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Component shortages and price hikes of components is the main reason. If you need to produce old modules at costs above MSRP, then it becomes unsustainable of course.
The original sin of eurorack is that the bar was set too low. Most module circuit and build quality is trash, and price was prioritized. It has been amazing for creativity, but if you want to produce high quality sustainably it costs money
I think the original, Doepfer, idea was legos: simple pieces that you can put together in wild arrangements. Eurorack has move away from that model IMO. Less simple units and more complete/exotic voices (Mutable Instruments). I think with that shift, companies that sell simple VCA's are going to be in a hard place. Ultimately I think people are more interested in "strong, opinionated stances" (e.g. complete voice) and less in "frameworks".
Yeah I think maybe that model is still there but now with a wider range of options like you mention, it means the more traditional workflow gets buried a little bit now. It’s main weakness is that it’s only strengths don’t necessarily justify the large consumer prices. So It becomes something you have to buy into for the passion and preferred workflow and not because it’s better than the alternatives.
@@Mavenfiction I think Moog is being quite clever with their product line, where you effectively always get a complete instrument, but it's ultimately a eurorack module you can take out of the case. If you're starting out it's much easier to stomach the $350 for a Moog Mavis vs $700 for a wooden box with no power.
Many of these "companies"(even the more prominent ones) are "mom and pop" operations with 5 people or less. Many who run these operations have little or no experience running a business. It's surprising there isn't MORE turn over. As for Mutable, it seems Emily was just ready to move onto something else.
Exactly. The nature of these small businesses also means new ones can pop out of nowhere any time so I wouldn't be so worried. Modular is also super DIYable, it doesn't take much to create your own basic modules if you know the basics of designing electronics.
I think there's also a point where you get good enough with your gear that you realize you don't actually need more of it because you can already do everything you can think of. Except I really want a rainmaker. Can never have too many delays. Synthesis technology is also going out of business next year as Paul is fully retiring. Such a great loss.
Hmm, wow you stirred up a bit of perspective in my head, but as a millennial, I think you and I are too young to see, or experience the wider range and evolution of synths in itself. I mean if people are still buying the MU/ 5U, MOTM, FracRack, Serge, and Buchla modular formats today, which started around 60s years ago… then I’m sure this 90s kid Eurorack, is going to be just alright. Haha!
When I moved about 4.5-5 years ago… I simply didn’t have the space to setup my rack how I like it. Coupled with having neighbors and some career changes, I opted to just mess with it every once and a while. I’m moving. For the first time in 5 years I’ll have no shared walls. I’m so excited.
Wow. Didn’t realise Mutable Instruments had closed down. One of my favourite companies. Got quite a few of their modules. She never really did it for the money and was quite happy to be a small independent company. The current climate will claim many more but we have new companies starting up such as Modbap Modular. Let’s see what the future brings.
Mutable was a 1 person company with product almost completely based around the STM32 microprocessor. Which is unobtainium due to the parts shortages. Same with WMD. Parts shortages in mass quantities have become a problem. They also manufacture for many other Eurorack companies. Parts shortages have been a huge problem for manufacturers. Simple as that.
I've thought about this. I'm going to learn how to solder. But the up front costs, decent variable temperature soldering iron plus multimeter that does not just do voltage and resistors but capacitors and diodes then maybe an oscilloscope for further debugging, tools like wire strippers, etc - well for the start up costs, I could buy me some assembled modules. Dilemmas!
I'd say for 1000 money, you can have a pretty decent electronics lab. A fraction for the minimum. buying too cheap means buying twice though. temperature controlled iron leaded solder, solder wick proper multimeter with 10MOhm range basic tools. pliers, tweezers, screwdriver magnification glas with light oscilloscope
Times are tough. Turning a small business into a success is EXTREMELY difficult, without accepting a capital investment from an outsider. It takes an average of 3 years to see ANY profit, and even then this is under ideal conditions. So, now is your profit enough to dig out of the whole you’ve been digging for three years? Probably not. Then comes self-questions like, “Do I love this? What else could I be doing? I got into this because I loved making music, and now I create little music making panels. Is this my passion?”
I think the smaller you are in some ways the easier it is to survive if you do it right, but the same thing is happening with guitar pedals there is a crazy number of manufactures now but fulltone who have been around for 30 years announced there closing this week because they don't make a profit anymore. Whenever you introduce a mass amount of competition to a market suddenly there will always be companies that don't survive this is true for any part of the economy and generally during recessions you see the companies that probably weren't going to be viable long term anymore close up. At the same time were seeing other bigger companies like Erica, Befaco and Insturo continue to release new and innovative products. But I guess personally I've never really seen any WMD modules where I think I really really want that module over something else, and as popular as MI has been there only real module that I've really wanted is clouds but at the end of the day I think I'd rather monsoon anyway.
As Eurorack becomes more popular, larger companies get into the market... especially for bread n butter modules like basic VCO, LFOs, rudimentary filters, VCAs, etc. The price for basic modules can come down as they'll occupy that portion of the market. The unique stuff, the innovative stuff, the odd stuff... will be the domain of small boutique manufacturers.
@@matejv2840 do you not think though, that’s all tech? To build upon existing ideas in a hope to get more feature that are user friendly. If the goal is just making great music (which though subjective, not everyone can necessarily achieve) then the more accessible and attainable the better? Not a counter argument btw- a genuine question. Thanks.
@@matejv2840 I can’t speak to the engineering as it’s not my background but I do find it fascinating, so thanks for taking the time to get back to me. In terms of music making, utilising mathematics and pre determined patterns is something all musicians do, even if they think they’re writing it for the first time. There’s very little left unexplored, especially in western music I’d imagine. I think it’s just another workflow. I’ve had success and made a career in music in a more traditional sense beyond this channel and now I enjoy the process of working with modular at times. But even with some of these generative modules, I still often make some shit music too haha.
Id like to see modular companies merge, find synergies and offer products at a more affordable price. I wonder why WMD did not find another maker before going belly up. But I have no idea about the financials and other bad biz choices they made. I do like how companies are putting more features into a module vs having each feature be its own module. VCAs should just be in any / all modules coming out. And if you can throw an LFO in there, great. Look at what Instruo did with their stereo osc or the Function Junction by Cre8 Audio. it seems like the path for eurorack is consolidation in companies and modules.
WMD used to collab with Steady State Fate a lot. That could have been a fine merger. And speaking of Cre8, they team up with Pittsburgh Modular from time to time.
Well this doesnt age well. i think at Superbooth 2023, eurorack manufacturers showing they still have some tricks up their sleeves. i suspect the competition by cheaper manufacturers have pushed them to make more interesting modules.
Well from what I remember of this video (which isn’t a great deal), its over arching theme was how the industry is continually growing. So that would appear to reflect what you’ve seen wouldn’t it? Either way it’s great that there’s some exciting modules coming out and I hope you’ve had an awesome time. Cheers.
@@apparently_sonam Well for one thing I'm not a typical Glaswegian. I'm filthy rich. Secondly, we are well known for our dry sense of humour. Americans tend not to get it mind.
Mutable instruments threatened to end production in 2019, but then came back for a few more years. If they were already thinking of calling it quits before the pandemic hit, parts shortages are probably not the only reason. WMD makes some good stuff, but competition is tough, there are lots of new companies that are eating their lunch. Even if you were good enough 10 years ago, there’s no guarantee that you will still make the cut. Lots of the earlier eurorack companies exited the market, Plan B, Cynthia, etc. and yet the ecosystem continued to grow. Basically it’s still a large vital ecosystem, and there are huge chip factories being built in several places America right now to combat the chip shortages. This is part of an attempt to disentangle vital parts of the western economy from China, but it still has a ways to go.
I believe MI Emilie retired- although why no-one took up the reins on her departure I do not know. But there are a whole bunch of smaller, geographically diverse makers emerging (Xaoc, Miso, etc) and one unlooked-for consequence of the total mismanagement of the UK by the Barely Sentient party is that some users are quitting- there are a lot of class modules in the s/h market atm.
I think even before starting eurorack, I would see full systems for sale pretty regularly. People fall into it hard then suddenly realise it isn’t for them. Or sometimes maybe it’s a cash issue and they hold their value fairly well I guess? Hope the trip went well!
This is my theory, because of all the cosmetic transformation eurorack has undergone, including hyper-faceted super-modules, replacing conventional names with catchier ones, it has created a lot of confusion. Eurorack came to be seen as a status qouo, just like Apple products. This attracted a market of people whose concept of making music does not align with the process of modularity. Because making music on modular synths is not as intuitive as RUclipsrs want it to be. In other words, this has generated a huge influx of purchases, but also of regrets. As a consequence, a parallel market has been created, where modules are constantly resold. Now, I know people who have filled a doepfer box with only second-hand modules, so I imagine this is no exception. Could give you more reason, more o less related, but that would run out your comments box. Ahahahah
Unavailability and cost of components is the number one reason why I am probably hanging up the towel for manufacturing modular. The profit margin was minimal before the sh** hit the fan, now it's unobtanium. Granted, used module prices will go through the roof as a result. We've noticed our sales plummet to 20% of what it was 2 years ago, lucky it's not important how fast things sell for us, but for many it is.
@@sandrainthesky1011 the SDS VCO won't go out of my rack. i got one with VCO fw going into one with the FX fw. I only wish some CV could be added to the FX fw, but it's still one of the best voices imho. Can't beat it for 3hp
I’m going to make a sequencer module that only plays “always look on the bright side of life” and a sample player that only plays samples that say “it’ll be reet” or “Ow much?”. While I think we can all agree giving toddlers e-number/sugar riddled treats is hilarious so long as you can quickly give them back to your relatives who will hence forth cross you off their Christmas card list, I think you should make some music, mate.
@@Mavenfiction I’ve seen the last mad max movie and although I don’t have a guitar there’s an amp socket on my ukulele. Apocalypse schmocalypse. Bring it on.
I find the problem with modular culture is that they use those machines just to sound like a bunch of testosterone filled DJs. Sounds homogenized I rarely hear people take chances get exploratory be daring do something unique it's like watching the same single colored painting being done over and over by different people.
Wow, pretty much none of the modular music I listen to sounds like traditional club/dance music. I've seen and heard some impressive sonic diversity in how people utilize their eurorack rigs. But one of the most popular genres that it is used for is ambient, atmosphere music, think like tonal sound washes. The opposite of what testosterone filled DJs would be banging.
I guess like anything it has it’s strengths and limitations. There’s a lot of techno I too which seems to be popular, as well as the ambient. My challenge now is to try see if I can use it live in a more ‘pop’ setting.
myself and most of the people I see using modular are into deep sound design, ambient and experimental vibes. what you're describing sounds more like arcade/splice, sample pack production. for the average modular user its all about exploring abstract audio and not at all the generic edm you describe.
At Synth East I asked a bunch of makers how business was and all of them said booming, but the supply chain issues are making it difficult to meet demand. WMD made a lot of their business from producing for other manufacturers with their machines. Mutable folding has been on the cards for a long time due to the disillusionment Émilie Gillet has shown publicly. Don't panic.
Thanks for the comment. No panic here, like I mentioned I can see the growth in the short time I’ve been involved in it. Nice to hear it from the horses mouth though mate, appreciate it! Cheers.
@@Mavenfiction in fairness, it reads like that, and there are many eurorack folk nout there who by stance, just aren’t knowledgeable at that level. No shade. And it’s the internet, so you can see why the aforementioned skepticism….
@@apparently_sonam without trying to sound petulant, I feel like just lately everything is under scrutiny on my channel and what started as a laugh has become a place where I feel like I’m constantly on the defensive. I guess that comes with the territory. I’m just venting by the way. Equally not trying to criticise.
I dont use it or never have... blank modules without opensource software are opening a new niche. You'll see blank modules are rising... where say max and pd patches are being installed instead of alt firmware... look into daisy patch the seed is used by many producers just like the raspberry pi . That's in dsp... I told a friend what you will see is limited runs followed by pre order investments in analogue or fgpa modules..which is taking place im waiting on two modules at the moment the xpo by MN and the three body by schlappi ..
Mutable going was a bad omen. Just goes to show, if you give your stuff away for free, people will take it, for free (looking at you micro freak). I think on the grander scheme of things, the excessive price of modular in general is going to further push it towards being a rich kids toy in this shyte economy. Sure there are ways to do it for cheap but they aren't too glamorous are they.
kinda got think it might supply chains its even at times hard to get tubes for guitar amps also everybody and there brother started making them and a few of mfg fell off but that be smaller makers i think
I wouldn't recommend ornithology as alternative content while there's a bird flu epidemic! But I agree that times will be hard for makers of modular gear. I stopped buying new modules about a year ago and don't intend to buy any in the foreseeable future.
Any system with more than 8-9 modules is redundant and time-waster. Even such simpler system is more-less unnecessary for music making, but still tolerable. It is a niche, grown on certain music aesthetic that became popular and will vanish by time.
@@Mavenfiction I get 10 also. I'm going with, "It was probably 4 only at some point," and I'm sticking to it. Definitely not just me being flatly wrong. I'm only partly flatly wrong.
Modular exploded coz during pandemic people had tons of free time on their hand and got into hobbies (hell, that's how I got that). Spending in anything electronic slowed down, but while big company can just fire some staff to tighten the belt, modular company doing niche stuff just gets unsustainable
Just had a quick look at your videos pal. The irony of you a) Commenting on someone else’s appearance, b) making reference to a Hobbit when you’re spitting dabs of Sam, and c) the fact you make comments offering life advice whilst trolling others is absolutely not lost on me at all. Cheers for the laugh!
This has happened to me, before, in other ways .. I arrived at the modular party, a year ago .. and, as you have just hinted at, Aaron, maybe all the beer is gone? .. me, .. I do hope that someone will pick up the Mutable Instruments torch, .. but, with it being open source .. is that a viable plan? MI's different modules do fit together pretty nicely, in my experience, .. at least the more recent release designs. Perhaps VST plugins are gaining a larger slice of the pie, too? The analogish thing of twisting real knobs, .. sometimes, even using real sliders .. that appealing less on average, to the newer & younger people? I've never worked with plugins, .. so, of course, I'm guessing. I suppose Arduino, and Rasberry Pi sales could fill some of this potential void, as well? Not that much of a stretch, to imagine .. modular synth purists possessing soldering irons, in their tool boxes. Take some of the classic mono output module types, and build them, at least in stereo, if not in quadraphonic output .. or, lately my favorite .. generate a 32 segement/slider version of MI Stages. Or, merging a couple of the classics, into super hybrid units.
You're not wrong about the vst/virtual environments. With programs like vcv and cardinal being free, or at least working on a busker business model, there's really little incentive to get into the hardware environment, even if you're a knob twiddler, it's super easy to just get a decent midi controller set up to do whatever you want. Plus you can achieve things in a virtual environment that are just impractical or straight up impossible with hardware (polyphony comes to mind, for instance). Add to that the conveniences of software like never having to tune vcos, drop down context menus, the ability to input specific number values on any parameter, like typing in exact voltage numbers, no constraint on rack size, rapidly growing free module libraries (including many popular hardware clones like Befaco, instruo and MI), etc, and the appeal of physical hardware really starts to diminish. The only upside is accessibility, now if someone decides they want to try and get into modular, it's not a $2000 chunk of circuitry that ends up collecting dust in the basement in 6 months after they bounce off it, and it does have the potential to grow the user base a lot faster and easier, which may or may not translate into more hardware consumers.
@@kyleh1127 Thanks for the comments .. good points, I think .. other than modular gear, I haven't tried to buy anything electronic, in the past couple of years .. but, computer chips, and the lack of .. it sounds like it's still a problem. A fragile industry, that's been taking some hits, eh? Missing just one piece, out of this big puzzle, means no operational gadgets, for either conventional modular, or for any substitute.
@@kenswanson1093 I wouldn't worry too much about chip shortage, considering that it affects the auto industry as well, i can't see an industry that big just standing idly by and doing nothing about it. Between big auto and big tech they will find a way around it, whether that means a new source of making chips or a way to eliminate the need for them altogether, it's really just a matter of time, and my money's on it being solved sooner than later when there's literal $billions on the line.
@@kyleh1127 Yeah? .. I was totally thinking like you, .. back when this first started .. "Just get past this COVID experience .." well, then other things have happened. And there is movement for new semiconductor plants, too. I did do some hunting about this topic, before I posted you, to see what the general speak is of late, about chips .. and, yes .. there's still problems, presently. Something like a 1000, to 1500 chips are now being installed in a new vehicle. Yikes .. Anyway .. I hope you're right.
I insisted of trying to remove the hair from the screen because it really looks like it’s laying on top. It is a privilege for me to have had the opportunity to engage in this hobby, I’m one of the very lucky few to have had both freedom and the means to explore and choose what to engage in. lf the people who created modules that you appreciate is alive, let them know how their creations are meaningful for you. Chances are that each and everyone of us possess knowledge, skill set and/or means in general that would be of good use to some of them if you are willing to consider it and extend the offer. The Worry though seems to consist of an idea of the future where we obtain new things that are going make us happy, and what reality seems to be in the now threatens our means to either become or maintain happiness, content, inspiration, motivation, creativity and so on. Changes are inevitable as well as gain and loss, worry and fear but if worry and fear are to be the chosen factual interpretation of both the now and future, what is missing now and what means is needed to ease it? Only my 10kr on the topic 🙂
Im single handedly keeping the industry afloat with my crack-like addiction. Greetings from Scalby mate
Component shortages and price hikes of components is the main reason. If you need to produce old modules at costs above MSRP, then it becomes unsustainable of course.
Sadly it seems to be…
The original sin of eurorack is that the bar was set too low. Most module circuit and build quality is trash, and price was prioritized. It has been amazing for creativity, but if you want to produce high quality sustainably it costs money
My worst fear is Bastl going out of business. That company has produced almost all of my fav modules and all for a respectably affordable price.
Oh man agreed. Not just modules either. Everything they do is great. They have discontinued the thyme. :(
chintzy
That's your worst fear? One would think something like being buried alive would be a bit higher on your list.
I use also many bastl Modules ❤love the wooden
My worst fear is to open a tap with a spoon facing up under it@@Reggie-The-Dog
I think the original, Doepfer, idea was legos: simple pieces that you can put together in wild arrangements.
Eurorack has move away from that model IMO. Less simple units and more complete/exotic voices (Mutable Instruments).
I think with that shift, companies that sell simple VCA's are going to be in a hard place.
Ultimately I think people are more interested in "strong, opinionated stances" (e.g. complete voice) and less in "frameworks".
Yeah I think maybe that model is still there but now with a wider range of options like you mention, it means the more traditional workflow gets buried a little bit now.
It’s main weakness is that it’s only strengths don’t necessarily justify the large consumer prices. So It becomes something you have to buy into for the passion and preferred workflow and not because it’s better than the alternatives.
@@Mavenfiction I think Moog is being quite clever with their product line, where you effectively always get a complete instrument, but it's ultimately a eurorack module you can take out of the case. If you're starting out it's much easier to stomach the $350 for a Moog Mavis vs $700 for a wooden box with no power.
Definitely we have moved to more integrated modules. I always despair at modular synth turning into dsp, i have dsp already
Yeah that seems what a lot of people are looking for. But I think the lego path leads to a more unique sound in the long run.
One word. Percussa. I’m sure it’s perfect for some people but the exact opposite reason I love Eurorack.
Many of these "companies"(even the more prominent ones) are "mom and pop" operations with 5 people or less.
Many who run these operations have little or no experience running a business. It's surprising there isn't MORE turn over.
As for Mutable, it seems Emily was just ready to move onto something else.
Exactly. The nature of these small businesses also means new ones can pop out of nowhere any time so I wouldn't be so worried. Modular is also super DIYable, it doesn't take much to create your own basic modules if you know the basics of designing electronics.
I think there's also a point where you get good enough with your gear that you realize you don't actually need more of it because you can already do everything you can think of. Except I really want a rainmaker. Can never have too many delays. Synthesis technology is also going out of business next year as Paul is fully retiring. Such a great loss.
Do you know if he'll release anything open source?
@@jocee2257 idk you can always email him and ask!
Synthesis Technology is closing down once Paul runs out of his current stock of parts.
Hmm, wow you stirred up a bit of perspective in my head, but as a millennial, I think you and I are too young to see, or experience the wider range and evolution of synths in itself. I mean if people are still buying the MU/ 5U, MOTM, FracRack, Serge, and Buchla modular formats today, which started around 60s years ago… then I’m sure this 90s kid Eurorack, is going to be just alright. Haha!
We’re a niche industry in a world of inflation and supply shortage. Time to buy up before we can no longer afford anything.
Very true! I’m stopping buying though for a while… I even believed that myself for a second then.
@@Mavenfiction lol, of course you have… I’m buying less too as outgrowing my cases and saving up to buy a tank of gas for winter ❄️
I tried buying a C4RBN but you bought them all 🤣😝
@@lockyp204 lol sorry!
@@markbooth Ha, I managed to get one. 😄👍 Sadly from their liquidation sale
When I moved about 4.5-5 years ago… I simply didn’t have the space to setup my rack how I like it. Coupled with having neighbors and some career changes, I opted to just mess with it every once and a while. I’m moving. For the first time in 5 years I’ll have no shared walls. I’m so excited.
It had quadrupeled or at least trippled by 2018 acc. to a sales rep at Sweetwater.
Wow. Didn’t realise Mutable Instruments had closed down. One of my favourite companies. Got quite a few of their modules. She never really did it for the money and was quite happy to be a small independent company. The current climate will claim many more but we have new companies starting up such as Modbap Modular. Let’s see what the future brings.
Hexinverter is shutting down as well. They were early developer's in the eurorack platform. Great drum modules.
Yeah I was talking about this on the livestream last Sunday. Very sad.
Mutable was a 1 person company with product almost completely based around the STM32 microprocessor. Which is unobtainium due to the parts shortages.
Same with WMD. Parts shortages in mass quantities have become a problem. They also manufacture for many other Eurorack companies.
Parts shortages have been a huge problem for manufacturers. Simple as that.
And if I’m not mistaken Mutable wanted to stop for personal reasons.
I hope Eurorack never dies, how else will I spend $3000 on a system significantly less useful than an Arturia Microbrute???
I support the smaller companies like After Later Audio and Tall Dog in the hopes that they can still keep making new modules at lower prices.
Didn't After Later Audio make all of the MI clones while Emily was still in business?
I've thought about this. I'm going to learn how to solder. But the up front costs, decent variable temperature soldering iron plus multimeter that does not just do voltage and resistors but capacitors and diodes then maybe an oscilloscope for further debugging, tools like wire strippers, etc - well for the start up costs, I could buy me some assembled modules. Dilemmas!
It’s probably a good plan anyway and something great to have in your locker. I wish I could utilise kits more. I’m useless at soldering etc.
I'd say for 1000 money, you can have a pretty decent electronics lab. A fraction for the minimum. buying too cheap means buying twice though.
temperature controlled iron
leaded solder, solder wick
proper multimeter with 10MOhm range
basic tools. pliers, tweezers, screwdriver
magnification glas with light
oscilloscope
Thanks for the video. See you Sunday.
See you at the live stream :)
Damn I am so out of touch. I live 8 minutes away from WMD and had no idea they were closing.
Sadly so :( they’re going out with three new limited edition modules.
Beyond the worry about the future of Eurorack, the most perturbing thing about this video is the stray hair on your mic muff.
Everyone always talks about the cat hairs on my mic hahahaha. I actually lint roller’d it about a week ago. It’s a losing battle! 😔
@@Mavenfiction “you’ve been a persistent as a cat’s hair on a mic muff”
@@StephenTallamyMusic that is 100% getting used next week haha! Thanks.
Thank you very much. I though it was on my screen. You've actually just saved it from INTENSE wiping🤣
Times are tough. Turning a small business into a success is EXTREMELY difficult, without accepting a capital investment from an outsider. It takes an average of 3 years to see ANY profit, and even then this is under ideal conditions. So, now is your profit enough to dig out of the whole you’ve been digging for three years? Probably not. Then comes self-questions like, “Do I love this? What else could I be doing? I got into this because I loved making music, and now I create little music making panels. Is this my passion?”
I'd watch a video series based on your reflections on Eurorack from a lizard's point of view.
FYI… I won’t sleep now until I come up with a hilarious name for this series!
Good chat. 👍
I think the smaller you are in some ways the easier it is to survive if you do it right, but the same thing is happening with guitar pedals there is a crazy number of manufactures now but fulltone who have been around for 30 years announced there closing this week because they don't make a profit anymore. Whenever you introduce a mass amount of competition to a market suddenly there will always be companies that don't survive this is true for any part of the economy and generally during recessions you see the companies that probably weren't going to be viable long term anymore close up. At the same time were seeing other bigger companies like Erica, Befaco and Insturo continue to release new and innovative products.
But I guess personally I've never really seen any WMD modules where I think I really really want that module over something else, and as popular as MI has been there only real module that I've really wanted is clouds but at the end of the day I think I'd rather monsoon anyway.
As Eurorack becomes more popular, larger companies get into the market... especially for bread n butter modules like basic VCO, LFOs, rudimentary filters, VCAs, etc. The price for basic modules can come down as they'll occupy that portion of the market. The unique stuff, the innovative stuff, the odd stuff... will be the domain of small boutique manufacturers.
This seems to be happening! Cheers. Aaron.
@@matejv2840 do you not think though, that’s all tech? To build upon existing ideas in a hope to get more feature that are user friendly. If the goal is just making great music (which though subjective, not everyone can necessarily achieve) then the more accessible and attainable the better? Not a counter argument btw- a genuine question. Thanks.
@@matejv2840 I can’t speak to the engineering as it’s not my background but I do find it fascinating, so thanks for taking the time to get back to me.
In terms of music making, utilising mathematics and pre determined patterns is something all musicians do, even if they think they’re writing it for the first time. There’s very little left unexplored, especially in western music I’d imagine.
I think it’s just another workflow. I’ve had success and made a career in music in a more traditional sense beyond this channel and now I enjoy the process of working with modular at times. But even with some of these generative modules, I still often make some shit music too haha.
Id like to see modular companies merge, find synergies and offer products at a more affordable price. I wonder why WMD did not find another maker before going belly up. But I have no idea about the financials and other bad biz choices they made. I do like how companies are putting more features into a module vs having each feature be its own module. VCAs should just be in any / all modules coming out. And if you can throw an LFO in there, great. Look at what Instruo did with their stereo osc or the Function Junction by Cre8 Audio. it seems like the path for eurorack is consolidation in companies and modules.
WMD used to collab with Steady State Fate a lot. That could have been a fine merger. And speaking of Cre8, they team up with Pittsburgh Modular from time to time.
Rise and Fall.. or... Attack and Decay
😂😂 I love it!
Well this doesnt age well. i think at Superbooth 2023, eurorack manufacturers showing they still have some tricks up their sleeves. i suspect the competition by cheaper manufacturers have pushed them to make more interesting modules.
Well from what I remember of this video (which isn’t a great deal), its over arching theme was how the industry is continually growing. So that would appear to reflect what you’ve seen wouldn’t it? Either way it’s great that there’s some exciting modules coming out and I hope you’ve had an awesome time. Cheers.
We are all fucked. Not me though. I am loaded.
Me too to be honest mate. However, If things get really bad I’ll have to cut down to one new piece a gear a month rather than weekly.
@@Mavenfiction Tough times!!
Conceited, maybe. Not a typical Glaswegian response……
@@apparently_sonam Well for one thing I'm not a typical Glaswegian. I'm filthy rich. Secondly, we are well known for our dry sense of humour. Americans tend not to get it mind.
@@StephenMcLeod ouch. Glaswegian here. You’d fit in well in Edinburgh tho…
Mutable instruments threatened to end production in 2019, but then came back for a few more years. If they were already thinking of calling it quits before the pandemic hit, parts shortages are probably not the only reason.
WMD makes some good stuff, but competition is tough, there are lots of new companies that are eating their lunch. Even if you were good enough 10 years ago, there’s no guarantee that you will still make the cut.
Lots of the earlier eurorack companies exited the market, Plan B, Cynthia, etc. and yet the ecosystem continued to grow.
Basically it’s still a large vital ecosystem, and there are huge chip factories being built in several places America right now to combat the chip shortages. This is part of an attempt to disentangle vital parts of the western economy from China, but it still has a ways to go.
Also straight analog gear is on the rise
especially as winter arrives. turn down the furnace and fire up the 14 oscillators
We're all doooommmmed!
Not whilst we have great people like yourself supplying us with alcohol!
I’ve not even watched your vid yet but anyone who starts with “Eyup” immediately gets my sub 👍
😂😂 perfect! Cheers pal!
I believe MI Emilie retired- although why no-one took up the reins on her departure I do not know. But there are a whole bunch of smaller, geographically diverse makers emerging (Xaoc, Miso, etc) and one unlooked-for consequence of the total mismanagement of the UK by the Barely Sentient party is that some users are quitting- there are a lot of class modules in the s/h market atm.
I think even before starting eurorack, I would see full systems for sale pretty regularly. People fall into it hard then suddenly realise it isn’t for them. Or sometimes maybe it’s a cash issue and they hold their value fairly well I guess? Hope the trip went well!
At least you didn't make a bs political comment.
@@PorchBass did I do that? 🫣
@@Mavenfiction lol not really. Lets not pick sides and hate each other is what i mean.
This is my theory, because of all the cosmetic transformation eurorack has undergone, including hyper-faceted super-modules, replacing conventional names with catchier ones, it has created a lot of confusion. Eurorack came to be seen as a status qouo, just like Apple products. This attracted a market of people whose concept of making music does not align with the process of modularity. Because making music on modular synths is not as intuitive as RUclipsrs want it to be. In other words, this has generated a huge influx of purchases, but also of regrets. As a consequence, a parallel market has been created, where modules are constantly resold. Now, I know people who have filled a doepfer box with only second-hand modules, so I imagine this is no exception.
Could give you more reason, more o less related, but that would run out your comments box. Ahahahah
You’re a funny dude. Take my sub!
I won’t link my modular playlist, but if you are interested I know you can find it.
I found it. Sorry it took me three weeks. Will binge over the weekend! Thanks 😊
Unavailability and cost of components is the number one reason why I am probably hanging up the towel for manufacturing modular. The profit margin was minimal before the sh** hit the fan, now it's unobtanium. Granted, used module prices will go through the roof as a result.
We've noticed our sales plummet to 20% of what it was 2 years ago, lucky it's not important how fast things sell for us, but for many it is.
Sorry to hear that. What’s the company? Thanks for the comment.
@@Mavenfiction SDS Digital Modular
@@sandrainthesky1011 the SDS VCO won't go out of my rack. i got one with VCO fw going into one with the FX fw. I only wish some CV could be added to the FX fw, but it's still one of the best voices imho. Can't beat it for 3hp
I’m going to make a sequencer module that only plays “always look on the bright side of life” and a sample player that only plays samples that say “it’ll be reet” or “Ow much?”. While I think we can all agree giving toddlers e-number/sugar riddled treats is hilarious so long as you can quickly give them back to your relatives who will hence forth cross you off their Christmas card list, I think you should make some music, mate.
😂😂 brilliant comment! Love it. As for making music… that is so pre-apocalypse!
@@Mavenfiction I’ve seen the last mad max movie and although I don’t have a guitar there’s an amp socket on my ukulele. Apocalypse schmocalypse. Bring it on.
Friggin' this friggin' that!
Just keeping it light!
I find the problem with modular culture is that they use those machines just to sound like a bunch of testosterone filled DJs. Sounds homogenized I rarely hear people take chances get exploratory be daring do something unique it's like watching the same single colored painting being done over and over by different people.
Wow, pretty much none of the modular music I listen to sounds like traditional club/dance music. I've seen and heard some impressive sonic diversity in how people utilize their eurorack rigs. But one of the most popular genres that it is used for is ambient, atmosphere music, think like tonal sound washes. The opposite of what testosterone filled DJs would be banging.
I guess like anything it has it’s strengths and limitations. There’s a lot of techno I too which seems to be popular, as well as the ambient. My challenge now is to try see if I can use it live in a more ‘pop’ setting.
myself and most of the people I see using modular are into deep sound design, ambient and experimental vibes. what you're describing sounds more like arcade/splice, sample pack production. for the average modular user its all about exploring abstract audio and not at all the generic edm you describe.
So many good firms closing like Mutable Instruments and WMD Devices. Sad state of the world.
Just signed up to the Patreon, excited to interact with you.
Thanks Philip for the support. The 1-1s in the calendar! See you then :)
Huh?
At Synth East I asked a bunch of makers how business was and all of them said booming, but the supply chain issues are making it difficult to meet demand. WMD made a lot of their business from producing for other manufacturers with their machines. Mutable folding has been on the cards for a long time due to the disillusionment Émilie Gillet has shown publicly.
Don't panic.
Thanks for the comment. No panic here, like I mentioned I can see the growth in the short time I’ve been involved in it. Nice to hear it from the horses mouth though mate, appreciate it! Cheers.
A vco is not a complicated piece of kit I don't know why they are so expensive.
It does put it into perspective when you watch people like look mum no comp make a full system in no time with bits he has around his house haha.
@@Mavenfiction He is an engineer. If he wasn't he wouldn't have those "bits" laying around and if he did he wouldn't know what to do with them.
@@l1fef0rm oh mate come on. You can’t seriously read that comment and think it’s filled with the utmost sincerity.
@@Mavenfiction in fairness, it reads like that, and there are many eurorack folk nout there who by stance, just aren’t knowledgeable at that level. No shade. And it’s the internet, so you can see why the aforementioned skepticism….
@@apparently_sonam without trying to sound petulant, I feel like just lately everything is under scrutiny on my channel and what started as a laugh has become a place where I feel like I’m constantly on the defensive. I guess that comes with the territory. I’m just venting by the way. Equally not trying to criticise.
I dont use it or never have... blank modules without opensource software are opening a new niche. You'll see blank modules are rising... where say max and pd patches are being installed instead of alt firmware... look into daisy patch the seed is used by many producers just like the raspberry pi . That's in dsp... I told a friend what you will see is limited runs followed by pre order investments in analogue or fgpa modules..which is taking place im waiting on two modules at the moment the xpo by MN and the three body by schlappi ..
Digital modules are creeping back because of the raspberry pi... the Zima will takes its place.. trade restrictions are what's stopping growth..
There's also the Droid
Mutable going was a bad omen. Just goes to show, if you give your stuff away for free, people will take it, for free (looking at you micro freak). I think on the grander scheme of things, the excessive price of modular in general is going to further push it towards being a rich kids toy in this shyte economy. Sure there are ways to do it for cheap but they aren't too glamorous are they.
kinda got think it might supply chains its even at times hard to get tubes for guitar amps also everybody and there brother started making them and a few of mfg fell off but that be smaller makers i think
I have a pain sub and only have 6 racks
Ok 🦎
I wouldn't recommend ornithology as alternative content while there's a bird flu epidemic! But I agree that times will be hard for makers of modular gear. I stopped buying new modules about a year ago and don't intend to buy any in the foreseeable future.
If you could bottle your will power, I’d buy that! Haha
3:27 😂😂😂
🦎
Any system with more than 8-9 modules is redundant and time-waster. Even such simpler system is more-less unnecessary for music making, but still tolerable. It is a niche, grown on certain music aesthetic that became popular and will vanish by time.
If you knew anything about birds, you’d know that they are hardest hit by the chip shortage.
😂😂😂😂 that’s that out of the window then!
Wait… that’s the CHIRP shortage! Duh!
It's for the birds.
WMD is selling an 8-10hp? oscillator for 500$.....
Hi, do you just mean they’re still trading? They haven’t shut shop just yet but they are soon sadly.
I just thought it was interesting to see from a company that is shutting down due to costs etc.. 500$ for a not so fancy oscillator is steeeeeeep
Free users get 4 racks on MG (ETA free users can choose to only use 4 of their 10 available racks and complain about it for no good reason.)
I don’t pay and I get 10?
@@Mavenfiction eh? what's wrong with my account then???
@@Mavenfiction I get 10 also. I'm going with, "It was probably 4 only at some point," and I'm sticking to it. Definitely not just me being flatly wrong. I'm only partly flatly wrong.
I fear the synth revival may be waning. I hope I am wrong.
BALLS to the World Economic Forum.
I can afford the modules but powering them’s a problem 😂😂
@@Mavenfiction right? “You vil eat ze bugs!” - Klaus Schwab
Thanks for politicking on a eurorack video, really chilled out vibes
@@PorchBass politicking? They don’t care what “side” you’re on; the bastards are hurting us all.
@@rishpanjeet7479 there is no escape
Modular exploded coz during pandemic people had tons of free time on their hand and got into hobbies (hell, that's how I got that). Spending in anything electronic slowed down, but while big company can just fire some staff to tighten the belt, modular company doing niche stuff just gets unsustainable
can someone translate man-bun British hobbit English to America English please..?
Just had a quick look at your videos pal. The irony of you a) Commenting on someone else’s appearance, b) making reference to a Hobbit when you’re spitting dabs of Sam, and c) the fact you make comments offering life advice whilst trolling others is absolutely not lost on me at all. Cheers for the laugh!
Yo Topknot, why ya lettin’ Hairy Mic upstage ya on your own video? Kick’em back to the WC already ;-)
This has happened to me, before, in other ways .. I arrived at the modular party, a year ago .. and, as you have just hinted at, Aaron, maybe all the beer is gone? .. me, .. I do hope that someone will pick up the Mutable Instruments torch, .. but, with it being open source .. is that a viable plan? MI's different modules do fit together pretty nicely, in my experience, .. at least the more recent release designs.
Perhaps VST plugins are gaining a larger slice of the pie, too? The analogish thing of twisting real knobs, .. sometimes, even using real sliders .. that appealing less on average, to the newer & younger people? I've never worked with plugins, .. so, of course, I'm guessing.
I suppose Arduino, and Rasberry Pi sales could fill some of this potential void, as well? Not that much of a stretch, to imagine .. modular synth purists possessing soldering irons, in their tool boxes. Take some of the classic mono output module types, and build them, at least in stereo, if not in quadraphonic output .. or, lately my favorite .. generate a 32 segement/slider version of MI Stages. Or, merging a couple of the classics, into super hybrid units.
You're not wrong about the vst/virtual environments. With programs like vcv and cardinal being free, or at least working on a busker business model, there's really little incentive to get into the hardware environment, even if you're a knob twiddler, it's super easy to just get a decent midi controller set up to do whatever you want. Plus you can achieve things in a virtual environment that are just impractical or straight up impossible with hardware (polyphony comes to mind, for instance). Add to that the conveniences of software like never having to tune vcos, drop down context menus, the ability to input specific number values on any parameter, like typing in exact voltage numbers, no constraint on rack size, rapidly growing free module libraries (including many popular hardware clones like Befaco, instruo and MI), etc, and the appeal of physical hardware really starts to diminish. The only upside is accessibility, now if someone decides they want to try and get into modular, it's not a $2000 chunk of circuitry that ends up collecting dust in the basement in 6 months after they bounce off it, and it does have the potential to grow the user base a lot faster and easier, which may or may not translate into more hardware consumers.
@@kyleh1127 Thanks for the comments .. good points, I think .. other than modular gear, I haven't tried to buy anything electronic, in the past couple of years .. but, computer chips, and the lack of .. it sounds like it's still a problem. A fragile industry, that's been taking some hits, eh? Missing just one piece, out of this big puzzle, means no operational gadgets, for either conventional modular, or for any substitute.
@@kenswanson1093 I wouldn't worry too much about chip shortage, considering that it affects the auto industry as well, i can't see an industry that big just standing idly by and doing nothing about it. Between big auto and big tech they will find a way around it, whether that means a new source of making chips or a way to eliminate the need for them altogether, it's really just a matter of time, and my money's on it being solved sooner than later when there's literal $billions on the line.
@@kyleh1127 Yeah? .. I was totally thinking like you, .. back when this first started .. "Just get past this COVID experience .." well, then other things have happened. And there is movement for new semiconductor plants, too. I did do some hunting about this topic, before I posted you, to see what the general speak is of late, about chips .. and, yes .. there's still problems, presently. Something like a 1000, to 1500 chips are now being installed in a new vehicle. Yikes ..
Anyway .. I hope you're right.
I insisted of trying to remove the hair from the screen because it really looks like it’s laying on top.
It is a privilege for me to have had the opportunity to engage in this hobby, I’m one of the very lucky few to have had both freedom and the means to explore and choose what to engage in. lf the people who created modules that you appreciate is alive, let them know how their creations are meaningful for you.
Chances are that each and everyone of us possess knowledge, skill set and/or means in general that would be of good use to some of them if you are willing to consider it and extend the offer.
The Worry though seems to consist of an idea of the future where we obtain new things that are going make us happy, and what reality seems to be in the now threatens our means to either become or maintain happiness, content, inspiration, motivation, creativity and so on.
Changes are inevitable as well as gain and loss, worry and fear but if worry and fear are to be the chosen factual interpretation of both the now and future, what is missing now and what means is needed to ease it?
Only my 10kr on the topic 🙂
What?
Birds aren't real 🙂
VCV and Cardinal for the win
I wish I liked that workflow. I’d have a happier bank account haha
Because sample windows, aliasing and dsp latency is what eurorack is all about?
After 13.000€ Later…. it wasn't worth it
good riddance