I agree on everything being said in this video. Also on the Natah quest, Lotus mentioned how as Natah she had wanted children but as a sentient she is unable to reproduce. But as Lotus she is a mother and her children is the tenno.
This is a very well-research video that has swayed my opinion. I've been in the boat since the Sacrifice - the boat that most of the community is on - that for the entire game Natah was using us, knowingly. But now I see I have overlooked several important - and obvious - pieces of information, each deeper than the last.
The gameplay mecanic point goes even further. It's not just they would have to re-record all the dialogues, but also the entire mission system. Why would we, tenno, continue to do what Lotus asked us to do for someone else, and who could be able to do what she did ? (they clearly said that railjack will be an addition, there will still be the warframe "we know" and that new complication) Ballas is not a liar in the Chimera prologue, to me he's just as broken as we are. He realized he just lost forever her love, because natah was under lotus-skin all the time. I really think he's just emotionnally broken, he realized all the suffering he caused and how he got manipulated by the sentients.
im over a year late but heres another point: when ballas said that it was natah the whole time, I think he is referring to how she was her old self and this new personality of the lotus took hold of her mind and maybe ever since she has been fighting an internal battle, natah trying to take hold, but the lotus remained in control
I started playing Warframe after losing a close friend, then I took a break when Lotus became Natah. I came back after a friend of mine commited suicide. Lotus as a character really feels close to how much I want my friends and family back. I hope she comes back to us. I hope we can save her.
Love it! Feels like a lot of folks are just forgetting the base of lore established and how much they hated Ballas (quite rightfully).... The text of each quest is misaligned with the framing of it intentionally in most cases in warframe because they like that ambiguous uncomfortable narrative place
You definitely changed my 2nd view of The Lotus. At first I felt heart broken about losing someone who cared for us through most of the game, but eventually I chose the belief that most people were on. So thank you for reminding us about that stuff, a lot of us forgot about this. Don’t forget that Erros (Or Erris) said that Natah was having lapses, so this definitely means that the lotus was real, why would she be having lapses if Natah’s consciousness was part of the lotus?
I made an unholy happy screech at work when I saw this on my feed. Dark Souls and Warframe are my two fave series/games in terms of lore. Thank-you SmoughTown!! 8D
Interesting theory. New information suggests that you were at least partially correct. Natah mentions that her 'light' was altered. I suspect Natah infiltrated, but then got caught and reprogrammed by Balas into the Lotus. The question remains though; why did Balas let Lotus convince the Tenno to murder the Orokin? He survived and almost certainly knew what the Lotus was doing, so is it safe to assume that Balas planned to be the last of the Orokin?
Sorry for the late reply! I think this is heavily implied so. He had planned his betrayal to the Orokin, and the Dax that we now know as Umbra found out. That is why Umbra was turned into Umbra, the tortured warframe we know today. Ballas was bitter and angry at the fact that they killed Margulis and the fact that he at the time was subservient and allowed that to happen to his love.
Orokin Technology allows memories to be downloaded into objects such as Ayatans or to prolong their life as Cephelons. This making it fairly simple to imply that the Helmet has memories of the true Lotus, Margolis. The "Lotus" who left us in The Sacrifice is a Sentient Mimic capable of transforming into anything who was linked to the helmet who has Margolis' memories downloaded into it, allowing the Natah take her form, Margolis' form along with all of her love and protective nature towards the Tenno she held dear before her assumed execution by the orokin empire. The real Lotus has been with you, on your orbiter the whole time, Margelis is there by your side in your private room, floating on the pedestal. What has left is nothing more than a sentient puppet, now fixed but bares memories un which it will use as a weapon upon the tenno, to allow the Sentient to eradicate them, kill Natah, not only do you save the Origin System, you save all Tenno from being wiped out of existence.
SmoughTown, just now you have saved Lotus' neck from my blade, if possible i will try and spring her from the sentients and i will see what happens from there
So having only just done this quest I think there is several ways they could play it out, the first is have her been the bad guy all along, I don’t like this one as her past actions don’t fit with it, if she wanted us dead she had the perfect chance with second dreams ending but she saves us only to turn bad guy a bit later? It dosnt fit, now her been brainwashed does fit with what we see happen, she gets hit with that flash of light and suddenly is willing to go with him and who knows what they did to her mind after they had her in their grasp, look what they did to Ballas and he was a willing collaborator, also her calling to us, it could be the man in the wall playing with us or it could be what’s left of her mind that’s trapped trying to reach us so we can try and save her.
This sounds exactly like Limmy explaining Warframe lore in a "you all have been thinking about this the wrong way" tone the whole time, with continuous points throughout...except without as thick an accent lmao
You should make another video but now with the new information from the Gas City Update. The speech from Alad V & Natah gives a new layer to the story! Please! ❤️
I agree. Even after the Ropa content. I think we need to save her, and let her make her own choice for once. She keeps getting forced to do stuff; A common theme throughout the entire game's lore.
Sentients Message: Natah, kill the Tenno. Natah: (Hesatates, looking at the young Tenno sleeping in its pod.) ruclips.net/video/WrHdQmJ8hbc/видео.html Lotus: No.
Ok man, I think you’ve done it. I’m going to try and give this game another shot, I read up a little on people wondering the same thing I have been(When it starts to get better) and though there were a few who said that it doesn’t most said that it’s once you get/make your main Warframe and once you get past Earth(something I’ve already done but stopped shortly after) something I didn’t know happens part of the story, I always assumed that any Frames you get would be due to you going out of your way to get one. I’ve also read that there’s missions that get better than what’s at the start though but not to expect a major difference between them. What’s a good questline to start up on? I’m near the end of the Once Awake quest line and thinking of doing the Archwing next since when I played it last time on PS4 I stopped right after finishing it. On your latest video you mentioned getting new powers, powers from the Void. What are these powers you get and is there a lot of cool new things you can do as you progress? All I’ve got are the 4 abilities and starter weapons and kind of assumed that’s all I’ll have unless I either go out of my way to get other things or pay for them. Lol every time I watch one of these I find myself expecting you to start talking about the Pontiff Sully.
So I played it for about 3h, that's the longest I've played it in a couple years. At first I enjoyed it but shortly after that I was getting tired of it's repetition lack of purpose with each mission(like the mobile defense, spying missions). Instead of stopping I tried role playing and found a way to make the missions seem relevant to the quest at hand and then I started to try and play it differently, instead of just running and gunning I did it with finesse and then it suddenly became much better. I really like how they added so many different ways to get around, enough to where you can master it with time - somewhat like how I view Devil May Cry's combat, there's more to it than it shows you and even after learning all the combos there's still more you can learn to master them. One of the biggest things that's dragging me in though is the Tenno, at first I believed they were just advanced machines and were drawing power like how most sci-fi machines do but now I'm thinking they're drawing power from something/somewhere else, somewhat like how those with the Outsider's Mark in Dishonored draw power from the Void I'm thinking the Tenno do the same which makes it so much more interesting for me and it's why your latest vid really raised my interest in it. I finished that last quest I was on and just opened the Earth-Mars Junction so I'm going to start on the Archwing next time I turn it on. Edit: Oh and something else, those mods are so much better than I thought, I had no clue you could combine the elements to make different types of damage. I wonder what other mechanics I'll find that I didn't know about before
Now a question. What if the hologram is not a hologram but the Lotus memories and personality that Natah backed up into her helmet before going with Ballas????
To anyone interested. In the newest DE stream they were talking about lotus and the fact that most of us know her longer as a holo than the real lotus. They haven't said much, but they were hinting that something is going to change in 2021
Natah was brainwashed by the Orokin. She actually believed that she cared for us, not now! The tenno are not weak, the tenno have weakened the other factions.
Based on the lore of The Sacrifice quest I wonder if Ballas secretly defected to the side of the sentients before Umbra was made because he was really pissed that The Seven sentenced his beloved Margulis to death. Perhaps he was a cool guy at some point given that someone like Margulis loved him and her death to the Jade Light kinda broke him. Umbra was originally a Dax so he would have sided with the empire no matter how much he'd have wished otherwise. So Ballas had to dispose of him and he went about it in such a sadistic way because of how his loss of Margulis affected him. He wanted that Dax to live forever like an Orokin, be unable to make any more moves against him, like a war frame, and be forever tormented by the memory of seeing someone he loves die, like Ballas himself.
Well as we can see with all of the New Wad snippets it appears that she is being manipulated and that at some point in the future she will return as Lotus. He “kin” seem to be hiding something from her or using her.
I personally believe hunhow did not personally hate the tenno but when it appeared that the tenno took his daughter away he started to hate them. At now point does he call them devils. All he wanted was to protect Natah, but there comes a point in which the parent must let the children chose their own path and if it makes them happy they should support them. This is possibly why i personally think Hunhow will either become an ally or even a part of a warframe.
By helping us to get Umbra, Lotus/Natah is basically beging us to help and save her because Umbra is, In Lore, the most powerful Frame of the game!!!!!!!!!!
A rational distrustful opinion over the Lotus, as I personally think, is she put a blade on her neck the moment she revealed herself as a Sentient. Once Ballas is confirmed to be dead for good and both the Mothership and Hunhow are vanquished, I'd be really tempted to go against the Lotus to remove the last "rogue element" and finally close the chapter on the Sentient.
I seriously don't understand why people think Natah was fooling us the whole time. It literally makes no sense at all, and all you have to do is look at what swayed her away from being the Lotus in the first place: Ballas. Why would Natah be swayed by Ballas to leave? It's clear that the Operator isn't noticed by Ballas or the Lotus in the Apostacy Prologue, so it's not like they're putting on this show and dance just to fuck with the player. It's clear that Margulis was swayed by Ballas, who of course is nothing but a puppet to Erra at that point unbeknownst to Margulis, and Erra then uses the opportunity to bring out Natah and/or suppress Margulis.
this gives an idea of how does lotus know umbra? I mean I know she teleported Lua into the void but, it just doesn't make any sense. we never see someone other than Ballas interact, mention, or even talk about umbra. And he obviously didn't participated in the old war... If he did then yeah, sure Natah can in fact run into umbra and know him and yes, He could have been put back into his prison on Lua when celebrating the victory along with the tenno, But if that's the case then why didn't the tenno found umbra when they scavenge the remaining orokin facilites after they're ambush? It just doesn't make any sense...
![BLACK BAG - Official Trailer [HD] - Only in Theaters March 14](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Du0Xp8WX_7I/mqdefault.jpg)
I agree on everything being said in this video. Also on the Natah quest, Lotus mentioned how as Natah she had wanted children but as a sentient she is unable to reproduce. But as Lotus she is a mother and her children is the tenno.
Crossing the void caused her to become barren.
This is the most logical explanation about lotus I've heard yet, especially the remarks made about the hologram of lotus. Love this video 10/10
That's very kind, appreciate the support! more videos coming soon.
This is a very well-research video that has swayed my opinion.
I've been in the boat since the Sacrifice - the boat that most of the community is on - that for the entire game Natah was using us, knowingly. But now I see I have overlooked several important - and obvious - pieces of information, each deeper than the last.
Glad you enjoyed it :) Yeah in fairness, that theory initially spread like wildfire!
& (in case you didn't see) Eris threw her against a wall demanding she "Finish the War."
The gameplay mecanic point goes even further. It's not just they would have to re-record all the dialogues, but also the entire mission system. Why would we, tenno, continue to do what Lotus asked us to do for someone else, and who could be able to do what she did ? (they clearly said that railjack will be an addition, there will still be the warframe "we know" and that new complication)
Ballas is not a liar in the Chimera prologue, to me he's just as broken as we are. He realized he just lost forever her love, because natah was under lotus-skin all the time. I really think he's just emotionnally broken, he realized all the suffering he caused and how he got manipulated by the sentients.
Remember,the Lotus is composed of Natah and Margulis.
While Natah is Natah.
Margulis is no part of the Lotus. In the Chains Of Harrow we can hear Palladino say that the Lotus was based on "the dreams of these divine children".
im over a year late but heres another point: when ballas said that it was natah the whole time, I think he is referring to how she was her old self and this new personality of the lotus took hold of her mind and maybe ever since she has been fighting an internal battle, natah trying to take hold, but the lotus remained in control
I started playing Warframe after losing a close friend, then I took a break when Lotus became Natah.
I came back after a friend of mine commited suicide. Lotus as a character really feels close to how much I want my friends and family back.
I hope she comes back to us. I hope we can save her.
Love it! Feels like a lot of folks are just forgetting the base of lore established and how much they hated Ballas (quite rightfully).... The text of each quest is misaligned with the framing of it intentionally in most cases in warframe because they like that ambiguous uncomfortable narrative place
After Natah gave us some new lore and history in the Ropalolyst fight, I'm curious how it changes, or if it changes, your thoughts on this.
You definitely changed my 2nd view of The Lotus. At first I felt heart broken about losing someone who cared for us through most of the game, but eventually I chose the belief that most people were on.
So thank you for reminding us about that stuff, a lot of us forgot about this. Don’t forget that Erros (Or Erris) said that Natah was having lapses, so this definitely means that the lotus was real, why would she be having lapses if Natah’s consciousness was part of the lotus?
I made an unholy happy screech at work when I saw this on my feed. Dark Souls and Warframe are my two fave series/games in terms of lore. Thank-you SmoughTown!! 8D
*Happy Excalibur Umbra howl*
Interesting theory. New information suggests that you were at least partially correct.
Natah mentions that her 'light' was altered. I suspect Natah infiltrated, but then got caught and reprogrammed by Balas into the Lotus.
The question remains though; why did Balas let Lotus convince the Tenno to murder the Orokin? He survived and almost certainly knew what the Lotus was doing, so is it safe to assume that Balas planned to be the last of the Orokin?
Sorry for the late reply! I think this is heavily implied so. He had planned his betrayal to the Orokin, and the Dax that we now know as Umbra found out. That is why Umbra was turned into Umbra, the tortured warframe we know today. Ballas was bitter and angry at the fact that they killed Margulis and the fact that he at the time was subservient and allowed that to happen to his love.
The game design point is quite convincing. It would be hard to rerecord everything all over again.
and also now with the erra quest, it is shown that natah tried to kill her brother erra, and we witnessed it
Teshin also said she is using us, so did vor and tyl regor it's not just ballas it's been said long before the sacrifice
Cus vor and tyl are trustworthy
Then why is Natah hesitant to finish the New War?
Teshin, the same being used by the grineer queens?????
Destroyer3604 she did end up betraying us
Tiago Patrício yep the same one that killed one of the queens
Orokin Technology allows memories to be downloaded into objects such as Ayatans or to prolong their life as Cephelons. This making it fairly simple to imply that the Helmet has memories of the true Lotus, Margolis. The "Lotus" who left us in The Sacrifice is a Sentient Mimic capable of transforming into anything who was linked to the helmet who has Margolis' memories downloaded into it, allowing the Natah take her form, Margolis' form along with all of her love and protective nature towards the Tenno she held dear before her assumed execution by the orokin empire.
The real Lotus has been with you, on your orbiter the whole time, Margelis is there by your side in your private room, floating on the pedestal. What has left is nothing more than a sentient puppet, now fixed but bares memories un which it will use as a weapon upon the tenno, to allow the Sentient to eradicate them, kill Natah, not only do you save the Origin System, you save all Tenno from being wiped out of existence.
I like this!!
Finally, someone who understands the lore and doesnt spill bs like she was evil all along.
How often can a child lose his mother before going insane? Maybe three times is the limit?
SmoughTown, just now you have saved Lotus' neck from my blade, if possible i will try and spring her from the sentients and i will see what happens from there
love the rp with this one
So having only just done this quest I think there is several ways they could play it out, the first is have her been the bad guy all along, I don’t like this one as her past actions don’t fit with it, if she wanted us dead she had the perfect chance with second dreams ending but she saves us only to turn bad guy a bit later? It dosnt fit, now her been brainwashed does fit with what we see happen, she gets hit with that flash of light and suddenly is willing to go with him and who knows what they did to her mind after they had her in their grasp, look what they did to Ballas and he was a willing collaborator, also her calling to us, it could be the man in the wall playing with us or it could be what’s left of her mind that’s trapped trying to reach us so we can try and save her.
This sounds exactly like Limmy explaining Warframe lore in a "you all have been thinking about this the wrong way" tone the whole time, with continuous points throughout...except without as thick an accent lmao
You should make another video but now with the new information from the Gas City Update. The speech from Alad V & Natah gives a new layer to the story! Please! ❤️
I agree. Even after the Ropa content. I think we need to save her, and let her make her own choice for once. She keeps getting forced to do stuff; A common theme throughout the entire game's lore.
Sentients Message: Natah, kill the Tenno.
Natah: (Hesatates, looking at the young Tenno sleeping in its pod.)
ruclips.net/video/WrHdQmJ8hbc/видео.html
Lotus: No.
Lotus: *It's not a phase mother!*
I did not expect this to be in me sub feed
:O Me neither
And then then Gas City rework happened
Cant wait to new war comes out, I'm ready to save space mom!
I mean the game already has fully recorded mission voice lines for Teshan.
Ok man, I think you’ve done it. I’m going to try and give this game another shot, I read up a little on people wondering the same thing I have been(When it starts to get better) and though there were a few who said that it doesn’t most said that it’s once you get/make your main Warframe and once you get past Earth(something I’ve already done but stopped shortly after) something I didn’t know happens part of the story, I always assumed that any Frames you get would be due to you going out of your way to get one. I’ve also read that there’s missions that get better than what’s at the start though but not to expect a major difference between them. What’s a good questline to start up on? I’m near the end of the Once Awake quest line and thinking of doing the Archwing next since when I played it last time on PS4 I stopped right after finishing it. On your latest video you mentioned getting new powers, powers from the Void. What are these powers you get and is there a lot of cool new things you can do as you progress? All I’ve got are the 4 abilities and starter weapons and kind of assumed that’s all I’ll have unless I either go out of my way to get other things or pay for them.
Lol every time I watch one of these I find myself expecting you to start talking about the Pontiff Sully.
So I played it for about 3h, that's the longest I've played it in a couple years. At first I enjoyed it but shortly after that I was getting tired of it's repetition lack of purpose with each mission(like the mobile defense, spying missions). Instead of stopping I tried role playing and found a way to make the missions seem relevant to the quest at hand and then I started to try and play it differently, instead of just running and gunning I did it with finesse and then it suddenly became much better. I really like how they added so many different ways to get around, enough to where you can master it with time - somewhat like how I view Devil May Cry's combat, there's more to it than it shows you and even after learning all the combos there's still more you can learn to master them.
One of the biggest things that's dragging me in though is the Tenno, at first I believed they were just advanced machines and were drawing power like how most sci-fi machines do but now I'm thinking they're drawing power from something/somewhere else, somewhat like how those with the Outsider's Mark in Dishonored draw power from the Void I'm thinking the Tenno do the same which makes it so much more interesting for me and it's why your latest vid really raised my interest in it. I finished that last quest I was on and just opened the Earth-Mars Junction so I'm going to start on the Archwing next time I turn it on.
Edit: Oh and something else, those mods are so much better than I thought, I had no clue you could combine the elements to make different types of damage. I wonder what other mechanics I'll find that I didn't know about before
This comment was surprisingly entertaining to read
Now a question. What if the hologram is not a hologram but the Lotus memories and personality that Natah backed up into her helmet before going with Ballas????
wtf am i supposed to do with all my misplaced hatred now
Vanilla Ice dude, vanilla Ice
@@elderfenris.7537 lmao
Kill
I CAN'T KILL HER ANYMORE ;U; SHE IS TORIEL
bruh, not wrong
To anyone interested. In the newest DE stream they were talking about lotus and the fact that most of us know her longer as a holo than the real lotus. They haven't said much, but they were hinting that something is going to change in 2021
Natah was brainwashed by the Orokin. She actually believed that she cared for us, not now!
The tenno are not weak, the tenno have weakened the other factions.
Based on the lore of The Sacrifice quest I wonder if Ballas secretly defected to the side of the sentients before Umbra was made because he was really pissed that The Seven sentenced his beloved Margulis to death. Perhaps he was a cool guy at some point given that someone like Margulis loved him and her death to the Jade Light kinda broke him. Umbra was originally a Dax so he would have sided with the empire no matter how much he'd have wished otherwise. So Ballas had to dispose of him and he went about it in such a sadistic way because of how his loss of Margulis affected him. He wanted that Dax to live forever like an Orokin, be unable to make any more moves against him, like a war frame, and be forever tormented by the memory of seeing someone he loves die, like Ballas himself.
I agree with you ❤️
No the lotus is a mimic from what I gathered.
I never thought there was a grand plan,I'm just pissed that she left us
Well as we can see with all of the New Wad snippets it appears that she is being manipulated and that at some point in the future she will return as Lotus. He “kin” seem to be hiding something from her or using her.
@@unknown_individual7050 she still chose to willingly leave us
I personally believe hunhow did not personally hate the tenno but when it appeared that the tenno took his daughter away he started to hate them. At now point does he call them devils. All he wanted was to protect Natah, but there comes a point in which the parent must let the children chose their own path and if it makes them happy they should support them. This is possibly why i personally think Hunhow will either become an ally or even a part of a warframe.
By helping us to get Umbra, Lotus/Natah is basically beging us to help and save her because Umbra is, In Lore, the most powerful Frame of the game!!!!!!!!!!
lol natah just say she was forced to care about us.
A rational distrustful opinion over the Lotus, as I personally think, is she put a blade on her neck the moment she revealed herself as a Sentient.
Once Ballas is confirmed to be dead for good and both the Mothership and Hunhow are vanquished, I'd be really tempted to go against the Lotus to remove the last "rogue element" and finally close the chapter on the Sentient.
I seriously don't understand why people think Natah was fooling us the whole time. It literally makes no sense at all, and all you have to do is look at what swayed her away from being the Lotus in the first place: Ballas. Why would Natah be swayed by Ballas to leave? It's clear that the Operator isn't noticed by Ballas or the Lotus in the Apostacy Prologue, so it's not like they're putting on this show and dance just to fuck with the player. It's clear that Margulis was swayed by Ballas, who of course is nothing but a puppet to Erra at that point unbeknownst to Margulis, and Erra then uses the opportunity to bring out Natah and/or suppress Margulis.
People better not talk shit about Lotus-Mama.
I hope you can do a lore video about the stalker?
He much be a 14 year old edgelord
if she is using the tenno why is she lying about who she really is hmmmm??
But why did she destroy umbra Excalibur
this gives an idea of how does lotus know umbra? I mean I know she teleported Lua into the void but, it just doesn't make any sense. we never see someone other than Ballas interact, mention, or even talk about umbra. And he obviously didn't participated in the old war... If he did then yeah, sure Natah can in fact run into umbra and know him and yes, He could have been put back into his prison on Lua when celebrating the victory along with the tenno, But if that's the case then why didn't the tenno found umbra when they scavenge the remaining orokin facilites after they're ambush? It just doesn't make any sense...
SmoughTown > Vaati
Too Kind :)
I miss the lotus..
Is this space grandma?
How do we know that she didn’t make him give us the sword in the first place she had eyes on ballis she could have made him give us the bp
W video.
Been to long
Indeed my friend
warframe gameplay is so boring, and today you made me realise the lore is just as boring
Do you want to have a bad time