Does it make sense? FrSky dual band receivers
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- Опубликовано: 3 янв 2022
- Support my work / pawelspychalski
FrSky tries to put something new on the market: the Tandem series
TD R18 and TD MX dual-band receivers. They work, at the same time in 2.4GHz and 900Mhz! Of course, to pull it off, they need to be paired with Tandem radios like Frsky Tandem X20. On top of that, some people would like to see dual-band capability added to Express LRS. But, does it make sense? 
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This is about avoiding interference, jeti does dual band also
Dual band RC link is a legal requirement for large RC models. See JETI RSat, that product exists for the same exact reason. FrSky is pivoting towards the large expensive models market that is currently controlled by JETI. The Tandem X20 radio is also positioned as a direct competition to JETI.
I think that this is too far fetched assessment. Can you share a document that states that? Redundancy is for sure a requirement in some cases, but dual frequency link with single Rx and single Rx is not redundancy
The question that should be asked is not if you need that in a single receiver, but rather if you need 900G and 2.4 on board.
Once we look at this like that, they are not the first to invent the segment
FrSky is just copying from Jeti, (take a look at the x20, in comparison to the Jeti tx)
And Jeti already proved that there is a demand for that.
I know people here in Israel that use Jeti with both 2.4 &900 on turbines planes, as well as on F3A planes, expensive plane like this deserve any insurance you can.
@@FPVUniversity Jeti does the exact same thing. It is called "Duplex".
The redundancy is in the frequency, not in RX units.
In large scale airplanes, these receivers (one or more) are connected by SBUS to an external device - i.e. Powerbox / Booma AR , and it decides which receiver to use in any given time. 2 TD receiver can be connected.
So this feature is actually quite nice, as until today we used a separate 900MHz receiver for the frequency redundancy.
I can say that the 50-100KM range statement is just marketing, as we won't really need/use this receiver for those ranges.
At our field, we sometimes have heavy disturbances on 2.4 GHz and 5.8 GHz, probably caused by some WLANs in office buildings and/or nearby radio stations. We've had signal losses, independent of protocol or manufacturer.
In that case, the 900 MHz rsp. 868 MHz is not affected and could save the day. That's why I'm thinking about buying the X20 for my planes 🙂 Copters are already on X-Fire.
A second independent receiver would give even more safety, in case some part like a voltage regulator fails on one of them.
Sorry but your comment about cross interference and need for dual receivers is misleading, as the engineers of the board have taken all of this into consideration, and made sure there is no crosstalk on the two Rx's. also if you go back a few years we all used to run on 35 Mhz and this was fast enough for our models, so why would 900 Mhz be a problem for latency, except on a jet or so?
Jeti does dual 2.4Ghz and additionally 900Mhz, the TD system is not a fantastic new technology, what is new is receivers with 2.4Ghz and 900Mhz.
I think you missed the point... its NOT about long range for all the people at our field that has a bunch of 2.4 lockouts.... it about a backup on a totally different freq band that only takes over when the 2.4 craps out.... two 2.4 rx does squat when all 2.4 is hit....
Also Jeti has this Dual Mode.
The flight controller should hopefully add support multiple Receiver inputs. Using multiple sattelites was very common with spektrum systemsin the past. For large drones ,some extra redundancy is always welcomealso some bigger distances between antennes can offer added reliability.
My friend: you've missed the whole point, and the primary use-case of tandem (dual-band) comm links - redundancy and fidelity.
You fly $200 quadcopters that are little more than ToysRUs items. We fly $35,000 turbines needing 15+ channels and a field crew of 3+ guys.
JETI has done this for years, and FrSky is making some headway into the segment - good for them.
So important is redundancy and fidelity that most turbine guys double-up: 2 receivers, each dual-band with 2 TXs, with 1 primary and 1 inactive backup.
This is part of the bigger problem. The few big mouths of the fpv community all hate FrSky because they took away the clone recievers ability to steal business. So anything FrSky does is just a reason for these people to complain & talk about how great their radiomaster is! I laid the X20S down & watch one guy almost storm out of the room he was so angry to see anyone give it Love. Makes me laugh. I fly 5" quads, run Archer RS. Works great! I fly gasser's. I trust the 900 backup after watching one or two spektrum recievers plow planes in the ground a year! I want all of the security for planes costing thousands!
@@devinetime8938 Thank you. The FrSky haters think people are stupid. If FrSky said 1 + 1= 2 that would be wrong.
@@devinetime8938 Exactly..
Here in Oz our field is adjacent to a NBN Tx - 100k watts of 2.302G to 2.4G range plus another 4.57km away doing exactly the same . With further housing Dev etc. another is also likely .Interference modulation likely to cause interference in our 0.5 watt Tx ? At least 900M can Tx @ 1 watt. Your thoughts ??
Isn't DJI doing exactly the same thing on the FPV Drone? Those are dual band and to be honest the range and reception with the DJI drone is far better than the range on the air units that only use 5.8 Ghz. Seems to me that if a company like DJI sees the benefit in dual-band and is willing to invest in the technology then there most likely is a benefit.
Привет, у меня полётный контроллер matek f722 mini se
Обновил контроллер прошивкой inav 4 и у меня не возможности записи blackbox, в разделе blackbox есть только два варианта записи
Serial port
On-board SD card slot
Это Ваш промах или можно как-то активировать запись через CLI?
We have on our phone...use every day.
This is for those Berks using Spectrum on their big money scale aircraft. Instead of a decent radio .
Most of the USA then....🤔😳🙄🇬🇧
Excellent heads up Pawel!
Pawel, since I now work for FrSky i can tell you that this product fits a need for the fixed wing LOS community. The Tandem line is selling great and people are loving it. if you'd like to talk about it, please let me know.
But what exactly do you want to talk about? The fact that I don't think that dual band system makes sense? Because, youn know, it doesn't. And I'm not saying that Tandem is a bad radio. Just that single band would be good enought :)
@@FPVUniversity 2.4 for low latency, 900mhz for range. So far, it's been adopted by turbine jet pilots. The current leader in that market has a dual band 2.4ghz solution When it failsafes it then goes into 900mhz. The Tandem runs both bands at the same time, and switches over to 900mhz when 2.ghz RSSI degrades to below threshold.
But since when LOS needs range? maybe people buy Tandem because X20 is a nice radio, not because it's dual freq system? That makes waaaaaay more sense
@@FPVUniversity It's about redundancy, mainly. either band can fail, mid-flight, usually due to a (illegal?) nearby aggressor, some of us have seen it happen, even with advanced 2.4GHz systems. this is when dual band radio (TX and RX) can and, and often does, save the craft. People out there have the failsafe logs showing that this is a real life scenario.
Yes? I'll just say one thing! Frsky tandem x20S is shit! I had to buy a new power module and a new tandem module so that I could restore this equipment and sell it!
Hey Pawel.
Das ganze müsste mal in einem Labortechnischen Umfeld genauer Analysiert werden. Ganz einfach weil hier und da der Bedarf besteht und Fakten geschaffen werden müssen. Nicht nur die Dual Band Geschichten sind ein einziger Haufen von Fragezeichen. Ich denke da direkt an den Duty Cycle im 868mhz Band bei Systemen wie TBS Crossfire im 150Hz Modus. ExpressLRS im 500Hz Modus. Sendeleistungen der Module im Bereich von 2000mw. Ist man bei Nutzung diverser Systeme evtl. schon mit einem Bein im Gefängnis, wie Hoch ist das Risiko Funknetze oder andere RC Nutzer zu stören. Und vieles mehr. Evtl. könnte man dazu die Modelflugverbände ins Boot holen wegen der Finanzierung. Ich vermute mal die wären Interessiert an diesem ganzen Thema.
Thank you and full agree😂
well explained .
sounds like a marketing trick for 95% of the hobby.
Might be usefull for all those with the bigger , more valueable planes but they seem to prefer a redundance receiver which is a total different toy than this - at least what my buddies on the field had told me that this does not really help them having a 2,2 m ME 262 jet powered plane where he has a redundant receiver in case things go wrong.
Use case 1: Airframe control and head tracking in 1 unit.
Use case 2: 2-operator heavy lift applications
But those are not the use cases we are talking. You tak about multiple receivers and multiple TXes. I talk about a single receiver that automatically switches bands but still talks to only one radio at a time
@@FPVUniversity
Was thinking that FrSky could leverage their controller to be stand alone TX and have plug in “accessories” like data collection ground station or even video downlink, similar to Herelink, but use and integrate their other telemetry sensors. Feel like there’s a bigger play than just RC diversity.
We talk about hobby, not military device, or this hobby would go to another level. Multiband? of course to avoid jamming device.
Fair enough, Pawel. You seem to be correct about that.
What I think might be interesting are the dual band radios. Because then you can choose to use a 2.4Ghz receiver or a 900Mhz receiver.
Anyway, stay safe there with your family! 🖖😊
Ein Fehler hat das Video, mit Jeti ist seit Jahren bereits ein weiterer Hersteller auf dem Markt der im Sender bereits das 2,4 GHz und das 900mhz Band gleichzeitig nutzen kann.
I'm thinking of it as an enhanced diversity.
Its good when you have not the perfekt place to install the antennas,and thats on 90% of rc planes😊
en realidad no sabes
Have experienced horrible servo jitter with these receivers because of the 900 MHz telemetry link.
Do you not have to adjust the power output on the relevant link to sort this ?
dude double is better than one, cars has 4 tires not 1 or 3 but 4, double signal is for redundancy, to go above brownouts and to prevent any other radio signal yo wash yours out, u just mad that frsky has it and not spektrum😂 n now u can run 3 recievers at the same time talk about it. alot of spektrum users have had fly aways🤷♂️
sure the more is better. Just like having extra chromosomes and stuff!
@@FPVUniversity yup, just like having extra chromosomes ✌🏽
i think there trying to compete with the express lrs system which can achieve long range with 2.4ghz
"the name is like a name"
- Pawe£ Spychalski 😏
If they use alternating 900Mhz / 2.4Ghz then presumably the noise floor in and around the model wouldn't be a problem?
I agree though that this sounds like a gimmick. But given the competition they now face and the fact that they seem to be hemorrhaging customers perhaps that's not surprising?
I have a feeling here that because FRSky has made some controversial moves in the recent past with their proprietary hardware and protocol, that they are using this dual band trick to gain more more market confidence. They need to pull a rabbit out of their ass to gain the trust of the community again, and this is a trick to get the loyalists back in their corner. Just my two cents
Tandem is basically for RC Airplanes. It is used in jets and large scales when you want a redundancy over a different frequency.
We don't need additional range, as 2.4GHz is more than enough. We want to make sure that if, for some reason, 2.4GHz band is noisy and there are RF issues, 900MHz will take over.
@@grock89 My planes are long range FPV and i use 900mhz ELRS already. I dont feel the need for dual band fo my application but others might
@@North49RC and I agree it's not for you. You don't need the redundancy. You need a long range rf link, but you have a flight controller to cover you if something happens to the link.
In big airplanes, there is no flight controller. You lose link - you crash. That's why redundancy is so important. In frequency, battery and receivers.
The answer is No.
In capitalism, nothing makes sense. New products every week just sucks. Lets fly not buy.
The question is, does frsky make sense? The answer is NO! Don't buy anything from a company who hates their customers!!!