Awesome video Peter. Great explaination of the transient response of how that enclosure type actually responds in real world. Knowing that info helps when it comes to tuning properly for individual desires.
+Pssound +Erin Hardison Peter, thanks for doing the comparison measurements. Great information. 👍 It would be interesting to see if these measurements consistently follow basically the same response changes when measured in a variety of different sedan makes & models with similar trunk/seatback IB walls? That's one reason I've tagged Erin Hardison here. He's had multiple IB trunk wall setups, as well as sealed systems in the trunk, and 10 inch subs in the kick panels both sealed & IB. And he's done a lot of measurements before and after doing these different subwoofer setups, so maybe he has some data or interesting observations regarding your measurements and how they may correlate to other vehicles. And Erin has done all of these setups in the same vehicle, which is a 2006 Honda Civic 4-door sedan, IIRC. I personally have had similar measurements and experiences with both a single & dual 15" SEALED subwoofer setup that was placed down-firing in the far rear passenger side of the rear cargo area of an extended length '93 Ford Aerostar EXT van (LHD). This vehicle has a large rear hatch door and is obviously one large, continuous cabin without a separated trunk area. This was one of my first installs way back in the day, using the Sony CDX-C910 & later the CDX-C90 HUs with the Sony XDP-4000X DSP....which still sound amazing even with their limitations compared to the modern Helix DSP Pro MK II DSPs in my other vehicles. As a side note, I love the Alon Mor tracks, but in this case it was WAY too loud in the background, and very distracting during your commentary. EDIT: Here is one of Erin's funnier videos... ruclips.net/video/pcgPefrLlMM/видео.html But he's a serious dude when it comes to Car Audio, acoustics, & measurements, even having owned and extensively used a Klippel analyzer.
Great video, I admire the work you do. I wonder, with the seats up and the trunk shut in the system like this, is it still appropriate for the subwoofer to work as an IB? I mean whether the space between the sub and the rear seats is sufficient enough for daily driving regardless of the SPL drop.
Nice job pit. Like it. I wish I new how to use my program like you do. I have the same as you. But i can only use 10% of it. 🙁. Yes this is a good video
I had a ported 12" subwoofer IDQ12 in 2.2 cubic feet tuned to 28hz in my 10th gen Accord and switched to trunk baffled AE SBP15 mounted right against the rear seat. The uncorrected responses were almost the same both with a big dip at 35hz which makes sense since the dimensions of the car dominate the bass frequencies. The second the trunk is open the 10db dip at 35hz is gone and the SBP 15 response smooths out and gradually rises from 60 to 20hz vs peaking at 30 with the trunk closed. I was hoping for more output under 30hz and may try true IB in the future.
This was the setup used in the late 70’s early 80’s then different type of boxes we’re going into the trunks I live in south Florida it’s not being used anymore
Can you please cover the Fletcher Munson Chart and how it applies to tuning. I'm having a hard time understanding how to tune the car. Should I go rta flat or fletcher munson curve
I’d say RTA flat, curious if Peter says you’ll need more bass but I’ve never heard of tuning to the FM curve (and if so, which FM curve? As in it changes with volume. .
@@busyboxst7 I've done the FM curve using a spl meter. To me it sounded dark and or dull. I ended up combining my old eq with the curve and it sounds much more wonderful to me and my brother. I know it has more room to improve but as I don't have a rta I don't know if I'm even going in the right direction. Granted I could use the spl but it's difficult/anoying and filled with problems. To choose what line you want in the FM curve if you recall 1000hz is the reference point so you start there but also bare in mind your weekest frequency as well as what volume you truly want to listen to. Definitely curious to hear Peter's imput as well as others.
I’m not exactly sure what you mean by “I’ve done the FM curve”. If you have a smart phone, get an RTA on that. It’s not perfect, but better than nothing. Save current settings and try it.
@@busyboxst7 I used a db meter and turned as best as I can. I plan on getting a dsp and a rta soon. Thanks for the tip but I'm of the mind set "Anything worth doing is worth doing it right"
м it was measured with pink noise, which is not as accurate as feeding the measuring signal from the laptop into the system and being able to measure from like 5Hz with a sweep.
MJ Harris In well built doors it extends down to even lower, but not in this car. These Honda doors are shit even with heavy deadening. I wanted to build sealed enclosures, but there was no time for that.
Sq team Turkey No, i can’t, but u can load it into Helix in demo mode, make a note of the filters and type them into Zapco manually if you trust auto EQ.
He names the sub in the video. There are plenty of subs in that price range that can be used ib, but youd better be willing to do a lot of fab, because if you have a $200 budget for the sub you dont even need to ask a shop about doing the install for you
@@pssound9749 seriously? The actual footage of the actual IB, you just show us graphs on the computer. We want to see how you closed of the woofer from the cabin to the trunk
@@hometv5999 sorry, this video was shared years ago and your question wasn’t quite accurate. Please go to playlists and find trunk IB. There are several videos showing this type of application and the installation m, including this one too.
Crimboz what would be the difference in terms of sound if the magnet was in the trunk? I help: nothing! The cone of the speaker has 2 sides and the waves radiate both directions. This case it was mounted like this as this way there’s more practical space left in the trunk.
I'm not sure why our measurements are so different. With the windows down you only measured a slight difference in dB. But when my windows are down, onlookers are seeing a consistent gain of at least 50db 🤷
What I'd like to see is a totally sealed system. Seats up, trunk shut, windows closed. Other than that, this video is near meaningless, as I don;t know anyone with any kind of system, who drives daily with the trunk open, windows down and rear seats down.
Awesome video Peter. Great explaination of the transient response of how that enclosure type actually responds in real world. Knowing that info helps when it comes to tuning properly for individual desires.
+Pssound
+Erin Hardison
Peter, thanks for doing the comparison measurements. Great information. 👍
It would be interesting to see if these measurements consistently follow basically the same response changes when measured in a variety of different sedan makes & models with similar trunk/seatback IB walls?
That's one reason I've tagged Erin Hardison here. He's had multiple IB trunk wall setups, as well as sealed systems in the trunk, and 10 inch subs in the kick panels both sealed & IB.
And he's done a lot of measurements before and after doing these different subwoofer setups, so maybe he has some data or interesting observations regarding your measurements and how they may correlate to other vehicles.
And Erin has done all of these setups in the same vehicle, which is a 2006 Honda Civic 4-door sedan, IIRC.
I personally have had similar measurements and experiences with both a single & dual 15" SEALED subwoofer setup that was placed down-firing in the far rear passenger side of the rear cargo area of an extended length '93 Ford Aerostar EXT van (LHD).
This vehicle has a large rear hatch door and is obviously one large, continuous cabin without a separated trunk area.
This was one of my first installs way back in the day, using the Sony CDX-C910 & later the CDX-C90 HUs with the Sony XDP-4000X DSP....which still sound amazing even with their limitations compared to the modern Helix DSP Pro MK II DSPs in my other vehicles.
As a side note, I love the Alon Mor tracks, but in this case it was WAY too loud in the background, and very distracting during your commentary.
EDIT: Here is one of Erin's funnier videos...
ruclips.net/video/pcgPefrLlMM/видео.html
But he's a serious dude when it comes to Car Audio, acoustics, & measurements, even having owned and extensively used a Klippel analyzer.
Thanks for a nice and good video again Peter! I see you have a lot of e-mails to read..... :)
Great experiment and explanation!
Super informational! Thanks for the info!
Great video, I admire the work you do. I wonder, with the seats up and the trunk shut in the system like this, is it still appropriate for the subwoofer to work as an IB? I mean whether the space between the sub and the rear seats is sufficient enough for daily driving regardless of the SPL drop.
It sounds like a sealed box in the same scenario, this one needs less power and drops a bit lower.
Another good video! Thanks!
Nice job pit. Like it. I wish I new how to use my program like you do. I have the same as you. But i can only use 10% of it. 🙁. Yes this is a good video
man ur system sounds good reminds me of my bro n law system who did competition i would like to get that type of sound but now sure how
Great video
Awesome tests!
Nice peter
I'd be really interested to see this test redone with a sealed sub.
l34052 Good point! When i have a project/custom with a system like that, i’ll do a test, but the principal is the same.
I had a ported 12" subwoofer IDQ12 in 2.2 cubic feet tuned to 28hz in my 10th gen Accord and switched to trunk baffled AE SBP15 mounted right against the rear seat.
The uncorrected responses were almost the same both with a big dip at 35hz which makes sense since the dimensions of the car dominate the bass frequencies.
The second the trunk is open the 10db dip at 35hz is gone and the SBP 15 response smooths out and gradually rises from 60 to 20hz vs peaking at 30 with the trunk closed.
I was hoping for more output under 30hz and may try true IB in the future.
Best track, Peter! :D :D
NTG Innovations You really need the right time to get the best out of it! 😎
Good job peter again:)
This was the setup used in the late 70’s early 80’s then different type of boxes we’re going into the trunks I live in south Florida it’s not being used anymore
Can you please cover the Fletcher Munson Chart and how it applies to tuning. I'm having a hard time understanding how to tune the car. Should I go rta flat or fletcher munson curve
I’d say RTA flat, curious if Peter says you’ll need more bass but I’ve never heard of tuning to the FM curve (and if so, which FM curve? As in it changes with volume. .
@@busyboxst7 I've done the FM curve using a spl meter. To me it sounded dark and or dull. I ended up combining my old eq with the curve and it sounds much more wonderful to me and my brother. I know it has more room to improve but as I don't have a rta I don't know if I'm even going in the right direction. Granted I could use the spl but it's difficult/anoying and filled with problems.
To choose what line you want in the FM curve if you recall 1000hz is the reference point so you start there but also bare in mind your weekest frequency as well as what volume you truly want to listen to.
Definitely curious to hear Peter's imput as well as others.
I’m not exactly sure what you mean by “I’ve done the FM curve”. If you have a smart phone, get an RTA on that. It’s not perfect, but better than nothing. Save current settings and try it.
@@busyboxst7 I used a db meter and turned as best as I can. I plan on getting a dsp and a rta soon. Thanks for the tip but I'm of the mind set "Anything worth doing is worth doing it right"
Whenever you get a real RTA, perhaps get an iPhone one too (probably free, maybe $5 and see if they’re that different (?).
2:20 you make use Open Sound Meter program
My ib drops too under 20hz, not as steep as yours. 20hz highpass filter?
м it was measured with pink noise, which is not as accurate as feeding the measuring signal from the laptop into the system and being able to measure from like 5Hz with a sweep.
Does the RAm6A get down to 60hz?
MJ Harris In well built doors it extends down to even lower, but not in this car. These Honda doors are shit even with heavy deadening. I wanted to build sealed enclosures, but there was no time for that.
1:00 avratz 👍
Rew files can load to zapco new dsp?
Sq team Turkey No, i can’t, but u can load it into Helix in demo mode, make a note of the filters and type them into Zapco manually if you trust auto EQ.
What subs are you using and is their a sub priced under $200 for this set up
He names the sub in the video. There are plenty of subs in that price range that can be used ib, but youd better be willing to do a lot of fab, because if you have a $200 budget for the sub you dont even need to ask a shop about doing the install for you
Bro can we see how you did it?
Did what?
@@pssound9749 seriously? The actual footage of the actual IB, you just show us graphs on the computer. We want to see how you closed of the woofer from the cabin to the trunk
@@hometv5999 sorry, this video was shared years ago and your question wasn’t quite accurate.
Please go to playlists and find trunk IB. There are several videos showing this type of application and the installation m, including this one too.
@@hometv5999 it’s also explained in the first half minute that you can find the link to the build log of this system in description.
Should have gotten the 18H+
Why do you have the bass turned towards the rear of the car
Crimboz what would be the difference in terms of sound if the magnet was in the trunk? I help: nothing! The cone of the speaker has 2 sides and the waves radiate both directions.
This case it was mounted like this as this way there’s more practical space left in the trunk.
@@pssound9749 okay! Was just wondering if there was any difference?
Is this a demo or an excel class?
BRA-Lorenzo i guess both? 🤷🏻♂️
I'm not sure why our measurements are so different. With the windows down you only measured a slight difference in dB. But when my windows are down, onlookers are seeing a consistent gain of at least 50db 🤷
Zero chance for 50dB, that’s an absurd number and gain! Your measurement system is not working.
What does the Qts on the sub have to be to do an IB ?
You can get away with a QTS of 0.5-0.6 depending on subwoofer design. But Ideally should be a QTS of 0.7 and 1.0 is fantastic for IB.
I want to know entry song:)
Sq team Turkey Alon Mor-Presudeos
Anyone know the second song?
A Sharp Infected Mushroom - Avratz.
@@pssound9749 thanks!
I got SQ ptsd from hearing Avratz
Sorry man! At least their tunes don’t get blocked on YT!
Pssound it’s all good, I appreciate the videos and like your set ups
What I'd like to see is a totally sealed system. Seats up, trunk shut, windows closed. Other than that, this video is near meaningless, as I don;t know anyone with any kind of system, who drives daily with the trunk open, windows down and rear seats down.
utubecomment21 Mate, that’s the very first measurement, you probably missed that!?
I drive daily with my rear seats down not the damn trunk though hahaha
If you're reading this comment, stop watching now. There's no demo, just him talking for 11:48.
Some people want to learn. You can’t do that from looking at moving subs. You just wanna bang right? 👏
And by the way... the title does not state this is a demo...
We don't need you to talk just demo.
And you don’t need to tell me what to do on my channel. You’re welcome to run your channel and leave mine. 👍
Go elsewhere boo, his work is far past your intelligence and intuitiveness. Some people like to learn and be educated. You clearly do not…