbers, it looks to be among the best in terms of stopping the threat. Add in the fact that it’s lightweight, low recoil and uses firearms that are ridiculously easy to conceal and you can see where a .22 caliber firearm for concealed carry might be a winner."
@@2fast2block I agree. I have used nothing but CCI for several years and I can honestly say I have never had a failure with an LCP II, a Ruger SR 22 and even a Phoenix 22.
@@deere3321 you got blessed with your LCP II. I don't have one but review after review has complaints about that pistol. If they were not so bad, I'd own one.
@@2fast2block I have the the LCP II .22Lr. and have had almost flawless performance and when i had a problem it was the ammo. Mine is very picky it only likes Aguila 38gr HP.
for those who have never been shot with a 22lr I suggest you don't get shot. As a former Deputy US Marshal [ Air ] I was hit in my left shoulder from 30ft. from a suspect who had a Baratta model 70, Mossad .22 LRS. 40-years later I'm still carrying that bullet, it couldn't be removed because it was to close to a major artery. It's not the caliber but the marksmanship, He definitely knew where to shut me to take me out of the game. The problem I have with all this caliber stuff is the people who are the ballistic experts who have never been shot with any caliber bullet to know anything about damage. With all due respect, ballistics gels and targets don't shoot back.
sorry that happend to you. Super facts. Smaller Caliber rounds tend to not exit thus causing alot of trouble from lodging and or (tumble)swimming. Lots of guys i served with rather be shot up close than further away. entrance exit. with so much heat literal cauterize wound. but further away .. tumbles bounces off bones and exits away from the entrance. some nasty stuff .
Your doctor hasnt been shot either and he gave his opinion im sure. A one out of 3 odds of being effective is not good the police college would tell u that. By now u would have sent your assailant a nice lawsuit if he could pay it which is great for u but not great for the carrier of .22. Im glad u survived it goes without saying u were lucky it was a .22
in my past police career...i saw lots of people getting killed by 22 and 32 caliber handguns. Actually many more than from 9mm and 45 caliber. I even got to see a subject get opened up in the ER to try and find 3... 22 bullets... inside the man to stop the bleeding. Where the rounds entered and finally stopped was very different path....it was not straight and tore up incredible amounts of tissue! I was a believer after that! I carry SR 22 with velocitor rounds! 5-8 hits at 10 yards in the torso in a few seconds is how I train with it.
@@LiveToTrainInc not hard to figure out what I meant. He basically said that a .22 is a useless ineffective round. He supposedly works in a firearm environment and saying that he should know better. No one argues a .22 is not a first choice for self defense but I guarantee if he ever had one shot at him he wouldn’t be saying they’re ineffective.
@@CHEECHMUN I just read a study on silver tip and they break into three pieces upon entry?? That's good because it causes three wound paths! Thank you for the recommendation Sir
I put one .22 LR in the belly from a Ruger Standard Automatic Pistol of an attacker and he STOPPED, spun around and out the front door he went. It's the incredible pain caused by the bullet. We both survived.
I personally think you miss the point of carrying a firearm! The vast majority of encounters with thugs and robbers are assuming that you are defenseless. They think they have all the advantages. They do if you don’t carry and know how to use a weapon. If you have a situation where can you can put a 22 caliber on target and hit what you are shooting at, the whole dynamic changes. 99 out of 100 no longer are interested in doing you harm. They want to get away from you as bad as you from them. I’m 75 years old with reasonably good strength yet. I went and bought a 22 eight shot snub nose revolver for training purposes. I also bought a 38 S&W snub nose to carry. As my self training went on, I found out how much I enjoyed shooting that 22 revolver. I shoot it two or three times a week. I have gotten fairly proficient with both the 22 and to a lesser degree with the 38. The 22 weighs 16 oz., the 38 weighs 2 lb. I am convinced that the 22 with Federal punch is a better choice for me because I can and will carry it all the time! I won’t carry that 38 because I can feel it in my pocket all the time. It will turn into a burden and in time it will remain at home. You down played the federal punch because it didn’t have as big a wound channel as the hand cannon that you were comparing it with. I maintain that if you drive a pin thru a torso from front to back, you will change the behavior of your intended assailant. I am not saying that it is the best choice for everyone but it clearly has a place as a carry weapon for some folks!
I understand everyone’s opinion on the 22lr, but no one wants to get shot by anything and I’ve actually witnessed individuals being shot and killed by this round, it’s no joke
I understand that a 22lr round is only about the size of an average phillips screwdriver. However.. . A cci mini mag travels out of a 5 inch barrel at over 1000 fps, that's 700 mph. Imagine being stabbed in the chest or abdomen with a 8-12 inch screwdriver traveling at 700mph 1,2,3 or maybe 10-15 times
Plus cci mini mags are well documented to tumble aggressively into organic targets making a much larger permanent wound cavity. I definitely wouldn't want to be on the other side of a .22lr especially that particular one (minimag) or any segmenting .22lr rounds like the silver tips.
I grew up on a farm in the 70's. There were lots of wilds around us and my brother and I spent thousands of hours scouring the woods and fields with .22s. We had a Ruger Single Six and Mark 1, Browning 22 auto rifle and a couple of Remington auto rifles. There was not anything those .22s could not bring down or hit within 100 yards. For such a tiny little round, it is capable of soooooooo much.
The 22 short was a self defense pistol at one time. The gun writers used to tell me my 9mm BHP was only good for squirrels.My have times changed. The reality is that a 22 pistol is a great utilitarian firearm. It can do a lot of things. It may be the most useful pistol there is. But, obviously, other calibers are certainly better at somethings. I think the 32 ACP is a much better option for those that are sensitive to recoil, if “self defense “ “whatever that means” is more of a priority. It also has no recoil, and comes in very light pistols. The 25ACP is a less powerful option then the 32, but I like it. Both are also center fire which of course adds to reliability, but high quality 22 ammo has come a very long way. We shot 300 rounds a few days ago, not a single problem with the Punch, Velocitor, or Stingers. I carry my little pistols when working around the farm, hiking, and just knocking around. I use them for snakes, raccoons, and other predators trying to get my animals, etc. without sounding like a cannon. If you get swarmed by 20 ninjas with AKs you are toast no matter what pistol you have. Most people don’t want to be shot. They don’t usually wait around to see what caliber is putting extra holes in their bodies. Thanks for the video.
To be honest if your not afraid to be shot by it. I’m not carrying it. Was a EMT for a number of years and when I was treating GSW victims they were not screaming out “what caliber was it!?” It was “I was shot!”
My wife could not shoot my 9mm without dropping it. So, I bought a Bersa 380. She didn't drop it, but was still shy about firing more than one round at a time. So, I bought her a Ruger LCP2 in .22LR. Now she can mag dump 10 rounds inside a 6 inch circle, from 35 feet, without closing one eye. If that circle is your head, you will never get to tell your side of the story. I have killed coyote with one shot from a single action revolver in .22LR. There is no reason that the right .22LR round out of the right gun, cannot stop a 350 lb thug in his tracks. Nobody keeps fighting with a 40 grain chunk of hot lead in their brain.
The Bersa, while light-ish, is NOT pleasant to shoot. I switched from carrying it to a Keltek P17. Lighter weight even with laser and I can put more shots on target faster. I am much more confident in myself with the Keltek P17 with CCI stingers than with the Bersa 380. And like someone else said 99 percent of the time if a bad guy gets hit once, or even has booolots whizzing past, the bad guy starts running.
Here is where I ask my standard question based on my experience. How many homicide’s have you worked where the .22LR was the weapon used , handgun and rifle ? How many autopsies have you attended after the fact, and evidence collected ? Yes, the .22LR kills, most with one shot. Is it the best caliber for LE or Military application ? The answer is no. As a civilian, your goal is situational awareness so that you may avoid the need to use your concealed weapon altogether. However, if you are confronted with such a life or death circumstance, your goal is to use such weapon to break contact and escape the situation asap. Just something to consider.
Pretty sure Federal punch in 22lr wasn't designed to mushroom or expand at all. I think the idea behind it was penetration over anything else. In my opinion, those punch 22lr's aren't among the better choices. I wouldn't discount 22lr completely. Def wouldn't underestimate it by claiming it would just "overwhelm" an attacker, or as some folks like to say, "It'll just make em mad". It always makes me chuckle when I hear guys say something like "22lr is basically a pellet gun." 😔... 22lr is not a pellet gun. It is a soft lead, 36-40gr projectile, traveling around variations of different, yet very capable velocities, depending on the weapon & cartridge choice. 22lr is definitely capable of killing. ER doctors & surgeons will testify as to how effective it can be. Is it ALWAYS as effective as it's center fire counterparts? No. But CAN it be as effective? YES, absolutely! If you look into the percentage of incapacitating shots by handgun caliber & fatal shots by handgun caliber, you'll see many conflicting reports. The main commonality being that the majority percentage of homicides, fatalities & single incapacitating shots, usually shows 22lr at the top of most lists. And although the availability of guns chambered for 22 & cheap ammunition play a role, it only lends credence to the fact that the cartridge is clearly capable of lethal performance. You have to remember that FBI standards in ballistics gel are only demonstrative of ONE type of test, under ONE type of controlled scenario, attempting to replicate ONE set of repeatable circumstances, of which are only measuring ONE particular means of achieving lethality or incapacitation. In other words, the FBI tests only cover a small portion of the many ways in which a person could hypothetically die from a gunshot wound. A poorly placed 9 is much less effective than an accurately placed 22. If you're objective is to break contact & stop the threat, then yeah, it can be done with the 22. If you're objective is to drop a charging bear, then 22's prob a poor choice. Personal preference should favor the situation. If you live in a high risk area, carry accordingly to your risk. In the end, I'm a firm believer in shot placement & training. Access your risk & use the gun & cartridge that you can best operate for your circumstances, it's better than nothing. If that happens to be a 22lr pistol then train & focus hard on shot placement. If a 22 is the only thing you currently have access to or is all you can afford at the moment (whether that be the cost or availability of the gun or ammunition), then find an ammunition that's reliable in your gun & go train with it. (This of course should be done regardless of your choice btwn centerfire or rimfire). When you get more comfortable, confident & capable, then move up when you're ready & can afford to. Ppl who "poo poo" the 22 are usually the ones who have had limited life experiences with it. When you've grown up with it, put meat in the freezer with it & seen it, lived it, witnessed years of it's capabilities... then you already know & I don't have to explain it. Great video though, thanks. Always appreciate the discussion & thoughts of others.
I humbly thank you for viewing the video and taking the time to respond with such a well thought out post. I totally appreciate your point of view and enjoyed reading your thoughts. Thanks again and be safe.
A .22LR gut shot with a .22LR Federal punch just to the right of the belly button will put it through the left kidney. Take if from me, big guys who take a serious hit to the gut are not going to "just get mad." Of course 95% of the "big guys" are smaller than me at 6'3" and 200 pounds, but the ones bigger than me are not immune to pain. My experience with pain is limited to being hit by a car at 40mph and having my infected gallbladder die on me. I feel certain a 17" deep gut wound would take a lot of fight out of me. Of course, I have not battled zombies on crack like you all. In my day we just dealt with guys on "horse tranquilizers..."
Agreed, in the unlikely event you even have to use a gun, the agressor will retreat 99% of the time once you start shooting back, regardless of caliber.
@2A-Mel The way I see it, In court, it's easy for me to say I didn't want to harm them if I'm using a 22lr. The weakest of almost all calibers. I carry it to deter people. I can dump that whole mag in under 2 seconds. With 2 more ready.
It’s really not an issue. Remember, these videos are just editorials. People expressing their opinions, their personal likes and dislikes. The only real verifiable facts are that people have used 22s to defend themselves forever. Are there more effective rounds? Sure. However, that a round is more effective doesn’t magically reduce the effectiveness of the 22. It still works just fine.
I agree with some of your opinions but then again totally disagree with others. The .22 is capable of stopping an attacker for sure. Is it the best choice? Probably not but it will work and work well.
I have several pistols, .40 5” tactical, .45 1911, .380 body guard, and ruger mark 2 bull barrel target. If I knew I was going to be in a gun fight today, I would carry my ruger mark 2, from 2’ to 50 yrds I can easily hit an apple. And never misfired since around 2002 when I bought it.
First of all, nobody, literally nobody says that 22lr is a "very good" defense round. Even people who carry or advocate for it admit that it's just "good enough" or merely adequate. Everyone admits that surely there are better more capable rounds. However, one has always to determine the use case first. For example if you find yourself in potentially dangerous places often then by all means a 22 is a bad choice. But the truth is for many average people a good reliable 22 (yes there are such) is quite adequate for the typical day to day stuff like going to the office, stopping by the grocery store, walking in a park, etc. I would much prefer for more people to carry a 22 with them instead of much fewer people carrying a 9 or 45.
Yeah,I have 2 revolvers in 22 magnum, and a couple 22 lr rifles. I highly recommend hearing protection when firing the 22 magnum, it's MUCH louder than 22 lr!
in pistol barrel lengths (especially under 5" barrels), 22mag is almost no increase over 22lr. You need 12+ inches of barrel to really start seeing increased performance from the magnum.
@@thorman944 I'll agree the magnum suffers in short barrels, but we like the Speer Gold Dot for short barrels in .22wmr...there is decent velocity, and the bullet might expand...with .22 any advantage is most welcome,
In 1969, a very good friend and distant family member was shot accidently with a .22 short from a single shot .22 rifle at close range, about 3 feet. I was told later the bullet hit him center chest and passed through him after hitting his heart. He died instantly. He was a really super kid at 16 years old and it was a tragic accident. Sad story and I still think of him today. He was saved by the Grace of God and I know his spirit is in Heaven today. Never underestimate the little .22 no matter what.
I clean my TX22 after every range day. I had to defend my home and the 22lr was the closest for me to grab. Nobody died but the attacker was stopped. Prior to this i was against carry of .22lr but i would feel comfortable carrying my TX22. The problem isn't with the 22 its with the people like i once was who just has an opinion but doesnt know from experience. Carry what you feel comfortable with and any projectile moving at 700 fps is going to make an attacker turn around and say "not worth it"
Bummer...we own a mark iv, and I've only briefly considered it's defensive value...two mags, 20 rounds total, reasonably accurate, in a pinch if I knew it needed to be loaded it could help...
@@PetuniaIii-pd1ww I've had a Mark II for 45+ years. You should practice a bit more as I can hit a dime at 15 yards at the age of 72 and I don't need glasses.
I love how people talk shit about .22lr as not good enough for defense. I was watching forensic files and a guy back in the 60"s was driving in high speed chase shot his .22lr snubnose revolver through his back car window at a cop car 50 yards away through the cops windshield and killed him, true show story look it up. I would be totally confident with .22lr in a defensive situation if that's all I had, better even with a 22 single shot firearm than my hands. Shot placement matters with any caliber, shoot someone in the chest 10 times with a 22 and see if he survives. Plus watch forensic files thousands of people got killed with .22lr firearms it will blow your mind how easy it is. Also you have to remember not every criminal is a drug crazed beast a lot of people will go into shock and stop or even die from just going in shock even if they get like shot in the foot.
Buy what you prefer. Then practice with it until your hands bleed. Learn how to use so that with it in your hand you will run it without thinking. That weapon will be the best you need. Just like driving a stick shift truck; once you get home, you cannot tell anyone how many times you shifted into third. The tranny has become part of you, just like your weapon should be.
22 lr is much cheaper which means more range time, lots of us still carry revolvers. 30 yr veteran of albuq police dept and only know of 3 one shot stops,,a 30-30 center hit in back, 22 lr in the eye and a 22 lr in the base of the neck! I feel very safe with my 8 shot 22 revolver!
I saw a lady in a gun store considering between some giant bolt action 10ga antique (pretty cool) and a new Ruger 10/22. These where the only guns left in shop during the crazy times, I told her to get the 10/22 as her first gun. Don’t regret that suggestion at all, a .22lr makes a great first gun and have a gun you shoot well is better than no gun.
I think you did right...that 10/22 with good 10 rounds can be enough for vast majority of situations...a bolt action 10 gauge sounds ferocious but it would be heck to deploy for most women...
Just picked up my P17 today and will be taking it to the range this week! Huge fan of 22lr since it’s so affordable to buy even when it’s “expensive” we can pickup a box of 50 for less than 8 bucks.
Although it's not my EDC......I would not hesitate to carry my TX22 loaded with 17 rounds of Federal Punch. I can shoot it accurately and I have used the Punch enough that I'm a believer in it's performance.
Agreed. I have a Sig P365 for EDC, but also own a TX22. When I load CCI Stingers or Federal Punch, I have no insecurity of it not stopping any attacker immediately. And the TX22 is hands down my most accurate shot.
Truth being said nobody wants a speeding hot bullet in their body , getting hit once is enough for most people in their right mind to change their thought process. Thanks Bram C. I got shot with a BB gun and didn't want any more of that. It didn't penitrate but it hurt like hell!!
well you are obviously clueless about the real world of violence. There are a percentage of attackers who not stop until they suffer nervous system collapse (brain, spine shot) or they are incapacited from blood lost. Many people do not experience the full level of pain when they are on andreline and many will be unaware of their wounds. The biggest factor is that you are weak and ineffective in engage in combat and are afraid of death and have a low tolerance threshold for pain
Any bullet from any gun will severely injure someone impacting the right spot and if not it will still hurt like hell amd willmore than likely stop a threat unless the threat is a bear or someone numb on drugs
I am a 77 year old male and have arthritis in my arm and hands and find it very difficult to rack the slide on my Glock 45's and also hold on to the gun during recoil. I am seriously considering changing my everyday carry to the Ruger SR22 due to obvious reasons as my health deteriorates. Even a small bore gun such as the 22 is better than nothing.
A pistol in ANY caliber is not a primary weapon. The " tactical" market/ industry has done a phenomenal job convincing Joe six pack otherwise. The fancy ads, the sleek designs in every caliber you can imagine, the wiz bang wonder bullets in said calibers, "barrier blind" bullets, etc etc. A pistol is a SIDE arm, AKA a backup to a RIFLE. Unfortunately, most of us cant carry rifles in the civilian world. Most of us dont go looking for trouble, nor will most of us ever need our carry weapon to defend ourselves or a loved one.... and especially in a " Terminal List" type of scenario. All that said, I am pro gun and carry my LCP 2 in .22 everywhere I legally can. It is 100% reliable in my personal experiences and with the CCI mini mag I keep it loaded with at 10+1. Out of this pistol, this round averages around 920FPS and penetrates to FBI minimum standards of 10-12 inches. I feel perfectly fine and confidently arned. It's also a very legally friendly setup if in the slim chance I ever needed to justify my actions in front of a jury. It's a "small, non tactical" pistol and it's loaded with "small non threatening" cartridges.
Outstanding. Handguns for defense are a bad joke. We cannot get by with toting a rifle around the grocery store, so we opt for a lesser tool. Marketing to the testosterone crowd by manufacturers we have been led to believe that a 37 shot appendix carry 52 caliber gun is the one to go with. 99.9% of all handgun owners will never fire their weapon in a real confrontation. Yet may will spend upwards of $700-1,000 for a handgun that they never practice with and has dust bunnies in the barrel. Whatever caliber that weapon is makes NO difference.
Squirrel hunting with a .22 lr rifle a few months ago. Doe walks out into the soybean field nearby. These deer were destroying the in short order about a quarter of the crop already had been eaten. One shot with a .22 stinger right underneath her. She dropped the bullet went into her throat and right into her. She stopped in her tracks.
I started shooting with .22lr as a kid, I have shot tens of thousands of rounds from semi-autos. I have had very few failures in my semi-auto pistols. If ever in the situation of having to protect myself, I am not stopping with firing one or two rounds. I am going to empty my magazine on the threat. I have no doubt that my hollow point or fragmenting .22lr will do the job. How much penetration do you really need to do "devastating damage" to stop an attacker?
.22 isnt weak against flesh bodys & it does a great job for self defense. The only way it wouldn't do a good job would be if the offender was wearing body armor
I have to disagree on some parts of this video. I have shot 22s for a lifetime and rarely clean them and they still work exceptionaly well. Have I ever had a fail to feed or extraction issue? Yes, but they have been few and far between and I've had issues with other more expensive guns also. No gun ever will be 100% flawless unless you shoot it once and it works and you never shoot it again!
The 22 rimfire (short) with a 29 grain bullet and 4 grains of black powder was released in 1857 for use in the S&W #1 revolver as a self defense weapon. Older shooters that can no longer control the recoil of a heavier caliber use the 22lr. I have been in a situation where I would have been glad to have a 22lr rather than nothing.
I have spent 30 years in level one trauma center ED's. My experience with 22lr is they fragment sending bits everywhere. Also they bounce around internally. I've seen people shot in the chest and the bullet end up in the groin destroying tissue the length of its path
Thank you for the video. I have a Sidekick 9 shot revolver, 22LR-22 Mag, 4.3 inch. I have found a round it likes that seems to be dependable and will expand, (usually) on impact. Winchester ,Super X 22LR, 40gr, 1435fps HP. of course you don't have to worry about feeding! I'm a revolver guy as I live in the forest and don't worry about "urban critters". The first to rounds are snake shot and the rest are for the bigger ones. I hope my input is useful?
I believe the .22lr was actually first chambered in Smith and Wesson revolver. I kept one for a time as a self defense gun after hand surgery. I may have to rely on it during recovery after shoulder replacement.
If I recall some brief history from studying years ago, I think that the .22 Short was first designed for a S&W revolver, then the .22 Long. Both were a 29 gr classic ball shaped heeled bullet. Then the 40 gr LR was later designed for a rifle with it's more rifle like bullet shape, that's why .22 "Long Rifle" is it's literal name.
That argument is still ridiculous. If people can walk through being shot with 9mm multiple times, they sure as hell will walk through a 10/22 with 25rds. 22LR is good for plinking and squirrel hunting. That’s literally it. Don’t be saying, “but... but... shot placement over caliber!”
@@frawdulent Very, very, very, very few people walk through 9mm. Just as very, very, very, very few people would walk through a fulisade of 1400+ fps 22LR Velocitors launched from a semi auto rifle (that round achieves 12"+ penetrate in gel and reliably expands to about .40 caliber) If they decide that 25 Velocitors is not reason enough to die, you can beat them to death with the rifle while they are busy bleeding out.
In a survival scenario it's all about carrying enough ammo and killing small game for food, that and the accuracy of the Walther P22 makes it a necessary gun
You seem to characterize recoil sensitivity as something caused by lack of training or lack of familiarity with firearms. For some it is a medical issue, and is based on the physical characteristics of the hands. I formerly carried .45 ACP and 9mm, and would still prefer those calibers. My hands can no longer tolerate the recoil, so I am currently carrying a .22lr semi-auto. A larger caliber is simply not an option for me, not for lack of training, familiarity, or experience, but because of the medical condition of my hands.
@@ftdefiance1 My sympathies, I hope the surgery goes well for you. I would recommend the Walther PPK/S 22 for pocket carry, the Walther PPQ 22 for open carry, or concealed carry with a little more care in how one dresses. I am also intrigued by the Walther WMP in 22 Magnum, but I have not had an opportunity to try one. I additionally have severe arthritis in my trigger finger, so a very smooth trigger is essential, and most Walther’s are very good in that regard.
Thank you for viewing Allen. I perhaps was not clear enough in my description of recoil sensitivity in the video. In my opinion, recoil sensitivity is caused by a mental reaction manifested in physical form, flinching on trigger press, etc. Having said that, you open up a very valid consideration for carrying the .22lr that I overlooked. There are numerous people who have strength and dexterity issues with their hands and I did not have that in my mind when filming. I will add that onto a video in the future and humbly thank you for pointing that out! Well done sir.
Hmm… Federal Punch and Winchester Silvertip. Both defense rounds, both easily cycle modern 22lr auto pistols, both deliver 100-105 ft/lb of muzzle energy. Most semi auto 22lr pistols can go hundreds of rounds between cleaning, reliably, with quality ammo. Incredibly accurate and low recoil allows for multiple follow up shots on target. Lastly. I never met anyone that willingly said “shoot me with a 22lr it’s weak". So all in all your assessment is flawed on multiple fronts.
Umm, the only thing I might argue is trusting a dirty gun...especially with .22 we have religion about cleaning after every range visit...every minor hedge helps...
Your argument at 1:30 is why my grandmother is swapping to a 22. She is small of stature and the recoil/report of the 380 she used to have is too much for her and she wanted something that fit her hand better (a sig p238 is too large for her hands) and that has less recoil.
The 22lr, the Rodney Dangerfield of calibers. It gets the job done and people still don't respect it. Hardened Killers caliber of choice, the 22lr. Some Government Agencies use the 22 lr...It amazes me how some people still try and discredit it.
Thanks for the video. 22 caliber seems to be on the rise for self defense. Perhaps a 32 long fired out of a LCR snubby would be ideal for shootability, ease of carry, and effectiveness.
I spent 50 years in Compton and Watts. Seen plenty of guys taken out of the fight with a .22. Is it the best, no. But better than a knife, club, broomstick etc.
imo it's a question of ammunition quality. I recently shot through 100 rounds of cci with 2 dud rounds. reloaded and fired again only to still be dud rounds. i fired through federal punch defensive loads and did not have a single dud or failure of any type. for too long companies that produced 22lr have been comfortable with selling low quality ammo. premium 22lr fixes that
.22 rimfire first showed its face in smith and Wesson revolvers- chambered in .22 short sized cartridges, propelled by black powder and carried by many combatants during the American Civil War. Unfortunately after action reports or surgeons accounts are a bit lacking. Postwar accounts of folks being shot by small caliber arms are rife with lingering wounds resulting in infection and death
Q: What is the first message you telegraph to someone when you point a firearm at them? A: "I am about to poke holes into you" Do you think the target's first concern is how large or deep the holes will be?
The .22 puts more people in the ER or the Morgue than any other, but this is largely because it is so common - not because it is particularly effective or lethal. The data is what it is, and roughly equivalent with the .22 as compared to the service calibers. If the .22 causes more deaths per year, you can also bet that .22 victims survive much more often than from other, more powerful calibers as well. Moreover, performance varies with barrel length and the type of action. A .22 rifle with an 18 inch barrel produces about 140 ft-lbs of energy (twice that needed for lethality) - from a two-inch barrel the same round is on the very cusp of lethality (67 ft-lbs). The case size of the .22 is pretty small. It would make sense to load it with a hot, fast-burning powder for maximum effect. Consequently, the powder is mostly ignited before the bullet has a chance to go more than a few inches down the barrel. After rising substantially from 2 to 6 inches and then a fraction more from 6 to 8 inches, the velocity for the .22 tends to flatten out after about 8 inches of barrel travel. Can a small diameter round like a .22 Magnum with a velocity of 2000 fps, or a .22LR at 1200 fps be effective outside common service applications? An honest discussion about the relative merits of carrying a .22 in certain situations follows, but if a gunfight were imminent, a .22 handgun would be very low on my list and a 12 gauge double barrel loaded with #4 Buckshot would be very, very high. Two dozen #4 pellets (.24 lead balls traveling at about 1,200 fps) will definitely kill a large deer, or humans wearing normal clothing at close range. At longer ranges, however #4 buck may not be ideal for bringing down or neutralizing a threatening human or other large animal. It should be remembered during this discussion that there is no progression in lethality such as dead, deader, and deadest, but that there are very real differences for the defensive shooter and his target among injured, wounded, incapacitated, and frightened off! The FBI standards, while informative, are designed for DUTY weapons. The speed at which you can present a weapon and shot placement are more important than big calibers in a personal defensive situation. Shot placement is vitally important. If you can’t hit with your chosen carry gun, pick something else. In some situations you only get one shot - make it count. Encountering a motivated criminal who presses the fight against an armed citizen is exceedingly rare, but not impossible. Amazingly, not a single case has been found by researchers of an armed citizen killed by a criminal after the criminal had taken a hit by at least one .22 round. What’s more, government sponsored studies have found that the likelihood of victim injury was reduced from 10.9 percent before to 4.1 percent after brandishing any firearm. The victim injury rate after a defensive gun use was similar to using any other defensive weapon (5.3 percent) such as a knife or baseball bat, yet the elderly and infirmed are not going the swing a bat with the same authority as the young and athletic. The best advice is to carry a gun that is reliable and shoots well. Research shows that most self-defense encounters resolve themselves as soon as the potential victim shows a weapon, or in just two shots. Nonetheless, you must have both the skill and the will to use your weapon in a confrontation. In a summary of the data reported and published in American Handgunner Magazine (August 2018), the .22 reportedly required the least number of shots (1.38) to stop an attacker as compared to the other cartridges. Consider that the .22 stops were more likely “psychological stops” as opposed to physical incapacitations. Note that no caliber claimed a consistent “one shot stop,” but two shots usually did the job. The .38 SPL had the fewest rounds fired (not necessarily hits) to get a physical incapacitation (1.87). Conversely the 9mm had the most rounds fired to get an incapacitation (2.45). However, most 38 SPLs are fired from revolvers and most 9mm from semi-autos. The tendency to empty the magazine (i.e. magazine dump) in a stressful encounter MAY contribute to the inconsistency of the data. [ii] While the .22 is clearly no dragon-slayer, it’s better than begging for help (or mercy), and no one expects a grandma in the doorway with a small “get off me gun”. Increased energy is the most notable feature of most modern cartridges including 22s. Anyone can shoot the .22LR, which is noted as a mild shooter, and the .22 Magnum has many of the terminal ballistic characteristics of the mild firing mid-sized .38 Special without the associated recoil. Some experts from the law-enforcement and competitive shooting worlds argue that tactical pistol ammunition - no matter the caliber - is incapable of stopping a determined adversary without multiple shots in most cases. According to Ernest Langdon, a shooting instructor and respected competitive pistol shooter who has worked for gun makers such as Beretta, Smith & Wesson, and Sig Sauer, "You have to shoot people a lot with a handgun." Big caliber advocates will point to statements like these as proof of the ineffectiveness of lesser calibers. In a world where the one shot stop is a “myth” and shot placement is paramount, the low recoil, high capacity .22 would logically seem ideal according to these experts. Easy to use, carry, and conceal, with quick follow-up shots and little chance of pass through penetration, Israeli sky marshals and commandos proved that .22LR caliber HPs could be used to stop terrorists and criminals. No group of armed professionals has ever used a .22 caliber pistol as effectively as the Israelis in a CQB (Close Quarter Battle) scenario.[i] For the first time shooter wanting to purchase a self-defense carry weapon, you might try a revolver in .22 LR, or .22 Magnum for a little more power. Rimfire automatics can be picky about ammo, but revolvers will generally eat anything. The .22 Magnum has been around for a long time, but it is still a little off the mainstream. As a fun gun and as a practice tool, the .22LR is fine, but for the person relying for defensive needs on a larger caliber, the little .22 Magnum is great. Several manufacturers offer weapons that change cylinders from LR to Magnum with little trouble. This will widen the future uses to which you can put your weapon and allow for less expensive practice and recreational shooting, but in Single Action they may not be the best choice for self-defense. Many modern defensive revolvers retain a single action capability as a holdover from competitive target shooting from the 1900s to the 1950s, but this feature has little relevance in a modern self-defense context. Yet it is no slower to deploy than a lever action rifle. Weapons like the Double Action S&W 351 PD (Personal Defense), a 7-shot .22 Magnum revolver, or the Ruger LCR, a 6-shot .22 Magnum (or 8-shot 22LR), are designed for the self-defense purpose. - James M. Volo
All this interesting and I appreciate the videos, thank you. I'm left with a couple thoughts. I think the 22lr is a great choice for self defense, especially when over penetration is a concern. I choose my carry on the following 3 principals...1: always bring a gun to a gun fight. 2: would I want to be on the business end of the gun 3: do I trust my life to the gun functioning properly, when needed. In this video and I think a lot of videos of this type, the underlying message is...train, be familiar and properly maintain your firearms, especially if you intend to carry.
If you believe the .22L doesnt have the stopping power of the 9mm, then SOMEONE explain to me why the Mossad TO THIS DAY prefers the .22LR over the 9mm?
I have several thoughts about .22 as a defensive round. First, when you shoot someone with a .22, they don't know what caliber just hit them. I have seen several stats that show a .22 will stop a an attack with a single shot. Stopping power is not a good term to describe being hit with any handgun round. With that said, I do agree that because a .22 is the least dependable cartridge, I would never recommend it as a primary carry round. It does have it's place with some people and any firearm carried is always better than no firearm at all.
I don't understand. Your video is about the ineffectiveness of .22LR for self defense, but everything in your video showed how effective it would be. Then you summarize by pretending you didn't see what you just saw: 1) reliability in that specific mag dump; 2) more than sufficient FBI gel test penetration; 3) significant damage to the poultry flesh. And your criticism is that the chicken didn't jump high enough? The FBI gel test and the FBI's research with actual data into the effectiveness of the .22LR reach a different conclusion from what you espouse. It's people like you who don't understand external ballistics or terminal ballistics who give gun channels a bad reputation. I would also note that you selected a pretty weak ammo for the first shots. Yesterday at the range I sent 20 rounds of CCI Mini Mag over the chronograph out of my Walther P22, and got an average velocity of 975fps. Try to do better.
I personally disagree with the lack of reliability of a modern .22 cartridge. I have three .22 rifles (Bergara B14R/Tippmann M4/Ruger 10/22) and i have only had the occasional FTF with the Ruger and that was when i tensioned the magazine spring incorrectly. My ammo of choice is CCI Blazer HV for the semis and SK Standard plus for the bolt gun. Keep the firearms clean and maintained, use good quality ammo and you should not have any problems in my opinion.
I use a revolver with 22 LR for self defense. 8 shots. No jamming. My back up a .380 high capacity 14 rounds semi auto. Would not us 22LR in a semi auto for the reasons discussed in video . Light weight so I always have them on me. I know bigger calibers are more effective but not if they are at home or in the trunk of the car.
Most gangbangers and burglars have never been fired on in an gunfight. With this in mind, it's who throws "the first punch" that will be the decisive shooter.
Despite the efforts of many manufacturers in developing an specific .22lr ammunition for self defense, I still rely on the so proven, time tested, CCI Target Mini-Mag 22 LR 40 Grain on pistols and revolvers. Yes, I am among those who believe .22LR could be used by civilizians in self defense situations. As somebody once said, the minimum caliber for self defense is the largest one the person can handle at its best. Kindest regards from Brasil.
Well, I have had 1 Beretta M.21 # .22 LR since 1979 and, when traveling, I use it with Stinger HP, thank God I never lost confidence even though I didn't need to use it! ... "back-up" is 1 Taurus #.32 HP. . . !
The 22LR cartridge was developed in 1887 by the Stevens company for use in their several different top break model rifles as well as their bicycle and pocket rifle models, which were also top break designs.
I don't have a lot of experience/ knowledge with guns ,but I will give my 2 cents worth .18 months ago I bought a Taurus 942M,22 magnum revolver. For pocket carry. But found it's. WAY too heavy for that. But in the plus side it holds 8 rounds,with the reliability of a revolver.i would personally recommend, if you are going with a 22 for self defense, get a high capacity revolver in magnum,like that one,or get a quality 22 lr high capacity pistol.
You mentioned training… which caliber is someone more likely to train with? Which caliber is more affordable to train with? If you put those two criteria together, you will find that a lot of people that are sensitive become comfortable with a 22 . I think those people are more likely to also use the 22 with more confidence and a real life situation. If they are shooting 9 mm and never really like it and kind of dread it., consciously subconsciously that’s going to show up when they use it in a self-defense situation as well. No matter which gun somebody chooses if they can’t shoot it comfortably in training and don’t have the desire to overcome the parts. They don’t like, I would say it’s not a good choice for them. Usually the affordability if someone thinks self-defense is important enough, they will overcome that to some degree . I just haven’t seen them overcome the part of not liking the gun not liking to shoot it.
2 of 3 made it fully thru 16 inch block with punch.. fbi spec is 12 to 18 inches well within fbi spec. And lower recoil / easier to shoot no matter how much experience.
Although many 22's handguns are not nearly as reliable as their centerfire counterparts. A well broken in .22LR such as any of the Ruger MKIV pistols, a Ruger SR22 or the Ruger LCP2 in 22LR can be extremely reliable! With CCI Mini-Mags I find "most" .22LR pistols not only are reliable; that particular brand of ammunition CCI is extremely reliable; unlike federal punch which seems to only function reliably in some handguns. If you dive deep into the history of .22LR you will learn that the number of fatalities with the round is astonishing. Although I agree it is not an ideal caliber for person protection; I have NO problem using it for personal protection. A well known expert on .22's "Plinkster22" once took a .22LR stinger and shot the round through a titanium golf club. So never underestimate the capability of a particular caliber in the hands of someone that is proficient with it.
It wasn’t a stinger it was a stanger. If it’s from that guy you have to follow the rules….very important. Heck of a shooter! He does EDC a 9mm but I don’t be surprised if he’s got a lil 22 on him. I myself carry a 22 at least in a bag or stowed away in my work vehicle. I carry a .25 or .32 on me at all times. It’s the weight I’m focusing on. 22 is super lightweight and I can pack a lot of it.
I have the Keltec CP-33. She choked and gaged on most of the rounds for the first 5-6 magazines I fed her. She completely smoothed out now. I've fired hundreds of more rounds through it since. Not a single jam, ftf or stovepipe since. It uses a very reliable quad stack mag that holds 33 rounds. Very accurate at 50 yards shooting Winchester Super X (1300 fps). Excellent factory match trigger. I have a Primary Arms mini on it that seems like it was made just for it. I would easily trust my life with it. If things went south in a bad situation with multiple attackers, one could put a shit ton of rounds downrange with a few extra spare mags and in a hurry on targets with barely any recoil.
Though I've not fired a gun in my life, I've seen plenty of videos on RUclips and is used to kill livestock - with good shot placement - and it's effective, however it doesn't look ideal if one's home is threatened. Nothing with too much force that a family member or a friend ends up dead or disabled : thank you for your information.
My wife has arthritis in her hands and .22 is about all she can handle. She also can’t rack most semi-autos. I bought a Ruger LR .22 and she can handle it just fine. Not the best self-defense gun, but 11 rounds of Federal Punch to the face beats pepper spray.
Speaking as a father of a teenage daughter, I can say from experience that for some, a well set up Ruger Charger in 22lr with a light, laser and suppressor is an excellent choice for a home defense weapon. Of course I have more powerful options for myself. But for her and my wife, I know they can mag dump into a five inch circle at ten yards. I agree though that if you’re competent with a larger caliber weapon, the 22lr shouldn’t be your first choice.
I know of a guy who got shot with a .22 in his leg (hunting accident) and he said it felt like someone hit him as hard as they could with a baseball bat he was in extreme pain. So even just one of those to the chest or head I think its sufficient enough for sure lol
I think you're making a huge (and erroneous) assumption here right up front since you're focused on the CALIBER only, not on TACTICS as well -- meaning, the OTHER half of the "self-defense equation" (if you will). But then MOST people only consider the gun/caliber they're going to carry, not how they'll USE it (tactics)...a HUGE oversight, IMO. Yes, the "Stopping Power" of ONE round of 22LR certainly IS pretty "sketchy" since of course it's universally known it has the least "stopping-power" (however that's defined) of all the usual handgun calibers (25ACP is debatable) carried for self-defense. However, WHO -- and REGARDLESS of caliber, be it 9mm or 45ACP -- shoots a threat only ONCE? You shoot MULTIPLE times as fast as you can and still be on target....the low-recoiling 22LR is the best caliber to do this with. So in THAT context, you'll likely shoot a 22LR 3-5 times -- as if it's on full-auto (!)-- before even waiting to see what the first shot does. Consequently, if a 22 LR only has a "33% one-shot-stop" track-record, then shooting the threat 3 times would be a 99% stop, yes? ;-) I'm being a bit facetious here, but it doesn't alter my point: What threat is going to take 3-5 shots in its face/brain (first target choice) or heart (2nd choice), spinal cord (a "long" shot but COULD happen) and still be a threat? MAYBE, but really not at all likely. So yes, I agree that ONE shot of 22LR would have to be spot-on (instantly disrupt the Central Nervous System) like the brain (bullet must reach the rear of the brain, not just the frontal lobe) to make an instant stop -- not sure how many people are THAT good of a marksman -- but several shots to the face/eyes/brain? Heart/neck/groin artery hits depend on severe blood loss to incapacitate a threat -- it'll take maybe 15-20 seconds for the threat to bleed out so, so you KEEP SHOOTING until it isn't...however many shots that will take. Who knows... IMO, the 22LR is a VERY viable self-defense/EDC (Every Day Carry) choice...that is, IF you can shoot it well enough to stay on-target firing 3-5 shots at said target as quickly as you can. With a large-capacity 22LR pistol (16rds or so) like the Kel Tec P17 or Taurus TX22 -- two popular 22LR semi-auto pistols presently -- you can do that and still have ammo left in your magazine in case the threat is not alone. ;-) JMO... -- BR
I've used Ruger Mark-series pistols since the late 70s. I have a great deal of confidence in it for defensive use unless one is facing multiple assailants. Companies are now polishing their .22 rounds, so they are no longer dirty. I go to the range and go through dozens of rounds with no duds. Yes, one will get the occasional dud, but they are now so rare I hardly notice. If one depends on .22LR for defense, I recommend specialty ammo. These are clean, quality rounds, and your gun should be clean and a good quality CLP lightly used. I don't use, or recommend, cheap pistols like the Jennings J-22, but I'll tell you this, I haven't had one single misfire or failure of any kind with my CCI Mini-Mags. I've shot about 200 rounds through it, and yes, I had some jams with cheap ammo like the Remington Thunderbolts, but I stopped using it. Don't use it. Buy, and use, CCIs or other good ammo.
Recently built a Midwest industries 10/22. Put 6 consecutive BX-25 mag dumps with federal bulk ammo and not a single hiccup. In a self defense situation, I would trust it with my life. My point of aim might just be a bit higher on target.
I carry a Taurus Ultra Lite 22lr and it carries 9 rounds. I like it because it is light and I know that I can put rounds where I want too. I have many other guns but I like this little gun. If I could carry another it would be my S&W 9mm EZ. or my Glock 43X with a 15 round mag.
Your point at 2:15 about fouling assuring that reliability will be a problem is an outdated opinion. It was outdated when you uploaded this video. Defensive oriented modern semi automatic .22's have improved a lot in the last 15 years. The reviews coming in on the TX22 for example are phenomenal in terms of reliability. I have one myself, well over 1000 rounds in it since it was cleaned, and a student used it in a class yesterday. She put 250 rounds through it without a single problem. I'm purposely delaying cleaning it to see how long it will go without a malfunction. Your point at 2:40 is silly too, no matter how much you spend on any machine, at some point all mechanical processes will fail.
So I'm new'ish to guns... can someone explain this to me: Why do you need so much penetration for "stopping power" and to neutralize your target. The ballistics gel shows 8" pen with the Self Defense rounds. Now I'm no doctor, but unless you're shooting a fat guy in the gut, isn't 8" deep enough to pop any organ in the human body? Or is ballistics gel not representative of human penetration? Confused.
I think his last statement is the most intelligent assessment of using 22lr for self defense. It's utility is in using it to train past the reasons it was selected. To gain competence and confidence to graduate to a larger more effective caliber. Which leads me to ask, what about .32 h&r magnum?
I've always wanted something in 327fed so I could shoot the entire 32 fam. Would be SO practical if only the ammunition was more available & affordable. If I ever DID get into it, I'd have to start reloading the family of cartridges. 327 is such a little powerhouse, esp from a levergun. That's a spicy meatba-... I mean, cartridge. 🔥🔥🔥
@@thereindeertherabbitthebat592 Again, the most intelligent thing I read about the 327, I read on a forum. In the midst of a sea of "Its a solution looking for a problem", I found a reply that said "Yes, if you don't reload. But if you do a whole new world opens up to you." I don't reload, but that's an economic decision. I'd like to get my house paid off before the dollar crashes. 1 more hobby or caliber I can't justify right now. But yeah, the 32's look fascinating.
I'd love to get a .327 or .32h&r, but like y'all the economy comes into play...my studies indicate .32s&w is similar to .22lr, and .32s&w long might be okay in a wadcutter...I put that out here because it might be more affordable, or easier, to find a revolver for .32s&w long...
@@PetuniaIii-pd1ww I keep coming back to the LCR. Like so many have said, it's perfect for .32h&r. A 3" barreled sp101 would be perfect for .327 federal magnum. But now that the 30 super carry is out, would a semi be better?
@@kurt5490 ain't it pure hell having choices...Hoss, you will eventually go with what your gut tells you, so right now you know what you want...as for .30 super carry, I haven't studied the caliber so I can't advise...but again, whatever firearm you decide to acquire will be fine, and if it isn't you will trade in for the next...nothing wrong with the LCR (Well, I'd prefer the LCRx but that is just a preference), or the SP101...and honestly, the SP101 would last forever, constructed as it is...I don't have the cash laying around for a SP101, but if you are close I'd say hang in there, and get that bad boy...I've never heard anything bad about them...back to semi-autos, they have their good/bad points, just like revolvers...you're back to the choices thing again...assign heads/tails to your choices, and when you flip a coin you will know how you want the outcome to be...
I don't agree with the .22Lr not being a good self defense round i carry .22Lr,.380,or9mm depending on the situation. And feel very comfortable with any of them if you put 6or8 .22Lr in the face or pelvic area at 5-15 feet the attack is over. As far as FBI standards go i don't put much stock in that.
I don't know that I would use the term "stopping power" when describing the 22 round. But I do believe that "discouraging power" would definitely be fitting.
![Why Won't the Ruger Mini-14 Just Die? [Part 1]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/EzyGl_w-IXg/mqdefault.jpg)
"Not doing a chance of a devastating hit on your target." I read a study of over 1500 defensive shooting situations and the only criterion was caliber and result. In 30% of defensive shootings involving a 22 the subject hit...DIED. Never think the 22 isn't a fatal round. But in 100% of the remaining cases, where the subject struck remained mobile...he ran away. NO ONE hung around to be shot twice. Your singular goal as a civilian is to stop an attack. Hit your attacker ONCE with a 22. Mission accomplished.I carry the Ruger SR22.
I disagree on the most part with this video. I've shot MANY rounds of 22, 9mm, 40, and 45 in numerous pistols. Many of thousands in 22. My take on this is, if the gun functions well or if it didn't, was corrected, I can't say I had any more issues with the 22 than all the other rounds. If any pistol I had couldn't be corrected, I got rid of it.
I do agree that certain brands of 22 are rather dirty. For that ammo I clean the gun when I get home and even at that, it's rather quick. It's even hard for me to remember jams in my 22 semi auto pistols. What I may get in a few of them every once in a blue moon is a failure to fire because the primer edge just didn't ignite but it would on the 2nd attempt a huge majority of the time.
For self defense I have NO issue carrying a 22lr or 22 mag and have been for many years. That being said, I don't carry any round that does not go at least 10" in calibrated jell. This has been looked at in detail as far as the statistics go, and it was concluded....
"So, in short, what’s the answer? Is a .22 a good self defense round? According to the numbers, it looks to be among the best in terms of stopping the threat. Add in the fact that it’s lightweight, low recoil and uses firearms that are ridiculously easy to conceal and you can see where a .22 caliber firearm for concealed carry might be a winner."
@@2fast2block I agree. I have used nothing but CCI for several years and I can honestly say I have never had a failure with an LCP II, a Ruger SR 22 and even a Phoenix 22.
@@deere3321 you got blessed with your LCP II. I don't have one but review after review has complaints about that pistol. If they were not so bad, I'd own one.
@@2fast2block I have the the LCP II .22Lr. and have had almost flawless performance and when i had a problem it was the ammo. Mine is very picky it only likes Aguila 38gr HP.
I carry a Beretta M9-22
for those who have never been shot with a 22lr I suggest you don't get shot. As a former
Deputy US Marshal [ Air ] I was hit in my left shoulder from 30ft. from a suspect who had a
Baratta model 70, Mossad .22 LRS. 40-years later I'm still carrying that bullet, it couldn't be removed because it was to close to a major artery. It's not the caliber but the marksmanship, He definitely knew where to shut me to take me out of the game. The problem I have with all this caliber stuff is the people who are the ballistic experts who have never been shot with any caliber bullet to know anything about damage. With all due respect, ballistics gels and targets don't shoot back.
sorry that happend to you. Super facts. Smaller Caliber rounds tend to not exit thus causing alot of trouble from lodging and or (tumble)swimming. Lots of guys i served with rather be shot up close than further away. entrance exit. with so much heat literal cauterize wound. but further away .. tumbles bounces off bones and exits away from the entrance. some nasty stuff .
Your doctor hasnt been shot either and he gave his opinion im sure. A one out of 3 odds of being effective is not good the police college would tell u that. By now u would have sent your assailant a nice lawsuit if he could pay it which is great for u but not great for the carrier of .22. Im glad u survived it goes without saying u were lucky it was a .22
@LeatherneckSears0341 it's been proven that .22 doesn't tumble or bounce around inside you. It doesn't have enough speed to do that.
To paraphrase HonestOutlaw: "A bullet is a bullet and if you put them in the right place they all work."
*IF*
Rare is the person who stares down the barrel of a .22 and laughs.
in my past police career...i saw lots of people getting killed by 22 and 32 caliber handguns. Actually many more than from 9mm and 45 caliber. I even got to see a subject get opened up in the ER to try and find 3... 22 bullets... inside the man to stop the bleeding. Where the rounds entered and finally stopped was very different path....it was not straight and tore up incredible amounts of tissue! I was a believer after that! I carry SR 22 with velocitor rounds! 5-8 hits at 10 yards in the torso in a few seconds is how I train with it.
Yeah , this guy isn’t very smart putting out content like this. Extremely ignorant considering his profession
@@chrisburnsed6349 what do you mean Sir?
@@LiveToTrainInc not hard to figure out what I meant. He basically said that a .22 is a useless ineffective round. He supposedly works in a firearm environment and saying that he should know better. No one argues a .22 is not a first choice for self defense but I guarantee if he ever had one shot at him he wouldn’t be saying they’re ineffective.
Now try Federal Punch, CCI Uppercut & Winchester Silvertip 37 grain.
@@CHEECHMUN I just read a study on silver tip and they break into three pieces upon entry?? That's good because it causes three wound paths! Thank you for the recommendation Sir
I put one .22 LR in the belly from a Ruger Standard Automatic Pistol of an attacker and he STOPPED, spun around and out the front door he went. It's the incredible pain caused by the bullet. We both survived.
Nice job. More people shot with it than any other caliber.
real shit right here
You can’t tell what cal you’ve been shot by, all your brain knows it “oh shit”.
@@RyanGr33n Actually, we call it "FIBS," which is "Fk, I've Been Shot!" I think I heard John on Active Self Protection use it first.
Wonder if that preparator changed his life style choices
I personally think you miss the point of carrying a firearm! The vast majority of encounters with thugs and robbers are assuming that you are defenseless. They think they have all the advantages. They do if you don’t carry and know how to use a weapon. If you have a situation where can you can put a 22 caliber on target and hit what you are shooting at, the whole dynamic changes. 99 out of 100 no longer are interested in doing you harm. They want to get away from you as bad as you from them. I’m 75 years old with reasonably good strength yet. I went and bought a 22 eight shot snub nose revolver for training purposes. I also bought a 38 S&W snub nose to carry. As my self training went on, I found out how much I enjoyed shooting that 22 revolver. I shoot it two or three times a week. I have gotten fairly proficient with both the 22 and to a lesser degree with the 38. The 22 weighs 16 oz., the 38 weighs 2 lb. I am convinced that the 22 with Federal punch is a better choice for me because I can and will carry it all the time! I won’t carry that 38 because I can feel it in my pocket all the time. It will turn into a burden and in time it will remain at home. You down played the federal punch because it didn’t have as big a wound channel as the hand cannon that you were comparing it with. I maintain that if you drive a pin thru a torso from front to back, you will change the behavior of your intended assailant. I am not saying that it is the best choice for everyone but it clearly has a place as a carry weapon for some folks!
I understand everyone’s opinion on the 22lr, but no one wants to get shot by anything and I’ve actually witnessed individuals being shot and killed by this round, it’s no joke
I understand that a 22lr round is only about the size of an average phillips screwdriver. However.. . A cci mini mag travels out of a 5 inch barrel at over 1000 fps, that's 700 mph. Imagine being stabbed in the chest or abdomen with a 8-12 inch screwdriver traveling at 700mph 1,2,3 or maybe 10-15 times
Plus cci mini mags are well documented to tumble aggressively into organic targets making a much larger permanent wound cavity. I definitely wouldn't want to be on the other side of a .22lr especially that particular one (minimag) or any segmenting .22lr rounds like the silver tips.
I prefer Stingers
That 700 mph thing made my jaw drop.
what about a 16 inch barrel 22?
Your hear wouldn't do well with a hole in it.
I grew up on a farm in the 70's. There were lots of wilds around us and my brother and I spent thousands of hours scouring the woods and fields with .22s. We had a Ruger Single Six and Mark 1, Browning 22 auto rifle and a couple of Remington auto rifles. There was not anything those .22s could not bring down or hit within 100 yards. For such a tiny little round, it is capable of soooooooo much.
8” penetration in the eyes, stomach or groin is deadly for sure.
The 22 short was a self defense pistol at one time. The gun writers used to tell me my 9mm BHP was only good for squirrels.My have times changed. The reality is that a 22 pistol is a great utilitarian firearm. It can do a lot of things. It may be the most useful pistol there is. But, obviously, other calibers are certainly better at somethings. I think the 32 ACP is a much better option for those that are sensitive to recoil, if “self defense “ “whatever that means” is more of a priority. It also has no recoil, and comes in very light pistols. The 25ACP is a less powerful option then the 32, but I like it. Both are also center fire which of course adds to reliability, but high quality 22 ammo has come a very long way. We shot 300 rounds a few days ago, not a single problem with the Punch, Velocitor, or Stingers. I carry my little pistols when working around the farm, hiking, and just knocking around. I use them for snakes, raccoons, and other predators trying to get my animals, etc. without sounding like a cannon. If you get swarmed by 20 ninjas with AKs you are toast no matter what pistol you have. Most people don’t want to be shot. They don’t usually wait around to see what caliber is putting extra holes in their bodies. Thanks for the video.
To be honest if your not afraid to be shot by it. I’m not carrying it. Was a EMT for a number of years and when I was treating GSW victims they were not screaming out “what caliber was it!?” It was “I was shot!”
My wife could not shoot my 9mm without dropping it. So, I bought a Bersa 380. She didn't drop it, but was still shy about firing more than one round at a time. So, I bought her a Ruger LCP2 in .22LR. Now she can mag dump 10 rounds inside a 6 inch circle, from 35 feet, without closing one eye. If that circle is your head, you will never get to tell your side of the story. I have killed coyote with one shot from a single action revolver in .22LR. There is no reason that the right .22LR round out of the right gun, cannot stop a 350 lb thug in his tracks. Nobody keeps fighting with a 40 grain chunk of hot lead in their brain.
Sounds right to me.
i agree to you 100%
The Bersa, while light-ish, is NOT pleasant to shoot. I switched from carrying it to a Keltek P17. Lighter weight even with laser and I can put more shots on target faster. I am much more confident in myself with the Keltek P17 with CCI stingers than with the Bersa 380. And like someone else said 99 percent of the time if a bad guy gets hit once, or even has booolots whizzing past, the bad guy starts running.
@@marlonw5053 Exactly! I don't care what it is, nobody wants to get shot.
Hey 22lr can still reach your organs even though it doesn't have as much power as a 9mm.
And it needn’t to do to stop someone by changing their mind.
Here is where I ask my standard question based on my experience. How many homicide’s have you worked where the .22LR was the weapon used , handgun and rifle ? How many autopsies have you attended after the fact, and evidence collected ? Yes, the .22LR kills, most with one shot. Is it the best caliber for LE or Military application ? The answer is no. As a civilian, your goal is situational awareness so that you may avoid the need to use your concealed weapon altogether. However, if you are confronted with such a life or death circumstance, your goal is to use such weapon to break contact and escape the situation asap. Just something to consider.
Thank you for your comments Joseph. They are insightful and truly something to consider!
Pretty sure Federal punch in 22lr wasn't designed to mushroom or expand at all. I think the idea behind it was penetration over anything else. In my opinion, those punch 22lr's aren't among the better choices.
I wouldn't discount 22lr completely. Def wouldn't underestimate it by claiming it would just "overwhelm" an attacker, or as some folks like to say, "It'll just make em mad".
It always makes me chuckle when I hear guys say something like "22lr is basically a pellet gun." 😔... 22lr is not a pellet gun. It is a soft lead, 36-40gr projectile, traveling around variations of different, yet very capable velocities, depending on the weapon & cartridge choice. 22lr is definitely capable of killing. ER doctors & surgeons will testify as to how effective it can be. Is it ALWAYS as effective as it's center fire counterparts? No. But CAN it be as effective? YES, absolutely!
If you look into the percentage of incapacitating shots by handgun caliber & fatal shots by handgun caliber, you'll see many conflicting reports. The main commonality being that the majority percentage of homicides, fatalities & single incapacitating shots, usually shows 22lr at the top of most lists. And although the availability of guns chambered for 22 & cheap ammunition play a role, it only lends credence to the fact that the cartridge is clearly capable of lethal performance.
You have to remember that FBI standards in ballistics gel are only demonstrative of ONE type of test, under ONE type of controlled scenario, attempting to replicate ONE set of repeatable circumstances, of which are only measuring ONE particular means of achieving lethality or incapacitation. In other words, the FBI tests only cover a small portion of the many ways in which a person could hypothetically die from a gunshot wound.
A poorly placed 9 is much less effective than an accurately placed 22. If you're objective is to break contact & stop the threat, then yeah, it can be done with the 22. If you're objective is to drop a charging bear, then 22's prob a poor choice. Personal preference should favor the situation. If you live in a high risk area, carry accordingly to your risk.
In the end, I'm a firm believer in shot placement & training. Access your risk & use the gun & cartridge that you can best operate for your circumstances, it's better than nothing. If that happens to be a 22lr pistol then train & focus hard on shot placement. If a 22 is the only thing you currently have access to or is all you can afford at the moment (whether that be the cost or availability of the gun or ammunition), then find an ammunition that's reliable in your gun & go train with it. (This of course should be done regardless of your choice btwn centerfire or rimfire). When you get more comfortable, confident & capable, then move up when you're ready & can afford to.
Ppl who "poo poo" the 22 are usually the ones who have had limited life experiences with it. When you've grown up with it, put meat in the freezer with it & seen it, lived it, witnessed years of it's capabilities... then you already know & I don't have to explain it.
Great video though, thanks. Always appreciate the discussion & thoughts of others.
I think the video was talking about the common person who does not and probably will not train as much as enthusiasts.
I like this Ammo Mart guy, but your post explained more than the video did, in my opinion.
I humbly thank you for viewing the video and taking the time to respond with such a well thought out post. I totally appreciate your point of view and enjoyed reading your thoughts. Thanks again and be safe.
Well Stated & ABSOLUTELY CORRECT !! 🤨👍
A .22LR gut shot with a .22LR Federal punch just to the right of the belly button will put it through the left kidney. Take if from me, big guys who take a serious hit to the gut are not going to "just get mad." Of course 95% of the "big guys" are smaller than me at 6'3" and 200 pounds, but the ones bigger than me are not immune to pain. My experience with pain is limited to being hit by a car at 40mph and having my infected gallbladder die on me. I feel certain a 17" deep gut wound would take a lot of fight out of me. Of course, I have not battled zombies on crack like you all. In my day we just dealt with guys on "horse tranquilizers..."
I carry a SR22 with punch Ammo. I don't see an issue.
I don't either.
Agreed, in the unlikely event you even have to use a gun, the agressor will retreat 99% of the time once you start shooting back, regardless of caliber.
@@vikramgupta2326 absolutely
@2A-Mel The way I see it, In court, it's easy for me to say I didn't want to harm them if I'm using a 22lr. The weakest of almost all calibers. I carry it to deter people. I can dump that whole mag in under 2 seconds. With 2 more ready.
It’s really not an issue. Remember, these videos are just editorials. People expressing their opinions, their personal likes and dislikes. The only real verifiable facts are that people have used 22s to defend themselves forever. Are there more effective rounds? Sure. However, that a round is more effective doesn’t magically reduce the effectiveness of the 22. It still works just fine.
I agree with some of your opinions but then again totally disagree with others. The .22 is capable of stopping an attacker for sure. Is it the best choice? Probably not but it will work and work well.
Best choice? It might be. It's light, quick and accurate. That's all you need. Usually the first to be hit is the loser.
I have several pistols, .40 5” tactical, .45 1911, .380 body guard, and ruger mark 2 bull barrel target. If I knew I was going to be in a gun fight today, I would carry my ruger mark 2, from 2’ to 50 yrds I can easily hit an apple. And never misfired since around 2002 when I bought it.
First of all, nobody, literally nobody says that 22lr is a "very good" defense round. Even people who carry or advocate for it admit that it's just "good enough" or merely adequate. Everyone admits that surely there are better more capable rounds. However, one has always to determine the use case first. For example if you find yourself in potentially dangerous places often then by all means a 22 is a bad choice. But the truth is for many average people a good reliable 22 (yes there are such) is quite adequate for the typical day to day stuff like going to the office, stopping by the grocery store, walking in a park, etc. I would much prefer for more people to carry a 22 with them instead of much fewer people carrying a 9 or 45.
I think an 8-9 shot revolver in 22mag addresses 2 of the main complaints of this video while still getting the extremely low recoil
We often carry an 8 round Taurus 942 in .22wmr...we feel it can handle most problems we could encounter, loaded with Hornady or Gold Dots...
LCR in 22LR for recoil sensitive folks
Yeah,I have 2 revolvers in 22 magnum, and a couple 22 lr rifles. I highly recommend hearing protection when firing the 22 magnum, it's MUCH louder than 22 lr!
in pistol barrel lengths (especially under 5" barrels), 22mag is almost no increase over 22lr. You need 12+ inches of barrel to really start seeing increased performance from the magnum.
@@thorman944 I'll agree the magnum suffers in short barrels, but we like the Speer Gold Dot for short barrels in .22wmr...there is decent velocity, and the bullet might expand...with .22 any advantage is most welcome,
In 1969, a very good friend and distant family member was shot accidently with a .22 short from a single shot .22 rifle at close range, about 3 feet. I was told later the bullet hit him center chest and passed through him after hitting his heart. He died instantly. He was a really super kid at 16 years old and it was a tragic accident. Sad story and I still think of him today. He was saved by the Grace of God and I know his spirit is in Heaven today. Never underestimate the little .22 no matter what.
I clean my TX22 after every range day. I had to defend my home and the 22lr was the closest for me to grab. Nobody died but the attacker was stopped. Prior to this i was against carry of .22lr but i would feel comfortable carrying my TX22. The problem isn't with the 22 its with the people like i once was who just has an opinion but doesnt know from experience. Carry what you feel comfortable with and any projectile moving at 700 fps is going to make an attacker turn around and say "not worth it"
Any clean gun, especially .22 but any caliber, is another advantage...we are religious about cleaning, why give up anything we can control...
I had a high-school friend that was hit in the abdomen by a Ruger MK II. It was a accidental discharge from someone. He never made it to the hospital.
☹️😨😱😨😰
Bummer...we own a mark iv, and I've only briefly considered it's defensive value...two mags, 20 rounds total, reasonably accurate, in a pinch if I knew it needed to be loaded it could help...
@@PetuniaIii-pd1ww I've had a Mark II for 45+ years. You should practice a bit more as I can hit a dime at 15 yards at the age of 72 and I don't need glasses.
I love how people talk shit about .22lr as not good enough for defense. I was watching forensic files and a guy back in the 60"s was driving in high speed chase shot his .22lr snubnose revolver through his back car window at a cop car 50 yards away through the cops windshield and killed him, true show story look it up. I would be totally confident with .22lr in a defensive situation if that's all I had, better even with a 22 single shot firearm than my hands. Shot placement matters with any caliber, shoot someone in the chest 10 times with a 22 and see if he survives. Plus watch forensic files thousands of people got killed with .22lr firearms it will blow your mind how easy it is. Also you have to remember not every criminal is a drug crazed beast a lot of people will go into shock and stop or even die from just going in shock even if they get like shot in the foot.
If you're going to carry a .22lr, I think a .22lr revolver would be a better choice than a semiauto. Just my humble opinion.
I agree with you wholeheartedly for the reasons mentioned in the video. Thanks for watching and supporting the channel.
I just got a 22 revolver for that reason, the revolver feels so much more dependable.
Buy what you prefer. Then practice with it until your hands bleed. Learn how to use so that with it in your hand you will run it without thinking. That weapon will be the best you need. Just like driving a stick shift truck; once you get home, you cannot tell anyone how many times you shifted into third. The tranny has become part of you, just like your weapon should be.
22lr is just as deadly as a 9mm it all depends on who is behind the trigger
22 lr is much cheaper which means more range time, lots of us still carry revolvers. 30 yr veteran of albuq police dept and only know of 3 one shot stops,,a 30-30 center hit in back, 22 lr in the eye and a 22 lr in the base of the neck! I feel very safe with my 8 shot 22 revolver!
I saw a lady in a gun store considering between some giant bolt action 10ga antique (pretty cool) and a new Ruger 10/22. These where the only guns left in shop during the crazy times, I told her to get the 10/22 as her first gun. Don’t regret that suggestion at all, a .22lr makes a great first gun and have a gun you shoot well is better than no gun.
I think you did right...that 10/22 with good 10 rounds can be enough for vast majority of situations...a bolt action 10 gauge sounds ferocious but it would be heck to deploy for most women...
Kel tec p17 sure gives the 22lr more confidence knowing it can shoot 17 times with 3 mag in under a minute it is lethal !
Just picked up my P17 today and will be taking it to the range this week! Huge fan of 22lr since it’s so affordable to buy even when it’s “expensive” we can pickup a box of 50 for less than 8 bucks.
@@johnborges8231how has it been bro just got mine and going to shoot it soon
Kel tec 22 excellent 16 + 1` 3 mag dump.................. dump................... dump....................... man its great fun.
Work of art
Carrying
I had a Ruger mark 2 for many years. Never failed to feed. Rarely cleaned. Wish I still had it
My ruger mark 4 that I inherited from my grandfather is nasty accurate and never jammed
Although it's not my EDC......I would not hesitate to carry my TX22 loaded with 17 rounds of Federal Punch. I can shoot it accurately and I have used the Punch enough that I'm a believer in it's performance.
Agreed. I have a Sig P365 for EDC, but also own a TX22. When I load CCI Stingers or Federal Punch, I have no insecurity of it not stopping any attacker immediately. And the TX22 is hands down my most accurate shot.
Either of you still have the TX22? Has it stood the test of time?
@_skud still have mine. 325 rounds at the last range trip. Still going strong 💪
Truth being said nobody wants a speeding hot bullet in their body , getting hit once is enough for most people in their right mind to change their thought process. Thanks Bram C. I got shot with a BB gun and didn't want any more of that. It didn't penitrate but it hurt like hell!!
well you are obviously clueless about the real world of violence. There are a percentage of attackers who not stop until they suffer nervous system collapse (brain, spine shot) or they are incapacited from blood lost. Many people do not experience the full level of pain when they are on andreline and many will be unaware of their wounds. The biggest factor is that you are weak and ineffective in engage in combat and are afraid of death and have a low tolerance threshold for pain
Any bullet from any gun will severely injure someone impacting the right spot and if not it will still hurt like hell amd willmore than likely stop a threat unless the threat is a bear or someone numb on drugs
I am a 77 year old male and have arthritis in my arm and hands and find it very difficult to rack the slide on my Glock 45's and also hold on to the gun during recoil. I am seriously considering changing my everyday carry to the Ruger SR22 due to obvious reasons as my health deteriorates. Even a small bore gun such as the 22 is better than nothing.
A pistol in ANY caliber is not a primary weapon. The " tactical" market/ industry has done a phenomenal job convincing Joe six pack otherwise. The fancy ads, the sleek designs in every caliber you can imagine, the wiz bang wonder bullets in said calibers, "barrier blind" bullets, etc etc. A pistol is a SIDE arm, AKA a backup to a RIFLE. Unfortunately, most of us cant carry rifles in the civilian world. Most of us dont go looking for trouble, nor will most of us ever need our carry weapon to defend ourselves or a loved one.... and especially in a " Terminal List" type of scenario. All that said, I am pro gun and carry my LCP 2 in .22 everywhere I legally can. It is 100% reliable in my personal experiences and with the CCI mini mag I keep it loaded with at 10+1. Out of this pistol, this round averages around 920FPS and penetrates to FBI minimum standards of 10-12 inches. I feel perfectly fine and confidently arned. It's also a very legally friendly setup if in the slim chance I ever needed to justify my actions in front of a jury. It's a "small, non tactical" pistol and it's loaded with "small non threatening" cartridges.
Outstanding. Handguns for defense are a bad joke. We cannot get by with toting a rifle around the grocery store, so we opt for a lesser tool. Marketing to the testosterone crowd by manufacturers we have been led to believe that a 37 shot appendix carry 52 caliber gun is the one to go with. 99.9% of all handgun owners will never fire their weapon in a real confrontation. Yet may will spend upwards of $700-1,000 for a handgun that they never practice with and has dust bunnies in the barrel. Whatever caliber that weapon is makes NO difference.
Son you are wrong Ben through hundreds of thousands rounds you can kill every thing with this cartridge
1:42 the other reason I bring up is affordability. Shouldnt own a gun you can’t afford to become familiar with.
Squirrel hunting with a .22 lr rifle a few months ago. Doe walks out into the soybean field nearby. These deer were destroying the in short order about a quarter of the crop already had been eaten. One shot with a .22 stinger right underneath her. She dropped the bullet went into her throat and right into her. She stopped in her tracks.
I started shooting with .22lr as a kid, I have shot tens of thousands of rounds from semi-autos. I have had very few failures in my semi-auto pistols. If ever in the situation of having to protect myself, I am not stopping with firing one or two rounds. I am going to empty my magazine on the threat. I have no doubt that my hollow point or fragmenting .22lr will do the job. How much penetration do you really need to do "devastating damage" to stop an attacker?
.22 isnt weak against flesh bodys & it does a great job for self defense. The only way it wouldn't do a good job would be if the offender was wearing body armor
True, but then again, no pistol caliber is going to make a difference.
Aim for headshots
I have to disagree on some parts of this video. I have shot 22s for a lifetime and rarely clean them and they still work exceptionaly well. Have I ever had a fail to feed or extraction issue? Yes, but they have been few and far between and I've had issues with other more expensive guns also. No gun ever will be 100% flawless unless you shoot it once and it works and you never shoot it again!
The 22 rimfire (short) with a 29 grain bullet and 4 grains of black powder was released in 1857 for use in the S&W #1 revolver as a self defense weapon. Older shooters that can no longer control the recoil of a heavier caliber use the 22lr. I have been in a situation where I would have been glad to have a 22lr rather than nothing.
I have spent 30 years in level one trauma center ED's. My experience with 22lr is they fragment sending bits everywhere. Also they bounce around internally. I've seen people shot in the chest and the bullet end up in the groin destroying tissue the length of its path
Thank you for the video. I have a Sidekick 9 shot revolver, 22LR-22 Mag, 4.3 inch. I have found a round it likes that seems to be dependable and will expand, (usually) on impact. Winchester ,Super X 22LR, 40gr, 1435fps HP. of course you don't have to worry about feeding! I'm a revolver guy as I live in the forest and don't worry about "urban critters". The first to rounds are snake shot and the rest are for the bigger ones. I hope my input is useful?
I believe the .22lr was actually first chambered in Smith and Wesson revolver.
I kept one for a time as a self defense gun after hand surgery. I may have to rely on it during recovery after shoulder replacement.
If I recall some brief history from studying years ago, I think that the .22 Short was first designed for a S&W revolver, then the .22 Long. Both were a 29 gr classic ball shaped heeled bullet. Then the 40 gr LR was later designed for a rifle with it's more rifle like bullet shape, that's why .22 "Long Rifle" is it's literal name.
Measure from front to back of your chest then think about how far your heart and lungs are from just in side your chest all I got to say about the 22
Your body is gonna be softer than that damn jell there for penetrative farther even if it hits a rib
Using jell blocks for testing is the biggest joke on the market today
A hit with a 22 is better than a miss with a 9mm .
"22lr in my humble opinion will not pass the FBI test" *proceeds to be proven wrong with an N=3 😄
LOL. Yes, and the gun didn’t malfunction which was the other main reason he gave for not carrying 22lr.
Came here to say this
Good video. I agree, .22LR is weak. But… I wouldn’t wanna go up against a 10/22 with multiple 25-rnd mags.
I agree, a 22 semi-auto rifle with high capacity magazines, particularly one loaded with CCI velocitor, is a legitimate home defense weapon.
That argument is still ridiculous. If people can walk through being shot with 9mm multiple times, they sure as hell will walk through a 10/22 with 25rds. 22LR is good for plinking and squirrel hunting. That’s literally it. Don’t be saying, “but... but... shot placement over caliber!”
@@frawdulent Very, very, very, very few people walk through 9mm. Just as very, very, very, very few people would walk through a fulisade of 1400+ fps 22LR Velocitors launched from a semi auto rifle (that round achieves 12"+ penetrate in gel and reliably expands to about .40 caliber)
If they decide that 25 Velocitors is not reason enough to die, you can beat them to death with the rifle while they are busy bleeding out.
@@frawdulent Are you one of those peeps that beloved 45 is somehow “better” than a 9mm or even a 40?
@@colt10mmsecurity68 you caught me. I’m a .45 diehard.
In a survival scenario it's all about carrying enough ammo and killing small game for food, that and the accuracy of the Walther P22 makes it a necessary gun
Excellent choice I have the Walther P-22 and am considering the Walther 9mm caliber, with similar functions.
Wish you would had included .22 rifle review
You seem to characterize recoil sensitivity as something caused by lack of training or lack of familiarity with firearms. For some it is a medical issue, and is based on the physical characteristics of the hands. I formerly carried .45 ACP and 9mm, and would still prefer those calibers. My hands can no longer tolerate the recoil, so I am currently carrying a .22lr semi-auto. A larger caliber is simply not an option for me, not for lack of training, familiarity, or experience, but because of the medical condition of my hands.
Both my shoulders need replacement when that surgery is complete I will be in the same boat.
@@ftdefiance1 My sympathies, I hope the surgery goes well for you. I would recommend the Walther PPK/S 22 for pocket carry, the Walther PPQ 22 for open carry, or concealed carry with a little more care in how one dresses. I am also intrigued by the Walther WMP in 22 Magnum, but I have not had an opportunity to try one. I additionally have severe arthritis in my trigger finger, so a very smooth trigger is essential, and most Walther’s are very good in that regard.
Thank you for viewing Allen. I perhaps was not clear enough in my description of recoil sensitivity in the video. In my opinion, recoil sensitivity is caused by a mental reaction manifested in physical form, flinching on trigger press, etc. Having said that, you open up a very valid consideration for carrying the .22lr that I overlooked. There are numerous people who have strength and dexterity issues with their hands and I did not have that in my mind when filming. I will add that onto a video in the future and humbly thank you for pointing that out! Well done sir.
Hmm… Federal Punch and Winchester Silvertip. Both defense rounds, both easily cycle modern 22lr auto pistols, both deliver 100-105 ft/lb of muzzle energy. Most semi auto 22lr pistols can go hundreds of rounds between cleaning, reliably, with quality ammo. Incredibly accurate and low recoil allows for multiple follow up shots on target. Lastly. I never met anyone that willingly said “shoot me with a 22lr it’s weak". So all in all your assessment is flawed on multiple fronts.
Umm, the only thing I might argue is trusting a dirty gun...especially with .22 we have religion about cleaning after every range visit...every minor hedge helps...
Your argument at 1:30 is why my grandmother is swapping to a 22. She is small of stature and the recoil/report of the 380 she used to have is too much for her and she wanted something that fit her hand better (a sig p238 is too large for her hands) and that has less recoil.
The 22lr, the Rodney Dangerfield of calibers. It gets the job done and people still don't respect it. Hardened Killers caliber of choice, the 22lr. Some Government Agencies use the 22 lr...It amazes me how some people still try and discredit it.
Thanks for the video. 22 caliber seems to be on the rise for self defense. Perhaps a 32 long fired out of a LCR snubby would be ideal for shootability, ease of carry, and effectiveness.
I spent 50 years in Compton and Watts. Seen plenty of guys taken out of the fight with a .22. Is it the best, no.
But better than a knife, club, broomstick etc.
If a 22lr under stress wont thread the needle than a larger recoil impulse will make it that much harder
Yeah, that was one of his more ridiculous statements and there were a lot of them.
imo it's a question of ammunition quality. I recently shot through 100 rounds of cci with 2 dud rounds. reloaded and fired again only to still be dud rounds. i fired through federal punch defensive loads and did not have a single dud or failure of any type. for too long companies that produced 22lr have been comfortable with selling low quality ammo. premium 22lr fixes that
I havent finished the video yet but what about 22. revolvers? That would fix your reliability issue but brings with it difficulties reloading quick.
.22 rimfire first showed its face in smith and Wesson revolvers- chambered in .22 short sized cartridges, propelled by black powder and carried by many combatants during the American Civil War. Unfortunately after action reports or surgeons accounts are a bit lacking. Postwar accounts of folks being shot by small caliber arms are rife with lingering wounds resulting in infection and death
Q: What is the first message you telegraph to someone when you point a firearm at them?
A: "I am about to poke holes into you"
Do you think the target's first concern is how large or deep the holes will be?
The .22 puts more people in the ER or the Morgue than any other, but this is largely because it is so common - not because it is particularly effective or lethal. The data is what it is, and roughly equivalent with the .22 as compared to the service calibers. If the .22 causes more deaths per year, you can also bet that .22 victims survive much more often than from other, more powerful calibers as well.
Moreover, performance varies with barrel length and the type of action. A .22 rifle with an 18 inch barrel produces about 140 ft-lbs of energy (twice that needed for lethality) - from a two-inch barrel the same round is on the very cusp of lethality (67 ft-lbs). The case size of the .22 is pretty small. It would make sense to load it with a hot, fast-burning powder for maximum effect. Consequently, the powder is mostly ignited before the bullet has a chance to go more than a few inches down the barrel. After rising substantially from 2 to 6 inches and then a fraction more from 6 to 8 inches, the velocity for the .22 tends to flatten out after about 8 inches of barrel travel.
Can a small diameter round like a .22 Magnum with a velocity of 2000 fps, or a .22LR at 1200 fps be effective outside common service applications? An honest discussion about the relative merits of carrying a .22 in certain situations follows, but if a gunfight were imminent, a .22 handgun would be very low on my list and a 12 gauge double barrel loaded with #4 Buckshot would be very, very high. Two dozen #4 pellets (.24 lead balls traveling at about 1,200 fps) will definitely kill a large deer, or humans wearing normal clothing at close range. At longer ranges, however #4 buck may not be ideal for bringing down or neutralizing a threatening human or other large animal.
It should be remembered during this discussion that there is no progression in lethality such as dead, deader, and deadest, but that there are very real differences for the defensive shooter and his target among injured, wounded, incapacitated, and frightened off! The FBI standards, while informative, are designed for DUTY weapons. The speed at which you can present a weapon and shot placement are more important than big calibers in a personal defensive situation. Shot placement is vitally important. If you can’t hit with your chosen carry gun, pick something else. In some situations you only get one shot - make it count.
Encountering a motivated criminal who presses the fight against an armed citizen is exceedingly rare, but not impossible. Amazingly, not a single case has been found by researchers of an armed citizen killed by a criminal after the criminal had taken a hit by at least one .22 round. What’s more, government sponsored studies have found that the likelihood of victim injury was reduced from 10.9 percent before to 4.1 percent after brandishing any firearm. The victim injury rate after a defensive gun use was similar to using any other defensive weapon (5.3 percent) such as a knife or baseball bat, yet the elderly and infirmed are not going the swing a bat with the same authority as the young and athletic.
The best advice is to carry a gun that is reliable and shoots well. Research shows that most self-defense encounters resolve themselves as soon as the potential victim shows a weapon, or in just two shots. Nonetheless, you must have both the skill and the will to use your weapon in a confrontation.
In a summary of the data reported and published in American Handgunner Magazine (August 2018), the .22 reportedly required the least number of shots (1.38) to stop an attacker as compared to the other cartridges. Consider that the .22 stops were more likely “psychological stops” as opposed to physical incapacitations. Note that no caliber claimed a consistent “one shot stop,” but two shots usually did the job. The .38 SPL had the fewest rounds fired (not necessarily hits) to get a physical incapacitation (1.87). Conversely the 9mm had the most rounds fired to get an incapacitation (2.45). However, most 38 SPLs are fired from revolvers and most 9mm from semi-autos. The tendency to empty the magazine (i.e. magazine dump) in a stressful encounter MAY contribute to the inconsistency of the data. [ii]
While the .22 is clearly no dragon-slayer, it’s better than begging for help (or mercy), and no one expects a grandma in the doorway with a small “get off me gun”. Increased energy is the most notable feature of most modern cartridges including 22s. Anyone can shoot the .22LR, which is noted as a mild shooter, and the .22 Magnum has many of the terminal ballistic characteristics of the mild firing mid-sized .38 Special without the associated recoil.
Some experts from the law-enforcement and competitive shooting worlds argue that tactical pistol ammunition - no matter the caliber - is incapable of stopping a determined adversary without multiple shots in most cases. According to Ernest Langdon, a shooting instructor and respected competitive pistol shooter who has worked for gun makers such as Beretta, Smith & Wesson, and Sig Sauer, "You have to shoot people a lot with a handgun." Big caliber advocates will point to statements like these as proof of the ineffectiveness of lesser calibers. In a world where the one shot stop is a “myth” and shot placement is paramount, the low recoil, high capacity .22 would logically seem ideal according to these experts.
Easy to use, carry, and conceal, with quick follow-up shots and little chance of pass through penetration, Israeli sky marshals and commandos proved that .22LR caliber HPs could be used to stop terrorists and criminals. No group of armed professionals has ever used a .22 caliber pistol as effectively as the Israelis in a CQB (Close Quarter Battle) scenario.[i]
For the first time shooter wanting to purchase a self-defense carry weapon, you might try a revolver in .22 LR, or .22 Magnum for a little more power. Rimfire automatics can be picky about ammo, but revolvers will generally eat anything. The .22 Magnum has been around for a long time, but it is still a little off the mainstream. As a fun gun and as a practice tool, the .22LR is fine, but for the person relying for defensive needs on a larger caliber, the little .22 Magnum is great. Several manufacturers offer weapons that change cylinders from LR to Magnum with little trouble. This will widen the future uses to which you can put your weapon and allow for less expensive practice and recreational shooting, but in Single Action they may not be the best choice for self-defense. Many modern defensive revolvers retain a single action capability as a holdover from competitive target shooting from the 1900s to the 1950s, but this feature has little relevance in a modern self-defense context. Yet it is no slower to deploy than a lever action rifle. Weapons like the Double Action S&W 351 PD (Personal Defense), a 7-shot .22 Magnum revolver, or the Ruger LCR, a 6-shot .22 Magnum (or 8-shot 22LR), are designed for the self-defense purpose. - James M. Volo
All this interesting and I appreciate the videos, thank you. I'm left with a couple thoughts. I think the 22lr is a great choice for self defense, especially when over penetration is a concern. I choose my carry on the following 3 principals...1: always bring a gun to a gun fight. 2: would I want to be on the business end of the gun 3: do I trust my life to the gun functioning properly, when needed.
In this video and I think a lot of videos of this type, the underlying message is...train, be familiar and properly maintain your firearms, especially if you intend to carry.
If you believe the .22L doesnt have the stopping power of the 9mm, then SOMEONE explain to me why the Mossad TO THIS DAY prefers the .22LR over the 9mm?
A .22 will encourage a "smart" bad guy to head for the emergency room asap, a 9mm or better will encourage him to find an embalmer.
you have pellets also. that has 1160 fps. that well placed through an eye socket of any soft tissue location could also do damage.
I have several thoughts about .22 as a defensive round.
First, when you shoot someone with a .22, they don't know what caliber just hit them.
I have seen several stats that show a .22 will stop a an attack with a single shot.
Stopping power is not a good term to describe being hit with any handgun round.
With that said, I do agree that because a .22 is the least dependable cartridge, I would never recommend it as a primary carry round.
It does have it's place with some people and any firearm carried is always better than no firearm at all.
No one who says the .22 is no good for personal protection has ever agreed to take one in a stomach to test their theory.
I don't understand. Your video is about the ineffectiveness of .22LR for self defense, but everything in your video showed how effective it would be. Then you summarize by pretending you didn't see what you just saw: 1) reliability in that specific mag dump; 2) more than sufficient FBI gel test penetration; 3) significant damage to the poultry flesh. And your criticism is that the chicken didn't jump high enough? The FBI gel test and the FBI's research with actual data into the effectiveness of the .22LR reach a different conclusion from what you espouse. It's people like you who don't understand external ballistics or terminal ballistics who give gun channels a bad reputation. I would also note that you selected a pretty weak ammo for the first shots. Yesterday at the range I sent 20 rounds of CCI Mini Mag over the chronograph out of my Walther P22, and got an average velocity of 975fps. Try to do better.
I personally disagree with the lack of reliability of a modern .22 cartridge. I have three .22 rifles (Bergara B14R/Tippmann M4/Ruger 10/22) and i have only had the occasional FTF with the Ruger and that was when i tensioned the magazine spring incorrectly.
My ammo of choice is CCI Blazer HV for the semis and SK Standard plus for the bolt gun.
Keep the firearms clean and maintained, use good quality ammo and you should not have any problems in my opinion.
I use a revolver with 22 LR for self defense. 8 shots. No jamming. My back up a .380 high capacity 14 rounds semi auto. Would not us 22LR in a semi auto for the reasons discussed in video . Light weight so I always have them on me. I know bigger calibers are more effective but not if they are at home or in the trunk of the car.
Most gangbangers and burglars have never been fired on in an gunfight. With this in mind, it's who throws "the first punch" that will be the decisive shooter.
@@Bacpakin yep. Exactly
My only question for you. 22lr or no weapon for last ditch defense. I know which way I’m going.
For most hand guns it's all about hit placement. Plane and simple.
Despite the efforts of many manufacturers in developing an specific .22lr ammunition for self defense, I still rely on the so proven, time tested, CCI Target Mini-Mag 22 LR 40 Grain on pistols and revolvers.
Yes, I am among those who believe .22LR could be used by civilizians in self defense situations.
As somebody once said, the minimum caliber for self defense is the largest one the person can handle at its best.
Kindest regards from Brasil.
Well, I have had 1 Beretta M.21 # .22 LR since 1979 and, when traveling, I use it with Stinger HP, thank God I never lost confidence even though I didn't need to use it!
... "back-up" is 1 Taurus #.32 HP. . . !
The 22LR cartridge was developed in 1887 by the Stevens company for use in their several different top break model rifles as well as their bicycle and pocket rifle models, which were also top break designs.
Best explanation of the 22 lr I have ever heard.
I don't have a lot of experience/ knowledge with guns ,but I will give my 2 cents worth .18 months ago I bought a Taurus 942M,22 magnum revolver. For pocket carry. But found it's. WAY too heavy for that. But in the plus side it holds 8 rounds,with the reliability of a revolver.i would personally recommend, if you are going with a 22 for self defense, get a high capacity revolver in magnum,like that one,or get a quality 22 lr high capacity pistol.
You mentioned training… which caliber is someone more likely to train with?
Which caliber is more affordable to train with?
If you put those two criteria together, you will find that a lot of people that are sensitive become comfortable with a 22 . I think those people are more likely to also use the 22 with more confidence and a real life situation. If they are shooting 9 mm and never really like it and kind of dread it., consciously subconsciously that’s going to show up when they use it in a self-defense situation as well.
No matter which gun somebody chooses if they can’t shoot it comfortably in training and don’t have the desire to overcome the parts. They don’t like, I would say it’s not a good choice for them.
Usually the affordability if someone thinks self-defense is important enough, they will overcome that to some degree . I just haven’t seen them overcome the part of not liking the gun not liking to shoot it.
2 of 3 made it fully thru 16 inch block with punch.. fbi spec is 12 to 18 inches well within fbi spec. And lower recoil / easier to shoot no matter how much experience.
Although many 22's handguns are not nearly as reliable as their centerfire counterparts. A well broken in .22LR such as any of the Ruger MKIV pistols, a Ruger SR22 or the Ruger LCP2 in 22LR can be extremely reliable! With CCI Mini-Mags I find "most" .22LR pistols not only are reliable; that particular brand of ammunition CCI is extremely reliable; unlike federal punch which seems to only function reliably in some handguns. If you dive deep into the history of .22LR you will learn that the number of fatalities with the round is astonishing. Although I agree it is not an ideal caliber for person protection; I have NO problem using it for personal protection. A well known expert on .22's "Plinkster22" once took a .22LR stinger and shot the round through a titanium golf club. So never underestimate the capability of a particular caliber in the hands of someone that is proficient with it.
It wasn’t a stinger it was a stanger. If it’s from that guy you have to follow the rules….very important. Heck of a shooter! He does EDC a 9mm but I don’t be surprised if he’s got a lil 22 on him. I myself carry a 22 at least in a bag or stowed away in my work vehicle. I carry a .25 or .32 on me at all times. It’s the weight I’m focusing on. 22 is super lightweight and I can pack a lot of it.
I have the Keltec CP-33. She choked and gaged on most of the rounds for the first 5-6 magazines I fed her. She completely smoothed out now. I've fired hundreds of more rounds through it since. Not a single jam, ftf or stovepipe since. It uses a very reliable quad stack mag that holds 33 rounds. Very accurate at 50 yards shooting Winchester Super X (1300 fps). Excellent factory match trigger. I have a Primary Arms mini on it that seems like it was made just for it. I would easily trust my life with it.
If things went south in a bad situation with multiple attackers, one could put a shit ton of rounds downrange with a few extra spare mags and in a hurry on targets with barely any recoil.
Though I've not fired a gun in my life, I've seen plenty of videos on RUclips and is used to kill livestock - with good shot placement - and it's effective, however it doesn't look ideal if one's home is threatened.
Nothing with too much force that a family member or a friend ends up dead or disabled : thank you for your information.
#1 have a gun
#2 have a dependable gun
#3 have a accurate gun
#4 ammo that penetrates
Expansion is gravy
My wife has arthritis in her hands and .22 is about all she can handle. She also can’t rack most semi-autos. I bought a Ruger LR .22 and she can handle it just fine. Not the best self-defense gun, but 11 rounds of Federal Punch to the face beats pepper spray.
How does she do with the hard trigger pull on the LCR .22LR?
@@Blkojo Doesn’t bother her at all, but she can’t shoot any of my revolvers or rack the slide on any of my 9mm.
Speaking as a father of a teenage daughter, I can say from experience that for some, a well set up Ruger Charger in 22lr with a light, laser and suppressor is an excellent choice for a home defense weapon. Of course I have more powerful options for myself. But for her and my wife, I know they can mag dump into a five inch circle at ten yards. I agree though that if you’re competent with a larger caliber weapon, the 22lr shouldn’t be your first choice.
I know of a guy who got shot with a .22 in his leg (hunting accident) and he said it felt like someone hit him as hard as they could with a baseball bat he was in extreme pain. So even just one of those to the chest or head I think its sufficient enough for sure lol
My only criticism, why have the go pro on your noggin for your intro lol otherwise... great video my dude
I think you're making a huge (and erroneous) assumption here right up front since you're focused on the CALIBER only, not on TACTICS as well -- meaning, the OTHER half of the "self-defense equation" (if you will). But then MOST people only consider the gun/caliber they're going to carry, not how they'll USE it (tactics)...a HUGE oversight, IMO.
Yes, the "Stopping Power" of ONE round of 22LR certainly IS pretty "sketchy" since of course it's universally known it has the least "stopping-power" (however that's defined) of all the usual handgun calibers (25ACP is debatable) carried for self-defense. However, WHO -- and REGARDLESS of caliber, be it 9mm or 45ACP -- shoots a threat only ONCE? You shoot MULTIPLE times as fast as you can and still be on target....the low-recoiling 22LR is the best caliber to do this with. So in THAT context, you'll likely shoot a 22LR 3-5 times -- as if it's on full-auto (!)-- before even waiting to see what the first shot does. Consequently, if a 22 LR only has a "33% one-shot-stop" track-record, then shooting the threat 3 times would be a 99% stop, yes? ;-)
I'm being a bit facetious here, but it doesn't alter my point: What threat is going to take 3-5 shots in its face/brain (first target choice) or heart (2nd choice), spinal cord (a "long" shot but COULD happen) and still be a threat? MAYBE, but really not at all likely.
So yes, I agree that ONE shot of 22LR would have to be spot-on (instantly disrupt the Central Nervous System) like the brain (bullet must reach the rear of the brain, not just the frontal lobe) to make an instant stop -- not sure how many people are THAT good of a marksman -- but several shots to the face/eyes/brain? Heart/neck/groin artery hits depend on severe blood loss to incapacitate a threat -- it'll take maybe 15-20 seconds for the threat to bleed out so, so you KEEP SHOOTING until it isn't...however many shots that will take.
Who knows...
IMO, the 22LR is a VERY viable self-defense/EDC (Every Day Carry) choice...that is, IF you can shoot it well enough to stay on-target firing 3-5 shots at said target as quickly as you can. With a large-capacity 22LR pistol (16rds or so) like the Kel Tec P17 or Taurus TX22 -- two popular 22LR semi-auto pistols presently -- you can do that and still have ammo left in your magazine in case the threat is not alone. ;-)
JMO...
-- BR
Just curious and maybe I missed it but which round did you shoot at the poultry the 40 grain S&B or the Federal Punch?
I think 22 LR is a great training round. Great plinker round. Good at dispatching Trash Pandas too! Thanks for the share!!
WINCHESTER SILVERTIP is also another self defense round segmenting hollow point
I've used Ruger Mark-series pistols since the late 70s. I have a great deal of confidence in it for defensive use unless one is facing multiple assailants. Companies are now polishing their .22 rounds, so they are no longer dirty. I go to the range and go through dozens of rounds with no duds. Yes, one will get the occasional dud, but they are now so rare I hardly notice.
If one depends on .22LR for defense, I recommend specialty ammo. These are clean, quality rounds, and your gun should be clean and a good quality CLP lightly used. I don't use, or recommend, cheap pistols like the Jennings J-22, but I'll tell you this, I haven't had one single misfire or failure of any kind with my CCI Mini-Mags. I've shot about 200 rounds through it, and yes, I had some jams with cheap ammo like the Remington Thunderbolts, but I stopped using it. Don't use it.
Buy, and use, CCIs or other good ammo.
Recently built a Midwest industries 10/22. Put 6 consecutive BX-25 mag dumps with federal bulk ammo and not a single hiccup. In a self defense situation, I would trust it with my life. My point of aim might just be a bit higher on target.
I carry a Taurus Ultra Lite 22lr and it carries 9 rounds. I like it because it is light and I know that I can put rounds where I want too. I have many other guns but I like this little gun. If I could carry another it would be my S&W 9mm EZ. or my Glock 43X with a 15 round mag.
Your point at 2:15 about fouling assuring that reliability will be a problem is an outdated opinion. It was outdated when you uploaded this video. Defensive oriented modern semi automatic .22's have improved a lot in the last 15 years. The reviews coming in on the TX22 for example are phenomenal in terms of reliability. I have one myself, well over 1000 rounds in it since it was cleaned, and a student used it in a class yesterday. She put 250 rounds through it without a single problem. I'm purposely delaying cleaning it to see how long it will go without a malfunction.
Your point at 2:40 is silly too, no matter how much you spend on any machine, at some point all mechanical processes will fail.
So I'm new'ish to guns... can someone explain this to me: Why do you need so much penetration for "stopping power" and to neutralize your target. The ballistics gel shows 8" pen with the Self Defense rounds. Now I'm no doctor, but unless you're shooting a fat guy in the gut, isn't 8" deep enough to pop any organ in the human body? Or is ballistics gel not representative of human penetration? Confused.
I think his last statement is the most intelligent assessment of using 22lr for self defense. It's utility is in using it to train past the reasons it was selected. To gain competence and confidence to graduate to a larger more effective caliber.
Which leads me to ask, what about .32 h&r magnum?
I've always wanted something in 327fed so I could shoot the entire 32 fam. Would be SO practical if only the ammunition was more available & affordable. If I ever DID get into it, I'd have to start reloading the family of cartridges.
327 is such a little powerhouse, esp from a levergun.
That's a spicy meatba-... I mean, cartridge. 🔥🔥🔥
@@thereindeertherabbitthebat592 Again, the most intelligent thing I read about the 327, I read on a forum. In the midst of a sea of "Its a solution looking for a problem", I found a reply that said "Yes, if you don't reload. But if you do a whole new world opens up to you."
I don't reload, but that's an economic decision. I'd like to get my house paid off before the dollar crashes. 1 more hobby or caliber I can't justify right now. But yeah, the 32's look fascinating.
I'd love to get a .327 or .32h&r, but like y'all the economy comes into play...my studies indicate .32s&w is similar to .22lr, and .32s&w long might be okay in a wadcutter...I put that out here because it might be more affordable, or easier, to find a revolver for .32s&w long...
@@PetuniaIii-pd1ww I keep coming back to the LCR. Like so many have said, it's perfect for .32h&r. A 3" barreled sp101 would be perfect for .327 federal magnum.
But now that the 30 super carry is out, would a semi be better?
@@kurt5490 ain't it pure hell having choices...Hoss, you will eventually go with what your gut tells you, so right now you know what you want...as for .30 super carry, I haven't studied the caliber so I can't advise...but again, whatever firearm you decide to acquire will be fine, and if it isn't you will trade in for the next...nothing wrong with the LCR (Well, I'd prefer the LCRx but that is just a preference), or the SP101...and honestly, the SP101 would last forever, constructed as it is...I don't have the cash laying around for a SP101, but if you are close I'd say hang in there, and get that bad boy...I've never heard anything bad about them...back to semi-autos, they have their good/bad points, just like revolvers...you're back to the choices thing again...assign heads/tails to your choices, and when you flip a coin you will know how you want the outcome to be...
I don't agree with the .22Lr not being a good self defense round i carry .22Lr,.380,or9mm depending on the situation. And feel very comfortable with any of them if you put 6or8 .22Lr in the face or pelvic area at 5-15 feet the attack is over. As far as FBI standards go i don't put much stock in that.
I don't know that I would use the term "stopping power" when describing the 22 round. But I do believe that "discouraging power" would definitely be fitting.