Long, Deep, Passionate Thoughts on Tactics Ogre Reborn Being an Awesome Remake
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- Опубликовано: 20 май 2023
- See pinned comment for random notes. I've redone a video like this over and over, so this is the one I'm finally going with. To be blunt, this remake changes way more than I can cover in several hours.
Игры
"I hate grinding. I've never liked grinding in any form." - Coffee Tater
To be fair, my coffee comes pre ground 😀.
But yeah, doesn't mean I won't for a challenge run, but I'd gladly pick tricks over monotony any day 👍
I had no knowledge at all of this series prior to me picking it up, just some Final Fantasy Tactics and that's mainly Advance as i had little to no play time on the OG tactics. I didn't even know about the remake up until the AustinSV comparison video talking about it (who did give a shoutout to you) that brought it to my attention. Ever since i bought it, i have no regrets, and while i am playing multiple games now because, i like playing many games like an idiot, i am enjoying it; currently suffering PotD grind for relics.
It's always great to hear stories like that!
The big thing about this remake is that is a strategy game first, RPG second. I know a lot of people were disappoitned in the toned down RPG elements. But I hoenstly felt that was for the better.
Besides, we get plenty of RPGs, but not many strategy games.
Same, and I love to see the bigger emphasis on strategy this time around. There's so many fun tricks that just weren't worth the time before, like flying dragons into longbows.
Hey thanks for the videos im new to this game been playing for many years i love this game even though im still learning lots of stuff, videos help again thank you. I did play march of the dark queen back on super Nintendo i thought it was great due to multiple endings and play styles ff tactics was also a masterpiece. I did put a simulator on my phone and replayed march of dark queen . Im sad i missed this game and happy to have found it now keep up great content.
I'm doing my best, and it's always awesome to hear more folks getting into the series!
Minor corrections, in case I forgot/didn't have time to edit this for the 80th time:
-Video comparing OV/RB views on the same issues will be a thing later, I ran short on time, but it's a fun topic.
-Mighty Strike doesn't affect katana finishers, apparently it was just having a good day that day, but apparently does affect 1HKs. Might be some interesting synergy there for the ultimate edge lord.
-Minor clarification so it doesn't get confused again, but Evil Eye was always exclusive to the Medusa Shield. The player could never use it in PSP, being locked to the Gorgon. In this case Irresistible Beauty has interesting synergy with rotating Pincer setups. Still kinda hard to employ outside of a flank sniper, but a neat recontextualization.
-I forgot to mention folks having an issue with cards more for visuals than mechanics, which is fair. Personally I would've preferred green, but I'd assume they probably tested it a few ways before just going with an obvious color. That said, I wouldn't be against a transparent card mod, or even an invisible mod just for fun.
-I meant to cover Weapon Parry/Counter implementation more from what I've seen folks doing with those skills...or lack thereof over the years. Would have been neat to see Parry on Pikes, but that's for the One Revision Requests video.
-Forgot about the couple of music locations that changed. Honestly doubt this was an accident, it's too specific and out there, but I don't personally care enough about this one to remember it outside of when the mod to move songs around comes up. Haven't seen any angry reviews about it either.
-Should've elaborated more that the reason Debuff Weapons get to shine without the OV copy approach this time around is due to the Skill/Aug/Racial rework, and being able to hit on weaknesses for the same effect, instead of having as much reliance on Atk stats. So while before you'd always go elemental for that Aug stack, this time the weapon serves a counter element role, and the debuff weapon remains useful due to getting a chance to use an Aug it didn't have before.
-Could have put more emphasis on how much of the story is handled through very human misunderstandings, rather than personal drama. It's also absolutely willing to "go there" regularly. Not for shock, but for context. Yes, the Leaden on Cerya in front of Oz was probably for that. Yes, Ozma was willing to overlook that. Yes, you can overlook all of that for a special character.
-Technically you could also rank Augs through elemental finishers, and I did it once for Level 1, but... Yeah. No.
-While it could be argued that you could run Longbow/Octopus before, there was little reason to do so. Now an Aqua Bubble barrage into arrows is a solid push at long range, and it's dang fun to see.
-When I mention folks overlooking things in a broad sense, I'm talking about on average. Like realistically we're 6 months in and folks regularly are in Coda without ever even realizing elements are a thing. Stuff happens, everyone overlooks stuff for their own reasons, and ghost data has been a thing with this series since always. It's just a thing that happens to everyone. Always has been. It's not even an old design thing, just look up how many of us got stuck running in circles in Crimson Shroud despite having the key to progress, and there being only 10 rooms to go to. I didn't get stuck there farming minotaurs and skeletons wondering when it ends, I don't know what you're talking about 😂.
-I called weapon recruiting Stealing later, because that's what folks generally called it back then, and it's likely where we get the weird "my rogues used to steal equipment" misinformation. Just a theory.
-I forgot that my point later on about the down -levelling is what the Ogre Blade does, and allows for impossible cross class builds, like a Lich with Lament of the Dead and Phalanx.
Thanks for sharing all of your thoughts and tips on this game--I have been a fan of this game since PSX back in the 90's and enjoy all of the insight you've provided for this iteration.
Glad to help, it's what I'm here for 😀
Amazing video as always friend 🎉
Thanks, man! Looking forward to the next one from you too.
@@CoffeePotato thanks! be ready with the popcorn, its gonna be a BIG one
@@WarrenReport Oh shoot, is it the hidden lore of the Area 51 Faerie forest?
@@CoffeePotato damn, cant hide any secrets from yo
The thumbnail gave me 7th saga vibes
😂
Don't get eaten by the storage boxes!
Loved the level cap cutaway!
Thanks 🤣
When new players beat Tactics Ogre Reborn, and then somehow get to play Knight of Lodis and get the A+ ending. 🤯
Hilarious and informative. Keep em coming
Will do!
I finished the game on PSP and I knew I had to finish it on steam. I bought on release date, no questions asked and I don't regret it. They have improved on the OST. They added voice acting. They added language support for my language so that's great too. The gameplay reworks is great too. Easily 9 or 9.5 out of 10. I can't possibly give 10 out of 10, though.
There are some things that are not as improved as they should be and some things that would be nice to have.
Things to improve:
* AI. It is not bad per se but the non use of buffs and debuffs is pretty bad.
* The equipment system need a rework. There is no magic minor equipment all the way until postgame. Long lances (2 to 3 cells attack) should be a seperate type of weapon instead of forcing me to that type of attack if i want to use one of the high level improved lances. Shield cost spells and consumables even though they no longer protect from status effect. Status effect resistance passive have been partially removed. Why? Is not like AI can properly make use of it. Yeah, all that part seems a bit poorly made.
* What happened to rogues? I am not asking to have FF Tactics Advance rogues but enemy rogues exists and allies not. If you say "yeah but there are ninjas" well they could have just removed them completely. It just seems poorly made, like "well, I have worked enough for today".
* Some mechanics need better explanation. Additional armor resistance must have been done (because seems to be working as intended) in the most convoluted possible way. They could have just added: This armor offers 5% extra resistance against blunt damage (actually how it works in real life, not based on the weapon you are carrying) or more resistance against lightning.
* Some battles allow recon and others not. Why?
* If you finish some routes before others you are locked out of CODA until you finish the others.
* Some supposedly legendary weapons are pretty trash.
* Accuracy and evasion. I know you have been testing it but for the mortals like us it does not exist at all. Everything hit with 100% except rune knights summons on bosses. I am a bit exaggerating but it is almost like that.
* I don't understand why instill was changed to auto and only usable by some specific classes instead of a buff you could use on anyone with MP cost.
Nice to have:
* Once WORLD is active, add toggles to timeline to change flags that activate certain things instead of having to replay from a certain point entire chunks or even worse, i need some specific character death to trigger something but I have feed this character like all amulets in existance.
* Reduce the grind on materials and post game equipment and spells. The game is already pretty long as it is with all the palace and sactuaries and timelines and all to even add the grind.
* Visible list of all titles and prerequisite. For bragging rights.
About the minor magic equipment i mentioned, I am not asking for something crazy. Just something like:
Here you have a +1 range magic wand for caster that let you use 1 cast per battle of level 1 proyectile magic, because it seems like you are not having luck with that meditate. Cast the spell and try to save some MP for next turn.
It just seems overkill to play all game in need of MP and then suddenly reach endgame and get your hands on 300 FREE MP. Or get a fist weapon that let you cast summon 2 for FREE.
@@elolawynladriel I had a similar thing to note for a future video, but they did expand MP access pretty hard.
Most of the rest was covered in the video, admittedly it's quite a long one, and still didn't cover half of what I'd want to.
Spears, I'd love to have kept the Cursed Spear short, and added Parry instead of Counter to Pikes. You don't really use them for power, like the Scorpion or Voulge will out damage most end game spears if used for their debuff. Voulge/Berserk/Terrifying Impact/Phalanx/Conserve MP was basically my most successful Coda 4 build. Guaranteed Breach/Gear combo'd with a Paradigm Shift into Tempest. Wacky numbers everywhere.
Nah, the physical resistance typing is NOT "small enough to not matter". The spellcasting weapon thing cripples 2handers.
There's a lot of things I'll give Reborn credit for in terms of very subtle design goals. But there's still several concepts and mechanics that I would change entirely into something that applies more consistently, is more readily viewed without external tools, and just plain makes more sense.
The individual gears and cogs are polished to a high degree, but the final product is rough as chalk. Not painful to have rubbed on you, but the damn thing falls apart in the process.
Hold up. Cripples two handers how? You're misunderstanding what it does. It's not like it adds the bonus on top of your max. If you match your personal element, you still get your max 30%. The only thing the relic thing affects is the 10% for hitting Super-Effective status on a damage dealing spell, and only when you're not using your own element for some reason. Go and test it yourself, half the time you'd be lucky to even see 10-20 damage of a difference, if it even bothers showing up.
You get your personal bonus just fine, the feature, it even intentional, would allow someone to use a maxed relic to get close to their max bonus with an off element spell, which is only useful for that 10%, which then also only shows up if they're somehow running under 10% element resistance...5% of which is on practically every ring in the game, and 100% of the rings enemy units carry.
It's a minor quirk that no one would have even picked up on if it hadn't been loudly broadcasted.
@@CoffeePotato I think you should fact-check that with ruccession, because I'm looking at the damage calculator and they stack. 30+10 matters a fair bit under nature's touch, and a maxed relic bumps that up to 30+30 or just 30 if you run a multi-element caster.
@@benedict6962 I tested this with various relics, and while correct, it does seem to stack, even with tons going for a unit, for example...no armor or resistance on the receiving end, a massive level advantage, you know the drill, it's around an 80 damage difference.
Here's why I say it's not affecting anything. This bonus is pretty low by the time you can get it. You're almost required to be max level to achieve a maxed relic that can make use of this. Yes, you could do it sooner, but I'm saying for the average person hearing about this as a big.
So 1/8 that it would even apply to. You are locked into a weapon. Outside of one staff, you're locked out of using your extra range. Additionally, you're locked into using various elements instead of various types of abilities. No poison, no charm, no shields, just (presumably) summons. So if you're not running Lipul's, well, that's 3 range.
Now we take the several hours to get that maxed relic, and what's our return?
Meanwhile, for the price of a maxed relic grind, you could be getting weapons capable of one shotting end game bosses, armor to achieve near complete immortality and the like.
As far as I'm concerned, it's a fun thing you can do, but a massive waste of time in terms of being useful. I'd take the normal amount and an extra option that actually does something interesting any day, personally.
@@CoffeePotato and all that to get distracted from my main point: it's not "too small to matter". It's not META, but that wasn't what I was arguing for. It's a core piece of code of the spellcasting mechanic that is not functioning as intended, and you can't argue that it's for some hidden intention when 2handed wands aren't even that good.
@@benedict6962 2handers are great, what are you using them for? Sweepblade/Berserk/Mighty Strike/Fall Blade is some of the most consistently recreatable 3k+ universal slappage there is.
That's the thing, though. We *assume* it was supposed to be a mechanic, but it doesn't behave like the other elemental reworks. Rucession believes it's meant for all weapons, I believe it's the leftovers of some scrapped mechanic for the Relic Brynhildr, just because nothing really gets checked by hands, it's an anomaly. That said...we don't know. It could just as easily be an accidental double check, or could be an intentional way to nerf the AI because they wanted to try out relics on them (because they often use weird loadouts that cause their staves to give no bonus). We don't really know, once we know what's going on for sure, I'll report.
I put 1000 plus hours into the psp version and one vision. And reborn is just officially the only version i want to play anymore. It is such a good remaster, I wish other companies could do half as good of a job. So it always makes me laugh when people whine about it, because it should be the standard for not just remaking the same game, but across the board improving the game while keeping the same spirit.
I mean I'll still circle back for OV when on the road, but yeah, it's super rare to see those cases where they take the high level play experience, and just make it the standard right from the start.
Doing my second new file right now. Abusing the Ogre Blade on my Lich and Valkyries. Definitely want to beat all the Generals and finish Coda 4 this time.
Apologies in advance for a comment much longer than I'd anticipated! I bought Reborn on release day; even if I never fully play it, and whether or not the changes are ultimately for the best or otherwise, I will support anything Matsuno works on. Tactics Ogre has been one of my all-time favorite video games since the late 90s and I've played every version of it since then, with my favorite being the Saturn version which thankfully can now be played in English (prior to this I preferred the Super Famicom version). That being said, for me there is no "perfect" version of this game, and given my relatively unpopular tastes, almost certainly never will be. This is the only game I've ever played that I've maintained multiple spreadsheets for in order to make sure I completed it 100%; not only the unique drops and characters, but every hidden dialogue or sequence, every title (in the PSP version), etc. The larger Ogre Battle series is among my favorites, though I really only consider the two Super Famicom games to be absolute masterpieces.
Being the kind of person who primarily reveres these games as narrative and audio-visual works of art over the complex gameplay mechanics, my misgivings about the more recent versions are primarily with the aesthetics. The presentation of every aspect of the game in the original Super Famicom version is to me flawless, and I deeply regret that the PSP remake changed it so radically. I don't mean to suggest that the portraiture in the PSP and Reborn remakes aren't beautiful; they absolutely are, and I am very fond of the artists original designs and in-game artwork. But to me it is very jarring to see these portraits presented in a totally different style with dialogue appearing in the very wide, bright white, more modern comic book-style speech bubbles against the original environmental designs and character sprites. Everything about the UI of the Super Famicom version is so beautiful and coherent, from the unique font and color tones of the UI panels, to minor details such as the elemental icons resembling the four colored logo of the Super Famicom. For a game from 1995 the amount of detail represented onscreen is very impressive, especially the "Help" context menus, while the inventory and army management screens aren't cumbersome at all to navigate.
Honestly, if it weren't for the huge amount of content added to the remake, I'd simply replay the Super Famicom or Saturn version indefinitely. But CODA, the new classes and characters, the crafting system and expanded shop inventories, the grimoires (and the many other medieval European occult influences generally), and so forth force me to make the painful decision of playing what I feel to be artistically inferior versions in pretty much every regard besides the translation, which is excellent. The pseudo-"Shakespearian" speech fits Final Fantasy Tactics slightly better than Tactics Ogre, mainly because that game is clearly represented from the very beginning as being the recitation of a written narrative, itself based on a long-lost manuscript and as such modeled after real-life examples of legendary books like the Morte d'Arthur, Parzival or the Orlando Furioso. But I do very much appreciate the PSP translation and think it greatly enhances the quality of the narrative flow.
As for actual gameplay mechanics, I'm not as capable of making comparisons because it isn't my primary focus, but I will say that I tend to prefer the PSP version only slightly more than the original, and this is mostly to do with the grinding. Perhaps I'm mad, it is definitely possible, but I thoroughly enjoyed grinding in that version. Being able to level many of the individual skills? Or recruiting units with unusually high skill levels on specific maps for scavenging onto other characters? I get that this is likely a very unpopular opinion, but I always felt like the PSP remake was designed with people who enjoy freakish extents of grinding specifically in mind, and in a game that features endurance dungeons with random modifiers and unholy amounts of hidden unique drops and such, one that can be rewound and replayed while retaining the awarded growth, development, character recruits and accumulated inventory, this feels to me to be a natural focus and clear design prerogative.
Ultimately I am interested to experience Reborn as thoroughly as the previous versions at some point, I just am having difficulty accepting certain changes and omissions, while already agonizing over the major differences between my two favorite prior versions. The aesthetic choices seriously mar the beauty of the game, especially those sprites which worked so well on the Super Famicom because the artists were laboring to portray detail within the confines of that consoles capacities, but in high definition they just look awful, and even worse contrasted against the enlarged and refined character portraits - it is quite literally the incoherent amalgam of stylistic tendencies of three separate decades, each of which had different priorities given the hardware they were designed for. I may prefer the electronic synthesizer melodies of the sound chip OSTs but the orchestrated remakes are undoubtedly great, so it isn't something I feel strongly about one way or the other. What did very much disappoint me during the single chapter I did manage to play through are those random cards that begin to litter the battlefield. I can appreciate that they allow for greater complexity and present opportunities for more strategic and dynamic gameplay, but to me they are both an eyesore and a distracting presence. Perhaps my imagination is to blame, but when I played this game as a teenager in the 90s and again on PSP I was able to dissociate my perception of the actual visual animations and imagine each character moving across the battlefield in offensive or defensive maneuvers as if witnessing an actual battle. But now with them chasing down little cards it seriously detracts from the engaging experience I've long been so fond of. Anyway I realize that many of my feelings are those of nostalgia, and I'm probably in a very small minority, especially regarding the aesthetic changes which are for me the most egregious and aren't exclusive to Reborn. It spiritually bothers me to have a new iteration of Tactics Ogre in my Steam library barely touched, especially since I mainly play games on my Steam Deck and have enjoyed the Saturn version on it so recently, so I do intend to give it another try. I just wanted to share my thoughts on a favorite game as a long time fan.
Long comments are fine, we do a lot of that around here! Might be a shorter response, picked up a bug yesterday, and not really feeling too great today.
Definitely agreed on their being no perfect version, I just think this is the best for folks to start.
Anyhow, artistic stuff will always be subjective, like how I also appreciate the hell out of the artistic stuff they did in the original, but the sheer mechanical jank of the machine just takes out of the experience a lot of the time.
To some the experience is visual, to some it's sound, to some it's the push, or challenge. Like I regularly hear folks saying they didn't like the look of the cards. Makes sense, I know personally they just became invisible unless I was planning something, but the added sound options really let me get into the stuff that really did it for me personally, namely hearing the thunderstorms and clangs to an ever changing strategy board.
I loved the ideas of a lot of the options Classic brought to the table, but again, it was the relative jank that always pushed me towards the other versions.
I love the idea of using Gryphons early, but they lose to a fist fight against a basic soldier when you get them. I like the golems, but their defenses are not really fine tuned to make them reliable, and they have no abilities at all.
Seeing the mechanics evolve to where you feel the armor doing it's job, and feel the classes doing what they say they will feels special. Being able to look at the basic soldier guy, and knowing they can basically counter anything courtesy of their weapon access through finishers alone feels cool.
But that's the thing, someone will always prefer their own stuff. Like I have a nearly two hour comparison of just the different mechanical approaches One Vision and Reborn took, and it's super clear why no one can ever definitively agree on one perfect version.
That said....I've generally found that folks that get into one eventually try them all, so the one that's the most readily accessible will be the one that boosts the whole series.
But yeah, having the option for SNES portraits would have been neat. Actually....I should see if anyone's willing to make that mod...
@@CoffeePotato Thank you very much for taking time out of your day to respond so thoroughly to my comment, especially while being sick. I hope you recover very quickly though, it can be such a drag and I get especially miserable and moody when I come down with anything.
I also appreciate your taking the time to indulge my comment considering you must encounter this sort of commentary regularly; I am mostly a quiet fan who reads a ton of the online conversation (and have for many years, I used to post on the gamefaqs forum back when the PSP remake was new and watched those faqs and loot spreadsheets develop) and has very strong opinions on the game(s) so it is very nice to not be dismissed out of hand for rehashing a dialogue you possibly feel has been covered overly much.
As I mentioned in my previous comment, there is no question that much of my preference is rooted in nostalgia, and I am actively seeking to make myself more open to the changes in Reborn because my love for that game is matched by very few others. I'm more of a Western CRPG person also, with a particular fondness for dungeon crawlers, and especially those that featured open worlds (Wizardry 7 for instance), but I did somehow get my hands on a PlayStation (I forget how!) when I was about 14 so around '98 into '99 and both Tactics Ogre and Final Fantasy Tactics were absolute obsessions of mine at that age. A year or so prior I was able to burn copies of the original Baldur's Gate and Fallout from a friend who always had every new game, and to this day those 4 games remain in my top 10 and contend for my top 5! It is really great to be able to communicate so easily with others who are so passionate for this series, because it is something I could gush about for hours yet don't know anybody in real life who has even played it.
I would be hard pressed to think of another game that is in such a peculiar situation as Tactics Ogre, though. The only game with comparable variants that I can think of off hand would be Stalker, but the variants are all mods. Many games and especially those from the 80s that released on multiple computers and consoles have wildly different ports or remakes, but none of them are really masterpieces the way this game is. And I find that my biggest personal obstacle with Tactics Ogre is that within minutes of beginning to play any version of it, I am overwhelmed with thoughts about what I'm missing for having chosen to devote myself to one or the other, and the incessant bombardment of OCD internal dialogue exacerbates the issue. Playing the Saturn version was exceedingly difficult because I was plagued with regrets about not having access to CODA, to certain characters like Cressida (by FAR my favorite character, even more than Denam), to the ability to rewind the clock and see and do everything in one overall play through, etc.
Your comment has actually encouraged me to just go ahead and proceed with Reborn. After all, Matsuno himself was very much involved in this version as well, I believe (?) and it does bother me that I haven't experienced an offering of his, given how painfully rare art at his level of profundity is expressed in video games. I just need to establish a different perspective, one that instead of recoiling in horror at change rather considers that perhaps Matsuno had significant reasons for them. And on the plus side, given how deep the changes go, it would seem that I get to explore practically a whole new system, discovering the nuances and obscure details of which are the second artistic level at which I am in awe of the game.
Aesthetics aside, not being able to Steal via Rogue class, and adapting to the random battle cards are going to be the most difficult changes for me to feel acclimated to, but I am inspired to make a genuine effort, advanced by your response which is encouraging. Now, if someone with the capacity were able to mod the game to retain the original portraiture (though I suppose difficulties immediately arise with characters not in the original), that would just be a dream come true! But in the meantime I intend to try Reborn again with more of an open mind. After all, I was among those who decried the change to the leveling system for the PSP remake, and initially bounced off it! Yet I approached it again a few months later and absolutely fell in love with it, devoting months to my 100% save file.
Apologies again for my verbosity, I just am very enthusiastic about this series and returning to it after such a long absence feels like coming home, and I feel more inspired to try Reborn. I revisited the game around 2014 or so, but since then I moved on and only returned to it within the past year with the new of Reborn and then the Saturn translation. It had been in my mind the entire time to go back to it again at some point, but after my PSP memory card stopped working I sort of lost the motivation. Now with Steam Deck being my main emulation system, and the abundance of options for playing it, I've been feeling the magic for the game once again. Ah, if only Matsuno and his team had the capacity to realize the wider lore and narratives he surely has sketched out with more games... like New Vegas, his games are the kind that in retrospect appear miraculous for even existing at all.
@@BriteRory Funnily enough, I actually did reach out to the modding community, and it looks like there were plans to make that portrait mod, but the tools aren't quite there yet. Gibbed, who helped with the One Vision Mod, is chipping away at making a fully fleshed out mod tool for the thing, but he's a busy guy.
Also, technically there are mods that take out the cards, but I would encourage giving them a shot. While it seems like an odd chance, they are in many ways always retooling old ideas in new ways, and this is no exception. Like the element system here is functionally a scaled up version of elements from classic (which did about 4-12 of a damage difference), and the Zodiac signs in FFT, but opting for a more fluid percentage scale as compared with the old hard numbers. Personally, I found that fun, as it means you want to diversify your team and sort of re-assign roles on the fly. Your dedicated heavy hitter is mismatched vs that Berserker, maybe the dragoon can be reassigned over there for a more favorable matchup, or maybe the Terror Knight can break him for the archer to take the kill. Just gives that...team vibe, you know?
But how does that related to the cards, right?
That same team build versatility applies, in older versions they'd give big stat spikes in Classic, or Buff Skills in PSP, but the idea was always to have those moments of "oh shoot, this guy is actually a bit of a threat".
Keeping with the design philosophy here, it's done more fluidly. The cards are never the deciding factor, despite many reviews trying to claim as much. Sometimes a unit can Crit more, but they can always just build for Luck to Crit naturally. Did that mage just get 3 Crit cards against all odds? Sounds like that Curse debuff has a point now. Even bosses that come with troll setups, like Leonar having 2 MP Regens, Crit, and Phys Up, can be mitigated with simple debuffs. A Weaken renders him almost useless despite the cards. Plus the AI only ever picks them up on accident, exception being the final story boss, who will try to avoid them.
On the player side, though, this opens up so many niche builds and strategies. Canopus using the spell slots of a water crossbow for magic crits, using MP Regens for Stop Finisher spam, or stacking multiple activated effects constantly.
In many ways a lot of why I love this approach is because it's similar to how Knight of Lodis handled the Tactics Ogre formula ages ago. The Terror Knight was a class all about it's debuff, but ..why don't we just let everyone use it as an emblem? That kind of thing. Scaled damage over hard numbers, too.
I gotta go, but I'm glad you're giving it a shot, I think you'll have a great time, feel free to reach out any time!
@@CoffeePotato First off, I just want to thank you for actually reaching out to the modding community to inquire about the portrait mod idea, it is very exciting to learn that the idea was at least considered to where it may one day become possible. I'd always assumed that I was in too small a minority of fans concerned enough with this aspect to even consider it.
Something I hadn't thought about until now that I would like to get your opinion on, if you have the time, is how the sense of character progression feels? This was my main problem with the PSP remake back when it was first announced, before it even came out I was so disappointed in this change and like I said before it is the reason I stopped playing it during the first chapter. After a few months went by (and I even preordered it, with the big box and the tarot cards!) I decided to try it again and just see if it could work, and the gameplay of that version ended up being just as enjoyable to me as was the original, while in certain aspects I liked it even more.
What I found did it for me, the intangible magic that hooked me into the gameplay and attached me to my recruits and hires beyond the narrative, the setting, the lore and world-building details offered in the Warren Report and all the rest of it, was the ability to level so many of the skills. What ultimately differentiated my units in this version due to the class-leveling system was their individual attributes and their skills. Leveling up the racial skills, Steal, Persuasion, weapon proficiency, elemental magics etc. made it so addictive for me to grind and focus on raising specific skill ranks, and ultimately I would wind up with characters that were refined to excel in whichever skills were raised. So I could have a character that was my dedicated Persuasion master, for instance. And being on the lookout for high-skill rank enemies in random battles to recruit in order to scavenge was another whole dimension of gameplay that I enjoyed very much.
So I am curious if there is a comparable degree of customization and sense of perpetual, incremental development? I know that the skill system is very different and some are triggered automatically, some I think are dependent on class or armor; do you still have weapon proficiency to raise at least? I understand that the leveling system was reverted from class to individual unit, and that there is a level cap imposed; am I right in thinking that once you finish the game, the level cap is removed entirely and you can progress up to 50 from then on regardless of Worlding back to earlier chapters? Or am I under a wrong impression there?
Sorry for putting forth so many questions! I intend to start playing at some point this week or during the weekend at the latest, and am trying to prepare myself for what to expect and where to focus my attention during the game.
oh my god, i forgot that we had to activate the mobility powers on rings on the psp.
it really does get better kids.
Hold the car, mom, my moon boots haven't booted up yet!
@@CoffeePotato just click your heels dorothy
I think the damage bonus modifier stacking on the psp version is more intuitive than the use the 1 strongest bonus modifier of reborn, and that causes alot of the "game is broken/ buggy" feelings that people have. (at least it did for me)
I feel like a lot of it comes in more intuitive...without previous experience. I had that exact same feeling until it just clicked how different the system was. The immediate gut reaction is to try and find similarities, instead of learning something new.
Gossipmongers gonna gossip.
Still, nice to hear a retrospective of the series in general
Gossip about which part, out of curiosity?
@@CoffeePotato Nah, I mean you stated that the video was to address the gossip.
@@rottenmeat5934 Gotcha, yeah, it's weird how hostile those got
I barely played March of the Black Queen and never got to play 64, but I have a gut feeling that the elements having such a *huge* impact in the game is heavily based in the lore of the world.
It is, and has played a different part every time. It was pretty notable in MOTBQ, but it wouldn't say who was what, so it looked like your wizards were casting random spells, rather than signposting "maybe that guy is weak to lightning, y'all.". 64 you could see elements combine for some unique interactions, like elemental tornadoes and such. It was kind of half baked, but knowing a flaming thunderstorm could forge an Iron Golem into a Baldur golem mid battle is just cool.
The other TO titles handled them in more limited means, PSP tried to go for dedicated stacks, but this is definitely the most natural it's felt in the series. Like you'd get kills in Knight of Lodis by circling around for your +10-15 element bonus using your personal element tiles and such, but this really does more.
@@CoffeePotato Idk I mean, princess class in march literally says "f you're elements or lore, I win." But ok
@@CL-os5cz Well, until sundown, anyways. Then it's the Lich 's turn to roll in with his vampire squad.
@@CoffeePotato If I recall correctly, the shrines in Valeria are also the origin of elemental magic in itself, aren’t they?
Regardless, it’s really cool how important elements are in Reborn, seeing as it’s a lore thing!
I know you’ve covered this before, but I’m having a major brain fart, so I gotta ask:
If, for example, I have a Fire element unit, would it be better to amplify that with a fire weapon? Or give them a weapon to counter a water unit?
Depends. Matching is a 10% bonus against most things, and moves their entry point vs fire to a 40% advantage, while carrying other options gives you an advantage against each of them. So like you could match for more general purpose damage, but could out pace that with...let's say a 25% Bonus vs Divine and Dragons, and a 15% Bonus vs Earth through a Fafnir/Garuda setup, which also works Counter and Parry together, and may lead to a cozy Sword/Bow finisher setup to have advantages vs Dark and Water, while having a boosted Fire finisher, and several debuffs. It's not really a 1-1, just depends what you're looking for out of that unit.
@@CoffeePotato This is inaccurate. The bonus for matching a unit's Affinity to the Element of their Basic Attack (which is the Element of their equipped Weapon) is a x1.1 multiplier to their Total ATK stat. The bonus for an attacking unit having an Affinity that is Strong against their target's Affinity is a +30% modifier to the attacker's Stat Overhead. Total ATK and the Stat Overhead are completely separate components of damage calculations, and their values are derived from totally different unit stats.
Total ATK is the sum of a unit's ATK stats on their Weapon, Jewelry, and Class ATK. For example, if your unit is wielding a Fandango (101 ATK), has a Ring of the Horde equipped (4 ATK), is in the Warrior class (4 Base Class ATK), and is Level 40 (3 ATK, since Humanoid classes gain 1 Class ATK per 10 levels), your unit will have (99+4+4+3)= 110 Total ATK.
The Fandango has the Fire Element, so if that unit were to perform a Basic Attack (against a target of any Affinity) with the Fandango AND be of the Fire Affinity, they would gain (0.1 x 110)= 11 ATK, which translates into an 11 point increase to Final Damage (after stat-based calculations), unless your unit is suffering from the Frightened status (which applies a x0.85 multiplier to Total ATK).
The Stat Overhead on the other hand, is the product of subtracting an defending unit's contributions from STR+VIT/MND+RES (their "Toughness Value") towards damage reduction from an attacking unit's contributions from STR+DEX/INT+MND (their "Offense Value") towards damage dealt. Each individual stat is multiplied by the scaling factors of the attack being used.
For example, if a unit with 150 STR/150 DEX were performing a Basic Attack with the Fandango (1H Sword), the Basic Attack's damage formula would convert their 150 STR/150 DEX into ((150 x 1.8) + (150 x 1.3))= 465 Offense Value. And if their target had 150 STR/150 VIT, this target unit would have ((150 x 0.7) + (150 x 1))= 255 Toughness Value. This would result in the attacking unit having a Stat Overhead of (465 - 255)= 210.
If the attacking unit above was of the Fire Affinity, and the target unit of the Ice Affinity, a +30% bonus modifier would be applied to the attacking unit's Stat Overhead of 210, resulting in an increase of (0.3 x 210)= 63. If the attacking unit is not suffering from an ATK Deficit from the (Total ATK - Total DEF) half of damage calculations that is greater than their modified Stat Overhead, then this increase of 63 points to the Stat Overhead will translate directly to a 63 point increase in Final Damage (after stat-based calculations).
Physical/Elemental/Racial Damage Bonus values on Weapons are applied as percentage modifiers to the Stat Overhead as well. For physical attacks, Physical/Racial Damage Bonus values are applied to damage calculations of Basic Attacks and Finishers (with Physical Damage Bonus values being applied regardless of the type of Bonus or the damage type of the Finisher), while Elemental Damage Bonus values are only applied to damage calculations of Basic Attacks if the Element of the Basic Attack (a.k.a the Weapon's Element) is Strong against the target's Affinity.
One thing I missed from the ps1 version is special weapons/items being available during the story and before endgame, instead they just chucked it all into post game and Potd in reborn which was a little dull. I can't remember how it was in the psp version.
PSP they were chucked into the ultra post game. Namely you were only getting them if you triggered NG+ and knew how to take it early, otherwise hooker boots were basically the holy Grail. This time around they're available as early as Chapter 3 in various castle fights as drops.
@@CoffeePotato Ah right cool, a lot like Reborn then with most of it being postgame. In ps1 that heartbreaking moment when you auction off your little red dragons and cocatice you've been raising since the beginning to get some nice fire swords and wing rings...
My only complaint with the game is that it’s not on GOG 😁
Great video. Great game.
It isn't? I think I might be remembering it being on GMG, now that you mention it. One of them had a good discount a while ago.
I do have to say this has been my favorite version of the game
In general, I'd say so on most levels. I'm eagerly waiting for when we get the best of all worlds with One Revision, no pressure 😂
I'm done for now with this game. I'm sure mods will follow soon I'll play again
do you think they'l ever make a new game, like wasn't it supposed to be like star wars and have multiple chapters.
It is, and it does. They're just in a weird order. Like it started with 5, then went to 7, then did 4, 1 or 2, then 6, and started talking about 8. Then FFT and OB64 became the ideas from 8, then the director didn't want to figure out the canon with 3 other writers, but we might, someday? He's mentioned wanting to, the budget just ain't always there. He's notoriously hard to work with. (They were about to ship reborn when he demanded every sound in the game be redone.)
Loved the original, loved the remake. Tactics orge is fantastic!
Dang right!
If I'm ever in court, i know who to hire to properly defend me
Saul?
I think some people just end up regretting their choices (much like in real life) in game and prefer to blame others.
Fair point. Hell, one time someone was ranting about the cards for weeks, turned out they were just having a really bad go of things lately, and was a pretty good dude. Life's a bummer like that, but sometimes cool stuff happens.
Its the AAA shills angry the remakes are killing AAA and they arent getting paid to lie and gaslight. Its also the next generation truly couldnt P out of a boot with instructions on the heel and hate thinking games.