God has shown me how wrong Calvinism is when I asked Him for wisdom regarding His love for people here on earth. I am just glad I went straight to the source of love and hope rather than wasting time hearing men debate theologies they came up with. Praise God for his steadfast grace and love 💗
@@nerychristianI don't see anywhere in that comment above about them relying on their emotions. They say "God showed me" and they don't elaborate on how God showed them, but I would be willing to bet it wasn't through emotions but rather through the plain reading of God's word. Ezekiel 33:11
Many an ignorant soul has stumbled on the doctrine of TULIP aka "Calvinism" but this is the doctrine of salvation in a nutshell. Do not reject it because scripture affirms it as truth. Charles Spurgeon knew it was true and so did the Puritans and most of the church.
@@LAStreetPreacher Typical Calvinist, smart people were Calvinists and you think youre smarter than them? That is the dumbest argument possible. "But Lord, Spurgeon said YOU were the ultimate cause of all heinous evil!"
Ezekiel 33:11 Say to them: 'As surely as I live, declares the Lord GOD, I take no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but rather that the wicked should turn from their ways and live. Turn! Turn from your evil ways! For why should you die, O house of Israel?'
@macolyis yes i agree ,but ALL men are given Grace john 1 verse 4-9 - we are all have the Light of Christ ,so thats why GOD says i command ALL men Everywhere to Repent.acts 17-30 Paul goes on to say that God appoints the Times and Places of mans habitation and HE did that.so we might Seek and find HIM ,though HE is Not Far from anyone of US!
@macolyis i said john 1 verse 4-9 says in HIM was Life and the life was the Light of all mankind!! verse 9 the True Light gives Light to everyone who comes into the World!! Paul underscores this when he says all men are without any Excuse not to believe as we all have the Light of Conscience and the Light of Creation within us!! The context is that Everyone possesses Gods Light but man is a Practical Sinner and we do the evil,but we have an advocate with the Father, Christ Jesus. john says Brethren i tell you Not to sin,BUT if you do ,you have an advocate an that is Jesus Christ.Despite our sin nature,when we put our trust in HIM and believe, we are SAVED from all Sins past and present .But for those who walk in the darkness an reject Christ there is no hope for them. WE who have trusted Christ -ITS like we are on a ship headed for Heaven ,we slip onboard but never overboard as Christ will never let us GO. So sinners we are but we have a Savior!!
@@macolyisis'nt Christ set you free from the cross? did he gives you an opportunity to live an ever lasting life by sheding his blood? does the preachers told? that is the works of the Holy spirit... turn you heart to God and believe... dont expect the magical feeling. The african eunich read the bible and believes what the bible says, Philip baptise him. He get saves. the difference is some believe the message with their heart, and some do not believes with their heart. Paul told us to believe in our heart we should not believe our faith. we should believe the object of our faith. that can carry us throught.
Brother @macolyis let me say it this way. changes of heart and faith are like coin having two sides it goes hand in hand. why people cannot put their trust in christ is that they are not willing to change their heart unto GOD thats the reason why they cannot believe. without changing heart no one can put their trust in Christ finished work. bible says. Godly sorrow produces repentance that leads to salvation.
That’s how I feel. They always push back in such a way to cause one to feel like a dummy. That’s why these type of lectures are so important in helping us to realize we’re not crazy. Their doctrine is incoherent.
@rickmethven4374 Please give your coherent veiw. Also, be sure to check the calvinist he quoted and others to see if they agree with what he calls consistent Cavinism. I believe that the truth lies somewhere in between . I've been studying the Bible and I'm praying often on salvation and how it works as best we can understand on this Earth. I will always kneel to the authority of the word. I'd be interested in what you have to say and your biblical proof text.
Both thorough and concise, not to mention astute and gracious, this is the best treatment of Calvinism I've found. I'll be referring people to this a lot, I think. Thanks a ton!
57:24 According to Calvin, questioning Calvin is the same as questioning God: "No one can disprove the doctrine I have expounded except he who pretends to be wiser than the Spirit of God." --John Calvin (Concerning the Eternal Predestination of God, p.155 in the two-book collection "Calvin's Calvinism")
I was in a ministry with a guy that was a Calvinist. We discussed theology sometimes. Calvinism was one subject. I said John do you believe God tells the truth? Of course. He said. I said do you think your pastor tells the truth? And preaches God’s truth as in the Bible. Yes was his answer. I said then your pastor would stand up in the pulpit and say to his listeners some of you will go to Heaven and some will go to Hell and there is not a damn thing you can do about it.
yes....in Adam all die.....you can thank Adam for that; John Calvin didn't have anything to do with it...What you are really mad at is that the consequences of Adams 1 sin were so severe....1 sin caused the fall and damnation of the whole human race....that also speaks to how HOLY GOD REALLY IS!!!!......what the Arminian won't admit is that words like Predestined, Called, Chosen, Elect that appear throughout the New Testament make absolutely ZERO sense if man has free will and can come to Christ on his own.....If free will were true; then those words are not necessary at all. So the Arminian has to make up all kinds of nonsense to even explain what words like predestined, called, chosen, elect even mean. Many of the disciples hated, what you call Calvinism, when Jesus taught it in the 1st Century. Just read John 6:64-66.....it says that many of his disciples no longer followed him....so nothing has changed in 2000 years.....
2 verses in the Bible commonly misunderstood and misinterpreted are I Timothy 2:4 and 2 Peter 3:9......I Tim 2:4 means that God desires that ALL kinds of men to be saved; not ALL men to be saved.....Its the same word where it says that the love of money is a root of ALL kinds of evil; not the love of money is the root of ALL evil. And ALL kinds of men will be saved in that heaven will be represented by all nations, tribes and tongues..... on 2 Peter 3:9 you have to look to the first verses of I and II Peter and they say that they are addressed TO GOD's ELECT. So 2 Peter is saying that God desires that NONE of the ELECT shall perish; it is not saying that God wants to save ALL men. God did not desire for Hitler to be saved ; for example.....nor the Antichrist; nor the false prophet....etc.....God wants ALL His Elect sheep to be saved; and they will be; not one more and not one less. Jesus clearly said that ALL the Sheep get saved......John 6:37-39 "37 All those the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never drive away. 38 For I have come down from heaven not to do my will but to do the will of him who sent me. 39 And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all those he has given me, but raise them up at the last day."
@@timclark2925 What Calvinists won't admit is that "predestined" and "elect" relate to individual salvation exactly zero times. Every time it relates to the plan, the process. Context kills gnosticism, including Calvinism.
@@timclark2925 You just added words to scripture, nowhere does it say that God wants all kinds of people, He says He wants ALL. DO NOT PERVERT SCRIPTURE.
Wonderful, wonderful presentation . Ambiguous Calvinism or Effervescent Grace is one of most heretical attacks on God’s character possible. You do more good than you realize with this video. Thank you.
Believein1 Did the Early Church Believe the Doctrines of Total depravity and predestination? There are a number of websites and RUclips videos (some quite terrible, others a bit scholarly, yet equally terrible) that attempt to dissuade investigative readers to believe that, except for Augustine, or at least until the “time of Augustine”, that the early church did not believe in the depravity of man, in unconditional election and/or a sovereign predestination, Clement Of Alexandria (A.D. 190): “The soul cannot rise nor fly, nor be lifted up above the things that are on high, without special grace.” Origen: “Our free will…or human nature is not sufficient to seek God in any manner.” Eusebius (A.D. 330): “The liberty of our will in choosing things that are good is destroyed.” Augustine (A.D. 370): “If, therefore, they are servants of sin (2 Cor. 3:17), why do they boast of free will?…O, man! Learn from the precept what you ought to do; learn from correction, that it is your own fault you have not the power…Let human effort, which perished by Adam, here be silent, and let the grace of God reign by Jesus Christ…What God promises, we ourselves do not through free will of human nature, but He Himself does by grace within us…Men labor to find in our own will something that is our own, and not God’s; how can they find it, I know not.” UNCONDITIONAL ELECTION Clement Of Rome (A.D. 69): “Let us therefore approach Him in holiness of soul, lifting up pure and undefiled hands unto Him, with love towards our gentle and compassionate Father because He made us an elect portion unto Himself…Seeing then that we are the special elect portion of a Holy God, let us do all things that pertain unto holiness…There was given a declaration of blessedness upon them that have been elected by God through Jesus Christ our Lord…Jesus Christ is the hope of the elect…” Barnabas (A.D. 70): “We are elected to hope, committed by God unto faith, appointed to salvation.” Ignatius. A.D. 110 To the predestined ones before all ages, that is, before the world began, united and elect in a true passion, by the eternal will of the God. Justin Martyr: “In all these discourses I have brought all my proofs out of your own holy and prophetic writings, hoping that some of you may be found of the elect number which through the grace that comes from the Lord of Sabaoth, is left or reserved [set apart] for everlasting salvation.” Ignatius speaks of two sorts of persons, signified by, “two pieces of money; the one belongs to God, and the other to the world; which have each their own characters upon them, and every one shall go to his own place,” Irenaeus (A.D. 198): “God hath completed the number which He before determined with Himself, all those who are written, or ordained unto eternal life…Being predestined indeed according to the love of the Father that we would belong to Him forever.” Clement Of Alexandria (A.D. 190): “Through faith the elect of God are saved. The generation of those who seek God is the elect nation, not [an earthly] place, but the congregation of the elect, which I call the Church…If every person had known the truth, they would all have leaped into the way, and there would have been no election…You are those who are chosen from among men and as those who are predestined from among men, and in His own time called, faithful, and elect, those who before the foundation of the world are known intimately by God unto faith; that is, are appointed by Him to faith, grow beyond babyhood.” Cyprian (A.D. 250): “This is therefore the predestination which we faithfully and humbly preach.” Ambrose Of Milan (A.D. 380): “In predestination the Church of God has always existed.” Augustine (A.D. 380): “Here certainly, there is no place for the vain argument of those who defend the foreknowledge of God against the grace of God, and accordingly maintain that we were elected before the foundation of the world because God foreknew that we would be good, not that He Himself would make us good. This is not the language of Him who said, ‘You did not choose Me, but I chose you’ (John 15:16).”
Both Reformed Covenant Theology and modern Dispensational Theology ignore or pervert the New Covenant fulfilled in blood at Calvary. The term "new covenant" is not found in the confessions of Reformed Covenant Theology, but it is found in the Bible multiple times. "Calvinism" started when men were trying to get their children into an Old Covenant relationship with Christ. What the modern Church needs is a New Covenant Revival (Heb. 9:10) in which members of various denominations are willing to re-examine everything they believe and see if it agrees with the Bible, instead of the traditions of men. We need to be like the Bereans. It will be a battle between our flesh and the Holy Spirit. It will not be easy. If you get mad and upset when someone challenges your man-made Bible doctrines, that is your flesh resisting the truth found in God's Word. .Nobody can completely understand the Bible unless they understand the relationship between the Old Covenant given to Moses at Mount Sinai and the New Covenant fulfilled in blood at Calvary. What brings all local churches together into one Body under the blood of Christ? The answer is found below. New Covenant Whole Gospel: Let us now share the Old Testament Gospel found below with the whole world. On the road to Emmaus He said the Old Testament is about Him. He is the very Word of God in John 1:1, 14. Awaken Church to this truth. Jer 31:31 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah: Jer 31:32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by husband unto them, saith the LORD: Jer 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people. Jer 31:34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more. Is the most important genealogy in the Bible found in Matthew 1:1 (Gal. 3:16)? Is God's Son the ultimate fulfillment of Israel (John 1:49)? Why has the modern Church done a pitiful job of sharing the Gospel with modern Orthodox Jews? Why would someone tell them they are God's chosen people and then fail to share the Gospel with them? Who is the seed of the woman promised in Genesis 3:15? What did Paul say about Genesis 12:3 in Galatians 3:8? Who is the "son" in Psalm 2? Who is the "suffering servant" of Isaiah 53? Who would fulfill the New Covenant promised in Jeremiah 31:31-34? Who would fulfill the timeline of Daniel chapter 9 before the second temple was destroyed? Why have we not heard this simple Old Testament Gospel preached on Christian television in the United States on a regular basis? Once a person comes to understand the New Covenant promised to Israel and Judah in Jeremiah 31:31-34, which is found fulfilled by Christ during the first century in Hebrews 8:6-13, and Hebrews 10:16-18, and specifically applied to the Church in 2 Corinthians 3:6-8, and Hebrews 12:22-24, man-made Bible doctrines fall apart. Let us now learn to preach the whole Gospel until He comes back. The King of Israel is risen from the dead! (John 1:49, Acts 2:36) We are not come to Mount Sinai in Hebrews 12:18. We are come instead to the New Covenant church of Mount Zion and the blood in Hebrews 12:22-24. 1Jn 3:22 And whatsoever we ask, we receive of him, because we keep his commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in his sight. 1Jn 3:23 And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment. 1Jn 3:24 And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us. The following verses prove the Holy Spirit is the master teacher for those now in the New Covenant. Jer 31:34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more. Mar 1:8 I indeed have baptized you with water: but he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost. Joh 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you. Act 11:16 Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost. 1Co 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
1Jn 2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him. Watch the RUclips videos “The New Covenant” by David Wilkerson, or Bob George, and David H.J. Gay.
The Calvinist are the post modern gnostics. Instead of a secret handshake, we are offered up a warped view of God’s righteousness and our inability to make a decision by faith (like Abraham) to follow Him. This doctrine of election and predestination excludes “Come to Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden and I will give you rest.” The very existence of a command is that the person who hears it will make a choice to do so or not. Knowing who will and who will not obey the command is superfluous because God knows the answer. It is the invitation that excludes excuses for not obeying and the judgement that follows for failing to do so.
It seems odd that he would gloss over Total Depravity while talking about the importance of freedom in the rest of the presentation-- since the Calvinistic understanding is that man is born in a state where he needs to be made able to respond positively. Yes, pretty much all Christians agree that man is a sinful creature, but the Calvinists take it further by saying that sin blinds them to the truth unless enabled by God to see.
I agree. I thought he was conceding too much on the topic of Total Inability. But the T in Tulip was the first big crack in the edifice that led me out of Calvinism. I kept finding scripture that was urging sinners to choose righteousness, to trust God and to repent. If God was behind the scenes withholding regeneration from the people He was calling to repent and believe then you could not trust Him. If his word is his revealed will, but He has a secret will that is contrary to His revealed will then you cannot trust scripture. These things led me to trust the God of the Bible and to reject Calvinism.
@@nathancjarrett You just had a mistaken view of Calvinism - and if what you described was your view, I’m glad you stopped thinking that way - whether you wanted to call it Calvinism or whatever. I just hope this hasn’t prevented you from mining the theological riches t that can easily be found within the world of Calvinism/reformed theology.
@@PaDutchRunner Yes, one of the challenges everyone has in this discussion is being careful not to argue against a false version of someone else's position. I am aware that many in the Reformed church do not hold to all 5 points of Calvinism, and do not affirm exhaustive divine Determinism. And I certainly have fewer points of contention with these brothers. However I do think that the 4 point Calvy and the person who tries to affirm Determinism solely with respect to Soteriology while softening their stance on other moral decision making, are attempting to affirm 2 contradictory systems. If you don't affirm E.D.D. or Limited Atonement you may still believe you can consistently affirm some version of Reformed theology, but I think if you examine the doctrines that remain, you will find it necessary to affirm these other beliefs as well. Or, if you find as I have that the Biblical text cannot support these, then you will have a number of Calvy proof texts that you will need to reexamine to see if they truly say what the Reformed theologians have been teaching. I think many who call themselves Calvinists are holding non Calvinist beliefs in some areas, and they often don't understand why non Calvinists are arguing against a thing that is very different from what they have experienced first hand in their nominally Calvinist church or Bible study.
@@PaDutchRunner so I have a Reformed background. I've read some Surgeon, and in school I had to read some Jonathan Edwards, but I haven't really gotten into Puritan theologians. I'm currently focused on trying to understand the writings of the Church fathers, and trying to understand what was actually transmitted from the apostles to the generation after them. I'd be willing to read some John Owen at some point, but I haven't gotten to that yet.
To be a Calvinist, you must accept that God created humans unable to reason. Not that humans can error in reasoning, but rather man is unable to reason. Once one accepts that belief, any contradiction can be accepted.
If mankind can come to the conclusion that Jesus is the Messiah apart from Spirit, then I'll believe you. Matthew 16:15-17 ESV He said to them, "But who do you say that I am?" [16] Simon Peter replied, "You are the Christ, the Son of the living God." [17] And Jesus answered him, "Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jonah! For flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but my Father who is in heaven. John 3:8 ESV "The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear its sound, but you do not know where it comes from or where it goes. So it is with everyone who is born of the Spirit."
I am not overly committed to Calvinism, but the Bible certainly speaks on predestination. I watched this video in hopes that Dr. Walls would give scriptural evidence against Calvinism but he did not. If the Bible isn’t the basis for truth, then what is?
Good for you, Jennifer. You’re seeking truth while being discerning at the same time. Not many Christians are like that anymore and it’s really hard to change your mind in such a stubborn culture. About a year ago, I too was not committed fully to Calvinism and it was really picking my brain. My answers came from listening to RC Sproul and his scripture-filled analysis of predestination. A year later and I find Calvinism on every page of the Bible. It’s been a truly heartwarming discovery. I know it’s been 2 years since you posted this so hopefully you’ve found some answers :)
@rickmethven4374 I see that predestination has more to do with those who *are saved* and in Christ... they are predestined for Heaven and all things described there for them. Those who haven't trusted in Christ are not "in him" and are predestined for Hell and all that is described there. It doesn't have so much to do with *who will be saved* So before I trusted in Jesus, I had one destination ahead of me. AFTER I trusted Jesus as my Savior, I have a different and better (pre) destination. My destination has changed 😊 That's what I read..
FWIW, many years later: Arminianism accepts predestination. Goes something like: "God chose for those He foreknew would answer to His calling." It certainly makes more sense than the mental gymnastics needed to swallow down Calvinism.
As I see things the biggest problem with Calvinism is what it says about God, and the same thing could be said about any incorrect doctrine. All correct doctrine must harmonize with what we know about God as revealed in Christ, who said “When you’ve seen Me, you’ve seen the Father.”
Dr. Wall's basic presentation of core calvinistic framework is correct, however he makes almost no effort to compare those tenants with the Bible. Instead, he Compares them with the opinions of prominent Calvinists, and in a very bizarre move, uses appeals to emotion to claim they're not viable. It's very strange if you think about it. Who cares if John thinks that he loves his children more than God does? Who cares if j.i. Packer doesn't get contradiction correctly? Even if those were true statements (you'd have to actually ask those men and get their feedback), none of those factoids prove whether or not Calvinism is consistent with the Bible. Technically, his whole approach thus far has been a strawman, since he doesn't even refute Calvin directly (let alone show Biblically why Calvin's position doesn't fly). Walls would do much better if he spent his time showing from the Bible how Calvinism is not true, rather than making emotional Appeals to reject the opinions of prominent Calvinists. The two are not the same.
I thought this sounded familiar. Then I realized that I had heard it all before from the excellent book "Why I Am Not A Calvinist." It's nice seeing the face of someone whose book influenced my own thinking.
@@flamingooneleg77 Calvinism: The doctrine that believes Christ isn't who He claimed to be nor is capable of doing what He said He would do. Deceived? Calvinism cannot coexist with the gospel. There is no assurance for the believer. The message of the cross must be removed. The end times judgement is for nothing more than show. The word "believe", which in itself requires making a choice, must be removed from all scripture. C'mon man! Deceived?
@@djohnson3093 Wow! What a brilliant display of profound ignorance, You clearly have no clue what Calvinists believe and have affirmed and denied in our major confessions of faith.
@@TheBereanVoice No need to look beyond their gross corruption of the Gospel of Christ to see what Calvinists believe - hint: It's certainly not the Truth that set's one free!!!
@@caroldonaldson5936 Perhaps you can indicate one point on which the message we preach differs from the message the apostles. If you can't, you need to ask who it is that has grossly corrupted the gospel. I can show you many ways in which synergists have departed from the apostolic message.
IF a woman is FORCED to love you without CHOOSING to love you, then it is not real love. Real love comes from freedom of choice - and man's freedom of choice is void in Calvinism. In Calvinism, those who are saved are robots.
I agree 100%. That’s why this entire teaching falls apart. Calvinists DO believe in free will. This guy is presenting a straw man argument. Find me a Calvinist that says they don’t believe in free will and I’ll show you a nonCalvinist
@@rickmethven4374alvinists believe in a free will of their own definition. It is an illusion of free will. Just the run-of-the-mill Calvinist copout. Tell me you didn't watch the video without telling me you watched the video. This is funny. 😆 Not different from the way they impose eisegesis upon verses incongruent with their beliefs. Most of them are also Cessationists. It tells me in what high regard they hold the Scriptures, and all I need to know about their real stance on "Sola Scriptura", when this doctrine cannot be traced back to any verse in the Word. Yet they embrace it. They are just as, if not more cultish, than the prosperity gospel lovers and die-hard Charismatics. Have more in common with Catholics, e.g. at least the latter annul marriages - Calvinists do the same with the salvation of those that "didn't have the perseverance of the Saints." Not even Calvinists are Calvinists, since they preach the Gospel. Which there really is no need for, since all those preordained by God to be saved will be saved. What arrogance of people to think they need to assist God in something He already decided! God doesn't need more help from them than He needed it from Abraham and Sarah to get Isaac. It is a man-made cult, worshiping a moral monster called Calvin. I believe they are saved, because their misunderstanding of the mechanism of Salvation doesn't disquality them from it. Now, when it comes to false teachers, that's a place where I have my doubts. But I leave it to God's Grace, as it should be.
@@davidochieng2975LOL. With all due respect, typical Calvinist answer. I have yet to find a cult that operates from the same entitlement space as Calvinists 🙂. The typical Catholic is more pleasant than you guys.
It's funny when I think about all of this. Biblically, Jesus Christ paid the penilty for all of our sin( eternal seperation from God in hell). I mean all of our sins( past present future), it would not makes sense if died for all but one. So when someone is saved, they are saved by grace through faith, not of yourselves but a gift from God, not by works lest any man should boast. I think this is pretty clear scripture on how a man is saved. If I am saved by the finished work of the cross, and I trust in Jesus Christ alone to take me to heaven when I die how can I lose it when I didn't work for it? How can I pay the penalty for sins when it is already been paid? I'm not saving me, Jesus is saving me. I am trusting on him to take me to heaven... I just don't understand why people have a hard time understanding this. Scripture also sperated salvation from service. Salvation is a gift, Service is working. You don't serve to get saved, you get saved to serve.
Brittany Nguyen You spell it out very nicely. I do wonder though how that works in practice. If I am saved, how do I know it? By confessing Christ as Lord? If that makes me saved, then what do I have to do to STAY saved? Anything? Can I sin and repent, over and over again? Watch porn, tell God I am sorry (and really mean it) and the next week commit more sin, repent again, over and over again, and STILL be saved by faith alone in the finished work of the cross? If repentance means committing to staying clean from sin by praying, reading scripture, going to church - in other words, committing to works to lead a life of righteousness, doesn't that mean that works plays some kind of role in salvation? If works play no role in salvation, it is all a matter of accepting Christ, wouldn't that mean I could say, "Jesus died for me, and I accept Him as Lord," and still be saved even though I never prayed, went to church, or read the Bible?
your saved Unto good works never by them. we are always Sinners but Jesus takes on all those sins All the time but like a real father he wants to US to acknowledge them to HIM. We must also be very bothered when we sin.This is very important.
David Collins. Great points. Just one question. In James 2 he raises the question: What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if someone claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith SAVE them? . and he goes on to answer the question: You see that a person is considered righteous (justified) by what they do and not by faith alone. sorry guys, but scripture is very stubborn on that line
I'm wondering if you understood the presentation. Both Arminians and Calvinists believe exactly what you have described. The question that is brought to bear is ... Who first chooses that one will be saved. ~ According to Arminians, it is the man (each of us individually). ~ According to Cavinists, it is GOD who has chosen long before our existence. I used to think it was the former. Naturally, probably we all do. But after having studied this issue for several years, I now see much more Biblical evidence for the latter. Many Proof Texts that seem to contradict Calvinism, when seen in Literal forms and in Context, I see now support this view (which I call Sovereign Grace).
Perfect factual information about the misunderstanding of Calvinist who misunderstand and misrepresent the word of god into their own understanding of scripture
His point that ends at 47:10...This is how Calvinism maintains its credibility; by using the rhetoric of universal love in a way that their theology does not support. Bunker busting bomb!
@Stefano-o5f Dead sinners cannot cooperate unless and until they are born again by the Holy Spirit. The will is passive in regeneration. Only after being regenerated can the sinner cooperate in his believing, repenting, and obeying. The will cannot cooperate until after regeneration.
@@christophersnedeker2065 Patience imply you have to endure and wait for something better, that imply there's something worse in the first place. Real love imply that you have a choice to not love. Gratitude imply that you have seen worse and were liberated from it.
I asked my former pastor (a Calvinist) and he said he doesn't tell his children that they might not be elected. He told me "salvation is of the lord, I will never tell my children they could be dammed to hell. that's up to God to decide". Therefore he only tells his children that they need to repent and that God would do the rest if they are elected. I still think my former pastor means well and I still love him and pray for him.
@@David24476 I am not sure what kind of Calvinist your former pastor is but a knowledgeable Calvinist would not tell his children that "they need to repent and that God would do the rest if they are elected." A Calvinist would believe that their repentance would be the result of God's work in their hearts but that would not be part of the message they need to hear. The concept of election forms no part of our evangelistic message. Our message is simple. God has promised pardon and justification to everyone who will confide in His promise. He is able to make such a promise based on the infinitely valuable and abundantly sufficient redemptive work of Christ. No sinner has ever existed who would be denied pardon and justification if they trusted God's promise and repented of their hostility toward God. The gospel is not for elect sinners but for sinners as sinners.
@@TheBereanVoiceYour message is a lie. God is the truth. You follow doctrines of demons and you put confidence in mere men. You should know better but obviously not.
Friend, that was the same view Pelagius had when he debated St. Augustine. Pelagianism was soon considered heresy by the entirety of the Church in 415 AD. Read the debate summary to see the wisdom in Augustine’s response
@@laserfalcon Nobody said I do or don’t support MacArthur. We’re talking about the theology here, not mere men. If your theology is dependent on the men who teach it then your theology is in men, not theology of Word of God. Show me MacArthur affirming Pelagius and I’ll be more than happy to believe you. I simply stated a fact of history. If MacArthur affirms that, good for him
I have been working on a doctrine, you might be interested. Election is based on whether a person is proud or humble. God gives grace to the humble (James 4;6). All have sinned so all have something to be humble about,. Those that remain proud remain damned. Spirits are used to make people do evil, people that remain proud after evil remain damned. Mankind has partial free-will and partial self-control because of the spirits. If a person becomes too proud or does other sin God can no longer justify keeping the person in his grace. People are meant to obey to keep God's grace after they are elected.
God has no partiality (Rom 2:11) and the Bible calls having favoritism a sin (James 2:9) yet Calvinism teaches "Unconditional Election" which is favoritism on steroids.
I enjoyed this teaching. It seems to me that mankind, since the beginning in the Garden of Eden, has had free will. God told Adam and Eve what to do in that day, but allowed them to do the opposite. When man was seduced by the serpent, he freely chose to listen to him instead of God. God never forced man to listen to Him and He even made another way for man, even in his disobedience. God loves us and desires ALL to come to repentance, but He doesn't force us or pick certain ones. His Word draws us in, but doesn't force us to accept His free gift. Makes sense to me and certainly paints a beautiful picture of the love God has for us, as demonstrated in Christ.
Derick Bland, You seem to be majorly confused about what Calvinists mean when we deny free will. We do not mean that sinners are not able to choose contrary to what God has commanded or that they are able to make free, voluntary and meaningful choices that from the human standpoint change the outcome. People choose apart from external constraint. No Calvinist believes that God forces anyone to believe. You are correct that God desires the repentance of all. A holy being could desire nothing other than that. That is not the issue. The issue is whether He has determined to secure a people for Himself or if it is possible that all He has done for the salvation of His people will have been completely in vain. Calvinists simply believe that God is not merely one who wants to save and tries to save but one who actually saves whom He will and does so successfully and by Himself. He is not waiting for the sinner's cooperation. He graciously produces the sinner's cooperation by putting a new heart in us and giving us a new disposition toward Him.
That’s a misunderstanding of Calvinism that, I’m afraid, is very popular. The best way to go at Calvinists is to say they don’t believe in free will. It’s always sad to see someone shoot at it from such a wrong angle. Former Arminian speaking ✋
@@rickmethven4374 I have been uninvited or banned from attending a Calvinist church for believing exactly what J. Walls is teaching. Some believe that God pre determined who will be saved, others believe God has predestined all to be saved through Jesus. You can call it Calvinism or Arminianism but that is not the point. All who except the grace of God will be saved because Jesus’ death on the cross NECESSARILY was for all sin. Jesus’ death cannot be limited as it is SUFFICIENT to cover all sin. That’s how great Jesus is ! Our sin is evil, but His grace is sufficient to cover the sin of the world. Praise be to God! Also, the only unforgivable sin is unbelief. Even Jesus marveled that souls that don’t believe ; And Jesus said to them, “A prophet is not without honor, except in his own country, and among his own kin, and in his own house.” And he could do no mighty work there, except that he laid his hands upon a few sick people and healed them. (And he marveled because of their unbelief). And he went about among the villages teaching. Mark 6:4-6 - www.biblegateway.com/passage?search=Mark%206:4-6&version=RSV Your Unbelief is what keeps you from the grace of God.
@@jamesbrooks4374 I find it fascinating that you were “banned” from a church for believing in a certain view of Christianity. I wouldn’t commend any church for that. Either they’re a poorly mislead church or you’re being dishonest. I hope neither, and I’ll take your word for it. I pray you find forgiveness in your heart and that the church would reevaluate the treatment of their members. As for the conversation though, Calvinism and Arminianism have names for good reasons. Disassociating the names to their beliefs makes no sense to me, but call it what you like. We agree when you say that all who accept the saving grace of God will be saved. That much is promised in scripture and a firm belief of Calvinists and Arminians alike. What we do not affirm is that that grace was meant to cover all sin- even unrepentant sin. It’s a nice idea that Christ covers all sin, but it is not the story of the Bible and He is not the God of the Bible, if you are correct. If you suggest that Christ died for ALL sin, then you must also suggest that Christ failed at saving those He died with intention to save. I’m curious if you would directly affirm this statement. (You would say that this is only due to their unbelief, and I would agree. The question is: why would an omnipotent God send His Son for those He KNOWS will not repent?) You claimed that Christ dying for ALL sin is what explains “how great Jesus is!”, but what makes Him even greater is that He is JUST. Idk about you, but I’d rather have a Just God than one who attempts to save those who are unrepentant. Because God is just, He will not make atonement for unrepentant sin (which He foreknows), and therefore would be a different God from the God of the Bible if He sent His Son to die for unrepentant sin. Arminians are assuredly brothers and sisters in Christ, and should not be thrown out of any church, ever. But I believe they are brothers and sisters in Christ because of an inconsistency in their own theology. I’m afraid that if they WERE right and people DID accept God’s gift on account of themself and not 100% on account of God, there wouldn’t be a single Christian on the planet. We’re just far too sinful. Praise God it’s not up to me whether or not I’m saved, and praise God that in His infinite wisdom, He is just and reserved His mercy for those He sees fit.
@@rickmethven4374 I can show you the email; “It has been the decision of the pastor and chairman of the deacons to prohibit you from attending any activities at Pleasant Union Christian Church” Jesus Christ says in Matthew 25:41, "Depart from me, ye cursed, into EVERLASTING FIRE, prepared for the devil and his angels." Hell was prepared for the devil and his angels not for humans created in God’s image. God did not create humans just to hate them, that would not be “just” as you say. I believe God fore ordained the World before creating it. In doing so, using His omniscience, God knew which world He would create would allow for the most free creatures to spend eternity with Him. In doing so, there are indeed humans that when given revelation from God would not accept His grace. But God didn’t damn them before creating them they freely chose to not worship the Creator. My point about Calvinism and Arminianism was that mere Christianity is all that is needed for a rich and full relationship with our Lord, and Savior Jesus Christ. Reformed or Catholic doesn’t matter either. Not sure religion matters either. Just a tight relationship with our Creator. But one must get that right, no false god can save you. Only the True God can through the sacrifice of Jesus. One more point I hope you grasp, Jesus’ death did take away the sin of the world. If there are millions of worlds in existence we don’t know about Jesus’s death was sufficient for the sins of those worlds as well. Nothing but the blood of Jesus can save and that blood is not inefficient unless it is rejected. Look at Satan and his angels You believe that God is one; you do well. Even the demons believe-and shudder. James 2:19 But they don’t accept God’s grace do they ? "All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men; but the blasphemy against the Holy Spirit shall not be forgiven unto men" (Matthew 12:31). Sin is forgiven only because of Jesus’ propitiation on the cross. No one deserves salvation accept the sinless Christ, we now should love our Creator and Sustainer and our neighbors as ourselves, and sin no more. I appeal to you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, to present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God, which is your spiritual worship. Do not be conformed to this world but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that you may prove what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect. Romans 12:1-2 To continue in sin is to crucify Jesus over and over and over again. Stop sinning! Confirm to Christ as our example. Wasn’t that why Jesus sent the Holy Spirit to us? “If you love me, you will keep my commandments. And I will pray the Father, and he will give you another Counselor, to be with you for ever, even the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees him nor knows him; you know him, for he dwells with you, and will be in you. He who has my commandments and keeps them, he it is who loves me; and he who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I will love him and manifest myself to him.” Judas (not Iscariot) said to him, “Lord, how is it that you will manifest yourself to us, and not to the world?” Jesus answered him, “If a man loves me, he will keep my word, and my Father will love him, and we will come to him and make our home with him. He who does not love me does not keep my words; and the word which you hear is not mine but the Father’s who sent me. John 14:15-17,21-24 This is doable through the Holy Spirit, not by our own strength. Happy day brother! God bless and keep you!
Here's the issue: God desires His glory more than human autonomy. Or God desires human autonomy more than His glory. The first sentence is correct. The Arminians mistake is that they assume sinful man is able to objectivly judge whether God is good.
To give a lecture like this without quoting or expounding scripture he follows his forefather John Wesley on the same subject It is not acceptable to say that he is going to do this subsequently. Not all may get to hear the next lecture.
Short answer to why I am not a Calvinist: 1 Corinthians 1:10 "Now I plead with you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you, but that you be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment. 11 For it has been declared to me concerning you, my brethren, by those of Chloe’s household, that there are contentions among you. 12 Now I say this, that each of you says, “I am of Paul,” or “I am of Apollos,” or “I am of Cephas,” or “I am of Christ.” 13 Is Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Or were you baptized in the name of Paul?" To all those who call themselves Calvinists I would echo Paul's question, Was Calvin crucified for you? If anyone thinks this approach is frivolous I would reply two things: 1) that I also have a long answer, covering the many unbiblical aspects of Calvinistic doctrine. And 2). I have personally experienced the hurtful divisive effects of a prideful loyalty to Calvin that eclipsed a common fellowship in Christ. There is an individual, a brother in Christ, who has severed all communication with me because he could not convert me to Calvinism. We had discussed various aspects of "tulip theology" but our last communication was a conversation in which I brought up Calvin's involvement in the execution of Servetus. My friend angrily defended Calvin even though one of the "heresies" for which Servetus was burned at the stake was opposition to infant baptism, a charge for which I would be guilty and subject to execution if i had lived in Calvin's Geneva. Historian Bernard Cottret summarizes Calvin's argument in a syllogism based on a lost letter: "Socrates is a man, and therefore mortal; Servetus is a heretic, and therefore combustible." Cottret also cites a letter from John Calvin on Servetus that says: "One should not be content with simply killing such people, but should burn them cruelly." I forget who it was that asked, "How could a follower of Christ the Lamb act like such a cruel and ravenous lion?" P.S. I'm not an Arminian either.
"He had with you before the world began" in the sense that his being in the father's presence in the present tense, guaranteed from the beginning that he would be glorified in his father. Again, Calvinists gloss over the nuances of grammatical constructions, honing in on a single meaning when the construction of the sentence does not logically guarantee it.
@@ScottRachelson777 Jesus in his Bible is saying to me God thought everything out before time began and right there I can't undesrstand that timelessness and also God is One uncreated, so that's another mystery. God is the arhitect of everything and when He was ready he created = thought ot Jesus and begat him, made him to manage the putting in place the PLANS. Jesus is subject to time I am the Alpha and Omega where as God isn't and that reality puts the complete lie to the demonic Nicene creed that satan demands be dogmatised in order to explain away Jesus's ability to destroy his dreadful work ie the dismissal of demons, the cleansing and sourging of lower human natures.
@@ScottRachelson777 solid eisegesis. You just made all that up, it’s nowhere in the text. Calvinists of old were better suited in the Greek and thats definitely not what they saw that verse meant.
@@florida8953 You are a brainwashed Calvinist, so of course, you think it's eisegesis. I'm not surprised. It's like expecting a radical Muslim to see that Jesus is God or a JW that Jesus is eternal and that being born of man doesn't negate that fact. These groups are all bound up in the mind and so their spirits are blind as a bat.
Nothing is wrong with Calvinism... however, what’s wrong with this lecture is that there wasn’t even one Bible verse until 43 minutes into the lecture, and how he never presented passages from scripture like John 6:37-45, Romans 9, Ephesians 1:1-14 and 2:1-10 that all support Calvinistic soteriology. Why not go straight to Christ’s and the apostles’ teachings AKA scripture to refute Calvinism... oh wait, you can’t because it’s all throughout scripture. So much for that PhD if you can’t exegete scripture...
This is why I am a Primitive Baptist and not a Calvinist. We don't believe in a general call, only the effectual call *1 Corinthians **2:14** : 14* But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness unto him; neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. John 6:44 No man can come unto me unless my Father who sent me draws him
I never really understood Calvinism myself but am interested to know if certain personality types are more drawn to this kind of theology than others. Anecdotally, I've never really seen a Calvinist exhibit high levels of empathy for example and they tend to be much more risk averse than others which leads to the kind of closed-mindedness that in my opinion is quite damaging. I guess it's really hard to tell which came first whether it was the Calvinism that requires you to suppress empathy and become risk averse or whether it is being naturally lacking in empathy and being risk averse that predisposes someone to embracing Calvinism. This may seem like a strange angle to come from (the whole personality type thing). I do just wonder sometimes the psychological impact of having a vision of God who is ultimately opposed to the notion of possibilities and who presents himself to us (from the human perspective) as an apparently amoral certitude who defines his notion of goodness in a way irreconcilable with the definition of good I have come across in any human language. Why not use the English word "evil" for the Calvinist God if that seems to fit better? I'm aware that Calvinism has always been an easy version of Christianity to caricature due to the moral repulsion felt by most people who encounter it, at least for the first time. Hopefully I'm not leaning too heavily on those caricatures to make my argument, but if I am I'm open to correction. Again anecdotally, I've never really found a Calvinist whose life I would feel compelled to imitate in any significant way. Is it too harsh of me to question the tree if the fruit seems mostly distasteful?
I'm in a PCA church but I must admit I find Calvinism a nightmare. I'm desperate to find arguments that Calvinists have misunderstood essential things but I want truth, above all else.
@@urawesome4670 I agree - I'm reformed because I'm convinced I am hopelessly lost without the grace of God and I don't understand WHY HE WOULD PICK ME because I feel like has chased me my whole life and he will never stop. I love my Lord.
I think I understand what you mean, but also, think: the great majority of people on the planet (or who have You Tube) could not care any less about this topic, even many “Christians” or some may not have the intelligence to grasp its intricacies. I what I mean is that the mere fact that you’re here actually interested in this subject matter (and not bashing it, like some atheists like to do) represents at least a care and love for God such that you are willing to expand your understanding above and beyond what most others would do. I would venture to say that if you ask most Christians whether they embrace Calvinism or Arminianism, they wouldn’t even know what you were talking about. I attempted to explain the difference to my wife the other day and her head almost exploded, and I was unsaved before I met her, and but for her, I would probably remain unsaved (but not according to Calvinist, lol). I think the personality types would break down like this: cerebral/academically-inclined literalists= tend toward Calvin; heartfelt/emotional/romantic?= Arminian. Hard to pinpoint, because we all have Jesus in common....isn’t that enough?? That’s what my beautiful wife would say.
@@StudioGalvan If calvinists actually read the bible instead of worshipping MacArthur and company they would know that it doesn't support calvinism at all.
@@lintflas1183 Perhaps you should also warn Yohann Hus, Martin Luther, Zwingli and all the rest of the heroes of the Reformation about not following "Calvinism" or John MacArthur. Oh wait, They all PRECEDED John MacArthur. As did the early church fathers who wrote the churches and each other many things which support what you call "Calvinism". Here is a pretty good list of many of their writings. www.apuritansmind.com/arminianism/calvinism-in-the-early-church-the-doctrines-of-grace-taught-by-the-early-church-fathers/ (Jump about 3/16's down the page to see the available quotes.) ~ So the point is, there is Very Good reason that the doctrine of Sovereign Grace, (now popularly called Calvinism for some reason) exists.~ But as you indicated, it matter not what ANYONE says, if it is not supported in scripture. Here is a list of scripture as well as what many of the Pre-MacArthur theologians have commented. www.apuritansmind.com/tulip/calvinism-and-tulip-in-the-middle-ages/ ~ Perhaps you will study it from a Non-Calvinist Hater before you make judgement. "Remove the beam out of your own eye, and then you can see clearly to remove the speck out of your brother's eye." (That is, if you even consider all these great and Godly men of the past brothers.)
@@StudioGalvan Luther and Zwingli weren't calvinists. Calvinism plays almost no role in the German speaking world. It's a problem in the English-speaking part of the world. I don't deny that there are numerous attempts to turn them all into Calvinists.
@Lintflas You need to check your facts sister. Almost ALL of the Early reformers were believers in the doctrine of Sovereign Grace (Calvinism). Look it up.
You stressed the point that I have always believed and live by...for Wesleyans, it is not a defense of "free will" as much as it is a defense of the character and nature of God. This is what I try to impart to my Calvinist friends. I don't believe that I would be a Christian if it meant being a Calvinist. This video is a must-watch for both Calvinists and non-Calvinists. Wonderful lecture, Jerry. Thanks!!
So you would create a god in your image, rather than accept the God of the Bible? That is the real issue here - submission to scripture or forcing the Bible to support a god who is acceptable to sinful man.
That the fundamental issue is the character of God is spot on, couldn’t agree more. This is also a solid way to try to determine which theological ideas are correct in other contexts as well. The ideas that make God look the best, the most like Jesus Christ, are the ones most likely to be correct.
God is who He is. He doesn't need to be protected. He needs to be proclaimed. Twisting Scripture to make Him seem palatable is just as bad as outright rejecting Him. The truth is that He IS sovereign over EVERYTHING and WE are not.
@@douglasmcnay644Yes, indeed God is sovereign! But is that His only attribute? In the Bible, especially in the NT(through Christ Jesus, his death on the cross, his resurrection, his second coming) God is clearly portrayed as the loving God and Father..... God bless ...
Calvinism is not simple in the Salvation issue Other groups have similar if not worse understanding on this issue . To be safe , make personal study . And ask the Lord for wisdom .
Amen 💗 I asked God to help show me His truth after coming across Calvinism and I know now that Gods will is for everyone to be saved but some of us choose to accept or reject His gift of enteral life through faith in Jesus Christ
What is the point of telling Cain he must overcome sin if he supposedly was never able to overcome sin in the first place?? Calvinism is a load of (fill in the blank).
bud ekins- God gives us many commands that we of ourselves can not fulfill or obey. When you refuse to accept the gospel as explained by TULIP you reject Bible truth and show yourself still lost and in your sins. Seek the Lord that you might find Him. You have a false Jesus you have created and therefore you need to repent and ask God for true saving faith. Watch my many excellent videos that might help you.
The TULIP is treated as though it were a paragraph of scripture and part of the inspired text, and so doctrines are built around its precepts. They are just concepts that may contain aspects of truth but they are not true as biblical revelation to be embraced as a tenet of doctrine.
Biblical revelation regarding the triune nature of God isn't stated so simply as the word "trinity" (which the bible never uses), but it does systematically reveal that 1. God is three persons, 2. Each person is fully God, and 3. There is one God. (Hard to comprehend but God really is three different things that are omnipresent, while being one God). The Calvinist principles, if taken in their full context and studied systematically from Genesis to Revelation, are not systematically revealed, nor consistent. The one compromise I will make is the idea of Perseverance of the Saints. Aside from a few select texts in Hebrews (which I think are taken out of context by hard-core Arminians), I believe true salvation is eternal. Aside from that, I think Calvinists have it wrong, especially in regards to election, atonement, and the resistability of grace. With regards to Depravity, I don't get too worked up. We're depraved to a certain extent, call it total or not, whatever. That being said, I also think it's important to remember that if Jesus is your forgiver and leader and you have genuinely declared those words in your heart and with your mouth, then whether it's a sovereignty thing or whether there is some free-will involved (you can see where I stand), we are all on the same team. What Jesus did, who He is, and what He does inside of us and through us, is what's really important.
At 59ish he says God is only LORD/King after creation I dare say he has been from eternity past because God is immutable he doesn’t change all of his magnificent attributes have always been there he hasn’t gained or lost anything he is omnipotent before he created, he is love, he is righteous, he is absolute, self sufficient or autonomous, holy and all his other attributes have always been.
@@BuildingApologetics Malachi 3:6 “For I the LORD do not change; therefore you, O children of Jacob, are not consumed. If he was only creator after creation then that changed God from noncreator to creator and would not longer leave any accuracy in Malachi 3:6 and would nullify the doctrine of the immutability of God all of Gods attributes are eternal creation has just allowed them to be manifest. Is mercy and grace immutable attributes of God? Yes but they weren’t on display until the fall of man, and in full consummation at Calvary.
There is a answer people are grasping for but cant get. Paul said it best and I agree that who can understand God and his ways, we can talk and think until we die but we dont have the mental ability to understand Him fully. This is where faith comes in, I have faith God wishes all to be saved, I hqve faith that God knows all things and is all powerful, I have faith God created us in His image and we have free will. I dont understand it all and only God can, that is why you cant pkease Gid without faith.
@@tricord2939 not what that verse says at all. God is not willing that any should perish but that doesn’t mean that those who choose to reject Him won’t. Just as He draws everyone to Him there are those who will willfully turn away.
@@brendapfeil4584 Proof texting is a dangerous thing, you quoted “ALL”. In reply to John 6:44 “No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws them, and I will raise them up at the last day.
@@tricord2939 Yes, absolutely yes God must draw a person to Christ. How does He do it? The gospel is preached (Romans 10:13-14); The Holy Spirit ( John 16:8) The Father sent His Son, the Word, the gospel, the Holy Spirit, and faithful preachers so that men would be drawn. Literally a few verses up in John 6: 40 Jesus says, “For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in Him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.” And He EXPLAINS what He meant in John 6:44 later in verse 64-65. Those that wouldn’t believe and who would betray Him!! You have to read the whole chapter!
It ONLY makes sense that God gives people enough grace to love Him. "To whom little is given, LITTLE is required. To whom MUCH is given MUCH is required." Those who have not heard of Jesus, yet, with what little of the Grace of God they have received, do their best to feel the need for God, and love Him as best they know how, God will allow them to Salvation and the Atonement. Perhaps, when such a person, or a child dies, they are gently led to an understanding of Christ. If they truly have accepted the Grace of God, they will come to Christ after they die.
Mark Rogers Walls was not making a case for some non-Calvinist view. Anyone who is honest can agree that, given certain interpretations of scripture, a case can be made for Calvinism, Molinism, or Arminianism. To break the interpretive deadlock, we can turn to philosophy and logic which shows us the incoherence of Calvinism. Even Calvinist scholars have come to recognize the “mysteries” and “paradoxes” that their view logically leads to.
I agree, during all of his passionate rantings and ravings, not once did I ever hear him address the Biblical argument for Calvanism. This seems to be the consistent opposition with people making Willis' argument.
To follow Armenian logic, it sure is a good thing Noah decided to choose God, cause it sure would have been very awkward if God waited for Noah to build the Ark and Noah chose not to build it.
@@phillwithskill1364 The problem with the Non-Calvinists perspective is that it seeks to do away with the mystery. God has done the best He can. Some sinners respond properly because they are somehow more spiritual, humble, intelligent etc. than other sinners. God responds to their decision but controls nothing because He doesn't want to violate the sinner's free will. There is no mystery. For Paul, and the rest of those who are willing to believe what the Bible teaches, there will always be mystery. He wrote, "O the Depth of the riches of the wisdom and knowledge of God. How unsearchable are His judgments [decrees] and His ways [the providential outworking of those judgments] past tracing out."
I loved this! He did an excellent job in a very gentle and loving way. As a Calvanist, I appreciated that. It seems though, that the entire crux of his anti-Calvanist argument was based on Whether God loves everyone, or mankind’s general definition of love. But the Bible answers this. Paul clearly told the church in Roman’s 9 that God raised pharaoh up for his own glory and, in the same chapter Paul answered the argument with a rhetorical question. “Can the potter make a vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use?”. That question is rhetorical for two reasons. The first reason is because of course the potter can make a vessel for honorable use and one for dishonorable..and the second reason is because Paul already showed the Romans that Paul had made pharaoh for his own glory..So, I’ll answer the “does God love everyone” question with a question of my own..Did God love Pharaoh? Remember, according to Mr. Walls definition of Love “truly to love someone is to desire their well being and to promote their true flourishing as much as you can”. Does creating a “vessel” for dishonorable use fit this definition of love? Did God love pharaoh?
Yes, remember in God's love there is kindness, compassion, mercy, sacrifice, justice, judgement, hell and heaven, to name a few. God chose the Jews to carry his name (honored). However, the Gentiles (everyone else) he did not, you could say that the gentiles were raised at first for dishonor. When the words honored and dishonored are used it simply means one group or individuals were given preference over another or denied acknowledgement for whatever reason at whatever time in history. It does not mean that they were raised for destruction (forced into hell), or on the other hand, that they have automatic entrance into the Kingdom. When you cherry pick scripture and not take in the whole council of God’s word, you can easily come up with all types of ungodly beliefs, cults and the like. You must realize that Pharoah’s heart was by choice already at a state of disbelief in a God whom Moses was proclaiming. Pharaoh had choices just as we do today. This next passage might clear things up for you. “The coming of the lawless one will be in accordance with how Satan works. He will use all sorts of displays of power through signs and wonders that serve the lie, and all the ways that wickedness deceives those who are perishing. They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved. For this reason God sends them a powerful delusion so that they will believe the lie and so that all will be condemned who have not believed the truth but have delighted in wickedness” (2 Thessalonians 2:9-12). Did God send a delusion just to deceive people, no scripture clearly states "for this reason" they beleive not the truth but a lie. The delusion comes on behalf of people's own choices. Their sin if not repented of puts them back under the law out of grace, not by God's choice but their own. Remember the incidence of the snakes in Pharoah’s court. Pharoah’s magicians imitated the miracle of Moses's rod turning into a snake, not just one but several snakes. It was a counterfeit although at the time very real. Such as the case with Satan and his devices, very much real but yet a counterfeit to what God’s purposes and plans are. God as he did back then and does today send strong delusions to those who refuse to love the truth and obey as to be saved. In the Old Testament it was done by not believing through disobeying the prophets who spoke on God’s behalf. By choice people decide their own fate. In Acts 3:25-26 we read, And you are sons of the prophets and of the covenant God made with your fathers when He said to Abraham, ‘Through your offspring all the families of the earth will be blessed. When God raised up His Servant, He sent Him first to you to bless you by turning each of you from your wicked ways. Did God forcibly turn Israel from their wicked ways. No, he provided the way into which they might believe in His Son. Although they were chosen to be a nation honored by God to carry forth his purposes early on, yet Israel still had to decide whether or not to obey. They were raised up to be a vessel honored by God. Every one of us are sown in dishonored, for we have all sinned. But those who obey and believe in the truth will be raised from dishonor to honor and seated with Christ in heavenly places. God raised Pharaoh up as a vessel of dishonor. Not to force him into hell, but chose him to be a force of evil because he refused to believe in Moses a prophet sent by God to deliver his people, and also to fulfill his purposes. God is sovereign in his foreknowledge, not wanting anyone to perish, but all come into the fullness of Christ, whether by revelation through the prophets in the O.T or through Christ Jesus in this age. Pharaoh was already under a personal decision of disbelief and an unwillingness to know the one true God by choice. In Exodus 8:15, 32; and 9:34, we are told explicitly that Pharaoh hardened his own heart, so lets not put all the marbles on God's side. Or do you think lightly of the riches of His kindness and restraint and patience, not knowing that the kindness of God leads you to repentance? But because of your stubbornness and unrepentant heart you are storing up wrath for yourself on the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God, who WILL REPAY EACH PERSON ACCORDING TO HIS DEEDS: to those who by perseverance in doing good seek glory, honor, and immortality, He will give eternal life; but to those who are self-serving and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, He will give wrath and indignation. Rom 2:4 God raises kings, presidents, prime ministers today as He did in the O.T for his glory, for His purposes and plans. By no fault of our own, God does not purposely condemn to hell or eternally save to heaven. If so Christ died for some, not all. Remember your parents loved you by the hand of blessing and punishment/discipline. Did God love Pharaoh, yes in love through justice and judgement.
Of course God loved Pharaoh. Pharaoh was a vessel of wrath/destruction God used against the J--s, (don't want a hate speech strike for the geniuses at youtube) It does not logically follow the Pharaoh himself was a vessel of wrath unto himself or a personal recipient of Gods wrath as the Calvinist believes. He was simply a tool. There is no reason to assume he never believed. God hardened his heart, but for the express purpose of the aforementioned and not necessarily unto eternal punishment in hell. Just something to chew on...
Either Roman's 2:11-16 is true or God is a liar.....this is what brought me out of the heresy of Calvinism....God is NOT a respector of people, but of conditions...you must believe to have salvation is the condition...whole book of John states this over 100 times.
@@polskigirl8547 well if you were a Calvinist, dont you know that we believe that one must have faith for salvation? It sounds like you have no knowledge of this.
@@josephharrison4669 I do have knowledge ….. but your faith comes from God and not your free will… God chose you for heaven and decried others for damnation…
@@polskigirl8547 regardless of where the faith comes from, I still have faith in Christ so I don't know how you can call Calvinism a heresy. How does it change the gospel in any way? I believe Arminians are wrong about soteriology but I wouldnt call you a heretic because you still have faith in Christ for your salvation.
I've been studying and believe in Calvin doctrines...one thing I see consistently from Calvinist is they use scripture to support their views whereas those in opposition use almost no scripture and does not seek out God's word. Be careful of following those folks. Study scripture and the Holy Spirit will reveal the truth to you! God Bless!
Not all Calvinists use TULIP. Instead of Limited Atonement there is Definite or Actual Atonement. Instead of Irresistible Grace there is Effectual Grace or Effectual Calling. The Reformers used the words and understanding of the terms for their time period. Calvin gets so much hate and at least Walls educates his audience about this. Calvin was a brilliant man gifted by God that in his very early 20s already started writing Institutes. Brothers and Sisters, KNOW your church history! I don’t care if you are a Calvinist, Arminianist, Molonist, and some other varying degrees within each camp. KNOW your church history. Know how these doctrines came about. Walls is right about the Freedom discussion and John Frame does a very good job explaining it in one of his volumes of “A Theology of Lordship.” IMO, the biggest question for someone who does not believe in the Sovereignty of God in salvation to answer is, “Can Man Deny God?” Whatever your answer is that question will let you know how you view God. I am a 5 Point Calvinist. On July 31, 2005, my ODA and I were on a mission which ended with my vehicle striking an IED. My right eye was popped out of socket, left lung partially collapsed, and when my femur broke, it cut my femoral artery. It was two hours before I saw a surgeon. I used all the blood at KAF so some near ODAs came to give blood. 3SFG flew my wife to Germany because they were unsure if I was going to make it. I woke up from a drug induced coma to sound of my wife’s voice, “Hey Baby I’m here to take you home.” To this day I get emotional when I say that. She laid in the stretcher beside me and flew back with me on a C-141 Medical Transport and with a flight surgical team. I could not keep my eyes open because of all the drugs and coming out of the coma and I was not sure if I was going to die or not. My BP was so high, 225/115 was the average. Somewhere over the Atlantic God saved me. He regenerated my heart. God made me a new creation. A new man! He gave me a new nature that is set on Him and not sin. Do I sin still and Christians still sin…Absolutely. It’s not about the will. Your will is tied to your nature. YOU CANNOT CHANGE YOUR NATURE without the regenerating act of the Holy Spirt. In John 3, Jesus was teaching Nicodemus the Doctrine of Salvation. Verses 1-15 is the Sovereignty of God in salvation and verses 16-21 is Man’s Responsibility. It is not accident they are butted up against each other. Jesus, Who is God, goes from one to the other without skipping a beat lol. EVERYONE has to accept there is still mystery with the two and able to reconcile the two. I have Brothers and Sisters that are not Calvinist or are 3 or 4 Point Calvinist and it doesn’t matter to me, I still love them and do not degrade them like some would or some who have a distain for Calvinism and get belligerent with you lol. It’s crazy. When I was in that C-141, I was so doped up and could not even say coherent things, but our Lord placed repentance and faith within me (Ephesians 2:8) so I could repent of my sins and have faith in our Lord AND Savior Jesus Christ as my name was written in the Lamb’s Book of Life before the foundations of the world were made by God (Rev 13:8;17:8b). The Book of Life was written before God made the world. God is not a time traveler, because He is the Author history. If you TRULY believe Man is the Ultimate decider on whether he or she is saved, then you have to rip John 6:37, 45, 65; 10:14-16 and all of John 17. If you base what you believe on one verse then you are sitting in a one legged chair. One very good tool or rule to remember, “What is the context of the verse? What is the chapter about? What is the book about and who is it addressing to?!” Advocates of Anti-Calvinism like to use 2 Peter 3:9 to say, “See…God does not want anyone to perish and ALL to come to repentance.” Who is Peter talking to? He is talking to Believers! The reason we are in 2023 is because in time God will save those of whom He wrote their names in the Lamb’s Book of Life before the foundations of the world. God does not take delight in the destruction of man, but if God did not save some, NO ONE would be saved. Read Romans 3:10-18. NO ONE SEEKS AFTER GOD. Either way, I love all my Brothers and Sisters in Christ as we all should. I will caveat that there is this ugly stuff called “hyper Calvinism” which IMO is not Calvinism at all!! ANY Calvinist should be the most humble person in the world because he or she knows and comes to realize that he or she deserves death, the grave and Hell and not a shred of His Grace! I will put a link to my testimony and how God save me. In Christ, YBIC
Everything that happens in history has been decreed/Predestined before the world was created see Eph 1:11, Proverbs 16:33 and Amos 3:6. And yes even when terrible things happen, I know it's hard for some people to accept but look what happened when David sinned against God and one of Davids punishments was that God told him that he was going to use Davids own son to shame his Father by Absalom Absalom doing something immoral to his Fathers concubines in front of all of Israel, see 2 Samuel 12:11-12 God said "Thus says the Lord, ‘Behold, I will raise up evil against you from your own household; I will even take your wives before your eyes and give them to your companion, and he will lie with your wives in broad daylight. Indeed you did it secretly, but I will do this thing before all Israel, and under the sun." Notice how God said "I WILL DO THIS THING."That was fulfilled in 2 Samuel 16:21-22. Jesus did not die for every single person ever and Jesus didn't die to make people savable. He died to save his elect. In John 17:9 Jesus said that he does not pray for the world. The word world is used in different contexts, in that context he's talking about the non elect. In John 3:16 world means that he purchased people from every tribe, tongue and nation Rev 5:9 and for the children of God scattered abroad John 11:52. Some have been "long beforehand marked out for condemnation" Jude 4 and "appointed to doom." 1 Peter 2:8. About Pharaoh God said “For this VERY PURPOSE I raised you up, to demonstrate My power in you, and that My name might be proclaimed throughout the whole earth.” So then He has mercy on whom He desires, and He hardens whom He desires." Rom 9:17-18. Jesus said "I praise You, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that You have hidden these things from the wise and intelligent and have revealed them to infants. Yes, Father, for this way was well-pleasing in Your sight. All things have been handed over to Me by My Father; and no one knows the Son except the Father; nor does anyone know the Father except the Son, and anyone to whom the Son wills to reveal Him." Matthew 11:25-27. So, 2 Pet 3:9 the "not willing that any should perish" if you read that letter in context, 2 Pet 1:1 says "To those who have received a faith of the same kind as ours." As far as salvation for all men verses, Paul was refuting the false notion of his time that God was only desiring to save just the Jews and 1 Tim 2:2 says to pray "for kings and all who are in authority" because as humans WE DON'T KNOW WHO THE ELECT ARE SO WE PRAY FOR EVERYONE! That's what it means in verse 4 by saying "all men." Amos 3:2 God said "of all the nations of the earth I have only known you." For centuries God passed over the majority of humankind because this verse isn't about knowledge it's about relationship. And it isn't because God foresaw Israel was more righteous then the other nations because sometimes Israel was more sinful then the pagan nations see 2 Kings 21:9. Only those who were predestined to be saved will be see Acts 13:48, Ephesians 1:4-5, Eph 1:11, Romans 9:11-23, John 6:37.
The way you debunk Calvinism is to go to scripture and look at all the passages by which Calvinists use to come to their conclusions and teach those passages to be contrary to the Calvinist position. You also must prove your position from scripture. The debate is biblical. As a Calvinist it was the scriptures that renewed my mind. Philosophical positions dont interepret scripture. Scripture should sculpt the philosophical position of the believer.
You are correct. All man-made doctrines are revealed not by the scripture quoted by its proponents, but rather by the scripture they must ignore to make it work. The following are "Calvinism" killers. Gen 25:23 And the LORD said unto her, Two nations are in thy womb, and two manner of people shall be separated from thy bowels; and the one people shall be stronger than the other people; and the elder shall serve the younger. Joh_12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me Act 3:19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord; Act 17:30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent: Eph 1:13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise, .
Yes. And you have to do more than quote single verses and jump from verse to verse without considering the point the author intends. Eventually someone is going to read the context those verses, and if the subject isn't about what you say it is, or if other passages that more directly speak to that subject shed light on a different interpretation, then people are going to follow the view that makes better sense of the author's argument without having to jump to completely different books.
Why was Michael Servetus burned alive by John Calvin? How can Calvin go to heaven being guilty of murder? Servetus' blood crieth in flames and seeketh justice just as Abel's blood. How then is Calvin different from Cain?
Calvinism was the theology of the Baptist Church in America from its founding. Arminianism came in in the latter half of the 19th century and has misled many like this man does. He is using human philosophy and Gods thoughts are higher than mans.
Although I do not care for much of what Jerry Walls has to say, I do agree that his critique of Packer and D. A Carson was helpful and sound. God does not love everyone on the same level and Christian pastors have no business declaring that He does. The only obligation that men have is to preach the Gospel to everyone without exception because, unlike God, they do not know who is actually among the elect. The Calvinist pastor should present the Gospel to all knowing that it will have the effect it was intended to have. Even Jeremiah was commanded to preach to those in particular who would refused to hear.
Just like most theologians this man fails to use the bible to disprove calvinism and instead reverts to philosophical arguments. The man neither disproves nor proves calvinism with the gunk.
Calvinism and Arminianism are both philosophical in nature and both come out of scripture. Acts 2:41 (NIV, and most major translations, except KJV) -- Those who accepted his message were baptized, and about three thousand were added to their number that day. Actually, he does use a fair amount of scripture. He just doesn't quote book, chapter, and verses. E.g starting at 47:40 and 52:00 (there are lots more, but these two should suffice)
Well the bible does disprove calvinism. They call them self reformed and then proceed to make the most cherry picking rookie mistakes , misinterpreting scriptures due to ignoring what the majority of scriptures say about a subject.
One more thing... In the calvinist conundrum -- Why God didn't make everyone saved.. They do answer and they do put up a good fight, Romans 9:22 Does not the potter have the right to make from the same lump of clay one vessel for special occasions and another for common use? 22 What if God, intending to show His wrath and make His power known, bore with great patience the vessels of His wrath, prepared for destruction? 23What if He did this to make the riches of His glory known to the vessels of His mercy, whom He prepared in advance for glory-… God... Sort of gives the answer calvanist can use... So.. if Calvinism is incorrect.. What then do we do with rom 9:22 I've never labeled myself a calvanist but this verse just screams at you Again with the argument where you say Man is responsible for his actions but also divinely controlled, Once again Calvanist aren't pulling this from thin air, God himself gives that example time and time again, In exodus, Moses tells pharoah if he does not let his people go he will punish pharoah with plagues etc.. Yet pharoahs heart was hardened to NOT let people go by GOD, then God punished him for not letting his people go! Even to the point of pharoahs first born dying.. Yet why did God tell us HE HIMSELF hardened the pharoah... And then punishd pharoah for his hardened heart or at least what he decided... So tell me.. How could we possible answer calvanist we can't just use your arguments.. They don't tackle scripture! Oh and... Proverbs 16:4 The LORD has made everything for His purpose--even the wicked for the day of disaster.
2018's most famous retreat from Calvinism is a video from Dr. Leighton Flowers with 30,000 views in 7-days. This tells us many pastors won't support this confusing doctrine in their pulpits anymore.. so the landslide begins.. Amen? Back to sound biblical doctrine! @
"Thirty thousand viewers" That can tell us a number of things, dipwad! Why do ding-a-lings, like you, always try to force their conclusions onto other people. I perceive that you know enough about the Bible to make you stupid. The landslide has begun, for sure, and people like are riding the crest of the wave. For your information, Jesus, himself, was a Calvinist.
That is not Scripture Back to [SOUND] The Bible tells us that after a Time of sound doctrine we will get falls teachers [] From 1500 the main stream was Calvinist [ Rather Reformed] it is in the last time that these catholic heresies are coming back biblical doctrine! 2 Timothy 4:3- For the time will come when people WILL NOT PUT UP WITH SOUND DOCTRINE. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. 4 They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths. like Jerry Walls and Flowers and Kevin Thomson. You can recognize them on their twisting Scripture. Your doctrine is the same as that of the Catholic pope church with a minor difference. Catholic = Men has a freewill Catholic = Salvation by good works yours: “Salvation by a good decision” Catholic = You can lose your salvation Yours You can lose your salvation. Catholic = Denies total depravity yours Denies total depravity. Catholic = Conditional Redemption Your Conditional redemption. Catholic = Christ died for all humanity Yours Christ died for all Humanity
Marius VanWoerden Reformed Theology is just modified Roman Catholicism. For the past 500 years the false Gospel of calvinism has been misleading and misdirecting people. This is both wicked and sad.
@@LindsayJackel You did not read what I wrote your doctrine is total Roman Catholic in all its facets. The American Great Awakening was a reformed puritans movement and the doing of the Lord. Millions came to accept Christ our Lord as there Savior. Claiming that that was the work of satan is crossing a dangerous line. As Calvinist [I rather say Reformed,] we do not follow a man Calvin was just a small part of the reformation. You cannot find the amount of hateful videos from Calvinist like the Arminius followers post on RUclips. Edwards's earliest writings brought together John Locke and Isaac Newton in a defense of a religious metaphysics. Later, after a career as a practicing clergyman who led the ‘Great Awakening’, Edwards developed a Calvinist theology founded on the covenant of grace whose center was the experience of an omnipotent God. His views were most significantly spelled out in Religious Affections (1746) and Freedom of the Will (1754). JONATHAN EDWARDS ON THE SOVEREIGNTY OF GOD (CALVINISM) "The Sovereignty of God is the stumbling block on which thousands fall and perish; and if we go contending with God about His sovereignty it will be our eternal ruin. It is absolutely necessary that we should submit to God as an absolute sovereign, and the sovereign of our souls; as one who may have mercy on whom He will have mercy and harden whom He will" (Jonathan Edwards). The quote above, by Jonathan Edwards, is excerpted from Arminiunism: Another Gospel - Jonathan Edwards Most historians consider Jonathan Edwards, a Northampton Anglican minister, one of the chief fathers of the Great Awakening. Edwards’ message centered around the ideas that humans were sinners, God was an angry judge and individuals needed to ask for forgiveness. He also preached justification by faith alone. In 1741, Edwards gave an emotional sermon, entitled “Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God.” No-one in the church had dry eyes. It was not the gifted preacher because Edwards read most of the sermon. It was a strong conviction of the Holy Spirit. News of the message spread quickly throughout the colonies. Edwards was known for his passion. He generally preached in his home parish, unlike other revival preachers who traveled throughout the colonies. Edwards is credited for inspiring hundreds of conversions, which he documented in a book, Narratives of Surprising Conversions. George Whitefield George Whitefield, a minister from Britain, had a significant impact during the Great Awakening. Whitefield toured the colonies up and down the Atlantic coast, preaching his message. In one year, Whitefield covered 5,000 miles in America and preached more than 350 times. Martin Luther said this Gospel of “grace alone” will be for a moment but soon attacked by the Devil. We see so much hate against the sovereignty of God. ruclips.net/video/aY5raL-atDg/видео.html&lc=z222jvaydob5xhv2pacdp431jt2zsvsa2pel0umfvblw03c010c.1555844769254116 THIS IS HOW CALVIN PREACHED THE GOSPEL FREE OFFER OF THE GOSPEL (Calvin's Wisdom p119-120) He calls all men to himself, without a single exception, and gives Christ to all, that we may be illumined by him. When we pray, we ought, according to the rule of charity, to include all. God invites all indiscriminately to salvation through the Gospel, BUT THE INGRATITUDE OF THE WORLD IS THE REASON why this grace, which is equally offered to all, is enjoyed by few. Other than the result of men’s refusal. Calvin never preached Double predestination as you can see and put the responsibility by men. I say PREACHED!! Not doctrinal
@@MariusVanWoerden Wow! Talk about attempting to bury someone in verbiage. I stand by what I wrote and reject your response. Reform theology is erroneous and wicked. Quoting them to me means nothing. The reformers didn't transform, but rather created a new sect of Roman Catholicism. Hence similar errors like paedobaptism, priesthood required to dispense communion, order of salvation, a deterministic god, etc. Jerry Walls does well to expose the proud and hateful heart of calvinism and reformed theology and its adherents. God is love. You don't understand sovereignty. A sovereign rules, he doesn't control and dictate everything. Especially a loving ruler such as God. Of course God is omnipotent and by Him all things consist. BTW just because someone is not calvinist does not make them Arminian. I am neither. So please don't make assumptions and bring Arminianism into things. You slandered Arminians by mischaracterising them as nasty and argumentative. I think that's a projection of your calvinist heart and actions. Calvinists are up there with atheists as some of the most proud, rude, argumentative and dismissive people on the internet.
I just googled "anti-Calvinist Bible verses" and came up with at least fifty. But I'll give you one of my favorites right here. At Mark 10:17 Jesus is asked by a rich young man, "What must I do to be saved?" Jesus doesn't tell him, "Nothing. Just live till you die, and if you open your eyes in Hell, oh well..." No, Jesus ticked off several items in the Decalogue, and then finally told the man to give away all his possessions and follow Him, which seem to me to be some rather specific actions to secure salvation. If Calvinism were true, this would have been the perfect moment for Jesus to have told him about it.
The Bible certainly is our standard. At the end of his lecture, Jerry said he has a RUclips series that dives into Scripture that you can look up. It's called, "What's wrong with Calvinism" and it's split into 6 parts. The first three parts are what this lecture was about.
that is what I have observed..when I watched the Amazing grace video also on youtube...about understanding calvinism...the author uses scriptures verse by verse..context by context ...the reason why I have accepted this doctrine after 28 yrs...whereas this one is base only upon human logic..upon his own assumptions
Your question is begging the question. It's a logical fallacy. It implies that he does not base his positions on Scripture because this video deals with what Calvinists have said and basic logic. It is a break in basic reasoning skills to make the implication. But you're not alone. At least 9 others thought you had a good question.
To Calvinists: 2 Cor. 4:4 talks about Satan blinding the minds of unbelievers so they will not see the light of the Gospel. Why would Satan need to blind those who are spiritually blind already? Is this a double blinding? Why would God command all men to repent (Acts 17:30) if they can't unless God aids them by granting regeneration? Why is there not one bible verse that explicitly states that regeneration precedes faith? If God tells us that his nature is that he cannot lie, then why would it appear he has a revealed will in Scripture (all can come: Jesus will draw all men to Himself; whosoever believes) but He has this secret will that only the elect can come?
This is Calvinism. “Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;” Titus 3:5 KJV It is according to His mercy.
@@jimmyray5524 Thank you for your reply. I appreciate you disagreeing with me in an agreeable fashion. Allow me to be a bit slow/lenthened in my reply so that you can understand me and I can understand your position perfectly clearly. Also, I read the passage in esv and King James, and neither one seems inconsistent with Arminianism as far as I can tell. Firstly, it seems to me that I have no point yet to prove as far as I am aware. I simply said "That passage seems to be consistent with both views", and it is simply the nature of the idea of "consistency" that we consider two ideas to be consistent unless or until we have a good reason to say that they are not. Therefore, since you brought up the passage as proof against Arminianism, the burden of proof remains solidly in your court. "Mans free will and choice is not there!" I am going to ask you to clarify what you mean by this. If you mean mans free will and choice is not explicitly taught there, then I agree. Yet, if you are going to use the absence of an explicit mention of this doctrine within the passage in question, then you also must reject Total Depravity since that is also not mention in the passage in question. However, it is more likely that you meant that man's free will and choice is not possible given the passage. Yet, here still, I must ask you to further clarify. Do you mean all men or only some men (since the passage only mentions the man of God's council). One could take this as proof that the free will of only the believers is extinguished. So what does this verse say (without going beyond the meaning of the text). It simply says that if God ordains for one of His followers to come from the far country, then it will come to pass. Notice what the passage does not say. It does not say every man, it merely talks about the one who executes His council. It does not say God always ordains where the man will go. It does not say God ordains everything the man does. And even for the man for whom God did ordain to come from the far country, the passage does not say the man cannot make other types of choices (such as when to come, what route to take, what supplies to bring, who to bring with him, what mood to have along the way, etc). Now maybe God determines some or all of these other choices too, but the passage does not address the issue.
@@jimmyray5524 Thanks sfor checking in. This seems to be a youtube issue. I did indeed reply to your comment "I disagree my friend. I believe the verse only supports Calvinism!". If you did not get my response, then let me know and I can repost it. On the other hand, if you did reply to my comment, then I did not get that reply, and you will have to repost it.
@@jimmyray5524 Alright, here is my reply reposted Thank you for your reply. I appreciate you disagreeing with me in an agreeable fashion. Allow me to be a bit slow/lenthened in my reply so that you can understand me and I can understand your position perfectly clearly. Also, I read the passage in esv and King James, and neither one seems inconsistent with Arminianism as far as I can tell. Firstly, it seems to me that I have no point yet to prove as far as I am aware. I simply said "That passage seems to be consistent with both views", and it is simply the nature of the idea of "consistency" that we consider two ideas to be consistent unless or until we have a good reason to say that they are not. Therefore, since you brought up the passage as proof against Arminianism, the burden of proof remains solidly in your court. "Mans free will and choice is not there!" I am going to ask you to clarify what you mean by this. If you mean mans free will and choice is not explicitly taught there, then I agree. Yet, if you are going to use the absence of an explicit mention of this doctrine within the passage in question, then you also must reject Total Depravity since that is also not mention in the passage in question. However, it is more likely that you meant that man's free will and choice is not possible given the passage. Yet, here still, I must ask you to further clarify. Do you mean all men or only some men (since the passage only mentions the man of God's council). One could take this as proof that the free will of only the believers is extinguished. So what does this verse say (without going beyond the meaning of the text). It simply says that if God ordains for one of His followers to come from the far country, then it will come to pass. Notice what the passage does not say. It does not say every man, it merely talks about the one who executes His council. It does not say God always ordains where the man will go. It does not say God ordains everything the man does. And even for the man for whom God did ordain to come from the far country, the passage does not say the man cannot make other types of choices (such as when to come, what route to take, what supplies to bring, who to bring with him, what mood to have along the way, etc). Now maybe God determines some or all of these other choices too, but the passage does not address the issue.
Jerry Walls has a generally accurate understanding of what we Calvinists believe. However, I wish he would attempt to make his points from scripture rather than human reason.
monolith94 Good point! Some Calvinists do defend their theology based on reason. It's not always wrong to do so. What I really want to emphasize, however, is that the Bible should be our ultimate authority. In the end, the test of a theology's truthfulness is whether or not it matches up to the full council of God's Word.
monolith94 Since the canon is closed, and the charismatic gifts have ceased the Bible is our ultimate authority on this side of glory. If God did choose to intervene, or reveal himself again through prophets or apostles as cults like Pentecostalism and Mormonism claim, then perhaps it would be different. Contrary to what some would say, the Bible is totally sufficient. As 2 Timothy 3:16 says: All scripture is breathed out by God, profitable for teaching, correction, and training in righteousness." Anything that diverges from what is written in Scripture is false. As Paul so strongly writes in Galatians 1:8: But even if we or angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we have preached, let him be accused!" I can't go much further then that. If you deny the absolute authority of the Bible, then we can't carry on a discussion.
Let us grant that the Bible has absolute authority. If that were the case, how is it possible that Christianity can be schismatic? Are heretics reading a weird, different Bible? (well, maybe the Gnostics were). The majority of schismatics break from the Church because of their reading of the Bible. The fault lies not in the Bible, but in their reading of it. So, we must read the Bible in a way that is profitable, correct, and trains us in righteousness. After all, we all know that the devil can quote Bible passages. The scripture may be the breath of God, but the scripture says that God is love, so the only reliable method of interpretation, or reading, of scripture is through a vision of love. Love is the Cross we must take up in order to understand the world, the scripture, ourselves. Love brings us together, and by exalting scripture over God, the ultimate authority, you take God from being a trinity and construct a different God, a God of four pieces. In the spirit of this message, I say, go in peace, and may love be a part of every part of you, from your toes to your forehead and into your soul, as I hope that love can enter my own.
The most important thing about a person is what comes to mind when they think about who God really is...to understand truth you must know God's unchanging attributes. Study God's attributes and you'll find the answers to your questions.
That’s right. Sovereignty is no attribute, but status. Love, mercy, grace, justice, righteousness are attributes. Calvinism violates God’s character by limiting his attributes.
Jesus to Nicodemus: "You must be born again" Nicodemus: "HOW CAN THIS BE????" Clearly, Nicodemus understood what Jesus was saying: Salvation is a MIRACLE, wrought by God in a person's heart, and not a simple "decision". If it was a simple decision, man can boast, but verse after verse shows we cannot boast in any way n our salvation. Praise the Lord.
Not a Calvinist, but the Bible is clear that God doesn't love every human being who has ever lived equally. God himself literally said, "Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated." A lot of these arguments can be used by universalists or atheists. "Oh, so God loves everyone? Why did he flood the world? Why did he genocide the cananites? Why did he torment the Egyptions? Why doesn't he bring everyone to heaven? Sounds like God picked Israelites as a favourite in the OT." etc. etc. Maybe God is God and can do with His creation what He wills.
Calvinism is a theology; it is not the Bible in and of itself. Calvinists use intellectual and philosophical tools (logic, reasoning, grammar, syntax, arguments, illustrations, and more) to interpret the Bible and arrive at their beliefs. For example, 2 Peter 3:9 says that God is "not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance." Yet according to Calvinism, God in eternity past decided not to save some (perhaps most) of these very ones that He does not will to perish. The clear Word of God does not settle the issue because Calvinists attempt to use philosophical tools to somehow interpret the Bible so that God can will to save all and at the same time will not to save all of humanity. So it is necessary to point out the flawed thinking behind Calvinism so that all can see how their flawed thought processes lead them to flawed conclusions when they interpret the Bible. Calvinist and non-Calvinist Evangelicals read and love the same Bible and yet come to very different theological conclusions. So the question is not just Biblical, it is theological and philosophical as well and we must understand these theological and philosophical differences to understand both sides of this issue. Jerry's book "Why I am not a Calvinist" contains the Biblical reasons against Calvinism. If you truly do want to see the Biblical side of this issue, then get the book and read it.
bob polo agreed, also, that verse as well as other main ones commonly used against "Calvinism" are taken out of context and fail under real exegetical examination. Read 'The Potter's Freedom' by Dr James White. Why hold to a miss use of scripture to prove a doctrine?
Too bad any Calvinist is so attached to their Calvinist title and views that they’ll never hear the truth in what you’re saying. Guess they’re predestined by God to not hear your truth? 🤣
Interesting. I think that suggesting that God can't be love because He sends some people to Hell is a problem for the Arminian and the Calvinist. The question should probably be "why doesn't he send everyone to hell", since we all deserve it.
He should, but he doesn't want to. The Bible says his desire is not the death of sinners, but rather their repentence. He appears to want creatures who understand both good and evil and chooses good.
I wonder if anyone who has listened to Jerry Wall's talks or read his books have bothered to read Calvin? I have read an abridged edition of Calvin's Institutes. They are a marvellous clear, bible-based Christ-honouring work. I remain unconvinced by Jerry Walls because of Scripture but respect his position.
If someone gives a homeless person food, its not the homeless person who made his own food. He was given that food. But he can choose to not eat the food. We have free wil mate. Calvinism doesnt understand this.
I can't understand for the life of me why Calvinism is still a thing, since all you have to do is google "anti-Calvinist Bible verses" and you'll get scores of them. I'll give you one of my favorites right here. At Mark 10:17 Jesus is asked by a rich young man, "What must I do to be saved?" Jesus doesn't tell him, "Nothing. Just live till you die, and if you open your eyes in Hell, umm, don't blame me..." No, Jesus ticked off several items in the Decalogue, and then finally told the man to give away all his possessions and follow Him, which seem to me to be some rather specific actions to secure salvation. If Calvinism were true, this would have been the perfect moment for Jesus to have told him that no actions on his part could save him, for the matter was already decided. However, this is not what Christ said. Can any Calvinists out there give me an interpretation of this passage that saves your doctrine?
And they were greatly astonished, saying among themselves, “Who then can be saved?” But Jesus looked at them and said, “With men it is impossible, but not with God; for with God all things are possible.” Mark 10:26-27 there is your answer
Calvinism implies that God is the cause of evil which is blasphemy. I am in an area where there are a lot of Calvinists and one thing I have noticed is that they are obviously prideful.
God is the First Cause of all that is... rapist murders have their being through Him... all things that were created were created by Him... In His wisdom, God authored EVIL, AMEN.
I appreciate that Jerry gives a pretty fair presentation of the Calvinist position. Having noted that, at 57:00, he says, “Now I believe God can do anything he wants to do, but there’s some things God can’t want to do.” The Calvinist claims nothing more for human beings. What Jerry’s statement suggests is that God has freedom of the compatibilist sort (he can do anything he wants, but can’t want to do some things, because of his nature), whereas he believes that people have (what Jerry would consider real) libertarian freedom? Are we "more free" than God?
Counterfactuals of divine freedom are different from those of creatively freedom. God cannot do evil, yet humans can, so in order for a Calvinist to frame issues this way, then they must be fully deterministic and incapable of resolving Mackie’s problem of evil
Your will is just the act of your mind choosing. Do you think that your will is untethered from your mind??? In that case, it wouldn't even be YOU choosing, but rather a separate entity -- a different mind.
let me tell you why I reject his very sad doctrine of Total Depravity : The reformed concept of Total Depravity means that all of mankind is evil and sinful to his very core so that every inclination of his heart is always evil all the time (see Genesis 6:5). "Total" means utterly, complete, 100%, a term you would describe to Satan, not to us, created in the image of God :- (who so hated the world he despatched his demons to lead all gullible Christians to damnation, thinking there was nothing they had to than pompously declare, "I am saved." REBUTTAL: But if man has been created in God’s image and not the devil, and God has freewill, then man must at least has been granted moral responsibility even though his heart is inclined towards evil. Logic and common sense demands God can exercise his Will anyway he chooses. If he asks us to freely love Him then granting us freewill is a necessary prerequisite. A moral and just God who wants to judge us according to our deeds Matthew 16:27, could only do so if we are held accountable for our actions. Ergo, God must create us with a conscience to choose good over evil. Turn on the news and that become abundantly clear. Even atheists have an innate sense of what is good and just, right and wrong. That's why we see atheists giving time and resources to humanitarian causes (like hurricane relief.) If man was 100% evil, we wouldn't see this. I believe we are indeed sinful, just not totally depraved. U - Unconditional Election This doctrine asserts that even before the creation of the world, God had already chosen who would go to heaven and who would go to hell. So it completely takes man out of the equation and negates any free will. And it teaches that the only people that respond to witnessing are those who are already chosen by God. Only we do not know who is chosen and who isn't so we must witness to everyone just in case and then see if they are one of the elect. God doesn't play games and this would be one big very immoral game...it would be God saying "go preach the good news to everyone, but only I know who is saved and who isn't but you don't, so go try and see who accepts Me and then I will tell you if you were wasting your time or not.” It isn't in line with the gospel message of "all who call upon the Lord will be saved." I know all the work arounds on this, but it is adding to scripture to say that the "all" who call upon the Lord are only the elect as they are the only one's who will call upon the Lord. The Gospel is free and available to everyone. Read it with discernment.
Here we dont have God judging, which calvanists say he did when he elected some and dammed the many or most before judgement day when christ comes the second time.So God did not just choose some elect and dam all the rest.That would be a terrible judgement as calvin even called it.
It’s all over the Bible! We are commanded to repent and believe! ““The time has come,” he said. “The kingdom of God has come near. Repent and believe the good news!”” Mark 1:15 NIV “Through love and faithfulness sin is atoned for; through the fear of the Lord evil is avoided.” Proverbs 16:6 NIV “Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.” Acts 2:38 NIV “Or do you show contempt for the riches of his kindness, forbearance and patience, not realizing that God’s kindness is intended to lead you to repentance?” Romans 2:4 NIV Just a very small sample. These verses clearly indicate volitional choice. Why else would they be issued as commands?
@@florida8953when God says he abhors the murder of innocent babies, he means it. He is not making what he abhors happen. Your thinking said all things that are, are because of God's will, but things that are clearly against God's will (as presented in Scripture) continue to happen. Your God is the embodiment of God and evil combined. You're syncretistic, as if God were a yin yang.
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God has shown me how wrong Calvinism is when I asked Him for wisdom regarding His love for people here on earth. I am just glad I went straight to the source of love and hope rather than wasting time hearing men debate theologies they came up with. Praise God for his steadfast grace and love 💗
You are not supposed to base your doctrines on emotions. You are supposed to base your beliefs on the scriptures.
@@nerychristianI don't see anywhere in that comment above about them relying on their emotions. They say "God showed me" and they don't elaborate on how God showed them, but I would be willing to bet it wasn't through emotions but rather through the plain reading of God's word. Ezekiel 33:11
Many an ignorant soul has stumbled on the doctrine of TULIP aka "Calvinism" but this is the doctrine of salvation in a nutshell. Do not reject it because scripture affirms it as truth. Charles Spurgeon knew it was true and so did the Puritans and most of the church.
@@LAStreetPreacher Typical Calvinist, smart people were Calvinists and you think youre smarter than them? That is the dumbest argument possible. "But Lord, Spurgeon said YOU were the ultimate cause of all heinous evil!"
Ezekiel 33:11 Say to them: 'As surely as I live, declares the Lord GOD, I take no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but rather that the wicked should turn from their ways and live. Turn! Turn from your evil ways! For why should you die, O house of Israel?'
how clear can you get.
@macolyis yes i agree ,but ALL men are given Grace john 1 verse 4-9 - we are all have the Light of Christ ,so thats why GOD says i command ALL men Everywhere to Repent.acts 17-30 Paul goes on to say that God appoints the Times and Places of mans habitation and HE did that.so we might Seek and find HIM ,though HE is Not Far from anyone of US!
@macolyis i said john 1 verse 4-9 says in HIM was Life and the life was the Light of all mankind!! verse 9 the True Light gives Light to everyone who comes into the World!! Paul underscores this when he says all men are without any Excuse not to believe as we all have the Light of Conscience and the Light of Creation within us!! The context is that Everyone possesses Gods Light but man is a Practical Sinner and we do the evil,but we have an advocate with the Father, Christ Jesus. john says Brethren i tell you Not to sin,BUT if you do ,you have an advocate an that is Jesus Christ.Despite our sin nature,when we put our trust in HIM and believe, we are SAVED from all Sins past and present .But for those who walk in the darkness an reject Christ there is no hope for them. WE who have trusted Christ -ITS like we are on a ship headed for Heaven ,we slip onboard but never overboard as Christ will never let us GO. So sinners we are but we have a Savior!!
@@macolyisis'nt Christ set you free from the cross? did he gives you an opportunity to live an ever lasting life by sheding his blood? does the preachers told? that is the works of the Holy spirit... turn you heart to God and believe... dont expect the magical feeling. The african eunich read the bible and believes what the bible says, Philip baptise him. He get saves. the difference is some believe the message with their heart, and some do not believes with their heart. Paul told us to believe in our heart we should not believe our faith. we should believe the object of our faith. that can carry us throught.
Brother @macolyis let me say it this way. changes of heart and faith are like coin having two sides it goes hand in hand. why people cannot put their trust in christ is that they are not willing to change their heart unto GOD thats the reason why they cannot believe. without changing heart no one can put their trust in Christ finished work. bible says. Godly sorrow produces repentance that leads to salvation.
It feels like being gaslit when discussing theology with Calvinists. Thanks for helping me understand better why.
677
778
Perfectly said.
That’s how I feel. They always push back in such a way to cause one to feel like a dummy. That’s why these type of lectures are so important in helping us to realize we’re not crazy. Their doctrine is incoherent.
Test every spirit. Read the Bible and don't let people use emotional arguments. The heart is Deceitful above all else
I feel so lucky to have someone speak so coherently and cleanly on this matter. Thank you Jerry!
You believe in luck?
I believe God doesn't want you to be DECIEVED into this satanic doctrine, your not lucky.
This is the most incoherent view on Calvinism I’ve ever heard
Definitely @@rickmethven4374
@rickmethven4374 Please give your coherent veiw. Also, be sure to check the calvinist he quoted and others to see if they agree with what he calls consistent Cavinism. I believe that the truth lies somewhere in between . I've been studying the Bible and I'm praying often on salvation and how it works as best we can understand on this Earth. I will always kneel to the authority of the word. I'd be interested in what you have to say and your biblical proof text.
Both thorough and concise, not to mention astute and gracious, this is the best treatment of Calvinism I've found. I'll be referring people to this a lot, I think. Thanks a ton!
I agree completely!
All my thoughts well organized into a coherent presentation, keep on the good work Jerry Walls.
I'm thinking the exact same watching this.
The The best
Me too:)
Fear not Jerry, you may have been elected and yet know it.
57:24 According to Calvin, questioning Calvin is the same as questioning God: "No one can disprove the doctrine I have expounded except he who pretends to be wiser than the Spirit of God." --John Calvin (Concerning the Eternal Predestination of God, p.155 in the two-book collection "Calvin's Calvinism")
I was in a ministry with a guy that was a Calvinist. We discussed theology sometimes. Calvinism was one subject. I said John do you believe God tells the truth? Of course. He said. I said do you think your pastor tells the truth? And preaches God’s truth as in the Bible. Yes was his answer. I said then your pastor would stand up in the pulpit and say to his listeners some of you will go to Heaven and some will go to Hell and there is not a damn thing you can do about it.
God decides everything.
yes....in Adam all die.....you can thank Adam for that; John Calvin didn't have anything to do with it...What you are really mad at is that the consequences of Adams 1 sin were so severe....1 sin caused the fall and damnation of the whole human race....that also speaks to how HOLY GOD REALLY IS!!!!......what the Arminian won't admit is that words like Predestined, Called, Chosen, Elect that appear throughout the New Testament make absolutely ZERO sense if man has free will and can come to Christ on his own.....If free will were true; then those words are not necessary at all. So the Arminian has to make up all kinds of nonsense to even explain what words like predestined, called, chosen, elect even mean. Many of the disciples hated, what you call Calvinism, when Jesus taught it in the 1st Century. Just read John 6:64-66.....it says that many of his disciples no longer followed him....so nothing has changed in 2000 years.....
2 verses in the Bible commonly misunderstood and misinterpreted are I Timothy 2:4 and 2 Peter 3:9......I Tim 2:4 means that God desires that ALL kinds of men to be saved; not ALL men to be saved.....Its the same word where it says that the love of money is a root of ALL kinds of evil; not the love of money is the root of ALL evil. And ALL kinds of men will be saved in that heaven will be represented by all nations, tribes and tongues..... on 2 Peter 3:9 you have to look to the first verses of I and II Peter and they say that they are addressed TO GOD's ELECT. So 2 Peter is saying that God desires that NONE of the ELECT shall perish; it is not saying that God wants to save ALL men. God did not desire for Hitler to be saved ; for example.....nor the Antichrist; nor the false prophet....etc.....God wants ALL His Elect sheep to be saved; and they will be; not one more and not one less. Jesus clearly said that ALL the Sheep get saved......John 6:37-39 "37 All those the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never drive away. 38 For I have come down from heaven not to do my will but to do the will of him who sent me. 39 And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all those he has given me, but raise them up at the last day."
@@timclark2925 What Calvinists won't admit is that "predestined" and "elect" relate to individual salvation exactly zero times. Every time it relates to the plan, the process.
Context kills gnosticism, including Calvinism.
@@timclark2925 You just added words to scripture, nowhere does it say that God wants all kinds of people, He says He wants ALL. DO NOT PERVERT SCRIPTURE.
Wonderful, wonderful presentation .
Ambiguous Calvinism or Effervescent Grace is one of most heretical attacks on God’s character possible. You do more good than you realize with this video. Thank you.
Dumbest thing I’ve ever read.
Believein1 Did the Early Church Believe the Doctrines of Total depravity and predestination?
There are a number of websites and RUclips videos (some quite terrible, others a bit scholarly, yet equally terrible) that attempt to dissuade investigative readers to believe that, except for Augustine, or at least until the “time of Augustine”, that the early church did not believe in the depravity of man, in unconditional election and/or a sovereign predestination,
Clement Of Alexandria (A.D. 190): “The soul cannot rise nor fly, nor be lifted up above the things that are on high, without special grace.”
Origen: “Our free will…or human nature is not sufficient to seek God in any manner.”
Eusebius (A.D. 330): “The liberty of our will in choosing things that are good is destroyed.”
Augustine (A.D. 370): “If, therefore, they are servants of sin (2 Cor. 3:17), why do they boast of free will?…O, man! Learn from the precept what you ought to do; learn from correction, that it is your own fault you have not the power…Let human effort, which perished by Adam, here be silent, and let the grace of God reign by Jesus Christ…What God promises, we ourselves do not through free will of human nature, but He Himself does by grace within us…Men labor to find in our own will something that is our own, and not God’s; how can they find it, I know not.”
UNCONDITIONAL ELECTION
Clement Of Rome (A.D. 69): “Let us therefore approach Him in holiness of soul, lifting up pure and undefiled hands unto Him, with love towards our gentle and compassionate Father because He made us an elect portion unto Himself…Seeing then that we are the special elect portion of a Holy God, let us do all things that pertain unto holiness…There was given a declaration of blessedness upon them that have been elected by God through Jesus Christ our Lord…Jesus Christ is the hope of the elect…”
Barnabas (A.D. 70): “We are elected to hope, committed by God unto faith, appointed to salvation.”
Ignatius. A.D. 110 To the predestined ones before all ages, that is, before the world began, united and elect in a true passion, by the eternal will of the God.
Justin Martyr: “In all these discourses I have brought all my proofs out of your own holy and prophetic writings, hoping that some of you may be found of the elect number which through the grace that comes from the Lord of Sabaoth, is left or reserved [set apart] for everlasting salvation.”
Ignatius speaks of two sorts of persons, signified by, “two pieces of money; the one belongs to God, and the other to the world; which have each their own characters upon them, and every one shall go to his own place,”
Irenaeus (A.D. 198): “God hath completed the number which He before determined with Himself, all those who are written, or ordained unto eternal life…Being predestined indeed according to the love of the Father that we would belong to Him forever.”
Clement Of Alexandria (A.D. 190): “Through faith the elect of God are saved. The generation of those who seek God is the elect nation, not [an earthly] place, but the congregation of the elect, which I call the Church…If every person had known the truth, they would all have leaped into the way, and there would have been no election…You are those who are chosen from among men and as those who are predestined from among men, and in His own time called, faithful, and elect, those who before the foundation of the world are known intimately by God unto faith; that is, are appointed by Him to faith, grow beyond babyhood.”
Cyprian (A.D. 250): “This is therefore the predestination which we faithfully and humbly preach.”
Ambrose Of Milan (A.D. 380): “In predestination the Church of God has always existed.”
Augustine (A.D. 380): “Here certainly, there is no place for the vain argument of those who defend the foreknowledge of God against the grace of God, and accordingly maintain that we were elected before the foundation of the world because God foreknew that we would be good, not that He Himself would make us good. This is not the language of Him who said, ‘You did not choose Me, but I chose you’ (John 15:16).”
Very well done presentation. I better understand Calvinism now.
No, you don’t. Lol. Read a reformed book from legit theologians, not Flowers or this guy.
Both Reformed Covenant Theology and modern Dispensational Theology ignore or pervert the New Covenant fulfilled in blood at Calvary. The term "new covenant" is not found in the confessions of Reformed Covenant Theology, but it is found in the Bible multiple times. "Calvinism" started when men were trying to get their children into an Old Covenant relationship with Christ.
What the modern Church needs is a New Covenant Revival (Heb. 9:10) in which members of various denominations are willing to re-examine everything they believe and see if it agrees with the Bible, instead of the traditions of men. We need to be like the Bereans. It will be a battle between our flesh and the Holy Spirit. It will not be easy. If you get mad and upset when someone challenges your man-made Bible doctrines, that is your flesh resisting the truth found in God's Word.
.Nobody can completely understand the Bible unless they understand the relationship between the Old Covenant given to Moses at Mount Sinai and the New Covenant fulfilled in blood at Calvary.
What brings all local churches together into one Body under the blood of Christ? The answer is found below.
New Covenant Whole Gospel:
Let us now share the Old Testament Gospel found below with the whole world. On the road to Emmaus He said the Old Testament is about Him.
He is the very Word of God in John 1:1, 14. Awaken Church to this truth.
Jer 31:31 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
Jer 31:32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by husband unto them, saith the LORD:
Jer 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
Jer 31:34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.
Is the most important genealogy in the Bible found in Matthew 1:1 (Gal. 3:16)? Is God's Son the ultimate fulfillment of Israel (John 1:49)? Why has the modern Church done a pitiful job of sharing the Gospel with modern Orthodox Jews? Why would someone tell them they are God's chosen people and then fail to share the Gospel with them? Who is the seed of the woman promised in Genesis 3:15? What did Paul say about Genesis 12:3 in Galatians 3:8? Who is the "son" in Psalm 2? Who is the "suffering servant" of Isaiah 53? Who would fulfill the New Covenant promised in Jeremiah 31:31-34? Who would fulfill the timeline of Daniel chapter 9 before the second temple was destroyed? Why have we not heard this simple Old Testament Gospel preached on Christian television in the United States on a regular basis?
Once a person comes to understand the New Covenant promised to Israel and Judah in Jeremiah 31:31-34, which is found fulfilled by Christ during the first century in Hebrews 8:6-13, and Hebrews 10:16-18, and specifically applied to the Church in 2 Corinthians 3:6-8, and Hebrews 12:22-24, man-made Bible doctrines fall apart.
Let us now learn to preach the whole Gospel until He comes back. The King of Israel is risen from the dead! (John 1:49, Acts 2:36)
We are not come to Mount Sinai in Hebrews 12:18. We are come instead to the New Covenant church of Mount Zion and the blood in Hebrews 12:22-24.
1Jn 3:22 And whatsoever we ask, we receive of him, because we keep his commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in his sight.
1Jn 3:23 And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.
1Jn 3:24 And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us.
The following verses prove the Holy Spirit is the master teacher for those now in the New Covenant.
Jer 31:34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.
Mar 1:8 I indeed have baptized you with water: but he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost.
Joh 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.
Act 11:16 Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost.
1Co 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
1Jn 2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.
Watch the RUclips videos “The New Covenant” by David Wilkerson, or Bob George, and David H.J. Gay.
Flowers was a Calvanist for 10 years & then he left it. He's trustworthy.
The Calvinist are the post modern gnostics. Instead of a secret handshake, we are offered up a warped view of God’s righteousness and our inability to make a decision by faith (like Abraham) to follow Him. This doctrine of election and predestination excludes “Come to Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden and I will give you rest.” The very existence of a command is that the person who hears it will make a choice to do so or not. Knowing who will and who will not obey the command is superfluous because God knows the answer. It is the invitation that excludes excuses for not obeying and the judgement that follows for failing to do so.
It seems odd that he would gloss over Total Depravity while talking about the importance of freedom in the rest of the presentation-- since the Calvinistic understanding is that man is born in a state where he needs to be made able to respond positively. Yes, pretty much all Christians agree that man is a sinful creature, but the Calvinists take it further by saying that sin blinds them to the truth unless enabled by God to see.
I agree. I thought he was conceding too much on the topic of Total Inability. But the T in Tulip was the first big crack in the edifice that led me out of Calvinism. I kept finding scripture that was urging sinners to choose righteousness, to trust God and to repent. If God was behind the scenes withholding regeneration from the people He was calling to repent and believe then you could not trust Him. If his word is his revealed will, but He has a secret will that is contrary to His revealed will then you cannot trust scripture. These things led me to trust the God of the Bible and to reject Calvinism.
@@nathancjarrett You just had a mistaken view of Calvinism - and if what you described was your view, I’m glad you stopped thinking that way - whether you wanted to call it Calvinism or whatever. I just hope this hasn’t prevented you from mining the theological riches t that can easily be found within the world of Calvinism/reformed theology.
@@PaDutchRunner Yes, one of the challenges everyone has in this discussion is being careful not to argue against a false version of someone else's position. I am aware that many in the Reformed church do not hold to all 5 points of Calvinism, and do not affirm exhaustive divine Determinism. And I certainly have fewer points of contention with these brothers. However I do think that the 4 point Calvy and the person who tries to affirm Determinism solely with respect to Soteriology while softening their stance on other moral decision making, are attempting to affirm 2 contradictory systems. If you don't affirm E.D.D. or Limited Atonement you may still believe you can consistently affirm some version of Reformed theology, but I think if you examine the doctrines that remain, you will find it necessary to affirm these other beliefs as well. Or, if you find as I have that the Biblical text cannot support these, then you will have a number of Calvy proof texts that you will need to reexamine to see if they truly say what the Reformed theologians have been teaching. I think many who call themselves Calvinists are holding non Calvinist beliefs in some areas, and they often don't understand why non Calvinists are arguing against a thing that is very different from what they have experienced first hand in their nominally Calvinist church or Bible study.
@@nathancjarrett Are you able to profit from reading the puritans, Dutch reformed, etc?
@@PaDutchRunner so I have a Reformed background. I've read some Surgeon, and in school I had to read some Jonathan Edwards, but I haven't really gotten into Puritan theologians. I'm currently focused on trying to understand the writings of the Church fathers, and trying to understand what was actually transmitted from the apostles to the generation after them. I'd be willing to read some John Owen at some point, but I haven't gotten to that yet.
To be a Calvinist, you must accept that God created humans unable to reason.
Not that humans can error in reasoning, but rather man is unable to reason.
Once one accepts that belief, any contradiction can be accepted.
If mankind can come to the conclusion that Jesus is the Messiah apart from Spirit, then I'll believe you.
Matthew 16:15-17 ESV
He said to them, "But who do you say that I am?" [16] Simon Peter replied, "You are the Christ, the Son of the living God." [17] And Jesus answered him, "Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jonah! For flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but my Father who is in heaven.
John 3:8 ESV
"The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear its sound, but you do not know where it comes from or where it goes. So it is with everyone who is born of the Spirit."
Thank you. Very instructive lecture
I am not overly committed to Calvinism, but the Bible certainly speaks on predestination. I watched this video in hopes that Dr. Walls would give scriptural evidence against Calvinism but he did not. If the Bible isn’t the basis for truth, then what is?
Yes, the Bible is truth. But election was pertaining to Israel in context
Good for you, Jennifer. You’re seeking truth while being discerning at the same time. Not many Christians are like that anymore and it’s really hard to change your mind in such a stubborn culture. About a year ago, I too was not committed fully to Calvinism and it was really picking my brain. My answers came from listening to RC Sproul and his scripture-filled analysis of predestination. A year later and I find Calvinism on every page of the Bible. It’s been a truly heartwarming discovery. I know it’s been 2 years since you posted this so hopefully you’ve found some answers :)
@rickmethven4374 I see that predestination has more to do with those who *are saved* and in Christ... they are predestined for Heaven and all things described there for them.
Those who haven't trusted in Christ are not "in him" and are predestined for Hell and all that is described there.
It doesn't have so much to do with *who will be saved*
So before I trusted in Jesus, I had one destination ahead of me. AFTER I trusted Jesus as my Savior, I have a different and better (pre) destination. My destination has changed 😊
That's what I read..
FWIW, many years later: Arminianism accepts predestination. Goes something like: "God chose for those He foreknew would answer to His calling."
It certainly makes more sense than the mental gymnastics needed to swallow down Calvinism.
@szilardfineascovasa6144 I think Predestination has more to do with those who are already saved. Not who will or won't be saved.
Love it! Inconsistencies = Mysteries
Because there are no mysteries with how God works and the Arminians have it all figured out amirite?
@@florida8953not ever non Calvinist is Arminian.
As I see things the biggest problem with Calvinism is what it says about God, and the same thing could be said about any incorrect doctrine. All correct doctrine must harmonize with what we know about God as revealed in Christ, who said “When you’ve seen Me, you’ve seen the Father.”
Thank you Dr Walls.
Brilliant! This guy's logic is impeccable.
it is NOT mans logic that teaches the sure word of God- it is the Holy spirit!!!- 🎺 - get-with-it!!!
Dr. Wall's basic presentation of core calvinistic framework is correct, however he makes almost no effort to compare those tenants with the Bible. Instead, he Compares them with the opinions of prominent Calvinists, and in a very bizarre move, uses appeals to emotion to claim they're not viable. It's very strange if you think about it.
Who cares if John thinks that he loves his children more than God does?
Who cares if j.i. Packer doesn't get contradiction correctly?
Even if those were true statements (you'd have to actually ask those men and get their feedback), none of those factoids prove whether or not Calvinism is consistent with the Bible.
Technically, his whole approach thus far has been a strawman, since he doesn't even refute Calvin directly (let alone show Biblically why Calvin's position doesn't fly).
Walls would do much better if he spent his time showing from the Bible how Calvinism is not true, rather than making emotional Appeals to reject the opinions of prominent Calvinists.
The two are not the same.
I am so grateful this popped up in my feed today.
I thought this sounded familiar. Then I realized that I had heard it all before from the excellent book "Why I Am Not A Calvinist." It's nice seeing the face of someone whose book influenced my own thinking.
DarthBobCat that’s so said but i get it you been deceived
@@flamingooneleg77
Calvinism: The doctrine that believes Christ isn't who He claimed to be nor is capable of doing what He said He would do.
Deceived?
Calvinism cannot coexist with the gospel. There is no assurance for the believer. The message of the cross must be removed. The end times judgement is for nothing more than show. The word "believe", which in itself requires making a choice, must be removed from all scripture.
C'mon man! Deceived?
@@djohnson3093 Wow! What a brilliant display of profound ignorance, You clearly have no clue what Calvinists believe and have affirmed and denied in our major confessions of faith.
@@TheBereanVoice No need to look beyond their gross corruption of the Gospel of Christ to see what Calvinists believe - hint: It's certainly not the Truth that set's one free!!!
@@caroldonaldson5936 Perhaps you can indicate one point on which the message we preach differs from the message the apostles. If you can't, you need to ask who it is that has grossly corrupted the gospel. I can show you many ways in which synergists have departed from the apostolic message.
IF a woman is FORCED to love you without CHOOSING to love you, then it is not real love. Real love comes from freedom of choice - and man's freedom of choice is void in Calvinism. In Calvinism, those who are saved are robots.
Your mind is different from the mind of God
@@davidochieng2975 The Word of God says I have the mind of Christ
I agree 100%. That’s why this entire teaching falls apart. Calvinists DO believe in free will. This guy is presenting a straw man argument. Find me a Calvinist that says they don’t believe in free will and I’ll show you a nonCalvinist
@@rickmethven4374alvinists believe in a free will of their own definition. It is an illusion of free will. Just the run-of-the-mill Calvinist copout.
Tell me you didn't watch the video without telling me you watched the video. This is funny. 😆
Not different from the way they impose eisegesis upon verses incongruent with their beliefs.
Most of them are also Cessationists. It tells me in what high regard they hold the Scriptures, and all I need to know about their real stance on "Sola Scriptura", when this doctrine cannot be traced back to any verse in the Word. Yet they embrace it.
They are just as, if not more cultish, than the prosperity gospel lovers and die-hard Charismatics. Have more in common with Catholics, e.g. at least the latter annul marriages - Calvinists do the same with the salvation of those that "didn't have the perseverance of the Saints."
Not even Calvinists are Calvinists, since they preach the Gospel. Which there really is no need for, since all those preordained by God to be saved will be saved.
What arrogance of people to think they need to assist God in something He already decided! God doesn't need more help from them than He needed it from Abraham and Sarah to get Isaac.
It is a man-made cult, worshiping a moral monster called Calvin. I believe they are saved, because their misunderstanding of the mechanism of Salvation doesn't disquality them from it.
Now, when it comes to false teachers, that's a place where I have my doubts. But I leave it to God's Grace, as it should be.
@@davidochieng2975LOL.
With all due respect, typical Calvinist answer. I have yet to find a cult that operates from the same entitlement space as Calvinists 🙂.
The typical Catholic is more pleasant than you guys.
Great lecture, very informative :) Thank you for your work, may God bless you as you continue it!
It's funny when I think about all of this. Biblically, Jesus Christ paid the penilty for all of our sin( eternal seperation from God in hell). I mean all of our sins( past present future), it would not makes sense if died for all but one. So when someone is saved, they are saved by grace through faith, not of yourselves but a gift from God, not by works lest any man should boast. I think this is pretty clear scripture on how a man is saved. If I am saved by the finished work of the cross, and I trust in Jesus Christ alone to take me to heaven when I die how can I lose it when I didn't work for it? How can I pay the penalty for sins when it is already been paid? I'm not saving me, Jesus is saving me. I am trusting on him to take me to heaven... I just don't understand why people have a hard time understanding this. Scripture also sperated salvation from service. Salvation is a gift, Service is working. You don't serve to get saved, you get saved to serve.
Brittany Nguyen You spell it out very nicely. I do wonder though how that works in practice. If I am saved, how do I know it? By confessing Christ as Lord? If that makes me saved, then what do I have to do to STAY saved? Anything? Can I sin and repent, over and over again? Watch porn, tell God I am sorry (and really mean it) and the next week commit more sin, repent again, over and over again, and STILL be saved by faith alone in the finished work of the cross?
If repentance means committing to staying clean from sin by praying, reading scripture, going to church - in other words, committing to works to lead a life of righteousness, doesn't that mean that works plays some kind of role in salvation?
If works play no role in salvation, it is all a matter of accepting Christ, wouldn't that mean I could say, "Jesus died for me, and I accept Him as Lord," and still be saved even though I never prayed, went to church, or read the Bible?
Works are evidence of faith. So if you have faith, you will intrinsically do good by spreading the faith and helping others.
your saved Unto good works never by them. we are always Sinners but Jesus takes on all those sins All the time but like a real father he wants to US to acknowledge them to HIM. We must also be very bothered when we sin.This is very important.
David Collins. Great points. Just one question. In James 2 he raises the question: What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if someone claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith SAVE them? . and he goes on to answer the question: You see that a person is considered righteous (justified) by what they do and not by faith alone.
sorry guys, but scripture is very stubborn on that line
I'm wondering if you understood the presentation. Both Arminians and Calvinists believe exactly what you have described. The question that is brought to bear is ...
Who first chooses that one will be saved.
~ According to Arminians, it is the man (each of us individually).
~ According to Cavinists, it is GOD who has chosen long before our existence.
I used to think it was the former. Naturally, probably we all do. But after having studied this issue for several years, I now see much more Biblical evidence for the latter. Many Proof Texts that seem to contradict Calvinism, when seen in Literal forms and in Context, I see now support this view (which I call Sovereign Grace).
Perfect factual information about the misunderstanding of Calvinist who misunderstand and misrepresent the word of god into their own understanding of scripture
His point that ends at 47:10...This is how Calvinism maintains its credibility; by using the rhetoric of universal love in a way that their theology does not support. Bunker busting bomb!
I know God commands me to share the Gospel. God only can convert the sinner.
Thank you. And sinner has to cooperate and not harden his heart. Thank you again , it's good catholic teaching.
@Stefano-o5f Dead sinners cannot cooperate unless and until they are born again by the Holy Spirit. The will is passive in regeneration. Only after being regenerated can the sinner cooperate in his believing, repenting, and obeying. The will cannot cooperate until after regeneration.
@Stefano-o5f The source of truth is the Bible alone, not the church. Protestants are the true catholics. Romanists are not catholic.
@@ThomasCranmer1959 great. Show me that in the bible. Show me bible verse where someone was dead then Holy spirit regenerated him so he could believe.
This was a brilliant in-depth explanation of Calvinism. Very much appreciated.
You don't get things such as love, gratitude, patience, etc. without the presence of evil and adversity.
Why not?
@@christophersnedeker2065 Patience imply you have to endure and wait for something better, that imply there's something worse in the first place. Real love imply that you have a choice to not love. Gratitude imply that you have seen worse and were liberated from it.
Without evil you can not comprehend what good even is and calvinsm is still falsehood.
awesome video....go ask your calvinistic preacher if God has chosen his family for salvation and listen to his response..
I asked my former pastor (a Calvinist) and he said he doesn't tell his children that they might not be elected. He told me "salvation is of the lord, I will never tell my children they could be dammed to hell. that's up to God to decide". Therefore he only tells his children that they need to repent and that God would do the rest if they are elected.
I still think my former pastor means well and I still love him and pray for him.
@@David24476 I am not sure what kind of Calvinist your former pastor is but a knowledgeable Calvinist would not tell his children that "they need to repent and that God would do the rest if they are elected." A Calvinist would believe that their repentance would be the result of God's work in their hearts but that would not be part of the message they need to hear. The concept of election forms no part of our evangelistic message. Our message is simple. God has promised pardon and justification to everyone who will confide in His promise. He is able to make such a promise based on the infinitely valuable and abundantly sufficient redemptive work of Christ. No sinner has ever existed who would be denied pardon and justification if they trusted God's promise and repented of their hostility toward God. The gospel is not for elect sinners but for sinners as sinners.
@@TheBereanVoiceYour message is a lie. God is the truth. You follow doctrines of demons and you put confidence in mere men. You should know better but obviously not.
God would not be GRIEVED at sin and his Spirit would not be STRIVING with man, if everything that occurs is God's will.
Extraordinarily well done
Its about time people looked at calvinisms blatant supersissions and call out them.
God would never command men to repent if they where unable.
Repent of what?
Pride will keep them unsaved... The humiliation that they hold satanic doctrine will make them blind and keep on going to the lake of fire..
Friend, that was the same view Pelagius had when he debated St. Augustine. Pelagianism was soon considered heresy by the entirety of the Church in 415 AD. Read the debate summary to see the wisdom in Augustine’s response
@@rickmethven4374 This is the same err MacArthur spews.
@@laserfalcon Nobody said I do or don’t support MacArthur. We’re talking about the theology here, not mere men. If your theology is dependent on the men who teach it then your theology is in men, not theology of Word of God. Show me MacArthur affirming Pelagius and I’ll be more than happy to believe you. I simply stated a fact of history. If MacArthur affirms that, good for him
Well, John Calvin certainly created God in his own image.
I have been working on a doctrine, you might be interested. Election is
based on whether a person is proud or humble. God gives grace to the
humble (James 4;6). All have sinned so all have something to be humble
about,. Those that remain proud remain damned.
Spirits are used to make people do evil, people that remain proud after evil remain damned. Mankind has partial free-will and partial self-control because of the spirits.
If a person becomes too proud or does other sin God can no longer justify keeping the person in his grace. People are meant to obey to keep God's grace after they are elected.
+LEAFY GUITAR SOLOS So God elects and predestines people based on their own works?
God has no partiality (Rom 2:11) and the Bible calls having favoritism a sin (James 2:9) yet Calvinism teaches "Unconditional Election" which is favoritism on steroids.
Absolutly brilliant. Thank you from France !
I enjoyed this teaching. It seems to me that mankind, since the beginning in the Garden of Eden, has had free will. God told Adam and Eve what to do in that day, but allowed them to do the opposite. When man was seduced by the serpent, he freely chose to listen to him instead of God. God never forced man to listen to Him and He even made another way for man, even in his disobedience. God loves us and desires ALL to come to repentance, but He doesn't force us or pick certain ones. His Word draws us in, but doesn't force us to accept His free gift. Makes sense to me and certainly paints a beautiful picture of the love God has for us, as demonstrated in Christ.
Derick Bland,
You seem to be majorly confused about what Calvinists mean when we deny free will. We do not mean that sinners are not able to choose contrary to what God has commanded or that they are able to make free, voluntary and meaningful choices that from the human standpoint change the outcome. People choose apart from external constraint.
No Calvinist believes that God forces anyone to believe.
You are correct that God desires the repentance of all. A holy being could desire nothing other than that. That is not the issue. The issue is whether He has determined to secure a people for Himself or if it is possible that all He has done for the salvation of His people will have been completely in vain. Calvinists simply believe that God is not merely one who wants to save and tries to save but one who actually saves whom He will and does so successfully and by Himself. He is not waiting for the sinner's cooperation. He graciously produces the sinner's cooperation by putting a new heart in us and giving us a new disposition toward Him.
That’s a misunderstanding of Calvinism that, I’m afraid, is very popular. The best way to go at Calvinists is to say they don’t believe in free will. It’s always sad to see someone shoot at it from such a wrong angle. Former Arminian speaking ✋
@@rickmethven4374
I have been uninvited or banned from attending a Calvinist church for believing exactly what J. Walls is teaching. Some believe that God pre determined who will be saved, others believe God has predestined all to be saved through Jesus. You can call it Calvinism or Arminianism but that is not the point. All who except the grace of God will be saved because Jesus’ death on the cross NECESSARILY was for all sin. Jesus’ death cannot be limited as it is SUFFICIENT to cover all sin. That’s how great Jesus is ! Our sin is evil, but His grace is sufficient to cover the sin of the world. Praise be to God!
Also, the only unforgivable sin is unbelief. Even Jesus marveled that souls that don’t believe ;
And Jesus said to them, “A prophet is not without honor, except in his own country, and among his own kin, and in his own house.” And he could do no mighty work there, except that he laid his hands upon a few sick people and healed them.
(And he marveled because of their unbelief).
And he went about among the villages teaching.
Mark 6:4-6 - www.biblegateway.com/passage?search=Mark%206:4-6&version=RSV
Your Unbelief is what keeps you from the grace of God.
@@jamesbrooks4374 I find it fascinating that you were “banned” from a church for believing in a certain view of Christianity. I wouldn’t commend any church for that. Either they’re a poorly mislead church or you’re being dishonest. I hope neither, and I’ll take your word for it. I pray you find forgiveness in your heart and that the church would reevaluate the treatment of their members. As for the conversation though, Calvinism and Arminianism have names for good reasons. Disassociating the names to their beliefs makes no sense to me, but call it what you like.
We agree when you say that all who accept the saving grace of God will be saved. That much is promised in scripture and a firm belief of Calvinists and Arminians alike. What we do not affirm is that that grace was meant to cover all sin- even unrepentant sin. It’s a nice idea that Christ covers all sin, but it is not the story of the Bible and He is not the God of the Bible, if you are correct. If you suggest that Christ died for ALL sin, then you must also suggest that Christ failed at saving those He died with intention to save. I’m curious if you would directly affirm this statement. (You would say that this is only due to their unbelief, and I would agree. The question is: why would an omnipotent God send His Son for those He KNOWS will not repent?)
You claimed that Christ dying for ALL sin is what explains “how great Jesus is!”, but what makes Him even greater is that He is JUST. Idk about you, but I’d rather have a Just God than one who attempts to save those who are unrepentant. Because God is just, He will not make atonement for unrepentant sin (which He foreknows), and therefore would be a different God from the God of the Bible if He sent His Son to die for unrepentant sin.
Arminians are assuredly brothers and sisters in Christ, and should not be thrown out of any church, ever. But I believe they are brothers and sisters in Christ because of an inconsistency in their own theology. I’m afraid that if they WERE right and people DID accept God’s gift on account of themself and not 100% on account of God, there wouldn’t be a single Christian on the planet. We’re just far too sinful. Praise God it’s not up to me whether or not I’m saved, and praise God that in His infinite wisdom, He is just and reserved His mercy for those He sees fit.
@@rickmethven4374
I can show you the email;
“It has been the decision of the pastor and chairman of the deacons to prohibit you from attending any activities at Pleasant Union Christian Church”
Jesus Christ says in Matthew 25:41, "Depart from me, ye cursed, into EVERLASTING FIRE, prepared for the devil and his angels."
Hell was prepared for the devil and his angels not for humans created in God’s image. God did not create humans just to hate them, that would not be “just” as you say. I believe God fore ordained the World before creating it. In doing so, using His omniscience, God knew which world He would create would allow for the most free creatures to spend eternity with Him. In doing so, there are indeed humans that when given revelation from God would not accept His grace. But God didn’t damn them before creating them they freely chose to not worship the Creator.
My point about Calvinism and Arminianism was that mere Christianity is all that is needed for a rich and full relationship with our Lord, and Savior Jesus Christ. Reformed or Catholic doesn’t matter either. Not sure religion matters either. Just a tight relationship with our Creator. But one must get that right, no false god can save you. Only the True God can through the sacrifice of Jesus.
One more point I hope you grasp, Jesus’ death did take away the sin of the world. If there are millions of worlds in existence we don’t know about Jesus’s death was sufficient for the sins of those worlds as well. Nothing but the blood of Jesus can save and that blood is not inefficient unless it is rejected. Look at Satan and his angels
You believe that God is one; you do well. Even the demons believe-and shudder.
James 2:19
But they don’t accept God’s grace do they ?
"All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men; but the blasphemy against the Holy Spirit shall not be forgiven unto men" (Matthew 12:31).
Sin is forgiven only because of Jesus’ propitiation on the cross. No one deserves salvation accept the sinless Christ, we now should love our Creator and Sustainer and our neighbors as ourselves, and sin no more.
I appeal to you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, to present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God, which is your spiritual worship. Do not be conformed to this world but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that you may prove what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect.
Romans 12:1-2
To continue in sin is to crucify Jesus over and over and over again. Stop sinning! Confirm to Christ as our example.
Wasn’t that why Jesus sent the Holy Spirit to us?
“If you love me, you will keep my commandments. And I will pray the Father, and he will give you another Counselor, to be with you for ever, even the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees him nor knows him; you know him, for he dwells with you, and will be in you. He who has my commandments and keeps them, he it is who loves me; and he who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I will love him and manifest myself to him.” Judas (not Iscariot) said to him, “Lord, how is it that you will manifest yourself to us, and not to the world?” Jesus answered him, “If a man loves me, he will keep my word, and my Father will love him, and we will come to him and make our home with him. He who does not love me does not keep my words; and the word which you hear is not mine but the Father’s who sent me.
John 14:15-17,21-24
This is doable through the Holy Spirit, not by our own strength.
Happy day brother! God bless and keep you!
Here's the issue:
God desires His glory more than human autonomy.
Or
God desires human autonomy more than His glory.
The first sentence is correct.
The Arminians mistake is that they assume sinful man is able to objectivly judge whether God is good.
To give a lecture like this without quoting or expounding scripture he follows his forefather John Wesley on the same subject It is not acceptable to say that he is going to do this subsequently. Not all may get to hear the next lecture.
ruclips.net/video/D6rmrX5p44Y/видео.html it's really not too hard to find.
To write a critique like this without quoting or expounding scripture....
Short answer to why I am not a Calvinist:
1 Corinthians 1:10 "Now I plead with you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you, but that you be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment. 11 For it has been declared to me concerning you, my brethren, by those of Chloe’s household, that there are contentions among you. 12 Now I say this, that each of you says, “I am of Paul,” or “I am of Apollos,” or “I am of Cephas,” or “I am of Christ.” 13 Is Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Or were you baptized in the name of Paul?"
To all those who call themselves Calvinists I would echo Paul's question, Was Calvin crucified for you? If anyone thinks this approach is frivolous I would reply two things: 1) that I also have a long answer, covering the many unbiblical aspects of Calvinistic doctrine. And 2). I have personally experienced the hurtful divisive effects of a prideful loyalty to Calvin that eclipsed a common fellowship in Christ. There is an individual, a brother in Christ, who has severed all communication with me because he could not convert me to Calvinism. We had discussed various aspects of "tulip theology" but our last communication was a conversation in which I brought up Calvin's involvement in the execution of Servetus. My friend angrily defended Calvin even though one of the "heresies" for which Servetus was burned at the stake was opposition to infant baptism, a charge for which I would be guilty and subject to execution if i had lived in Calvin's Geneva.
Historian Bernard Cottret summarizes Calvin's argument in a syllogism based on a lost letter: "Socrates is a man, and therefore mortal; Servetus is a heretic, and therefore combustible." Cottret also cites a letter from John Calvin on Servetus that says: "One should not be content with simply killing such people, but should burn them cruelly."
I forget who it was that asked, "How could a follower of Christ the Lamb act like such a cruel and ravenous lion?"
P.S. I'm not an Arminian either.
Oh lawd! 🤦🏽♂️
John 17 : 5 " Father, glorify me in Your own presence with the glory which I had with You before the world began."
"He had with you before the world began" in the sense that his being in the father's presence in the present tense, guaranteed from the beginning that he would be glorified in his father. Again, Calvinists gloss over the nuances of grammatical constructions, honing in on a single meaning when the construction of the sentence does not logically guarantee it.
@@ScottRachelson777 Jesus in his Bible is saying to me God thought everything out before time began and right there I can't undesrstand that timelessness and also God is One uncreated, so that's another mystery. God is the arhitect of everything and when He was ready he created = thought ot Jesus and begat him, made him to manage the putting in place the PLANS. Jesus is subject to time I am the Alpha and Omega where as God isn't and that reality puts the complete lie to the demonic Nicene creed that satan demands be dogmatised in order to explain away Jesus's ability to destroy his dreadful work ie the dismissal of demons, the cleansing and sourging of lower human natures.
@@ScottRachelson777 solid eisegesis.
You just made all that up, it’s nowhere in the text. Calvinists of old were better suited in the Greek and thats definitely not what they saw that verse meant.
@@florida8953 You are a brainwashed Calvinist, so of course, you think it's eisegesis. I'm not surprised. It's like expecting a radical Muslim to see that Jesus is God or a JW that Jesus is eternal and that being born of man doesn't negate that fact. These groups are all bound up in the mind and so their spirits are blind as a bat.
@@florida8953 Calvinism is clever. Walls points that out.
Thanks for this great video 2023
Nothing is wrong with Calvinism... however, what’s wrong with this lecture is that there wasn’t even one Bible verse until 43 minutes into the lecture, and how he never presented passages from scripture like John 6:37-45, Romans 9, Ephesians 1:1-14 and 2:1-10 that all support Calvinistic soteriology.
Why not go straight to Christ’s and the apostles’ teachings AKA scripture to refute Calvinism... oh wait, you can’t because it’s all throughout scripture. So much for that PhD if you can’t exegete scripture...
Yes there is alot wrong with calvinism. It's false for one. It is not the truth of reality.
This is why I am a Primitive Baptist and not a Calvinist. We don't believe in a general call, only the effectual call
*1 Corinthians **2:14** : 14*
But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness unto him; neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
John 6:44
No man can come unto me unless my Father who sent me draws him
I never really understood Calvinism myself but am interested to know if certain personality types are more drawn to this kind of theology than others. Anecdotally, I've never really seen a Calvinist exhibit high levels of empathy for example and they tend to be much more risk averse than others which leads to the kind of closed-mindedness that in my opinion is quite damaging. I guess it's really hard to tell which came first whether it was the Calvinism that requires you to suppress empathy and become risk averse or whether it is being naturally lacking in empathy and being risk averse that predisposes someone to embracing Calvinism. This may seem like a strange angle to come from (the whole personality type thing). I do just wonder sometimes the psychological impact of having a vision of God who is ultimately opposed to the notion of possibilities and who presents himself to us (from the human perspective) as an apparently amoral certitude who defines his notion of goodness in a way irreconcilable with the definition of good I have come across in any human language. Why not use the English word "evil" for the Calvinist God if that seems to fit better? I'm aware that Calvinism has always been an easy version of Christianity to caricature due to the moral repulsion felt by most people who encounter it, at least for the first time. Hopefully I'm not leaning too heavily on those caricatures to make my argument, but if I am I'm open to correction. Again anecdotally, I've never really found a Calvinist whose life I would feel compelled to imitate in any significant way. Is it too harsh of me to question the tree if the fruit seems mostly distasteful?
I'm in a PCA church but I must admit I find Calvinism a nightmare. I'm desperate to find arguments that Calvinists have misunderstood essential things but I want truth, above all else.
I believe it is according to His mercy. I guess that makes me a Calvinist. Maybe you can examine me? 🤔
You are right my friend I agree
@@urawesome4670 I agree - I'm reformed because I'm convinced I am hopelessly lost without the grace of God and I don't understand WHY HE WOULD PICK ME because I feel like has chased me my whole life and he will never stop. I love my Lord.
I think I understand what you mean, but also, think: the great majority of people on the planet (or who have You Tube) could not care any less about this topic, even many “Christians” or some may not have the intelligence to grasp its intricacies. I what I mean is that the mere fact that you’re here actually interested in this subject matter (and not bashing it, like some atheists like to do) represents at least a care and love for God such that you are willing to expand your understanding above and beyond what most others would do. I would venture to say that if you ask most Christians whether they embrace Calvinism or Arminianism, they wouldn’t even know what you were talking about. I attempted to explain the difference to my wife the other day and her head almost exploded, and I was unsaved before I met her, and but for her, I would probably remain unsaved (but not according to Calvinist, lol). I think the personality types would break down like this: cerebral/academically-inclined literalists= tend toward Calvin; heartfelt/emotional/romantic?= Arminian. Hard to pinpoint, because we all have Jesus in common....isn’t that enough?? That’s what my beautiful wife would say.
Never heard of this guy before, but what an excellent lecturer! My gosh, Calvinists are Christianity's answer to Wahabbist Islam.
This statement might be true as Whahhabists follow the Quran much more closely than most Muslim people do.
@@StudioGalvan If calvinists actually read the bible instead of worshipping MacArthur and company they would know that it doesn't support calvinism at all.
@@lintflas1183 Perhaps you should also warn Yohann Hus, Martin Luther, Zwingli and all the rest of the heroes of the Reformation about not following "Calvinism" or John MacArthur. Oh wait, They all PRECEDED John MacArthur. As did the early church fathers who wrote the churches and each other many things which support what you call "Calvinism". Here is a pretty good list of many of their writings.
www.apuritansmind.com/arminianism/calvinism-in-the-early-church-the-doctrines-of-grace-taught-by-the-early-church-fathers/
(Jump about 3/16's down the page to see the available quotes.)
~ So the point is, there is Very Good reason that the doctrine of Sovereign Grace, (now popularly called Calvinism for some reason) exists.~ But as you indicated, it matter not what ANYONE says, if it is not supported in scripture. Here is a list of scripture as well as what many of the Pre-MacArthur theologians have commented.
www.apuritansmind.com/tulip/calvinism-and-tulip-in-the-middle-ages/
~ Perhaps you will study it from a Non-Calvinist Hater before you make judgement.
"Remove the beam out of your own eye, and then you can see clearly to remove the speck out of your brother's eye."
(That is, if you even consider all these great and Godly men of the past brothers.)
@@StudioGalvan Luther and Zwingli weren't calvinists.
Calvinism plays almost no role in the German speaking world. It's a problem in the English-speaking part of the world.
I don't deny that there are numerous attempts to turn them all into Calvinists.
@Lintflas You need to check your facts sister. Almost ALL of the Early reformers were believers in the doctrine of Sovereign Grace (Calvinism). Look it up.
You stressed the point that I have always believed and live by...for Wesleyans, it is not a defense of "free will" as much as it is a defense of the character and nature of God. This is what I try to impart to my Calvinist friends. I don't believe that I would be a Christian if it meant being a Calvinist. This video is a must-watch for both Calvinists and non-Calvinists. Wonderful lecture, Jerry. Thanks!!
Exactly ~ agree! Not defending freewill so much as GOD'S CHARCTER. I will only serve a GOOD GOD.
So you would create a god in your image, rather than accept the God of the Bible? That is the real issue here - submission to scripture or forcing the Bible to support a god who is acceptable to sinful man.
That the fundamental issue is the character of God is spot on, couldn’t agree more. This is also a solid way to try to determine which theological ideas are correct in other contexts as well. The ideas that make God look the best, the most like Jesus Christ, are the ones most likely to be correct.
God is who He is. He doesn't need to be protected. He needs to be proclaimed. Twisting Scripture to make Him seem palatable is just as bad as outright rejecting Him. The truth is that He IS sovereign over EVERYTHING and WE are not.
@@douglasmcnay644Yes, indeed God is sovereign! But is that His only attribute? In the Bible, especially in the NT(through Christ Jesus, his death on the cross, his resurrection, his second coming) God is clearly portrayed as the loving God and Father..... God bless ...
Calvinism is not simple in the Salvation issue Other groups have similar if not worse understanding on this issue . To be safe , make personal study . And ask the Lord for wisdom .
Amen 💗 I asked God to help show me His truth after coming across Calvinism and I know now that Gods will is for everyone to be saved but some of us choose to accept or reject His gift of enteral life through faith in Jesus Christ
Excellent 🙏🏼
What is the point of telling Cain he must overcome sin if he supposedly was never able to overcome sin in the first place?? Calvinism is a load of (fill in the blank).
bud ekins When did God tell Cain to overcome sin?
Hi Speaks, it was in Gen 4:7. ."sin is crouching at the door. Its desire is for you, but you MUST RULE OVER IT".
bud ekins ..ah, ok. thanks man!
Constant The God Rapper ..I been watching alot of your videos bro. I Thank God for working through you to get to me. keep the videos coming!
bud ekins- God gives us many commands that we of ourselves can not fulfill or obey. When you refuse to accept the gospel as explained by TULIP you reject Bible truth and show yourself still lost and in your sins. Seek the Lord that you might find Him. You have a false Jesus you have created and therefore you need to repent and ask God for true saving faith. Watch my many excellent videos that might help you.
Mr. Walls,
God doesn't send people to hell unconditionally. It seems to be your assumption that sinners don't deserve to perish.
I wish ya'll would come up with a better straw man than that. It's old, rhetorically dismissive and not how people seek truth.
The TULIP is treated as though it were a paragraph of scripture and part of the inspired text, and so doctrines are built around its precepts. They are just concepts that may contain aspects of truth but they are not true as biblical revelation to be embraced as a tenet of doctrine.
I agree
out of interest, would you say the same about the triune nature of God?
That's a good question. I will think on that for awhile and contemplate how it would relate in regards to the previous description that I made.
Kenneth Mcclurkin ok
Biblical revelation regarding the triune nature of God isn't stated so simply as the word "trinity" (which the bible never uses), but it does systematically reveal that 1. God is three persons, 2. Each person is fully God, and 3. There is one God. (Hard to comprehend but God really is three different things that are omnipresent, while being one God). The Calvinist principles, if taken in their full context and studied systematically from Genesis to Revelation, are not systematically revealed, nor consistent. The one compromise I will make is the idea of Perseverance of the Saints. Aside from a few select texts in Hebrews (which I think are taken out of context by hard-core Arminians), I believe true salvation is eternal. Aside from that, I think Calvinists have it wrong, especially in regards to election, atonement, and the resistability of grace. With regards to Depravity, I don't get too worked up. We're depraved to a certain extent, call it total or not, whatever. That being said, I also think it's important to remember that if Jesus is your forgiver and leader and you have genuinely declared those words in your heart and with your mouth, then whether it's a sovereignty thing or whether there is some free-will involved (you can see where I stand), we are all on the same team. What Jesus did, who He is, and what He does inside of us and through us, is what's really important.
What a fantastic, exciting, deep professor. How I wish my professors were such!
Read Ken Wilson's recent book "The Foundation of Augustinian-Calvinism", if you want to understand the origin of this man-made doctrine.
At 59ish he says God is only LORD/King after creation I dare say he has been from eternity past because God is immutable he doesn’t change all of his magnificent attributes have always been there he hasn’t gained or lost anything he is omnipotent before he created, he is love, he is righteous, he is absolute, self sufficient or autonomous, holy and all his other attributes have always been.
Was God the creator before He created?
@@BuildingApologetics Malachi 3:6 “For I the LORD do not change; therefore you, O children of Jacob, are not consumed.
If he was only creator after creation then that changed God from noncreator to creator and would not longer leave any accuracy in Malachi 3:6 and would nullify the doctrine of the immutability of God all of Gods attributes are eternal creation has just allowed them to be manifest. Is mercy and grace immutable attributes of God? Yes but they weren’t on display until the fall of man, and in full consummation at Calvary.
There is a answer people are grasping for but cant get. Paul said it best and I agree that who can understand God and his ways, we can talk and think until we die but we dont have the mental ability to understand Him fully. This is where faith comes in, I have faith God wishes all to be saved, I hqve faith that God knows all things and is all powerful, I have faith God created us in His image and we have free will. I dont understand it all and only God can, that is why you cant pkease Gid without faith.
John 6, 44 “No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws them, and I will raise them up at the last day.
John 12:32. And I,when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw ALL people to myself
@@brendapfeil4584 Oh, wow, I have never read all of John. Everyone is is going to Heaven. 😎
@@tricord2939 not what that verse says at all. God is not willing that any should perish but that doesn’t mean that those who choose to reject Him won’t. Just as He draws everyone to Him there are those who will willfully turn away.
@@brendapfeil4584 Proof texting is a dangerous thing, you quoted “ALL”. In reply to John 6:44
“No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws them, and I will raise them up at the last day.
@@tricord2939
Yes, absolutely yes God must draw a person to Christ. How does He do it? The gospel is preached (Romans 10:13-14); The Holy Spirit ( John 16:8)
The Father sent His Son, the Word, the gospel, the Holy Spirit, and faithful preachers so that men would be drawn.
Literally a few verses up in John 6: 40 Jesus says, “For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in Him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.”
And He EXPLAINS what He meant in John 6:44 later in verse 64-65. Those that wouldn’t believe and who would betray Him!! You have to read the whole chapter!
It ONLY makes sense that God gives people enough grace to love Him.
"To whom little is given, LITTLE is required. To whom MUCH is given MUCH is required."
Those who have not heard of Jesus, yet, with what little of the Grace of God they have received, do their best to feel the need for God, and love Him as best they know how, God will allow them to Salvation and the Atonement. Perhaps, when such a person, or a child dies, they are gently led to an understanding of Christ. If they truly have accepted the Grace of God, they will come to Christ after they die.
Where oh where is the Scriptural foundation to what Wallis propounds??!! This is not theology. This is humanist philosophy
Mark Rogers Walls was not making a case for some non-Calvinist view. Anyone who is honest can agree that, given certain interpretations of scripture, a case can be made for Calvinism, Molinism, or Arminianism. To break the interpretive deadlock, we can turn to philosophy and logic which shows us the incoherence of Calvinism. Even Calvinist scholars have come to recognize the “mysteries” and “paradoxes” that their view logically leads to.
He points you towards 3 further videos that discuss the theology of his argument. See the last few minutes of this video for the details.
I agree, during all of his passionate rantings and ravings, not once did I ever hear him address the Biblical argument for Calvanism.
This seems to be the consistent opposition with people making Willis' argument.
To follow Armenian logic, it sure is a good thing Noah decided to choose God, cause it sure would have been very awkward if God waited for Noah to build the Ark and Noah chose not to build it.
@@phillwithskill1364 The problem with the Non-Calvinists perspective is that it seeks to do away with the mystery. God has done the best He can. Some sinners respond properly because they are somehow more spiritual, humble, intelligent etc. than other sinners. God responds to their decision but controls nothing because He doesn't want to violate the sinner's free will. There is no mystery. For Paul, and the rest of those who are willing to believe what the Bible teaches, there will always be mystery. He wrote, "O the Depth of the riches of the wisdom and knowledge of God. How unsearchable are His judgments [decrees] and His ways [the providential outworking of those judgments] past tracing out."
I loved this! He did an excellent job in a very gentle and loving way. As a Calvanist, I appreciated that. It seems though, that the entire crux of his anti-Calvanist argument was based on Whether God loves everyone, or mankind’s general definition of love. But the Bible answers this. Paul clearly told the church in Roman’s 9 that God raised pharaoh up for his own glory and, in the same chapter Paul answered the argument with a rhetorical question. “Can the potter make a vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use?”. That question is rhetorical for two reasons. The first reason is because of course the potter can make a vessel for honorable use and one for dishonorable..and the second reason is because Paul already showed the Romans that Paul had made pharaoh for his own glory..So, I’ll answer the “does God love everyone” question with a question of my own..Did God love Pharaoh? Remember, according to Mr. Walls definition of Love “truly to love someone is to desire their well being and to promote their true flourishing as much as you can”. Does creating a “vessel” for dishonorable use fit this definition of love? Did God love pharaoh?
Yes, remember in God's love there is kindness, compassion, mercy, sacrifice, justice, judgement, hell and heaven, to name a few.
God chose the Jews to carry his name (honored). However, the Gentiles (everyone else) he did not, you could say that the gentiles were raised at first for dishonor. When the words honored and dishonored are used it simply means one group or individuals were given preference over another or denied acknowledgement for whatever reason at whatever time in history. It does not mean that they were raised for destruction (forced into hell), or on the other hand, that they have automatic entrance into the Kingdom.
When you cherry pick scripture and not take in the whole council of God’s word, you can easily come up with all types of ungodly beliefs, cults and the like. You must realize that Pharoah’s heart was by choice already at a state of disbelief in a God whom Moses was proclaiming. Pharaoh had choices just as we do today.
This next passage might clear things up for you.
“The coming of the lawless one will be in accordance with how Satan works. He will use all sorts of displays of power through signs and wonders that serve the lie, and all the ways that wickedness deceives those who are perishing. They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved. For this reason God sends them a powerful delusion so that they will believe the lie and so that all will be condemned who have not believed the truth but have delighted in wickedness” (2 Thessalonians 2:9-12).
Did God send a delusion just to deceive people, no scripture clearly states "for this reason" they beleive not the truth but a lie.
The delusion comes on behalf of people's own choices. Their sin if not repented of puts them back under the law out of grace,
not by God's choice but their own.
Remember the incidence of the snakes in Pharoah’s court. Pharoah’s magicians imitated the miracle of Moses's rod turning into a snake, not just one but several snakes. It was a counterfeit although at the time very real. Such as the case with Satan and his devices, very much real but yet a counterfeit to what God’s purposes and plans are. God as he did back then and does today send strong delusions to those who refuse to love the truth and obey as to be saved. In the Old Testament it was done by not believing through disobeying the prophets who spoke on God’s behalf. By choice people decide their own fate.
In Acts 3:25-26 we read,
And you are sons of the prophets and of the covenant God made with your fathers when He said to Abraham, ‘Through your offspring all the families of the earth will be blessed. When God raised up His Servant, He sent Him first to you to bless you by turning each of you from your wicked ways.
Did God forcibly turn Israel from their wicked ways. No, he provided the way into which they might believe in His Son. Although they were chosen to be a nation honored by God to carry forth his purposes early on, yet Israel still had to decide whether or not to obey. They were raised up to be a vessel honored by God. Every one of us are sown in dishonored, for we have all sinned. But those who obey and believe in the truth will be raised from dishonor to honor and seated with Christ in heavenly places.
God raised Pharaoh up as a vessel of dishonor. Not to force him into hell, but chose him to be a force of evil because he refused to believe in Moses a prophet sent by God to deliver his people, and also to fulfill his purposes. God is sovereign in his foreknowledge, not wanting anyone to perish, but all come into the fullness of Christ, whether by revelation through the prophets in the O.T or through Christ Jesus in this age. Pharaoh was already under a personal decision of disbelief and an unwillingness to know the one true God by choice.
In Exodus 8:15, 32; and 9:34, we are told explicitly that Pharaoh hardened his own heart, so lets not put all the marbles on God's side.
Or do you think lightly of the riches of His kindness and restraint and patience, not knowing that the kindness of God leads you to repentance? But because of your stubbornness and unrepentant heart you are storing up wrath for yourself on the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God, who WILL REPAY EACH PERSON ACCORDING TO HIS DEEDS: to those who by perseverance in doing good seek glory, honor, and immortality, He will give eternal life; but to those who are self-serving and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, He will give wrath and indignation. Rom 2:4
God raises kings, presidents, prime ministers today as He did in the O.T for his glory, for His purposes and plans.
By no fault of our own, God does not purposely condemn to hell or eternally save to heaven.
If so Christ died for some, not all.
Remember your parents loved you by the hand of blessing and punishment/discipline.
Did God love Pharaoh, yes in love through justice and judgement.
Of course God loved Pharaoh. Pharaoh was a vessel of wrath/destruction God used against the J--s, (don't want a hate speech strike for the geniuses at youtube) It does not logically follow the Pharaoh himself was a vessel of wrath unto himself or a personal recipient of Gods wrath as the Calvinist believes. He was simply a tool. There is no reason to assume he never believed. God hardened his heart, but for the express purpose of the aforementioned and not necessarily unto eternal punishment in hell.
Just something to chew on...
Either Roman's 2:11-16 is true or God is a liar.....this is what brought me out of the heresy of Calvinism....God is NOT a respector of people, but of conditions...you must believe to have salvation is the condition...whole book of John states this over 100 times.
It doesn't sound like you ever understood Calvinism if you think that Calvinists don't think faith is necessary?
@@josephharrison4669 I understand Calvinism fully and was a convert for years until the Lord showed me the way
@@polskigirl8547 well if you were a Calvinist, dont you know that we believe that one must have faith for salvation? It sounds like you have no knowledge of this.
@@josephharrison4669 I do have knowledge ….. but your faith comes from God and not your free will…
God chose you for heaven and decried others for damnation…
@@polskigirl8547 regardless of where the faith comes from, I still have faith in Christ so I don't know how you can call Calvinism a heresy. How does it change the gospel in any way? I believe Arminians are wrong about soteriology but I wouldnt call you a heretic because you still have faith in Christ for your salvation.
This is great, God bless you.
I've been studying and believe in Calvin doctrines...one thing I see consistently from Calvinist is they use scripture to support their views whereas those in opposition use almost no scripture and does not seek out God's word. Be careful of following those folks. Study scripture and the Holy Spirit will reveal the truth to you! God Bless!
Did you hear him mention at the end of the lecture that this was a philosophical lecture? And that he deals with the Biblical texts also?
Not all Calvinists use TULIP. Instead of Limited Atonement there is Definite or Actual Atonement. Instead of Irresistible Grace there is Effectual Grace or Effectual Calling. The Reformers used the words and understanding of the terms for their time period. Calvin gets so much hate and at least Walls educates his audience about this. Calvin was a brilliant man gifted by God that in his very early 20s already started writing Institutes.
Brothers and Sisters, KNOW your church history! I don’t care if you are a Calvinist, Arminianist, Molonist, and some other varying degrees within each camp. KNOW your church history. Know how these doctrines came about.
Walls is right about the Freedom discussion and John Frame does a very good job explaining it in one of his volumes of “A Theology of Lordship.”
IMO, the biggest question for someone who does not believe in the Sovereignty of God in salvation to answer is, “Can Man Deny God?” Whatever your answer is that question will let you know how you view God.
I am a 5 Point Calvinist. On July 31, 2005, my ODA and I were on a mission which ended with my vehicle striking an IED. My right eye was popped out of socket, left lung partially collapsed, and when my femur broke, it cut my femoral artery. It was two hours before I saw a surgeon. I used all the blood at KAF so some near ODAs came to give blood. 3SFG flew my wife to Germany because they were unsure if I was going to make it.
I woke up from a drug induced coma to sound of my wife’s voice, “Hey Baby I’m here to take you home.” To this day I get emotional when I say that. She laid in the stretcher beside me and flew back with me on a C-141 Medical Transport and with a flight surgical team. I could not keep my eyes open because of all the drugs and coming out of the coma and I was not sure if I was going to die or not. My BP was so high, 225/115 was the average.
Somewhere over the Atlantic God saved me. He regenerated my heart. God made me a new creation. A new man! He gave me a new nature that is set on Him and not sin. Do I sin still and Christians still sin…Absolutely. It’s not about the will. Your will is tied to your nature. YOU CANNOT CHANGE YOUR NATURE without the regenerating act of the Holy Spirt.
In John 3, Jesus was teaching Nicodemus the Doctrine of Salvation. Verses 1-15 is the Sovereignty of God in salvation and verses 16-21 is Man’s Responsibility. It is not accident they are butted up against each other. Jesus, Who is God, goes from one to the other without skipping a beat lol. EVERYONE has to accept there is still mystery with the two and able to reconcile the two.
I have Brothers and Sisters that are not Calvinist or are 3 or 4 Point Calvinist and it doesn’t matter to me, I still love them and do not degrade them like some would or some who have a distain for Calvinism and get belligerent with you lol. It’s crazy.
When I was in that C-141, I was so doped up and could not even say coherent things, but our Lord placed repentance and faith within me (Ephesians 2:8) so I could repent of my sins and have faith in our Lord AND Savior Jesus Christ as my name was written in the Lamb’s Book of Life before the foundations of the world were made by God (Rev 13:8;17:8b). The Book of Life was written before God made the world. God is not a time traveler, because He is the Author history. If you TRULY believe Man is the Ultimate decider on whether he or she is saved, then you have to rip John 6:37, 45, 65; 10:14-16 and all of John 17. If you base what you believe on one verse then you are sitting in a one legged chair.
One very good tool or rule to remember, “What is the context of the verse? What is the chapter about? What is the book about and who is it addressing to?!” Advocates of Anti-Calvinism like to use 2 Peter 3:9 to say, “See…God does not want anyone to perish and ALL to come to repentance.” Who is Peter talking to? He is talking to Believers! The reason we are in 2023 is because in time God will save those of whom He wrote their names in the Lamb’s Book of Life before the foundations of the world. God does not take delight in the destruction of man, but if God did not save some, NO ONE would be saved. Read Romans 3:10-18. NO ONE SEEKS AFTER GOD.
Either way, I love all my Brothers and Sisters in Christ as we all should. I will caveat that there is this ugly stuff called “hyper Calvinism” which IMO is not Calvinism at all!! ANY Calvinist should be the most humble person in the world because he or she knows and comes to realize that he or she deserves death, the grave and Hell and not a shred of His Grace!
I will put a link to my testimony and how God save me. In Christ, YBIC
Everything that happens in history has been decreed/Predestined before the world was created see Eph 1:11, Proverbs 16:33 and Amos 3:6. And yes even when terrible things happen, I know it's hard for some people to accept but look what happened when David sinned against God and one of Davids punishments was that God told him that he was going to use Davids own son to shame his Father by Absalom Absalom doing something immoral to his Fathers concubines in front of all of Israel, see 2 Samuel 12:11-12 God said "Thus says the Lord, ‘Behold, I will raise up evil against you from your own household; I will even take your wives before your eyes and give them to your companion, and he will lie with your wives in broad daylight. Indeed you did it secretly, but I will do this thing before all Israel, and under the sun." Notice how God said "I WILL DO THIS THING."That was fulfilled in 2 Samuel 16:21-22. Jesus did not die for every single person ever and Jesus didn't die to make people savable. He died to save his elect. In John 17:9 Jesus said that he does not pray for the world. The word world is used in different contexts, in that context he's talking about the non elect. In John 3:16 world means that he purchased people from every tribe, tongue and nation Rev 5:9 and for the children of God scattered abroad John 11:52. Some have been "long beforehand marked out for condemnation" Jude 4 and "appointed to doom." 1 Peter 2:8. About Pharaoh God said “For this VERY PURPOSE I raised you up, to demonstrate My power in you, and that My name might be proclaimed throughout the whole earth.” So then He has mercy on whom He desires, and He hardens whom He desires." Rom 9:17-18. Jesus said "I praise You, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that You have hidden these things from the wise and intelligent and have revealed them to infants. Yes, Father, for this way was well-pleasing in Your sight. All things have been handed over to Me by My Father; and no one knows the Son except the Father; nor does anyone know the Father except the Son, and anyone to whom the Son wills to reveal Him." Matthew 11:25-27. So, 2 Pet 3:9 the "not willing that any should perish" if you read that letter in context, 2 Pet 1:1 says "To those who have received a faith of the same kind as ours." As far as salvation for all men verses, Paul was refuting the false notion of his time that God was only desiring to save just the Jews and 1 Tim 2:2 says to pray "for kings and all who are in authority" because as humans WE DON'T KNOW WHO THE ELECT ARE SO WE PRAY FOR EVERYONE! That's what it means in verse 4 by saying "all men." Amos 3:2 God said "of all the nations of the earth I have only known you." For centuries God passed over the majority of humankind because this verse isn't about knowledge it's about relationship. And it isn't because God foresaw Israel was more righteous then the other nations because sometimes Israel was more sinful then the pagan nations see 2 Kings 21:9. Only those who were predestined to be saved will be see Acts 13:48, Ephesians 1:4-5, Eph 1:11, Romans 9:11-23, John 6:37.
The way you debunk Calvinism is to go to scripture and look at all the passages by which Calvinists use to come to their conclusions and teach those passages to be contrary to the Calvinist position. You also must prove your position from scripture. The debate is biblical. As a Calvinist it was the scriptures that renewed my mind. Philosophical positions dont interepret scripture. Scripture should sculpt the philosophical position of the believer.
You are correct. All man-made doctrines are revealed not by the scripture quoted by its proponents, but rather by the scripture they must ignore to make it work. The following are "Calvinism" killers.
Gen 25:23 And the LORD said unto her, Two nations are in thy womb, and two manner of people shall be separated from thy bowels; and the one people shall be stronger than the other people; and the elder shall serve the younger.
Joh_12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me
Act 3:19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;
Act 17:30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:
Eph 1:13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
.
paul atr8eez
What’s the difference between you and someone God didn’t elect before time began?
Yes. And you have to do more than quote single verses and jump from verse to verse without considering the point the author intends. Eventually someone is going to read the context those verses, and if the subject isn't about what you say it is, or if other passages that more directly speak to that subject shed light on a different interpretation, then people are going to follow the view that makes better sense of the author's argument without having to jump to completely different books.
oracleoftroy
If scripture contradicts your theology then your theology is wrong.
So are you trying to say that nothing this man said was effective and good good information to use ??
Why was Michael Servetus burned alive by John Calvin? How can Calvin go to heaven being guilty of murder? Servetus' blood crieth in flames and seeketh justice just as Abel's blood. How then is Calvin different from Cain?
Calvinism was the theology of the Baptist Church in America from its founding. Arminianism came in in the latter half of the 19th century and has misled many like this man does. He is using human philosophy and Gods thoughts are higher than mans.
Although I do not care for much of what Jerry Walls has to say, I do agree that his critique of Packer and D. A Carson was helpful and sound. God does not love everyone on the same level and Christian pastors have no business declaring that He does. The only obligation that men have is to preach the Gospel to everyone without exception because, unlike God, they do not know who is actually among the elect. The Calvinist pastor should present the Gospel to all knowing that it will have the effect it was intended to have. Even Jeremiah was commanded to preach to those in particular who would refused to hear.
I appreciate your forthright attitude about whatever Calvinism actually entails.
Just like most theologians this man fails to use the bible to disprove calvinism and instead reverts to philosophical arguments. The man neither disproves nor proves calvinism with the gunk.
Did the Early Church Fathers teach "Calvinism"? Ken Wilson
ruclips.net/video/YTSEh1o8HdE/видео.html
Calvinism and Arminianism are both philosophical in nature and both come out of scripture.
Acts 2:41 (NIV, and most major translations, except KJV) -- Those who accepted his message were baptized, and about three thousand were added to their number that day.
Actually, he does use a fair amount of scripture. He just doesn't quote book, chapter, and verses. E.g starting at 47:40 and 52:00 (there are lots more, but these two should suffice)
Well the bible does disprove calvinism. They call them self reformed and then proceed to make the most cherry picking rookie mistakes , misinterpreting scriptures due to ignoring what the majority of scriptures say about a subject.
If Calvinism can be dismantled by logic alone, it’s not a robust doctrine
"You do what you want to do"
Yes..but God gave that Freedom
So that Freedom has A certain capacity... God created it
One more thing... In the calvinist conundrum -- Why God didn't make everyone saved.. They do answer and they do put up a good fight, Romans 9:22 Does not the potter have the right to make from the same lump of clay one vessel for special occasions and another for common use? 22 What if God, intending to show His wrath and make His power known, bore with great patience the vessels of His wrath, prepared for destruction? 23What if He did this to make the riches of His glory known to the vessels of His mercy, whom He prepared in advance for glory-… God... Sort of gives the answer calvanist can use...
So.. if Calvinism is incorrect.. What then do we do with rom 9:22 I've never labeled myself a calvanist but this verse just screams at you
Again with the argument where you say Man is responsible for his actions but also divinely controlled, Once again Calvanist aren't pulling this from thin air, God himself gives that example time and time again, In exodus, Moses tells pharoah if he does not let his people go he will punish pharoah with plagues etc.. Yet pharoahs heart was hardened to NOT let people go by GOD, then God punished him for not letting his people go! Even to the point of pharoahs first born dying.. Yet why did God tell us HE HIMSELF hardened the pharoah... And then punishd pharoah for his hardened heart or at least what he decided... So tell me.. How could we possible answer calvanist we can't just use your arguments.. They don't tackle scripture!
Oh and... Proverbs 16:4
The LORD has made everything for His purpose--even the wicked for the day of disaster.
Until a man does not understand that everything was created for God’s glory will continue think that Calvinism is wrong .
If we don't accept Gods undeserved Grace freely it would mean nothing.
2018's most famous retreat from Calvinism is a video from Dr. Leighton Flowers with 30,000 views in 7-days. This tells us many pastors won't support this confusing doctrine in their pulpits anymore.. so the landslide begins.. Amen? Back to sound biblical doctrine!
@
"Thirty thousand viewers" That can tell us a number of things, dipwad! Why do ding-a-lings, like you, always try to force their conclusions onto other people. I perceive that you know enough about the Bible to make you stupid. The landslide has begun, for sure, and people like are riding the crest of the wave. For your information, Jesus, himself, was a Calvinist.
That is not Scripture Back to [SOUND] The Bible tells us that after a Time of sound doctrine we will get falls teachers [] From 1500 the main stream was Calvinist [ Rather Reformed] it is in the last time that these catholic heresies are coming back biblical doctrine! 2 Timothy 4:3- For the time will come when people WILL NOT PUT UP WITH SOUND DOCTRINE. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. 4 They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths. like Jerry Walls and Flowers and Kevin Thomson. You can recognize them on their twisting Scripture.
Your doctrine is the same as that of the Catholic pope church with a minor difference.
Catholic = Men has a freewill
Catholic = Salvation by good works yours: “Salvation by a good decision”
Catholic = You can lose your salvation Yours You can lose your salvation.
Catholic = Denies total depravity yours Denies total depravity.
Catholic = Conditional Redemption Your Conditional redemption.
Catholic = Christ died for all humanity Yours Christ died for all Humanity
Marius VanWoerden Reformed Theology is just modified Roman Catholicism. For the past 500 years the false Gospel of calvinism has been misleading and misdirecting people. This is both wicked and sad.
@@LindsayJackel You did not read what I wrote your doctrine is total Roman Catholic in all its facets. The American Great Awakening was a reformed puritans movement and the doing of the Lord. Millions came to accept Christ our Lord as there Savior. Claiming that that was the work of satan is crossing a dangerous line. As Calvinist [I rather say Reformed,] we do not follow a man Calvin was just a small part of the reformation.
You cannot find the amount of hateful videos from Calvinist like the Arminius followers post on RUclips.
Edwards's earliest writings brought together John Locke and Isaac Newton in a defense of a religious metaphysics. Later, after a career as a practicing clergyman who led the ‘Great Awakening’, Edwards developed a Calvinist theology founded on the covenant of grace whose center was the experience of an omnipotent God. His views were most significantly spelled out in Religious Affections (1746) and Freedom of the Will (1754).
JONATHAN EDWARDS ON THE SOVEREIGNTY OF GOD (CALVINISM)
"The Sovereignty of God is the stumbling block on which thousands fall and perish; and if we go contending with God about His sovereignty it will be our eternal ruin. It is absolutely necessary that we should submit to God as an absolute sovereign, and the sovereign of our souls; as one who may have mercy on whom He will have mercy and harden whom He will" (Jonathan Edwards).
The quote above, by Jonathan Edwards, is excerpted from Arminiunism: Another Gospel -
Jonathan Edwards
Most historians consider Jonathan Edwards, a Northampton Anglican minister, one of the chief fathers of the Great Awakening.
Edwards’ message centered around the ideas that humans were sinners, God was an angry judge and individuals needed to ask for forgiveness. He also preached justification by faith alone.
In 1741, Edwards gave an emotional sermon, entitled “Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God.” No-one in the church had dry eyes. It was not the gifted preacher because Edwards read most of the sermon. It was a strong conviction of the Holy Spirit. News of the message spread quickly throughout the colonies.
Edwards was known for his passion. He generally preached in his home parish, unlike other revival preachers who traveled throughout the colonies.
Edwards is credited for inspiring hundreds of conversions, which he documented in a book, Narratives of Surprising Conversions.
George Whitefield
George Whitefield, a minister from Britain, had a significant impact during the Great Awakening. Whitefield toured the colonies up and down the Atlantic coast, preaching his message. In one year, Whitefield covered 5,000 miles in America and preached more than 350 times.
Martin Luther said this Gospel of “grace alone” will be for a moment but soon attacked by the Devil. We see so much hate against the sovereignty of God. ruclips.net/video/aY5raL-atDg/видео.html&lc=z222jvaydob5xhv2pacdp431jt2zsvsa2pel0umfvblw03c010c.1555844769254116
THIS IS HOW CALVIN PREACHED THE GOSPEL
FREE OFFER OF THE GOSPEL (Calvin's Wisdom p119-120)
He calls all men to himself, without a single exception, and gives Christ to all, that we may be illumined by him. When we pray, we ought, according to the rule of charity, to include all. God invites all indiscriminately to salvation through the Gospel, BUT THE INGRATITUDE OF THE WORLD IS THE REASON why this grace, which is equally offered to all, is enjoyed by few.
Other than the result of men’s refusal. Calvin never preached Double predestination as you can see and put the responsibility by men. I say PREACHED!! Not doctrinal
@@MariusVanWoerden Wow! Talk about attempting to bury someone in verbiage. I stand by what I wrote and reject your response. Reform theology is erroneous and wicked. Quoting them to me means nothing. The reformers didn't transform, but rather created a new sect of Roman Catholicism. Hence similar errors like paedobaptism, priesthood required to dispense communion, order of salvation, a deterministic god, etc. Jerry Walls does well to expose the proud and hateful heart of calvinism and reformed theology and its adherents. God is love.
You don't understand sovereignty. A sovereign rules, he doesn't control and dictate everything. Especially a loving ruler such as God. Of course God is omnipotent and by Him all things consist.
BTW just because someone is not calvinist does not make them Arminian. I am neither. So please don't make assumptions and bring Arminianism into things.
You slandered Arminians by mischaracterising them as nasty and argumentative. I think that's a projection of your calvinist heart and actions. Calvinists are up there with atheists as some of the most proud, rude, argumentative and dismissive people on the internet.
Yet. Not a single scripture used in this over an hour rant. I find that odd.
I just googled "anti-Calvinist Bible verses" and came up with at least fifty. But I'll give you one of my favorites right here. At Mark 10:17 Jesus is asked by a rich young man, "What must I do to be saved?" Jesus doesn't tell him, "Nothing. Just live till you die, and if you open your eyes in Hell, oh well..." No, Jesus ticked off several items in the Decalogue, and then finally told the man to give away all his possessions and follow Him, which seem to me to be some rather specific actions to secure salvation. If Calvinism were true, this would have been the perfect moment for Jesus to have told him about it.
Notice how he is talking about what other people say rather than the Bible. Isn't the Bible our standard?
The Bible certainly is our standard. At the end of his lecture, Jerry said he has a RUclips series that dives into Scripture that you can look up. It's called, "What's wrong with Calvinism" and it's split into 6 parts. The first three parts are what this lecture was about.
that is what I have observed..when I watched the Amazing grace video also on youtube...about understanding calvinism...the author uses scriptures verse by verse..context by context ...the reason why I have accepted this doctrine after 28 yrs...whereas this one is base only upon human logic..upon his own assumptions
Caleb....If he merely quoted what others have said, and those "others" supposedly base their belief on the Bible, where is the problem?
Your question is begging the question. It's a logical fallacy. It implies that he does not base his positions on Scripture because this video deals with what Calvinists have said and basic logic. It is a break in basic reasoning skills to make the implication. But you're not alone. At least 9 others thought you had a good question.
The nature of truth is that it agrees with itself; you don't get to rank sources.
To Calvinists:
2 Cor. 4:4 talks about Satan blinding the minds of unbelievers so they will not see the light of the Gospel. Why would Satan need to blind those who are spiritually blind already? Is this a double blinding?
Why would God command all men to repent (Acts 17:30) if they can't unless God aids them by granting regeneration?
Why is there not one bible verse that explicitly states that regeneration precedes faith?
If God tells us that his nature is that he cannot lie, then why would it appear he has a revealed will in Scripture (all can come: Jesus will draw all men to Himself; whosoever believes) but He has this secret will that only the elect can come?
how would have responded Spurgeon to this guy argument?
you need a few centuries and more than a litte chat to prove calvinism wrong.
It takes five minutes to disprove- a lot longer to persuade people
@@josephchapman9575 When you have a false view of who God is and His character, you can "disprove" just about anything in the Bible.
Most Calvinists don't believe all can be saved or could be saved.
This is Calvinism.
“Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;”
Titus 3:5 KJV
It is according to His mercy.
If you are going to prove Calvinism, then you need to cite a verse that is not consistent with all of the views.
@@jimmyray5524 That passage seems to be consistent with both views
@@jimmyray5524 Thank you for your reply. I appreciate you disagreeing with me in an agreeable fashion. Allow me to be a bit slow/lenthened in my reply so that you can understand me and I can understand your position perfectly clearly. Also, I read the passage in esv and King James, and neither one seems inconsistent with Arminianism as far as I can tell.
Firstly, it seems to me that I have no point yet to prove as far as I am aware. I simply said "That passage seems to be consistent with both views", and it is simply the nature of the idea of "consistency" that we consider two ideas to be consistent unless or until we have a good reason to say that they are not. Therefore, since you brought up the passage as proof against Arminianism, the burden of proof remains solidly in your court.
"Mans free will and choice is not there!"
I am going to ask you to clarify what you mean by this. If you mean mans free will and choice is not explicitly taught there, then I agree. Yet, if you are going to use the absence of an explicit mention of this doctrine within the passage in question, then you also must reject Total Depravity since that is also not mention in the passage in question.
However, it is more likely that you meant that man's free will and choice is not possible given the passage. Yet, here still, I must ask you to further clarify. Do you mean all men or only some men (since the passage only mentions the man of God's council). One could take this as proof that the free will of only the believers is extinguished.
So what does this verse say (without going beyond the meaning of the text). It simply says that if God ordains for one of His followers to come from the far country, then it will come to pass. Notice what the passage does not say. It does not say every man, it merely talks about the one who executes His council. It does not say God always ordains where the man will go. It does not say God ordains everything the man does. And even for the man for whom God did ordain to come from the far country, the passage does not say the man cannot make other types of choices (such as when to come, what route to take, what supplies to bring, who to bring with him, what mood to have along the way, etc). Now maybe God determines some or all of these other choices too, but the passage does not address the issue.
@@jimmyray5524 Thanks sfor checking in. This seems to be a youtube issue. I did indeed reply to your comment "I disagree my friend. I believe the verse only supports Calvinism!". If you did not get my response, then let me know and I can repost it. On the other hand, if you did reply to my comment, then I did not get that reply, and you will have to repost it.
@@jimmyray5524 Alright, here is my reply reposted
Thank you for your reply. I appreciate you disagreeing with me in an agreeable fashion. Allow me to be a bit slow/lenthened in my reply so that you can understand me and I can understand your position perfectly clearly. Also, I read the passage in esv and King James, and neither one seems inconsistent with Arminianism as far as I can tell.
Firstly, it seems to me that I have no point yet to prove as far as I am aware. I simply said "That passage seems to be consistent with both views", and it is simply the nature of the idea of "consistency" that we consider two ideas to be consistent unless or until we have a good reason to say that they are not. Therefore, since you brought up the passage as proof against Arminianism, the burden of proof remains solidly in your court.
"Mans free will and choice is not there!"
I am going to ask you to clarify what you mean by this. If you mean mans free will and choice is not explicitly taught there, then I agree. Yet, if you are going to use the absence of an explicit mention of this doctrine within the passage in question, then you also must reject Total Depravity since that is also not mention in the passage in question.
However, it is more likely that you meant that man's free will and choice is not possible given the passage. Yet, here still, I must ask you to further clarify. Do you mean all men or only some men (since the passage only mentions the man of God's council). One could take this as proof that the free will of only the believers is extinguished.
So what does this verse say (without going beyond the meaning of the text). It simply says that if God ordains for one of His followers to come from the far country, then it will come to pass. Notice what the passage does not say. It does not say every man, it merely talks about the one who executes His council. It does not say God always ordains where the man will go. It does not say God ordains everything the man does. And even for the man for whom God did ordain to come from the far country, the passage does not say the man cannot make other types of choices (such as when to come, what route to take, what supplies to bring, who to bring with him, what mood to have along the way, etc). Now maybe God determines some or all of these other choices too, but the passage does not address the issue.
What about those who have never heard the general call, Jerry? Missionaries are unnecessary?
Jerry Walls has a generally accurate understanding of what we Calvinists believe. However, I wish he would attempt to make his points from scripture rather than human reason.
As though Calvinists don't attempt to make their points from reason?
monolith94 Good point! Some Calvinists do defend their theology based on reason. It's not always wrong to do so. What I really want to emphasize, however, is that the Bible should be our ultimate authority. In the end, the test of a theology's truthfulness is whether or not it matches up to the full council of God's Word.
Really? The Bible is the ultimate authority? Over God? Over Jesus? Over the Holy Spirit?
monolith94 Since the canon is closed, and the charismatic gifts have ceased the Bible is our ultimate authority on this side of glory. If God did choose to intervene, or reveal himself again through prophets or apostles as cults like Pentecostalism and Mormonism claim, then perhaps it would be different. Contrary to what some would say, the Bible is totally sufficient. As 2 Timothy 3:16 says: All scripture is breathed out by God, profitable for teaching, correction, and training in righteousness." Anything that diverges from what is written in Scripture is false. As Paul so strongly writes in Galatians 1:8: But even if we or angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we have preached, let him be accused!" I can't go much further then that. If you deny the absolute authority of the Bible, then we can't carry on a discussion.
Let us grant that the Bible has absolute authority. If that were the case, how is it possible that Christianity can be schismatic? Are heretics reading a weird, different Bible? (well, maybe the Gnostics were). The majority of schismatics break from the Church because of their reading of the Bible. The fault lies not in the Bible, but in their reading of it. So, we must read the Bible in a way that is profitable, correct, and trains us in righteousness. After all, we all know that the devil can quote Bible passages. The scripture may be the breath of God, but the scripture says that God is love, so the only reliable method of interpretation, or reading, of scripture is through a vision of love. Love is the Cross we must take up in order to understand the world, the scripture, ourselves. Love brings us together, and by exalting scripture over God, the ultimate authority, you take God from being a trinity and construct a different God, a God of four pieces. In the spirit of this message, I say, go in peace, and may love be a part of every part of you, from your toes to your forehead and into your soul, as I hope that love can enter my own.
The most important thing about a person is what comes to mind when they think about who God really is...to understand truth you must know God's unchanging attributes. Study God's attributes and you'll find the answers to your questions.
That’s right. Sovereignty is no attribute, but status. Love, mercy, grace, justice, righteousness are attributes.
Calvinism violates God’s character by limiting his attributes.
Jesus to Nicodemus: "You must be born again"
Nicodemus: "HOW CAN THIS BE????"
Clearly, Nicodemus understood what Jesus was saying: Salvation is a MIRACLE, wrought by God in a person's heart, and not a simple "decision".
If it was a simple decision, man can boast, but verse after verse shows we cannot boast in any way n our salvation. Praise the Lord.
Not a Calvinist, but the Bible is clear that God doesn't love every human being who has ever lived equally. God himself literally said, "Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated."
A lot of these arguments can be used by universalists or atheists. "Oh, so God loves everyone? Why did he flood the world? Why did he genocide the cananites? Why did he torment the Egyptions? Why doesn't he bring everyone to heaven? Sounds like God picked Israelites as a favourite in the OT." etc. etc. Maybe God is God and can do with His creation what He wills.
Calvinism is a theology; it is not the Bible in and of itself. Calvinists use intellectual and philosophical tools (logic, reasoning, grammar, syntax, arguments, illustrations, and more) to interpret the Bible and arrive at their beliefs. For example, 2 Peter 3:9 says that God is "not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance." Yet according to Calvinism, God in eternity past decided not to save some (perhaps most) of these very ones that He does not will to perish. The clear Word of God does not settle the issue because Calvinists attempt to use philosophical tools to somehow interpret the Bible so that God can will to save all and at the same time will not to save all of humanity. So it is necessary to point out the flawed thinking behind Calvinism so that all can see how their flawed thought processes lead them to flawed conclusions when they interpret the Bible. Calvinist and non-Calvinist Evangelicals read and love the same Bible and yet come to very different theological conclusions. So the question is not just Biblical, it is theological and philosophical as well and we must understand these theological and philosophical differences to understand both sides of this issue.
Jerry's book "Why I am not a Calvinist" contains the Biblical reasons against Calvinism. If you truly do want to see the Biblical side of this issue, then get the book and read it.
If you truly do want to see the Biblical side of this issue, get the holy Word of God, not jerry's book of interpretations
bob polo agreed, also, that verse as well as other main ones commonly used against "Calvinism" are taken out of context and fail under real exegetical examination. Read 'The Potter's Freedom' by Dr James White. Why hold to a miss use of scripture to prove a doctrine?
Too bad any Calvinist is so attached to their Calvinist title and views that they’ll never hear the truth in what you’re saying. Guess they’re predestined by God to not hear your truth? 🤣
Stay away from calvinism.
Stay away from fanaticism of men.
Follow Jesus, become a Christian.
Interesting. I think that suggesting that God can't be love because He sends some people to Hell is a problem for the Arminian and the Calvinist. The question should probably be "why doesn't he send everyone to hell", since we all deserve it.
He should, but he doesn't want to. The Bible says his desire is not the death of sinners, but rather their repentence. He appears to want creatures who understand both good and evil and chooses good.
I wonder if anyone who has listened to Jerry Wall's talks or read his books have bothered to read Calvin? I have read an abridged edition of Calvin's Institutes. They are a marvellous clear, bible-based Christ-honouring work. I remain unconvinced by Jerry Walls because of Scripture but respect his position.
If you want to unravel the calvinist elegant ly, you better do it with the main authority, the bible itself, unless you embarrass yourself.
I listened for 10 minutes. All I heard was someone hollering. There was not one audible word in that 10 minutes.
Every wicked person is good enough to save himself by pulling himself up by his own bootstraps. Right Jerry? Sounds Pelagian to me.
If someone gives a homeless person food, its not the homeless person who made his own food. He was given that food. But he can choose to not eat the food. We have free wil mate. Calvinism doesnt understand this.
@@kehanvanvuuren7718 If God foreknows that you will go to hell, is it possible that you will not go there?
@@kehanvanvuuren7718 If you have free will, why do you choose to sin?
I can't understand for the life of me why Calvinism is still a thing, since all you have to do is google "anti-Calvinist Bible verses" and you'll get scores of them. I'll give you one of my favorites right here. At Mark 10:17 Jesus is asked by a rich young man, "What must I do to be saved?" Jesus doesn't tell him, "Nothing. Just live till you die, and if you open your eyes in Hell, umm, don't blame me..." No, Jesus ticked off several items in the Decalogue, and then finally told the man to give away all his possessions and follow Him, which seem to me to be some rather specific actions to secure salvation. If Calvinism were true, this would have been the perfect moment for Jesus to have told him that no actions on his part could save him, for the matter was already decided. However, this is not what Christ said. Can any Calvinists out there give me an interpretation of this passage that saves your doctrine?
And they were greatly astonished, saying among themselves, “Who then can be saved?” But Jesus looked at them and said, “With men it is impossible, but not with God; for with God all things are possible.”
Mark 10:26-27 there is your answer
Calvinism implies that God is the cause of evil which is blasphemy. I am in an area where there are a lot of Calvinists and one thing I have noticed is that they are obviously prideful.
God is the First Cause of all that is... rapist murders have their being through Him... all things that were created were created by Him...
In His wisdom, God authored EVIL, AMEN.
I appreciate that Jerry gives a pretty fair presentation of the Calvinist position.
Having noted that, at 57:00, he says, “Now I believe God can do anything he wants to do, but there’s some things God can’t want to do.” The Calvinist claims nothing more for human beings. What Jerry’s statement suggests is that God has freedom of the compatibilist sort (he can do anything he wants, but can’t want to do some things, because of his nature), whereas he believes that people have (what Jerry would consider real) libertarian freedom? Are we "more free" than God?
Counterfactuals of divine freedom are different from those of creatively freedom. God cannot do evil, yet humans can, so in order for a Calvinist to frame issues this way, then they must be fully deterministic and incapable of resolving Mackie’s problem of evil
What you need to understand is that God gave man DOMINION over earth. Once you understand that you are on the right path
The more I hear the points of Calvinism, the more I come to see how ridiculous they are.
Your will is just the act of your mind choosing. Do you think that your will is untethered from your mind??? In that case, it wouldn't even be YOU choosing, but rather a separate entity -- a different mind.
let me tell you why I reject his very sad doctrine of Total Depravity :
The reformed concept of Total Depravity means that all of mankind is evil and sinful to his very core so that every inclination of his heart is always evil all the time (see Genesis 6:5). "Total" means utterly, complete, 100%, a term you would describe to Satan, not to us, created in the image of God :-
(who so hated the world he despatched his demons to lead all gullible Christians to damnation, thinking there was nothing they had to than pompously declare, "I am saved."
REBUTTAL: But if man has been created in God’s image and not the devil, and God has freewill, then man must at least has been granted moral responsibility even though his heart is inclined towards evil. Logic and common sense demands God can exercise his Will anyway he chooses. If he asks us to freely love Him then granting us freewill is a necessary prerequisite.
A moral and just God who wants to judge us according to our deeds Matthew 16:27, could only do so if we are held accountable for our actions. Ergo, God must create us with a conscience to choose good over evil. Turn on the news and that become abundantly clear. Even atheists have an innate sense of what is good and just, right and wrong. That's why we see atheists giving time and resources to humanitarian causes (like hurricane relief.) If man was 100% evil, we wouldn't see this. I believe we are indeed sinful, just not totally depraved.
U - Unconditional Election
This doctrine asserts that even before the creation of the world, God had already chosen who would go to heaven and who would go to hell. So it completely takes man out of the equation and negates any free will.
And it teaches that the only people that respond to witnessing are those who are already chosen by God. Only we do not know who is chosen and who isn't so we must witness to everyone just in case and then see if they are one of the elect.
God doesn't play games and this would be one big very immoral game...it would be God saying "go preach the good news to everyone, but only I know who is saved and who isn't but you don't, so go try and see who accepts Me and then I will tell you if you were wasting your time or not.”
It isn't in line with the gospel message of "all who call upon the Lord will be saved." I know all the work arounds on this, but it is adding to scripture to say that the "all" who call upon the Lord are only the elect as they are the only one's who will call upon the Lord. The Gospel is free and available to everyone. Read it with discernment.
For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through Him.
Here we dont have God judging, which calvanists say he did when he elected some and dammed the many or most before judgement day when christ comes the second time.So God did not just choose some elect and dam all the rest.That would be a terrible judgement as calvin even called it.
Didn’t see him give any scriptural proof for libertarian freedom ??
That is because there can't be any Scriptural proof for libertarian freedom.
@@TheBereanVoice agreed. God bless these folks
It’s all over the Bible!
We are commanded to repent and believe!
““The time has come,” he said. “The kingdom of God has come near. Repent and believe the good news!””
Mark 1:15 NIV
“Through love and faithfulness sin is atoned for; through the fear of the Lord evil is avoided.”
Proverbs 16:6 NIV
“Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.”
Acts 2:38 NIV
“Or do you show contempt for the riches of his kindness, forbearance and patience, not realizing that God’s kindness is intended to lead you to repentance?”
Romans 2:4 NIV
Just a very small sample. These verses clearly indicate volitional choice. Why else would they be issued as commands?
It all comes down to free-will-Best explained in the clearest book on this topic!-"Where Calvinism goes wrong!"
I think it all comes down to Gods character.
@@AlanaL3 amen 💗 and Satan does nothing but slander God’s character. God is a God of love and His will is for everyone to be saved 💗
@@SillyChickens222 If He WILLS it, then why isn’t everyone saved? If He wills something, it gets done. It can’t be stopped.
@@florida8953when God says he abhors the murder of innocent babies, he means it. He is not making what he abhors happen. Your thinking said all things that are, are because of God's will, but things that are clearly against God's will (as presented in Scripture) continue to happen. Your God is the embodiment of God and evil combined. You're syncretistic, as if God were a yin yang.
@@florida8953 Is He obligated to save everyone no questions asked?