Compound turbo zd30, can it make more average torque then a 200 series??
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- Опубликовано: 12 июл 2024
- On this episode, we do a quick run down on the compound set up on Matty's zd30 powered patrol ute. We do a little comparison between this set up and a few of the Toyota v8 turbo diesels. Not in an effort to lay claim to which is better, but to purely show the wide torque curve the compounds produce. Helping to portray for the people at home just how good this vehicle now drives, after we got the turbos working properly and having it tuned to suit.
Apologies about the audio, phone Mic must be on its way out.
![Nissan Patrol Engines TD42 vs ZD30 - [ Why Do You Have One ? ]](/img/1.gif)
Great to see you back,enjoying the knowledge..love the idea of compounds
Thanks mate, we have filmed a heap more from other small builds, just finding time to edit and make something worth watching isn’t easy.
Well I’m impressed ! The numbers are pretty dam consistent and extremely impressive for a ZD . Great vid
ZD goals! Need this compound set up for my D22
What a great video - Loads of good information, proper explanation and no bullsh!t, love it. I have a 2015 CRD I would like to liven up a bit, currently got a UniChip running 20PSI on full stock engine and 3" exhaust. You have given me some new ideas now 😁
Good Intake, front mounted intercooler would be a great place to start, and you won’t need it retuned with those mods. Then once funds allow, a turbo swap with a ZL30 and retune should see some great gains in both drive ability and outright power. Plus doing it this way means you’ll have all the supporting mods, so once turbo goes on, it’s ready to be retuned to take advantage of all the other mods. We see these combos go regularly in the 190-210hp range.
Awesome info on the compound setup 👌 definitely has me thinking now 🤔 Love the examples of comparisons to the VDJs 👍
Benny has been trying to talk me into seeing you for a tune for years! 😂
If yours hasn’t even been tuned yet, good a intercooler and intake plus a remap, will make a world of difference. We usually see a good 30-40% increase in power and torque.
Bloody awesome video! Love to have that done to my zd30 ( which is running supurbly . All I have done is installed an HPD intercooler and a pro ent catch can
i'm a diesel fitter by trade ,,reading the comments,,, i dont think people understood this is peak power tuned as you called it full send tune , lolol,,, numbers are good but the engine wouldnt last to long being pushed that hard,,,, ive got 07 s4 Patrol zd30, engine is standard,,, its great on and off road,,,, you dont need crazy numbers on paper to have fun
100% mate, a lot of people get caught up on peak figures from one shop to another. We can full send every car that comes through the door, but then how many wouldn’t survive. Not a risk we are willing to take on most peoples pride and joy. 99% of the time it’s about drive ability and torque increase, not just peak figures on a dyno.
My crd goes pretty well and is reasonable responsive with 21psi on the stock turbo with 470nm and 175hp this thing must be an absolute animal!!! Interesting to see how reliable this thing is after a few ks
Good video Chappy 🤘🏻
I wish you were in Melbourne. Really enjoy the content mate
Thanks buddy.
super informative bro! thanks
My pleasure man.
Awesome comparisons to the other engines, really interesting. I agree that it'll be happier with some arp's, just solidifying my want to put a ZD in the MK if the SD ever goes bust...
Great move! I've got a FMIC TD in my MK SWB and a boosted ZD in my GU - different motors/cars/torque feels, but I'd definitely go for a ZD to replace your SD, if and when. Good fun and great torque from a ZD.
For sure would be a solid conversion. Far lighter and arguably easier to fit then something like a td42. Only negative would be the electrics required to make it work when comparing to simpler motors like SD and Td.
@@boostedsagas884 that’s where I’m considering a late model DI instead of a CRD, seems like all the early issues were well and truly fixed long before the S4 came out, so I figure it would probably be easier to do a conversion with just as reliable of a motor, just much harder to tune which is a bit of a problem. It should also be cheaper to buy a DI since they’re the ones with the bad reputation, regardless of year, so people will probably sell them for less.
Unless you reckon a CRD conversion would be worth it? Curious to know your thoughts on the two options if you’ve got time
@@boostedsagas884
Hi mate where is your shop located ?
Have a zd want to up grade
@@alexsanderbajic7945 Beerwah, on the sunshine cost in QLD mate.
Can't wait to bring mine down send it to the moon🚀🚀🚀🚀
Mate I was really impressed with how these performed. Yours with studs, should be a damn good thing.
This is the info I've been needing. I have a stock zd30 di and I've been wanting to do a compound turbo setup for more power/torque. I just need to find someone to do the job and do it right
If you watch Banks Power you want the biggest turbo your engine can handle for max performance and the you want a small turbo big enough to drive the big turbo.
I bet it's so nice to drive
It accelerates soo smoothly. As the torque is virtually there the second you squeeze the throttle, it doesn’t come on hard or aggressive, it literally just feels like your driving a 6ltr diesel and has torque off idle all the way to redline.
Awesome vid mate, very surprised what the ZD is capable of, considering it was not that long ago everyone viewed this engine as rubbish.
Most people were ripping them out and putting a td42 in, if only this information was around earlier it would've saved people a lot of money!
I'd be very interested to see how the compound setup would go with a td42 with ARP head bolts and all the usual add-on's.
Pump & injectors, cooling, intake, exhaust.
And any other iconic motor really.
I'd say most would do a lot better than the standard single snail setups!
I'm sure you'd have predictions on how they'd fair?
Iv always loved that the ZD30’s were rubbished. Kept parts nice and cheap haha.
I did put it against a FTE with 21L and +30’s. But it demolished the zd30. They make around 900-1000nm and 300-320hp on there big tune. But that’s gods motor and they can’t be compared to anything hahah.
This zd30 combo against your average 200-220hp td42, the zd30 beats it hands down in usable torque. Not just peak figures, but simply has more across the entire rev range. The torque curve is so wide and flat, the delivery is really smooth, if you have ever drive a 250hp single turbo Td, there very “two stroke” in the way they make power. Big hit of torque at 2000-2200rpm then drops away after that. Which some people love, others don’t. This was very smooth in its torque delivery, which made it very easy to drive and manage. It just accelerated and kept on pulling the entire way to redline.
Obviously a built td42 or similar sized motor with compounds would be better again, there’s no denying that.
@@boostedsagas884 So true with FTE they are in their own realm haha, I have a swb TD42 with 240hp and yeah your right it has a very small window where it makes good power.
I was more asking what that compound setup would do on the TD, the size of the turbos look like they would match up pretty well.
Really makes a lot of sense, having two perfectly matched turbs coming on throughout the rev range, I think it would turn my 240hp into a really useful power curve.
Awesome work good thing my zd just shit a turbo looks like I'm up for 2 new ones 😀
Thanks for the great content 👍 I would have lived to see some boost graf's from both turbos just to see how the big one takes over, totally understand that you maybe can not do that whith the inputs you have.
You sed you get around getting a bigger pump with water meth injection. Just a comment on this one, it does not need to be methanol, you can give it all kind off fuel, lpg is quite common, in some areas, more to make it cheaper to drive around, but you get more fuel to play around with in the same, some people have tried gasoline and E85
My understanding is that you just need to keep it lean enough in the intake fuel to not self ignite before diesel ignition, that's the rule off thumb, you can run up to 50% lpg on a diesel. And you see some stupid easy systems, just a regulator, with a solenoid and some adjustment valve and a house in the intake before turbo,
You are bang on mate, we used to chuck a line straight off our camp gas bottles down the intake as kids, and pretend it was nitrous racing mates up the beach hahaha. So it for sure works.
As for turbos, I did log them individually, small turbo comes on super early, gets to about 10psi, then the large turbo starts working, essentially then what ever the big turbo makes, the small turbo will double. So for general cruising around at light throttle, if the big turbo is making 5psi, you’ll have 10psi in the manifold. It works like this right up to 100% throttle. Then the gate on the small turbo bypasses 90% of the gas flow. And at peak boost pressure, big turbo was making around 25-27psi, and small turbo was bumping that up to 35-37psi. So we knew the small turbo wasn’t working very hard, and were not going to have any reliability issues going forward.
I always wondered in a compound turbo system when some people have the problem, not you in this case. That the small turbo wg does not keep up, and still running a wg on the big boy too, you have the extra exhaust going in serie true two wg's. Would it not work better to have the big turbo wg bypass bought turbos, so still having two wg's, but the small turbo wg feed's in to the big one like it is, and the other from manifold to down pipe. This way you might get a way with using smaller wg's. When you have enough exhaust to open the big turbo wg, there is enough exhaust for the small turbo that it's already having wg open. So if we let extra gas in parallel out from under that, it shouldn't care. And for the big turbo control, well pressure different is bigger between two turbos that just the big one, so it's easier to get higher wg flow even with a smal wg 🤔 I might be completely wrong in my theory, and there might be a lot of other factors involved I missed completely
@@kristiangronberg3150 you could, though as long as the small turbo’s gate can flow enough. There isn’t any real need. You just treat them as two seperate turbos, working by themselves. The turbo doesn’t know any different, it just pulls air in, and multiplies it. The small turbo doesn’t know it’s being fed air, it simple multiplies what air volume it has, depending on the shaft speed it’s being driven by the turbine. So if we can control shaft speed. We control how hard it has to work. Ideally, you just want it there for quick spool and response, then let the big turbo do the rest, as it’s far more efficient at flowing larger volumes of air. On performance set ups we can size the big turbo up so large, that it barely even needs a gate at all. Just let it make all the boost it wants from fuel drive.
EGTs would be very interesting - one of the CRD's biggest anxiety creators.
Matt said when he drove it up to us from Goldy, it was constantly hitting the alarm set at 550C. Now remembering this is going through two turbine, which we usually see 150c drop across a single turbo set up, so I’d have to imagine we are seeing atleast a 100C drop across each turbo here too. Now after making this set up work properly over how it came in, plus proper tuning, it barely registers on the pyro at all on the tow tune. And needs a long heavy acceleration in order to make them climb on the big tune.
Another great vid, i like the zd stuff. P.s turn ur flag around, its not hanging the right way..👍
Well I’m be damned, I never gave it a second thought after hanging it up, tried having it vertically, but didn’t work to well. So I just let her drop down and secured it. I’m glad someone told me, I’ll get it sorted ASAP.
Hi mate i love your work, its good to see the tough little ZD up the ladder, they get an un fair bad wrap lol and
Can you get the arp head studs for the direct injection zd's? if so what price are you looking at roughly?
Pretty sure you can mate, we don’t play around with the Di a lot. Different ecu means different tooling is required to tune them. So not 100% on pricing for studs.
Thanks heaps, definitely something to consider. Appreciate the fast responses aswell.
Have you had the chance to work on a OM606 and if so, what would you think as a conversion candidate? This was my first consideration for a conversion as I didn't want to go with a huge engine to try and keep weight down.
The OM606 seems to tick a lot of boxes, however, they are an old engine now and they're nowhere near as common so parts may be costly and an issue to find.
No I haven’t played with one of them either. Hugely popular over seas, but as you said, parts and availability here in Aus is the biggest down fall of this engine.
m57 seems to be the way to go
Great vid Chappy, that torque curve is amazing, any gear she'd be rippin and ready to go. Couldn't tell from the video but is the exhaust manifold stock ZD with an adapter? custom? or does the complete Iveco/Renault and manifold bolt up?
Thanks mate, it does. It drives and responds like a much larger engine then it actually is.
Stock exhaust manifold with a small adaptor to bolt turbos on, then dump from small turbo to large had been modified. These usually run a w2a intercooler between the stages. I’d love to see what difference that would make.
Time to do some more web research and scouring Ebay listings, a setup up like this would be the dream on my CRD ST coil cab. If I get it done I know who to see to get it tuned 👍😁
That extremely impressive for a zd, wonder how my 3.0l ranger would do with a similar setup that torque curve is phenomenal.
They would love it man. I’d honeslty go slightly larger on the big turbo. And let it eat.
Hey mate, awesome video as always. Do you tune DI zd30s or do anything tune wise for them
I really want to get mine tuned
No we don’t I’m sorry.
@@boostedsagas884 all good mate, I saw they do a unichip for the di zd30. Are you able to do them.
Haha I should just engine swap to a CRD 😅
@@harleywatsonofficial we can do the uni-chips. But bang for buck, your probably better of finding someone who can remap the factory ecu. Full unichip supplied and fitted will be nearly double what a remap will cost you.
Hi, nice explanation on the zd compounds, im getting interested on building one. Im from philippines. Can you help me with the the turbo side of the build?
These are stock Iveco turbos. Hunt around for a set or try find their specs and you’ll be on the right path.
I really need to get a spare ZD...
Yep keen as how much can I get this for and get you to setup
That all depends how much your willing to do yourself. I’d imagine this exact combo would be worth 10-15k.
Hey mate, loving the zd30 series.
I've been looking at a possible ISB 4.5 Cummins swap but after roughly pricing a conversion it seems like it's no great value for money but almost everyone I've spoken to that has one loves it and with diff gears can sit on 100-110 @1700rpm.
Have you ever worked with one?
What are your thoughts on them?
Worth the swap or just put the money on building the ZD30?
Haven’t gotten our hands on one yet. On paper they seem great, but need to be set up proplery. Gearing is the biggest thing for a low revving Cummins. We drive and tune a lot of 5.9’s and 6.7’s. Every time there used in a conversion, my opinion is they drive pretty crap, cuz they simple don’t rpm like a normal car engine. You need really low gearing to make them work properly. Most 5.9’s won’t rev past 2500rpm at full power, they rev out, but are derating more and more as they rev. So on the road you get a big hit of torque, then it’s all down hill from there. Compared to something like a FTE, which can still make 1000nm of torque, but will continue making power all the way to 3500+rpm.
As for putting money into the zd30, well ya just need to be realistic with your expectations. I feel 200hp and 500nm is easily achieved and reliable. 300hp and 700+nm is faulty uncharted territory for long term. There’s a handful of zd30’s making that power, but long term reliability or use ability may be questionable.
…and there goes any credibility you may have had.
Hi, I am interested in the egt temperatures? Did you also measure those as you retuned the engine, cheers Ian
On the drive up, Matty said it cruises down the highway at 500-650 when he hit a hill. After tuning, cruised down highway at 300c and flat out saw 500c foot flat.
That’s a great result, thanks for letting me know
Who does what you do in WA mate? Got a zd30 am rebuilding atm so may as well do what needs to be done.
Get onto the boys at Modified Diesel Performance. They will sort you out.
Where did ypu get the alphatech ? Cant find any resellers with good info on google.. also does it support soi? And what abaut bosch edc ecus?
We are a Alpha Tech dealer. We supply and fit them, from Alpha Tech Australia. No, it only controls rail, durations, boost and throttle. SOI is part of the changes we make in the factory ecu, along with torque limits, fuel curves, egr, etc etc.
@@boostedsagas884 ok tnx. Can you just tell if it supports bosch ecus?
@@Heinosendampperi yes of course, this is on a Bosch EDC ecu.
Compound turbo's are the way to go! The biggest mistake people make tuning diesel's is thinking more fuel is more power. Rich diesel blowing black smoke has less power than a lean diesel. Having unburned fuel in the cylinder is effectively reducing the cubic capacity.
Efficiency is king.
The Iveco Daily 4x4 engine is a Fiat Power Train Industrial (FPT) F1C not a Renault engine FYI.. Pretty much the same engine used by Fuso for their small trucks
Well there ya go, thanks for the info man.
had to read this twice thought it said compound 200 series !!
Now that would be something to see. Only compound 1VD I know of is Frankenmule. From GSL.
What would you think a drive in drive out would cost from a stock zd30 patrol would need a fmic kit aswell
To do a set up like this? That’s hard to quote as the price of the turbos is kinda unknown. But I’d budget 15k easily.
What would this setup cost vs the 200hp video from 5months ago?
Virtually same same, just different turbos. So that would virtually boil down to what you get the turbos for, and how much work you can do yourself to fit them.
Are those zd30 reliable at the 250hp mark?
The only weak point is the head bolts. We have never heard or seen one physically break from power. Unlike td42’s and 4j’s which love snapping cranks around this power level. With some ARP head bolts and a good cooling system to ensure temps stay under that 100-105c range to prevent the head/block sealing surface from warping due to heat. I don’t see a reason why this wouldn’t hold together.
What can I expect with a GQ 2.8 liter turbo diesel cheers Graham
Plenty of time to look around and enjoy the scenery while trying to reach the speed limit.
Maybe on the highway but off-road it seems to do all right. My son spent all day pulling his mates out of the mud in the Glass house mountains. Brought the old girl home with mud up to the windows.
These two compound turbos....are they VNT turbos? It's gated turbos yeah ?
From factory, it’s gated on the small and nothing on the big. Factory they limit fuel to limit outright boost from the large turbo, resulting in a really lean burns and cool combustion temps. When we added more fuel trying to make more power, we needed to add a way of controlling the big turbo, hence adding the external gate.
You need a pointing finger on a stick, like option video!
So badly hahaha.
What are you using for boost control?
Boost tee on the small turbo, as it’s actuator is a little unknown. Then the waste gate on the large turbo with the correct spring.
@@boostedsagas884 so using the factory actuator on the small turbo?
All mechanical control? Would there be any benefit to electronic control and is it something you could do with the Alpha Tech?
Also one more while I'm here, are you tuning the fuel to the MAF or MAP values?
@@bennyjahmin3953 I believe these would be a Vacuum actuator from factory on these turbos. As it’s easier for most moderns ecus to control. This has been swapped to a positive pressure actuator at some stage I’m assuming by previous owner.
If you wanted to try have some form of variable boost between tunes then maybe. But the Alpha Is unable to manage a max valve or similar. Usually we prefer the most simple solution to a problem, correctly specked waste gate spring and a boost tee, pretty hard for anything to go wrong.
@@bennyjahmin3953 maf for part throttle light loads, throttle input for full throttle fuelling. Maf and map both tap out so we can’t use there readings at higher boost levels. Not such a big deal in diesels, as long as we have enough airflow to keep AFR’s and EGT’s in check. But maf is great for part throttle fuel economy, and generally drive ability hence why we keep it.
@@boostedsagas884
So is the small turbo a vnt?
I didn't think you could control a gate with a vacuum actuator?
I dont really know where to ask this so I guess here, how old is too old to do a bit of mods on a 4jj1
I have one with 245k kms and it’s got a pretty unknown history
Guy had it for 7 years, “did his own servicing” and the wiring is spaghetti but I’ve been told the car is fine mechanically
Kinda just wanna maybe do 30 injectors and an exhaust, then later on maybe intercooler and turbski if i feel like it warrants it in a few years
Worth doing injectors without all the rest? I heard you might need a new fuel pick up too so eh
It’s a process and I just don’t wanna be doing stuff to a car that can’t take it
Generally speaking, you can throw some 30’s straight in a 4j and they pick up some decent power and gains, then have it tuned to suit. I’d be looking at doing a intake manifold clean, and deleting the swirl flaps in the manifold. They have a habit of coming loose and dropping screw through the engine. So do a little google search on that too, you’ll see what I mean.
@@boostedsagas884 thanks mate
My 2.0 LDV compound turbo puts out 500nm at 1500rpm
On a chassis dyno? Or is that manufacturers specs for the vehicle?
@@boostedsagas884 Manufacturers specs
@@sailingcitrinesunset4065 yeah so that is at the crank, This torque is measured at the wheels. There’s a big difference between what the manufacturers claim, and what we actually get to the ground. Nissan claims the zd30 makes about 380nm, in reality we see maybe 250nm at the treads. Roughly a 30% reduction over factory specs.
Turbosmart wastegate on the charge piping would fix it alot better
I’m curious what you think it would fix exactly?
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6/8 cylinder engines even making the same torque and hp just feel strong? Compared to a 4 cylinder.
There’s no doubt, it’s the off boost response they have until boost comes on. That’s what makes larger capacity diesel feel nicer to drive. Lack of low down torque is what zd30’s (Infact all new small capacity diesel) are terrible for, waiting for that turbo to come on. Hence why modern diesel/vehicles have more and more gears, the autos can keep the engine in its happy operating range for longer. These how ever are so responsive, it’s very impressive to drive. It’s the torque it makes so quickly. Torque is what makes diesel/4wd’s nice to drive. And having a wider torque curve is even better again. This pulls the same at 1500rpm as it does virtually all the way to redline. Wide torque curve, and a climbing power curve is what makes vehicles feel “powerful” they take off easily, and just keep gaining speed.
@@boostedsagas884 cheers thanks. Maybe next time I get a crd gu I'll give it a run first before pulling it out.
@@donaldwills2135 most zd30’s won’t touch this kind of usable torque, it’s really the compounds that make this a stand out vehicle.
@@boostedsagas884 yeah definitely. Shows what a good set up can do. Completely changed the torque curve
I work for iveco.. the small turbo will fail the oil seal and pump that engine full of oil.. end up with a run away and self destruct.. I can't wait 😆 common occurrence with the daily's 🙂
Not knocking your work love your channel but throw that turbo to the shithouse
Eeeekkkkk, I’ll keep that in mind next time I chat to Matty. Thanks for the heads up.
Your also comparing a 4cyl to v8...
Yeah mate, That was kind of the point.
For those at home who obviously can’t drive this vehicle, but May of driven or even been in a tuned 70 series cruiser or 200 series. This ute has more power and more torque then both of them. And not only “peak” figures, but it makes more power/torque across the entire rev range then the v8’s. Again like I said in the video, both v8’s were tuned very conservatively, as both where being set up for towing/touring round the country. It was just to help illustrate just how drive able this combo is thanks to those compound turbos giving it a extremely wide usable torque curve.
@@boostedsagas884 I want to put compound turbo on a 3.9 Mitsubishi Rosa bus motor in a 4wd.
How much for to do that to mine brah everyting💰💰🚀🚀
Not something we offer as a drive in drive out package I’m sorry. The compound Turbo availability being the main issue.
can this turbo setup work on a Di ? even if the injector pump is the VP44 you can tap into the pulse off the accelerator input map . and how much is the cost ? good video ! 🛻📹😎🤙
this is alot of power ! it would be quite responsive and very livly usable power I would imagine!
how do you think this compares to the Gturbo bad boy upgrade ?
No single turbo compares to a properly set up compound set up. It’s why compounds are a thing. I’m not bashing Gturbo, or any other VNT turbo. It’s simple physics, a small turbo will respond quicker, and the big turbo will outflow a single VNT turbo which is trying to do the job of both turbos.
Please tell us about the internals of the engine...stock?
As far as I’m aware, it’s completely stock. My only concern as mentioned is lack of ARP head bolts.