I sometimes feel like the writers would not have included April in 2012 if April wasn't already iconic to TMNT lore. Somebody asked Ciro Nieli on a podcast (back when Season 1 was still airing) if they could add more female characters to the show. Nieli replied they had enough, even though the only 2 female characters in the show at the time were April and Karai. He had said this: "Any time a girl is on the show, they're usually too powerful. And it's just the nature of a girl. For some reason, I don't know what it is. I mean, this happened on Teen Titans. We had trouble limiting Starfire and Raven's powers. It happens with Wonder Woman. It happened on my Super Robot Monkey show with this character named Jinmay. It's just like... And I'm afraid... I've been fighting it with April with where we're going with her to not let her get too powerful. And it's hard. Sometimes guys are a lot cooler and easier to deal with in these cartoons. So, I mean, the fact that we have a good girl and a bad girl already, I think we're kind of maxed out a little bit." Edit: Woah, my comment is pinned! Thanks! Also, I'm glad 2012 added more female characters in eventually, but a lot of them feel shoehorned in. Almost all of them are love interests to the point their personalities don't really get to shine through like other characters do. Shinigami is cool, but she feels like she only exists so Karai doesn't look like a complete loner in Season 4. Alopex is the only female character I can think of (unless you count the Utroms, like Queen and Rook, or other aliens) who's not a love interest (although Raph does find her pretty), but she only gets 1 episode and is never mentioned again. In that same podcast, Ciro Nieli actually admitted that Greg Cipes (the voice of Mikey) kept asking him to give Mikey a girlfriend ("Cipes bugs me on a daily basis to get him a girlfriend on the show"), so I wouldn't be surprised if Renet or Shini were introduced simply so Mikey could have a gf. 2nd Edit: I guess it's unpinned now.
@howieedits9426 I feel like this quote should be the teaching example that making movies, cartoons, games is much harder than people think not just because of the budget or beefs with the publishing company.
@howieedits9426 just wanted to add to one of your thoughts. Yeah, I'm not too fond that almost all of 2012 girls were introduced mainly as love interests, but still when compared to 1987 and 2003 2012 girls at least got good writing and got to be much more than household wives. Or at least being written like a sane likeable person when it comes to comparing 2012 Karai with 2003 delusional one.
@@ashesGeek I don't mind how 2003 wrote women that much. 2003 Renet was funny, and Angel had a fun episode with Casey on escaping the Purple Dragons. Then there's Quarry, and Jhanna, who are also cool. Viral was an entertaining female villain too, and there were one-off female characters like the Montser Hunter lady who were enjoyable. None of them were housewives. While 2003 April was a love interest, she always felt like her own person and wasn't afraid to speak her mind. Her first episode with Casey has her calling him a misogynist because he keeps disrespecting her boundaries by calling her babe and assuming she's hiding in her dad's home until she gets a real job. She comes to like Casey because he grows as a person and wants to make her happy. I'd argue 2003 April and Casey have one of the best romances in the franchise. I know a lot of people don't like how 2003 Karai turned out, but I think it's interesting. She has clearly been brainwashed by him to the point she worships him, not unlike Pucci idolizes DIO in JoJo's Bizarre Adventure. Ch'rell basically forced the idea into her head that honor and loyalty are the same thing to the point it's driven her nuts. If she ever questions what he's doing, there's something wrong with her, not him. It reminds me of cults who will justify their leaders' actions, even if they have to make excuses or outright deny their evils. I think if they spent more time on her delusions, people would enjoy her more. I dislike her redemption in 2003, however. It was really rushed. And then TF tried to make her evil again, which sucked. Her romance with Chaplin was out of nowhere too, so I'll give you that. Edit: I haven't seen enough of 1987, so I can't really agree or disagree with you on that point.
@howieedits9426 I mean, I don't necessarily hate how 2003 series handled women except Karai and Renet, I actually think gals like Starlee and Joi are quite underrated, but they just never stood up as anything interesting like male characters: Usagi, Nobody, Cody, Bishop, Hun, Torbin Zixx. Sure, 2012 show could've toned out love interest game, but at the very least all gals were memorable, even Alopex. And I wouldn't mind Karai becoming a villain if she didn't know what Shredder was doing. She was actually quite likeable in "City at War" arc, but her character took a deep dive quality drop as the show went on. She had no business being angry at Turtles and trying to kill them. She's no means the worst Karai out there, but she's definitely the most annoying one. IDW comics did "truly villainous" Karai much better and more fun.
The things that April was able to get away with would not be the same treatment compared to Mikey. Instead he would be facing tons of criticism and backlash for his shenanigans especially coming from Ralph. Even thou his brothers and yes Ralph included adored and care about their baby brother. They would still be holding him accountable just for his safety. Which’s April lacks and desperate needed throughout the seasons.
Thank you! It's kinda annoying that despite Mikey's skills he still gets heavily criticized by his brothers for his mistakes, especially from Raph. but at least Mikey at times he knows he's a bit in over his head and tries to make a plan. April here just jumps in without thinking and puts herself and the turtles into danger, and yet she gets away without any criticism.
April telling Donnie, “Protect yourself” makes me feel bad for him; the. I get mad at him when he pushes Raph back to hug April. My response would be, “Your brother’s fine too, you know.” It can be obnoxious that Donnie favors April over his own brothers, especially Raphael. I mean, Raph has done more for Donnie than the other way around.
@@sheriharmidarow249 The pilot episode of Gravity Falls is "Tourist Trapped". Mabel was in love with a guy who Dipper thought was a zombie. She ignored his advice and found out that the guy was a bunch of gnomes who ended up kidnapping her. I'm just saying this because Mabel haters claim that she never gets punished for her bad behavior. But she was the one who ended up defeating the gnomes and even apologised to Dipper for ignoring him. BUT APRIL?! She displays an absolutely terrible attitude towards the turtles but then never apologises for it and even gets praised for 'saving their lives' with a sonic blast she couldn't even control.
Thank you for sharing your intense anger. As someone who was never really an April hater but also HATES this episode, this was quite cathartic to watch.
Another thing about the gender card If we’re talking about feminine culture in the west THE WAY APRIL ACTS IN THIS EPISODE WOULD ABSOLUTELY NOT FUCKING FLY BY ANY GIRL. If she pulled this in a fem friend group best case scenario she gets back-talked for a while. Worst case she strains her relationships with others. From experience we are not afraid of drama if it means calling out someone’s bullshit😭 I get the ick when people say shit like “good/bad female character” because it implies that their problems have to do with their gender when in reality the writers just fucked up the character in general.
I feel like this episode should've been about Turtles doubting April's abilities still being afraid she was captured and tortured in season 1 finale. It would've been so much better if it were the Turtles captured by Kraang and April rescuing them proving she's just as capable if not more capable than them despite training for only few months/half a year.
I feel like the "I'm independant! I don't need help!" could actually work if, like you said, _she_ was the one who learned a lesson in the end. And maybe, it could make for a really interesting plot about how women are constantly treated like they can't do anything and she admits that her pride made her lash out.
In a way, I see April Derp as the living abomination of April's frustrations where she couldn't find her identity and be sure whether she truly belongs in Turtles family or not. Or you can just say I'm overthinking about children's cartoon, which objectively wouldn't be far from the truth.
This video is how i learned that the staff disagreed on who April should end up with, and this is HILARIOUS x) imagine the shipping wars among the crew fhyhgtdhfrs
@user-kq5lb1pq6r and in the end she chose Donnie after all. It was already shown in When Worlds Collide which feels like kinda unofficial Valentine's Day special. And if we consider Ice Cream Kitty music video canon then Apritello is the true endgame.
The problem with April, like you said, is her writing and the fact that the writers messed her entire character in this episode, especially when they completely avoid including a punishment for the consequences of her actions. The 2012 tmnt show has also lots of plot holes :they could have added at least some scenes to develop or explain why she's a partialy mutated hybrid kraang, or maybe adding a some scenes in which she get to learn how to use her powers properly, or maybe they could have tell us what happened to her mother after got kidnapped by the Kraang and if she even stayed alive after ten years, the writing was really messed up in this version of TMNT, even the 2003 series, the bayverse (2016&2017 movies) got better written.
Oh no, hard disagree about 2003 series and especially Out of the Shadows being written better than 2012 show. That scene of Bayverse Raph throwing retro-mutagen vile into a wall without even consulting it with his brothers just makes both him and that subplot dumb. And it's very hypocritical of Raph that he was calling Leo out for not even considering discussing this topic together when he did the same thing not bothering to ask Mikey's and Donnie's opinion about it.
@ashesGeek Well you're not completely wrong about it, every version of TMNT has it's flaw and pros, the second movie of Bayverse was a mid sequel to the first one since the main plot line was set after the event of the first one with the turtles's situation of being still hidden in shadow after saving NYC from The Shredder's plan of affecting it with a virus then using the mutagen to cure everyone so they could make money out it, and ngl the 2003 series, despite of being the only version that it's kinda based off the comics (with restrictions of course for the censorship sake) still kinda cringe with a bit of inconsistency. But in both of these versions, we got to see both April O'Neil and Casey Jones having good writing and character development unlike 2012, not because they're adults but they actually got properly aborded by the writers : in the 2003 they're both sticks with their original lores from the comics, with Casey being that one guy who wanted to get his vendetta from the purple dragon gang who ruined his life and getting a redemption arc with him ending up befriend the turtles and April got the same treatment as well since she get introduced minding her own business before getting saved by the turtles with no romantic tension at all. The Bayverse in the over way added more depth and explored more opportunities by making Casey a police officer who made himself in the government side because he wanted to make sure that justice would be applied as it should, even if later he realizes it's not always the case, meanwhile April get to be to know the turtles in her childhood since her father was implied in their creation in the first place. So when I say that TMNT 2003 and the Bayverse movie hot better writing than 2012, and never talked about the Whole plot and story line, I was talking about the main human cast writing.
@Eniza_Nedjma Mmm, still disagree, while 2003 April and Casey's motives are OK they're not given much development at all and they're barely feel like background characters. Think about it, 2003 Splinter taught April ninjitsu in season 3. Did 2003 writers lead this plot even further making April more valid member of the team? Nope, after that she continues to be just a tech support and Casey's eye candy. The things get a little bit better in Fast Forward, but April and Casey are not 2003 ones, they 2007 movie April and Casey stripped into the show to act like 2003-selves. But if 2003 April is tolerable, than Casey... oh boy, the disrespect Jones goes through each season passing by is astonishing. He went from a badass wild card of the team in season 1 to the background character and pushover just like April. Starting from season 2 he gets dumber and more useless. He's not as competent as the Turtles, he does not contribute to the plot at all. The only things this Casey is remembered for are his grief over his dead father, grudge with Hun and fighting against Khan in season 7. Like, both April and Casey just stay at the lair while literally everybody, even Stockman and Chaplin fight Tengu Shredder in season 5. How much more disrespectful you can get to these characters who are supposed to be main protagonists of TMNT equally with the Turtles and Splinter.
@@ashesGeek Well it's was a long time since I watched the series like, I don't know... 7 or 9 years ago ? But at least they got a happy ending in the series finale unlike 2012 since... Earth is destroyed by the apocalypse and we don't get to know what happened to them, may be they died right after the mutagen bomb explodes or stayed alive but ended up getting outlived by the turtles (there's even a skull that Donnie kept and it's could be Casey's skull💀)
@Eniza_Nedjma but the thing is, it's still not canon. And I'm not talking about whether who said that, the showrunners or Nickelodeon. This isn't canon because the whole point of season 5 is to pay tribute to different stories of Mirage "Tales of TMNT" line up. Ciro even said later on that you can mash these arcs however you personally like. That's why in my book Lone Rat and Cubs is the first arc of the season reflecting the very first episode where Splinter told Turtles backstory, and the last arc is, surprisingly, Demodragon Arc. Sure, it contradicts continuity with 87 arc, but I just pretend Bebop and Rocksteady got away from 2012 Shredder. And the Demodragon arc works better as the finale of the series for 2 things: it shows that Shredder drama is more impactful for Turtles than monsters and alien conquest and it also comes around the full circle with "Owari" where Turtles also kill Shredder. I think had 2012 writers stick to this idea the show's finale would've been a masterpiece. Still, it was the smart decision of them to make all these loose stories so everybody would pick their favorite as the finale.
2:52 “stay unhinged” *proceeds to go reasonably unhinged because this girl is making everyone scream and yell* “It’s not who I am anymore- I redeemed myself.” You go girl you stronger than me I’d still throw hands at her..
I like the idea if april was the one to save the turtles. Like in the beginning, she probably would sigh being like "yeah i guess im not ready" The episode would go on, and she waits on the rooft top like leo asked. Only to find out the turtles are captured and in danger. And she tries to save them. And maybe when the kraang are about to 'kill' the turtles her powers are unleashed. Saving them, then on the way to the lair she tells the turtles, how shes sorry for acting up. And that she learned she still has a long way to go. But the turtles also thank her for saving them. But they tell her she did a good job for out smarting the enemy. Then it ends with how april is a mutant hybrid. So yeah- SORRY FOR THE RAMBLING! Maybe someone could do a comic of this idea-.
As a writer and a girl I HATE how they wrote April and she was always just kinda there while on screen or being a pain I wanted to throw out the window cause of her being all over the place. BTW dont worry I traumatize and flesh out all the girls I gotchu If she makes a mistake (Which happens since shes young when it starts) THE CONSEQUENCES SHOULD BE EQUAL!! I stand here with you and us writers and readers who see the truth need to stick together 🫡
As tmnt fan, I personally think they did April so dirty personally the writer had so much time and potential to give April a strong independent personality, but we are left is whiny and temperamental April, i seriously tried to like April when watching this version of the turtles but the writers didn't decide to break model, my overall thoughts is that Rottmnt and Mutant Mayhem and even 2003 did better job at giving us well written versions of April as a character
I loved the premise potential and the beginning fight, but April being in over her head and being mean about it, as well as, it being the turtle learning the lesson when the whole thing proved them right ruins the episode.
You know, I never understand people who need/want characters to be realistic. Anything involving fiction, fiction like TMNT or fantasy, hardly anything is going to be realistic.
I think anytime the male character apologize for the female character behavior, it just makes the female character look worst and caused people to dislike them, it doesn't help when the writer is trying to favor them ,this is why people can't certain female characters seriously because the writers baby them or less they want people to dislike them
I honestly agree, this version of April was pretty unlikable. For me, no other version of April is better than the 2003 version of her, 2003 April is a cool big sister figure to the turtles and she was a cool woman you would like to hang out with 2012 April would get on your nerves if you spend too much time with her
Idea for another 2012 TMNT video after the Donnie video, one about the Shredder and his descent into darkness, I personally have issues with that iteration of the Shredder but I’d love to hear your opinion on it and see if I agree and at least get a new perspective on him
I love writing TMNT fanfiction & at first, I really didn't want to do anything including 2012 April because of how inconsistent her writing is & like knowing what to do with her powers & all that is difficult. It's made a little more frustrating that I do age them up so I try figuring out how April is in her early 20's which ugh, takes a lot of brain stretching since a lot of her qualities shown in the series definitely feels like they belong to a teenager... one with psychic powers. What helped me was working on a fic where it's largely in 2012 April's perspective, that way I could get a better feel for the character as well as show why she makes the choices that she does. It helped a ton for me to understand on how to put her in other things. More than anything, I wish this show gave us more of April's perspective. It would be nice seeing more of who she is as a person instead of making guesses on who she is deeper, the things we don't get to see. I'm sure she has depth, the writers were just too chicken to allow it to be present.
Honestly, I don’t really care about April when I was younger. I didn’t really care for April. I didn’t even ship April with Donnie back then and be honest. I don’t really care about her now I think rise. April is much better than her but either way, I don’t care, the only thing I hate about her is her design. It’s so ugly.
Imagine complaining about the person trying to save you, getting training from an amazing martial artist because your tired of being in distress, and literally just be useless the rest of the episodes 💀 cmon bro I honestly don’t know why Donnie or Casey liked her, like even pigeon Pete was more useful than this 💀 April is also so cocky she got beaten by shinagami’s hat 💀 A HAT. Then again it’s not aprils fault it’s the poor writing that went into her character.
You know, I've been analyzing 2012 Shredder and Karai relationship and came to this conclusion, would you like to make a video discussing how Shredder and Karai's relationship could've been much better written if he told her that he's her uncle? Like, imagine him telling all the truth about Hamato clan wiping out all of Saki's family and keeping it from him all his life and also telling that he accidentally killed Tang Shen because of Yoshi. I think it would've made Karai's truth discovery and reuniting with Yoshi so much more interesting and it would've made Shredder much more tragic character that he already was in the show.
I always find it funny that despite the fact that I actually really really like this April, Mae's acting, and her arc overall. Despite all of that...I hate this episode so much. April doesn't bother me really and when she does, I mainly blame the writers for bad direction, but this? Aye aye aye. April Derp was funny though
I want to say this. I like strong female characters who are independent. But that dosen’t mean I want to seem them being perfect. Yes, I enjoy characters who are brave, wise, strong and calm, but I still want to them feel flawed, inexperienced and emotional because it makes them feel real. Because it makes them feel real as their problems can relate ours. But that’s just how I feel.
I feel like Leo from rottmnt is a better dumbass in distress cause he’s better at taking criticism and other things or Mikey from rottmnt who is wrongly accused of not being able to handle himself by Raphael
Re watching the show I see where the april criticism comes from I found her to be very self righteous and whiny most of the time.Most of the characters Mae Whitman voices are very similar to April in terms of personality with them being sweet but short-tempered girls aka Katara, Tinkerbell, Amity blight, and Shanti but April definitely is my least favorite Mae Whitman character. But in defense for how she acted in this episode I think it's more out of frustration that she's constantly on the sidelines and she's fully aware she always falls into the damsel in distress role not that it excuses her attitude but you see where it comes from. I myself can get frustrated because I try to be independent but always end up needing to depend on others. In the episode enemy of my enemy she was slightly offended when Donnie unintentionally called karai a real kunoichi compared to her and April was probably jealous that trust issues aside they wouldn't mind having their mortal enemy fight beside them whilel they always stick her with being the lookout. Also in addition to her complaining about Raph saving her he did mock her half the episode for slowing them down when she really was trying her best to be helpful and he didn't seem to take offense when she complained saying that they all had moments they can't live down. The episode karai's vendetta did give a harsh lesson that inexperienced or not April had to survive or not against the more experience karai and the others agreed that they had to finish the mission first even though April was in danger of being killed because the entire city including April would have been poisoned if they hadn't finished the mission so in April's defense they should make up their minds can she or can she not handle things on her own.
April is rubbish in this episode and she gets rewarded for it. Maybe the writers see this plot in April's favour but didn't see the problem. She's also really salty in this episode.
Watching this episode I truly feel Like April should've ended with Cassey or even be a Lesbain or something idk I don't just not the way it was Done in the Show Great Video 😊😊
Another a dumbass in distress trope is Miko in Transformers Prime. She deliberately goes into active battelfields to just see robots fights. Not because she tries to save the day, not because she is worried about Bulkhead, not because any morally or intellectually reason. Just want to see robot fights. She is not only an idiot, but, besides that one episode with her and Wheeljack went to kill Hardshell, she is overall useless to the plot both situational and narrative wise. She can just be written out of the plot and the events will still unfold.
She's not the only one who can go Super. If you've played any Sonic game, you know what happens when you collect all 7 chaos emeralds. And I have "Sonic" in my name. RAAAAAAHHHHHHH *goes Super Saiyan*
girl we are feeling the sme i thought the same when i watched this i was like she is the best april when i founded april 2018-2022 i said NOOOOOO! untill i founded that 2018 was nicer kinda the oppeset as 2012 april
Do a video about whether or not the 2012 TMNT are weak or strong. I notice that the turtles do not really improve in their fighting prowess in the 2012 series and they tend to get beat a lot.
It all comes down to the fact that the showrunners have a misogynistic attitude towards female characters. Or somewhere close to the term. But it feels off, and a bit baffling how people can ignore just how bad the writing is. Like, April flip flops to being Jean Grey or a damsel; Karai has Dumbass In Distress moments all the time; Renet is fine but is shoehorned in like Shini because Greg wanted Mikey to have a girlfriend (can confirm this being Insta mutuals with the guy); Y'Gythgba? Don't get me started on how lazy of a "character" she is, it is like a canon ball to the face. They didn't even try with her and made her somehow worse than her 87 counterpart (I heavily recommend y'all reading Sophie Campbell's adaptation of Mona in the IDW comics - such a palette cleanser and actually gives Mona, a side character, a lot that feels authentic, genuine, and it makes me get what people liked about the idea of her. Where I can't say that about the 2012 Mona given that there is nothing for me to enjoy; she is a plain ass hamburger between two pieces of wonder bread) and she had more episodes! Like really?! Alopex? The one love interest that had great chemistry with Raph and was close to him in age? Completely rewritten into being an adult and Tiger Claw's sister. Like come ON. If I had a nickel this shoe makes Raph's two iconic love interest into unanimously adults, I'd have two nickels. It is concerning how ths happened twice.
I've been wondering, have you seen 2003 TMNT series? I know you have problems with 2012 Karai writing but I'd love to see your analysis on 2003 Karai. Mainly because her Mirage characterization was adapted terribly in the show, her loyalty to Shredder made zero sense and her whole season 4 arc was forced as fuck and just presented her as psycho hypocrite. Unfortunately, it got so much worse when she saved her dad in Turtles Forever despite the fact she left the life of crime. Personally, nowadays I just can't understand how anybody would call this character well-written.
See in the one scene where she tells donnie to protect himself i could see it as lashing out because before the kraang got there she learned some terrible stuff about her family and teenagers sometimes lash out at people who did nothing wrong because they feel bad and apirl a teen and she going though bad stuff more terrible and horrible then just a bad day at school but she never apologized, nobody said a thing and only she only got worse though the episode. And no body said anything.....like master splinter a parent of 4 wildly different teenage boys, parent your student who has no father or mother to tell her right from wrong, because right now he like the only trusted adult in her life.
6:21 Tbh for the geek or creep vid, I would say geek tbh, Reasoning: Donnie likes April sure and sometimes stalks her but that is a phase we’ve all been through. It’s not much of a good reasoning but it’s A reasoning
Now I know what I must do "deep inhale" GD WHEN'S THE NEXT CHAPTER OF GOTEN BLACK GOING TO COME OUT I NEEDS IT I NEEDS IT NOW I CAN'T LEAVE WITHOUT IT I'M GOING TO KEEP SPAMMING IN THE COMMESNTS UNTIL IT COMES OUT!!!! RREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE- random annoying fan 2024
Did you NOT see her latest ch.7 announcement video? She says she’ll cancel Goten black if you continue to rush her! Don’t be a prince Kuriza! We don’t want her to cancel Goten black!
I sometimes feel like the writers would not have included April in 2012 if April wasn't already iconic to TMNT lore. Somebody asked Ciro Nieli on a podcast (back when Season 1 was still airing) if they could add more female characters to the show. Nieli replied they had enough, even though the only 2 female characters in the show at the time were April and Karai. He had said this:
"Any time a girl is on the show, they're usually too powerful. And it's just the nature of a girl. For some reason, I don't know what it is. I mean, this happened on Teen Titans. We had trouble limiting Starfire and Raven's powers. It happens with Wonder Woman. It happened on my Super Robot Monkey show with this character named Jinmay. It's just like... And I'm afraid... I've been fighting it with April with where we're going with her to not let her get too powerful. And it's hard. Sometimes guys are a lot cooler and easier to deal with in these cartoons. So, I mean, the fact that we have a good girl and a bad girl already, I think we're kind of maxed out a little bit."
Edit: Woah, my comment is pinned! Thanks!
Also, I'm glad 2012 added more female characters in eventually, but a lot of them feel shoehorned in. Almost all of them are love interests to the point their personalities don't really get to shine through like other characters do. Shinigami is cool, but she feels like she only exists so Karai doesn't look like a complete loner in Season 4. Alopex is the only female character I can think of (unless you count the Utroms, like Queen and Rook, or other aliens) who's not a love interest (although Raph does find her pretty), but she only gets 1 episode and is never mentioned again. In that same podcast, Ciro Nieli actually admitted that Greg Cipes (the voice of Mikey) kept asking him to give Mikey a girlfriend ("Cipes bugs me on a daily basis to get him a girlfriend on the show"), so I wouldn't be surprised if Renet or Shini were introduced simply so Mikey could have a gf.
2nd Edit: I guess it's unpinned now.
@howieedits9426 I feel like this quote should be the teaching example that making movies, cartoons, games is much harder than people think not just because of the budget or beefs with the publishing company.
Oh hey, it got pinned again. Just not gonna edit that comment again, so it stays pinned lol.
@howieedits9426 just wanted to add to one of your thoughts. Yeah, I'm not too fond that almost all of 2012 girls were introduced mainly as love interests, but still when compared to 1987 and 2003 2012 girls at least got good writing and got to be much more than household wives.
Or at least being written like a sane likeable person when it comes to comparing 2012 Karai with 2003 delusional one.
@@ashesGeek I don't mind how 2003 wrote women that much. 2003 Renet was funny, and Angel had a fun episode with Casey on escaping the Purple Dragons. Then there's Quarry, and Jhanna, who are also cool. Viral was an entertaining female villain too, and there were one-off female characters like the Montser Hunter lady who were enjoyable. None of them were housewives.
While 2003 April was a love interest, she always felt like her own person and wasn't afraid to speak her mind. Her first episode with Casey has her calling him a misogynist because he keeps disrespecting her boundaries by calling her babe and assuming she's hiding in her dad's home until she gets a real job. She comes to like Casey because he grows as a person and wants to make her happy. I'd argue 2003 April and Casey have one of the best romances in the franchise.
I know a lot of people don't like how 2003 Karai turned out, but I think it's interesting. She has clearly been brainwashed by him to the point she worships him, not unlike Pucci idolizes DIO in JoJo's Bizarre Adventure. Ch'rell basically forced the idea into her head that honor and loyalty are the same thing to the point it's driven her nuts. If she ever questions what he's doing, there's something wrong with her, not him. It reminds me of cults who will justify their leaders' actions, even if they have to make excuses or outright deny their evils. I think if they spent more time on her delusions, people would enjoy her more. I dislike her redemption in 2003, however. It was really rushed. And then TF tried to make her evil again, which sucked. Her romance with Chaplin was out of nowhere too, so I'll give you that.
Edit: I haven't seen enough of 1987, so I can't really agree or disagree with you on that point.
@howieedits9426 I mean, I don't necessarily hate how 2003 series handled women except Karai and Renet, I actually think gals like Starlee and Joi are quite underrated, but they just never stood up as anything interesting like male characters: Usagi, Nobody, Cody, Bishop, Hun, Torbin Zixx.
Sure, 2012 show could've toned out love interest game, but at the very least all gals were memorable, even Alopex.
And I wouldn't mind Karai becoming a villain if she didn't know what Shredder was doing. She was actually quite likeable in "City at War" arc, but her character took a deep dive quality drop as the show went on.
She had no business being angry at Turtles and trying to kill them. She's no means the worst Karai out there, but she's definitely the most annoying one.
IDW comics did "truly villainous" Karai much better and more fun.
The things that April was able to get away with would not be the same treatment compared to Mikey. Instead he would be facing tons of criticism and backlash for his shenanigans especially coming from Ralph. Even thou his brothers and yes Ralph included adored and care about their baby brother. They would still be holding him accountable just for his safety. Which’s April lacks and desperate needed throughout the seasons.
Thank you! It's kinda annoying that despite Mikey's skills he still gets heavily criticized by his brothers for his mistakes, especially from Raph. but at least Mikey at times he knows he's a bit in over his head and tries to make a plan. April here just jumps in without thinking and puts herself and the turtles into danger, and yet she gets away without any criticism.
Let’s be honest though: we all know someone who acts like April 💀
@@1Big_Mama True, that’s a fact!
@@camipalos9876 Lizzy from Murder Drones.
That person is my classmate who likes every boy in school and no one likes her back
Meggy from SMG4 DEFINITELY
At least Meggy is more mature than Lizzy.
April telling Donnie, “Protect yourself” makes me feel bad for him; the. I get mad at him when he pushes Raph back to hug April. My response would be, “Your brother’s fine too, you know.” It can be obnoxious that Donnie favors April over his own brothers, especially Raphael. I mean, Raph has done more for Donnie than the other way around.
The real name of the episode should be called “Thanks April, You Suck!!!”
@@sheriharmidarow249 The pilot episode of Gravity Falls is "Tourist Trapped". Mabel was in love with a guy who Dipper thought was a zombie. She ignored his advice and found out that the guy was a bunch of gnomes who ended up kidnapping her.
I'm just saying this because Mabel haters claim that she never gets punished for her bad behavior.
But she was the one who ended up defeating the gnomes and even apologised to Dipper for ignoring him.
BUT APRIL?! She displays an absolutely terrible attitude towards the turtles but then never apologises for it and even gets praised for 'saving their lives' with a sonic blast she couldn't even control.
Thank you for sharing your intense anger. As someone who was never really an April hater but also HATES this episode, this was quite cathartic to watch.
I'm a sucker for when video essay people become so passionately angry about a game or cartoon. That's that good kush
Another thing about the gender card
If we’re talking about feminine culture in the west THE WAY APRIL ACTS IN THIS EPISODE WOULD ABSOLUTELY NOT FUCKING FLY BY ANY GIRL.
If she pulled this in a fem friend group best case scenario she gets back-talked for a while. Worst case she strains her relationships with others. From experience we are not afraid of drama if it means calling out someone’s bullshit😭
I get the ick when people say shit like “good/bad female character” because it implies that their problems have to do with their gender when in reality the writers just fucked up the character in general.
I feel like this episode should've been about Turtles doubting April's abilities still being afraid she was captured and tortured in season 1 finale.
It would've been so much better if it were the Turtles captured by Kraang and April rescuing them proving she's just as capable if not more capable than them despite training for only few months/half a year.
I feel like the "I'm independant! I don't need help!" could actually work if, like you said, _she_ was the one who learned a lesson in the end. And maybe, it could make for a really interesting plot about how women are constantly treated like they can't do anything and she admits that her pride made her lash out.
The April Derp scared the shit out of me when the episode came out. Terrifying 🥶
In a way, I see April Derp as the living abomination of April's frustrations where she couldn't find her identity and be sure whether she truly belongs in Turtles family or not.
Or you can just say I'm overthinking about children's cartoon, which objectively wouldn't be far from the truth.
It still looks derpy.
Derp. 😐
This video is how i learned that the staff disagreed on who April should end up with, and this is HILARIOUS x) imagine the shipping wars among the crew fhyhgtdhfrs
@user-kq5lb1pq6r and in the end she chose Donnie after all. It was already shown in When Worlds Collide which feels like kinda unofficial Valentine's Day special. And if we consider Ice Cream Kitty music video canon then Apritello is the true endgame.
The problem with April, like you said, is her writing and the fact that the writers messed her entire character in this episode, especially when they completely avoid including a punishment for the consequences of her actions.
The 2012 tmnt show has also lots of plot holes :they could have added at least some scenes to develop or explain why she's a partialy mutated hybrid kraang, or maybe adding a some scenes in which she get to learn how to use her powers properly, or maybe they could have tell us what happened to her mother after got kidnapped by the Kraang and if she even stayed alive after ten years, the writing was really messed up in this version of TMNT, even the 2003 series, the bayverse (2016&2017 movies) got better written.
Oh no, hard disagree about 2003 series and especially Out of the Shadows being written better than 2012 show. That scene of Bayverse Raph throwing retro-mutagen vile into a wall without even consulting it with his brothers just makes both him and that subplot dumb.
And it's very hypocritical of Raph that he was calling Leo out for not even considering discussing this topic together when he did the same thing not bothering to ask Mikey's and Donnie's opinion about it.
@ashesGeek
Well you're not completely wrong about it, every version of TMNT has it's flaw and pros, the second movie of Bayverse was a mid sequel to the first one since the main plot line was set after the event of the first one with the turtles's situation of being still hidden in shadow after saving NYC from The Shredder's plan of affecting it with a virus then using the mutagen to cure everyone so they could make money out it, and ngl the 2003 series, despite of being the only version that it's kinda based off the comics (with restrictions of course for the censorship sake) still kinda cringe with a bit of inconsistency.
But in both of these versions, we got to see both April O'Neil and Casey Jones having good writing and character development unlike 2012, not because they're adults but they actually got properly aborded by the writers : in the 2003 they're both sticks with their original lores from the comics, with Casey being that one guy who wanted to get his vendetta from the purple dragon gang who ruined his life and getting a redemption arc with him ending up befriend the turtles and April got the same treatment as well since she get introduced minding her own business before getting saved by the turtles with no romantic tension at all.
The Bayverse in the over way added more depth and explored more opportunities by making Casey a police officer who made himself in the government side because he wanted to make sure that justice would be applied as it should, even if later he realizes it's not always the case, meanwhile April get to be to know the turtles in her childhood since her father was implied in their creation in the first place.
So when I say that TMNT 2003 and the Bayverse movie hot better writing than 2012, and never talked about the Whole plot and story line, I was talking about the main human cast writing.
@Eniza_Nedjma Mmm, still disagree, while 2003 April and Casey's motives are OK they're not given much development at all and they're barely feel like background characters.
Think about it, 2003 Splinter taught April ninjitsu in season 3. Did 2003 writers lead this plot even further making April more valid member of the team?
Nope, after that she continues to be just a tech support and Casey's eye candy. The things get a little bit better in Fast Forward, but April and Casey are not 2003 ones, they 2007 movie April and Casey stripped into the show to act like 2003-selves.
But if 2003 April is tolerable, than Casey... oh boy, the disrespect Jones goes through each season passing by is astonishing. He went from a badass wild card of the team in season 1 to the background character and pushover just like April.
Starting from season 2 he gets dumber and more useless. He's not as competent as the Turtles, he does not contribute to the plot at all. The only things this Casey is remembered for are his grief over his dead father, grudge with Hun and fighting against Khan in season 7.
Like, both April and Casey just stay at the lair while literally everybody, even Stockman and Chaplin fight Tengu Shredder in season 5. How much more disrespectful you can get to these characters who are supposed to be main protagonists of TMNT equally with the Turtles and Splinter.
@@ashesGeek
Well it's was a long time since I watched the series like, I don't know... 7 or 9 years ago ? But at least they got a happy ending in the series finale unlike 2012 since... Earth is destroyed by the apocalypse and we don't get to know what happened to them, may be they died right after the mutagen bomb explodes or stayed alive but ended up getting outlived by the turtles (there's even a skull that Donnie kept and it's could be Casey's skull💀)
@Eniza_Nedjma but the thing is, it's still not canon. And I'm not talking about whether who said that, the showrunners or Nickelodeon. This isn't canon because the whole point of season 5 is to pay tribute to different stories of Mirage "Tales of TMNT" line up.
Ciro even said later on that you can mash these arcs however you personally like. That's why in my book Lone Rat and Cubs is the first arc of the season reflecting the very first episode where Splinter told Turtles backstory, and the last arc is, surprisingly, Demodragon Arc.
Sure, it contradicts continuity with 87 arc, but I just pretend Bebop and Rocksteady got away from 2012 Shredder. And the Demodragon arc works better as the finale of the series for 2 things: it shows that Shredder drama is more impactful for Turtles than monsters and alien conquest and it also comes around the full circle with "Owari" where Turtles also kill Shredder.
I think had 2012 writers stick to this idea the show's finale would've been a masterpiece.
Still, it was the smart decision of them to make all these loose stories so everybody would pick their favorite as the finale.
2:52 “stay unhinged” *proceeds to go reasonably unhinged because this girl is making everyone scream and yell*
“It’s not who I am anymore- I redeemed myself.” You go girl you stronger than me I’d still throw hands at her..
Remember everyone! Stay Unhinged and go Super Saiyan like me and GD!
I like the idea if april was the one to save the turtles. Like in the beginning, she probably would sigh being like "yeah i guess im not ready" The episode would go on, and she waits on the rooft top like leo asked. Only to find out the turtles are captured and in danger. And she tries to save them. And maybe when the kraang are about to 'kill' the turtles her powers are unleashed. Saving them, then on the way to the lair she tells the turtles, how shes sorry for acting up. And that she learned she still has a long way to go. But the turtles also thank her for saving them. But they tell her she did a good job for out smarting the enemy. Then it ends with how april is a mutant hybrid. So yeah- SORRY FOR THE RAMBLING! Maybe someone could do a comic of this idea-.
Maturing is just saying sorry if you were wrong
Exactly!
As a writer and a girl I HATE how they wrote April and she was always just kinda there while on screen or being a pain I wanted to throw out the window cause of her being all over the place. BTW dont worry I traumatize and flesh out all the girls I gotchu If she makes a mistake (Which happens since shes young when it starts) THE CONSEQUENCES SHOULD BE EQUAL!! I stand here with you and us writers and readers who see the truth need to stick together 🫡
👏👏👏
At this point I can literally call it being sexist and no one would disagree. It feels too real to not call it that.
I consider this an offense to both genders. The fact that people keep doing this trope is bullshit.
What the fuck is wrong with those people?
As tmnt fan, I personally think they did April so dirty personally the writer had so much time and potential to give April a strong independent personality, but we are left is whiny and temperamental April, i seriously tried to like April when watching this version of the turtles but the writers didn't decide to break model, my overall thoughts is that Rottmnt and Mutant Mayhem and even 2003 did better job at giving us well written versions of April as a character
I loved the premise potential and the beginning fight, but April being in over her head and being mean about it, as well as, it being the turtle learning the lesson when the whole thing proved them right ruins the episode.
At times it felt like the writers hated April in this show, this episode being a primary example of this
2012 April O’Neil was wasted potential
Rise April is what 2012 April should’ve been
You know, I never understand people who need/want characters to be realistic. Anything involving fiction, fiction like TMNT or fantasy, hardly anything is going to be realistic.
Rest In Peace, Robert Forster
Mr. Kurtzman. :(
Unfortunate Fact: Toriyama died on March 1 of this current year. 😰
Unfortunate Fact: Janice Burgess died on March 2 of this current year. 😰
Just found your videos while I binged TMNT 2012! Can I just say I love your little character sona? 💜⚡️
I think anytime the male character apologize for the female character behavior, it just makes the female character look worst and caused people to dislike them, it doesn't help when the writer is trying to favor them ,this is why people can't certain female characters seriously because the writers baby them or less they want people to dislike them
I honestly agree, this version of April was pretty unlikable.
For me, no other version of April is better than the 2003 version of her, 2003 April is a cool big sister figure to the turtles and she was a cool woman you would like to hang out with
2012 April would get on your nerves if you spend too much time with her
Idea for another 2012 TMNT video after the Donnie video, one about the Shredder and his descent into darkness, I personally have issues with that iteration of the Shredder but I’d love to hear your opinion on it and see if I agree and at least get a new perspective on him
@@GenerationAvenger2001 cool thanks
R.I.P. Robert Forster The Voice Of Jack Kurtzman
3:31 I like the critic video about it He shows that not only male can be one but went to different media
I love watching your 2012 tmnt videos
There are some enemy's she can't defeat
I love writing TMNT fanfiction & at first, I really didn't want to do anything including 2012 April because of how inconsistent her writing is & like knowing what to do with her powers & all that is difficult. It's made a little more frustrating that I do age them up so I try figuring out how April is in her early 20's which ugh, takes a lot of brain stretching since a lot of her qualities shown in the series definitely feels like they belong to a teenager... one with psychic powers.
What helped me was working on a fic where it's largely in 2012 April's perspective, that way I could get a better feel for the character as well as show why she makes the choices that she does. It helped a ton for me to understand on how to put her in other things.
More than anything, I wish this show gave us more of April's perspective. It would be nice seeing more of who she is as a person instead of making guesses on who she is deeper, the things we don't get to see. I'm sure she has depth, the writers were just too chicken to allow it to be present.
April needs more training than she thinks
Did April even try to defend herself? 😒
April did out smart karai and flipped karai down the subway stairs when karai had her gard down
Honestly, I don’t really care about April when I was younger. I didn’t really care for April. I didn’t even ship April with Donnie back then and be honest. I don’t really care about her now I think rise. April is much better than her but either way, I don’t care, the only thing I hate about her is her design. It’s so ugly.
I only liked this april in the tmnt 2012 series on the first season
Imagine complaining about the person trying to save you, getting training from an amazing martial artist because your tired of being in distress, and literally just be useless the rest of the episodes 💀 cmon bro I honestly don’t know why Donnie or Casey liked her, like even pigeon Pete was more useful than this 💀 April is also so cocky she got beaten by shinagami’s hat 💀 A HAT. Then again it’s not aprils fault it’s the poor writing that went into her character.
Yeah April always made me mad in this episode
Is it because she rejected Donnie’s assistance?
@ no, because she was acting like a brat
@@AshBlueFox16 oh yeah, I really don’t like April being a jerk in season two
15:50 I can do that too, ya know. They call me "Sonic" Orange for a reason.
*RAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHH* *goes Super Saiyan*
Wow! I didn't know you could go Super Saiyan!
@@QuietLuxuryyy Of course I can!
LOL?
*performs a Kamehameha*
*performs a Z Move*
This April is sooo sillay lol why are they making this regular ass girl fight aliens
You know, I've been analyzing 2012 Shredder and Karai relationship and came to this conclusion, would you like to make a video discussing how Shredder and Karai's relationship could've been much better written if he told her that he's her uncle?
Like, imagine him telling all the truth about Hamato clan wiping out all of Saki's family and keeping it from him all his life and also telling that he accidentally killed Tang Shen because of Yoshi. I think it would've made Karai's truth discovery and reuniting with Yoshi so much more interesting and it would've made Shredder much more tragic character that he already was in the show.
I always find it funny that despite the fact that I actually really really like this April, Mae's acting, and her arc overall. Despite all of that...I hate this episode so much. April doesn't bother me really and when she does, I mainly blame the writers for bad direction, but this? Aye aye aye.
April Derp was funny though
@@JasmineBaker-h5k i agree
I want to say this.
I like strong female characters who are independent. But that dosen’t mean I want to seem them being perfect. Yes, I enjoy characters who are brave, wise, strong and calm, but I still want to them feel flawed, inexperienced and emotional because it makes them feel real. Because it makes them feel real as their problems can relate ours.
But that’s just how I feel.
I feel like Leo from rottmnt is a better dumbass in distress cause he’s better at taking criticism and other things or Mikey from rottmnt who is wrongly accused of not being able to handle himself by Raphael
Maybe you should make a video about your top 10 episodes from tmnt 2012?
Raph and Leo makes good points
Re watching the show I see where the april criticism comes from I found her to be very self righteous and whiny most of the time.Most of the characters Mae Whitman voices are very similar to April in terms of personality with them being sweet but short-tempered girls aka Katara, Tinkerbell, Amity blight, and Shanti but April definitely is my least favorite Mae Whitman character. But in defense for how she acted in this episode I think it's more out of frustration that she's constantly on the sidelines and she's fully aware she always falls into the damsel in distress role not that it excuses her attitude but you see where it comes from. I myself can get frustrated because I try to be independent but always end up needing to depend on others. In the episode enemy of my enemy she was slightly offended when Donnie unintentionally called karai a real kunoichi compared to her and April was probably jealous that trust issues aside they wouldn't mind having their mortal enemy fight beside them whilel they always stick her with being the lookout. Also in addition to her complaining about Raph saving her he did mock her half the episode for slowing them down when she really was trying her best to be helpful and he didn't seem to take offense when she complained saying that they all had moments they can't live down. The episode karai's vendetta did give a harsh lesson that inexperienced or not April had to survive or not against the more experience karai and the others agreed that they had to finish the mission first even though April was in danger of being killed because the entire city including April would have been poisoned if they hadn't finished the mission so in April's defense they should make up their minds can she or can she not handle things on her own.
April is rubbish in this episode and she gets rewarded for it. Maybe the writers see this plot in April's favour but didn't see the problem. She's also really salty in this episode.
Warning: Jump-scare moment 8:07
Watching this episode I truly feel Like April should've ended with Cassey or even be a Lesbain or something idk I don't just not the way it was Done in the Show Great Video 😊😊
This episode really made me hate April 🙄
Another a dumbass in distress trope is Miko in Transformers Prime. She deliberately goes into active battelfields to just see robots fights. Not because she tries to save the day, not because she is worried about Bulkhead, not because any morally or intellectually reason. Just want to see robot fights. She is not only an idiot, but, besides that one episode with her and Wheeljack went to kill Hardshell, she is overall useless to the plot both situational and narrative wise. She can just be written out of the plot and the events will still unfold.
You used super saiyan!!!😲 Like the video i made of you!!!🤩
She's not the only one who can go Super. If you've played any Sonic game, you know what happens when you collect all 7 chaos emeralds. And I have "Sonic" in my name.
RAAAAAAHHHHHHH *goes Super Saiyan*
@sonicorange9050 nice my turn HAHHHHHHHH!!!! *SUPER SAIYAN*
*RAAAAAHHHHHH* *goes Super Saiyan*
Yes! More power!
YEEESSS
Maybe this episode should come out in season 1
This video is amazing 👏🏾
girl we are feeling the sme i thought the same when i watched this i was like she is the best april when i founded
april 2018-2022 i said NOOOOOO! untill i founded that 2018 was nicer kinda the oppeset as 2012 april
Do a video about whether or not the 2012 TMNT are weak or strong. I notice that the turtles do not really improve in their fighting prowess in the 2012 series and they tend to get beat a lot.
It all comes down to the fact that the showrunners have a misogynistic attitude towards female characters. Or somewhere close to the term. But it feels off, and a bit baffling how people can ignore just how bad the writing is.
Like, April flip flops to being Jean Grey or a damsel; Karai has Dumbass In Distress moments all the time; Renet is fine but is shoehorned in like Shini because Greg wanted Mikey to have a girlfriend (can confirm this being Insta mutuals with the guy); Y'Gythgba? Don't get me started on how lazy of a "character" she is, it is like a canon ball to the face. They didn't even try with her and made her somehow worse than her 87 counterpart (I heavily recommend y'all reading Sophie Campbell's adaptation of Mona in the IDW comics - such a palette cleanser and actually gives Mona, a side character, a lot that feels authentic, genuine, and it makes me get what people liked about the idea of her. Where I can't say that about the 2012 Mona given that there is nothing for me to enjoy; she is a plain ass hamburger between two pieces of wonder bread) and she had more episodes! Like really?!
Alopex? The one love interest that had great chemistry with Raph and was close to him in age? Completely rewritten into being an adult and Tiger Claw's sister. Like come ON. If I had a nickel this shoe makes Raph's two iconic love interest into unanimously adults, I'd have two nickels. It is concerning how ths happened twice.
I've been wondering, have you seen 2003 TMNT series? I know you have problems with 2012 Karai writing but I'd love to see your analysis on 2003 Karai.
Mainly because her Mirage characterization was adapted terribly in the show, her loyalty to Shredder made zero sense and her whole season 4 arc was forced as fuck and just presented her as psycho hypocrite. Unfortunately, it got so much worse when she saved her dad in Turtles Forever despite the fact she left the life of crime.
Personally, nowadays I just can't understand how anybody would call this character well-written.
make video about Wendy from gravity falls please
Is zamasu in goten black ark immortal?
8:42 You did not need to say it like that.
AYO! 🤨
What the fuck?
most of the idiot at risk is because of misdirection in writing.
Damn Awesome video
She is a kid
@@RyanOlakitan-zv5uf not excuse for bad writing
@@loiiysailor1177 And bullshit gender tropes.
Same here bro, but I ain't a dumb dumb who can't take responsibility for their dumb dumb actions
See in the one scene where she tells donnie to protect himself i could see it as lashing out because before the kraang got there she learned some terrible stuff about her family and teenagers sometimes lash out at people who did nothing wrong because they feel bad and apirl a teen and she going though bad stuff more terrible and horrible then just a bad day at school but she never apologized, nobody said a thing and only she only got worse though the episode. And no body said anything.....like master splinter a parent of 4 wildly different teenage boys, parent your student who has no father or mother to tell her right from wrong, because right now he like the only trusted adult in her life.
6:21 Tbh for the geek or creep vid, I would say geek tbh,
Reasoning:
Donnie likes April sure and sometimes stalks her but that is a phase we’ve all been through.
It’s not much of a good reasoning but it’s A reasoning
Idk about you but I've never stalked someone even a little bit when I liked them. I don't think that's something we all go through.
He's both
you not look at the normal gd your looking at super GD !
Two can play at that game. *RRAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHH* *goes Super Sonic*
Third place!
Hey. Just because April was being a moody mess, doesn't make her a b****.
I guess
Now I know what I must do "deep inhale" GD WHEN'S THE NEXT CHAPTER OF GOTEN BLACK GOING TO COME OUT I NEEDS IT I NEEDS IT NOW I CAN'T LEAVE WITHOUT IT I'M GOING TO KEEP SPAMMING IN THE COMMESNTS UNTIL IT COMES OUT!!!! RREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE- random annoying fan 2024
Did you NOT see her latest ch.7 announcement video? She says she’ll cancel Goten black if you continue to rush her! Don’t be a prince Kuriza! We don’t want her to cancel Goten black!
@@dbzfangirl2654 It's a joke, idiot.