@@waterheaterservices - but if you also get the polyglycoat Summer/Winter undercoat protection for another thousand, they may throw in the trunk mat. Ask the salesman to talk to his sales manager about it ;)
One thing I would have added is to decline the dealer's offer to appraise your trade-in until you do the math on the purchase of the new car. Two things can happen if you don't follow this advice: (1) When they appraise your old car it comes in a a lot lower than you think it should and when you ask for your keys to leave they suddenly become "lost". I had to call the cops on O'Reilly Chevrolet in Tucson once because they had "lost" my keys. (2) They will play the high-low game on the trade-in with you until you are so confused you lose track of what your new car will actually cost.
I used your advise on buying a used car from a dealership and saved! I negotiated $1500 off a used car and they attempted to put $550 back in to it with license and registration which it already had. Thanks to you I was watching for something like this in the contract. I barely even mentioned this on the contract and they quickly removed it. Only added cost was the $85 doc fee. thank you.
I bought my wife a used KIA Sorento from a big dealership ,when we were trying to negotiate the price theey said that they could not come down that they were as low as they could go. While the salesman was gone to "talk to the manager" my wife was looking on line for other cars like the one we were negotiating and she found that same vehicle on line at the dealership we were at for $4000 dollars less. When the salesman returned he said they could come down $400, i said you are going to have to come down $4000 dollars and he said that would be below what they paid for it. At that point we showed him the on line price and he did not know what to say. He went and talked to his manager and they gave us an additional $500 off of the Online price.
I'm a bit different than most when it comes to interacting with a dealer. I always do my homework on cars I am interested in before ever going to a dealer. I select what options I am interested in on a vehicle. When I negotiate with a dealer I only allow them to deal against a final price (I pay exactly that price). They can do their paperwork any way they want but I pay that final price. If they don't like dealing on a final price then I walk. This has worked for me since 1977.
Yup! I always ask for the OTD (out the door) price and pit dealer against dealer. Even with that, I still spent 6 hours at a dealer on a deal I worked with the sales guy via email because the manager wanted to screw me on my trade-in and financing - I told them that when my car was paid off in 4 months I would be back (as the truck was sitting there for 4 months already and would likely be there in another 4) and to have a great day - finally the manager threw the keys at me and told me to take the truck because he didn't want to see me ever again. That was a winning moment in my life :)
I went to a used car dealer years ago and wrote out a check for around 15% less than he was asking for the car. I said here is the total I will pay for the car. You can give me the car and take the check or I will keep the check and go. He he-hauled around and then took the check and I got the car.
I helped to purchase a car, for my son before I saw Kevin's videos. I inadvertently helped the dealer to rip off my son. Never again. I set a bad example for my son that I was "helping" to purchase a car for. I have shared my experience and Keven's videos with all my family and friends. I don't want anyone else getting ripped off like I did.
I ended up walking out of a deal on a car I was considering not too long ago because the dealer wouldn't budge on the fees or the price. The finance guy, and eventually the manager, kept telling me this story about how they were already selling me the car under what they paid and that the fees were required. Most of the dealers in my area add a bunch of fees, including a $799 dealer or document fee. I didn't know about checking for what's included in taxes, I just looked at my state DMV for vehicle fees such as registration. In my state, a typical car costs $43 to register, and $10 to title. I'll grudgingly pay $75 for dealer paperwork shuffling, but I won't pay a penny more.
Kevin is doing such a fantastic service for people about to buy a car. Honestly, if you don't pay attention to his videos and make notes before your trip to the seller, you will end up a lot poorer. Thank you, Kevin! Keep em coming!
My last car deal, I e-mailed several dealers asking for an out-the-door price on the model I wanted, including all fees and taxes. I then double-checked the offers at home with no pressure. Dealers who tried to play hide-the-ball didn't get my business. Among the genuine offers, I chose the dealer with the lowest overall price. I thought it was a fair way to compare a low car price (plus lots of fees) with a higher price (plus few or no fees).
I plan to do the same thing. The out the door price is all that matters. When buying a new car, they're all the same, so you can easily compare prices, go to the lowest dealer and haggle some more. I hate the process, but everyone plays this game.
@Scott Gunderson My Corolla is 11 years old but only 50K miles and in good shape. I'm keeping an eye out for a deal (like I did in the 2009 downturn), but I haven't found one yet. The dealers near me are holding steady on price and pushing cheap financing. Like you, I can hold out.
@Mark Burk true, if all the emailed dealers are charging a well-dressed salesman fee, just some more than others, you could still wind up with a bad deal. Hopefully, the emailing from home would bring out their competitive spirit, but there's no guarantee. All the same, I might try this next time because going to the dealership is like swimming with a stick in a piranha tank for 6 hours!
The one helpful thing I did for my latest vehicle purchase that I haven't seen Kevin Hunter mention (although it might be in there somewhere; I haven't watched them all) was just having patience. Dealerships don't all ask the same price as the starting point for similar vehicles, and if you don't rush yourself, you can get a sense of what's average and which ones are higher and which ones are lower, and the longer it takes to find the one that's low enough, the longer you get to keep saving up more money for it in the meantime. Once I decided that I was going to get a truck sometime in the next half-year to a whole year or so, I just kept doing online searches for trucks like I might want, nearly every day for months, all while saving more & more money for it. After a few months, when I was used to the fact that most trucks like I wanted had asking prices usually at least 29k to the low 30s (with sparse handfuls of them occasionally down to the 27s & 28s or up to the mid 30s), I started excluding anything over 30k from my searches and carried on searching & waiting & saving some more. Eventually my routine normal search of the day just happened to bring up a truck about like those (or even a bit better than most) in terms of model, age, & mileage, but with an asking price of 25k. It was like "negotiating" down about 15% before even needing to hear a single word from a sales schlock.
I remember the dealer told us to talk over the price and the salesman would leave us alone. I noticed an intercom system our job used. The intercom can be used to listen in, unless the privacy button is pushed down. I pointed the system out to my wife. I told my wife (car was for her) there was no way I was paying more than x amount of dollars....way below what the dealer wanted us to pay for the Subaru. When the salesman returned I mentioned my price and got it for $100 more than I mentioned. I never expected the dealership to go that low. Disclosure: new Subaru dealer in a county next to where we lived. They wanted their car sold and in our county. I can almost guarantee the dealer was listening in !
I think the same thing happens with pawnstars. They do an interview with the seller and ask what they want for the item. Then the interviewers tell the bald guy. The bald guy already knows what the lowest price is. Or the bald guy gets a price out of the seller and "calls the expert". It is obvious , prior to the expert going on camera, the bald guy tells the expert to appraise the item lower than the asking price.
I helped prepare a friend to buy a car. Sent her these videos as well as others. Taught her all the tricks they use. I even picked out a car for her (2018 Camry). I did my homework and based on trim and mileage, taxes and fees, came up with a very reasonable out the door price. She was putting $4500 down. I spent HOURS preparing her. The car was listed at $22k. Her out the door offer was supposed to be $21,700, which I KNEW they would accept if she stuck to it. I said the loan should be 48 months with a payment of ~$450/month. I told her If that’s not what she saw on the paperwork, she was getting screwed. Well guess what? 72 month loan and her out-the-door price of a $22k car was....... $26,800. They managed to add $4800 to the price of the car before she got outta there! And 4.9% interest. She said she had no idea people could bully her like that. She said they just kept saying “sign here. And here” and when she tried to question them they got upset at her. She said she’d never been so intimidated. And now she’s paying for it. They essentially stole her down payment. So even if you’re prepared with information, you BETTER be prepared for them to try and bully you.
Absolutely top quality info. (I have to admit I feel I'm unfairly watching these, but I'm 65+ and total income monthly is around $1k, else I'd be a patreon, own the tshirt, buy the book, and continue to imagine myself in a new, fully paid vehicle. My 2007 Corolla is the vehicle I'm thankful for.)
Another way to test it is to ask and then demand that they put their answer in the contract. For example, "Is this Aged Inventory Fee legally required?" "Okay. Then I'd like the contract to say legally required aged inventory fee." They won't do it. They know that it becomes fraud if they intentionally lie in the contract and the contract becomes voidable. Anything that you aren't sure you trust them on should go in the contract. Even if they do put it in there, it gives you a lot more time to research it for yourself.
Great Video Kevin. You are highly focused and share the crooked car dealers who pad every car deal after a negotiated price........ Im pretty savvy and always share the dealer holdback fee the dealer earns after the sheister salesman complains hes not making much money off of me. To bad ask your freaking boss for a raise.....
Things like this make me thankful to live in Missouri. Our dealers cannot collect any licence or tax fees, except for the temp tag fee, at the dealership. Taxes are paid at the licence office. Everything paid at the dealership is taxable. All I ever negotiate is the out the door price. The finance office never sells me extras. I know how much the total will be before I walk in to the finance office.
In Florida legitimate state fees are: “Lead Acid Battery Fee” $1.50, “New Tire Fee” $1 per tire, “Title Transfer Fee” $74 (if you transferred your plate from a Florida trade), “New Vehicle Registration Fee” $195.00 (if you had no trade or you are trading an out-of-state vehicle) , “State Sales Tax” 6% + 1% local option tax which is capped at $50, (tax is calculated on trade difference not vehicle purchase price). Most all dealers in the state charge a “Predelivery” or”Dealer Charge” or “Dealer Fee” of $800-$1,000 and will try and sneak in an “Electronic Filing Fee” of $195. I’m seeing a lot of dealers have vehicles marked up with a “Market Adjustment” calculated around 10% or around $4,000 to $5,000 depending on MSRP. Then of course most vehicles on a lot have the paint protection, nitrogen et al which adds another $750-$1,500. Knowing all that, a persistent buyer can still get a vehicle without all the markups. A lot of times its just easier to take a trip to the midwest where you can get a much better deal and save thousands and thousands and just pay the legitimate fees directly to the state when you come back.
According to this site=www.autolist.com/guides/dealer-fees-florida the lead-acid battery fee and tire fee is for environmental cleanup and to help car buys that got junk cars. So Florida has thought about it and it's illegal to lie about fees that are fake you have to put them in the fine print and not to include them in the advertised price. It's just enforcing is hard so if you see a dealership break these laws walk and say you're reporting them... How can the midwest beat that?
I love calling them out on their tactics. The stall, four square thing, one thing I have had trouble with was the fees. I usually set an out the door price that I am comfortable paying with and have financing from my bank before I go in. Last dealership wanted to hold on to my driver's license while he went to talk to his manager. I told him I didn't have time for a stall and he wasn't going anywhere with my license.
Kevin I have some ideas about how to deal with these kinds of things that you may like. It is true the law of supply and demand controls the selling price of a car, But if we have a slow selling market and a motivated dealer, think about deducting the following from the final price at an end of the month buy. Here are some extra "allowances" I seek. First, let's not forget a new vendor allowance if you never bought from this dealer before . This is easily worth the total amount of the doc fee. If this does not get their attention try the vendor preference allowance as you can buy from another dealer. Don't forget your slotting allowance as you are setting up a new vendor for financing. Time is money (ask a dealer!) so remember you have costs in writing and mailing or making a bank transfer for the monthly car payment. Your time is involved writing and mailing a check with postage. if you are financing 60 months. explain to the dealer that at $10.00 per check that is worth $600.00. He should agree its only fair if he charges a doc fee. Don't forget your ADR waiver fee . This should be at least $2,000.00 . Read the back of the contract. You are probably giving up important rights going to Alternate Dispute Resolution rather going to court. It is also a very useful tool to get up and walk out of the dealership If more people knew exactly what they were giving up (depending on the state) more people would think long and hard before signing a a car dealer's contract.
Good video. About 4 years ago. I bought a used 2002 Buick. The sales rep tried to charge me a fee for getting my tags. I said never mind that. I will pay my own tax tags fee at Motor Vehicle Dept when I pick up my own tags. So I wrote him a check for the car and he did get me $75.00 for handling fees. I should have bucked on that. But I didn't. A week later I went to the MVA and bought my own tags and paid the taxes and title fees. Thanks for sharing your video.
Thank you for your videos. I just bought a car after watching your videos and used everything you taught me. I went to two dealerships and the experiences were very different. First one tried to trick me into buying a car that day. The second salesman took his time, no pressure, and let me leave to think about it. Then when I decided to buy, they gave me an “out the door” price with taxes and the (admittedly high “processing fee” clearly stated, and focused on the total price, and even negotiated down a bit. They also never once said “how much do you want to pay per month” like the first place. And I navigated the finance guy deftly. Thank you.
Went to the dealer on Tuesday 5/26. Was looking at an X5 for $15,800. I went through USAA to see the price and it was listed for $14.100. The dealer added $165 dollar for 3 free oil changes, $495 for theft protection and a $300 doc fee. I told them to remove all the add ons and drop the doc fee to $75 and we had a deal at $14100. they said they couldn't so I got up and walked out with my wife who really wanted the car. By the time we got outside they said they would drop the price another $300 off the price to cover the doc fee, for a total price $13800. All said with everything totaled up the price was $15366.69 and we put $2000 down. Should have it paid off well before the end of the year. We also had them fix the crack in the windshield which was at the base and a check engine light before agreeing. Still waiting on them to call us as it had to go to a certified BMW repair shop to be looked at. The dealer might end up paying another $500-$3000 dollars depending on what is wrong. I will keep you posted if you want to know more.
I just found your channel this past weekend and have watched about 5 videos. They're friggin awesome. I thought I was a savvy car shopper, but am currently making excuses to not check the details of my new car purchase 3 years ago.
Non car-buying, but car maintenance fees, piss me off: "Shop fee" added at an oil change for what? The damn rag they used to wipe oil off their hands? Why don't these fools simply add the cost to the oil change price? Rhetorical question, we know why. It's simply the same car pricing gambit on a smaller scale: keep the advertised price down.
I was looking to see if anyone else had already posted this. Places like Pep Boys add on a 10% misc. shop fee. I'll never go to any place that plays that game.
Yes, that one pisses me off too! Wiping his hands on a rag that’s been used for weeks if not months. The government should step in and regulate everything about them. I won’t go there as they’re as corrupt!
My son was going to buy a used car and sent me the purchase information sheet and just like you said, there were fees that sounded legitimate, but weren't. Sent him the link to your videos. Thanks Kevin.
Excellent topic!!! I'm in the market of buying a car and this helps me a lot. I went to the car dealership and they asked me right away "HOW ARE YOU GOING TO PAY THE VEHICLE ? AND HOW MUCH DOWN PAYMENT ARE YOU PLANNING TO PUT DOWN? I WAS SO IRRITATED AND TOLD THEM THAT I HAVE NOT SEEN THE VEHICLE YET. THEN NEXT THE SALES PERSON ASKED ME AGAIN " I NEED TO KNOW IF YOU ARE PAYING CASH OR FINANCE SO I CAN LOOK FOR A CAR THAT WILL FIT YOUR BUDGET. THE SALESPERSON WAS IN A RUSH AND THEN I LEFT. Thank you VERY MUCH FOR THIS VIDEO. GOD BLESS YOU KEVIN H
My daughter went to buy her first car. She was 20 but looked maybe 16. Short blonde girl. List used car at about $2800. She paid absolutely no extra fees just tax. He made the mistake of telling her that he was leaving on vacation that afternoon so had to be that day or two weeks later. She used that in negotiations that he would need to worry about it and have money for vacation. She had talked him down quite a bit already. Her final ploy was after he waived all other fees and gave her a price after taxes. He said, have a deal? She responds no, make it an even 2550. She told him she didn't want to write more numbers on the check. He gave into it. All this time, I am sitting on a couch nearby talking with the dealer's friend and listening to her conversation. I didn't see any reason to step in unless to help the dealer. Almost felt sorry for him. Side note. She deals quite a bit with the local Muslim and Mexican community and has learned to negotiate from them . Not bad for a young girl and first time car buyer. She had already walked away from several cars that day to include a dodge charger that she liked at that dealer.
The best thing about about all of your videos is that I’m now confident and know about the whole car sales process. As soon as the shelter in place lifts, I’m ready to head to the dealer and rip them a new a** hole. Knowledge is power! Thank you.
Sam Walton himself said outright that the big items, the end caps, the stuff in the big aisles, was sold cheap. Sometimes at cost. But the majority if the stuff in the store? Like a $3 USB cable selling for $8.95? More than made up for it. THAT was the WalMart genius.
Thank you so much for the brutal truth and honesty calling out the dealers. At the end of the day the fees all boils down to profit, about time they take responsibility for the crap they pull every day!!
The last used car I bought, I shopped online for several weeks, comparing cars & trade-in values. When I finally settled on the make & model, I cranked up the search, looking at cars onine at dealer lots & private parties. Along the way I encountered about a half dozen scams on the PP side of things, mostly to do with non-existant cars that looked too perfect, the price was too good, and all these "sellers" were just about to ship out overseas & would ship the car to me at no additional charge (because the government gave this to them as a perk of service), & I'd have a generous amout of time to cancel the deal at a full refund. Way too good to be true and all scams, of course. After wading through all the fertilizer mentioned above, I finally located several cars at dealers. I made an appointment to see one I particularly liked & arrived on time for the test drive. I was fully prepared to go see another car afterward. The drive went great & I sat down with the saleman to talk turkey. I had done all my homework & made what I considered to be a fair offer, which of course allowed for the dealer to make a profit. He gets up to "check with the sales manager," & lets me sit for a few minutes. He came back, sat down, & began to explain how they just couldn't go that low. I extended my hand as I rose & said, in an ever so calm & friendly tone, "Thanks so much for your time. It was nice meeting you.," and I turned to go. The look of shock on his face was quite unexpected on my part & it was priceless. I really WAS expecting to go & look at the next car. Bottom line, I got my deal, out the door, for my offer. It helps to remember that there are far more cars than buyers. I don't mind walking away from a car that I love if I can't live with the deal. (By the way, I still have that car, I still love it & I'm keeping it for another 10 years if I can.) I'm again looking for a second used car, & I'm so grateful to learn about all these fake fees. Thank you so very much for the education.
I was going to buy a new truck cash and was looking forward to using things I learned from you but Im starting to have second thoughts about giving up 30k on a truck.
What a great public service he provides. As an X car sales guy, the reason why I left the business is for so many scams car dealer sell... thanks for the videos kevin
I did the same thing for my '88 Toyota Pickup and my '02 Highlander. Both times the salesman looked he had lost his best friend, but I got the price I wanted. The last thing the dealer wants to see is you walking out the door without the keys in your hand.
I was a sales at Toyota dealership. They told me all my car sales were "minis" which would be $100 per transaction. And NO I did not get that $100 because the hourly wage rate would be higher than $100 per day. Now I know they cheated on their employees..
Years ago I was trading in my 2002 dodge quad and cab back to the dealer I bought it from for a used 2000 jeep wrangler. We kept fighting over trade in value and sale price of the jeep. Well, the sales manager told me that since it was summer the jeep was worth more and my truck was worth less because "nobody" buys pick ups in summer. So I told him I'd be back in the fall and I expected the price of the jeep to be a lot less and my trade in value on my truck to be a lot higher, since well, jeeps certainly dont sell well in winter but 4x4 trucks would. He got pissed and told me in didn't work that way. I said no? I'm just applying your sales demand theory to the sale. I thought he was going to take a swing at me! HAHAHAHA
Yes #TheHomeworkGuy - I would be very curious to hear your take on these companies, since they do "seem" to offer a better experience and better prices on vehicles than going to a brick and mortar dealership...
Quentin Gerlach. I read reviews on both Vroom and Carvana and they are enough to make me walk away very fast. And I am not talking about a few reviews, but hundreds. They score very very low. Many horror stories. I quickly said no to this option.
These places are predatory. They prey on silly people who are afraid of confrontation. They tout "No hassle". OF COURSE IT'S NO HASSLE! You just end up paying thousands more for your car than you should have.
Heh, my mom used to do tags/title work at a somewhat less-shady car dealership, and she'd tell me some of the crazy extra prices on things that a customer was buying that weren't needed like this. The ' fee' was always up in there. Hers in particular didn't work so much on car sales, so much as they did in parts and service. Tons and tons of extra charges for things that actually weren't done or needed.
Mark Miller Subaru in Salt Lake posts "Factory Price", then a "discount" off that price, which is their "fixed price". I asked the sales rep to take $500 off that price. He agreed without hesitation. I have learned to study the sale "price estimate" sheet provided by the dealer, and then I ask for a pen and proceed to cross out fake dealer fees. I simply say "I'm not going to pay that fee". I then calculate the adjusted price and say "'That's what I will pay for this car". If they say they can't waive a fee, I say "That's a shame. I'm surprised you choose to lose this sale over fees you don't need to include. I know you receive a rebate from the manufacturer on this car, and also other credits not shown on this price estimate sheet either now or at the end of the model year, so you will make a decent profit without charging these fees. Give me a call if and when you can agree to my bottom-line price. I need to visit another dealership. Have a good day".
So the main point is to split up costs into different fees to make the individual fees look smaller and to reduce the initial car price displayed in the showroom. Add up multiple fees, so that the customer doesn't know how much each fee is. Third most important is using tax like yet another fee that has been subtracted from the initial car price, so the car price in the showroom is basically excl. Tax.
I think the whole dealership game has become to advertise the lowest sale price. Unfortunately the dealers have repeatedly one upped themselves by undercutting each other that the advertised sale prices in a lot of cases just aren’t profitable so hence they started making up fees and including high margin options like etching and pin striping and fabric protection on every car to maintain profitability. If everyone would just go back to an msrp based system and then offering those things to people who actually wanted them it would be fairer and they wouldn’t be needed. A lot of the super low price ad cars have negative profit without the add ons.
I’m still lost on why cars aren’t sold the same way as other products?? You don’t walk into a CVS and ‘negotiate’ a fee on detergent or toothpaste... if there’s a sale, then the price indicated is the sale price. A car should go for X, plus whatever government tax and DMV fee there is, then that’s it.
It's literally just how it's always been, and there's an absurd amount of market protection for dealerships that allows them to not have to compete with anyone besides other dealerships who use the same scummy tactics.
Because consumers have allowed it and many think they can out play a skilled salesman. The problem is consumers spend more money on vehicles than they can afford and don't even realize it. If you were to buy four new vehicles in a lifetime and make payments, you could have purchased a home in full. The difference, you have four depreciating assets and one appreciating asset.
Hey Kevin, I have learned so much from you being that I am looking for a car right now. I used that one Ace up the sleeve with the full cash payment at the end with one dealership. I was looking into buying a Hyundai Genesis coupe and they kept on trying to talk about financing options and I said exactly what you said," I am not talking about finances until we finalize the out the door price of the car." When we finalized the price of the car and I told them then I was paying in cash they could not deal with it. So I laughed at them and took my money elsewhere. Keep up the good content I got my bag of popcorn. By the way Elizabeth is a freaking level 100 boss.
LOL - I got this classic statement today regarding the dealer's $500 DOC fees -- "Oh, we can't waive it! That pays the girls in the back office." I almost started to laugh. I've tried to negotiate several deals over the last couple weeks. It seems like no one is willing to negotiate. This is our price - take it or leave it, and we won't waive our doc fees or add-ons.
#HomeworkGuy Kevin you are fricking awesome. (pardon the French). I never knew any of this info. I'm definitely going to look closer at my contract. I'm saving this video for future references. I'm sure glad there is honest people like you that brings out these crooked car dealer ship. I just wished I would of found you several years ago when I got majorly screwed by a dealership. Thank you for your tips.
I hated going to the dealer because they ripped you off. But thanks to the #ThehomeworkGuy i am actually feel i am more prepared and taking some time to researching and find the deal that works for me. God bless you Sir like 20% down payment and paying for the fees upfront and not finance them. This basic things have made me rethink everything on buying a car. Thank you once again.
All I can say is thanks Kevin for these examples I caught almost everyone of them so I know better before I buy my truck. Now it makes me want to see what my parents really paid for their vehicles to spot the hidden charges to so them money next time they need a vehicle.
I'm hoping your comment is intended to be humorous... and my comment on the video was also intended to be funny. If someone actually DID send me a $500 tip resulting from my "Fake Fee" payment joke, I'd return it. Paypal allows me to decline any payment at any time for any reason.
Hey Kevin, love THIS and all your videos. I'm doing a Virtual Shopping right now during our NJ COVID shutdown (while demand is low and we get to pick our exact make, model and color). I have 3 proposals and will lease from 1 of these 3 dealerships. Will be contacting them for questions on WTF are these fees and other issues (1 of the 3 have no fees). I'll follow up when we agree on a contract. Thanks again.
I like the design of several shirts, however I would never ever buy a shirt with the RUclips logo on it... I'm not 10 years old anymore. Would appreciate e.g. the shirt at 00:40 without the RUclips logo
Kevin, I would love to see a hidden camera of you walking into the dealership and negotiating with a salesman. Watching him bring you a contract full of bogus fees and then watching his face as you tell him who you are.
I wish I'd found your channel before I bought my car on Dec 1st, 2019. I thought I was being savvy waiting until December, and I DID get a lot of rebates and 0% financing plus did NOT accept any extended warranty or gap coverage (In fact, I had to tell the finance officer I was going to leave after he would not take, "No" for an answer about extended warranty) ...but I'm sure I paid all these fees.
When I was buying my car 2 years ago, the finance officer wouldn't take no for an answer for the GAP coverage he was trying to sell me. I said my stocks was my insurance. I'll sell my stocks if I have to, to pay off the loan ... LOL, I didn't have any stocks.
When I bought my 2012 Sierra (new) it was quite a battle when I refused to buy the extended warranty. 8 years later I’m so glad I didn’t, but like you, I’m sure I got ripped on all those BS fees and I never had a clue.
The last time i bought a car they wanted to sell me an extended warranty. I told them my car insurance company beat their price by a signicant amount using OEM parts and I wasnt interested. They offer to drop the price by half. Told them it was still higher than my car insurance and I wasnt interested.
I came up with a method for leasing, I offer $2,000 for license, and all fees and the rest goes to pay down the lease, and then compare 36 month 12,000 miles lease payments, dealer to dealer. My out of pocket is the same, I don't care about what "fees" are tacked on.
I've watched quite a few of your videos, Kevin, and I learn SO much with each one. Two questions I still have: (1) Are fixed-price/no haggle car sellers, like CarMax, Carvana and Vroom, showing their "sticker price" or their final out-the-door price? (2) I understand why I shouldn't tell regular dealers up front that I'm paying cash, but it doesn't matter if I tell one of those fixed-price dealers, right? I've tried to find answers on their websites, but none of them mentions fees or all-cash sales. Obviously, they hope to make most of their profit from financing, like regular dealers. I will be test-driving used Camrys next week, and if the salesperson pressures me to buy one right away I'm going to say I'll be comparing prices of the same make, model, features, age, and similar mileage with other dealers first. If I find a better deal I'll give the salesperson an opportunity to match it. I know they'll say no two "similar" cars can be exactly the same, but they're close enough for me. Thanks, Bill
The same things apply to new cars. Don't ever pay a dealer prep fee on a new car. The dealer gets paid by the manufacturer to prepare the car for sale once it gets off the truck.
My issue when I bought my first car was my credit union more so than the dealer. I got financing through my credit union because that’s what I had read was the smart move. However I didn’t expect them to be just as shady as a dealer finance office so my guard was down completely. The car I was looking at came in just under $12k, I had $2k to put down in cash. My credit union required that I give them the $2k as a down payment but then sold me on needing essentially $2,200 in extended warranty and gap insurance (which I haven’t used once in 4 years). I put all my focus and energy into preparing to be screwed at the dealer, when in fact it was at my own credit union. I guess I’ll know for next time, but damn does that leave a sour taste.
I wish I could hire Kevin when I’m ready for a new car! When I look at new cars, I start off by asking price of vehicle, I can do math just give me the price your asking. Before I know it the salesman is talking to me about something other than the car, I get exhausted and leave.
Call the dealer before you go and ask what their Doc Fee is. If it's $300, I just take $300 off what I was willing to pay so when they add it on, I'm at what I wanted to pay.
Thank u so much for sharing ur tips n knowledge sir much appreciated, it's very frustrating n scary knowing that u might be overcharging when u go buy cars
Bought a CPO Honda in Ohio a couple weeks ago. Tried to get them to wave doc fee- they said they cannot. They would be open to discrimination lawsuits. I said BS. Some research online says the same thing! I said so is it discrimination if I get a car for a better deal than the next customer? Sales manager didn’t know what to say. Needless to say got $200 off price of vehicle. @kevinhunter
Illinois ALLOWS dealers to charge a doc fee ($300 in 2020) but DOES NOT REQUIRE a doc fee be paid. (815 ILCS 375/11.1) (from Ch. 121 1/2, par. 571.1) " Every retail installment contract under this Act shall contain or be accompanied by a notice containing the following information: "DOCUMENTARY FEE. A DOCUMENTARY FEE IS NOT AN OFFICIAL FEE. A DOCUMENTARY FEE IS NOT REQUIRED BY LAW....".
#thehomeworkguy a big thank you for this video and all your other videos. I don't plan to ever be ripped off again after watching your informative videos. I feel more confident for my next car purchase. I will definitely share with family and friends!
You have the right to cancel it. You may even get a refund for the amount you have paid so far. Go back to the dealership and talk to them. Stand you ground. Good luck 👍
I’m in Kentucky and planning on buying a USED SUV in the up coming months. Anyway, in researching, I found two dealers that had a car listed on Craigslist, at the bottom of the AD, they listed some of their FEES. A Compliance and Emission fee ?? I can NOT find anything online in Kentucky about these fees. We do NOT have yearly inspections or testing on vehicles here.
I live in England and there are virtually no fees. I found it unbelievable that you have so many add-ons. I paid a registration fee of £55. If I wanted any extras like mud flaps or special floor mats that was all and the cost was minimal compared to the extortionate fees you talk about. Who pays $200 for air! Like your channel by the way.
Superb! I am looking to trade for a new car soon. These videos are so information, props to you! If I have any issues or questions, i will be sure to email you. NY has some of the shadiest dealers in the land! You are a steely eyed missle man!
Hi Kevin. Huge fan here. Here in Canada, Quebec we have regulations in place so all this bullshit doesnt apply this much but I really enjoy your videos. Keep up the good work 👍
Looking forward to seeing Corona Virus Hazard Fee
$999.99
@@waterheaterservices No, it would be $1900.
More like a $20.20 fee ;)
vietdude03 more like $666
@@waterheaterservices - but if you also get the polyglycoat Summer/Winter undercoat protection for another thousand, they may throw in the trunk mat. Ask the salesman to talk to his sales manager about it ;)
One thing I would have added is to decline the dealer's offer to appraise your trade-in until you do the math on the purchase of the new car. Two things can happen if you don't follow this advice: (1) When they appraise your old car it comes in a a lot lower than you think it should and when you ask for your keys to leave they suddenly become "lost". I had to call the cops on O'Reilly Chevrolet in Tucson once because they had "lost" my keys. (2) They will play the high-low game on the trade-in with you until you are so confused you lose track of what your new car will actually cost.
salesman here. you're 100% right people just don't want to see the truth.
I used your advise on buying a used car from a dealership and saved! I negotiated $1500 off a used car and they attempted to put $550 back in to it with license and registration which it already had. Thanks to you I was watching for something like this in the contract. I barely even mentioned this on the contract and they quickly removed it. Only added cost was the $85 doc fee. thank you.
I bought my wife a used KIA Sorento from a big dealership ,when we were trying to negotiate the price theey said that they could not come down that they were as low as they could go. While the salesman was gone to "talk to the manager" my wife was looking on line for other cars like the one we were negotiating and she found that same vehicle on line at the dealership we were at for $4000 dollars less. When the salesman returned he said they could come down $400, i said you are going to have to come down $4000 dollars and he said that would be below what they paid for it. At that point we showed him the on line price and he did not know what to say. He went and talked to his manager and they gave us an additional $500 off of the Online price.
Yeah that didn’t happen. $4,000 difference and it’s the same used car and miles?
Michael Buffington they do that all the time. I had to show my CarGurus ad. Offer them 12,500 out the door.
I would leave. Why give money to a business like that.
Beautiful.
@@jaimieconroy36 Naw, not really
I'm a bit different than most when it comes to interacting with a dealer. I always do my homework on cars I am interested in before ever going to a dealer. I select what options I am interested in on a vehicle. When I negotiate with a dealer I only allow them to deal against a final price (I pay exactly that price). They can do their paperwork any way they want but I pay that final price. If they don't like dealing on a final price then I walk. This has worked for me since 1977.
Yup! I always ask for the OTD (out the door) price and pit dealer against dealer. Even with that, I still spent 6 hours at a dealer on a deal I worked with the sales guy via email because the manager wanted to screw me on my trade-in and financing - I told them that when my car was paid off in 4 months I would be back (as the truck was sitting there for 4 months already and would likely be there in another 4) and to have a great day - finally the manager threw the keys at me and told me to take the truck because he didn't want to see me ever again. That was a winning moment in my life :)
I went to a used car dealer years ago and wrote out a check for around 15% less than he was asking for the car. I said here is the total I will pay for the car. You can give me the car and take the check or I will keep the check and go. He he-hauled around and then took the check and I got the car.
I helped to purchase a car, for my son before I saw Kevin's videos. I inadvertently helped the dealer to rip off my son. Never again. I set a bad example for my son that I was "helping" to purchase a car for. I have shared my experience and Keven's videos with all my family and friends. I don't want anyone else getting ripped off like I did.
What happened in your case if you care to share?
I ended up walking out of a deal on a car I was considering not too long ago because the dealer wouldn't budge on the fees or the price. The finance guy, and eventually the manager, kept telling me this story about how they were already selling me the car under what they paid and that the fees were required. Most of the dealers in my area add a bunch of fees, including a $799 dealer or document fee. I didn't know about checking for what's included in taxes, I just looked at my state DMV for vehicle fees such as registration. In my state, a typical car costs $43 to register, and $10 to title. I'll grudgingly pay $75 for dealer paperwork shuffling, but I won't pay a penny more.
They make these contracts and fee structures something that seems like I should have an attourney present to negotiate buying a car.
Kevin is doing such a fantastic service for people about to buy a car. Honestly, if you don't pay attention to his videos and make notes before your trip to the seller, you will end up a lot poorer. Thank you, Kevin! Keep em coming!
My last car deal, I e-mailed several dealers asking for an out-the-door price on the model I wanted, including all fees and taxes. I then double-checked the offers at home with no pressure. Dealers who tried to play hide-the-ball didn't get my business. Among the genuine offers, I chose the dealer with the lowest overall price. I thought it was a fair way to compare a low car price (plus lots of fees) with a higher price (plus few or no fees).
I plan to do the same thing. The out the door price is all that matters. When buying a new car, they're all the same, so you can easily compare prices, go to the lowest dealer and haggle some more. I hate the process, but everyone plays this game.
@Scott Gunderson My Corolla is 11 years old but only 50K miles and in good shape. I'm keeping an eye out for a deal (like I did in the 2009 downturn), but I haven't found one yet. The dealers near me are holding steady on price and pushing cheap financing. Like you, I can hold out.
@Mark Burk true, if all the emailed dealers are charging a well-dressed salesman fee, just some more than others, you could still wind up with a bad deal. Hopefully, the emailing from home would bring out their competitive spirit, but there's no guarantee.
All the same, I might try this next time because going to the dealership is like swimming with a stick in a piranha tank for 6 hours!
The one helpful thing I did for my latest vehicle purchase that I haven't seen Kevin Hunter mention (although it might be in there somewhere; I haven't watched them all) was just having patience. Dealerships don't all ask the same price as the starting point for similar vehicles, and if you don't rush yourself, you can get a sense of what's average and which ones are higher and which ones are lower, and the longer it takes to find the one that's low enough, the longer you get to keep saving up more money for it in the meantime.
Once I decided that I was going to get a truck sometime in the next half-year to a whole year or so, I just kept doing online searches for trucks like I might want, nearly every day for months, all while saving more & more money for it. After a few months, when I was used to the fact that most trucks like I wanted had asking prices usually at least 29k to the low 30s (with sparse handfuls of them occasionally down to the 27s & 28s or up to the mid 30s), I started excluding anything over 30k from my searches and carried on searching & waiting & saving some more. Eventually my routine normal search of the day just happened to bring up a truck about like those (or even a bit better than most) in terms of model, age, & mileage, but with an asking price of 25k. It was like "negotiating" down about 15% before even needing to hear a single word from a sales schlock.
I remember the dealer told us to talk over the price and the salesman would leave us alone. I noticed an intercom system our job used. The intercom can be used to listen in, unless the privacy button is pushed down. I pointed the system out to my wife. I told my wife (car was for her) there was no way I was paying more than x amount of dollars....way below what the dealer wanted us to pay for the Subaru. When the salesman returned I mentioned my price and got it for $100 more than I mentioned. I never expected the dealership to go that low. Disclosure: new Subaru dealer in a county next to where we lived. They wanted their car sold and in our county. I can almost guarantee the dealer was listening in !
I think the same thing happens with pawnstars. They do an interview with the seller and ask what they want for the item. Then the interviewers tell the bald guy. The bald guy already knows what the lowest price is. Or the bald guy gets a price out of the seller and "calls the expert". It is obvious , prior to the expert going on camera, the bald guy tells the expert to appraise the item lower than the asking price.
senseofstile nope. Pawnstars ain’t real. Those deals are staged ...
Negotiate only on the out-the-door price.
I did this last year when I bought my car and my wife just did it too when she bought her new car.
I helped prepare a friend to buy a car. Sent her these videos as well as others. Taught her all the tricks they use. I even picked out a car for her (2018 Camry). I did my homework and based on trim and mileage, taxes and fees, came up with a very reasonable out the door price. She was putting $4500 down. I spent HOURS preparing her. The car was listed at $22k. Her out the door offer was supposed to be $21,700, which I KNEW they would accept if she stuck to it. I said the loan should be 48 months with a payment of ~$450/month. I told her If that’s not what she saw on the paperwork, she was getting screwed. Well guess what? 72 month loan and her out-the-door price of a $22k car was....... $26,800. They managed to add $4800 to the price of the car before she got outta there! And 4.9% interest. She said she had no idea people could bully her like that. She said they just kept saying “sign here. And here” and when she tried to question them they got upset at her. She said she’d never been so intimidated. And now she’s paying for it. They essentially stole her down payment. So even if you’re prepared with information, you BETTER be prepared for them to try and bully you.
Absolutely top quality info. (I have to admit I feel I'm unfairly watching these, but I'm 65+ and total income monthly is around $1k, else I'd be a patreon, own the tshirt, buy the book, and continue to imagine myself in a new, fully paid vehicle. My 2007 Corolla is the vehicle I'm thankful for.)
Another way to test it is to ask and then demand that they put their answer in the contract.
For example, "Is this Aged Inventory Fee legally required?"
"Okay. Then I'd like the contract to say legally required aged inventory fee."
They won't do it. They know that it becomes fraud if they intentionally lie in the contract and the contract becomes voidable. Anything that you aren't sure you trust them on should go in the contract. Even if they do put it in there, it gives you a lot more time to research it for yourself.
Great Video Kevin. You are highly focused and share the crooked car dealers who pad every car deal after a negotiated price........ Im pretty savvy and always share the dealer holdback fee the dealer earns after the sheister salesman complains hes not making much money off of me. To bad ask your freaking boss for a raise.....
Things like this make me thankful to live in Missouri. Our dealers cannot collect any licence or tax fees, except for the temp tag fee, at the dealership. Taxes are paid at the licence office. Everything paid at the dealership is taxable. All I ever negotiate is the out the door price. The finance office never sells me extras. I know how much the total will be before I walk in to the finance office.
Brilliant! It’s about time all states we’re forced to do the same!
In Florida legitimate state fees are: “Lead Acid Battery Fee” $1.50, “New Tire Fee” $1 per tire, “Title Transfer Fee” $74 (if you transferred your plate from a Florida trade), “New Vehicle Registration Fee” $195.00 (if you had no trade or you are trading an out-of-state vehicle) , “State Sales Tax” 6% + 1% local option tax which is capped at $50, (tax is calculated on trade difference not vehicle purchase price). Most all dealers in the state charge a “Predelivery” or”Dealer Charge” or “Dealer Fee” of $800-$1,000 and will try and sneak in an “Electronic Filing Fee” of $195. I’m seeing a lot of dealers have vehicles marked up with a “Market Adjustment” calculated around 10% or around $4,000 to $5,000 depending on MSRP. Then of course most vehicles on a lot have the paint protection, nitrogen et al which adds another $750-$1,500. Knowing all that, a persistent buyer can still get a vehicle without all the markups. A lot of times its just easier to take a trip to the midwest where you can get a much better deal and save thousands and thousands and just pay the legitimate fees directly to the state when you come back.
According to this site=www.autolist.com/guides/dealer-fees-florida the lead-acid battery fee and tire fee is for environmental cleanup and to help car buys that got junk cars. So Florida has thought about it and it's illegal to lie about fees that are fake you have to put them in the fine print and not to include them in the advertised price.
It's just enforcing is hard so if you see a dealership break these laws walk and say you're reporting them... How can the midwest beat that?
I love calling them out on their tactics. The stall, four square thing, one thing I have had trouble with was the fees. I usually set an out the door price that I am comfortable paying with and have financing from my bank before I go in. Last dealership wanted to hold on to my driver's license while he went to talk to his manager. I told him I didn't have time for a stall and he wasn't going anywhere with my license.
Good to know. I'm going to Photo-Copy my License before I go in. The Salesman will probably shit MY pants.
Four square is the biggest scam in the process.
The non-profit car dealership extension of the trade school I manage charges a Doc fee of $25.00 and thats it.
Kevin I have some ideas about how to deal with these kinds of things that you may like. It is true the law of supply and demand controls the selling price of a car, But if we have a slow selling market and a motivated dealer, think about deducting the following from the final price at an end of the month buy. Here are some extra "allowances" I seek.
First, let's not forget a new vendor allowance if you never bought from this dealer before . This is easily worth the total amount of the doc fee. If this does not get their attention try the vendor preference allowance as you can buy from another dealer. Don't forget your slotting allowance as you are setting up a new vendor for financing. Time is money (ask a dealer!) so remember you have costs in writing and mailing or making a bank transfer for the monthly car payment. Your time is involved writing and mailing a check with postage. if you are financing 60 months. explain to the dealer that at $10.00 per check that is worth $600.00. He should agree its only fair if he charges a doc fee. Don't forget your ADR waiver fee . This should be at least $2,000.00 . Read the back of the contract. You are probably giving up important rights going to Alternate Dispute Resolution rather going to court. It is also a very useful tool to get up and walk out of the dealership If more people knew exactly what they were giving up (depending on the state) more people would think long and hard before signing a a car dealer's contract.
Good video. About 4 years ago. I bought a used 2002 Buick. The sales rep tried to charge me a fee for getting my tags. I said never mind that. I will pay my own tax tags fee at Motor Vehicle Dept when I pick up my own tags. So I wrote him a check for the car and he did get me $75.00 for handling fees. I should have bucked on that. But I didn't. A week later I went to the MVA and bought my own tags and paid the taxes and title fees. Thanks for sharing your video.
Thank you for your videos. I just bought a car after watching your videos and used everything you taught me. I went to two dealerships and the experiences were very different. First one tried to trick me into buying a car that day. The second salesman took his time, no pressure, and let me leave to think about it. Then when I decided to buy, they gave me an “out the door” price with taxes and the (admittedly high “processing fee” clearly stated, and focused on the total price, and even negotiated down a bit. They also never once said “how much do you want to pay per month” like the first place. And I navigated the finance guy deftly. Thank you.
Went to the dealer on Tuesday 5/26. Was looking at an X5 for $15,800. I went through USAA to see the price and it was listed for $14.100. The dealer added $165 dollar for 3 free oil changes, $495 for theft protection and a $300 doc fee. I told them to remove all the add ons and drop the doc fee to $75 and we had a deal at $14100. they said they couldn't so I got up and walked out with my wife who really wanted the car. By the time we got outside they said they would drop the price another $300 off the price to cover the doc fee, for a total price $13800. All said with everything totaled up the price was $15366.69 and we put $2000 down. Should have it paid off well before the end of the year. We also had them fix the crack in the windshield which was at the base and a check engine light before agreeing. Still waiting on them to call us as it had to go to a certified BMW repair shop to be looked at. The dealer might end up paying another $500-$3000 dollars depending on what is wrong. I will keep you posted if you want to know more.
USMC2003 Sounds like it went great. Any updates?
They're charging you $165 for three FREE oil changes? Wow, that's slimy.
I just found your channel this past weekend and have watched about 5 videos. They're friggin awesome. I thought I was a savvy car shopper, but am currently making excuses to not check the details of my new car purchase 3 years ago.
Non car-buying, but car maintenance fees, piss me off: "Shop fee" added at an oil change for what? The damn rag they used to wipe oil off their hands? Why don't these fools simply add the cost to the oil change price? Rhetorical question, we know why. It's simply the same car pricing gambit on a smaller scale: keep the advertised price down.
I was looking to see if anyone else had already posted this. Places like Pep Boys add on a 10% misc. shop fee. I'll never go to any place that plays that game.
Yes, that one pisses me off too! Wiping his hands on a rag that’s been used for weeks if not months. The government should step in and regulate everything about them. I won’t go there as they’re as corrupt!
My son was going to buy a used car and sent me the purchase information sheet and just like you said, there were fees that sounded legitimate, but weren't. Sent him the link to your videos. Thanks Kevin.
Excellent topic!!! I'm in the market of buying a car and this helps me a lot. I went to the car dealership and they asked me right away "HOW ARE YOU GOING TO PAY THE VEHICLE ? AND HOW MUCH DOWN PAYMENT ARE YOU PLANNING TO PUT DOWN? I WAS SO IRRITATED AND TOLD THEM THAT I HAVE NOT SEEN THE VEHICLE YET. THEN NEXT THE SALES PERSON ASKED ME AGAIN " I NEED TO KNOW IF YOU ARE PAYING CASH OR FINANCE SO I CAN LOOK FOR A CAR THAT WILL FIT YOUR BUDGET. THE SALESPERSON WAS IN A RUSH AND THEN I LEFT. Thank you VERY MUCH FOR THIS VIDEO. GOD BLESS YOU KEVIN H
My daughter went to buy her first car. She was 20 but looked maybe 16. Short blonde girl. List used car at about $2800. She paid absolutely no extra fees just tax. He made the mistake of telling her that he was leaving on vacation that afternoon so had to be that day or two weeks later. She used that in negotiations that he would need to worry about it and have money for vacation. She had talked him down quite a bit already. Her final ploy was after he waived all other fees and gave her a price after taxes. He said, have a deal? She responds no, make it an even 2550. She told him she didn't want to write more numbers on the check. He gave into it. All this time, I am sitting on a couch nearby talking with the dealer's friend and listening to her conversation. I didn't see any reason to step in unless to help the dealer. Almost felt sorry for him.
Side note. She deals quite a bit with the local Muslim and Mexican community and has learned to negotiate from them . Not bad for a young girl and first time car buyer. She had already walked away from several cars that day to include a dodge charger that she liked at that dealer.
I like the comparison to taxed vs. non-tax fees. Makes it easy.
The best thing about about all of your videos is that I’m now confident and know about the whole car sales process. As soon as the shelter in place lifts, I’m ready to head to the dealer and rip them a new a** hole. Knowledge is power! Thank you.
Sam Walton himself said outright that the big items, the end caps, the stuff in the big aisles, was sold cheap. Sometimes at cost. But the majority if the stuff in the store? Like a $3 USB cable selling for $8.95? More than made up for it. THAT was the WalMart genius.
As always sir thank you. I'm also very happy to see you supporting ChrisFix and Scotty K. You guys are in a class of your own!
How exactly is he supporting Chris and Scotty? I'm curious because I actually don't know.
A used car salesman's worst nightmare. Love it!
I HAVE SHARED YOUR VIDEOS TO OVER 200 PEOPLE AT WORK! THEY ARE SHARING AT THEIR WORK PLACES.
I’ve learned so much from this guy!
Thank you so much for the brutal truth and honesty calling out the dealers. At the end of the day the fees all boils down to profit, about time they take responsibility for the crap they pull every day!!
Stick it to them kevin! Information empowers the buyer and puts the dealership in their rightful place! Keep up the good work brother.
The last used car I bought, I shopped online for several weeks, comparing cars & trade-in values. When I finally settled on the make & model, I cranked up the search, looking at cars onine at dealer lots & private parties. Along the way I encountered about a half dozen scams on the PP side of things, mostly to do with non-existant cars that looked too perfect, the price was too good, and all these "sellers" were just about to ship out overseas & would ship the car to me at no additional charge (because the government gave this to them as a perk of service), & I'd have a generous amout of time to cancel the deal at a full refund. Way too good to be true and all scams, of course.
After wading through all the fertilizer mentioned above, I finally located several cars at dealers. I made an appointment to see one I particularly liked & arrived on time for the test drive. I was fully prepared to go see another car afterward. The drive went great & I sat down with the saleman to talk turkey. I had done all my homework & made what I considered to be a fair offer, which of course allowed for the dealer to make a profit. He gets up to "check with the sales manager," & lets me sit for a few minutes. He came back, sat down, & began to explain how they just couldn't go that low. I extended my hand as I rose & said, in an ever so calm & friendly tone, "Thanks so much for your time. It was nice meeting you.," and I turned to go. The look of shock on his face was quite unexpected on my part & it was priceless. I really WAS expecting to go & look at the next car. Bottom line, I got my deal, out the door, for my offer.
It helps to remember that there are far more cars than buyers. I don't mind walking away from a car that I love if I can't live with the deal. (By the way, I still have that car, I still love it & I'm keeping it for another 10 years if I can.)
I'm again looking for a second used car, & I'm so grateful to learn about all these fake fees. Thank you so very much for the education.
I was going to buy a new truck cash and was looking forward to using things I learned from you but Im starting to have second thoughts about giving up 30k on a truck.
What a great public service he provides. As an X car sales guy, the reason why I left the business is for so many scams car dealer sell... thanks for the videos kevin
Doc fee in California is $85. Never paid more.
If that 'fee' is taxable, then it's negotiable, since it's just an arbitrary profit item.
I did the same thing for my '88 Toyota Pickup and my '02 Highlander. Both times the salesman looked he had lost his best friend, but I got the price I wanted. The last thing the dealer wants to see is you walking out the door without the keys in your hand.
I was a sales at Toyota dealership. They told me all my car sales were "minis" which would be $100 per transaction. And NO I did not get that $100 because the hourly wage rate would be higher than $100 per day. Now I know they cheated on their employees..
Years ago I was trading in my 2002 dodge quad and cab back to the dealer I bought it from for a used 2000 jeep wrangler. We kept fighting over trade in value and sale price of the jeep. Well, the sales manager told me that since it was summer the jeep was worth more and my truck was worth less because "nobody" buys pick ups in summer. So I told him I'd be back in the fall and I expected the price of the jeep to be a lot less and my trade in value on my truck to be a lot higher, since well, jeeps certainly dont sell well in winter but 4x4 trucks would. He got pissed and told me in didn't work that way. I said no? I'm just applying your sales demand theory to the sale. I thought he was going to take a swing at me! HAHAHAHA
Do they charge higher fees for certain people-women, seniors, minorities, first-time buyers.
Kevin, what do you think about those "delivery only" dealerships like Vroom or Carvana. Also what about the "fixed price" dealerships?
Yes #TheHomeworkGuy - I would be very curious to hear your take on these companies, since they do "seem" to offer a better experience and better prices on vehicles than going to a brick and mortar dealership...
Quentin Gerlach. I read reviews on both Vroom and Carvana and they are enough to make me walk away very fast. And I am not talking about a few reviews, but hundreds. They score very very low. Many horror stories. I quickly said no to this option.
These places are predatory. They prey on silly people who are afraid of confrontation. They tout "No hassle". OF COURSE IT'S NO HASSLE! You just end up paying thousands more for your car than you should have.
I agree just tell me the price no more games.
Just found your channel thank you single mom not wanting to get ripped off
Heh, my mom used to do tags/title work at a somewhat less-shady car dealership, and she'd tell me some of the crazy extra prices on things that a customer was buying that weren't needed like this. The ' fee' was always up in there. Hers in particular didn't work so much on car sales, so much as they did in parts and service. Tons and tons of extra charges for things that actually weren't done or needed.
Mark Miller Subaru in Salt Lake posts "Factory Price", then a "discount" off that price, which is their "fixed price". I asked the sales rep to take $500 off that price. He agreed without hesitation. I have learned to study the sale "price estimate" sheet provided by the dealer, and then I ask for a pen and proceed to cross out fake dealer fees. I simply say "I'm not going to pay that fee". I then calculate the adjusted price and say "'That's what I will pay for this car". If they say they can't waive a fee, I say "That's a shame. I'm surprised you choose to lose this sale over fees you don't need to include. I know you receive a rebate from the manufacturer on this car, and also other credits not shown on this price estimate sheet either now or at the end of the model year, so you will make a decent profit without charging these fees. Give me a call if and when you can agree to my bottom-line price. I need to visit another dealership. Have a good day".
Spot on and absolutely right, good job Kevin, keep them on their toes for sure #thehomeworkguy
My next car deal is looming.. need a new car and its a great time to buy.. I am taking your tool kit with me
So the main point is to split up costs into different fees to make the individual fees look smaller and to reduce the initial car price displayed in the showroom.
Add up multiple fees, so that the customer doesn't know how much each fee is.
Third most important is using tax like yet another fee that has been subtracted from the initial car price, so the car price in the showroom is basically excl. Tax.
Tool rental companies are another type of store that adds ridiculous fees to the price.
I think the whole dealership game has become to advertise the lowest sale price. Unfortunately the dealers have repeatedly one upped themselves by undercutting each other that the advertised sale prices in a lot of cases just aren’t profitable so hence they started making up fees and including high margin options like etching and pin striping and fabric protection on every car to maintain profitability. If everyone would just go back to an msrp based system and then offering those things to people who actually wanted them it would be fairer and they wouldn’t be needed. A lot of the super low price ad cars have negative profit without the add ons.
Watching every video of you!! Very informative! The world needs more honest people like you!
I’m still lost on why cars aren’t sold the same way as other products?? You don’t walk into a CVS and ‘negotiate’ a fee on detergent or toothpaste... if there’s a sale, then the price indicated is the sale price. A car should go for X, plus whatever government tax and DMV fee there is, then that’s it.
It's literally just how it's always been, and there's an absurd amount of market protection for dealerships that allows them to not have to compete with anyone besides other dealerships who use the same scummy tactics.
Because consumers have allowed it and many think they can out play a skilled salesman. The problem is consumers spend more money on vehicles than they can afford and don't even realize it. If you were to buy four new vehicles in a lifetime and make payments, you could have purchased a home in full. The difference, you have four depreciating assets and one appreciating asset.
Lobbyists and weak-minded legislatures.
What is a reasonable margin for a dealership to charge? Like 20 Percent? It's kind of an expensive business to be in.
Hey Kevin, I have learned so much from you being that I am looking for a car right now. I used that one Ace up the sleeve with the full cash payment at the end with one dealership. I was looking into buying a Hyundai Genesis coupe and they kept on trying to talk about financing options and I said exactly what you said," I am not talking about finances until we finalize the out the door price of the car." When we finalized the price of the car and I told them then I was paying in cash they could not deal with it. So I laughed at them and took my money elsewhere. Keep up the good content I got my bag of popcorn. By the way Elizabeth is a freaking level 100 boss.
$500 for watching this video ok.
*throws wallet at screen*
Kevin, as always another great video on how to buy a vehicle without getting ripped off.
LOL - I got this classic statement today regarding the dealer's $500 DOC fees -- "Oh, we can't waive it! That pays the girls in the back office." I almost started to laugh. I've tried to negotiate several deals over the last couple weeks. It seems like no one is willing to negotiate. This is our price - take it or leave it, and we won't waive our doc fees or add-ons.
#HomeworkGuy Kevin you are fricking awesome. (pardon the French). I never knew any of this info. I'm definitely going to look closer at my contract. I'm saving this video for future references. I'm sure glad there is honest people like you that brings out these crooked car dealer ship. I just wished I would of found you several years ago when I got majorly screwed by a dealership. Thank you for your tips.
I hated going to the dealer because they ripped you off. But thanks to the #ThehomeworkGuy i am actually feel i am more prepared and taking some time to researching and find the deal that works for me. God bless you Sir like 20% down payment and paying for the fees upfront and not finance them. This basic things have made me rethink everything on buying a car. Thank you once again.
All I can say is thanks Kevin for these examples I caught almost everyone of them so I know better before I buy my truck. Now it makes me want to see what my parents really paid for their vehicles to spot the hidden charges to so them money next time they need a vehicle.
There was no link below to send you the $500 for watching the video. Please update. Thanks.
I saw the link. Now send your $500 TIP ... LOL!!!
I'm hoping your comment is intended to be humorous... and my comment on the video was also intended to be funny. If someone actually DID send me a $500 tip resulting from my "Fake Fee" payment joke, I'd return it. Paypal allows me to decline any payment at any time for any reason.
@@KevinHunter of course I was kidding. Love your work and your videos.
Fantastic video, my friend! Thanks for continuing to educate people on the frivolous charges the stealerships are charging!
Hey Kevin, love THIS and all your videos. I'm doing a Virtual Shopping right now during our NJ COVID shutdown (while demand is low and we get to pick our exact make, model and color). I have 3 proposals and will lease from 1 of these 3 dealerships. Will be contacting them for questions on WTF are these fees and other issues (1 of the 3 have no fees). I'll follow up when we agree on a contract. Thanks again.
I like the design of several shirts, however I would never ever buy a shirt with the RUclips logo on it... I'm not 10 years old anymore. Would appreciate e.g. the shirt at 00:40 without the RUclips logo
I was looking at cars today and one dealership had a claim to an easy no haggle price which just happened to be $2000 over blue book.
Ha ha ha. "No Haggle" only means that they'll screw you over and you'll take without fighting back.
Kevin, I would love to see a hidden camera of you walking into the dealership and negotiating with a salesman. Watching him bring you a contract full of bogus fees and then watching his face as you tell him who you are.
I second that motion
@@kgooch69 I oppose. The current format is fine. Don't go fixing it.
I wish I'd found your channel before I bought my car on Dec 1st, 2019. I thought I was being savvy waiting until December, and I DID get a lot of rebates and 0% financing plus did NOT accept any extended warranty or gap coverage (In fact, I had to tell the finance officer I was going to leave after he would not take, "No" for an answer about extended warranty) ...but I'm sure I paid all these fees.
When I was buying my car 2 years ago, the finance officer wouldn't take no for an answer for the GAP coverage he was trying to sell me. I said my stocks was my insurance. I'll sell my stocks if I have to, to pay off the loan ... LOL, I didn't have any stocks.
When I bought my 2012 Sierra (new) it was quite a battle when I refused to buy the extended warranty. 8 years later I’m so glad I didn’t, but like you, I’m sure I got ripped on all those BS fees and I never had a clue.
The last time i bought a car they wanted to sell me an extended warranty. I told them my car insurance company beat their price by a signicant amount using OEM parts and I wasnt interested. They offer to drop the price by half. Told them it was still higher than my car insurance and I wasnt interested.
Great and to the point info. It is greatly appreciated.
Clear. Concise, Professional. Subscribed!!
I came up with a method for leasing, I offer $2,000 for license, and all fees and the rest goes to pay down the lease, and then compare 36 month 12,000 miles lease payments, dealer to dealer. My out of pocket is the same, I don't care about what "fees" are tacked on.
I've watched quite a few of your videos, Kevin, and I learn SO much with each one. Two questions I still have: (1) Are fixed-price/no haggle car sellers, like CarMax, Carvana and Vroom, showing their "sticker price" or their final out-the-door price? (2) I understand why I shouldn't tell regular dealers up front that I'm paying cash, but it doesn't matter if I tell one of those fixed-price dealers, right? I've tried to find answers on their websites, but none of them mentions fees or all-cash sales. Obviously, they hope to make most of their profit from financing, like regular dealers.
I will be test-driving used Camrys next week, and if the salesperson pressures me to buy one right away I'm going to say I'll be comparing prices of the same make, model, features, age, and similar mileage with other dealers first. If I find a better deal I'll give the salesperson an opportunity to match it. I know they'll say no two "similar" cars can be exactly the same, but they're close enough for me.
Thanks, Bill
Kevin is a hero
You're the man Kevin! Well done sir.
Thanks for exposing these car dealer con merchants
The same things apply to new cars. Don't ever pay a dealer prep fee on a new car. The dealer gets paid by the manufacturer to prepare the car for sale once it gets off the truck.
I like the excuse " I wouldn't sell that car to my mother for that price." haha
Excellent. Wanted to ask you to view car contracts and explain them...Many thanks :)
My issue when I bought my first car was my credit union more so than the dealer. I got financing through my credit union because that’s what I had read was the smart move. However I didn’t expect them to be just as shady as a dealer finance office so my guard was down completely. The car I was looking at came in just under $12k, I had $2k to put down in cash. My credit union required that I give them the $2k as a down payment but then sold me on needing essentially $2,200 in extended warranty and gap insurance (which I haven’t used once in 4 years). I put all my focus and energy into preparing to be screwed at the dealer, when in fact it was at my own credit union. I guess I’ll know for next time, but damn does that leave a sour taste.
Yes I've been there! Thanks for sharing!
I wish I could hire Kevin when I’m ready for a new car! When I look at new cars, I start off by asking price of vehicle, I can do math just give me the price your asking. Before I know it the salesman is talking to me about something other than the car, I get exhausted and leave.
Call the dealer before you go and ask what their Doc Fee is. If it's $300, I just take $300 off what I was willing to pay so when they add it on, I'm at what I wanted to pay.
There you go. Let them play their "Doc game." Take it off the price of the car. It's an easy remedy, and it works!
Thank u so much for sharing ur tips n knowledge sir much appreciated, it's very frustrating n scary knowing that u might be overcharging when u go buy cars
Bought a CPO Honda in Ohio a couple weeks ago. Tried to get them to wave doc fee- they said they cannot. They would be open to discrimination lawsuits. I said BS. Some research online says the same thing! I said so is it discrimination if I get a car for a better deal than the next customer? Sales manager didn’t know what to say. Needless to say got $200 off price of vehicle. @kevinhunter
Illinois ALLOWS dealers to charge a doc fee ($300 in 2020) but DOES NOT REQUIRE a doc fee be paid. (815 ILCS 375/11.1) (from Ch. 121 1/2, par. 571.1) " Every retail installment contract under this Act shall contain or be accompanied by a notice containing the following information:
"DOCUMENTARY FEE. A DOCUMENTARY FEE IS NOT AN OFFICIAL FEE. A DOCUMENTARY FEE IS NOT REQUIRED BY LAW....".
#thehomeworkguy a big thank you for this video and all your other videos. I don't plan to ever be ripped off again after watching your informative videos. I feel more confident for my next car purchase. I will definitely share with family and friends!
I should have gotten gap insurance outside of the dealer, they stuck it to me.
You have the right to cancel it. You may even get a refund for the amount you have paid so far. Go back to the dealership and talk to them. Stand you ground. Good luck 👍
Return the GAP insurance to your dealer and get the insurance on your own but different company from your regular car insurance.
I’m in Kentucky and planning on buying a USED SUV in the up coming months. Anyway, in researching, I found two dealers that had a car listed on Craigslist, at the bottom of the AD, they listed some of their FEES. A Compliance and Emission fee ?? I can NOT find anything online in Kentucky about these fees. We do NOT have yearly inspections or testing on vehicles here.
Some good advice Kevin,you have to look at a contract real good before you agree on it,
I live in England and there are virtually no fees. I found it unbelievable that you have so many add-ons. I paid a registration fee of £55. If I wanted any extras like mud flaps or special floor mats that was all and the cost was minimal compared to the extortionate fees you talk about. Who pays $200 for air! Like your channel by the way.
The taxes - Is that state taxes or sales tax? Where can we find information so that we can calculate the taxes?
Superb! I am looking to trade for a new car soon. These videos are so information, props to you! If I have any issues or questions, i will be sure to email you. NY has some of the shadiest dealers in the land! You are a steely eyed missle man!
This is good info, doing my homework now on a 2020 GMC 2500 HD Sierra. Going to be a cash deal with No Trade In
Hi Kevin. Huge fan here.
Here in Canada, Quebec we have regulations in place so all this bullshit doesnt apply this much but I really enjoy your videos.
Keep up the good work 👍
What should I negotiate a 2020 4Runner SR5