To Tarik Pasik thank you for your part as well and the podcast guys as well this case is just creepy but thank you for keeping her and Maura Murray’s cases alive
This man is so brave! I'd be terrified to put my name out like that after putting out this info. I live in NH,really close to VT. I always thought nothing bad happens here. Because Brianna and Maura,I'm much more aware of my surroundings.
This case always hit close to home because I grew up an hour away and was the same age as Brianna. A few things really stick out to me on this one. First of all, the fight she had with Caleigh LaCrosse was because Brianna had supposedly flirted with LaCrosse's boyfriend at the party they were attending. After a heated argument Brianna went outside and sat in her boyfriends car. LaCrosse came out, tapped on the window, and when Brianna rolled it down LaCrosse punched her in the face. I do not believe this had anything at all to do with her disappearance. It's pretty much a known fact that Brianna was beginning to dabble in hard drugs, specifically crack cocaine. There was a rumor that she was interested in buying a large quantity of the drug, possibly to sell or use, probably both. She fronted at least $1k to the dealer(s) who had made big promises to her. She was too young and naive to realize he planned on keeping the money all along. I believe that it wasn't a huge secret as to what was going on with the money, and that at the mall Brianna ran into someone whom she got info from that she wasn't getting the drugs or money back after all. That's a lot of money to anyone let alone a hard working 17 year old. Brianna was quiet the whole drive home and of course agitated. Now, I believe that regardless of what her mother said or asked her that Brianna would not have said anything in regards to the truth since it most likely involved a lot of money and hardcore drugs. In other words, I really dont believe it would have mattered if her mother spoke up and asked her what was wrong. Assuming this is true, and I believe it is, would you tell your mother at 17? Now, one of the things that stands out to me the most about this entire case, and also backs up my theory, is the note Brianna left for her roommate. First of all, Brianna had NEVER left a note like that before. Second, Brianna knew that her roommate was not going to be home that night...so why leave it?? I think Brianna had made some phone calls before work that night to figure out what was going on and when she realized she was getting ripped off a grand she most likely threatened the person/people. Now, this is significant because they were serious hardcore drug dealers and a naive 17 year old threatening to go to the police is a very, very serious threat that can, and will, bring them down hard. I think he/they basically said something like "Okay, I'll give you your money back, meet me at XXXX right after work." I believe Brianna had a VERY BAD feeling about this but forced herself to go through with it because...well, a thousand bucks. Hence why she left the note just in case. I also want to mention another significant clue here, Brianna was always one to want to hang out after work with friends and/or coworkers and almost always did. However, when her coworkers invited her to stay with them that night she had declined, saying she had to work the next morning. So, obviously common sense says that Brianna had somewhere to be that night. Obviously I have no idea what happened after that, but I dont believe she was killed right there. I believe she was taken and killed sooner than later but my best guess would be that they kept her in the basement for a day or so and then killed her and disposed of her body. This is a very sad case overall and I truly hope it is solved one day, but I dont think it will be. Well, that's my theory. I've been following this case since day 1 and have been down the rabbit hole many times. Some may not agree with this theory and thats okay, but it's the only one that makes enough sense for 99% of the puzzle pieces to fit. Every other theory has major holes, alibis, etc. This one is also backed up by several facts that fall perfectly into place. Plus, way too many coincidences for it not to be true. Other than serial killers almost all murder victims know their killer one way or another. This case is no exception.
Well I do know if someone threatens serious crack and herion dealers that they are going to police you just signed your death warrant.. no point giving the money back you've already said your thinking about going to the police what if you give her the money back and she goes to the police anyway out off spite that you were trying to rip her off....or they met up took her to the house on the promise off the drugs and boom game over...but I don't think she would be that naive to go with people willingly that you've threatened on your own or even with someone I wouldn't...I would say I want to meet you in a very public place and hand me an envelope or the drugs...if they asked you to go anywhere out the way you know your getting shot....or maybe they said how can we be sure your not gonna go to the police anyway and she had to do something so they had security from her ..
Claim about the phone calls make sure whole story fall apart because she didn’t make any calls at work and it’s been confirmed that the drug dealers didn’t front money so also, that theory falls apart
There’s literally no pieces that fall together in this case there is absolutely no way she did that much money first of all, and the theory falls apart. Once you realize she didn’t make any phone calls from the apartment or work so how can she meet anyone because a majority of her friends did not know where she worked outside of the ex-boyfriend so this theory falls way apart do I think the drug dealers are assholes? Absolutely but I don’t think they are culprits here
Two people can keep a secret if one of them is dead, it is said. If that's true, how in the hell do 15 people keep a secret? No way did 15 people, or even close to 15 people, witness what happened to Brianna.
Criminals have come to realize that rural areas have less “heat” than urban areas, so more and more of these thugs are moving to remote areas to ply their trade, virtually unhindered. Young, naive people who are seeking a thrill will associate with these shifty characters, and then discover the hard way that people who engage in criminal activities can be quite ruthless.
how sad makes me grateful to hug my daughter as they say it takes a village to raise a child and now we as and a nation to find them how horrific that stuff like missing children and sexually abused children even exist....may God watch over our children where ever they are
Exactly, you can't collect money from a dead person you break their fingers etc. Killing someone only brings heat down on you and is bad for business. This wasn't about owed money.
I find it very weird that the police never mentioned this individual. If he is a local farmer involved in narcotics surely the police would know by now. The more I read about this case the more is seems that some are trying to wipe this case under the rug.
Picked up a local hitchicker the other day, spoke w a few ppl at some near by businesses. NO ONE will say a damn and if you go through this town, there is ZERO indication anyone is missing a young woman. TOO CLOSE to the boarder to speculate... with the countless numbers of women trafficked. The RUMORS are more like people TRYING to get street credit. LOOK at the BIGGER picture.
Pure speculation here...trying to piece this together without anyone being specific about anything. I am wondering if at some point, Brianna, being outspoken as her father mentioned as one of her character traits, threatened someone in this group or groups of by saying she would go to the police about something. If one of them was this local farmer boy whose family owned the pig farm, and who was apparently the subject of the fight between Keallie Lacross (sp?) and Brianna, the fight may not have been over jealousy, but rather her direct threat. The situation could've been made known to Ramon Ryans and Nathaniel Jackson, who obviously had much more at stake and were prompted to take action to remove her from the picture. In one of the other Crawlspace videos, at the end, a bombshell was dropped saying James Robatelli (sp?), the ex-boyfriend (he couldn't have been ex that long as they appeared to be together as of a couple weeks prior to the disappearance) touched her car that night. I assume his previous story was that he drove by, noticed she wasn't there and went home. I don't know if he changed his story after it became known that the police had a dna sample or not, but his story did change for some reason. I haven't seen anything more specific on that comment. He would've been the one she trusted in this group of locals/non-locals, who may have gotten her to stop at the farm in the first place, if it wasn't a complete ambush. He may have been the one she talked to outside when with her mother who may have warned/threatened her? Felt like that was alluded to in one of these videos. Since it also appears the police do believe there was a struggle at her car, where it appears she backed up in a panicked haste, resulting in becoming stuck on the foundation, then this was not a friendly, let's party gone wrong drug overdose. The stories that Megan and Katie have settled on could simply be confusion as a result of their trust in whoever they heard the story from, or worse, misdirection as a result of coercion. This case most definitely suffers from a lack of individuals going on public record. Whether that is a result of complicity or fear, I do not know. But until somebody goes on record, all there can be is speculation.
One more thing, if she did actually meet this Joker dude at some point, she could identify him so that puts her up there in the very dark mix. If he was out of prison for a couple days, (not clear on this information), then he may have felt compelled to "handle" the situation. It more than likely was not about collecting some petty sum of money, since dead people typically do not pay off their debts. Makes more sense that this was about her being a potential snitch. Have not seen anything about the Joker's working relationship with Ramon or Nathaniel or the amount of direct involvement he had with locals. It would seem like these types of disappearances would be commonplace if drug dealers are continually exposing themselves to local kids who have no real sense of the potential danger. Or is commonplace, but this one is simply lacking enough evidence to prosecute?
another one like Maura Murray or Leah Roberts disappearance for example...I can't imagine the "not knowing what happened to my child if I was in that parent"s shoes...I hope these families can at least someday get some sort of closure cause its sad to think about!!!
I cant think off many things worse...having to re live it everyday..I mean your never gonna get over your child's death but in time you will accept it and allow yourself at least try and live again...but if you have no clue if there alive or dead everyday your gonna be in limbo till the day you die wondering if there still alive somewhere and need your help
How could this not be connected when they both went missing in the exact same way, around the same area in the US and only a month apart?! This seems like it can't be a coincidence. I dont think it's this common for young women to go missing in this way.. Idk I could definitely be wrong. It could just be a crazy coincidence. Or the person who did this was trying to make it look like the Maura Murray case to throw people off? Idk just a thought.
@@adamant5550 very true…👍🏻 it was only about a month later and the similarities are very close in MO. It makes you wonder if there is a sex trafficking thing that both girls got abducted into.
@@danilecashin4126 I think the similarities end when you take away the fact that both disappeared after a seeming car accident. Maura was not from the area and the circumstances leading to her disappearance are very different from Brianna's who was from the area and was involved with dozens of other young people. Sex trafficking is a possibility, but I really have never bought into the serial killer theory, specifically with Maura, as her driving on that road at that time was purely coincidental.
Truly enjoy your Missing Maura Murray podcast, and the multiple guests you have brought on, especially my favorite podcasters from The Generation Why, but this was an episode I wish I had truly skipped not to do with the case, but solely due to the guest ; but hey this is an awesome and respectfully done free podcast series, that I have been listening to since May of 2016. This episode though was extremely vague that I could barely get through this though. Hoping for a different more in depth podcast if another one is in the works.
Alot off these murders it rarely turns out to be some big time drug dealers more often than not its there friends or a neighbour or the postman or something
I might be missing something but, I believe these two cases have nothing in common with one another. Besides the obvious, that they are both missing persons, whose cars were both wrecked and abandoned.
If one can shed light on the other, then its a good thing. It sounded as if in the case of Brianna Maitland, that a lot more information on who could be responsible for her disappearance is known, at least by some anyways.www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/19200/13
I don't know much about this case, and I'm a little confused. Is he saying that she was involved with a gang of people who were involved in drugs/drug trade, and she started to pull away from them, therefore they killed her? And if so, why would a 17 year old and her presence be so important to a group involved in the drug trade?
Cleared on the basis of what exactly? In the case of the Yorkshire Ripper, police questioned the killer twice and let him go each time thinking he wasn't involved. I bet this happens a lot. False alibis? Lazy police work? Incompetence? Rural Vermont police probably don't have a lot of experience in murder investigations.
Bigwave2003 No matter how things ended, if you see your ex’s car on the side of the road at 4am, don’t you go check it out? Or call your ex about it to see if they’re okay?
One thing this guy left out is….. why she was killed. You can say drugs. But did she owe money? Was she going to squeal? Why was she killed by so many.
After listening to this It made me think. Drugs, Drugs Drugs in Rural areas. Going a city to a rural area I can't tell you how many young people are using drugs besides opiods. My ex was so addicted to methafedrin, while in college. Keeps you awake like speed. In Wisconsin truckers use it to keep them awake. People become very emotional when they become addicted to it. It is not to far fetched that both these girls have drug addictions.
There is a video on here of Brianna's friend who was interviewed by a news stations. She said she had talked to Brianna before she went missing and Brianna owed the wrong people money for the wrong thing. Do you find this friend creditable? Also it is amazing how there could be 6-10 people involved in Brianna missing and no one has talked. I figured with that many people involved someone would have said something after all these years. Also Tarik where have you gotten your information? Did you get it from the police or from people who are close to the case? Since you seem to know a lot do you know do you know if they've tested all these suspects d.n.a against the d.n.a left in Brianna's car?
They asked her if she thought Brianna was still alive? Her friend said no, she talked to Brianna two days before she went missing and she owed the wrong people for the wrong thing. If the friend isn't lying she basically said Brianna told her she owed people money for drugs. Now the friend didn't come out and say drugs, but I'm guessing that's what she was implying? Why would the friend come out and lie? Now I ain't not body language reader, but the friend seemed to be telling the truth to me.
Pasic TP I wouldn't be surprised if she did know, but there isn't evidence to prove it. It could be hearsay as well. To me the way Katie talked it seems Brianna let her in on her troubles. Do you know if Katie Manning ever talked to police?
Pasic TP so you do or don't think she knows more? I think Brianna may have told her that she was gonna be meeting up with someone and that's how Katie knows someone was in Brianna's car. Then again Katie may know more and is scared to say. According to you there seems to be a whole bunch of people involved? Didn't you say 6-10 people? I'd be scared to talk if I were Katie. If that many people could get rid of Brianna what's getting rid of others to them? They haven't got caught yet. It is so scary to think that whoever did this is out there walking around free! I hope Brianna is found soon and the guilty people are brought to justice.
Pasic TP if you say there are 6-10 people involved that tells me that you may know some of the ones you think are involved? I know there are something's you can not say, but can you say what exactly you think happened and why she disappeared?
I enjoyed the show and it gave some good information. I give the journalist credit from Germany for following this case shedding some new light on it and investigating it. However he may not know how crime works in the U.S. 15 people are you kidding. These criminals in the drug world can't keep their mouths shut for 5 minutes after having a drink or smoking weed. Usually people involved in the drug trade will get arrested often for various things. The chances of 15 people being involved and not saying anything is like a thousand to 1 chance. The first of them that got arrested for anything would be like I have some info on a murder if you cut me a deal. Now 2 people maybe 3 I get but 15 no way. I know he said up to 15 and maybe but that theory doesn't get much of a second thought.
Truly enjoy your Missing Maura Murray podcast, and the multiple guests you have brought on especially my favorite podcasters from Generation Why, but this was an episode I wish I had truly skipped not to do with the case, but solely due to the guest ; but hey this is an awesome and free podcast series that I have been listening to since May of 2016. This episode, particularly the guest was so vague and uninformative that I could barely get through this. This woman deserves better than what was presented in this podcast. I'm hoping for a follow up with a different guest(s). This woman deserves more respect than what the guest presented in this episode.
I'm curious if Brianna & Maura knew each other… Maura search on MapQuest: Burlington, Stowe. Ok because she went on holidays on october But Berkshire!!! Strangely enough area where Brianna lived and worked… Why? Schedules each other since october 2003? Sorry but I don't speak English very well
Sorry, I don't speak English. Moi aussi, je serais curieux de savoir si Maura et Brianna se connaissaient. En octobre 2003, Maura était allée avec son père dans les montagnes du Vermont aux alentours de Stowe et de Burlington. N'aurait-elle pas pu y faire la connaissance de Brianna? Où vivait Brianna et que faisait-elle lorsque Maura se trouvait avec son père près de Stowe? De plus, pourquoi Maura avait-elle fait des recherches sur Mapquest pour se rendre aux Berkshires? Avait-elle rendez-vous avec Brianna qui justement travaillait à proximité de Berkshire? ... Je suis persuadé que, pour que l'enquête avance, il faudrait que les enquêteurs établissent les emplois du temps de Maura et de Brianna depuis le mois d'octobre 2003.
Added comment on Maura. Do you know you are drug tested in the Nursing field ? Could Maura have been ephedrine and realized her career was coming to a halt. I can't tell you how many people take this drug to keep you awake. I believe she planned her disappearance.
@Tarik Pasic I've often heard that rural people are very suspicious of strangers. I got a taste of that suspicion on my photographic visits to very rural non-tourist areas. I'm curious as to what they think when drug-dealing strangers come to their area.
Okay one more post as I listen along to this. Did the guy just say she knew she was going to die and be murdered but because she was 19 she went. Maybe I misheard it. I mean 19 is not 2 years old who in their right mind would go to a place with friends if they told you and you knew they wanted to kill you. I respect this guys effort into this case and he seems like a decent journalist but man the theories are out there.
Yes I spoke wrong I apologize Canada not Germany. I actually agree with 95 percent of what you said. I think there possibly was a situation like you said. For example maybe she owed money for drugs she was fronted and was going to meet the dealer and tell him I'll pay you soon. A situation where her friends might have said it's no big deal but she thought it could be worse but figured I'll work it out with that person. Then it went bad that I'd agree too. The only part I disagreed with was the wording of she knew what was going to happen. A 17 year old is usually a Junior or Senior in High School. They are young and don't always think like an adult but if you are going to a situation that you think you are going to get killed you may want to think that over or show some resistance. I also agree more than one person was involved. You stated that well again I'm agreeing with most of it. The only part is the number 15. You watch any episode of The first 48 and the only thing you know for sure is if 2 people committed a crime and are getting arrested they are going to blame the other person and say they did it and I was just standing there. So if you take a group of 15 people involved in the drug trade who are bound to continuingly get arrested they will talk. Soon as the detective says you could do 5-10-15 years first thing they will say is I have some information on a murder to help their own cause. Overall I enjoyed the interview and respect the time and work you put. I'm simply disagreeing with those couple points the same way you might think my opinion is wrong.
Brianna believed everyone was good and pure by default, I'm not saying she 100% knew what was going to happen BUT there is a possibility that she did not take a potential threat as seriously if she should have. And I'm not blaming her for it, she was a 17 year old girl.
oh i thought same state..my bad OWWW.. but to add their are truckdriver killers..I DONT THINK A KILLER IS GOING TO STAY PUT,,SOME TRAVEL..AND BOTH ARE SIMILER HOW THE CARS WERE LEFT~
Yeah, that's Brianna three weeks prior to when she disappeared. Initially attention was directed towards the woman who did that to her. At the present time it would appear that was a red herring... that bigger fish were involved. What is known is Brianna simply wanted peace and to live a life with friends and lovers.,,OH WELL NOW I KNOW IT WASNT A SERIAL KILLER WHO DID THIS,, iT THAD TO BE THE WOMEN WHO DID THIS TO HER,,ALL MAKES SENSE!!! Reply
oky possible not serial killer,,,but i will say this police always leave their jurisdiction ..i got a ticket from a police in a total wrong jurisdiction..he was way far off..like an hr from his area.. in the Maurry case ..it goes down to 3 people police bus driver and the people who lived by the crime scene~
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To Tarik Pasik thank you for your part as well and the podcast guys as well this case is just creepy but thank you for keeping her and Maura Murray’s cases alive
In France , we also know Maura and Brianna cases........
Ah bon? Je n'étais pas au courant.
She may be 17 in the photo but her eyes are so old. She’d lived a lot of life to be so young, but not nearly enough.
This man is so brave! I'd be terrified to put my name out like that after putting out this info.
I live in NH,really close to VT. I always thought nothing bad happens here. Because Brianna and Maura,I'm much more aware of my surroundings.
This case always hit close to home because I grew up an hour away and was the same age as Brianna.
A few things really stick out to me on this one. First of all, the fight she had with Caleigh LaCrosse was because Brianna had supposedly flirted with LaCrosse's boyfriend at the party they were attending. After a heated argument Brianna went outside and sat in her boyfriends car. LaCrosse came out, tapped on the window, and when Brianna rolled it down LaCrosse punched her in the face. I do not believe this had anything at all to do with her disappearance.
It's pretty much a known fact that Brianna was beginning to dabble in hard drugs, specifically crack cocaine. There was a rumor that she was interested in buying a large quantity of the drug, possibly to sell or use, probably both. She fronted at least $1k to the dealer(s) who had made big promises to her. She was too young and naive to realize he planned on keeping the money all along.
I believe that it wasn't a huge secret as to what was going on with the money, and that at the mall Brianna ran into someone whom she got info from that she wasn't getting the drugs or money back after all. That's a lot of money to anyone let alone a hard working 17 year old.
Brianna was quiet the whole drive home and of course agitated. Now, I believe that regardless of what her mother said or asked her that Brianna would not have said anything in regards to the truth since it most likely involved a lot of money and hardcore drugs. In other words, I really dont believe it would have mattered if her mother spoke up and asked her what was wrong. Assuming this is true, and I believe it is, would you tell your mother at 17?
Now, one of the things that stands out to me the most about this entire case, and also backs up my theory, is the note Brianna left for her roommate. First of all, Brianna had NEVER left a note like that before. Second, Brianna knew that her roommate was not going to be home that night...so why leave it?? I think Brianna had made some phone calls before work that night to figure out what was going on and when she realized she was getting ripped off a grand she most likely threatened the person/people. Now, this is significant because they were serious hardcore drug dealers and a naive 17 year old threatening to go to the police is a very, very serious threat that can, and will, bring them down hard.
I think he/they basically said something like "Okay, I'll give you your money back, meet me at XXXX right after work."
I believe Brianna had a VERY BAD feeling about this but forced herself to go through with it because...well, a thousand bucks. Hence why she left the note just in case. I also want to mention another significant clue here, Brianna was always one to want to hang out after work with friends and/or coworkers and almost always did. However, when her coworkers invited her to stay with them that night she had declined, saying she had to work the next morning. So, obviously common sense says that Brianna had somewhere to be that night. Obviously I have no idea what happened after that, but I dont believe she was killed right there. I believe she was taken and killed sooner than later but my best guess would be that they kept her in the basement for a day or so and then killed her and disposed of her body.
This is a very sad case overall and I truly hope it is solved one day, but I dont think it will be. Well, that's my theory. I've been following this case since day 1 and have been down the rabbit hole many times. Some may not agree with this theory and thats okay, but it's the only one that makes enough sense for 99% of the puzzle pieces to fit. Every other theory has major holes, alibis, etc. This one is also backed up by several facts that fall perfectly into place. Plus, way too many coincidences for it not to be true. Other than serial killers almost all murder victims know their killer one way or another. This case is no exception.
Unfortunately since it is another theory, this remains to be unseen.
Well I do know if someone threatens serious crack and herion dealers that they are going to police you just signed your death warrant.. no point giving the money back you've already said your thinking about going to the police what if you give her the money back and she goes to the police anyway out off spite that you were trying to rip her off....or they met up took her to the house on the promise off the drugs and boom game over...but I don't think she would be that naive to go with people willingly that you've threatened on your own or even with someone I wouldn't...I would say I want to meet you in a very public place and hand me an envelope or the drugs...if they asked you to go anywhere out the way you know your getting shot....or maybe they said how can we be sure your not gonna go to the police anyway and she had to do something so they had security from her ..
Do you believe these dealers are still in the area?
Claim about the phone calls make sure whole story fall apart because she didn’t make any calls at work and it’s been confirmed that the drug dealers didn’t front money so also, that theory falls apart
There’s literally no pieces that fall together in this case there is absolutely no way she did that much money first of all, and the theory falls apart. Once you realize she didn’t make any phone calls from the apartment or work so how can she meet anyone because a majority of her friends did not know where she worked outside of the ex-boyfriend so this theory falls way apart do I think the drug dealers are assholes? Absolutely but I don’t think they are culprits here
Two people can keep a secret if one of them is dead, it is said. If that's true, how in the hell do 15 people keep a secret? No way did 15 people, or even close to 15 people, witness what happened to Brianna.
satanic cults can keep secrets. freemasons also..lots of them but you wouldnt know it.
@@mistaleesreversespeech7728 Knock it off with the woo. You’re not contributing anything useful to the conversation.
Criminals have come to realize that rural areas have less “heat” than urban areas, so more and more of these thugs are moving to remote areas to ply their trade, virtually unhindered. Young, naive people who are seeking a thrill will associate with these shifty characters, and then discover the hard way that people who engage in criminal activities can be quite ruthless.
Sounds like Tarik and the Police already know who did this they just can't provide it. Wish it was that easy for Maura.
They do, I do, if you do enough research you will know, too.
I agree
how sad makes me grateful to hug my daughter as they say it takes a village to raise a child and now we as and a nation to find them how horrific that stuff like missing children and sexually abused children even exist....may God watch over our children where ever they are
The two paychecks tell me she showed the perps and they werent interested in paychecks.
Exactly, you can't collect money from a dead person you break their fingers etc. Killing someone only brings heat down on you and is bad for business. This wasn't about owed money.
damn good job Tarik.
I can't believe that with the latest technology in forensics and such that they couldn't come up with a solid lead after 12 years.
It's sad and pathetic at the same time.
Pasic TP so who is the person she saw outside the store on the shopping day?
And he was the one warning Brianna about her fate that night?
I find it very weird that the police never mentioned this individual. If he is a local farmer involved in narcotics surely the police would know by now. The more I read about this case the more is seems that some are trying to wipe this case under the rug.
That's tough to do with out her remains. Forensics can solve a case, but not having a body can make it almost impossible.
Picked up a local hitchicker the other day, spoke w a few ppl at some near by businesses. NO ONE will say a damn and if you go through this town, there is ZERO indication anyone is missing a young woman.
TOO CLOSE to the boarder to speculate... with the countless numbers of women trafficked.
The RUMORS are more like people TRYING to get street credit.
LOOK at the BIGGER picture.
ARE you sure NO other crimes--- interesting- Young man face down in a pool AFTER-
Pure speculation here...trying to piece this together without anyone being specific about anything. I am wondering if at some point, Brianna, being outspoken as her father mentioned as one of her character traits, threatened someone in this group or groups of by saying she would go to the police about something. If one of them was this local farmer boy whose family owned the pig farm, and who was apparently the subject of the fight between Keallie Lacross (sp?) and Brianna, the fight may not have been over jealousy, but rather her direct threat. The situation could've been made known to Ramon Ryans and Nathaniel Jackson, who obviously had much more at stake and were prompted to take action to remove her from the picture. In one of the other Crawlspace videos, at the end, a bombshell was dropped saying James Robatelli (sp?), the ex-boyfriend (he couldn't have been ex that long as they appeared to be together as of a couple weeks prior to the disappearance) touched her car that night. I assume his previous story was that he drove by, noticed she wasn't there and went home. I don't know if he changed his story after it became known that the police had a dna sample or not, but his story did change for some reason. I haven't seen anything more specific on that comment. He would've been the one she trusted in this group of locals/non-locals, who may have gotten her to stop at the farm in the first place, if it wasn't a complete ambush. He may have been the one she talked to outside when with her mother who may have warned/threatened her? Felt like that was alluded to in one of these videos. Since it also appears the police do believe there was a struggle at her car, where it appears she backed up in a panicked haste, resulting in becoming stuck on the foundation, then this was not a friendly, let's party gone wrong drug overdose. The stories that Megan and Katie have settled on could simply be confusion as a result of their trust in whoever they heard the story from, or worse, misdirection as a result of coercion. This case most definitely suffers from a lack of individuals going on public record. Whether that is a result of complicity or fear, I do not know. But until somebody goes on record, all there can be is speculation.
One more thing, if she did actually meet this Joker dude at some point, she could identify him so that puts her up there in the very dark mix. If he was out of prison for a couple days, (not clear on this information), then he may have felt compelled to "handle" the situation. It more than likely was not about collecting some petty sum of money, since dead people typically do not pay off their debts. Makes more sense that this was about her being a potential snitch. Have not seen anything about the Joker's working relationship with Ramon or Nathaniel or the amount of direct involvement he had with locals. It would seem like these types of disappearances would be commonplace if drug dealers are continually exposing themselves to local kids who have no real sense of the potential danger. Or is commonplace, but this one is simply lacking enough evidence to prosecute?
another one like Maura Murray or Leah Roberts disappearance for example...I can't imagine the "not knowing what happened to my child if I was in that parent"s shoes...I hope these families can at least someday get some sort of closure cause its sad to think about!!!
I cant think off many things worse...having to re live it everyday..I mean your never gonna get over your child's death but in time you will accept it and allow yourself at least try and live again...but if you have no clue if there alive or dead everyday your gonna be in limbo till the day you die wondering if there still alive somewhere and need your help
How could this not be connected when they both went missing in the exact same way, around the same area in the US and only a month apart?! This seems like it can't be a coincidence. I dont think it's this common for young women to go missing in this way.. Idk I could definitely be wrong. It could just be a crazy coincidence. Or the person who did this was trying to make it look like the Maura Murray case to throw people off? Idk just a thought.
I completely agree 👍🏻
It wasn't really in the same area. 90 miles away is quite a distance when you are talking about rugged mountain terrain and primarily backroads.
@@adamant5550 very true…👍🏻 it was only about a month later and the similarities are very close in MO. It makes you wonder if there is a sex trafficking thing that both girls got abducted into.
@@danilecashin4126 I think the similarities end when you take away the fact that both disappeared after a seeming car accident. Maura was not from the area and the circumstances leading to her disappearance are very different from Brianna's who was from the area and was involved with dozens of other young people. Sex trafficking is a possibility, but I really have never bought into the serial killer theory, specifically with Maura, as her driving on that road at that time was purely coincidental.
Truly enjoy your Missing Maura Murray podcast, and the multiple guests you have brought on, especially my favorite podcasters from The Generation Why, but this was an episode I wish I had truly skipped not to do with the case, but solely due to the guest ; but hey this is an awesome and respectfully done free podcast series, that I have been listening to since May of 2016.
This episode though was extremely vague that I could barely get through this though. Hoping for a different more in depth podcast if another one is in the works.
The assault 3 weeks earlier probably was committed by the same group as the abduction & murder.
Alot off these murders it rarely turns out to be some big time drug dealers more often than not its there friends or a neighbour or the postman or something
I might be missing something but, I believe these two cases have nothing in common with one another. Besides the obvious, that they are both missing persons, whose cars were both wrecked and abandoned.
If one can shed light on the other, then its a good thing. It sounded as if in the case of Brianna Maitland, that a lot more information on who could be responsible for her disappearance is known, at least by some anyways.www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/19200/13
This guy imo isn’t backing up anything he says. No offense but .. moving along.
That's not my job, it's the police's job to verify that and back it up.
I don't know much about this case, and I'm a little confused. Is he saying that she was involved with a gang of people who were involved in drugs/drug trade, and she started to pull away from them, therefore they killed her? And if so, why would a 17 year old and her presence be so important to a group involved in the drug trade?
satanists/gangs ..they don't accept a member leaving.
brianna was very pretty.
Briana's ex-boyfriend puts himself at the scene with her car at 4 AM the day she disappeared. Sounds like a good suspect.
Cleared on the basis of what exactly? In the case of the Yorkshire Ripper, police questioned the killer twice and let him go each time thinking he wasn't involved. I bet this happens a lot. False alibis? Lazy police work? Incompetence? Rural Vermont police probably don't have a lot of experience in murder investigations.
Bigwave2003 No matter how things ended, if you see your ex’s car on the side of the road at 4am, don’t you go check it out? Or call your ex about it to see if they’re okay?
yep ~ check out the inlaws before the outlaws
One thing this guy left out is….. why she was killed. You can say drugs. But did she owe money? Was she going to squeal? Why was she killed by so many.
That's for the VSP to determine.
the marua murray case brought me to her disappearance.
She looks old for 17
After listening to this It made me think. Drugs, Drugs Drugs in Rural areas. Going a city to a rural area I can't tell you how many young people are using drugs besides opiods. My ex was so addicted to methafedrin, while in college. Keeps you awake like speed. In Wisconsin truckers use it to keep them awake. People become very emotional when they become addicted to it. It is not to far fetched that both these girls have drug addictions.
Did the methafredin turn him into a sex pest like speed lol 😆
God bless you for caring....
Both Places are Cell Phone Dead zones
Tara Woodruff Rural mountainous areas have lots of dead areas. I live in a town of 18,000 not far from Minneaapolis and we have plenty.
chilling
There is a video on here of Brianna's friend who was interviewed by a news stations. She said she had talked to Brianna before she went missing and Brianna owed the wrong people money for the wrong thing. Do you find this friend creditable? Also it is amazing how there could be 6-10 people involved in Brianna missing and no one has talked. I figured with that many people involved someone would have said something after all these years. Also Tarik where have you gotten your information? Did you get it from the police or from people who are close to the case? Since you seem to know a lot do you know do you know if they've tested all these suspects d.n.a against the d.n.a left in Brianna's car?
+Pasic TP Yes but the friend is credible to me and I do believe what she said that she owed money to the wrong person/person's.
They asked her if she thought Brianna was still alive? Her friend said no, she talked to Brianna two days before she went missing and she owed the wrong people for the wrong thing. If the friend isn't lying she basically said Brianna told her she owed people money for drugs. Now the friend didn't come out and say drugs, but I'm guessing that's what she was implying? Why would the friend come out and lie? Now I ain't not body language reader, but the friend seemed to be telling the truth to me.
Pasic TP I wouldn't be surprised if she did know, but there isn't evidence to prove it. It could be hearsay as well. To me the way Katie talked it seems Brianna let her in on her troubles. Do you know if Katie Manning ever talked to police?
Pasic TP so you do or don't think she knows more? I think Brianna may have told her that she was gonna be meeting up with someone and that's how Katie knows someone was in Brianna's car. Then again Katie may know more and is scared to say. According to you there seems to be a whole bunch of people involved? Didn't you say 6-10 people? I'd be scared to talk if I were Katie. If that many people could get rid of Brianna what's getting rid of others to them? They haven't got caught yet. It is so scary to think that whoever did this is out there walking around free! I hope Brianna is found soon and the guilty people are brought to justice.
Pasic TP if you say there are 6-10 people involved that tells me that you may know some of the ones you think are involved? I know there are something's you can not say, but can you say what exactly you think happened and why she disappeared?
I enjoyed the show and it gave some good information. I give the journalist credit from Germany for following this case shedding some new light on it and investigating it. However he may not know how crime works in the U.S. 15 people are you kidding. These criminals in the drug world can't keep their mouths shut for 5 minutes after having a drink or smoking weed. Usually people involved in the drug trade will get arrested often for various things. The chances of 15 people being involved and not saying anything is like a thousand to 1 chance. The first of them that got arrested for anything would be like I have some info on a murder if you cut me a deal. Now 2 people maybe 3 I get but 15 no way. I know he said up to 15 and maybe but that theory doesn't get much of a second thought.
true, prison songbirds, etc
I found this to have been rivetting.
Truly enjoy your Missing Maura Murray podcast, and the multiple guests you have brought on especially my favorite podcasters from Generation Why, but this was an episode I wish I had truly skipped not to do with the case, but solely due to the guest ; but hey this is an awesome and free podcast series that I have been listening to since May of 2016.
This episode, particularly the guest was so vague and uninformative that I could barely get through this. This woman deserves better than what was presented in this podcast. I'm hoping for a follow up with a different guest(s). This woman deserves more respect than what the guest presented in this episode.
I'm curious if Brianna & Maura knew each other… Maura search on MapQuest: Burlington, Stowe. Ok because she went on holidays on october But Berkshire!!! Strangely enough area where Brianna lived and worked… Why? Schedules each other since october 2003? Sorry but I don't speak English very well
What's your main language? No, they did not know each other.
I'm curious if Brianna & Maura knew each other.
Sorry, I don't speak English. Moi aussi, je serais curieux de savoir si Maura et Brianna se connaissaient. En octobre 2003, Maura était allée avec son père dans les montagnes du Vermont aux alentours de Stowe et de Burlington. N'aurait-elle pas pu y faire la connaissance de Brianna? Où vivait Brianna et que faisait-elle lorsque Maura se trouvait avec son père près de Stowe? De plus, pourquoi Maura avait-elle fait des recherches sur Mapquest pour se rendre aux Berkshires? Avait-elle rendez-vous avec Brianna qui justement travaillait à proximité de Berkshire? ...
Je suis persuadé que, pour que l'enquête avance, il faudrait que les enquêteurs établissent les emplois du temps de Maura et de Brianna depuis le mois d'octobre 2003.
To my knowledge they did not know each other.
Added comment on Maura. Do you know you are drug tested in the Nursing field ? Could Maura have been ephedrine and realized her career was coming to a halt. I can't tell you how many people take this drug to keep you awake. I believe she planned her disappearance.
Is the town in on it? I know that sounds crazy but.....
***** Exactly so it seems like a lot of them are in on it.
***** It is very odd
***** Agreed
@Tarik Pasic I've often heard that rural people are very suspicious of strangers. I got a taste of that suspicion on my photographic visits to very rural non-tourist areas. I'm curious as to what they think when drug-dealing strangers come to their area.
sometimes a satanic cult runs a town. they traffick drugs,babies,sex slaves.
Okay one more post as I listen along to this. Did the guy just say she knew she was going to die and be murdered but because she was 19 she went. Maybe I misheard it. I mean 19 is not 2 years old who in their right mind would go to a place with friends if they told you and you knew they wanted to kill you. I respect this guys effort into this case and he seems like a decent journalist but man the theories are out there.
Yes I spoke wrong I apologize Canada not Germany. I actually agree with 95 percent of what you said. I think there possibly was a situation like you said. For example maybe she owed money for drugs she was fronted and was going to meet the dealer and tell him I'll pay you soon. A situation where her friends might have said it's no big deal but she thought it could be worse but figured I'll work it out with that person. Then it went bad that I'd agree too. The only part I disagreed with was the wording of she knew what was going to happen. A 17 year old is usually a Junior or Senior in High School. They are young and don't always think like an adult but if you are going to a situation that you think you are going to get killed you may want to think that over or show some resistance.
I also agree more than one person was involved. You stated that well again I'm agreeing with most of it. The only part is the number 15. You watch any episode of The first 48 and the only thing you know for sure is if 2 people committed a crime and are getting arrested they are going to blame the other person and say they did it and I was just standing there. So if you take a group of 15 people involved in the drug trade who are bound to continuingly get arrested they will talk. Soon as the detective says you could do 5-10-15 years first thing they will say is I have some information on a murder to help their own cause. Overall I enjoyed the interview and respect the time and work you put. I'm simply disagreeing with those couple points the same way you might think my opinion is wrong.
Brianna believed everyone was good and pure by default, I'm not saying she 100% knew what was going to happen BUT there is a possibility that she did not take a potential threat as seriously if she should have. And I'm not blaming her for it, she was a 17 year old girl.
Alot of information is here: www.wnd.com/2006/03/35310/
nah I don’t buy that many people were involved are you kidding me. i think up to two people abducted and killed her. Maybe three but 15??? Hell na
I didn't say 15 killed her, I said up to 15 might know what happened. Obviously, this is for the VSP to determine.
yes these cases are related..so obvious same state and same way they got missing..sounds like a serial killer
Beach Waves Brianna went missing in VT. Maura went missing in NH. not the same state.
oh i thought same state..my bad OWWW.. but to add their are truckdriver killers..I DONT THINK A KILLER IS GOING TO STAY PUT,,SOME TRAVEL..AND BOTH ARE SIMILER HOW THE CARS WERE LEFT~
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Yeah, that's Brianna three weeks prior to when she disappeared. Initially attention was directed towards the woman who did that to her. At the present time it would appear that was a red herring... that bigger fish were involved. What is known is Brianna simply wanted peace and to live a life with friends and lovers.,,OH WELL NOW I KNOW IT WASNT A SERIAL KILLER WHO DID THIS,, iT THAD TO BE THE WOMEN WHO DID THIS TO HER,,ALL MAKES SENSE!!!
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oky possible not serial killer,,,but i will say this police always leave their jurisdiction ..i got a ticket from a police in a total wrong jurisdiction..he was way far off..like an hr from his area.. in the Maurry case ..it goes down to 3 people police bus driver and the people who lived by the crime scene~
She looks 25, not 17.
Bruh she's dead