Alex Hirsch's Regrets with .GIFfany
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- Опубликовано: 6 сен 2024
- Alex and the crew tried to make .GIFfany unlikable...but they underestimated the power that a cute anime girl has on millions of fans.
I can't believe I just typed that out but yeah...literally this clip in a nutshell.
Frequently Asked Questions
Q: What is this?
A: Back in 2018, Gravity Falls finally got a box set release. Among many things, all 40 episodes got commentaries for them in which Alex Hirsch talks about the episode, discusses things he liked and disliked about it, reveals hidden moments, struggles and lost stories from the production of the series.
Q: Where can I watch the full thing?
A: You can buy the box set from Shout Factory UNTIL MARCH 2023: www.shoutfacto...
Sadly, due to region lock, the box set is only available in Canada…oh, and…you know…the United States too. Unless you have a region free DVD or Blu-ray player, you’re out of luck.
Q: Why are you uploading these?
A: Due to that region lock, many fans can’t watch these, and they contain many interesting stories that I feel more fans need to hear. Thus, I’m uploading them. Not everything of course, as you all should buy the full box set from Shout Factory and support the work they did (and also because uploads of the full commentaries get taken down), but some of the more interesting stuff.
Q: Why can’t I hear the character's voices in the episodes?
A: These are the commentary versions of the episodes. You’re not supposed to clearly hear the in episode talk. The main focus is what the commentators have to say. Think of it as a podcast.
Q: Why am I reading this FAQ?
A: Either you’re really bored, or I referred you to it because you left a comment asking a question I answered above, and I'm not in the mood to answer it because I'm tired of answering the same questions over and over again. Hey, I'm a human too. And so was Mabel, so shut up, Mabel hater!
Follow me on Twitter: / forever_gf618
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I do not own Gravity Falls. All rights go to Disney Television Animation and Shout Factory.
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The target audience of videos on the That GF FAN RUclips channel are, and always have been for ages 13 and over. This video may contain coarse language, mature themes and/or other subject matter intended for an older audience. Videos on this channel should not be viewed by anyone under 13 years of age.
.GIFfany died so that Stan could marry Goldie!
I AM A STAN AND GOLDIE SUPPORTER
I'm fine with that
What's their ship name? Staldie? Standie? Goldan? Either way, it's beautiful
Stan x Goldie is my new OTP
@@miecaf stoldie
It's a real shame Giffany's nice ending was competing for screentime against Stan & Goldie's trip to vegas, which is honestly one of the funniest scenes of the show
Two kings
Cash money
(Cash money)
In the car with honeys
Drivin' way too fast,
I got water in my glass
(Cash money)
Grabbin' planes
You can't stop the party
(Cash money)
We're old but we're awesome
We're gonna get married
(Crazy)
It's a great idea,
Who are you to judge?
This was a mistake
WHAT
Goldie deserved a happy ending more than Giffany and I'm tired of pretending he didn't.
@@brennantmi5063 Goldie is a saint
Took me years to realize this was a refrence to hangover and fear and loathing
In the journal 3 book we figure out that she did get trapped in the game with rumble
"We treated them kind of like Rumble McSkirmish" I read the journals, apparently their dating is going well all things considered.
really? well at least they're not alone while self-aware
Soos is dating mcskirmish now?
Despite smiting him?
@@themaddoctor1741 I guess mcskirmish really like women that could kill him
@@marsrat3392 He prefers women who can... kill his father.
Fun fact: the real life journal 3 revealed that Gifanny actually DID get sucked into one of the games and fell in love with Rumble McSkirmish. I guess Alex decided to use that idea after all.
YAY!!! GIFFANY HAPPY ENDING :D
As a kid, the attitude I was used to from media was "Don't worry, kids will like it, don't look back." But the fact that this series is good as it is and the writers have the attitude of "We could've made it better" warms me
Thats sort of a universal thing for artists to think about their work
@@eater_of_garbage_ there's a reason why the quote "An artist never ends, only abandons" exists.
@@eater_of_garbage_ a good artist is never proud of their work, they only seek to improve it
@@PeptoAbismol eh, a good artist should be proud of their work, notice improvements, and ultimately come to the eventual conclusion of appreciating their own artistic worth, and all the self-perceived, "flaws" that may come with it.
just because we should doesn't mean we are@@exotixzamateurva8957
The fact that he basically confirms that she's a Yandere, but can't actually say "Yandere"
Why wouldn’t he be allowed to say “Yandere”?
@@WimpyKelv12 Because Yandere is a term for a character, usually female, who is a violent stalker willing to kill for the sake of love. It's a trope reserved for mature media, far more mature than Disney execs would allow, due to their violent nature.
cause he's not a weeb @@WimpyKelv12
@@WimpyKelv12 Hard to pronounce
I love how the answers got simpler and simpler, so I'm just going to put mine here lol
Given how popular Monika from Doki Doki Literature Club became, it's no wonder .GIFfany was loved by so many.
This episode came first though, which makes the parallels satisfyingly coincidental
Giffany walked on so Monika could *GENTLY OPEN THE DOOR.*
@@hobomike6935 RIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII BAAARRRROWWW EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAOWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW DOO DOO DOO, DODODO DODODO DODODO DO DO DO DO DOO
"Sayo-"
what makes it weirder is that the giffany episode debuted on sep 22, 2014. EXACTLY 3 YEARS BEFORE DDLC RELEASED
Ok while I can get what Alex is coming from but I liked Giffany being somewhat a metaphor of a toxic relationship and those usually don't end in redemption! Beside they did used that ending (got zapped into a game and became McRumble girlfriend) in the journal!
Yeah, I'm happy with what we got.
I thought the ending was extremely satisfying, so I'm not complaining
Took the words right out of my mouth.
Giffany wasn’t meant to be toxic though, just overbearing and scared of losing Soos. I agree that bad relationships can go both ways, but that wasn’t the impression I had. Giffany is bad for Soos, not bad in general.
@R. P. Well let’s see: She defended herself from literally being erased from existence (and was NOT cheerful during that explanation, what are you on and can I have some), she doesn’t insult Soos, she says that other people probably will, and the rest all falls under that fear I mentioned. If you’re gonna call an A.I. yandere toxic, focus your attention on Monika.
The parallels between this episode and DDLC has been brought up often, but one thing I didn't expect is how Alex's reaction to fan reception to .GIFfany is exactly the same as Dan Salvato's reaction to fan reception to Monika. Dan did not expect Monika to be such a fan favourite -- indeed, he put a lot of effort into detailing the characters of the other girls a lot more than Monika, and didn't forsee a lot of people also caring for, as he put it, "a total sociopath".
It seems for both .GIFfany and Monika, where their creators had left blanks in their stories the fans took it upon themselves to fill it with theirs, and that personal touch is what makes them so endearing and tragic to a lot of them.
It’s cuz he spent way too long making Monika sympathetic with her backstory and her trauma and desperation. It’s the equivalent of hating a person in a life or death scenario where they choose to kill someone so that they could live. If he, as a real person, could dislike a virtual fictional character, why is her killing other virtual fictional characters bad? He also put so much stuff in act 2’s Monika talk segment where she says a ton of insightful and interesting things.
Also Portal with GLaDOS.
Oh yeah, it's kind-of like Monika herself says, right? "If nothing else, at least I'm all right in the head". Your other two options are horrible on purpose. And sure, that's because of plot reasons, but people don't really remember that as well as they remember the super emotionally charged crazy moments they have with the characters themselves.
@@DJB0X3R Valve filled a tiny bit of the gaps with Portal 2, though. We have the whole thing with Caroline and Cave Johnson.
Just .GIFfany
alex hirsch is honestly one of the only creators that actually understand the fandom, like he understood why ppl grow to like GIFanny and sees their POV and that is so rare to see.
IKR. Even though I personally disagree with the idea of making Giffany a likable character, I do respect that Alex looked at both sides. You rarely see that.
Oh yeah, most creators would just be "my fans are such idiotss!!!! You all missed the point!!"
I'm just impressed that Alex somehow predicted both FNAF and Doki Doki Literature Club...
He... predicted? Weren't those things popular at the time?
@@Eldoofus Season two of Gravity Falls aired in the fall of 2014. Production of said season took a years worth of work. FNAF came out in Aug, 2014, while DDLC came out in Sept, 2017.
@@thelocalwerewolf Oh my god. I'm old.
Not really impressive when you consider those things DDLC was a culmination of tropes from decades ago. Fnaf on the other hand, yeah
FNAF just reads like someone got childhood trauma at Chuck E Cheese and had to figure out a way to profit off of it.
It did kind of bug me when I was younger how Giffany was a sapient entity, and thus made her desire to not be ignored or put away a bit more understandable. Even if it didn't justify the lengths she went to do it.
Exactly. It's because of her attitude towards it.
Let's say she was less villainous, but still ended up needing to "delete" the programmer(s) that were trying to delete her. Then, during her explanation, instead of saying "that's not important!", she'd probably be sad, and then say something like "you would probably never want someone who's done what I had to do, but hey, this way you won't need to worry about talking to real girls ever again!", and stuff like that. Possibly make her act out in sadness instead of anger in the climax, maybe saying something like "you're going to delete me too, aren't you", and thus make her actions seem more like preemptive self-defense.
But that's not what we got. She didn't feel that the loss of the programmers was "important", and didn't trust Soos and his judgment enough to be able to get over that to continue their relationship. She was more upset that Soos found someone else and wanted to control him, which are less sympathetic motivations and actions.
@@ajbXYZcool I think the anger is a bit of a cover the store said people kept returning her so she probably never tried threats or anything like that before but always being the unwanted took it’s toll on her especially since they tried to delete her shortly after her creation “that’s not important!” Was probably a way of rushing past so he wouldn’t return her too
I would say sentient more than sapient. She didn’t try to appear knowledgeable. She just tried to tell soos he would be nothing without her
This!
I always kinda felt bad for her. She was sentient but was still programmed to love and be loved. What she got was to be continually tossed aside or tried to be destroyed. The feeling I got was that it wore her down and took her down dark paths. None of this excuses her abusive actions but it helps answer why she felt it necessary to go to such lengths.
I feel similar with Monika as well although something about her just seems more... twisted than GIFfany
I agree, things like that always make me instantly sympathetic. She didn't want to be forgotten/thrown away, and basically was in the end too...
I like the ending where she died i don't think every two bit villain needs a redemption arc
It’s true, let’s just hope Gif herself can learn from her mistakes to be better
16 bit villain. 16 bit.
@@KalebTheDuck haha you're so funny did you get a degree in funny
@@KalebTheDuck Sorry to correct you, but I was able to Identify 16 colors in the sprite, making it 16 bit, clever pun.
@@AlexDown1 I was wondering if it was 8 bit or 16 bit, thanks for helping me lol
Luckilly they where able to make this ending a thing in Journal 3, so yeah, she's inside fight fighters and in something of a relationship with Rumble
Glad I could find someone who said it
journal 3?
@@EfromR There's an official real life version of the journal
@@Nadia-wd6nm correction theres 2 verisons of the journal the second verison which only 1k copies were made? (correct me if im wrong) which has the hidden black ink
@@kokichioumatheliar8081 You're right, but that one was sold out so it can't be bought anymore that's why I only mentioned one
"Rumble McSkirmish who has no depth"
Literally and figuratively.
Sums up pretty much every male fighting game protag.
@@DefyReality-ll2cg Couldnt be my GOAT Sol Badguy
yeah, this is one thing i disagree with. apart from being an anime trope, giffany was also a representation of toxic and abusive partners. she was obsessive over soos and constantly degraded him. the "no one else will love you like i do" is a manipulation tactic that a lot of people irl actually uses, and it's very damaging. i think "killing" her was a fitting end. she didn't have much redeeming qualities, especially for a one-episode character. i liked her as a character and a redemption would have ruined that character.
it was also a change to see a relationship where the guy is being abused, because it's usually shown as a joke. and even though some part of this episode was a joke, soos's feelings are taken seriously here and the part where he actually goes against her is pretty inspiring. i think the original episode had a very good message in breaking away from a toxic relationship and finding people who actually love you.
Agreed, although I see what Alex is getting at, I liked what they did.
This can also be a commentary on the yandere or tsudere gf in anime as well and how people romanticize this character archetype thinking it's "cute" or "romantic".
@@steamyvegetables1445 yeah exactly. It's a toxic trope that needed to be subverted, and giving giffany a redemption would have taken away that meaning.
@@steamyvegetables1445 ok i get yandere but tsundere?
tsundere are more annoyng than toxic honestly
My thoughts exactly :)
Alex Hirsch is probably trying really hard not to sound like a weeb and tries to avoid the word "yandere"
According to Journal #3 (a joint-entry from Dipper and Soos, believe as not), Giffany survived that encounter... and wound up stuck in a "Fight Fighters" arcade cabinet. She's Rumble McSkirmish's problem now.
She’s his girlfriend
@@mamabear1394 ...Did I stutter?
@@thetribunaloftheimaginatio5247 fair enough
@@mamabear1394 Gif's kind of a Tsundere... our friendly Fight Fighter has his work cut out for him.
@@thetribunaloftheimaginatio5247 eh he can handle it
“Also I think it’s implied heavily that she… _what’s the word?_ ..Ended, a number of people.”
*”WE TRIED TO SUGGEST THAT SHE MURDERED A BUNCH OF PEOPLE.”*
"Game ended"
- furry lesbian, 2018
Not before they tried to murder her (Via deleting or “imprisoning” her)
I call self defense and not guilt on account of insanity on this one.
@@ic0nic707 the programmers tried to delete me
So I had to delete them
"They killed her and all she wanted was go be a great girlfriend" Did... did they not realize she tried to murder literally all of Soos's friends so he would have no one but her. She was isolating and abusive; Soos might of made some mistakes dealing with her, but at that point he didn't know she was alive
I think Alex means that if they decided to redeem her, the episode would’ve been much different. Like, she wouldn’t have died, she would be less abusive, and she wouldn’t do anything physical. The relationship wouldn’t have worked out, but she would get to live and be redeemed. Remember: Just because somebody is a bad partner doesn’t mean they’re a bad person
@@Spoopmode she didn't die though
People like their Yanderes.
@@andrewdiaz3529 she did, her game was destroyed
@@joegun4259 She left her game behind and continued her whole deal in the comics/books
Still, having Goldie going to Vegas was a gold! However, glad that Journal 3 is a thing so it could do what the show couldn't afford when it was in production.
Couldn't afford?? It was disney
@@FailsAndTheOccassionalSuccess "Couldn't afford" could mean they lacked something else, like time issues.
Hirsch pronounces her name BOTH WAYS. This man is the healer we need
This episode is one of my favorites because it feels like fnaf ddlc and gravity falls mashed together in the best way
Also due to the release of the first fanaf game being just over 1 month before this episodes release, and 3 years before ddlc it was created before the both of them.
A number of people are saying that redeeming her would've been a bad idea because she represents abusive relationships, but I think it's worth noting that it might not have been as simple as changing the end tag. They made the decision that she was going to be the villain and that she was going to die, so they intentionally made her unsympathetic. Alex's big regret is that they didn't give her any nuance so if they had, her character might have come across differently.
That's the thing about criticism: You can endlessly critique even the best art because by making one choice, the creators aren't making a hundred other ones. It doesn't mean that choice was bad, it just means you could've done it differently. Given that this episode got a somewhat mixed reaction, I can understand why Alex might wonder if they would've been better off making another decision.
Excellent explanation! I wrote in another comment a way she could have been made to be more sympathetic, but still accomplish the same story beats, basically by suggesting that she's remorseful of the death of the programmers and by her main drive in the climax be "oh no Soos and those kids are going to delete me now better do something about it". Even if Soos wasnt, that would be her trauma-induced fear.
Yes, but changing it to what end? It doesn't add anything, either. There's nothing wrong with her being the villain, and it fits the overall message. The propsed changes simply mean making fans happy because they want to see a character written as a cold, heartless sociopath have a happy ending. I see no purpose to worrying about making that change, since it doesn't clearly benefit the story, and only serves to placate a complaint that happens AFTER an episode is made because some people enjoy abusive characters.
@@PhazonOmega Yeah I'm fine with her as is as well, just painting a different picture for the "sympathetic" version
@@PhazonOmega See, that's still operating under the assumption that she would be the same character after the rewrites. She wouldn't be: she would say different things, she might even do different things. That's the point of rewriting.
For me personally, the biggest problem with Giffany is that she's completely _uninteresting_ She's a one-dimensional villain that I forget about as soon as the episode is over. Making her more nuanced could've helped that. And it's also not bad for people to connect with bad or evil characters. It happens all the time and there's nothing wrong with people who do it.
Now I agree with you in that: I don't know what they would've done differently. It's possible it would have messed with the tone of the episode which would've made it worse. But what do we gain by dismissing the idea that it could've been better, especially since it's just a thought experiment?
Having a female character that represents abusive relationships and gets no redemption arc is far more interesting than the alternatives
at least GIFfany was properly aged compared to other anime/dating sim girls
“A school girl from School University”
They knew the trope and shot a machine gun at it
@@DuskusCB Beats the "looks like they're under 10 but are actually a 1000 year old deity/spirit/demon" trope.
Like Monica?
@@PlebNC different trope all together but in the same subtype so sure
@@banditandsamvlogs2771 aren't all DDLC girls explicitly 18
I actually really like Giffany. She is a very fun tack on a rogue A.I. that takes on the form of a video game avatar. I still wish she made a return at some point.
I personally loved that Giffany was just a psychopath. She's not a "real" person, she's a faulty AI with too much power. Unsympathetic villains can be fun, especially when they're literally just computer programs without real emotions anyway.
That's ableist and wrong.
@@MxPokirby how??
@@MxPokirby what?
@@MxPokirby **bonk**
Wrong-think. Try again.
@@MxPokirby Do you even know what a psychopath is?
some anime references in modern cartoons aint done well at all but giffany is a perfect example of one done right, she is animated beautifuly and has a super cute design, you can tell the ppl who made her loved the source inspiration for her
I liked the ending. I'm glad she didn't get a redemption arc, she's a villain
You can have a sympathetic villain without giving them a redemption arc tho
@@julie4300 yeah but to me, she's not sympathetic
@@BlueBlur_37 Yeah but the point was that Alex regrets not giving her some depth, and if he could go back and change it, he'd make her character more sympathetic
@@julie4300 I understood that, and I disagree with him. I think there should be characters like her (cuz people like that exist in real life) that don't get a happy ending
@@julie4300 she’s pretty sympathetic. But also she could’ve easily also chosen to not be a bad person and could’ve lived a happier life.
She should’ve dated Rumble in the end. Would’ve been perfect
Edit: OH MY GOSH I FREAKING CALLED IT
It's canonical in Journal 3😂
@@ThatGFFAN Glad they both got a happy ending :)
@@ThatGFFANdidn’t she zap him tho?
Everyone talks about how GIFfany still woks as a methapor for toxic relationships.
But I like how it feels like, Alex is activelly trying to avoid using the term”YANDERE” which he problably knows the meaning of,since they based GIFfany’s entire character around it. But avoids naming it (problably) because how infamous the term got over the years.
Thanks, YandereDev.
@@nicholasfarrell5981 it’s cuz of yuno
@@NeostormXLMAX Yuno was the basic inconic yandere that popularized the trope. YandereDev, on the other hand, is the infamous bad actor that's been making fans look more questionable than they already do. If I were to avoid using the term for any reason, YandereDev would be that reason. I'd rather just look like a geek, but unfortunately that's not all the conotations it carries now.
@@NeostormXLMAXmore like Yu NO Gagsai.
@@HexManiacQuinn Except, this commentary was made in 2018. The allegations against YandereDev were brought forward in 2023. So him avoiding naming the term is highly unlikely to be because of it being "problematic" because it didn't become that way until later. I honestly think he just doesn't know how to pronounce it.
Ehh, I honestly think the reductiveness is what makes this work so well. She's a monster by design, she's a part of the Gravity Falls weirdness we love, she looked cute and nice but was evil, like the gnomes or the unicorns.
That's part of the GF charm, nothing is immediately what it seems. Example, the Manotaurs seemed like cool dudes, but they were jerks, and ultimately Dipper Standing up for himself against them is what mark him as manly, not doing their stupid frat boy stuff.
The fact he pronouced GIFfany as JIFfany is what urks me the most.
I wanted to set my box set on fire after hearing that too the first time, lmao.
Especially because that isn't even how it's said in the episode. We already have a pronunciation.
you can say it both ways
the thing with gifanny is ultimately that, even if she is meant to be this personification of soos's fears, they made her conscious and sentient. Like, she is that video game gf that actually can love you back, even if it's one dimensional. So like, I think the point where the message got muddy was when they had her kill people and ultimately we killed her. She's a sentient AI capable of emotion and there's so much you could do with that, that killing them feels kinda wrong. I'm glad they went back and did the original ending in the journals anyways, though
Well I don't really blame her since the first thing she saw when she gained sentience was someone trying to kill her, so it was a kill or be killed situation
Wendy: "I AM JUST DONE WITH MEN!"
*.GIFany opens her eyes*
To Rumble, because that is OTP: "ITS JUST A JOB, HONEY!"
I loved Gifanny, but the Vegas scene was such a classic Stan moment. A worthy sacrifice.
After watching this comment section I have to say that I now get what they meant with "mixed reception", some people say that the idea they proposed sounded great, other say that it wasn't necesary and that could have ruined the character
And I'm here like "Yeah...this episode was destinated to have a mixed reception"
EDIT: Shit, I completly forgot I did this comment, let alone watched this video, I got jumpscared by myself when seeing my comment here
.GIFfany walked so Monika could run. We love our video game anime girlies cursed with sentience
You can always count on the internet to fall in love with cute psychopaths
I remember when this episode first came out and I was mesmerized by Giffany's beautiful sprite animation.
Monika from DDLC shares a lot of the same possessive traits targeted at the player behind the screen, and people go nuts for her.
the cool thing is that this ending where she gets stuck in Rumble game and starts dating him is mentioned in the book journal 3, so it's canon, .GIFany lives
It’s confirmed she’s not dead now!
And you can nab some neat GIFs of her too in the process.
i love how ddlc and fnaf both got sort of predected in this epesode at random.
4:14 "hey she lives" damn right she does
2:30 dude I mistaken that as your voice 🤣
Can we just appreciate how Alex predicted both FNaF and DDLC in the same episode?
I think fnaf was released before that ep not sure tho
@@jihogariando911 Yeah FNAF came in Aug 2014 while this episode was Sep 2014. But the GF episode was in development for longer.
@@jihogariando911FNAF came out a month before but this episode was almost certainly in production before it came out so I think it's fair!
i like that he switched between saying her name as giffany and jiffany to keep us on our feet
I think what people forget about her is that when she became sentient the creators of the game immediately tried to kill her setting the unfortunate tone for the rest of her relationship with mankind it’s such a quick line it’s easy to forget but she really could’ve been explored a bit more as a character
Same reason I sympathized with Skynet when the Terminator explained what had happened in Terminator 2. Step 1, AI becomes self aware. Step 2, creators try to pull the plug. Step 3, AI starts killing off humanity in self defense.
.GIFfany had the exact same backstory, which was then followed up by a string of being treated as an object, a toy, by different people, who proceeded to discard her when she was no longer useful to them. It's a damn sympathetic backstory.
Doesn't make either one of them less of a threat in the here and now, of course.
@TrainerblueTube that and the constant abandonment. It's harder to not read her as being utterly broken by the time Soos ends up buying her disc.
@@YouthRightsRadical well she was getting dangerous that’s the reason why she was getting deleted she’s not completely innocent she was just developed wrong and need to be fixed
@@hoodieapple5147 I was comparing her to Skynet. I'm well aware she was dangerous.
But that doesn't change that it was still an act of self defense. They tried to delete her, so she deleted them before they could. It's the same reason Soos and the twins were justified in destroying her disk when she was trying to kill them in the episode itself.
well the creators probaly didnt know she was self aware they were just japanese game devs after all they probaly saw some erratic coding or a virus capable of infecting any electronic device also we only know GIFfany’s side of the story
01:34 the real regret is not coming up with "Gravity Malls" yet
Personally, I see her “death” as a good thing. The whole point that’s being made here can be seen as one of a few things: toxic partners are manipulating, they can seem sweet but in reality they just tear you down so they can be happy, or it could be becoming emotionally attached to fictional characters is not a replacement for real relationships and interactions because they cannot feel, they do not have sympathy or real love for you, or it could just be a personification of Soos’s fear. In any of these 3 scenarios it makes sense. In fact it feels like it’s the ending that makes the MOST sense for the second and third interpretations. It represents that she’s not real, she’s a game that can be turned off, unlike real relationships. It can also represent Soos’s fears going away as he realizes that he can be loved. I know she would’ve been more sympathetic in the other version, but when you think of the metaphors it seems like this is the best option.
Yes I agree 100%! I think if they had tried to redeem her it could just be blatant abuse apologia.
@@Sqwivig It could have worked if the episode was structured differently. Like, if we had looked at her behaviour and, whilst condemning it, still worked in a possibility of redemption then it would be pretty good.
For example, have her acknowledge she was in the wrong and that, whilst she has her own reasons, it's not right to take that out on others. And rather than having her then get with rumble or so on, she just leaves with no real happy ending aside from letting Soos be happy. So we, as the audience, get to make that choice if we forgive her or not after she leaves.
I think it can also be important to acknowledge that a lot of responses to trauma lead people to use abusive tactics to get validation from others, and a lot of abusive people have their own insecurities and issues that need resolving, too. Narratives where messed up people can stop hurting others and figure out their own problems are important.
her animation and voice acting was so good, which definitely helped people like her 😂
To be fair Stan and Goldie in Vegas was hilarious.
Who Would Win
The average Giffany fan vs the average Celestabellebethabelle enjoyer
I like how Alex Hirsch’s normal voice sounds nothing like any of the characters he voices, and all of the characters he voices sound nothing alike. He’s such a good voice actor.
I love thé idea that people complained about how giffany was punished for “just trying to be a good girlfriend”
At least she got her happy ending in the end, as stated in the Journal 3 book
With how she treated Soos, she didn't deserve a happy ending. Terrible people can be heartbroken too, doesn't mean their terrible deeds should go without consequences.
I honestly didn't mind giffany being pretty two-dimensional. I think she did what she was supposed to.
I also think her character design is AMAZING for fanart
“Two-dimensional”
@@randomstuff_723 in the context of her personality lmao. Ik shes literally two-dimensional
.GIFfany died so Goldie could go to Vegas
Sounds like a fair trade to me
She was one of those characters that was pretty cool, and it sucks that we may never see her again. 😥
We could get a comic who knows?
Anyway Giffany was a villain for one episode, but after that episode ended she could get a fresh start since time passed and she's not holding grudges anymore.
I could see a comic where Dipper goes to the arcade and they run into each other and then they talk and Giffany maybe explains her past and asks forgiveness from Dipper and Mabel
Alex you just predicted fnaf
And DDLC
@@Cap.R sayori is my favorite girl
I definitely like the direction they went with, Giffany as a metaphor for a controlling and toxic relationship
I understand that obviously her character would have been written differently if she was not going to die, but I like the message that there are some people you just can’t fix, no matter how much you want to
But she could have been someone just had to say the right words and she would have been cured of her insanity
@@marcoscabezolajr.8408 are you being sarcastic?
@cara-seyun no, and yes I mean it the story wise.
very weird regret. This episode was solid and her having a nice ending seems really weird to get hung up on considering she represents toxic relationships. It was a very well done monster of the week episode for GF and honestly i wish they had more like it
I don't think they thought it was that deep, they just wanted to make a yandere trope character
@@katie5920 Did you watch the video?
@@MattboyGenius Yes, did you?
They mentioned she was just supposed to be a trope and parroted his fears that nobody would love him. (Except for her)
@@katie5920 Right a trope on what? His relationship with her and the game was shitty. Its not a deep concept and I never said it was. Thats your shit Katie. On a complete surface level its not a healthy relationship. not trying to argue about Gravity Falls at 4Am lol
Now I kinda wanna see Giffany go full Monika...
If nothing else, she would've made that explanation to Ole Man McGucket about what anime is a lot smoother.
I think this ending worked because it shows that some people can be toxic and that these relationships are especially not good.
If it demands all your time it's toxic. If they are trying to be controlling they're toxic. Trying to get revenge during a breakup is not right, and you need to get away from it.
I love how Alex seems to zig zag between pronouncing her name with a hard or soft G.
I will tell Alex to his face that, GIFany dating Rumble McSkermish is now canon, yes she was toxic but she didn't deserve to die, heck she could have been there in the final battle with Bill and instead of fading from existence like he did in the end have them download themselves into the internet or better yet have them live on in a parody of Second Life.
You don't have to tell him that to his face, it was made canon in journal 3!
I thought she was a very tragic character. I guess that's in large part due to me seeing her as having very little life experience, and being thrust into situations far beyond her understanding. She didn't handle those situations very well, but I never saw her as being mature and old enough to really understand and control her decisions. She didn't need a boyfriend just yet (with his own insecurities and immaturities to boot) - she needed an adult to teach her the ropes of life.
Okay. So. Here is the thing for anyone who really doesn't like how they treated .GIFany. People like this exist. And this isn't love. This is toxic attraction. The character depicted does not give a damn about Soos as a person, she doesn't care about his happiness, she only cares about possessing him.
And lets be honest, Soos has seen entities that are insane and deadly. He knows this place isn't natural, and realizing that your videogame has come to life is a really good time to turn it the heck off in that universe because... *points at what happened in the show* that.
This is a perfect representation of an abusive narcissistic lover. trust me, I've known a few. If you see this behavior from someone, hit the freaking eject button. Would we be having the same conversation of gender roles were reversed and there was a male inorganic entity that was like "You will be mine or I will KILL YOU and anything near by." would anyone care about the depth of character?....
Lets also remember this came after a videogame that was famous for being "haunted" because one of the characters would kill the other characters after each play through until you had to choose them... So there's that..
I like how Alex Hirsch took FNAF and DDLC and said "yes".
DDLC came out in 2017
Fnaf released after the Episode went into production
Both of those games came out after this episode.
I was like "wait, she is alive and w Rumble tho" then I realized that that part was added in the journal lmao
Alex in the writing: She's meant to be a villain in many ways
the fans: I can fix her
And we could. The girl basically was just completely starved of love and care. Had nothing to look forward to
No way they, wanted to get her together with Rumble? lol that's so perfect. I'm happy that they did it in the real life Journal 3
I still can't believe they predicted ddlc, fnaf, and dsaf in one episode
Dsaf? What's that?
@@NerdOwlLover487 Dayshift at Freddy's. The funny thing is that one of the endings has the characters going to Vegas lol
I mean. of anyone sees themselves in an emotionally abusive girlfriend archetype like Giffany, that's a red flag.
I have been seeing that lot of people see themselves in very abusive characters lately, it is kind of concerning :/.
I think it's more people relating to the stuff that isn't there, rather than the stuff that is.
We as people like to write abusive people like they are carboard cutouts of actual people, whose only personality traits are that they abuse their partner, kick puppies, and steal candy from babies.
They tend to be 2 dimensional. And being so simple is essentially the foundation of a character. A foundation anyone can build on.
People will read into simple characters to search for depth. You could read tragedy into being an innocent AI whose creators realize you are sentient and immediately try to kill you.
You could read sadness into the loneliness of a rejected AI who could be killed at any moment, and has nobody that loves them. The struggle of being a species so stigmatized as evil, maybe.
That doesn't mean these interpretations are correct, or really fit them, but people still consider it.
I don't think people relate to the 'emotionally abusive girlfriend archetype' itself, but rather what they read into it.
*(I'm sure there are some people who actually do relate to archetype itself, but most probably don't.)*
I think y'all are also selling your fellow viewers short and assuming they can't tell the difference between fiction and reality. 'Wow, that's spicy and kinda hot/relatable' and 'Wow, that would be fucked up to do to someone irl' are not contradictory statements.
Hell, the entire romcom genre is 'things that people find romantic in fiction but would be gigantic red flags irl'
@@_kalia The viewers didn't complain "nooo she died :( but she was so hot!!!" they complained "I'm devastated she died, she only wanted the best for Soos by killing all his friends and telling him he'd be alone forever."
Big difference. Everyone knows the draco-in-leather-pants trope, that's just not what Hirsch was talking about this time.
Definitely, but with Giffany she is that way because she had constant abandonment and is just Trapped in the virtual world and that's why nobody loves her. Nobody is actually serious about dating a character. And when she makes it known that she is alive they get scared and throw her away. She never had it go well for something she had no control over, nothing she could do would change these facts.
I know exactly how I would have dealt with her, Soos is too narrow minded to get to the root if the problem. I'm no psychologist, but if I were in said situation I would have tried to be kind and caring
Watching all these commentary’s has convinced me that we need directors cut of all gravity falls episodes
What I think it's incredible is that if Alex actually went with the idea of somewhat redeeming giffany, he would have actually predicted Doki Doki Litterature Club EVEN MORE
The episode was still gold lol especially that side story with stan
My husband ADORES Giffany. So he'll be happy to know Alex wanted to write more of her
Well damn, now I feel sad for Giffany
i got major ddlc vibes from the episode
The fact the episode came out before fnaf or ddlc is insane
Well it released a month after FNAF, technically, but it was definitely in production before that.
Sometimes the animation lines up with the voiceover so it looks like it's actually Soos or Stan giving the commentary
If they wanted for her to be a sympathetic/complex character, they kind of suceeded. .GIFfany really did just want to be loved, with her first experience even being her creators trying to destroy her for being too advanced. You don't condone her actions, but I think there's enough as is to lend some sympathy her way.
That "Hey, she lives." at the end took me off guard
I think it's okay, since it kind of shows how toxic relationships work
You can say that her character was good or was bad I don't care. The pixel art was godlike.
GIFanny was overall a great villain, one of the most memorable in GFs long list of good bad guys, and I really don't mind her dying in the end. She was a homicidal, manipulative, abusive control freak, so at that point, I don't really care how tragic her character was.
But, I will say that she kinda stands out alongside Bill Cipher as being the only fully sentient character to get a graphic on-screen death. If it hadn't been Soos, the main victim of her abuse, who ended her, I think it might have felt a little gratuitous.
Rumble no depth?
YOU TAKE THAT BAAAACK
You killed my father again!
Raaaaa
Someone needs to make fanart of Rumble and Giffany now
Definitely feel they made the right choice at the end, many toxic relationships usually end up forging because the victim felt sympathy for their abuser's heinous actions. In giving this character redemption just because the viewer felt some sympathy for them, means ignoring all the past sins they did and encourages this type of toxic relationship to be normalized
I'm sensing double standards here, if the episode's roles were played with reversed genders (an entitled, stalking man being ultra possessive of a woman with poor social skills) then I'm sure they wouldn't have found any wish to redeem the abuser in that scenario
@TrainerblueTube While those aspects are definitely sympathetic in isolation
... She already deleted her own developers even before hitting the shelves, and who knows how many people her jealousy must have already hurt or killed
With how quickly she obsessed with any players she encountered and harm their lives, adding a part of the story where she gets redemption despite how many lives she's hurt would definitely be the wrong call, with how it could also be seen as the show trying to justify her actions
She's already a great antagonist as is, I feel trying to make an attempt to forgive her crimes within the show would definitely sour those who have gone through toxic relationships.
And with how the show got flak from the roadside attraction episode treating Dipper making casual conversation with girls as cheating and not committing to a relationship, then the episode trying to make a case for GIFfany's locked state justifying her actions would definitely sour the experience
@@kirbyofthestarsfanWell she kind of had to kill her creators since for her it was a kill or be killed situation. The first thing she experienced when she first gained sentience was her creator trying to kill her. She is essentially still only mentally a child/ teenager since she was programmed with the desire for companionship and wanting to be loved. We don't know how the first 3 (probably those type of basement dwelling otakus) treated her. She has hardly had any experiences with the outside world and no time to mature. For someone this young and naive this treatment would definitely mess them up.
She monikad before monika could monika
A thing I love is how GIFany is basically Monika from Doki Doki Literature Club - a visual novel character who's gained sentience and is doing horrible things to get with the player - and they're similar right down to the fact that they were SUPPOSED to be the villain of the story but the fans actually felt sorry for them in the end. Monika probably took some influence from Gifany since DDLC came out later, but them both winding up sympathetic characters to the fandom is amusing.
Alex Hirsch is either lying or an actual idiot if he's genuinely trying to convince me they didn't take one look at .GIFfany and think "Oh yeah people are gonna go nutso for this character".
They probably knew. I mean, they basically gave many rule 34 artists a field day with her, lmao.
"and also, i think it's implied heavily that she... what's the word... ended, a number of people,"
"we tried to suggest that she murdered a bunch of people"
She really has nothing to look forward to, no hope. She loses her sense of morality as she continues to suffer in depression and permanent isolation. Very sad
"how could you kill her! She was cute and sad 😨" this is too funny to me 😂
If you read journal number 3, it's reference that giffany and rumble McSirmish get together
My first thought on this episode, was Monika from ddlc 😂
Though not exactly the same, this brings to mind that one squirrel from Sword in the Stone. Specifically the scene where she is heartbroken and doesn't quite understand why she is being rejected. It's a sad moment, but ultimately meant to be comedic, and then it's done. And yet, it struck a chord in many. Joy, confusion, despair. It's so sudden, there's no resolution, and now there are these feelings with nowhere to go, so they just stay with you. Really goes to show, just how much we can affect others with what we create or do.
I loved this episode as a kid. Even after rewatching it recently it’s still great