Reclaiming LGBT+ Slurs (Are some words off limits???)
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- Опубликовано: 28 авг 2024
- Should we reclaim gay slurs? Can all slurs be reclaimed?
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"Hey everyone it's Ashley here"
"That's not my name anymore"
I thought that before Ash said it😂😂
"And Ashley here is awesome."
"Who's awesome?"
"ASH"
Haha, lolz.
Stiino 19 same😂
ashley is her name ashe is just the shortened version
no, she had it changed to ash legally. her name isn't ashly now.
Ash uses they/them pronouns :)
I think that the word "nerd" is one of the most impressive examples of reclaiming a word. Once the word stopped being offensive, there was practically a renisance of nerd culture. Nerds everywhere are now proud to call themselves nerds. If nerds have taught us anything, it's that words can be reclaimed.
This is why I strongly believe in the power of reclaiming words and that it is a usually a good thing.
Exactly! When people call me a band or drama nerd I just say ‘yep’
I'm a nerd that loves presenting my hard work
Ya
I'm a nerd and I take it as a compliment :)
Once someone yelled at me, "HOMO!" I just said back, "talking to me, hetero?"
That was before I realized that fighting fire with fire isn't such a great idea, but I still use it as a moment of strength.
Mean it does put across the idea that saying that is kinda frivolous.
Lmao calling someone hetero isn’t offensive 😂😂😂😂
It is What it is neither is calling someone homo lmao
Comebacks can be ok... and that was a good one!
Icon 😊♥️🌈
HEY ALL :D David and I share our humble *opinion* reclaiming LGBT+ slurs. I'm curious how y'all feel? Do you reclaim any slurs? Are some words off limits?
Ash Hardell Reclaimed the word QUEER because it feels like I don't have to explain my sexuality to people just that I'm not straight
The word QUEER was a slur until that decade ^^ think about that - as Ash mentioned. As forthe other slurs, the limit is for those who have a violent meaning behind it, like the F word whose semantic origin refers to burning people alive. This one will never be acceptable.
but then i love to call myself gay as it's often used to hurt me and my lgbt+ friends and so then we're like hehe we are just very gay and when they call us gay we are just like oh thanks
If someone calls me something like that with the intention to offend me I'm just like, "Yes, that is what I am, what's your point?"
now when i heared your opinion on that word i feel like i should like say that we make sure to only use it when everyone is fine with it so if we know someone isnt okay with the word we dont use it
"heterosexual asexual" : nope xD You wanted to say "heteroromantic asexual" aren't you ?
This.
I’d like to offer up an explanation for how what Ash said can make sense:
Some asexual people do also identify as heterosexual, because when they do feel sexual attraction, it’s heterosexual. Not all asexual people never have sex or are sex repulsed.
I personally am on the grey asexual spectrum (aceflux: my a sexual attraction fluctuates), but I also identify as pansexual, because when I do want to have sex I’m sexually attracted to all genders.
Yeah lmao
Hads not really? You worded that kind of wrong asexual is the lack of all sexual attraction ever. Where you could say “sexual” if you partake in sex it’s still wrong. Grey-ace (which also includes all of the ace spectrum) feels sexual attraction sometimes, so not asexual. To be asexual having sex it is not sexual attraction but “this random type that I found sex enjoyable with” but it could also be aesthetic attraction.
Not to be mean but people have a hard time with it already and could use that to be like “so you aren’t actually asexual”
I like to call the community aces and ace spects unless I know I am purely talking about aces. Like my dubbed ace confusion in response to gay/bi/etc. panic.
Or maybe heterosexual gray asexual? I mean, wow that sounds complicated, but yeah. That's a thing.
Thanks so much for having me on the channel, Ash! I always enjoy talking with you about important issues like these, and I'm glad we got to share some insights with the interwebs :)
David Levitz it was nice seeing you on the channel!
thanks! it was an honor to be on the channel tbh
I like Thomas Sanders' intro: "hey guys, gals, & nonbinary pals!" it's inclusive & fun.
Jackie That's why I start mine with "Hello, fellow humans!".
The Madhouse, that's non-inclusive to otherkin... Not everyone is a human.
That's actually from his outro, his Intro is "what is up everybody?!?!"
Schneed if other kin aren't human then do we need to address them ? They're just hyped up furries
Schneed otherkin /are/ humans. psychical form is human. i respect that in your mind or a different matter you may not be or feel human, but youre still human. this comes from someone who used to be heavily involved in the therian and otherkin community.
I thought it was kinda funny how you mentioned "the crooked community" because in Norway we call ourselves "skeive" which translates to crooked and is the contrary to straight
bi squad where u at? 💖💜💙
Right here! 💖💜💙
You have summoned me?! :P
💓💙💜💗💙💜💖
Aye! :D
Louise Hally here!
I feel like context is most important when it comes to these words. Like who is saying them and how it's used.
slightly surprised the lesbian "d-word" wasnt brought up
i'd really like to hear people's opinions on it, such as is it just a lesbian word or would it apply to bi/pan girls as well?
It's an offensive term that can apply to anyone, really. A transman who may not be fully transitioned can be called it, lesbians can, bi and pan women. It can be offensive to anyone.
My Mom called me that when I came out as trans.
My friend's dad called me that. I was picking her up and I had a pride pin on my beanie and he asked me what it was and after I told him he laughed and said "so what are you a d***" I just kinda gaped at him for a second. Honestly, then I slapped him really hard across the face. He almost fell over!😂 it was SO satisfying!
I'm happy to say that I have no idea what the d-word is
and don't tell me
@@sarahthompson4505 look an innocent! :D. (This was not meant to be offensive in any way)
I'm aromantic and I love that you mentionned 'no romo' in your discussion. It's definitely something that I use when telling my alloromantic friends that I love them. I find it cute and a little way to reassure myself of my aromanticism.
Yvonne L I don't get why people have such beef with no romo. I think they're just angry they don't have monopoly on gay jokes/slurs.
I'm not aro but I think it's cute
Yvonne L Yay! Same!
sorry but what is alloromantic?
I have seen the use of no romo and I have been meaning to use it because I think it’s cute and I’m aro so why not
@@bobwater3921 not aromantic, basically experiencing more or less normative romantic attraction.
I didn't even know "queer" was a slur at one point
Like Ash said, I think the t-slurs, at least for now, is off-limits. as a part of the transgender community, I have seen and felt how it hurts us, and I don't like other people, even new to the community transgender people, using it. However, I feel one of the biggest places it's a problem is in the gay community itself. When a gay guy calls me a t-slur in a joking manner, or when RuPaul, a figurehead for the drag community and LGBTQ+ community in general, uses them, I can really see the difference in the community. It's not their word to reclaim. They're not part of that community that experienced so much violence in the past and still does today. Sure, they experienced their own type, but as outsiders to the transgender community, they need to respect the specific history we've had with it.
I wholeheartedly disagree!!!🙄
I've been called special snowflake online a bunch, and then there was one instance where my dad called me a special snowflake (not in a derogatory way, he was trying to compliment, also unaware that the term has been used in a derogatory way at all) and I was very confused whether he was trying to be nice or not and then he was like "but like snowflakes are pretty, and you're my beautiful daughter, thus you're a special snowflake"
I think snowflake and "gender special" are two terms I'd actually self-identify with to spite current "alt-right" sentiment. Then again, I spent much of my adolescence in a gothier version of the Myspace look, knowing full-well how many sensibilities I would (and did) offend; the way I respond to prejudice isn't everyone's cup of tea.
+Cassidy McCabe +AMaliciousMoose
I find the terms annoying too, if only because they're used as ad hominems that don't add anything to the discussion, but they weren't made by the alt-right, hell, the alt-right is a very, very, VERY, small percentage of people who use those phrases to refer to people who go out of their way to be the MOST special, despite being relatively regular outside of one or two aspects of their personality.
That, and just about everyone who isn't alt-right, hate the alt-right, especially those who are critical of things like 3rd & 4th wave feminism or Antifa. Their identity politics of screaming "but what about the able-bodied hetcis white christian men!" is just as annoying as the people screaming "what about the disabled-pan-non binary-black-muslim-womyn!" the truth is, both authoritarian extremes are heavily criticized by me and just about everyone who don't fit in those ideological circles.
I was surprised that they didn't mention d**e.
which is funny because it's on the thumbnail
Kathryn Fuhrer I have noticed that people don't use it as frequently as the f word (even towards females) and never towards me so I don't have a negative connotation with it
bubblegum pandas it really isn't used that much. Probably because it's easier to just use one term that can apply to anyone, similar to lesbians that just refer to themselves as gay
I feel the same way. I can't stand that word.
Kathryn Fuhrer actually it is, its more so used amongst the urban community. Ive seen ppl use it to refer only to masculine lesbians tho. Sum them using the word dont even see it as a slur, but as a label. Idk its ignorant asf ive gotten into sum fights over it so yeah id say its still very much around
This morning my parents and I were talking about the acronym LGBTQIA and I was listing out what the letters stood for. When I said queer my mom said 'I thought that was a slur' and I realized I had completely forgotten that the word queer used to be used as a slur. I think that's a sign of a successful reclamation.
Evelyn Flynn i know this kinda old, but what does I mean?
Intersex.
I saw someone use SAGA as an umbrella term for the community to stand for 'sexuality and gender alliance'. I thought that was a cool idea as it includes everyone without having the issue of LGBT..... Being kinda endless.
What about romantic orientations? Does that fall into the sexuality category.
And the people who are intersex?
It does not include everything.
So maybe it might be a little bit longer in real life?
Rachel Potato, I like the MOGAI acronym.
The allies can fit into the category since cis is a gender identity and Heterosexual is a sexuality...I just feel like Homophobic people wouldn't appreciate being classed as LGBT+ in any way.
I
Besides, I have a super inclusive term.
(It's "Human".It's not an acronym, it's just the word . I mean we're all still human at the end of the day right?)
that elusive all inclusive word you are looking for is "human".
One important point in this discussion is language. I'm gay and the f word doesn't hurt me at all. But I'm not a native English speaker, and the equivalent word in my mother language makes me feel nauseous.
Same
Same but now I'm so used to talking in English that it hurts me (and the d slur)
I think taking back slurs is like staining a white shirt with red wine. Sometimes you can take it out and it's like it was never there. Other times it leave a slight stain as a reminder of what was there.
I think it's more like this: the spill is the slur, what we do when we reclaim the slur is either like bleaching it out, where we remove the hurtful context; or we stain the shirt red, so you can't see the spill, where we take the meaning and transform it to suit ourselves. Leaving the shirt with the stain is using the slur defiantly in such a way as to induce shame in the person that made the stain in the first place.
Each tactic has its uses, and each can reclaim a slur in a different way.
I'm bisexual. Personally, I do use the word "queer" because I don't see it as negative and I do identify with it in more ways than one, like David said. I don't use that "F" word you were talking about or "no homo" because those both really bother me and I strongly dislike when they are said by anyone. It offends me more to hear LGBTQ+ individuals using those types of words. But of course, if they want to reclaim words, it's really their decision which ones to reclaim. "Queer" is pretty much the only word I've reclaimed personally. Mainly because I have issues with most of the other ones being said and as I said previously, "queer" is a word I personally relate to for many reasons, so I see it as relatable, not negative.
The term "queer" has already been reclaimed, though, which is probably why it's not as offensive to a lot of people anymore. Older generations (from what I've seen) generally seem to see it as inoffensive, now, and are often actually upset with the younger generation for thinking it's a slur again (because it effectively takes away all their hard work and makes their identities a bad word).
From what I've seen the resurgence of queer being used as a slur happened on Tumblr, at the hands of terfs who wanted to split up the community more and took advantage of how badly we know our own history and how easy it is to spread misinformation on that site.
I genuinely love the word, since it's a much more inclusive umbrella term for the whole community than gay or lgbtqia+ (especially since people usually just say lgbt).
I don't think any words should be off-limits for being reclaimed, but I 100% agree that time needs to pass for them to be less... intense? Causing people anxiety attacks just so you can call yourself a "F-word" isn't exactly fair.
I hope you don't mind, but I want to add a source for this comment about how Queer has been a reclaimed word in the community since at least as far back as the 1920s: 68.media.tumblr.com/a60f68f36daa6f1bbcb8618f2a246d38/tumblr_inline_omggvmw7Vq1qh8qgw_500.png
Pocketgeek it's partial. Obviously not everyone thinks it is a reclaimed term and there are people who do like it. I know lots of older lesbians that don't want to use it. So it's more of a preference for the person. Personally, I don't like it because lesbians already get shit from others . IMO the word queer can be used if you want to call yourself that, but I don't want to be associated. I believe it implies that I'm not a "monosexual."
bullshit. I am a 22 y/o openly gay man and I find queer unbelievably offensive and is one of the reasons I have switched off from engaging in this 'community'. @ Jazeolo. You dont understand how slurs are employed do you? 'Gay' has been around for ages but can still be USED as a slur. It does not matter how old a term has been in use. Queer has a root meaning of negativity, whereas gay does not. Gay means happy and queer means odd, weird and unusual. Cool if thats you and how you want to identity. But FUCK YOU for including me as an openly gay man in that label twat.
+matt colins
Of course, if you do not like the word and don't want to be associated or identified with it, especially if you have had negative experiences with it, that's totally your prerogative; I'm not trying to force my identity on you.
What I have a problem with is the belief that Queer has always been a slur up until recently, and people basically telling those who identify with Queer that their identity is offensive, and that they shouldn't use it ever (this is a general observation of the community, not referring to yourself). For many people, Queer is the only term that accurately describes their identity, especially those who don't fit snugly into the binaries and categories. If you find Queer personally offensive, it's absolutely your right to assert that and people should respect that and not refer to you as it; I'm not questioning that. I don't use Queer to refer to anyone other than myself because I know how sensitive that word is to many, even though I feel that LGBT+ as a term is a bit archaic at this point.
Pretty much every widespread word or term that pertains to the community has origins as a pejorative term or is/has once been used as one. When it comes to which words strike a nerve or not is down to each individual. Whereas you don't like Queer in part because it means odd, weird and unusual, I personally like that for the same reasons that David pointed out in the video. I personally find f**got a really violent word and I don't like it, and it's origin is a food! [And the shortened version f*g also means a cigarette if you're British [which I'm assuming you are based on your choice of insult ;) ]]
Unfortunately, I don't think that there's any term right now that can encompass every identity aside from hetero/cis, be concise (LGBTQQIAAP is a bit of a mouthful) and also respect everyone's personal experience with the hardships that come with being not hetero/cis. I personally think Queer is the best term to describe our community - that I know of as of right now - because it includes not only all the identities we currently have, but also all the identities that have yet to be discovered and invented. For me, Queer means to be outside of the binaries and gender roles that I feel constricted by, and all of the fluidity and nuance that comes with it. But there are so many like yourself that are greatly offended by the word, and no matter what reason there may be for that, people should always feel welcome and safe in our community. It's a very complex and murky situation.
Part of me thinks we should do away with all of our labels, but that would mean that the sense of community would also dissipate, and I don't want that to happen. We should just instead call ourselves "The Cool Club" or something.
Sorry for the long reply, and thank you for reading.
@@mattcolins9264 So you think odd, weird and unusual is inherently bad? If you don't, it certainly seems so in your comment.
I personally use queer to describe my gender and romantic attraction just because of that, because it fits how I feel.
Of course I'm not about to call you queer without your consent, but I would like you to respect me enough to let me use a term for myself that I feel suits how I feel about myself.
(Woah, so many comments already!)
Thank you for talking about this, it's such an important subject as all of us face microaggressions on such a regular basis and so many of us who are in the LGBTQ+ community are so scared of offending that it sometimes gets hard to know in what context some of these words are or aren't offensive. There are so many things I want to say and I my thoughts are kind of shoving each other to get out of my brain goo and onto the intergoo... that sounded weird. Anyway, I'll just keep writing and see how this turns out.
So, I use the word queer proudly and I love using it. The only person who has ever been uncomfortable hearing me say it so far is my mom, which kind of goes with what you were saying in the video about the older generation being potentially offended by it. My mom's straight, but one of her brothers is gay and she remembers it being used as a homophobic slur against her loved ones, so I can understand where she's coming from. Also, it's a bit funny for me because everyone in my family, including my gay uncle, is in a stable, long term relationship, owns a house or condo, has a cute little picture-perfect life... and I'm a divorced trans girl in a polyamorous relationship living downtown in my little queer bubble. I totally feel like the rainbow sheep of the family :)
One of my friends, who's also trans, uses the t-slur as a re-appropriated word that "we" can use, but "they" can't. It still makes me uncomfortable when she says it and I did tell her once, but I don't want to ask her to stop because I feel she's well within her rights to re-appropriate it. However, the one word that absolutely gets me furious whenever I hear it is the s-slur. I've had straight boys on dating apps use that word thinking that they were somehow paying me a compliment! I don't understand how some people (even straight, cis, white boys!) can be so ignorant! I also hate being told that I "have the best of both worlds". That phrase disgusts me so much for so many reasons! I mean, clearly people who say that have gotten it from porn. Also, by telling me this, they're totally speculating on my genitals, which I never talk about with someone I'm just meeting for the first time! And if a presumed pre/non-op trans girl with breasts has the "best of both worlds," does that mean that a trans boy who's only had top surgery has the worst? What kind of fucked up implication is that? And what do those people say to cis women? "Oh, too bad you have a vagina, but at least you have boobs, so I'll fuck you anyway?"
Ugh... rant over. Thanks again, your videos are always so good! :)
Me: **hugs guy friend** No Hetero
I like using gay as an umbrella term... I know it means homosexual, but for me, who is non binary, I am fine with using gay, like saying I'm hanging with the gays. I like how it means happy as well, and I always use it when someone says they aren't comfortable with the q- word, which is really how I identify, but gay is a close second if the q word hurts someone.
I like this sort of thing in an informal sense, but I don't think this should be a mainstream umbrella term, because it leaves room for people to ignore the existence of the BTQIA. Even though some people still ignore them when the letters are blatantly in the LGBTQIA+ acronym, at least the letters are there.
I have huge issues with gay being used as an umbrella term. to me it's super erasing. I'm ace, I'm not gay. I'm trans, I'm not gay. I'm queer, I'm not gay. gay is one of few things I just very much am not. gay has such a specific meaning, and G has historically been such an imposing part of the LGBT(...) acronym that takes all the space, is all that's talked about, people only care about "gay rights", it's called "gay marriage" even though bi/pan/etc people are also affected, when people come out as trans people often react with "what so like you're gay?" and so on and so on ...
to me it just feeds so hard into negative stereotypes and enforces the erasure by gay people of pretty much everyone else in the community and I find it super hurtful when people see me and a partner and label us as gay, not to mention the trope of trans femmes being seen as "gay men who dress up".
I use gay to describe my sexuality unless I'm actually coming out to someone then I will tell them bi or pan
Kai they call it gay rights and gay marriage because they can't name every sexuality that is being attracted to the same gender in any kind of way that would take to long
sara I see it as a umbrella term for any of those that are at least part gay (bi pan includes romantics). But I feel like that’s mostly when referring to a smaller group of friends that you are close to. So hanging out with the gay group, overly horny gay group (only by the ace and spects) but my favorite term to call people with sexuality is to “the sexualities”
I'm not from an older generation (I'm 19) and before hearing lgbt people use queer i had only ever heard it used in a negative way. I don't mind if others identify as queer but i would prefer people to refer to me as bi rather than queer
ALL INCLUSIVE TERM:
SAGA !
sexuality
and
gender
alliance
it's my favorite
I feel a bit.... uncomfy with aro ppl using "no romo" though. because, unless they are gay aro, then the phrase no homo isn't theirs to reclaim. especially since no homo carries a lot of shame and uncomfy feelings for the gay community, but straight aros don't really get that, so I don't think it's theirs to reclaim at all.
Beth Nott i totally agree, really dont like hearing 'no romo' ugh
Beth Nott but if someone is aro, then they aren't straight.
GoToHello if theyre aro and heterosexual then theyre certainly not gay..
They're somewhere in the middle. The community is huge.
din margarine there is a lot of sexualities that “is not gay” would you say an asexual heteroromatic is straight? Maybe it was not ours to reclaim to begin with but it’s now apart of our community and a way to bond with other aces and friends even. Especially saying only “gay aces” can use no romo would break us apart and lead to outcasting by those not in the community as “straight”. I use it even though I have never wanted a relationship with the same sex. I use it as a way to allow those not comfortable saying love you to friends feel more comfortable and to stop my friends from saying “no homo”
Gay squad where you at?
Far from the computer....
The Useless Duck AKA Talia M Haiii❤💙💚💛💜🌈🌈🌈
wolf blood 🏳️🌈🏳️🌈🌈🌈❤️💛💚💙💜
The Useless Duck AKA Talia M ❤💛💚💙💜 There's no orange hearts :(
They should really have orange hearts 😭
The best description of the entire community that I’ve heard is “GSM.” Gender/Sexual Minorities
I think we should rename the LGBTQIA+ community to SAGA (Sexuality And Gender Acceptance) It sounds cool and includes everyone. It's just a thought, there might be a better name for it though.
IDK What I'm Doing At my school GSA stands for Gender Sexuality Alliance, rather than Gay Straight Alliance!
awesomecupcake 92 same and I like it a lot more
ISeeBothSidesLikeChanel well, we at least need the + for people who’s identities aren’t included within the other letters.
awesomecupcake 92 same!! That’s what we use :3
Finn Doesn't Know What They're Doing
Please don’t stop reading this right after my first statement but...SAGA kinda sucks if you’re planning on using it interchangeably with LGBT+. “Sexuality and Gender Alliance” implies the inclusion of everyone who falls into LGBT+ of course, but also eVERyOnE who is an ally to the entire LGBT+ community. That doesn’t work.
There’s a similar acronym that isn’t a list (list meaning something like LGBT+) that works a TON better. It’s MOGAI for “Marginalized Orientations/Gender Alignments & Intersex”. The addition of “Marginalized” includes everyone the same way the + attempts (because sometimes it isn’t read that way) to WITHOUT including cis-het allies because...even though we love them, they aren’t us.
my friends and i say "no hetero"
~Your Local Gay
hey pan squad where you at? 🍳
Legit Pro daz me
Legit Pro 🍳🍳🍳🍳🍳🍳
👋🏻🍳
:)
I'm late but howdy!
My stomach actually turns when I think of the F slur. A lot of Middle school/ High School trauma.
Its funny, I never realized how much Ive reclaimed the phrase "no homo". I can be having a casual conversation with a friend and say "Oh hey no homo, but I think you look really nice today." I even use it when talking to my datemate occasionally?????
I'm with David on the F-word. When I hear it and usually speak up. I tell them I equate it with calling a black person the N-word (with a hard R). The T-slur is along the same lines. Especially since I have a close friend who is transgender.
Me personally, I'm a 43 year old gay man.
5:08 I'm so glad that you two said "the f word" instead of actually saying it. :)
Personally, I really REALLY enjoy calling Conservative Christians who get offended by people of the same sex kissing "snowflakes" because they get really taken aback by it.
I feel like "special snowflake" is reclaimable in the way that "homo" is reclaimable. They don't really work in the traditional idea of affected peoples using the terms for themselves, but they do work in the reverse where the affected people use the term back on their oppressors. Aka, calling people offended by 'progressive' ideas and views "special snowflakes" like you mentioned or the way people talk about "heteros"
My friend used to say, “no homo” whenever we hugged or anything, but then I told her I’m nonbinary and she started saying, “no hometero”
My dad was a mechanic for a number of years ago and he used tranny as shorthand for transmission (i.e. "I need to do some tranny work on the van").
The first time I had ever heard it used as a slur against trans people I was so confused, I was just like "What about transmissions? Why are you calling someone a transmission?"
This is probably the best thing I have heard
But Ash! what about SAGA! (sexuality and gender acceptance) it's I a better title for the community than continuing to add more letters to LGBT+, and it's easier to say!
asmartkid on tumblr first introduced me to this acronym, and it solves the problem quite nicely! Also, a saga is "a long story of heroic achievement" which is a super rad way to describe us 'not straight' peeps!
The only word I'd really reclaim is queer because it's an identifier for many questioning/'not straight' people, and I think seeing it as a slur now that it's more accepted is doing a useful word a disservice.
Words such as T*****, D***, and F**/F***** are used as insults all of the time, Especially towards students like my friends and myself. A school is a very odd place for slurs, I think because of restrictions and loss of freedom students lash out at each other with disgusting things more than almost anywhere. A school creates the same sort of disassociation as a youtube comments section, we don't care if we're hurting people, as long as we are accomplishing a goal. Whether that goal is being funny or proving a point, the impact of most slurs is still there, so be extra careful when reclaiming words that are still being used as insults.
Hey, so I JUST saw this notification like two seconds after I came out to my parents as Pansexual. Don't worry, they were super supportive and nice. I also wanted to say that you (Ash) were one of a handful that helped a LOT in my coming out. Even if you never see this comment, I want to say thank you. :)
"yaaasss" is AAVE though, pls be aware of that and like. Don't.
I really enjoyed this conversation and hearing yall's perspectives. I hope the convo continues on the future!
I love your videos, Ash, but I feel the need to comment on your use of "heterosexual asexual" people and whether or not they count as straight. First, I'm going to assume you meant either asexual, heteroromantic people or heterosexual, aromantic people. But saying either of those identities don't really count as not-straight kind of invalidates what people with those identities have gone through, at least in my eyes. Like any other LGBT+ identity, people who are asexual and heteroromantic or heterosexual and aromantic have to go through a questioning phase, a coming out process, potentially face discrimination and have to worry about how their partners might react to their identities, in the same way you have worried about partners reacting to your pansexuality. I'm sure you didn't mean anything by it, but since your channel has always been such an accepting place, it was kind of hard to hear. I obviously can't speak for everybody, and Iike you were talking about in the video, there is no perfect blanket term. But to describe asexual, heteroromantic or heterosexual, aromantic people as "not straight but not LGBT+" could potentially be really hurtful.
Sound of the Waves I joke about asexuality as, "I'm so not-straight I went straight passed gay on the Kinsey Scale into the void." And even if I weren't also aromantic, that still wouldn't make me straight. Straight requires me to be attracted to male identified people, and I'm not. At all. Even if I were demi-asexual, and sometimes attracted to men, you couldn't say I'm "sometimes straight" because you wouldn't say someone who's bi is "sometimes straight." If they're always bi, they're always demi.
Sound of the Waves I'm sure she wasn't trying to hurt anyone's feelings or offend them, she was just saying that it gets tricky when talking about heterosexual asexual people as a whole, because it'd be hard to call them either straight or LGBT, as it would depend on what the person identifies as that determines that
TheLaziestU I think the important part of their comment was to address the "not not-straight" description. I see the term "cishet aces" in the Ace Discourse a lot and it sets my teeth on edge. We're not cishet. We're not straight. Asexual =/= heterosexual.
(I'm not angry with you, I mean this in a commiserating way. I know Ash didn't mean it negatively, but it's still hard to hear.)
Sound of the Waves ahhhhhhhhhhh I misspoke, I misspoke! I DID mean heteroromantic Ace people. My bad. And to clarify I definitely feel like any Ace or Aro person who identifies as LGBT is valid in that! I was trying to bring up the ace/Aro people who DO still ID as straight because of any hetero orientation they might also have. Because if they still ID'd as straight then "not straight" wouldn't work for them!
I can not STAND the term 'Cishet Aces' because it couldn't be further from the truth; just because one is Cisgendered does NOT indicate they are Heterosexual (I myself identify as a Cis Ace). To be honest, I feel like when people use the term Cishet Ace, they are pretty much invalidating Asexuals and Asexuality as a whole :/
Too late now, of course, but would have been interesting to have involved Jessica Kellgren-Fozard, (whom Ash has collaborated with before), in this.
JG-F is a Quaker, which was originally used as a sneering term for members of 'The Religious Society of Friends', but which is now totally owned and reclaimed by them, and now used by everybody with no negative connotations.
There was this one kid in my class who used the word 'homo' (to try and be like "your gay" but in a idiotic way because there was no "your") and I was like, "what, would you say, is 'homo?'" And he said "you" (with dumbfounded look on his face) and I said "congratulations! You have eyes!"
CRINGE
I’d love to see this type of video again, but with a guest who is old enough to remember the word “queer” being a slur and not a reclamation. I’m very interested in hearing their opinions based on their experience.
When someone calls me the “f” word I just say “yeah you’re not wrong”
What is this f-word everyone's talking about. I've genuinely no idea.
@@ElenaKomleva maggot with an f
@@ElenaKomleva same😭🙏
Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me
Me and my friends have reclaimed "No homo" by saying "All homo"
I’m so young that I never had a bad experience with any of these words. In my mind, they’re all reclaimed. It makes me feel safe and secure to know that people like you, normalizing the GRSM community have lead to me never experiencing hate for being bi. Thank you
Omg! Ash! I love your videos! You make me feel amazing about living my life and you help me to make the most of every day? 😋
Just thought this was a good quote: "It's hurt me, not my people, and I WILL take the power from it." -Ash Hardell 2017
i use the f word/d word when im by myself (im a lesbian btw) i never use it against anyone else in the community cus u never know who's okay with it and who's not unless u specifically ask, a lot of middle school trauma happened for me with the f word/d word so personally after reclaiming it i feel more empowered? (again only using when alone or talking w/ lgbtq+ friends who are okay with me using that slur near them or to them in a empowering way)
anyways just thought i would share my experience with these slurs lol
This is one of the best comment sections I’ve ever read! Almost everyone is nice and the conversations are really good to read. Makes me so happy!!!! :D
I thing we, as a community should use the term saga, which is sexuality and gender acceptance and it sounds hella cool. thumbs up if you agree?
W Glaser We as a community need to actually learn the meaning of community
How about the term cringe
W Glaser the only issue I have with SAGA is that it leaves too much room for cishet non-ace allies to butt into the conversation and try to argue that by being allies they are somehow part of our community
+Sasha Powers, good god you are a fucking idiot, you would really love segregation! It fits your "us vs them" mentality perfectly! Let me tell you something shithead having sexual preferences doesn't make you special and it doesn't make you a part of some super secret group.
Detective Lynch that's really unnecessary??
Forget “no homo” being homophobic. That’s obvious. I personally hate it because it’s ruining the concept of friendship between men.
Yes no romo is great
queer means derogatory its a disgusting word that was used against me as a gay man in the 80/s
Love this
this did not age well...
"Leave your answers in the comments below!"
"DON'T"
Lolz, that made me laugh.
If the violence David meant with the f word is about gay people being burned at the stake, that's actually a myth. F- does mean a bundle of sticks, but it had nothing to do with burning anyone. It started as an insult to women, mostly older women, as in calling them a burden (something you have to carry around) and was then used toward gay men. Obviously it's still insulting, and there is certainly a history of it being used alongside violence, but I learned that recently myself and wanted to clear up that particular myth! (Not saying that makes it okay to use, at all, and apologies if I misunderstood his meaning!)
I have seen a lot of people spreading a post saying that f-g originated from the slang for cigarette, saying that gay men were rolled up in rugs and burned alive much like a cigarette, but that was later proven to be untrue. However I've never actually seen anybody talk about the actual origin of the word before!!
Identity used to be very important to me, and I felt a strong need to find labels that matched how I felt. As I've grown into my identity a bit more, I have lost this feeling of urgency. I personally identity with the word 'queer', because it expresses my non-binary gender identity and my non-heterosexuality.
Something I've experienced from within the LGBT+ community is a sort of reverse slur. My current partner is a bisexual cis man and although I am non-binary/genderqueer, I present in traditionally feminine ways. Often, my partner and I will be holding hand/sitting together/giving a quick peck on the cheek, and the LGBT+ people around us will recoil and call us 'hetero'. I personally find this very bothersome, as neither of us is hetero. While being in a hetero-passing relationship does give us a certain privilege, I feel it is inappropriate to use 'hetero' as an insult against such relationships.
As a label for the community I like "gsd" which stands for "gender and sexual diversity" :)
the term GSD was made by a pedophile so that pedophilia could be considered lgbt+, so it's not a great word to use. Any other new, short acronym I'm all for but that one probably shouldn't be used because of its origins
aquarius oh good point, I didn't know that.
aquarius Sure. It's more complex that I thought. I like GSD as a group with LGBT+ being a subset of that but that doesn't solve the problem of LGBT being unencompassing.
I can get really angry when people refer to Other people with a word I have reclaimed. Just because not everyone might be comfortable or get offended. Just because I reclaimed it doesnt make it ok for my friends or family to call someone that word based on their prejudices. "But they're like you" is a common defensive response. Not a fan.
to point out something you said early on in the video, the term GSD (gender sexuality diversity) is a term i like that describes the LGBT+ community without excluding any identities :)
lizard boy although it doesn't take into account romantic orientations... like homoromantic/biromantic/pan etc
Ghost Bill yeah that's true. it would be better if it wascalled GRSD
Ghost Bill yeah that's true. it would be better if it wascalled GRSD or something like that
Source please
lizard boy
I think GSM (gender and sexual minorities) makes slightly more sense but it means practically the same thing. It would be cool to see these become more mainstream cause it's more inclusive than LGBTQ+ but I don't think it will any time soon.
I told my friends that I'm Pan and they told that they were questioning and we use "the gay swing"
PIVOT!!
I totally agree with what you guys said. I don't have ties to the lgbtq+ community as a straight women, but I do feel similarly as a special ed teacher about the "R" word. I know so many people that have been hurt by that word and it causes me to feel very upset when I hear it used in any context. I'm glad you made this video.
Personally, I think words are what you make of them and hold as much power as you give them. If you let yourself get really offended over the word "queer," then that's what it'll be to you. Meanwhile there's some people who use the word "tranny" as a cute little nickname of sorts. But in the end, they're just words. :3
interesting view but i don't think it's always that easy because word do have power and (how Kat Blaque said) speech (slurs etc.) often is the step before violence so i think that it's important not to forget that :). but if you can just let no words affect you and take all the power away from slurs for yourself that's awesome :3.
Elli Cookiee Whether or not words come before violence, they are not violence so cannot hurt you unless you take offense. And I wouldn't take advice from Kat Blaque anyway, unless you want to fed a false reality of the world. Kat is very skilled in her language to make you believe the craziest of things.
I'm 72 years old, and in spite of taking part in street demonstrations chanting "We're here, we're queer, get used to it" the word still makes me uncomfortable.
I am queer in the sense that I am a hobbit who adventured beyond the Shire.
Ngl I’d be so down to be called the Crooked Community. Gives me pirate vibes 😩
I always really enjoy your discussions! I feel like you get into the issues really well, but remain very respectful of the subjects. I always come away from these videos feeling like I've learned something.
I have a problem with the current reclaiming and identification with "it" as "it" was used as a slur against gender non-conforming and non-binary individuals when I was younger, and certain people around me do it. As much I want to respect pronouns, I'd rather use no pronouns than call someone "it" due to the harm done against my friends, family, and myself due to the word.
I think a good umbrella term for the community is the "Awesome-sauce Community"
I love it! 🥺🌈✨♥️
SAGA, GSD and MOGAI, possibly amongst other acronyms, are some more inclusive and encompassing alternatives to LGBT+!
This is very interesting as someone who's not from an english-speaking country !!
I've personally reclamed the word queer, mostly because it's being so mainstream (?) and since the word gay is usually heavily connected to mlm, it feels more like an umbrella term or a good term for someone (like me) who's kind of not sure about their label, but I'm not really sure if I should use it, since I don't have any personal experience with it
You could also say that I've reclamed the word homo, since I use it in every day situations. But the thing is that in my language homo (and lesbo) are really the only terms for people who experience same-sex attraction (we don't have words like gay or queer, and even our lgbt (hlbt) is not well-known or something that really works in conversations)
Now, the f slur is something I think, for me, is off limits, even if I for some reason wanted to reclaim it. Not because I'd be uncomfortable with it, but because it's not something that has been used against me
It's an English term so I don't have any history with it and no ties to it, so I don't feel like I can truly understand it (like something like pink triangles - I think only jewish gays can reclaim it)
But then there's some slurs in my native language that I have thoughts about. As someone who kind of identifies as lesbian, I feel like lepakko (lit. a bat) is something I can reclaim. H*ntti, on the other hand is like the f word for you - so bad I just want it to go away, maybe reclaim it in 30 years or something but not right now, not when it's still used so much around
Where I live the f-word is not considered an insult by a majority of the youth and is used in conversation without any consequences and its HORRIBLE!
My brother absolutely refuses to use my correct pronouns and the fact that I am gender-fluid not a man or woman and he always calls me Mr sister witch just makes me feel like I am taking 5 steps back in the process of coming out
Mr sister witch
I'm really liking the up in quality and production in your videos, Ash!
I have a question.
So I'm a lesbian and sometimes I use the word "gay" to describe myself or things.
I know the word gay is most described for gay men right? So is it okay if I use the word to describe myself even tho im a lesbian.
Sorry if that was confusing.
THE CROOKED COMMUNITY. I love it. I feel that this video is so so important. I personally identify a lot with the word queer, and I have to remember a lot that many people see queer as a slur. It was one of then first identities I really felt at home in when I first started figuring out my sexuality, so it's very personal to me and I have trouble pulling back from it sometimes when I should. This discussion is so important to me as well because some of my friends use slurs like the f word a lot. Not constantly, but in a way that is noticeable. They are all a part of the LGBTQ+ community in some way, but I still feel that it is important to be careful about it. They can really make people uncomfortable or hurt. The f word makes me uncomfortable, like David said, even though I haven't had anything really personal happen to me involving that word. It just feels wrong. Idk. Thank you so much for making this! Love it
4:25 WE SHOULD CALL THE COMMUNITY THE SAGA COMMUNITY (Sexuality And Gender Alliance)
A word that wasn't mentioned that isn't really used anymore but I still have a negative connection with is the d word (for those of you who don't know what the d word is its a very homophobic word meant for masculine lesbians) I know it's not used much now but I still hear it a little bit and not in a homophobic way, it's almost coming back in a casual way which I don't think is okay
Hey Ash! I was wondering if you could make a video about some of the more controversial intra-community debates (are ace/aro people inherently LGBT? etc.), just because we all really value your opinion, and it'd be really interesting to hear you talk about!
I like what Ash said about being aware of who you're talking to. I think intentions are very important, because everyone can slip up every now and then but it's def important to call them out and let them know why it offends you. I personally never understand the defence of: "but it's only a word!!" because like yeah, exactly - it's only a word so why use it if you know it causes offence, when there are loads of other words you could easily use instead?
The week off did you good, Ash. You're absolutely glowing!
I prefer using the term queer to describe the community because it's inclusive without being an acronym, and it's easy for people to understand what I'm talking about. LGBT+ is probably the best term to use right now, but I feel as though it's created an unofficial hierarchy in the community and that people feel entitled to pick and choose which identities get to be included.
I feel like I'll switch to one of the better acronyms once most people are familiar with them.
I tend to use LGBT+ in unfamiliar situations and should probably stick to that more often online.
It's more respectful to older LGBT+ people who might have bad experiences with the word, and I hadn't considered that.
i think what it comes down to is respect and common courtesy. no one should call someone a name that they don't want to be called, even if its been reclaimed by the first person. i'm from a rural area in australia and the word queer is still very much used as an insult here. just yesterday i heard a straight person say as an insult it to say why they're against 'queers' and marriage equality in this country. i'm not really triggered by the word queer but its does make me uncomfortable. i don't identify with the word and i would rather just be called gay or lesbian, you know? i have no issue with people who do like the word and identify with it and i would never insist that they should call themselves a word that i am more comfortable with. only call people by words they want to be called should be understood by people on all sides of the reclaimed slurs debate tbh.
Very thoughtful video. I get what David is saying about the 6-letter F-word being the most directly born of violence (due to its murderous origin), but once ties to violence is interpreted to mean 'words that have been used during violent attacks' I feel like the legitimacy of excusing the word 'Queer' goes out the window. I know people (baby boomers) who were coming up well before we were and who are still triggered by that word after horrific experiences to the tune of 'queer'. I personally use the reclaimed word as my primary identifier, but I think it is important to recognize that it is not so faded into the past for some of our elders in the community.
great video. you handled the topic really well 💛
personally I will not use the f word to describe myself or anyone else but where I'm from in England (I'm not sure everyone uses it) the short form of the word is used to describe cigarettes. although i do not smoke, some people in my family do and often use the word for this meaning. not to mention they use it to describe people of the LGBTQ+ community and not being out to them this is really harmful. the same word is a type of meat and gravy food mostly eaten in Wales and the southish parts of the UK and so it is still difficult for me to hear the word even with it's context and meaning being completely different.
About what to call the LGBT+ community, I was thinking, we keep adding more letters to the acronym to try and include more people, but obviously, if we were to try and include everyone's identity, the acronym would be EXTREMELY long. So no matter what we do, some people are going to fall into the catch all "+". But what if we just got rid of everything in front and made it the "plus community"? Then we could include everyone's identity equally instead of having it be like "LGBT (maybe QIA) and then everyone else. Also that could solve the problem of what to call people because it doesn't have the potential negative connotation of "queer" or the weird connotation of "this person is LGBT+" (like all at the same time???) Also, Ash, loved this video and every other video of yours that I've ever seen lol!
I just realized that every time I watch one of Ash's videos I always have just one earbud in and it'll be wrapped around my ear, and whenever I finish watching the video I'm always like "Damn I have so may thoughts with this topic I really need to start a channel"
Lmao love you Ash, keep up the good work
I don't know where I read that anymore but someone talked about usings Sexuality And Gender Acceptance (SAGA) as a new acronym for the LGBTQIA+ community and I liked it, it's a lot broader and includes labels that haven't yet been coined
The T slurs should not be reclaimed because of the violence against transgender people-Jessi
My friend Kay changed her name from Katie to Kay a few years ago and i honestly found it easy to remember because i would start saying "Katie" and then just stop short. :) But it also made me accidentally stop short and call my brother Caleb "Kay" sometimes. :P
A really interesting real-life example of this is documented in the film Pride where LGSM (Lesbians and Gay's Support the Miners) were getting discriminated against in newspapers with the headline 'perverts support the pits' so the group had a huge fundraising event called Perverts Support the Pits for the miners (also Pride is incredible and everyone should watch it)
I haven’t watched the full video yet but I had to pause it so I could leave this comment! There was a day that I remember so vividly when a group of guys in my elementary school came up to me and my friend and randomly asked “are you crooked or straight?!” I knew it was a loaded question given their enthusiasm but I said with no hesitation “crooked” and they laughed so hard then ran back to their friends and left me with no idea with what that meant. Then I asked my mom later (I was never close with my mom) “hey, do you know what being crooked means?” And she responded with “you mean straight?” And I told her what the guys said and she said “they were just making a play on words, basically the guys thought if you weren’t straight (Herero) then you must be crooked” I was okay with my answer then and now. 😂 but I haven’t heard that since he said crooked. Flashback for sure. 😂 I love that idea.