100kW charging in Winter with the VW Id.3
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- Опубликовано: 11 фев 2021
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Awesome video as always 👌🏼👏🏼
Volkswagen if you are watching, I’m buying an id4 partly because of Chris and his videos 😁🇩🇰🇩🇪
I bought the ID3 AND an OBDEleven partly because of Chris and his videos :D
Where is my Commission? ;)
@@BatteryLife What commission....? I remind you, this is not a Volkswagen Channel... :D
Chris needs a VW referral link to get 1500 free km for each sold ID. ☺️
Best test explaining Speed & outside/battery temperature relation. Explains a lot. I´ll take the 130 km/h for future long winter and autumnn trips.
Well done Chris. This is the video to link when people complain about charging speed 👍
I must say, I don't think it's complaining. If a manufacturer says you car can charge with 100kW but it almost never does, it's false advertising.
What about buying a washing machine, advertised with washing under one hour, but in practice, the machine takes up to three hours because the water is to cold...
I had a pretty heated dicussion with my garage over this. My complaint was that my car isn't charging fast enough and they couldn't explain any of this to me. So, props to Chris!
A week ago i went driving with the id3, drove 100km on the motorway, doing lots of breaking and acceleration from 80-150 here in finland. Temperature was -9. Arrived at ionity with 15%. Got 67kw. Oh well.
Awesome video- good to see you’ve got the obd software working with some useful features! Really sheds clear light on what’s happening. +1 for a manual over-ride battery heating option - that would be an awesome feature! Keep up the awesome ID3 work 👍
Awesome!!! Thank you for this and I’m glad to hear that this update will be coming at some point.
Excellent illustration of the issue, and good to see it working as expected :)
Best EV-channel. 👍😎👍
Have an excellent weekend and take care. Cheers,, 🍻😋👍!
Thank you Chris for this information
Have a Good weekend &greetings from the netherlands 🇳🇱🇳🇱👋
Fascinating! Definitely giving me something to think about. Explains why my ID.3 has been charging so slowly for the last few days when the weather has been so cold.
Great sound again! WOW, You've reached 32,8 degrees. Learning new tricks for heating the battery (ID3 battery heater sould warm much more than the 13 degrees - hopefully through the new software that will be solved).
Like the content, music, the dogs and the black cat!😆👍👍👍
Bravo Chris, another video that makes me understand how my ID3 works !
Great video! I always wondered how that battery heating worked and some cars don't even have it!
Thanks for your video take care and safe travels
Excellent video and concrete proof of battery temp vs charging speed. Thanks for the sympathies for us in the Nordics. Especially some countries here with minute based DC charging pricing, this is valuable information for keeping the EV-driving prices at reasonable levels in the winter. Great to hear also that VW is also planning to support the DC charging preconditioning at some point.
Hi Chris, well done as usual, New button or a battery temperature somewhere in the car would be great step forward. Let’s see, what Zwickau’s guys will develop in the future 👍👍👍
Very interesting content and great video quality 👏
klasse video, mit top infos und top musik
Great video, Thanks
Thanks for that. I was going to complain to vw that speeds were low. 👍🏻
Same same with M3 great video as usual
I was worried about that "clunk" too, nice to know it's a feature, not a bug 😄 I had the same problem on long trips this winter, it was hard to get the 100kw charging speed when cruising at 110 which is dumb .. sometimes you go faster by driving slower because you charge less, unless you lose time because you don't charge fast enough.. what a mess ... And charge may be more expensive when you're charged /minutes
It'd be nice if they could just have a button to preheat the battery for charging. They can put up a warning or something that it'll drain your battery if used improperly and leave it up to the driver
YoYo driving as Tesla Bjorn calls it worked for me the best in the past, it really heats up the battery fast as there are also a lot of losses in the drivetrain besides the battery.
You are the ID.3 Flüsterer! 😅
Another chapter in my "ID.3 in Finnish winter" saga today: ME2.0, freezing -13°C, SoC 20%, pre-programmed time of departure @ 12:00, planning to drive ~5km downhill to the 50kW fast charger downtown.
(1) pre-warming *didn't happen*
(2) available regen/power bars were at roughly 50%. No surprise there with the frozen battery...
(3) when I started the car I got a warning about "limited performance" and *drum roll please* a yellow "turtle inside circle" icon appeared in the drivers display, at the place where usually the red/yellow "please charge battery" icon is.
(4) the battery heater *DID NOT START* and stayed off for the whole drive
(5) the "turtle" icon was visible the whole drive, sometimes changing to the yellow "please charge battery" icon and back.
(6) horrible charging performance at the start of the process. No surprise there with the frozen battery...
So again a hard-wired "make it easier for the driver" EV decision in the VW SW: if SoC is 20% or less then disable pre-warming & the battery heater.
This is annoying, because I knew the remaining 20% SoC were waaay enough for pre-warming and driving to the charger...
Good video. I was hoping for VW to come up with a "force battery heater"-button for manual control, not only a navigation-based feature to control the fast charging pre-heating. Essentially because I sincerely doubt the nav system will always be 100% updated with the location and availability of litterraly every fast charger.
Another helpful lesson for EV newbies, thanks!
Great video, thanks!
To anyone who pre-ordered an ID3 (not 1st), when are you receiving it? Mine is scheduled for the 31th of march at the latest.
Grand video Chris, Kona comparison, I just travelled to UK, left home at -7C and snowing, got to Calais -3C travelled 1495km total. A frigging nightmare in France because of the charging network disaster, only used 50kw Ionity chargers but even those are spaced too far apart on my route.
Anyways I checked what temperature the Kona reaches before it allows fast charging (50kw not sure about highest speed) it's 15 C, as I mentioned previously if I use type 2 11kw, it will only allow full 11kw when battery temp is 5C and higher. A Big Red Button to start battery heating would be a time saver for sure. Stats, at 110kph the car used 198 w/km
BTW brilliant music selection.
thresholds are at 5, 15 and 25°C. In the winter driving fast is better. My Niro maintains battery temp at around 130 km/h with 0°C outside temperatures.
@@doudoune1067 Thanks, makes sense, I stopped at a 100kw instavolt charger in UK, only got 48kw, battery temp was 23C
@@mickcartwright3842 Are those the ones near Oxford? In my experience although they’re “100kw” I think the grid supply is far lower. I’ve not seen more that 75 ish KWH.
@@ciaranwebb6871 Yes, Stroud Park Banbury, 8 all in a row, it of course depends what you drive, the Hyundai - Kia Trio will only charge maximum 75kw.
Very good, interesting, thank you!
Gruß aus Unterfranken
So after all the software is sorted out for the release of the Cupra I wonder if that is a car to consider against the ioniq5 competition. Good video and music this time
The ioniq 5 is a bigger car as far as i know. Model Y /id4 size. The el born will get dual motors, but is still limited to the meb platform with it's max 77 kWh battery and 125 kW top charging speed.
Bravo, Chris!
Can't remember...do the pups have rear seat heaters?? Aka bacon 🥓
No
Great video Chris. When you say battery heater is that the same as a heat pump? The heat pump is an non standard option on UK ID3's.
No. Heat pump is just a different way to heat. I do not have a heat pump in my car.
4:35 Black cat from the right side it not good for her... But good for the dogs.
For the heating i really hope there will be a solution in the future. Better isolation or a heat storage. We will see
Hi Chris, thx for that very helpful video. Are you still in the first mover club, where VW listens to the ID3 drivers? If yes and if you like the following, you might forward it to that group as suggestion to VW: In winter there is always a tension between heating up the battery for better loading and driving performance and saving energy, especially on short distances. Many drivers want to have a choice depending on the situation. The solution to heat the battery to 13°C is a kind of compromise. Why not tying it to the drive mode select: Normal is like now, Economy does not or less heat up the battery, maybe with more power restriction and Sport Mode heats up the battery to a level, where full speed charging is possible. So no complicated extra settings needed and the driver can choose intuitively.
It is known and being discussed.
Well, hopefully also implemented! ☺
I believe, that the air going under the car at fast speed, cools the battery. So I think, that fast acceleration would be better for warming up the battery.
It all depends on the outside temp, the power usage and how long you do it.
Enjoyed OBD stuff! Chris, do you have any plans to test ID3 45, once it's available?
I am asking for Pure and ProS all the time. But I don't get one. Yet!
@@BatteryLife Thanks! Hope it will happen anyway. 🙏
That app doesn’t seem to make good use of the available screenspace. Only seeing 4 measurements is a waste. They could do much better. :)
Thanks for test! We did a similar test yesterday @ -11degC outside. Unfortunately, could only heat up the battery to about 19degC driving up to 120km/h, so charging at 150kW charger was quite a disaster. Only 38kW at 35% SOC. On the same day, we got to a battery temp of about 25deg (mainly because we were driving uphills), charging was fine again. So the limit is somewhere between 25degC and 30degC, I assume. Did anybody experience the same?
@timemachine_194 Well, I did not expect 100kW at that SOC, but 80-90kW should have been possible from the charging curve. We got that charging power at 25degC bat temperature. Unfurtunately, we are not that brave/cracy ( :-) ) to go down to SOC < 20% like Chris, mainly because we have kids in the back and at that low outside temp the car really needs more energy than we experience the weeks before.
What? You want to have a button?
I think VW fired all engineers who design buttons! Maybe a Menu slider or a touch surface. :D
Software button!
@@BatteryLife I know, was just joking :)
It would be interesting to see how long it takes to fall below the 30°C when you drive let's say 120 kph after the first charging stop. This might be interesting for planning a second charging stop.
Fast charging also heats the battery. It went from 30 to 43 degrees in less than 4 minutes. So even driving slightly slower shouldn't be that big a problem. The problem is a totally cold battery. The slow charge then doesn't heat the battery enough, meaning it can't charge faster.
@@Psi-Storm I know that fast charging heats up the battery. My point was how long does it take to cool the battery down to a point where 100 kW charging isn't possible anymore. We see in the video that 130 kph isn't enough (at a certain ambient temperature) to keep the battery at 30°C.
I wonder what the long term effect the accelerating/regen cycles will have on the battery if you do that a lot.
None. Batteries are made for that. Unless you do it every day, all the time.
Thanks you for the great video. Could you do a test of driving 100/150 km at 130 kmh and than Look at battery temperature. It would be nice to know how long you need to drive on a highway to get 100 kw charging speed in Winter.
I can do that the next time I do a long distance trip. Nothing planned right now though.
Motor, battery temperature and other important parameters should be visible on instrument cluster. Option of heating the battery should be available to the user at any time. I understand that Volkswagen wants to make cars simple... but advanced options for users should be avaiable...
True, but also no other car has that.
Have VW given any idea when battery pre-heat on navigation to charger upgrade will be made? I'm getting an ID.4 next month and would like this feature.
Ha Ha! I should wait to the end of the video before commenting!
Thanks! Does battery heater run if you keep car plugged in on AC and not charging? Will it run when AC charging? You only have a 2.3 kW EVSE at home, so does that influence pack heating?
No, right now. Battery heating only without being plugged in or DC charging.
Hello Chris
How long does it take to heat up the battery to 30c .... Ho what was the start temperature. You have some balls charging at only 4% when does it go in to turtle mode plus when does the 100kw start to reduce I guess 80% thanks for the video's
Start temp is in the video. It took 30min, but more because I had to drive to the charger.
4% is no problem.
Turtle mode depends on the battery.
Cold battery turtle mode appears on higher soc.
100kW stays until 30% Also mentioned in the video.
That setup with the suckers and phone on your front windscreen must restrict your vision making a large blind spot.
No, not more than the mirror.
Do this same test with the ID4 you are getting on the 24th.
Sorry no. I can only drive 100km with the Id.4 and it will be the same.
Really useful video. I've hired an ID3 to try in the mild UK and can't get above 50kW charge speeds, even after an hour at UK motorway speeds. We don't have unlimited speed autobahn to warm the battery, so looks like in the UK owners are limited to 50kW charging in the winter...? Any insight on when pre-charge battery conditioning will arrive?
All depends on the driving and the outside temp.
No news yet
@@BatteryLife Thanks for that. In UK we have a 110kmh speed limit, so doesn't warm battery. Based on your experience only preheats to about 10C. Is the only solution to accelerate/brake hard on way to charger? If so, for how long?! Really love the channel!
I find the white interior and the white steering wheel absolutely gergeous. The problem I see with it, however, is that it gets dirty after a while. What are your experiences on that and what would your advice be considering the black and white steering wheel?
You can keep it clean! Just stay clean yourself.
@@BatteryLife Thanks for the helpful videos! Will you be able to test the Skoda Enyaq soon and compare it to the Id4.?
Skoda said they will contact me.
Can you say more about The OBD 11-2?
I made a video about it.
Let's hope the 6 kW heater is powerful enough to heat the battery to 25 - 30 degrees within a reasonable time...
PS: There is a "Dynamic charge current limit" parameter in OBD Eleven. Perhaps that gives information about the max. charging speed without having to go to an actual charger...I'll take a look tomorrow...
Interesting!
Yes, it's the BMS parameter that indicates maximum allowed charging current at given temp/SoC, no matter it is regen or DC charging.
Now I know what you mean. I thought this for regen, not for charging.
@@BatteryLife Interesting since there are videos with higher regen also (90+ kW).
yo-yo driver is faster to warm up battery, but its recomended to be alone on the road, i did full power and full regen yesteday for 10 min and i was way faster then driveing with my egolf
What application are you using ?
Thank for your vidéos 👍😉
I say it in the beginning of the video ;)
@@BatteryLife OK but I'm french and i don't understant the name of the app, 😅
It is an obd dongle. obd eleven ii
@@BatteryLife Thank 👍😉
Hi Chris,
Weißt du ob ich die Batterie mit dem 230v Ladegerät vorheizen kann?
Vermute eher nicht wegen der geringen Leistung?
Liebe Grüße!
Im Moment nicht mal mit 11kW AC. Kommt aber auch noch.
@@BatteryLife danke für deine schnelle Antwort! 😎
Would love to see how long time the battery needs to hit the target temperature of 13c, without climate on (meaning only the 6kW being used straight for heating the battery)
The climate does not heat the battery.
@@BatteryLife I know. I meant no climate so we can see how much % of the battery the heating to 13c on battery used, without also losing SOC from heating the cabin.
Hi Battery Life, I have been following your videos for almost a year, and have enjoyed them. You are responsible for me buying a UK 1st edition. I do small mileage around 400 Kim’s per month. Now at the risk of causing you to get annoyed at my question concerning battery drain, why is it I can charge my id3 to 80% not drive it for a week and my app tells me that that I now have 40%? Btw I am on software 0564.
Do you have preheating on? if you added a preheating schedule your high voltage battery may drain because the car will heat up the cabin at the scheduled times... other than that it sholdn't happen, an ID.3 should lose no more than 1% per month for the HV battery
@@Gresteh Thanks for the reply, my app does not yet allow scheduling preheating. I believe the UK 1st Editions do not have battery heating, it is now an expensive option.
@@davidbrewster5309 hello david i would check your settings on your car it maybe set to preheat the battery you may not have it on your app but i guess your car has the option in the settings ... You may Have it set to preheat heat the inside of your car .... Check your settings
@@raptorpome2577 Thank you for your reply. I will check the car now.
FYI just returned from Charging M3 sr+ from 18% -94% on a type 2 50kw charger at -2deg C and found battery heater stayed on up to 90 % 😲
50kW type 2? doubt that ;)
@@BatteryLife you are right 50kw CCS but only 40kw , rip off 😮
Is it the chinese version?
@@BatteryLife MY 19 so not Chinese
How to activate battery heater? Does the id3 do it on his own? If yes, at which outside temperature? Today it was 4 degrees outside and i had no such high consumption.
If battery is under 7 it will be heated to 13 degrees. Cold outside temp does not mean the battery is the same temp.
@@BatteryLife thanks. Is there en extra effect, if i preheat the car inside for 15 minutes before i use the car? Does the battery heat up faster?
Chris, do you own VW stocks? Just curious....(I do)
Yes, got it at the frankfurt motor show.
@@BatteryLife Socks 😅
Does the id3 with no heat pump have no battery heating?
Yes, it does.
I have electric corsa. Range a big let down.
Really? I have not driven it.
Great stuff! Waaay too many permutations with battery charging rates, ambient and battery temperatures, durability of batteries when supercharging, range, etc etc. Perhaps the future is really with hydrogen fuel-cells. Much simpler and none of this rubbish! Also, they are much more environmentally friendly with no environmental pollution from mining the rate metals, disposal of batteries (lithium ion batteries cannot be recycled!).
@@EinzigfreierName I really do not want to continue polluting our Earth. Too much pollution from mining all these rare metals, cobalt and lithium for these batteries. Hydrogen can be easily produced from excess wind energy at night, and we have an abundance of wind energy in the UK.
The fun fact is that a hydrogen vehicle contains a high current capable traction lithium ion battery. 😄
@@JPetr94 Yes, we all do have to use a small battery (probably 1.5kWh size) to provide the traction power to the motor, but thankfully not a 60 to 80 kWh battery pack. An added advantage is that this battery can be easily replaced and at much lower cost than a EV pack. No more concerns about battery degradation, charging rates and times, battery temperatures, and so on. It will be back to the convenience of an ICE car, but much more reliable and true zero emissions transport.
@@EinzigfreierName I've been following the development of the Toyota Mirai and much of what you mentioned about hydrogen issues is not as bad as you think. We thought the same about petrol too (risk of fires in accidents, spillages, etc), lpg/lng storage tanks, etc. There are thousands of Mirais on the road in Japan, US and Europe and there have never been one accident with refuelling, storage, transport etc.
@timemachine_194 Lithium ion batteries are current not economical to recycle! Indeed, it takes more energy and harmful chemicals that pollute the environment to simply seperate the lithium. These batteries are therefore disposed of in landfills after the metal casing and some other easily recovered materials are removed.
I wonder if people realise the damage they are doing to their expensive power electronics and motor windings by generating heat with max accel and decel cycles. I hope i never buy a car that had an owner drive in this way just to charge a little quicker. I see bjorn do it regularly and then has a clunk on his driveshafts also. Its total abuse of the vehicle.
Unless you do it every day all the time. It is fine. Especially since the Id.3 does not have that much power.
@timemachine_194 How much regen does a Tesla actually do? It cannot be that much from what I have seen.
VW! ID.3 is a joke....sorry, but I can't take it serious....ugly as hell, shitty software, shitty BMS....shitty range....shitty in cold..... just shitty ;-)