Mike is honestly a brave man. He's made videos politely critiquing Sulek, Cbum and Mike Mentzer in the last few months. The amount of fanboys who hate him must have peaked by now
@@stevend481 That won't stop them from getting angry at him lol. I 'debated' a HIT bro recently and he couldn't fathom how someone could train without copying their favourite Bodybuilders routine- in his case obviously Mentzer. I don't give a shit about any of them and just try to train optimally personally. But that's the type of kid you're dealing with. No independent thought, they look up to these guys like they're gods and copy everything they do
@@silverhost9782 you definately need to change the training every few months because you get wear and tear on tendons snd joints At a certain point you just get so strong that even with perfect technqiue squatting heavy every 5 or 7 days gets to you. Lee hainey for example.simply used pre exchaustion so he didnt have to suquat 500 but just 315
Said during him doing seated single arm lat pull downs lol. Fitness industry dudes are always farming off other content creator or big names. Hardly an original thought in the bunch. Then again Sam Sulek has brought something refreshing, not farming bullshit content.
"The original machine had a base-plate of prefabulated aluminite, surmounted by a malleable logarithmic casing in such a way that the two main spurving bearings were in a direct line with the pentametric fan."
I first started lifting weights in high school when I played football. Our strength coaches always told us the negative is as important as the lift, and to maintain control throughout the process.
I love this explanation so many people at the gym want to do it fast hard and loud...they don't take their time and think...I've seen so many injuries that can be avoided
When a lot of people that don't understand Mike's advice reach 10 plus years of training (a very low percentage of people) or 40 plus years of age they'll understand by the hard way the meaning of his words. It's a fact that people who train don't last too long, because they do not understand what sustainability is. There is a thing out there called health guys.
Sam has acknowledged he's seen the research recently showing the importance of the stretched position for hypertrophy. Be interesting to see how his training changes.
Tru mike even said he trained the same was Sam did at that age so once he ages and the natural ego starts to shrink he'll probably start training more and more like mike. Look at cbums oldest training kids compared to now. A similar transition happened.
The importance of the stretched position only applies to certain muscle groups. Not all muscles have the internal leverage to be active (as per neuromechanical matching), or have the operating sarcomere length to experience passive tension (which is necessary for sarcomerogenesis (I.e. stretch mediated hypertrophy)) If you want more details, lmk
@@Zombies8MyPizza Sounds good, and sorry in advance for the long paragraphs. So regarding muscles not all having the internal leverage to be active in stretched positions, the lats are a great example of this. So, the lats have best leverage (I.e. longest moment arm and thus ability to produce torque) from 90 degrees and down, particularly around 45 degrees. Above that 90 degrees (i.e. the lats getting more stretched), the lat’s moment arm decreases (and as per neuromechanical matching, which states that motor unit recruitment will be allocated to muscles that have the most leverage in that position, the lats won’t be activated as much (eventually, at all) in those higher degrees of humeral elevation, but rather it is the pecs and triceps’ long head. All of this example is also shown in EMG data with DB pullovers) Regarding operating sarcomere lengths, and requirements for a muscle to experience passive tension, a good graphic of this is the length-tension relationship. Passive tension is when a sarcomere stretches past its resting length, causing an elastic-like protein (called titin) to be stretched, which kickstarts a mechanism called sarcomerogenesis (which is a type of hypertrophy that adds sarcomeres in a longitudinal sequence. Note that this is also why stretch mediated hypertrophy is only an adaptation for the first few months of lifting because by adding sarcomeres in series, the resting sarcomere length gets shorter). This passive tension can only be experienced by sarcomeres that are of a length that reaches the descending limb of the length-tension relationship graph (because titin is already more stretched in those long sarcomere lengths), so, because muscles have different resting sarcomere lengths, different muscles may or may not experience stretch mediated hypertrophy. With all of this taken into account, what the guy is saying in this video about getting a “good stretch,” is a bit too broad/misleading b/c not all muscles benefit from that (but rather, it is just extra Ca2+ related fatigue).
Guys like this were the first to bring me to the gym but all of them had jacked up shoulders and backs so I was quick to hit the interwebs to see if there was a better way. 12 years later I’ve been relatively injury free and I’m bigger than most of those guys.
@@ChicagoScorpion in some cases they don’t at all, in others they have had to take breaks or have had to decrease intensity and volume. They trained like bros back then and Idk if they ever improved their approach. The were soldiers and all went separate ways so all I have to judge is photos on social media
He has a published article for hypertrophy, i've read it as a doctor and its pretty well done. He is talking about perfect types of workouts that show demonstrated results. Ofc consistency is above anything else. But in a perfect universe where you have consistency, adequate rest etc, slow excentric with a pause at deep stretch and faster concentric showed the best results in muscle hypertrophy. Edit: people can hate on him as long as they want, he is still right this is how hypertrophy works
@@Pearmesan for hypertrophy is doing sets in a controlled fashion with the relaxing part longer than the contraction with a small pause at deep stretch. But you need 1. Diet 2. Rest 3. Consistency 4.Training. I recommend adding cardio days the same or more than fitness days for general health. Having big muscles and not being able to run more than 5 km at a decent pace is not proportionate. It s a very complex topic with many answers and possibilities depending on your goals
@@simionpaul3935 building muscle mass and calisthenics because i'm on the light side and could be bigger but I don't wanna just be strong but not athletic yk
@@Pearmesan small caloric surplus (250-500kcal/day) with adequate protein intake. If you are doing calisthenics means you have a good understanding how exercises work in general and changing to a 1 second pause at deep stretch won t do much. To grow is more dependent on diet and rest and to not overtrain rather than how you perform the exercises.
The ratio of stimulus to fatigue is the key take away of this. It's the classic mistake of feeling like you haven't worked hard enough if didn't completely systemically fatigue yourself even though all that extra exertion doesn't really contribute to muscle growth it just satisfies you psychologically.
Man this comment is extremely relatable for me. I'm addicted to feeling dead after workouts. I don't plan on changing so the trade off is adding more rest days.
Right. I struggle with this myself, the difference is I don’t go to the gym to get bigger per se, I mean I love it and it’s great, but I go to the gym so I don’t rip my hair out during the day and am able to sleep at night. I guess I better chill out and just up my cardio. Maybe I’ll start doing the stair master instead of incline treadmill, stairs kick my ass.
@@MrLardobuttI’m a retired pro basketball player. When I stopped playing I ballooned. Battle ropes helped me get cardio and a pump in a fun way. Don’t discredit things you don’t like. Battle ropes are a great tool.
Love that he acknowledges Sam’s style is a lot of him being young and strong and gives a more appropriate approach to trading after and not dissing rather acknowledging
@@Baronnaxyup, strained his manhood through an aggressive, some might say violent, masturbation technique will watching other jacked guys pumping iron.
I enjoy watching Sam Suleks videos, other than utilizing partials and legitimate failure, I wouldn’t follow anything else that he does. Just because I like watching his videos doesn’t mean I’ll agree with everything he does or defend it
@@trev6664 not that the way he trains is necessarily wrong, what he does works for him but for me since I’m sort of a beginner I focus more on form not just throwing weight around.
I used to be pretty fit, nothing like this, but I didn’t follow good advice, got injured multiple times, and really didn’t back in the saddle till recently. I never fully stopped, but I haven’t been in my peak shape in about 10yrs Finally getting back there boys!
I'm having to relearn my training style at 35, going all out heavy every session and the amount of injuries/overuse injuries accrued/stockpiling is atrocious, I wish I could keep training as is but I'm really going to have to start lightening the loads and slowing down... Not many lifts can I give all out max exertion anymore without drawback, I keep saying I'm going to switch things up but then when I'm there and get fired up it's hard to contain not pushing. Oh well, I'll figure it out, if age and time didn't happen to me I'd def be on the side of going all out as heavy as possible indefinitely! In other words, I see why folks like Dr.Mike switched from just training purely for strength output to more of a bodybuilding style contraction/stretch focused approach. I used to think bodybuilding was stupid, but really it has just been me who's stupid for thinking I was going to reap much from strength training other than a broken body over the years hahaha. Oh well, there's always room to learn/change/improve I mean, lifting at your maximum capacity is a rush like no other, but I still want to be able to train for years to come and not just become so beat up that I can't even function.
@@larrycera9276 Doesn't seem to be the panacea it once was... a lot of folks include it in low dose long term for systemic relief but it also has some not so pleasant neurological impact. On the plus side, it pushes my chronic patellar tendonitis back enough to allow for heavier squats without as much pain, the negative is... def a bit more lethargic, depressive, sleep longer (def noticeable too), so there's some trade offs but I def wouldn't write nandrolone off. Just I can tell the difference with vs without. Funny that it can cause what it does neurologically because it also ups the cns stimulation and allows you to max exert much more. So I like how I feel mentally without it, but physically am better with it performance and functionality wise.
@@unclemoneymoneyuncle8702 yes I’ve never had such issues, but have always used a touch more test and most recently (as in the last times I used it) have used dbol with it the times I did it. I actually found the combination made me feel better as far as sense of well-being and positive mindset overall. I suspect this is more to do with d bol, which effects me more positively than the average, although I don’t have the water gains and such either. I always suspected most of the issues come from long-term and/or high dosages. I actually found so little bloat with the combo that I’ve cut with them and had great results. It’s amazing the variation seen from person to person. Out of curiosity, have you tried peptides that get so many crazy claims on this subject? Btw, my initial comment was a joke, but the fact that you are actually experienced with my prescriptive recommendation is all the better 😂
I’m no trainer - just a guy, but these tips I’ve noticed actually help - I took the leap and have been working out 5-6 days a week staking my claim - extended the rep just a touch further makes ALL the difference and my results almost felt like they sped up
Thank you so so so much Mike!! Your advice has made my growth double I would say. The controlling and slowing of movements has made my mind and muscle connection significantly increase.
Thank you, sir. I've been lifting for over 30 yrs, and from day one, I've always concentrated on form first , I never was concerned about the weight I was lifting, and made sure I fully stretched each muscle during reps, strength definitely came and 38 yrs later I am still lifting like I was still in my 20& 30's, I have never received an injury bodybuilding related. People need to understand this is a lifestyle for a lot of us not just a hobby to look good on the beach. I'm 56 and stay pretty shredded year round without dieting, I maintain a bodyweight of 240 lbs year round, I'm 6 ft ,29" waist, 52 " chest and 19" arms, I've only done roughly ten 12 week cycles in my entire life, I am on a TRT program now using 200mg test cyp per week. This new generation of kids need to learn that with hard work, consistency and a lifestyle of eating well you won't need PED's. And most importantly you MUST have a personal relationship with Christ, make time each and every day to give praise and thanksgiving to the God that created and died on a cross for you
Honestly hes not really wrong, a lot of people look at huge guys lifting huge weights and take a lot of inpsiration Im glad, at least someone is trying to keep the herd straight on a good path. trust me I love sam, hes awesome and down to earth its all textbook compliments over here, but im glad someone is helping other newer people learn the right and not just right but safe way to lift.
Most of Sulek's fans have been training for 3 years max. They defend him as if he were the last superhero and even copy his training methods. I'm not saying that Sulek is wrong about everything but he is not the best example to follow.
Sam is pretty chill, most of his fans i think he actually wouldn’t get along with very well. A portion of his fan base are the natural progression of the zyzz bros we saw 1-2 years back, but now they can bench their bodyweight 😂
@@sawkmicoc4287Most Sulek fans are former Zyzz and Chris Bumstead fans, and probably former Mike Mentzer fans. They just follow whatever is trendy at the time.
I’ve been training for over 20 years. Suleks methods are sound, you’re obviously a nothing clown. You would feel shame if you had any humility… maybe you’ll be better at some point.
People dont understand that people on steroids can literally do anything and they will grow. Sam trains like that because hes on roids. If youre natural, dont train like sam. You will not get bigger. And youre just going to get hurt.
I hope you realize training on steroids and just normally training is pretty normal It’s absolutely the same training and everything. All that steroids does is just boost your muscle growth.
Love it! I see people working out like this all the time and when I say anything about slowing it down a bit on the eccentrics, they don’t wanna listen
I really like how Mike constructivly criticizes, says what he likes, a techneque that may work better and some of the risk vs rewards of whover he is critiquing. All while polite, respectfully and intellectually explaining each point.
@@ludvig3242 he is, though if you compare them to a person that’s actually on steroids his body is natural, natural muscle growth his muscles are in the actual spots they’re supposed to be not just one big glob and you can look at pictures from when he started working out and his progress. His progress didn’t snap all of a sudden he’s big it took him at least 10 years to get this big.
I've seen kids copying his squat technique at the gym and it's cringe. I despise 98percent of online fitness influencers. Drives me nuts seeing these idiots
@@jaku8513 Bruh dont compare Sam to Tom Platz. Tom Platz preached good technique even if you only use the bar. Tom would never tell you to egolift like Sam XD
squatting with heels in a plate is a great variation for quads. Also imagine being old and paying so much attention to what kids do at the gym lmao focus on your own shit and let the kids have fun
I love doing single arm lat pull-downs exactly how he’s describing them here - I go slow and really emphasise that deep stretch at the top before exploding into the next two then slowing down the eccentric again; feels super awesome and the mind muscle connection is amazing
Sam's lifting is not good formwise. His range of mostion is crap, his control of the weight is crap. I like him, but I wouldnt ever watch him lift and emulate his lifting.
@SCW_Fitness ... I can't say that I agree. 1- I don't like the look of that kind of bulk. 2- I don't think he's considering the longterm ramifications of his sloppy technique.
@@smashleyscott8272 objectively he’s built a lot of muscle so his results are great. Maybe so good that you personally don’t like the end result but that doesn’t make the results bad or not impressive. We will have to see the long term ramifications for sure. He’s quite intuitive so I have faith he will adapt as and when needed
@SCW_Fitness ... You must be used to saying stupid things. I don't particularly care if you think I'm "jealous". I've done more athletically than this guy in my 48 years without road assistance ever will. All he does is work out. Take away the free time, the youth, the roids... would he still look like a muscly eater baloon?? AND, It's really not a look that I dig on men or women anyway. He looks like he struggles to wipe his ass. Aside from that, his form will ruin his body unless he fixes it.
Well everything you said is true, the first part about it being fun is the key. Motivation is the number one factor in consistency, and Sam's results speak for themselves.
I used to hate this community with how much they tried to say they could fight and shit, but this dude is very reasonable and makes great sense when talking form and technique.
You are 100% right. We're not young forever and it's better to train rather than ego lift. We want to keep our joints happy for as many years as possible.. Father time doesn't fuck around...
This is very good advice. I didnt follow this rule when i started and have a permanent shoulder injury now. Makes it much harder to train and impossible to make the same kind of gains i was making.
As I approach 40 I focus more and more on what I’m doing and what the muscles are doing while I’m doing it. Often means weights I could technically “move”, I can’t move in the most effective way. I’d dropped nearly everything down, but I’m moving it much more controlled and “better” and seeing, and more importantly feeling the results. Love ya Mike. You’re my main advice guy these days.
Did the slow controlled reps for years and stopped short of failure. Made some gains but not much. Changed to Sam’s protocol and gained what seems like inches on my lats within a couple months.
I do like listening to what this dude has to say. Because while I do failure sets at the gym, integrating alot of the dicentric and eccentric elements and movements is a great way to burn out the muscles completely and besides, everybody including bodybuilders have some food on the table to eat from as far as advice or training tips goes. But this dude makes great points. And yes I do like sam sulek alot, but other people have good points too
This honestly was a really great take. It makes complete sense and I’ve been in both situations before. And I’d definitely agree I’d much rather control the weight because it gave me a more stimulated set without being grossly fatigued after pushing weight like crazy. I just focused on my breathing, moving the weight slow and uniform and it always worked nicely.
Boss, I appreciate your video here, as I'm a first time viewer in your realm. And though I appreciate your approach to this lesson, your subtitle does sam an injustice. He has actually covered this exact topic that you're bringing up in some of his videos before. I think where the most room to critique lays is his daily approach and how he does/doesn't explain his approach for the day. (He does this well, but not always does he explain why the difference on said day) Stay safe! Much love. Also, I'd love to see more of your stuff, so I'll subscribe.
What I did find was that a few sessions of doing these Sam- style, super heavy lat pulldowns, did enable me to jump up several weight increments for my regular struct reps . Far more than I found possible before.
When you're young, it's the way. When you get older, you can't do that shit no more. If i do something slightly wrong these days I feel it, sometimes weeks.
I think Sam is doing great I don’t watch him but pushing till failure keeping it going and not tryna be perfect he’ll see results he knows it’s about the effort and time he puts in that builds his muscle
The issue with any hate to this is people think this is mike saying it's useless. He is all about optimal technique for the results you want the fastest and most effective way. Training like sam will possibly get you big. But you'll hurt yourself, and 100% cause issues in the future, you'll gain strength faster than size (size will come with steroids at the same pace, as shown by sam), and most people just think if you gain strength, you will gain size faster than hypertrophy. Which is just wrong. The issue with that is so many people relate hypertrophy training (slow eccentric, 'lighter' weight, perfect form with partial reps in the lengthened position, etc) with those weak people who train at 30% of their effort. Those people are training worse than sam for hypertrophy. The people who train for hypertrophy more than strength are people like jay cutler, if you watch any of his training videos, you can see him being focused and deliberate with lighter weight than he can move.
As I near 40, I am constantly injured at the gym. My body has just finished recovering from tricep tendonitis, or damn near close to it and I have had to drop weight like crazy so I can still work out without aggravating the injury more. But slow, steady and controlled with less weight is absolutely a great way to build muscle as opposed to just throwing up my max.
been binging your videos for about a week, one thing I've taken away is that going with lighter weight in order to utilize a full range of movement and proper form is more beneficial than just "ego lifting"
47 and I’m glad I never touched steroids or anything like that. I’m small as shit but I’m healthy (knock on wood) , working out 4-5 times a week and my body is still holding up pretty well. I might not of burnt very bright but I’ll be glowing for decades to come.🤞
As a newbie/lamen gym goer I don't know as much about bodybuilding as either of these two but something I've heard Sam say I hadn't by anyone else is that he said stop early or don't train with pain. He talked about all the guys who just mindlessly push through even when they feel discomfort that isn't just muacle burn. The wrecked shoulders that never recover properly that could have been easily avoided when stopping when you feel that firsr pull that's off but happened because they ignored that warning sign and wanted to hammer out that set.
This touches on something I try to instill in people who ask for advice, but that 95% of people in the gym absolutely do not get. If at any point you're relying on momentum to freely move the weight, you're not maximizing your time in the gym.
I’ve mastered ration of stimulus to injury probability, it’s by doing a total number of reps without pushing yourself in set. Doing 3 sets of 20 curls will leave you way more sore and at risk for injury than doing 60 curls through 6 sets of 10 for example. And the pump is very comparable. Also doesn’t have to be 10 reps a set, could be 3
I agree with the early sentiment. When i was in my early 20s, doing lots of experimental workouts and reps lead to insane results with little pain. You don't appreciate form until every little mess up adds up too fast.
Mike knows whats up. I could lift however I wanted age 19 a year into training, but theres no free lunch, those injuries start plaguing your lifting as the years roll on. Do it smart from day 1 is my #1 bit of advice.
Agreed You learn by mistakes. Too. And when you are young you can get away with some mistakes. But if you get injured, when you are young. You will have to carry that i injury for the rest of your life. When you are young train with different, older partners. They will show you,the way. Than you can free fall by yourself. But first you have to get there Respect
I got hit with some autoimmune flares in my early adulthood that rocked my world. Lost tons of weight/all my gains each time, but they also made my joints weaker. I think I had to adopt it prematurely relative to others, but “stimulus to injury probability ratio” is now the number one focus for me at 28.
Both small and big range of motion both have their benefits. Both train the muscle differently. To make the muscle grow, you have to stress it. And mix it up. Both of those movements are helpful in different ways.
Fact slow and controlled is key. Thats why they say slow and steady wins the race. Anybody can push weight fast now if you want to work on explosiveness activating your fast twitch fibers this is efficient but if you want to put on muscle low reps do it slowly squeeze and pause for 1-3 seconds
I think the people who workout for a living do both, keeping the weight moving consistently with little less range of motion gets a serious burn and pump, then do some sets where you stretch it. if you just go slow and stretch all the way out/lock out, your resting for a second in each rep.
I get that this is to help people watching these videos know what to do and what not to do but this Sam guy is massive and whatever he is doing in the gym is obviously exactly what works for him. I doubt the guy can get much bigger than he already is all gear aside
Dr Mike is 100% correct here if your goal is hyper optimization of your workout. But just remember some lifts are for hypertrophy and some lifts are for the soul. Nothing wrong with throwing around heavy weight just for the fun of it, just stay as safe as you can
I got hurt trying to be like Sam 😂 he’s right chill out and do what you can do 🤦🏾♂️ now I’m out for a month with a ripped abdomen from deadlifts 🤦🏾♂️ you guys be careful and healthy 💯
Mike is honestly a brave man. He's made videos politely critiquing Sulek, Cbum and Mike Mentzer in the last few months. The amount of fanboys who hate him must have peaked by now
Real.
I train like sam and i fully understand that it could be better BUT its just more fun that way for me.
Yeah but he does it politely and in an educational way. He's not really making fun of them
@@stevend481 That won't stop them from getting angry at him lol. I 'debated' a HIT bro recently and he couldn't fathom how someone could train without copying their favourite Bodybuilders routine- in his case obviously Mentzer. I don't give a shit about any of them and just try to train optimally personally. But that's the type of kid you're dealing with. No independent thought, they look up to these guys like they're gods and copy everything they do
@@ari_a2764 That's fair, having fun is a good reason to train a certain way for sure. As long as you keep safe and injury free of course
@@silverhost9782 you definately need to change the training every few months because you get wear and tear on tendons snd joints
At a certain point you just get so strong that even with perfect technqiue squatting heavy every 5 or 7 days gets to you.
Lee hainey for example.simply used pre exchaustion so he didnt have to suquat 500 but just 315
"Ratio of stimulus to injury probability". I like this term.
dr fyck face says a lot of crazy shyte
It's especially relevant if you are juiced up and have grown the muscle for a certain load, but not necessarily the tendons and ligaments.
@@carlpanzram7081yeah he just tweaked his bicep.
Said during him doing seated single arm lat pull downs lol. Fitness industry dudes are always farming off other content creator or big names. Hardly an original thought in the bunch. Then again Sam Sulek has brought something refreshing, not farming bullshit content.
I say this when making coitus
Guys voice is narration perfect. I could sit in a class all day and listen.
ik what you mean and it almost sounded like AI with the cadence it caught me off guard lol
he's actually a professor
"The original machine had a base-plate of prefabulated aluminite, surmounted by a malleable logarithmic casing in such a way that the two main spurving bearings were in a direct line with the pentametric fan."
Look up his Ted talk. P dang good.
I’ll whisper you through class if you want…….hissssssssss
I first started lifting weights in high school when I played football. Our strength coaches always told us the negative is as important as the lift, and to maintain control throughout the process.
Weird then why do former HS athletes always have the most trash form in my gym? 😂
@@nottheone582Most don’t listen to anybody lol. You were a 16 year old boy at one point , you do it the way you feel like it .
@@rafsimmzI feel it’s the opposite actually, they listen too much to old school washed coaches who have outdated and wrong knowledge of workouts
@@nottheone582do you think his coaches coached every player?
@@nottheone582cuz most coaches don’t teach the right things.
I love this explanation so many people at the gym want to do it fast hard and loud...they don't take their time and think...I've seen so many injuries that can be avoided
When a lot of people that don't understand Mike's advice reach 10 plus years of training (a very low percentage of people) or 40 plus years of age they'll understand by the hard way the meaning of his words. It's a fact that people who train don't last too long, because they do not understand what sustainability is. There is a thing out there called health guys.
Yeah it’s fine to horse the weights around until it’s not and you don’t know it’s not there until it’s not. 😅
In a persons 30s and beyond, one of the primary goals lifting is injuring prevention not one rep PRs. :)
@@ThePhysicalReaction you might want to get that testosterone checked… PRs are still being chased into your 40s
Yes and when health becomes a problem .. you gna wish u paid attention to ppl like mike !
Still horsing weight after a decade plus, closing in on a 800 lb deadlift natty. Albeit I train for strength not hypertrophy.
But if you lower the weight and use a more advantageous form, you don’t look as dope in the grams.
lol do it for the gram!
Exactly haha
You look better IMO. Rather than this half ROM, no control bs.
Whats imp? @@adammiller9179
You get a better pump the longer your stes last I find.
Sam has acknowledged he's seen the research recently showing the importance of the stretched position for hypertrophy. Be interesting to see how his training changes.
When he starts focusing on stretched position, all of his fanboys will start doing the same in their training 😂
Tru mike even said he trained the same was Sam did at that age so once he ages and the natural ego starts to shrink he'll probably start training more and more like mike.
Look at cbums oldest training kids compared to now. A similar transition happened.
The importance of the stretched position only applies to certain muscle groups.
Not all muscles have the internal leverage to be active (as per neuromechanical matching), or have the operating sarcomere length to experience passive tension (which is necessary for sarcomerogenesis (I.e. stretch mediated hypertrophy))
If you want more details, lmk
@@User1245.. It's a very interesting topic that I'd love to learn more about. Do share your thoughts if you feel like it 😊
@@Zombies8MyPizza
Sounds good, and sorry in advance for the long paragraphs.
So regarding muscles not all having the internal leverage to be active in stretched positions, the lats are a great example of this. So, the lats have best leverage (I.e. longest moment arm and thus ability to produce torque) from 90 degrees and down, particularly around 45 degrees. Above that 90 degrees (i.e. the lats getting more stretched), the lat’s moment arm decreases (and as per neuromechanical matching, which states that motor unit recruitment will be allocated to muscles that have the most leverage in that position, the lats won’t be activated as much (eventually, at all) in those higher degrees of humeral elevation, but rather it is the pecs and triceps’ long head. All of this example is also shown in EMG data with DB pullovers)
Regarding operating sarcomere lengths, and requirements for a muscle to experience passive tension, a good graphic of this is the length-tension relationship. Passive tension is when a sarcomere stretches past its resting length, causing an elastic-like protein (called titin) to be stretched, which kickstarts a mechanism called sarcomerogenesis (which is a type of hypertrophy that adds sarcomeres in a longitudinal sequence. Note that this is also why stretch mediated hypertrophy is only an adaptation for the first few months of lifting because by adding sarcomeres in series, the resting sarcomere length gets shorter). This passive tension can only be experienced by sarcomeres that are of a length that reaches the descending limb of the length-tension relationship graph (because titin is already more stretched in those long sarcomere lengths), so, because muscles have different resting sarcomere lengths, different muscles may or may not experience stretch mediated hypertrophy.
With all of this taken into account, what the guy is saying in this video about getting a “good stretch,” is a bit too broad/misleading b/c not all muscles benefit from that (but rather, it is just extra Ca2+ related fatigue).
Guys like this were the first to bring me to the gym but all of them had jacked up shoulders and backs so I was quick to hit the interwebs to see if there was a better way. 12 years later I’ve been relatively injury free and I’m bigger than most of those guys.
no you are not.....
@@Trennycakes And you know this how?
So I'm assuming the guys with fucked up shoulders and backs no longer train?
@@ChicagoScorpion in some cases they don’t at all, in others they have had to take breaks or have had to decrease intensity and volume. They trained like bros back then and Idk if they ever improved their approach. The were soldiers and all went separate ways so all I have to judge is photos on social media
Yeah right buddy. So you use peds to?😂
He has a published article for hypertrophy, i've read it as a doctor and its pretty well done. He is talking about perfect types of workouts that show demonstrated results. Ofc consistency is above anything else. But in a perfect universe where you have consistency, adequate rest etc, slow excentric with a pause at deep stretch and faster concentric showed the best results in muscle hypertrophy.
Edit: people can hate on him as long as they want, he is still right this is how hypertrophy works
can you help me understand what I’m supposed to do I don’t get it I just like while my muscles are shaking until I can’t anymore and then take a pause
@@Pearmesan for hypertrophy is doing sets in a controlled fashion with the relaxing part longer than the contraction with a small pause at deep stretch. But you need 1. Diet 2. Rest 3. Consistency 4.Training. I recommend adding cardio days the same or more than fitness days for general health. Having big muscles and not being able to run more than 5 km at a decent pace is not proportionate. It s a very complex topic with many answers and possibilities depending on your goals
@@simionpaul3935 building muscle mass and calisthenics because i'm on the light side and could be bigger but I don't wanna just be strong but not athletic yk
@@Pearmesan small caloric surplus (250-500kcal/day) with adequate protein intake. If you are doing calisthenics means you have a good understanding how exercises work in general and changing to a 1 second pause at deep stretch won t do much. To grow is more dependent on diet and rest and to not overtrain rather than how you perform the exercises.
@@simionpaul3935 is rhabdomyolysis a noteworthy concern
The ratio of stimulus to fatigue is the key take away of this. It's the classic mistake of feeling like you haven't worked hard enough if didn't completely systemically fatigue yourself even though all that extra exertion doesn't really contribute to muscle growth it just satisfies you psychologically.
yep, it's like people who think they're accomplishing something by "doing" battle ropes
Man this comment is extremely relatable for me. I'm addicted to feeling dead after workouts. I don't plan on changing so the trade off is adding more rest days.
Right. I struggle with this myself, the difference is I don’t go to the gym to get bigger per se, I mean I love it and it’s great, but I go to the gym so I don’t rip my hair out during the day and am able to sleep at night. I guess I better chill out and just up my cardio. Maybe I’ll start doing the stair master instead of incline treadmill, stairs kick my ass.
@@MrLardobuttI’m a retired pro basketball player. When I stopped playing I ballooned. Battle ropes helped me get cardio and a pump in a fun way. Don’t discredit things you don’t like. Battle ropes are a great tool.
I absolutely feel fatigued after the rep or set, but leave the gym itself feeling refreshed, so I know I'm on the right track.
i like how hes polite about it unlike others who just hate on sam for how he lifts
Love that he acknowledges Sam’s style is a lot of him being young and strong and gives a more appropriate approach to trading after and not dissing rather acknowledging
Thanks for being science based and teaching people
Always a fan of constructive criticism.. great video👍
This video aged like fine wine
Wait, what happened? Did Sam injure himself?
@@Baronnaxleaving this if someone answers
@@Baronnaxyup, strained his manhood through an aggressive, some might say violent, masturbation technique will watching other jacked guys pumping iron.
Lol the Sulek groupies behaving exactly as expected
And Dr mike Groupies behaving the exact same way
@@trev6664 hahahaha!
I enjoy watching Sam Suleks videos, other than utilizing partials and legitimate failure, I wouldn’t follow anything else that he does. Just because I like watching his videos doesn’t mean I’ll agree with everything he does or defend it
@@Dm12572 what does he do in his training that you think is so ineffective?
@@trev6664 not that the way he trains is necessarily wrong, what he does works for him but for me since I’m sort of a beginner I focus more on form not just throwing weight around.
I used to be pretty fit, nothing like this, but I didn’t follow good advice, got injured multiple times, and really didn’t back in the saddle till recently. I never fully stopped, but I haven’t been in my peak shape in about 10yrs
Finally getting back there boys!
Sam would probably agree
To be fair, he's just a steroid user so his thoughts don't really matter.
@@Lenexa1 what? Thats ridiculous
@@GodMaxDrinkerofTea no it's perfectly fair.
@@Lenexa1 elaborate
@@GodMaxDrinkerofTea do you think stupid people are worth listening to?
I'm having to relearn my training style at 35, going all out heavy every session and the amount of injuries/overuse injuries accrued/stockpiling is atrocious, I wish I could keep training as is but I'm really going to have to start lightening the loads and slowing down...
Not many lifts can I give all out max exertion anymore without drawback, I keep saying I'm going to switch things up but then when I'm there and get fired up it's hard to contain not pushing.
Oh well, I'll figure it out, if age and time didn't happen to me I'd def be on the side of going all out as heavy as possible indefinitely!
In other words, I see why folks like Dr.Mike switched from just training purely for strength output to more of a bodybuilding style contraction/stretch focused approach. I used to think bodybuilding was stupid, but really it has just been me who's stupid for thinking I was going to reap much from strength training other than a broken body over the years hahaha. Oh well, there's always room to learn/change/improve
I mean, lifting at your maximum capacity is a rush like no other, but I still want to be able to train for years to come and not just become so beat up that I can't even function.
@@larrycera9276 Doesn't seem to be the panacea it once was... a lot of folks include it in low dose long term for systemic relief but it also has some not so pleasant neurological impact. On the plus side, it pushes my chronic patellar tendonitis back enough to allow for heavier squats without as much pain, the negative is... def a bit more lethargic, depressive, sleep longer (def noticeable too), so there's some trade offs but I def wouldn't write nandrolone off. Just I can tell the difference with vs without. Funny that it can cause what it does neurologically because it also ups the cns stimulation and allows you to max exert much more. So I like how I feel mentally without it, but physically am better with it performance and functionality wise.
@@unclemoneymoneyuncle8702 yes I’ve never had such issues, but have always used a touch more test and most recently (as in the last times I used it) have used dbol with it the times I did it. I actually found the combination made me feel better as far as sense of well-being and positive mindset overall. I suspect this is more to do with d bol, which effects me more positively than the average, although I don’t have the water gains and such either.
I always suspected most of the issues come from long-term and/or high dosages. I actually found so little bloat with the combo that I’ve cut with them and had great results. It’s amazing the variation seen from person to person.
Out of curiosity, have you tried peptides that get so many crazy claims on this subject?
Btw, my initial comment was a joke, but the fact that you are actually experienced with my prescriptive recommendation is all the better 😂
@@larrycera9276 yeah raise your Alt and AST liver levels higher than a chronic alcoholic that's smart 😂
@@mor9n243 take a double dose of Tudca and man up mf’r 😂
Honestly a training video would be Hella cool. See how he handles strict work and controlled movement at high volume
I’m no trainer - just a guy, but these tips I’ve noticed actually help - I took the leap and have been working out 5-6 days a week staking my claim - extended the rep just a touch further makes ALL the difference and my results almost felt like they sped up
I love how you can see some improvement and mention it without bringing others down 🙏🏻 just started weight training I love your channel!
Mike "This is good, but *This* is better" Mentzer
= progress
Thank you so so so much Mike!! Your advice has made my growth double I would say. The controlling and slowing of movements has made my mind and muscle connection significantly increase.
Mid 40s with a completely different mindset than 30 and under. "milking it" is the proper term for me 😂
I do a mix of both. Ive liked Sam's training style but I've tweaked it other advice I've gotten like yours and that's been working the best for me.
Thank you, sir. I've been lifting for over 30 yrs, and from day one, I've always concentrated on form first , I never was concerned about the weight I was lifting, and made sure I fully stretched each muscle during reps, strength definitely came and 38 yrs later I am still lifting like I was still in my 20& 30's, I have never received an injury bodybuilding related. People need to understand this is a lifestyle for a lot of us not just a hobby to look good on the beach. I'm 56 and stay pretty shredded year round without dieting, I maintain a bodyweight of 240 lbs year round, I'm 6 ft ,29" waist, 52 " chest and 19" arms, I've only done roughly ten 12 week cycles in my entire life, I am on a TRT program now using 200mg test cyp per week. This new generation of kids need to learn that with hard work, consistency and a lifestyle of eating well you won't need PED's. And most importantly you MUST have a personal relationship with Christ, make time each and every day to give praise and thanksgiving to the God that created and died on a cross for you
Honestly hes not really wrong, a lot of people look at huge guys lifting huge weights and take a lot of inpsiration Im glad, at least someone is trying to keep the herd straight on a good path.
trust me I love sam, hes awesome and down to earth its all textbook compliments over here, but im glad someone is helping other newer people learn the right and not just right but safe way to lift.
Most of Sulek's fans have been training for 3 years max. They defend him as if he were the last superhero and even copy his training methods. I'm not saying that Sulek is wrong about everything but he is not the best example to follow.
Sam is pretty chill, most of his fans i think he actually wouldn’t get along with very well. A portion of his fan base are the natural progression of the zyzz bros we saw 1-2 years back, but now they can bench their bodyweight 😂
@@sawkmicoc4287bold of you to assume I can bench that much
@@sawkmicoc4287Most Sulek fans are former Zyzz and Chris Bumstead fans, and probably former Mike Mentzer fans. They just follow whatever is trendy at the time.
I think 3 years is very generous.
I’ve been training for over 20 years. Suleks methods are sound, you’re obviously a nothing clown. You would feel shame if you had any humility… maybe you’ll be better at some point.
People dont understand that people on steroids can literally do anything and they will grow. Sam trains like that because hes on roids. If youre natural, dont train like sam. You will not get bigger. And youre just going to get hurt.
You'll absolutely get bigger. Steroids or not doesn't matter, it's just not ideal. Did you not watch the video?
Dr Mike has videos on exactly this subject tldr, the rules for training on roids is pretty much the same, check them out!
I hope you realize training on steroids and just normally training is pretty normal It’s absolutely the same training and everything. All that steroids does is just boost your muscle growth.
If you lift heavy weights you’ll get stronger and grow muscle…
I do it all the time, no rush, feel the stretch, welcome the burn and never worry bout the little f-boys taking up the benchs
Love it! I see people working out like this all the time and when I say anything about slowing it down a bit on the eccentrics, they don’t wanna listen
I really like how Mike constructivly criticizes, says what he likes, a techneque that may work better and some of the risk vs rewards of whover he is critiquing. All while polite, respectfully and intellectually explaining each point.
Thought it was Sam Hyde
it is
Don't you feel silly?
@@Aurora-bv1ys Don't you feel... ashamed?
Sam is big and obviously very naturally strong. But that doesn't mean he knows how to properly train or teach others
He’s the opposite of natural 😂
@@ludvig3242 he is, though if you compare them to a person that’s actually on steroids his body is natural, natural muscle growth his muscles are in the actual spots they’re supposed to be not just one big glob and you can look at pictures from when he started working out and his progress. His progress didn’t snap all of a sudden he’s big it took him at least 10 years to get this big.
I've seen kids copying his squat technique at the gym and it's cringe. I despise 98percent of online fitness influencers. Drives me nuts seeing these idiots
Heels elevated platz style squat? What is wrong with that?
what's cringe about wanting more out of less weight and getting a bigger focus on the quads? are you an angry powerlifter or what
@@jaku8513 Bruh dont compare Sam to Tom Platz. Tom Platz preached good technique even if you only use the bar. Tom would never tell you to egolift like Sam XD
squatting with heels in a plate is a great variation for quads. Also imagine being old and paying so much attention to what kids do at the gym lmao focus on your own shit and let the kids have fun
@@Jan-ie6lcSams squat technique aint bad tbh, and both sam and platz ego lift on certain excercises (see tom platz doing baby reps for hamstrings)
the insight this gives me for my workout makes me cry with 0% injury is really amazing info
I love doing single arm lat pull-downs exactly how he’s describing them here - I go slow and really emphasise that deep stretch at the top before exploding into the next two then slowing down the eccentric again; feels super awesome and the mind muscle connection is amazing
Sam's lifting is not good formwise. His range of mostion is crap, his control of the weight is crap. I like him, but I wouldnt ever watch him lift and emulate his lifting.
His results are fantastic though
@SCW_Fitness ... I can't say that I agree. 1- I don't like the look of that kind of bulk. 2- I don't think he's considering the longterm ramifications of his sloppy technique.
@@smashleyscott8272 objectively he’s built a lot of muscle so his results are great. Maybe so good that you personally don’t like the end result but that doesn’t make the results bad or not impressive.
We will have to see the long term ramifications for sure. He’s quite intuitive so I have faith he will adapt as and when needed
@SCW_Fitness ... You must be used to saying stupid things. I don't particularly care if you think I'm "jealous". I've done more athletically than this guy in my 48 years without road assistance ever will. All he does is work out. Take away the free time, the youth, the roids... would he still look like a muscly eater baloon??
AND, It's really not a look that I dig on men or women anyway. He looks like he struggles to wipe his ass. Aside from that, his form will ruin his body unless he fixes it.
@@smashleyscott8272you're old and jealous
I always do my workouts very slowly and deliberate, it's always felt more effective and you've confirmed it. Thank you 👍
Well everything you said is true, the first part about it being fun is the key.
Motivation is the number one factor in consistency, and Sam's results speak for themselves.
I would say this dude is the best commentator of muscle building correctly and most importantly efficiently on the net
I used to hate this community with how much they tried to say they could fight and shit, but this dude is very reasonable and makes great sense when talking form and technique.
facts. so glad you’re calling it out.
You are 100% right. We're not young forever and it's better to train rather than ego lift. We want to keep our joints happy for as many years as possible.. Father time doesn't fuck around...
Love how he puts his point without bossing on what people should or shouldnt do
Omg I'm a Lil newbie and I'm so glad I'm doing it right, slow and controlling the weight with a hold. I listen to Mike and Jeff Nippard a ton.
This is very good advice. I didnt follow this rule when i started and have a permanent shoulder injury now. Makes it much harder to train and impossible to make the same kind of gains i was making.
Ive worked out how Mike explains and I’m jacked. It’s awesome to have the discipline to control the weight. And having that TOT is a must.
As I approach 40 I focus more and more on what I’m doing and what the muscles are doing while I’m doing it. Often means weights I could technically “move”, I can’t move in the most effective way. I’d dropped nearly everything down, but I’m moving it much more controlled and “better” and seeing, and more importantly feeling the results. Love ya Mike. You’re my main advice guy these days.
Did the slow controlled reps for years and stopped short of failure. Made some gains but not much. Changed to Sam’s protocol and gained what seems like inches on my lats within a couple months.
I've been doing exactly Dr Mike's rep cadences for every movement, and it works extremely well.
I do like listening to what this dude has to say. Because while I do failure sets at the gym, integrating alot of the dicentric and eccentric elements and movements is a great way to burn out the muscles completely and besides, everybody including bodybuilders have some food on the table to eat from as far as advice or training tips goes. But this dude makes great points. And yes I do like sam sulek alot, but other people have good points too
This honestly was a really great take. It makes complete sense and I’ve been in both situations before. And I’d definitely agree I’d much rather control the weight because it gave me a more stimulated set without being grossly fatigued after pushing weight like crazy. I just focused on my breathing, moving the weight slow and uniform and it always worked nicely.
Boss, I appreciate your video here, as I'm a first time viewer in your realm.
And though I appreciate your approach to this lesson, your subtitle does sam an injustice.
He has actually covered this exact topic that you're bringing up in some of his videos before.
I think where the most room to critique lays is his daily approach and how he does/doesn't explain his approach for the day. (He does this well, but not always does he explain why the difference on said day)
Stay safe! Much love. Also, I'd love to see more of your stuff, so I'll subscribe.
Everything this guy is saying is on point.Slow and controlled as a thousand times better than just slamming weight
I’m just learning about slow and controlled eccentrics and it’s revolutionized my workouts
He is so freaking jacked!!!Why you care of the way he is treating??You have the truth and everybody should follow…
He is jacked because he's blasting gear and because he has top tier genetics, not because of his "magic" training methods.
What I did find was that a few sessions of doing these Sam- style, super heavy lat pulldowns, did enable me to jump up several weight increments for my regular struct reps . Far more than I found possible before.
I may not fully understand what you explained but since your an expert I will definitely try your method
I do those lat pull downs like that every time now. LOVE THEM
When you're young, it's the way. When you get older, you can't do that shit no more. If i do something slightly wrong these days I feel it, sometimes weeks.
I think Sam is doing great I don’t watch him but pushing till failure keeping it going and not tryna be perfect he’ll see results he knows it’s about the effort and time he puts in that builds his muscle
He’s giving advice and critiquing so politely it’s great
Perfectly well said about ali
Eccentric and concentric contraction while being explosive
I admire your methods. You’re amazing my guy!!
The issue with any hate to this is people think this is mike saying it's useless. He is all about optimal technique for the results you want the fastest and most effective way. Training like sam will possibly get you big. But you'll hurt yourself, and 100% cause issues in the future, you'll gain strength faster than size (size will come with steroids at the same pace, as shown by sam), and most people just think if you gain strength, you will gain size faster than hypertrophy. Which is just wrong. The issue with that is so many people relate hypertrophy training (slow eccentric, 'lighter' weight, perfect form with partial reps in the lengthened position, etc) with those weak people who train at 30% of their effort. Those people are training worse than sam for hypertrophy. The people who train for hypertrophy more than strength are people like jay cutler, if you watch any of his training videos, you can see him being focused and deliberate with lighter weight than he can move.
Having ego lifted myself to an injury and losing 3 months of training and all my progress, I recommend being safe and controlled over lifting big.
Colloquially. Going to try to insert that into a conversation this week. Thank you.
Sam has been changing his tune lately. He's maturing.
As I near 40, I am constantly injured at the gym. My body has just finished recovering from tricep tendonitis, or damn near close to it and I have had to drop weight like crazy so I can still work out without aggravating the injury more. But slow, steady and controlled with less weight is absolutely a great way to build muscle as opposed to just throwing up my max.
been binging your videos for about a week, one thing I've taken away is that going with lighter weight in order to utilize a full range of movement and proper form is more beneficial than just "ego lifting"
47 and I’m glad I never touched steroids or anything like that. I’m small as shit but I’m healthy (knock on wood) , working out 4-5 times a week and my body is still holding up pretty well. I might not of burnt very bright but I’ll be glowing for decades to come.🤞
Dr. Mike is refreshing to hear
As a newbie/lamen gym goer I don't know as much about bodybuilding as either of these two but something I've heard Sam say I hadn't by anyone else is that he said stop early or don't train with pain.
He talked about all the guys who just mindlessly push through even when they feel discomfort that isn't just muacle burn. The wrecked shoulders that never recover properly that could have been easily avoided when stopping when you feel that firsr pull that's off but happened because they ignored that warning sign and wanted to hammer out that set.
love having controlled lifts you explained it perfectly
This touches on something I try to instill in people who ask for advice, but that 95% of people in the gym absolutely do not get. If at any point you're relying on momentum to freely move the weight, you're not maximizing your time in the gym.
I’ve mastered ration of stimulus to injury probability, it’s by doing a total number of reps without pushing yourself in set. Doing 3 sets of 20 curls will leave you way more sore and at risk for injury than doing 60 curls through 6 sets of 10 for example. And the pump is very comparable. Also doesn’t have to be 10 reps a set, could be 3
I agree with the early sentiment. When i was in my early 20s, doing lots of experimental workouts and reps lead to insane results with little pain. You don't appreciate form until every little mess up adds up too fast.
Are you telling me I'm doing it right? Thank fuck for PTs who know what they are doing, love my PT at the moment what a legend for guiding me properly
This is good content.
Polite critiques with good intentions
Good mix of seriousness and light heartedness
Hopefully crazed fanboys can take it
It was something about when he said "let your lats really tear apart at the top!"... i got shivers!!!
Mike knows whats up. I could lift however I wanted age 19 a year into training, but theres no free lunch, those injuries start plaguing your lifting as the years roll on. Do it smart from day 1 is my #1 bit of advice.
Agreed
You learn by mistakes.
Too.
And when you are young you can get away with some mistakes.
But if you get injured, when you are young.
You will have to carry that i injury for the rest of your life.
When you are young train with different, older partners.
They will show you,the way.
Than you can free fall by yourself.
But first you have to get there
Respect
Finally! Im glad someones said it on record..
I got hit with some autoimmune flares in my early adulthood that rocked my world. Lost tons of weight/all my gains each time, but they also made my joints weaker. I think I had to adopt it prematurely relative to others, but “stimulus to injury probability ratio” is now the number one focus for me at 28.
That was a very kind critique.
Both small and big range of motion both have their benefits. Both train the muscle differently. To make the muscle grow, you have to stress it. And mix it up. Both of those movements are helpful in different ways.
Fact slow and controlled is key. Thats why they say slow and steady wins the race. Anybody can push weight fast now if you want to work on explosiveness activating your fast twitch fibers this is efficient but if you want to put on muscle low reps do it slowly squeeze and pause for 1-3 seconds
I like how Mike can be respectful and s
I think the people who workout for a living do both, keeping the weight moving consistently with little less range of motion gets a serious burn and pump, then do some sets where you stretch it. if you just go slow and stretch all the way out/lock out, your resting for a second in each rep.
I get that this is to help people watching these videos know what to do and what not to do but this Sam guy is massive and whatever he is doing in the gym is obviously exactly what works for him. I doubt the guy can get much bigger than he already is all gear aside
I didn't gain muscle, but definitely gained knowledge with that word "colloquially".
Dr Mike is 100% correct here if your goal is hyper optimization of your workout. But just remember some lifts are for hypertrophy and some lifts are for the soul. Nothing wrong with throwing around heavy weight just for the fun of it, just stay as safe as you can
I got hurt trying to be like Sam 😂 he’s right chill out and do what you can do 🤦🏾♂️ now I’m out for a month with a ripped abdomen from deadlifts 🤦🏾♂️ you guys be careful and healthy 💯
The stretch is what people seem to forget.💪
this is the perfect critique. You don’t discredit Sam, in fact explain why he lifts the way he does, and provide tips for a better alternative.
I hope more people pay attention to this guy's advice.
After all it's resistance for a reason, you need to also resist when putting them down, don't slam the weights use that to really get a good pump