Basicly parental figures usually died in the Marvel Universe unless they hate/fear their kids and never want to see them. think about it these are teenagers who have to save the world and fight super villains. who many xmen would really turn on the team when magneto was like Look I'll do my best to keep you parents breathing inferior beings that they are but sabertooth is bored alot... so you best give me what I want...
She doesn't actually *die die* she's the Phoenix. She "rises from the ashes." She is essentially immortal, but just her soul. Not so much her physical body though.
So, here's the thing. I'm feeling kind of under the weather, which is partially why most of this is voice over. But really, the main reason why is because my parents were in town, and I didn't have time to write out a full script. So most of this is just off the cuff. We'll get back to scripted stuff next week. Also, here's the newsletter link. We've got some great stuff in store! www.nerdsyncnews.com/ Thanks! Love you!
Lol! I don't think that it matters anymore. I love the character of Jean Grey, but the fact that your video seems to exemplify is that she's not a mortal woman anymore, and likely hasn't been since her first death* back in 1976. When she bonded with the Phoenix Force , it was indeed "now and forever." Others may wield the power of the Phoenix from time to time. Rachel Grey, the Phoenix Five, Hope Summers, but they've all remained mortal and the power eventually moved on. But Jean has remained the constant. She IS the Phoenix, a cosmic being in a mortal shell. The shell might be destroyed -- repeatedly -- but Jean is now a being of "fire and life incarnate." The White Phoenix of the Crown. What makes Jean interesting is her struggle to hold onto her humanity despite what she's become.
The only wolverine explanation for his healing factor is that his cells are actually really small fusion reactors used to make energy and matter of different types by combining the right atoms to get the right elements and these things are probably powered by microscopic inter dimensional wolverines in hamster wheels inside his cells.
This was awesome. One I distinctly remember was a "What If" comic celebrating Scott and Jeans wedding in 1994. It explored what could have happened if Jean *1.* Married Scott earlier (per Phoenix) *2.* Fell for Angel during the early days *3.* Fell for Wolverine as Pheonix. Simplified, (1) All Second Gen X-Men, including Charles, due on Krackoa, (2) without Jean to soften/round him out, Scott gets too militant, Charles makes Beast leader, and Cyclops defects to Magneto's Brotherhood where Scarlet Witch starts something with him, (3) without Scott's strong compassion and guidance, Pheonix Jean is influenced by Wolvie's wildness, goes Dark Phoenix, loses it, wipes out the Shi'are empire at the games, sets the Force free, and 12 galaxies die in her wake. So yeah.... that counts as a death too, I think 😆
The original Phoenix was not just a "copy". It duplicated Jean's body and "borrowed" a piece of her soul. After phoenix died it tried to return to Jean but unconsiously rejeacted it. Enter Madelyn Pryor.
Sceptile Tube Imagine that the multiverse is a body and each reality is a cell. They were a multiversal disease, devouring cosmic beigns and hollowing-out entire universes. they werent your average shambling corpse either, these arent science-based monsters. They were cursed. They could think, feel, talk, even strategise. if you cut their head or blow their brains, they jsut keep coming.
I swear I recall the pheonix once bringing Jean back to life when she was really young in some flashback. something about it always having an interest in her, so when she was (from what i vaugly remember) hit by a car, pheonix was like "hell nah" and tapped into life itself or something to being her back. no idea where this is from, but i swear it happened somewhere
Jean had an early friend, that died by getting run over by a car. She were there and held her friend's dying body, while her telepathic abilities awoke, feeling her friend's mind dying. In one retcon, Jean herself started to die from that while trying to do something about it, attracting the attention of the Phoenix. I have no idea from which issue that retcon is, though. And the Phoenix is, despite what happened with the "Dark Phoenix", a being of Life itself.
LOL Great subject! Yeah, it's like Jean is always dead. That's what kind of angers me with Marvel; they seem to ALWAYS get rid of their characters with telepathy. Why is it so hard to keep Jean and Prof. X around? It's as if they don't have permission to be heroes. The solution is to always kill them. Is there absolutely no way for their enemies to counter and resist these types of mutants? Haven't the X-Men encountered villains that were able to resist mutants with telepathic abilities? (i.e. Magneto, Proteus, Shadow King, Master Mold, Emma Frost, Juggernaut, and Onslaught)? Why can't Jean Grey exist with just having telepathy and telekinesis without the Phoenix force? My favorite version of Phoenix was from the 90s cartoons. It made so much sense to create Phoenix as this alien that takes control of Jean. The recent interpretations of Jean and Phoenix have been confusing. People don't know exactly what's going on, and I don't blame them. I don't like the whole Phoenix expressing itself as a latent mental illness; I find it more interesting to see Phoenix as a separate being who's trying to control Jean. >I know this would never happen, but I would love to see Prof. X, Jean, Emma Frost, and Psylocke working together. Show that tension between Jean and Emma. They can also help Psylocke to develop her telepathic abilities. Psylocke can also teach them some of her ninja moves LOL For me, it gets so boring to see the same stories and characters play out as they always do. We know what's going to happen. Each mutant will act out in the same predictable ways.
i guess they'd be 2 different multiverses, in a larger reality......*Cough* Infiniverse theory *COUGHS VIOLENTLY FOR REAL AND SPITS OUT BLOOD* .....uhhh
everything isn't in the multiverse while I think it is in the omniverse. It was established there are things outside the multiverse like wildspace where the Beyonders are from. Omniverse (can be plural multiverses) > multiverse > universes
Just a guess, but it seems like it can only inhabit certain forms of great power - she is one of the primary focal points, so it's kind of like a compass. It normally points North, but may also direct to other lesser magnetic forces if they're close enough, kind of like when we had the Phoenix Five (and even that took an outside force to trigger)
“All I ever did was die on you” is an amazing line that is neutered by the fact that Scott is such a pathetic man in that late 90s and early 2000s version of the character.
But if I am already subscribed, does that mean hitting the subscribe button unsubscribes me or just gives me an extra subscription? How many times have i subscribed? are any of my subscriptions actually real or are they just retconns? Should i try to figure out how many times i have subscribed? do i count only subscriptions in this universe? If i was cloned and my cloned also subscribed do those subscriptions count?
im so happy that this was made! Right now Im reading through All New XMen with only a general knowledge of Jean Grey. Now Im more prepared, thanks Scott!
And I love how Hugh Jackman has handled her passing in the movies. He's brought so much humanity to a one-dimensional character. Just that reaction to the sight of her at the end of DOFP.... And that's after every other epic thing that's happened.
Yo man this channel is awesome. You should be teaching a class on comics. You have a talent for explaining everything. Or maybe just a teacher at a school.
Scott!!! I'm considering becoming a Nerdsync patron on Patreon, and the perk with the Google hangout seems really cool. But!! I live in Australia and time zones are a thing so I'd want to be sure I wouldn't have to wake up at 3am for a Google hangout. What time of day do these usually happen and what Timezone are you in?
Do you also do Transformers related? Could you do history of the "Beast Wars"? Aw yeah would be awesome. Or even better, do a whole Transformers series.
I always loved that in John Byrne's run of Fantastic Four, Reed Richards was analyzing Jean Grey after being found in the cocoon and discovered that the cosmic rays that transformed the Fantastic Four were in fact part of the Phoenix force reaching out to Jean Grey and interacting with our atmosphere. Really changes the vague "cosmic rays" part of the origin. Also it is interesting to note that in AvX there were the "Phoenix 5". Could there have always been 5 wielders of the Phoenix force on Earth with Jean Grey and the FF?? As John Byrne is one of the co creators of the Phoenix force... maybe...?
Hey Scott. Long time, first time. I don't know if you take requests for ideas but I was wondering if you could do an episode on the psychology behind nerd culture. More specifically why people in the nerd/geek/comic book community feel attacked, insulted or angry when people who aren't really nerds act like they are. I know this doesn't apply for all of us in the community, but I do notice some people who act this way. Maybe you don't do requests but I just thought I'd put it out there
I do have to wonder why Jean didn't just implant Corbeau's piloting skills into Wolverine (who in all likelihood already had said skills, or was retconned to have them, anyway) or Colossus, both of which were present and likely could have survived the reentry. Also, 5:35 doesn't that apply to most of the X-Men anyway? Dying is like a rite of passage for them.
Hi Scott. I've got a question for you: I have recently watched the killing joke animated movie and there's a particular scene in it where Batman looks at his computer at some pictures of the joker. One of them has him and Harley Quinn, but technically, she wasn't around when the killing joke took place (because she wasn't created yet, right?). So how does this work in comics? Does this mean that now Harley was part of the DC universe when the killing joke took place? I'm a little confused
The animated Killing Joke took place in the BAS (Batman the Animated Series) so they just retcon this in order for it to take place after the show commenced.
Jean's black dress reminds me a lot of Tatsumaki's and Fubuki's from One Punch-man. One and Murata probably got inspiration from Jean considering they have similar powers.
My rule for superhero deaths is in order for it to count it has to last more than two issues. it can't be like, that time when superman faked his death by having Martian Manhunter pose as his ghost, or like with EVERY superhero of all time where an issue ends showing their "death" cliffhanger, only for it to be a ruse. I bend the rule for Jean Grey because it's more fun that way.
The main character in one of my screenplays has a habit for dying again and again. Her death before the most recent one was the one I assumed would be the last, but the direction the story took made it so that I ended up killing her off for the 6th time. I'm really hoping 6 is the last, but she does get resurrected in a different way almost every time.
You forgot: - fake death from X-Men #113 - Jean Grey temporarily merging with her Phoenix clone dying on the moon in X-Men Forever #3 - self sacrifice in New X-Men #155. I know this is technically alternate future, but it affected 616 timeline directly.
Wolverine could _slow_ his starvation by eating his own flesh. But he would eventually notice that his healing factor would start slowing down as he starved.
*1. That was confusing as hell. However I would like to posit that Ms Grey is the personification of or the embodiment of an eternal elder force (the phoenix force) and for this purpose "Jean" could die and at this rate probably has. Here when I mean death I mean like Uncle Ben dead and ain't really ever coming back. Though Jean the eternal force will persist.* 2. Her original personhood could very well be gone and this "new Jean" is a copy produced by the Phoenix Force, which as its namesake implies, ensures the maintenance of a condition (in this case the persistence of a "Jean") in the 616 continuity - even against the prospect of the endless slumber.* 3. I posit thus this theory. The Phoenix Force manipulated original Jean's psychic abilities (as we have seen happen countless times) to transfer her consciousness into a new body. Here comes the philosophy. Do you belief she died by this theory? If one is a physicalist one must stand on the assumption that she has died and these "New Jeans" are simply akin to backups made of computer hard drives - copies and nothing more, but still as useful and meaningful as the original. Conversely if one is a dualist she, by this theory, has never died as one of her fundamental halves (her mind) is still extent in the world in either the original or copied format - she at the least is always existing in realised state the mind. For a physicalist the abstract mind is unreal and thoughts are a consequences of physical neurological structures which have died and been replaced by other material - what this and where it is from is a big idk.*4. However if we replace her all, body-wise, but the neurological functions (be they copies or original) are the same and this new form operates as the old has she ever died? Has her place not been filled by another her and thus her hole to fill is filled , "she" is not gone and thus not dead? If one believes in the abstract soul, maybe hers has moved on and we see these fake Jeans to be a (for lack of a less insulting term) soulless duplicate that universal order has put in for the sake of balance.*.5. I conclude that she, and all those other heroes, who die and get resurrected willy-nilly never do, nor can, really die. Cosmic order, be it Franklin, or the real life writers, see them as "fun, interesting, necessary or too pointless to ditch" and they remain. This is mirrored in real life, do the bad guys ever really go away, yes individual characters, Hitler/Stalin/ect, die but they in their essence do they ever really disappear or die? Maybe that's what we learn from this frivolous re-birthing of heroes is that their niches will always be filled up by some means and sometimes that means they have to return in their actuality.*
How about in the MYS-TECH which was in Marvel UK? Does that count? I think its also on earth 616. She shot herself in the head after Cyclops has fallen. And a number of Heroes died too. But in the end, Time travel came into play and all was good. :)
Ok, but can we talk about that time when Scott cheated on Jean, with Jean (while she was dead), and when the original came back, the new one became a supervillain?
You could make a listicle of "5 Comic-book Characters Who Died and Came Back (Before Superman Did)" that would be populated entirely by Jean Grey and Professor X over and over again.
As a big Jeannie/Phoenix fan, I'd say this list is pretty accurate! It's a shame people have misconceptions about Jean and the Phoenix Force, their story arc has really interesting philosophical concepts.
Based on the video, I think I'd only count time when Thanos killed a bunch of people to try and impress Death as the only time Jean Gray has died, all the others seem like either near deaths where we're expected to believe she's dead, or things that would kill normal people and therefore at least weaken her. As for Wolverine; there is no good scientific reason as to why that would work. In terms of energy conservation, he already needs an enormous amount of energy to maintain his healing factor so realistically he'd need to eat on average 10's if not 100's of times more calories than a normal person (I can't be bothered to calculate it as it would depend on how often he needs to regenerate). Eating himself would provide him with energy, but the most it could possibly provide him with is just enough to regenerate what he'd eaten (which is highly unlikely, most processes are
Mr Sunday Movies makes videos about how many times pepole have killed pepole, you make videos about how many pepole dies. I dont know but I just find that funny.
Question: What became of the element Tony Stark created in iron man 2? They said it would "change the world " but apart from a passing mention in The Avengers hasn't been spoken about since.
there are suppose to be like 27-30 but i only count 7: when her powers first appeared she was in the mind of annie/anne her childhood friend when she died, dies to become phoenix, die as dark phoenix, die while in goblin queen's mind when she dies, dies by sentinels (puts her mind in emma to survive), die to become phoenix a second time and die as phoenix by magneto all in the same issue. lets see what you put on this list....well if you counting thanos then you need to count secret wars lol. i dont count those (phoenix endsong) as jean as it was revealed that jean is in the white hot room and until she returns as the phoenix phoenix its just a reanimated body not the real jean
Personally I think the Dark Phoenix story has gotten very boring and extremely repetitive. It’s better to just come up with a completely new story about the Jean Grey character instead of trying to capture lightning in a bottle again and again and again. How many times can you retail the same dueling story arc?
Naah. She never dies. The only character that dies in marvel universe is uncle ben. The rest? Nope. I dont think so.
What about Gwen Stacey, Tony Stark's parents and magneto's parents?
+Annoying Nerd Dude I see you on like every nerdsync video, and I know it's you because of your booster gold pic!
troll face avatar 2016
Ben Reilly. Killed heroically any time he's brought back
Basicly parental figures usually died in the Marvel Universe unless they hate/fear their kids and never want to see them. think about it these are teenagers who have to save the world and fight super villains. who many xmen would really turn on the team when magneto was like Look I'll do my best to keep you parents breathing inferior beings that they are but sabertooth is bored alot... so you best give me what I want...
Maybe returning from the dead is Jean's secondary mutant ability.
Makes sense, given that wolverine has both his claws and the healing factor
Wolverine also has beastlike senses.
That's every one's superpower
^ true
Well pheonexes are supposed to be able to rise from the ashes sooooo
So Jean Grey is the xmen version of Kenny?
You killed Kenny!
Yes
Or Krillin
Its comics everyone is Kenny in some way
Nah Kenny's backstory about how he gets revived is more solid than Jean Grey.
Jean...death isn't a hobby.
I'm not entirely sure she grasps that just yet.
Is if you're deadpool
Hahaha
🤣
a cat has 9 lives. we have 1. but this girl has 25.
StafeeMC possibly more
Everyone: “So, how many times have you died?”
Jean Grey: “Yes.”
"Jean died then got better" the video
That's the TL;DR version
She doesn't actually *die die* she's the Phoenix. She "rises from the ashes." She is essentially immortal, but just her soul. Not so much her physical body though.
If she dies, she dies. Whether she stays dead is another matter altogether. She's died a handful of times.
So, here's the thing. I'm feeling kind of under the weather, which is partially why most of this is voice over. But really, the main reason why is because my parents were in town, and I didn't have time to write out a full script. So most of this is just off the cuff. We'll get back to scripted stuff next week. Also, here's the newsletter link. We've got some great stuff in store! www.nerdsyncnews.com/
Thanks! Love you!
Great vid as per usual Scott :)
Thanks!
+mrrandomlol100 agredd
I think you should do a podcast on superhero deaths and why they have no significance (and are stupid) psloveyourstuffkthnxbi
We kinda sorta did one a while back regarding the MCU, but not really the comics. Could warrant a revisit.
Lol! I don't think that it matters anymore. I love the character of Jean Grey, but the fact that your video seems to exemplify is that she's not a mortal woman anymore, and likely hasn't been since her first death* back in 1976. When she bonded with the Phoenix Force , it was indeed "now and forever." Others may wield the power of the Phoenix from time to time. Rachel Grey, the Phoenix Five, Hope Summers, but they've all remained mortal and the power eventually moved on. But Jean has remained the constant. She IS the Phoenix, a cosmic being in a mortal shell. The shell might be destroyed -- repeatedly -- but Jean is now a being of "fire and life incarnate." The White Phoenix of the Crown. What makes Jean interesting is her struggle to hold onto her humanity despite what she's become.
Fire and *Life* incarnate.
Oops! You are correct! Edited! Thanks!
RogueTwo - Best comment by far.
10/10
+FlylikeaBr1an agree
Amazing!
The only wolverine explanation for his healing factor is that his cells are actually really small fusion reactors used to make energy and matter of different types by combining the right atoms to get the right elements and these things are probably powered by microscopic inter dimensional wolverines in hamster wheels inside his cells.
lol seems legit
Makes more sence then the way Cyclops retconed power now work.
Lawrence Riederer
Cyclops: OH MY GOD, YOU KILLED JEAN!
Wolverine: YOU BUBS!
Oh, c'mon, Scott, she die every single month and you know it better than i...
Maybe Lady Death simply does not like Jean and does some tricks to get rid of her. :-D
She's a terrible house guest.
She loves having Deadpool over though.
what about MJ?
DAVID S oh i was replying to your last comment lol
Death said something along the lines of Jean being outside it's reach :D
Well if she's the Phoenix it makes sense that she can come back. True to her name
This comment is quite literally pointless. He mentions exactly what you say about a minute into the video
SeerSmashChannel yep and I was just backing his statement up.
Haskin Payne Alrighty then XD forgive me, I was probably in a crabby mood
Exactly!
She died more often than Sean Bean. Inconceivable!!
maybe we could get sean to play her in the next x-men movie?
You keep using that word...
+Frank Castle and just what word is that?
I don't think it means what he thinks it means.
Part of this thread is quoting the cult classic movie The Princess Bride, which has been described as "eminently quotable"
perhaps 50 shades of.....Grey? 😊
Nicely done!
***** wow ,you replied! thanks!😊
She's. A hot piece though.
+NerdSync do a video about Amalgam Comics
I see what you did there.. Lmao!
Jean might have a death fetish,the scene of wolverine repeatedly stabbing her is proof to me
I mean, she did literally ask for it...
Stop making SO MUCH SENSE! I swear I 'd do it cannon if I wear editor chief at Marvel.
head ass 😂
You missed that one time that she died when you just blinked right now. It's okay she's back again
Thanks! Can't believe I missed that one!
Hey no problem
This was awesome. One I distinctly remember was a "What If" comic celebrating Scott and Jeans wedding in 1994. It explored what could have happened if Jean
*1.* Married Scott earlier (per Phoenix)
*2.* Fell for Angel during the early days
*3.* Fell for Wolverine as Pheonix.
Simplified, (1) All Second Gen X-Men, including Charles, due on Krackoa, (2) without Jean to soften/round him out, Scott gets too militant, Charles makes Beast leader, and Cyclops defects to Magneto's Brotherhood where Scarlet Witch starts something with him, (3) without Scott's strong compassion and guidance, Pheonix Jean is influenced by Wolvie's wildness, goes Dark Phoenix, loses it, wipes out the Shi'are empire at the games, sets the Force free, and 12 galaxies die in her wake. So yeah.... that counts as a death too, I think 😆
The original Phoenix was not just a "copy". It duplicated Jean's body and "borrowed" a piece of her soul. After phoenix died it tried to return to Jean but unconsiously rejeacted it. Enter Madelyn Pryor.
She's not called Phoenix without a reason, right.
I guess Jean is the Kenny of the marvel universe
OH MY GOD, THEY KILLED JEAN!!!
Am i the only one who thinks the Marvel Zombies are the greatest threat in Marvel history? It scared me man.
?what?
i don't know about that but it got destory in secret wars
Sceptile Tube Marvel zombies were near unstopabble.
Bruno Franco really?
Sceptile Tube Imagine that the multiverse is a body and each reality is a cell. They were a multiversal disease, devouring cosmic beigns and hollowing-out entire universes. they werent your average shambling corpse either, these arent science-based monsters. They were cursed. They could think, feel, talk, even strategise. if you cut their head or blow their brains, they jsut keep coming.
I swear I recall the pheonix once bringing Jean back to life when she was really young in some flashback. something about it always having an interest in her, so when she was (from what i vaugly remember) hit by a car, pheonix was like "hell nah" and tapped into life itself or something to being her back.
no idea where this is from, but i swear it happened somewhere
Jean had an early friend, that died by getting run over by a car. She were there and held her friend's dying body, while her telepathic abilities awoke, feeling her friend's mind dying. In one retcon, Jean herself started to die from that while trying to do something about it, attracting the attention of the Phoenix. I have no idea from which issue that retcon is, though. And the Phoenix is, despite what happened with the "Dark Phoenix", a being of Life itself.
a cosmic being saying "hell nah!"
XD
^ This is what I focussed on. Haha
Damn, she died more times than Yamcha! :P
too soon... lol
Actually, if Dragon Ball GT is counted, Krillin has died more times than Yamcha, with 4 deaths, as opposed to Yamcha's 2 deaths.
nssfleahedgehog If GT is counted. :P
well obviously she died more times then yamcha he only died like once
Crono Strife twice
Who would've thought you could turn this into a drinking game
Those who have played have died from the massive amount of drinking that would go on.
Jean Grey from Earth -1761165 watched this video. Played the drinking game. Died. Then the Phoenix resurrected her.
c.Elizabeth Eichner a And then came back to life
We all died and then got resurrected by the Phoenix Force. It was a great game though.
LOL Great subject! Yeah, it's like Jean is always dead. That's what kind of angers me with Marvel; they seem to ALWAYS get rid of their characters with telepathy. Why is it so hard to keep Jean and Prof. X around? It's as if they don't have permission to be heroes. The solution is to always kill them. Is there absolutely no way for their enemies to counter and resist these types of mutants? Haven't the X-Men encountered villains that were able to resist mutants with telepathic abilities? (i.e. Magneto, Proteus, Shadow King, Master Mold, Emma Frost, Juggernaut, and Onslaught)? Why can't Jean Grey exist with just having telepathy and telekinesis without the Phoenix force?
My favorite version of Phoenix was from the 90s cartoons. It made so much sense to create Phoenix as this alien that takes control of Jean. The recent interpretations of Jean and Phoenix have been confusing. People don't know exactly what's going on, and I don't blame them. I don't like the whole Phoenix expressing itself as a latent mental illness; I find it more interesting to see Phoenix as a separate being who's trying to control Jean.
>I know this would never happen, but I would love to see Prof. X, Jean, Emma Frost, and Psylocke working together. Show that tension between Jean and Emma. They can also help Psylocke to develop her telepathic abilities. Psylocke can also teach them some of her ninja moves LOL For me, it gets so boring to see the same stories and characters play out as they always do. We know what's going to happen. Each mutant will act out in the same predictable ways.
That moment when Scott finds Jean's brutal deaths funny
I mean...
lol
So I have a question for you Scott: Where does DC fit in in the Marvel multiverse?
YESSS
It doesn't (I think), but the amalgam universe is
i guess they'd be 2 different multiverses, in a larger reality......*Cough* Infiniverse theory *COUGHS VIOLENTLY FOR REAL AND SPITS OUT BLOOD* .....uhhh
Omniverse, according to marvel, every comic universe is on one omniverse
everything isn't in the multiverse while I think it is in the omniverse. It was established there are things outside the multiverse like wildspace where the Beyonders are from.
Omniverse (can be plural multiverses) > multiverse > universes
If she dies so often, won't the Pheonix Force get bored of reincarnating her?
Just a guess, but it seems like it can only inhabit certain forms of great power - she is one of the primary focal points, so it's kind of like a compass. It normally points North, but may also direct to other lesser magnetic forces if they're close enough, kind of like when we had the Phoenix Five (and even that took an outside force to trigger)
She IS the Phoenix Force.
Because they’re bff. That’s what bff do, you may had enough of your bff’s stupidity but at the end you’re still helping.
love it , great work 👊👊👊
Appreciate it!
I know comic book cohesion isn't perfect but Marvel is notorious for ignoring previous work and continuity.
And just overall wtferee
Scott, you're one of my top favorites. Keep making videos, and I'll keep watching them. (Mallrats and Stan Lee reference, yeah)
Thank you so much for the subtitles, man! I'm brazillian and they really helped me for a full compreension!
Love the commentary. Crazy video 👍
This is a great video, and the death count at the end is too good. Great job Scott!
“All I ever did was die on you” is an amazing line that is neutered by the fact that Scott is such a pathetic man in that late 90s and early 2000s version of the character.
8:00 That Greg Land photoraced art makes this unintentionally hilarious. Like, it looks like stock photos put through a monochrome threshold filter.
Love this show so much, keep up the good work Scott!!
But if I am already subscribed, does that mean hitting the subscribe button unsubscribes me or just gives me an extra subscription?
How many times have i subscribed?
are any of my subscriptions actually real or are they just retconns?
Should i try to figure out how many times i have subscribed?
do i count only subscriptions in this universe?
If i was cloned and my cloned also subscribed do those subscriptions count?
yeah i get that alot
Great video!
Thanks! I appreciate that!
Awesome vid as always! BTW Is that the Marvel Legends Cap Shield on your wall? If it is... how sturdy is it?
Does Marvel hate Jean Grey or something?
Yup lol
DaMario Clark they do, because she is Marvel strongest character combine with the phoenix.
They hate the Greys as a whole lol her entire family was decimated.
im so happy that this was made! Right now Im reading through All New XMen with only a general knowledge of Jean Grey. Now Im more prepared, thanks Scott!
I really think they need to do a run where Jean and Logan have a happy ending, the old man deserves some happy after having to kill her so often
Great Vid! :D
Thank you :)
Great video! nerdsync is the best comic channel on youtube!
GREAT SCOTT!!!!! YOU TALKED ABOUT AN ACTUAL MISCONCEPTION AT THE END!
And I love how Hugh Jackman has handled her passing in the movies. He's brought so much humanity to a one-dimensional character. Just that reaction to the sight of her at the end of DOFP.... And that's after every other epic thing that's happened.
Fun Fact:
Gambit killed Phoenix in an alternate universe
Fun fact
Gambit was almost a summers brother
Fun fact. Gamit IS a summers brother in an alternate universe story called End Song.
Yo man this channel is awesome. You should be teaching a class on comics. You have a talent for explaining everything. Or maybe just a teacher at a school.
Scott!!! I'm considering becoming a Nerdsync patron on Patreon, and the perk with the Google hangout seems really cool. But!! I live in Australia and time zones are a thing so I'd want to be sure I wouldn't have to wake up at 3am for a Google hangout. What time of day do these usually happen and what Timezone are you in?
Her dying and coming back to life over and over makes sense, she is Phoenix after all.
scott love your channel
I hope you continue making lots of videos.
Gotta love Scott 's humour! 👍
:)
Do you also do Transformers related? Could you do history of the "Beast Wars"? Aw yeah would be awesome. Or even better, do a whole Transformers series.
That would be awesome.
Actually if you go back to the beginning of the channel you'll see an Optimus prime video.
That would be interesting and to see if there is any validity to the idea the Beast Machines is actually the "End of the Primary TRANSFORMERS Saga"
Given the revelation of the Phoenix usurping the appearance of Jean Grey in Phoenix/Dark Phoenix saga, I wouldn't even count the first 2 deaths.
I always loved that in John Byrne's run of Fantastic Four, Reed Richards was analyzing Jean Grey after being found in the cocoon and discovered that the cosmic rays that transformed the Fantastic Four were in fact part of the Phoenix force reaching out to Jean Grey and interacting with our atmosphere. Really changes the vague "cosmic rays" part of the origin. Also it is interesting to note that in AvX there were the "Phoenix 5". Could there have always been 5 wielders of the Phoenix force on Earth with Jean Grey and the FF?? As John Byrne is one of the co creators of the Phoenix force... maybe...?
It's kind of messed up for Jean to ask other people to kill her multiple times, yet she comes back *every* *single* *time*
I don't dislike these list type videos...but I prefer the normal comic misconceptions format...also WE NEED ANOTHER SCOTT NISWANDER CHANNEL VLOG!!!
You could add more 20 deaths since her return in 2018 and the Krakoan era lol
Great video.
Is Jean Like the Kenny of Marvel?
Pretty much. I think each marvel story teller thinks they are doing something new and unique and then immediately regrets it and just washes it away.
I was thinking more like krillan from dbz... but hey that works too
Hey Scott. Long time, first time. I don't know if you take requests for ideas but I was wondering if you could do an episode on the psychology behind nerd culture. More specifically why people in the nerd/geek/comic book community feel attacked, insulted or angry when people who aren't really nerds act like they are. I know this doesn't apply for all of us in the community, but I do notice some people who act this way. Maybe you don't do requests but I just thought I'd put it out there
I do have to wonder why Jean didn't just implant Corbeau's piloting skills into Wolverine (who in all likelihood already had said skills, or was retconned to have them, anyway) or Colossus, both of which were present and likely could have survived the reentry.
Also, 5:35 doesn't that apply to most of the X-Men anyway? Dying is like a rite of passage for them.
Hey Scott, could you please tell me the name of the song you guys us in the podcast, I kind of want to make it my ringtone
Hi Scott. I've got a question for you: I have recently watched the killing joke animated movie and there's a particular scene in it where Batman looks at his computer at some pictures of the joker. One of them has him and Harley Quinn, but technically, she wasn't around when the killing joke took place (because she wasn't created yet, right?). So how does this work in comics? Does this mean that now Harley was part of the DC universe when the killing joke took place? I'm a little confused
The animated Killing Joke took place in the BAS (Batman the Animated Series) so they just retcon this in order for it to take place after the show commenced.
+Planet Spatula Incorporated *Batman Animated Series continuity*
+Planet Spatula Incorporated how does it take place in bas ? she get paralyzed in the movie but he isn't in batman beyond?
+narutodbz585 Well I guess it's quite possible. Her disability was only temporary in the comics right? So it might be the case also in BAS
narutodbz585 I meant in the same continuity, it is set after the animated show.
I like the new set, Scott!
Jean's black dress reminds me a lot of Tatsumaki's and Fubuki's from One Punch-man. One and Murata probably got inspiration from Jean considering they have similar powers.
You should do an episode about how Killgrave/Purpleman would ruin the justice system.
Hmm... maybe!
That's a great idea!
My rule for superhero deaths is in order for it to count it has to last more than two issues. it can't be like, that time when superman faked his death by having Martian Manhunter pose as his ghost, or like with EVERY superhero of all time where an issue ends showing their "death" cliffhanger, only for it to be a ruse. I bend the rule for Jean Grey because it's more fun that way.
The main character in one of my screenplays has a habit for dying again and again. Her death before the most recent one was the one I assumed would be the last, but the direction the story took made it so that I ended up killing her off for the 6th time. I'm really hoping 6 is the last, but she does get resurrected in a different way almost every time.
You forgot:
- fake death from X-Men #113
- Jean Grey temporarily merging with her Phoenix clone dying on the moon in X-Men Forever #3
- self sacrifice in New X-Men #155. I know this is technically alternate future, but it affected 616 timeline directly.
This was such a strange topic to look into....i like it!
she can't help it it's in her nature as the phoenix to resurrect and eventually burn out in a continious cycle
Wolverine could _slow_ his starvation by eating his own flesh. But he would eventually notice that his healing factor would start slowing down as he starved.
Yea, I can't get over that fan in cap's shield.
*1. That was confusing as hell. However I would like to posit that Ms Grey is the personification of or the embodiment of an eternal elder force (the phoenix force) and for this purpose "Jean" could die and at this rate probably has. Here when I mean death I mean like Uncle Ben dead and ain't really ever coming back. Though Jean the eternal force will persist.* 2. Her original personhood could very well be gone and this "new Jean" is a copy produced by the Phoenix Force, which as its namesake implies, ensures the maintenance of a condition (in this case the persistence of a "Jean") in the 616 continuity - even against the prospect of the endless slumber.* 3. I posit thus this theory. The Phoenix Force manipulated original Jean's psychic abilities (as we have seen happen countless times) to transfer her consciousness into a new body. Here comes the philosophy. Do you belief she died by this theory? If one is a physicalist one must stand on the assumption that she has died and these "New Jeans" are simply akin to backups made of computer hard drives - copies and nothing more, but still as useful and meaningful as the original. Conversely if one is a dualist she, by this theory, has never died as one of her fundamental halves (her mind) is still extent in the world in either the original or copied format - she at the least is always existing in realised state the mind. For a physicalist the abstract mind is unreal and thoughts are a consequences of physical neurological structures which have died and been replaced by other material - what this and where it is from is a big idk.*4. However if we replace her all, body-wise, but the neurological functions (be they copies or original) are the same and this new form operates as the old has she ever died? Has her place not been filled by another her and thus her hole to fill is filled , "she" is not gone and thus not dead? If one believes in the abstract soul, maybe hers has moved on and we see these fake Jeans to be a (for lack of a less insulting term) soulless duplicate that universal order has put in for the sake of balance.*.5. I conclude that she, and all those other heroes, who die and get resurrected willy-nilly never do, nor can, really die. Cosmic order, be it Franklin, or the real life writers, see them as "fun, interesting, necessary or too pointless to ditch" and they remain. This is mirrored in real life, do the bad guys ever really go away, yes individual characters, Hitler/Stalin/ect, die but they in their essence do they ever really disappear or die? Maybe that's what we learn from this frivolous re-birthing of heroes is that their niches will always be filled up by some means and sometimes that means they have to return in their actuality.*
The Phoenix force has just become the undo button for killing of Jean.
In marvel vs capcom when u die as Phoenix and u got 5 bars u become dark Phoenix and when u win she said she she died more times then she can count
I say we all get NerdSync Sync-Cups to go with our Sunday Syncups
Condolences on the hair cut. Good episode as usual.
How about in the MYS-TECH which was in Marvel UK? Does that count? I think its also on earth 616. She shot herself in the head after Cyclops has fallen. And a number of Heroes died too. But in the end, Time travel came into play and all was good. :)
I REALLY wanted this series to be called *THE* Comics Misconceptions.
I love that one where Jean repeatedly dies from Wolverine XD
I saw Don't Breathe, I know Stephen Lang is morally questionable but I didn't know he was a mutant hater.
Ok, but can we talk about that time when Scott cheated on Jean, with Jean (while she was dead), and when the original came back, the new one became a supervillain?
You could make a listicle of "5 Comic-book Characters Who Died and Came Back (Before Superman Did)" that would be populated entirely by Jean Grey and Professor X over and over again.
Now that is very good question thank for doing this video
As a big Jeannie/Phoenix fan, I'd say this list is pretty accurate! It's a shame people have misconceptions about Jean and the Phoenix Force, their story arc has really interesting philosophical concepts.
Based on the video, I think I'd only count time when Thanos killed a bunch of people to try and impress Death as the only time Jean Gray has died, all the others seem like either near deaths where we're expected to believe she's dead, or things that would kill normal people and therefore at least weaken her.
As for Wolverine; there is no good scientific reason as to why that would work. In terms of energy conservation, he already needs an enormous amount of energy to maintain his healing factor so realistically he'd need to eat on average 10's if not 100's of times more calories than a normal person (I can't be bothered to calculate it as it would depend on how often he needs to regenerate). Eating himself would provide him with energy, but the most it could possibly provide him with is just enough to regenerate what he'd eaten (which is highly unlikely, most processes are
Digging the new hairstyle, Scott!
@1:22 Pray I don't alter it further.
Mr Sunday Movies makes videos about how many times pepole have killed pepole, you make videos about how many pepole dies. I dont know but I just find that funny.
People??????????
+Ramon Castillo pepole.
We cover the whole gamut!
Can you do something similar w/ Cyclops' costumes throughout the years? Capped dome, hair, X-visor, etc
Question: What became of the element Tony Stark created in iron man 2? They said it would "change the world " but apart from a passing mention in The Avengers hasn't been spoken about since.
So cool 😊❤️❤️👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻❤️
Thank you!
there are suppose to be like 27-30 but i only count 7: when her powers first appeared she was in the mind of annie/anne her childhood friend when she died, dies to become phoenix, die as dark phoenix, die while in goblin queen's mind when she dies, dies by sentinels (puts her mind in emma to survive), die to become phoenix a second time and die as phoenix by magneto all in the same issue. lets see what you put on this list....well if you counting thanos then you need to count secret wars lol. i dont count those (phoenix endsong) as jean as it was revealed that jean is in the white hot room and until she returns as the phoenix phoenix its just a reanimated body not the real jean
Personally I think the Dark Phoenix story has gotten very boring and extremely repetitive. It’s better to just come up with a completely new story about the Jean Grey character instead of trying to capture lightning in a bottle again and again and again. How many times can you retail the same dueling story arc?