I also ride in Wisconsin and it’s the perfect place for 4 strokes. What’s more silly are the guys running paddle tracked mountain sled down the groomed trails of northern Wisconsin.
Ha ha right, that's sort of why I made this video. I get so much crap about my "heavy sled" but that's the thing, it just doesn't matter here. It's a trail sled and Im rarely able to leave the trail so why should I care??? At least I don't have to carry and fill oil!
I see the same nonsense in MN. Went to Hinckley a few weeks ago and seen a guy with a deep paddle Alpha One... WTF??? They're all over like that on the weekends.
I’ve put 10k miles on my 2011 600Ace and I can honestly say for long distance trail riding the 4 stroke is the only snowmobile I’ll own again. Very peaceful experience.
Went from a 600 2-stroke to a 9000 and don’t regret it at all! You wouldn’t be disappointed if you upgraded. I’m a trail rider 90% of the time and don’t mind throwing it into some deep stuff too and have never had an issue. I’m not hitting the mountains with it any time soon but a little off trail is always fun haha.
Same thing was said about outboard 4strokes on boats.... and it took about 15 years but now they are absolutely taking over with equal or better power, much better fuel economy and the weight has been reduced to the point its a non-factor. Seems snowmobiles are just a bit behind but they are working there way to the same point.
My wife and I both have 4 strokes 2016 Skidoo 900 ace and 1200 4tec. Love the low maintenance and specially the 87 regular gas at the pump. I came off a 800 switchback, too much unused power for my needs. Also the 900 has 15000 miles and the 1200 just rolled 11000 last weekend. They spend alot of time pinned on the bar so there not driven easy! Very dependable!
Xf1100 owner and have been very happy with its performance. I think a person just needs to be really honest with what they will actually use their seld for when considering what to get. For me in west central wi, I'm a flat land trail rider and really wanted reliabilty and comfort which this machine has given me. The power is very comparable to a 600 class 2 stroke. I think a 2 stroke might have an advantage at the top end, but I rarely ever get to that point, so I don't mind. It's a wonderful thing for us to have so many choices! Everyone can find the model that fits what they want!
I liked the front bumper mount setup. Nothing wrong with 4 strokes. For most people out poking around on the trails, which are most people, it's probably the optimum setup. When you get into off-trail, 2 stroke tends to be the way to go. I'm interested in seeing what the ev segment will bring. There's a company called Taiga motors up in Canada making some impressive claims about their sleds for power, range and weight. And ev instant power is pretty hard to beat. Can it really work in a cold environment is another story. It's something I'm watching though.
Thanks for the content Swanky! Left 2 strokes 7 years ago and will never go back. Love the torque, quiet, and smooth motor. Picked up the 22 ski doo 900 ace turbo R x and it is great!
@@SwankyCatProductions if you want quite and fast as hell get a 4 stroke turbo. if you want loud and be stupid fast corner to corner and hit jumps and stuff get a 2 stroke really just riding preference though
I had all 2 strokes and rebuilt them all the time. Then my last sled wast a 09 renegade 600 etec, still had lots of fixing. Bought my 15 Viper xtx new and it's been the most reliable thing I've owned so far. 7000km ish and been awsome, it is heavier, it's definitely faster than my 600 so I'm pretty happy with the 4 stroke. I don't get out too much so I need it not to break down when I get to go.
@@SwankyCatProductions I crank up my 8v92 2 stroke detroit and love the rumble. Buying a few gallons of BRP XD-100 etec oil to top it off is something. it was on sale at walmart. My mower and rotary are on amsoil interceptor. .
I'm a 4 stroke guy for the simple fact I'm not interested in rebuilding my engine every two years. With that said, Ride Whatever, just enjoy the ride. First thing I think is often misunderstood or is quick vs fast. Sure, many two strokes are quick off the line but my 4 strokes can go fast, really fast. The fastest production sleds are 4 strokes. Look up SRX and Thundercat on Snowtracks channel. My new Yamacat Sidewinder X TX LE 146 is a beast. Turbo is key. Horsepower and torque or amazing with arm stretching pull. With the torque the weight of the sled isn't an issue on Adirondack trails and on the lakes the weight ads stability in the triple digits. 🏁
hey! i'm an off trail rider mostly ditch banging and swamp bashing and i'm a light guy, 145pounds. The weight really does matter to me to pull a machine around weighing as little as I do!
@@sylfixplayz2142 I'm 145 and have no issue riding my buddies sidewinder mtx for the day you notice the weight but with 285hp just stab the gas and the weight goes away. Even when it was stock. The biggest thing is letting the sled do the work for you don't try and man handle it. If you do any sled will have you exhausted half way through the day.
Yeah but you absolutely never need to rebuild engine on 2 strokes every 2 years i have sleds that is 50 years old and still runs really good and it was never rebuilt.
Ok, I bought a Nytro XTX at end of last season. Buzzed for 15 minutes this morning and am going out tomorrow for first REAL ride. A) it is heavy B) it has so much torque, it is scary. Does not feather like a two stroke (it has clutch kit) so that will be the hardest thing to get used to. I am NOT sorry I went to 4 stroke. I will report after tomorrow’s ride on my true first experience and rating. Keep on posting. Good stuff!
I ride a 900 turbo and don’t plan on going back to a 2 stroke. It really fits my style of riding. I get great acceleration and top speed does not interest me. But it goes plenty fast!
I haven't had a snowmobile in about 10 years and it used to be a 97 MXZ 440 fan. Just this last May, I scored a 2015 Sr Viper XTX with 524 km. I predominantly ride trail but like wandering off trail every now and then. To say the four stroke is an upgrade for me is an understatement. Yeah it's heavy but if I predominantly ride trail it's not at all an issue. In fact, it's a bit of an asset as the machine tends to cling to the trail a little better than some lighter sleds.
That's awesome! I'm jealous, really always wanted one of those. Glad to hear your enjoying it and totally agree the weight can be an asset on the trails.
I bought a 2006 Cat T660 Turbo Touring a couple years ago as my first 4-stroke sled. Loved it and still have it as a spare. SOOO quiet and stink free, 20mpg easy all day long was a nice bonus. Last year I bought a couple 2010 Phazer 500 4-strokes for something a bit lighter than the big Cat to play around with. After a bit of suspension tuning and some Curve XS skis I got them to handle great finally. They've been super reliable too. Best sleds I've had so far! No stink and 16-20mpg on the trails. I actually get nauseous after awhile if I have to follow a 2-smoker on the trails, even the new ones. They burn very little oil compared to the older ones but I can still smell the exhaust just the same. I'll never go back to a 2-stroke.
I currently ride a 2016 ZR 8000 Limited 137 and I had the opportunity to ride a New ZR 9000 137" with the Yamaha 998 cc triple turbo. I can tell you from back to back comparison of that turbo and my 800 stroke the weight difference wasn't that dramatic. What was dramatically different however, was the power, holy crap does that Turbo pull hard!! I'm having a hard time picking between the new Cat/ Yamaha Turbo and a new Polaris Matryx 850. All I can say is you won't be disappointed in the Turbo 4 stroke if you look at the 2017 - 2022. :-) P.S. Might I suggest putting a set of C&A Pro XPT ski's with a set of at least 7.5" shaper carbids on your F1100. It will be night and day different over them stock ski's with dual carbides!
Came off a 13 f8 with good intentions to update but prices went sky high so I bought a 11 z1 1100 with 300 miles on it for a filler sled till I bought new a new 2 stroke I’m super impressed with it and still riding! I agree on the turbo thinking have a good one Ben
Great video had a 2010 ski doo 600HO grand touring 2 stroke and I always coughed after my rides and smell of oil , got a 2017 1200 grand touring SE 4 stroke problem solved and this sled is super fast I always ride trails . ( Please stay on the trails we are loosing too many trails )
Rode 2 strokes all my life.....my wife and I made the switch from 600 two strokes to SkiDoo MXZs with 900ace 4 stroke in 2017.11,000+ miles and could not be happier.For groomed trail riding we give those engines 10 out of 10
I rode a 2013 Renegade X 1200 for 8 seasons and 12k miles. I did love that sled but last year I went back to a 2 stroke short track (129). I bought a 2019 MXZ XRS 600r. The weight difference is unbelievable. And that is what I sick of with the 4 stroke , the heavy front end. The 4 stroke was great but the lighter 2 stroke is way better in my opinion.
We have a Polaris that we keep now as a "backup" sled as the kids are out of the house now. It is VERY reliable, always starts and runs fine. Just gotta keep coolant in it.
I picked up a 2013 F1100 Turbo RR beginning of 2020/21 season. Have ridden ZR 700s and 800s for years before this beast. It also has a Speedwerx tune and 240hp on 91 octane. Power is insane and feels awesome on trail. Ditch bangin is not so much fun with it. The front end weight and insane torque makes it hard to lighten up the front for driveway approach or big moguls. Central MN trails, fields, lakes are sooo much fun. But you are right, 2-stroke to 4-stroke is like apples to oranges. They both have their high-points and low points. Will have to get my old ZR700 ut and jump back and forth to get a better comparison. Ride safe.
I've ridden a Nytro since 2008. 4 stroke trple 1049 (CTEK4 in the Cat version). Definitely torquey fun and very responsive to the throttle. Some of that might be gearing but I think Yamaha was sneaky and under-represented the horsepower. If it claims 130, I'd say 135 or approaching 140. Also, the gas delivery is not through the long throttle body of the 1100 cat and that is the reason for the crazy instant throttle -don't sneeze while you're riding. Never mind the ski doo 4 stroke, that puppy had a big rep for throttle lag. Anyways, 14,000 miles -oil changes only. Easy on the Yamaha clutch -never serviced yet. And finally, very good gas mileage for a high performance motor (I always use less than my 2 stroke ski doo riders).
Started watching you because of my XF9000 137, good sled and super fast in a straight line but too heavy, I'm 175 6'1" and it was hard for me to muscle around. I now have 600 miles on my 22 renegade 850 and freaking love it, Rides like a Cadillac and the acceleration and nimbleness is what I needed for my 95.67% MI trail riding. Keep up the vids!
After coming off an old 2 stroke Polaris, I own a pair of 900 ACE sleds. I ride trails exclusively and its nice to be able to go nearly 200 miles on 87 octane without worrying about running out of fuel. The serenity and the reliability of the 4 stroke is nice and Ive hit 87mph routinely on the lakes, which is plenty fast enough for me. That learning key was really helpful for the kids when they were starting out too. I have no problem with the modern 2 strokes that don't have you stinking like a landscaper at the end of the day, but all in all I'm glad I made the choice.
Went from 2 stroke to 4stroke now im hooked on the 4 stroke for trail riding cant be beat!!! now own a Z! 1100 turbo Artic Cat 225Hp no shortage of power LOL :-)
I had the 1100 before that one, the 2010. A lot of people say the sled improved but my 2010 year was epic for trail riding. I bought a 2015 assault and the build quality was low but the machine was cool. I found it very wobbly in trail riding. I think the 4 stroke cruiser is the way to go for us old guys. I think the new 2 stroke engines are made to such high quality but emissions has cut the oil to nothing. I would Beth these new 2 strokes would last 30000k if you could re-map it to use more oil and run a touch more rich But for me 4 stroke quiet. The Suzuki twin or the Yamahas that exhaust out back are the most quiet for us older fellows However I think that the new Polaris are the absolute most cool looking machine ever made I see why the resale is so high They just look so good
I have a 2014 pro rmk and I’ve like it better then my dads assault. I even use it on the trail too. Mainly to get to the powder. But getting a 4 stroke unstuck sucks. The extra weight makes a big difference, just depends what you like better. Snappy, Lightness and off trail use, or smooth trail riding with some insane top speed.
I have a 2012 F1100 and a 2015 ZR8000.... my girl has a the 4 stroke (heated seat makes them happy)... and yeah, I prefer the two stroke. You can carbide it up and whatnot but the weight is there, but most importantly, at least for me, is the slower throttle response. It makes it less fun. With the two stroke, the response is so fast, and with less weight, I can blip the throttle on uneven trails, and that keeps the front of the sled from going down into valleys.... so it's more comfortable/smoother, as you can use the throttle on/off to even out bumpy terrible trails. The 4 stroke is still a great sled.... it's just not as fun, and not as comfortable. Try riding one back to back and report back. I like the torque of the 4 stroke... and never adding oil is cool.... and I beat every 600 I ever raced... but.. it just wasn't as FUN, and I want to have FUN when I ride. Zuke 800 is the coolest engine you can get in this chassis imho; not very refined but super fun, only reason it was stopped was emissions.
I've actually got a 2 stroke I'm testing out right now and I definitely agree, they are fun. Especially how punchy the throttle is and how light the engine feels when it's reving. Best to just have both! Haha.
I keep going back and forth on getting a modern 4 stroke sled, my current sled is a 03 ZR900 APV with some performance mods, its 100% adrenaline rush every time I ride it, but MPG sucks and its getting hard on the body for long trail rides. Might just have to own both 2 and 4 stroke sleds. Thanks for the video.
I just sold my two Yamaha Nytro’s. Yes they are full of torque but I could never get my suspension properly adjusted. Had them for 5 years but ended up buying an AC Xf 1100, and wow 🤩 what an improvement in ride 👌. However the motor in the AC sounds and feels a little gutless compared to the arm ripping acceleration of the Yammis. All in all I’m very happy with my switch to the kitty cat 😃🍻🍻🍻
@@SwankyCatProductions The ride/comfort of the Procross sleds are really awesome. I actually really like going off trail with that 141 track. Not a mountain sled but definitely great back country sled for out here in Manitoba. Cheers 🍻 buddy and keep up the great videos👍
I used a 2013 F1100 Turbo for 2 years and that sled was a pain when I had to move it by hand in the snow. Going to a 2015 Polaris 800, shaving ~200lbs makes a huge difference. However, I do miss the high-end speed, smooth-running engine, and better fuel economy.
Someone will always have a faster sled than you, no matter what you get. As you said buy a sled for your riding style. I use mine for 90% ice fishing and the rest is some trail and ditch banging. I don't care that it's not a 120mph trail sled that can boondock...that's fun and I was a teenager once, but not what I'm after now Also, the reliability factor of a 4-stroke is the biggest upside 👍
I just bought a two stroke 2000 Polaris 500 xc Basically just for ice fishing and ripping down farm fields you’d say a 4 strokes better for that application?
No, I should have specified..my sled is a 01 Polaris Classic touring 600... Just saying that you buy what's in the budget and fits your needs. And it's not always a mountain sled
We have a sidewinder 998 four stroke do distance trails and is comfortable smooth and reliable… had a two stroke oil cost alone adds up significantly over the course of a 2000 mile year 6800 on our sidewinder and so far two oil changes and just add gas but it all depends what type of riding you do I think there is a use for both
Went from an F7 to a 14 XF9000 with a 260 hp tune Can’t say I miss the F7 ! For a trail sled the weight does not matter, anyone who makes a big deal about it clearly has not ridden one. Buddies got the 8000 2 stroke sleds and they don’t compare. They are fun too but on the tail they handle 95% the same but lighter steering feel but the 9000 feels more planted with less ski lift so it’s up to you. But out the flipper to the gripper and the Turbo makes you giggle
Rode 2 strokes most my life. Picked up a 2013 xf1100 turbo a couple years back now and it has some pros and cons for sure. I do like 70 trail 30 off. Mainly ride in the northern Wisconsin or UP area. I found after a long day of trail riding the extra weight really made a difference. Normally would do 200 miles a day if trail riding. So it was definitely nice not buying all that oil. And when taking it off trail it’s very hard to get it on one ski to carve. Even with the crossover version of the sled. 141” track I believe. When I got stuck as well if I was alone not sure if I’d be able to get the sled out by myself. I now ride a 2018 Polaris pro-s switchback and find its a lot better on and off trail with weight being the biggest thing for me. I’m thinking about getting a T-Cat in the coming years now that it has power steering on them. Seems like a cool thing to have. Would still need a off trail sled though as that would be trail on sled.
I started on a Yamaha phazer 500 to an apex 1000 which has 160 ish horse power and keep in mind I’m 13 and I can’t handle that much power so now I’m on a Polaris XC 500 but hoping to switch to a Polaris XC 600 and for only having a 500 two stroke love it more then my other 4 strokes
I’m in Ontario and I ride 2014 Polaris pro rmk 800. Cut my lugs down to 2-1/4” and w/155 track. It’s super light and amazing in the powder and slush if it comes up. Where is struggles though is top speed and because of the narrow ski stance I have to lean more in the corners on the trail to get to the powder. There is always pros and cons.
That being said if I where to upgrade I thing “my” perfect sled would be a khaos or SKS with wider stance and adjustable shocks, 155 w/ 2.4” lugs. Or the new maytrx assault with wider skis and 2” lug 146” track.
I have a AC T660 touring. Definitely love the 4 stroke. Quiet and you don't smell like 2 stroke oil at the end of the day. I get about 16mpg or so with mine but it's geared down compared to the regular trail version.
Had a 2000 yamaha srx 700 triple 2-stroke. It was snappy as hell and scary fast. Now I have a 21 rs venture, 1049cc 4-stroke. It is great, quick, reliable and quiet. Only maintenance needed is oil changes and carbides. Nothing against 2-strokes theyre fun but for long term reliability and trail riding ill only ever own a 4-stroke snowmobile. People underestimate mid range torque on 4 strokes as well, theyre very powerful in their own way.
I have been watching some of your videos and you really do a good job on reporting on what you like...dont like or just an honest review. I have always had 2 strokes and sold the last two a 1.5 years ago and they were a 2015 xf8000 sno pro and the wife's was a 2014 el tigre 6000 and really liked both....next weekend we are picking up a package deal and they are a 2015 xf9000 sno pro limited 137" with the turbo and a 2015 yamaha r tx dx 129" and hoping they will be a good choice. I read all the comments and replies on this video and its alot like republican or democrat...or dodge, chevy or ford...everyone will always like something different and that's what makes the world go around. I'm from Minnesota and will try and give a little feedback when we get them home and can swing a leg over them and put on some miles, we ride trails around Duluth and up north and should be good with these choices. Thanks again for your common sense videos and offering useful information from them! Subscribed....
Thanks Bryan! Yep spot on, very few people who don't take a hard line one way or the other. Just got back from a ride (in the dirt lol) in my 4 stroke and was pretty happy to not worry about the sled getting to warm. Also really just enjoyed the sled! Definitely let me know what you think of yours!
For the average rider there is 0 issue running a 4 stroke with today's technology. The only place I'd say it's beneficial to run a smoker is in the mountains or when your worried about not starting in -40 nights at the camp otherwise it's almost always better running a 4 stroke.
I switched in 2011 from 800cc 2 stroke to an 2012 XF 1100 turbo. Boosted it before I even rode it. 220 HP on that one. Snow checked a 2016 ZR 9000 limited with the 137" track. Boosted it and got the 3" intimidator exhaust by turbo Dynamics. And a bunch of other goodies. I still have it with 6, 390 MI. It's over 300 horsepower and I put a 2 in track on it. It's the most amazing sled ever. It has anti-lag for starts and will rip your arms off!! I will never buy another two-stroke.
I have moved to an XF 1100 Turbo after owning and racing too many 600cc two strokes than I can count. I like the effortless, calm and quiet power of the turbo 4 stroke, but I definitely miss the lightness of my 2 strokes. I've had to put a lot of effort into getting the 4 stroke to be able to turn, and it was a big learning curve to not be able to use the throttle as an on/off switch like I could on the 600cc 2 strokes. Overall, I feel like I will never sell XF 1100 Turbo for use as a back up sled and for long rides with lakes, but I will buy another 600cc 2 stroke primary sled for corner to corner tight woods riding which is what I enjoy most.
I went from a 700 2 stroke, to a yamaha 4 stroke non turbo, and back to a 2 stroke 850. 2 strokes are light, nimble, quick, and just straight up FUN. I love both, but just something about the 2 stroke that just brings me back (and keeps me young I guess). I'm pushin 50 years old now. My next, and probably last new sled will more than likely be a four stroke.
Yeah they definitely both have their own attitudes and it's nice to be able to switch back and forth once in a while. I've actually been testing a 19 ZR6000 which has been a lot of fun!
4 stroke are ideal for trail riding. I got a new 2022 900 GT and I can put it in eco mode and go nearly double the distance on the same amount of gas then anyone I ride with. And in sport mode it feels identical to the power of a 2 stroke 600 but probably a bit more torque. Also once you flip it over to finger throttle. You can't go back to thumb. Much better grip and control. I know I'll never go back to 2 stroke.
I've got a Phazer 500 MTX. I regret it. I mean it runs fine, reliable, starts easy but it's a heavy pig. I've rolled it a few times and needed help to get it back on its skis. One time I rolled it, it puked oil out of the oil reservoir through the breather into the air box. I had to limp it home with low oil. Also the finicky gearbox reverse is no way as good as a two-stroke that can just start the motor backwards. For a trail sled on groomed trails, sure, but for mountain riding or even ditch-banging where you might end up rolling it? I'd say two-stroke all the way. Also, and this is more a complaint about the Phazer, but why have a nice big spot on the end of the tunnel to mount extra gas or other equipment and then point the exhaust right at it?
My neighbour had one of those Phazers and every time I would bump into him he would tell me another horror story about. It was constantly in the garage. Odd for a Yamaha as my 08 Yamaha Nytro has been virtually bullet proof since I bought it 13 years ago.
I've got a 2010 ski doo gsx 1200se it's a beast it's heavy I will say it's no slouch. What I like most about my 4 stroke is it doesn't stink like a 2 stroke
Thanks for posting so many awesome videos I really enjoy watching them. Question for you, which type of headlights did you end up purchasing for your sled? I think you mentioned in one of your videos that you switched over to LEDs but I'm wondering what brand and bulb number? I have a 2012 F1100 Sno Pro and I've always wanted to switch it over to LEDs as the stock bulbs are rather dim. Thanks !
Raise the front limiter strap a notch/inch. That will give you a more predictable ride on that model and more bite in the front end. You will have to balance out the ski pressure with steering effort based on your riding.
I have a 2 stroke and 4 stroke. (20 RiotX and 15 XF7000) I love the 7000 for trail riding. I will always have a 4 stroke in my fleet. Use my Riot for deeper powder adventures.
My wife and I run vipers . We love them . The odd time it would be nice to have a 2 stroke but we are 90% trail riding so it’s much better with the 4 stroke. What are you running for a gps?
I had a xf1100 for two seasons and ended up selling it due to the track length than it not having enough power, I'm from southeast wi and ride in the same areas you do. Bought a renegade 850 in 2019 witch was a amazing sled but 165hp can get outta control pretty easily so I sold that in fall because of the market I got more than I paid for it and picked up a 2022 tnt 600r. Only have 50 mi so far but seems to be the perfect sled for the areas I ride
Yeah I kinda figured that would be the case with the non turbo XF1100. My sled does ok but I think I'd want more power of I had a longer track. Glad you found one you like!
I don’t regret buying a 4-stroke even a little bit. 2-stroke and 4’s are very different and made for different things. We need both and I love both. As far as 4-strokes being slow? 4-strokes are more amicable to modification but are ready made for super chargers or turbochargers. In fact, the most powerful snowmobile stock engine ever created to date is a 4-stroke.
I went from 2007 2 stroke 1000cc sno pro to a 2017 thundercat, both were fairly heavy sleds but the Tcat handles and is so much more dependable. The old sno pro had a very comfy ride but required much more maintenance. I work on both but the tcat is much easier to work on and the newer body panels make service simple. I'm right at 6k miles on the tcat and my 1000 I sold at 7k it was getting pretty worn out. I plan on putting as many miles on the 4 stroke as I can.
I have driven both a 4 stroke and a 2 stroke and I prefer 4 stroke over a 2 stroke because one you can travel further on the trails and the reliability I dont want to keep spending money on repairs so that is why a 4 stroke fits me better
I went from a Rev chassis MXZ 600 to '10 Yamaha Nytro XTX to a '17 Polaris Pro-S. The Polaris handles much better, is lighter, less tiring on long trail rides, and more fun in general. To me the trade off is worth it, and I don't keep my sleds long enough to worry about long term reliability. Next sled will most likely be a 2 stroke as well
I love two strokes but my next sled will be a four stroke cat…been riding since 1972 . First sled was a brand new kitty cat at 6 years old lol. I have a Thundercat and F7 zRT 800 and 2002 Yamaha SRX 700. I’m 56 now I want something quiet and comfortable
4 strokes are the Cadillacs of trail riding period. Extremely planted, confidence inspiring hogs. By nature 2 strokes are lighter more playful sleds. Ridiculous to compare them. In a perfect world I'd own one of every different terrain sled.
It's all about the weight when the trail gets bumpy. For a smooth trail, the 4 stroke is fine but when it gets moguled out, that extra 70-100 lbs is brutal. Power delivery is just different but both have plenty
@@SwankyCatProductions I think it's still 50 plus pounds more, which is a noticeable weight. But you also ride pretty much 100% on trail and your trails are in pretty decent shape, most of the time. Head to say Munising or Minocqua or Eagle River on a weekend and run 40-50 miles on some pounded out trail and you'll be wishing the sled weighed 100 lbs less. We got rid of our Cat 4 stroke for that very reason. Even the Doo 900 just feels too heavy in the front IMO compared to a 600 or 850.
Thought the arctic cat 660 turbo pulled ok.... heavy? Yes. But smooth....1100 turbo hits..... I love 2 stroke power. But sometimes enjoy the peace and sneakability of a 4 stroke
@@SwankyCatProductions Incredible. A little too heavier than a 2st. And yes even with some light parts 80 lbs heavier. So tree busting takes more effort. But at altitude where you need hp especially to set the track when sidehilling and countersteering, I still have 300hp. The 2st’s drop from 170 to 130.
Somewhat of an off topic question.... the trails you ride, are they all one way trails? They look narrow, with lots of blind turns, and kind of look scary if there was two way traffic.
Yeah they are two way and definitely dangerous. The camera makes them look much worse and like I'm riding way to fast to be able to see but that's just the wide angle lens.
I ride a 2012 F1100 turbo with a turbo dynamics programmable tune, exhaust and some other stuff and it's is crazy fast. It would be interesting to get your take on it compared to your sled.
Have same sled and an f800. Same year. Turbo is too heavy if u get stuck. Put a 136 on my f800. Fukin love it. I do mostly trail with ditch banging. Maine and NH trails
@@chucknorris277 Yeah you don't want to get this big girl stuck. My reverse went out on one of my trips and that was enough of a work out for me! I've had 2 strokes my whole life so it was big change going to the 4 stroke. I love the power but I can't ride it as hard in the trails like the lighter 2 strokes.
I've owned both, from Indy 440s, Indy 400, to Polaris XLT, two 97 700 Vmaxs, 98, 2000 SRXs, 07 Apex, 12 Apex XTX. Now on 2010 Cat Z1 turbo. The Apexs were great sleds once set up, motor is an anvil in those Yammis, just don't break. But still rode heavyish. Z1 I have now, rides much lighter than it is, feels to pull harder than my Apex XTX it replaced, and the Suzuki motor is reputed to be about bulletproof. I'd be hard pressed to ever buy a 2s again. For trail riding, reliability, you just can't beat a reputable 4s in a good chassis.
Bought a 2010 Polaris dragon 750 turbo 4 stroke, really fast up to 85, you'll definitely get embarrassed on the lake by a lot of 25-30 yr. Old two strokes. Be a lot less sore riding the 4 strokes though and putting 10,000 plus miles on without a rebuild is nice too.
Went to a 4 stroke in 2003 when Yamaha came out with the RX1, NO CHANCE of ever going back!! 12 Nytro, 06 Apex, 07 Phazer!! Heavy? Maybe alittle bit but everthing else about them outways the weight for trail riding!!
Exactly, weight might be a big issue in the mountains but on the trail... Why not ride a trail sled that doesn't need oil dumped into it every hundred miles???
Where do you ride man? I ride Ozaukee trails but go up north constantly. The mountain, suring, Townsend area is also great. Would love to ride with ya sometime. Got 1500mi in already
My 94 ZR 580 does surprisingly well for being just a 580 with a 121 track. I do mostly lake riding because the edges of the lake build of with 3-4ft deep snow. Only on my second year of riding so I'm not sure if thats considered deep for a 121 track. Not sure if I'll ever get rid of it.
Ah yes, i miss my ole 94 580zr. Still have my 74 Eltigre, had a 84 el tigre 6000 and then that 94 ZR 580. That ZR sled design absolutely dominated the Snocross races when it came out. Everyone else had to change up quick to catch up. Funny that all the sleds were trailing arm suspensions except Arctic cat (Yamaha had those goofy telescopic front end suspensions) and now they all use the same basic version that Cat brought to snomobiling. It was a good sled for me but I did replace the clutch cuz I waited too long to get it serviced so you may want to watch that.
I ride deep powder/mountains 100% of the time with my FX Nytro MTX, but I've done some work to make better suited to mountain riding. Narrowed a-arm from Mountain Tech, 162 track with 2.5" lugs, steering relocate, turbo, etc. It works great. Of course it's not as light as the 2 stroke mountain sleds but it gets everywhere my buddies on 2 stokes get to and with ~180hp it does it very quickly. I also have much longer range and the benefit of zero concerns about major engine failure. Point being, the setup of the entire sled plays a much bigger role in how the sled performs for different types of riding than 2 stroke vs 4 stroke. It's just that most 4 strokes are setup to be on the comfort/touring/trail side of the market since the average mountain rider is replacing their sled ever 2 or 3 years and wants the absolute best performance and is willing to give up longevity for it.
I own a 2018 ski doo tundra and a 2019 renegade sport with the 600 ace 4stroke motor. I'll never buy another 2 stroke snowmobile ever again. My son's 2020 zr 200 is even a 4 stroke.
I like my skidoo 600etec it's just like a 4stroke it's quite and easy on gas. I ride with 2 guys one with a yamaha 4 stroke the other with a cat 4 stroke. We did a 165 mile ride they had to fill up. I made it on one tank of gas. The cat used 2 tanks of gas. I could go 200 miles on a tank easy
4 strokes for trail riding until the ev model comes out. 2 strokes for off trail riding. A 4 stoke can not tip over or you will leak oil into the motor. 2 stroke sleds can tip over or roll over and no issues for the machine. Living in the mtns of Idaho I need a trail sled and a mountain sled. You got your moneys worth with the hair cut.
I had a mishapp this year with my xf1100 and rolled it onto its top in a ditch while turning around (was a bit embarrassing). I rolled in back over and let it sit for about 5 minutes to let the fluids settle, fired back up and rode the 40 miles back to the truck without issue. The majority of the engine oil isn't actually in the bottom of the motor so I'm not sure this should be a major concern.
Convert the 4 joke stroke into a dry sump and run oil injection from it. Fill up with amsoil interceptor. I run amsoil interceptor in a 4 joke crankcase many times in a mower, then have a way to pull it off and mix at 40:1 it works great. I like my 2 strokes and rotaies as they do not need any oil changes and run either XD-100 or amsoil interceptor. I even fill and run 5 gallons of XD-100 in my silver 8v92 detroit diesel 2 stroke turbo. I bleed some off and with a blending valve that goes to the fuel inlet line and presto total loss 2 stroke oil burnoff!
The extra torque is great in powder. I used to be a 2 stroke guy but now everything I got is 4 stroke except for a 92 xcr and a blown 06 renegade powertek. A couple of old outbards too I guess.....little ones.
I ride with my "antennae" all the time. 360 from the head is sweet. Now try posting 360 to RUclips. I have a few on my channel. Just learning to post them in 360 over reframing in post production. BTW, I have ridden Yamaha fourstrokes since 2006 Currently on an Apex XTX. Love four stroke and will never go back.
You better make sure you don't hit one of those tree stands. Man where do you ride? Can you imagine taking a quad down that trail wearing a fur coat during deer season.
I also ride in Wisconsin and it’s the perfect place for 4 strokes. What’s more silly are the guys running paddle tracked mountain sled down the groomed trails of northern Wisconsin.
Ha ha right, that's sort of why I made this video. I get so much crap about my "heavy sled" but that's the thing, it just doesn't matter here. It's a trail sled and Im rarely able to leave the trail so why should I care??? At least I don't have to carry and fill oil!
I see the same nonsense in MN. Went to Hinckley a few weeks ago and seen a guy with a deep paddle Alpha One... WTF??? They're all over like that on the weekends.
I see that all the time.
I’ve put 10k miles on my 2011 600Ace and I can honestly say for long distance trail riding the 4 stroke is the only snowmobile I’ll own again. Very peaceful experience.
Slow af
50 horsepower
@@shrekwtb9529 60 but my first snowmobile had 22hp and I had a blast so that’s all that matters
@@ML-lg4ky hey that’s all that matters as long as you don’t end up in the trees
6900 on my 2020 600ace. Not to mention, not buying oil and better fuel economy means I can actually afford to put 3k on in a season.
Went from a 600 2-stroke to a 9000 and don’t regret it at all! You wouldn’t be disappointed if you upgraded. I’m a trail rider 90% of the time and don’t mind throwing it into some deep stuff too and have never had an issue. I’m not hitting the mountains with it any time soon but a little off trail is always fun haha.
Same thing was said about outboard 4strokes on boats.... and it took about 15 years but now they are absolutely taking over with equal or better power, much better fuel economy and the weight has been reduced to the point its a non-factor. Seems snowmobiles are just a bit behind but they are working there way to the same point.
Very true!!! Looking forward to the day we can expect the same out of 4 stroke sleds and dual sport motorcycles.
I have a 17 sidewinder mtx and all we do is technical riding and it's the most fun sled ever I think. Greatest sled in the world
My wife and I both have 4 strokes 2016 Skidoo 900 ace and 1200 4tec. Love the low maintenance and specially the 87 regular gas at the pump. I came off a 800 switchback, too much unused power for my needs. Also the 900 has 15000 miles and the 1200 just rolled 11000 last weekend. They spend alot of time pinned on the bar so there not driven easy! Very dependable!
That's awesome! I think mines got 10k on it now and 0 motor issues so far!
Xf1100 owner and have been very happy with its performance. I think a person just needs to be really honest with what they will actually use their seld for when considering what to get. For me in west central wi, I'm a flat land trail rider and really wanted reliabilty and comfort which this machine has given me. The power is very comparable to a 600 class 2 stroke. I think a 2 stroke might have an advantage at the top end, but I rarely ever get to that point, so I don't mind. It's a wonderful thing for us to have so many choices! Everyone can find the model that fits what they want!
Front. I think you nailed it. Same thing I tell everybody all the time. If it gets you on the trail, its a good machine!!
Indeed!
I liked the front bumper mount setup.
Nothing wrong with 4 strokes. For most people out poking around on the trails, which are most people, it's probably the optimum setup. When you get into off-trail, 2 stroke tends to be the way to go. I'm interested in seeing what the ev segment will bring. There's a company called Taiga motors up in Canada making some impressive claims about their sleds for power, range and weight. And ev instant power is pretty hard to beat. Can it really work in a cold environment is another story. It's something I'm watching though.
Thanks for the content Swanky! Left 2 strokes 7 years ago and will never go back. Love the torque, quiet, and smooth motor. Picked up the 22 ski doo 900 ace turbo R x and it is great!
850 is way more fun In The trails I have both the 900 is faster but the 850 is way more playful
Thanks! Nice I'd like to try one of those!
@@SwankyCatProductions I am from Abbotsford so we should link up and ride sometime. I was over near Athens yesterday and the trails we pretty nice
@@SwankyCatProductions if you want quite and fast as hell get a 4 stroke turbo. if you want loud and be stupid fast corner to corner and hit jumps and stuff get a 2 stroke really just riding preference though
I had all 2 strokes and rebuilt them all the time. Then my last sled wast a 09 renegade 600 etec, still had lots of fixing. Bought my 15 Viper xtx new and it's been the most reliable thing I've owned so far. 7000km ish and been awsome, it is heavier, it's definitely faster than my 600 so I'm pretty happy with the 4 stroke. I don't get out too much so I need it not to break down when I get to go.
Yeah I definitely get that 2 strokes are "easy" to rebuild but personally I'd rather ride a sled than work on it! Haha.
one thing i love about 2 strokes is just simply the way they sound!
A cummins 873 CID OP 2 stroke!
Yeah they definitely do have a sound that's hard to beat!
@@SwankyCatProductions I crank up my 8v92 2 stroke detroit and love the rumble. Buying a few gallons of BRP XD-100 etec oil to top it off is something. it was on sale at walmart. My mower and rotary are on amsoil interceptor. .
2 stroke diesel supercharged and turbocharged. Orgasmic sound.
I'm a 4 stroke guy for the simple fact I'm not interested in rebuilding my engine every two years. With that said, Ride Whatever, just enjoy the ride.
First thing I think is often misunderstood or is quick vs fast. Sure, many two strokes are quick off the line but my 4 strokes can go fast, really fast. The fastest production sleds are 4 strokes. Look up SRX and Thundercat on Snowtracks channel.
My new Yamacat Sidewinder X TX LE 146 is a beast. Turbo is key. Horsepower and torque or amazing with arm stretching pull. With the torque the weight of the sled isn't an issue on Adirondack trails and on the lakes the weight ads stability in the triple digits. 🏁
hey! i'm an off trail rider mostly ditch banging and swamp bashing and i'm a light guy, 145pounds. The weight really does matter to me to pull a machine around weighing as little as I do!
@@sylfixplayz2142 I'm 145 and have no issue riding my buddies sidewinder mtx for the day you notice the weight but with 285hp just stab the gas and the weight goes away. Even when it was stock. The biggest thing is letting the sled do the work for you don't try and man handle it. If you do any sled will have you exhausted half way through the day.
Yeah but you absolutely never need to rebuild engine on 2 strokes every 2 years i have sleds that is 50 years old and still runs really good and it was never rebuilt.
Sorry Brian I read this but apparently never responded. Glad to hear your enjoying you sled, I'm jealous!
@@skoterstugan5714 I'll bet heavy it isn't a 800 doo
Got a 2 stroke Lynx ST 600, what a durable mashin that is!
Ok, I bought a Nytro XTX at end of last season. Buzzed for 15 minutes this morning and am going out tomorrow for first REAL ride. A) it is heavy B) it has so much torque, it is scary. Does not feather like a two stroke (it has clutch kit) so that will be the hardest thing to get used to. I am NOT sorry I went to 4 stroke. I will report after tomorrow’s ride on my true first experience and rating. Keep on posting. Good stuff!
I ride a 900 turbo and don’t plan on going back to a 2 stroke. It really fits my style of riding. I get great acceleration and top speed does not interest me. But it goes plenty fast!
Thanks for your videos. They helped me pick a sled for what I want to do. I ride in northern WI, everything was new to me. I’m happy with our choice.
Interesting invisible selfie stick! Makes for some cool shots!
I haven't had a snowmobile in about 10 years and it used to be a 97 MXZ 440 fan. Just this last May, I scored a 2015 Sr Viper XTX with 524 km. I predominantly ride trail but like wandering off trail every now and then. To say the four stroke is an upgrade for me is an understatement. Yeah it's heavy but if I predominantly ride trail it's not at all an issue. In fact, it's a bit of an asset as the machine tends to cling to the trail a little better than some lighter sleds.
That's awesome! I'm jealous, really always wanted one of those. Glad to hear your enjoying it and totally agree the weight can be an asset on the trails.
I bought a 2006 Cat T660 Turbo Touring a couple years ago as my first 4-stroke sled. Loved it and still have it as a spare. SOOO quiet and stink free, 20mpg easy all day long was a nice bonus.
Last year I bought a couple 2010 Phazer 500 4-strokes for something a bit lighter than the big Cat to play around with. After a bit of suspension tuning and some Curve XS skis I got them to handle great finally. They've been super reliable too. Best sleds I've had so far! No stink and 16-20mpg on the trails. I actually get nauseous after awhile if I have to follow a 2-smoker on the trails, even the new ones. They burn very little oil compared to the older ones but I can still smell the exhaust just the same. I'll never go back to a 2-stroke.
Nice! Yeah I miss the smell sometimes but it is nice to have clothes that just smell like outside when your done haha.
I currently ride a 2016 ZR 8000 Limited 137 and I had the opportunity to ride a New ZR 9000 137" with the Yamaha 998 cc triple turbo. I can tell you from back to back comparison of that turbo and my 800 stroke the weight difference wasn't that dramatic. What was dramatically different however, was the power, holy crap does that Turbo pull hard!! I'm having a hard time picking between the new Cat/ Yamaha Turbo and a new Polaris Matryx 850. All I can say is you won't be disappointed in the Turbo 4 stroke if you look at the 2017 - 2022. :-)
P.S. Might I suggest putting a set of C&A Pro XPT ski's with a set of at least 7.5" shaper carbids on your F1100. It will be night and day different over them stock ski's with dual carbides!
Came off a 13 f8 with good intentions to update but prices went sky high so I bought a 11 z1 1100 with 300 miles on it for a filler sled till I bought new a new 2 stroke I’m super impressed with it and still riding! I agree on the turbo thinking have a good one Ben
Great video had a 2010 ski doo 600HO grand touring 2 stroke and I always coughed after my rides and smell of oil ,
got a 2017 1200 grand touring SE 4 stroke problem solved and this sled is super fast I always ride trails .
( Please stay on the trails we are loosing too many trails )
Yeah I don't miss the smell either lol. Agreed about staying on the trails but we can ride ditches in my area.
Rode 2 strokes all my life.....my wife and I made the switch from 600 two strokes to SkiDoo MXZs with 900ace 4 stroke in 2017.11,000+ miles and could not be happier.For groomed trail riding we give those engines 10 out of 10
I rode a 2013 Renegade X 1200 for 8 seasons and 12k miles. I did love that sled but last year I went back to a 2 stroke short track (129). I bought a 2019 MXZ XRS 600r. The weight difference is unbelievable. And that is what I sick of with the 4 stroke , the heavy front end. The 4 stroke was great but the lighter 2 stroke is way better in my opinion.
The only the the weight bothers me is when I have to drag it around... Then it's definitely annoying lol
Thanks for the Phazer shout out. I love my 2016 Phazer. It is so much fun.
They certainly are!
We have a Polaris that we keep now as a "backup" sled as the kids are out of the house now. It is VERY reliable, always starts and runs fine. Just gotta keep coolant in it.
That must be the 750?
I picked up a 2013 F1100 Turbo RR beginning of 2020/21 season. Have ridden ZR 700s and 800s for years before this beast. It also has a Speedwerx tune and 240hp on 91 octane. Power is insane and feels awesome on trail. Ditch bangin is not so much fun with it. The front end weight and insane torque makes it hard to lighten up the front for driveway approach or big moguls. Central MN trails, fields, lakes are sooo much fun. But you are right, 2-stroke to 4-stroke is like apples to oranges. They both have their high-points and low points. Will have to get my old ZR700 ut and jump back and forth to get a better comparison. Ride safe.
Nice! I'll bet that much power is insane lol. I need to get myself one...
I've ridden a Nytro since 2008. 4 stroke trple 1049 (CTEK4 in the Cat version). Definitely torquey fun and very responsive to the throttle. Some of that might be gearing but I think Yamaha was sneaky and under-represented the horsepower. If it claims 130, I'd say 135 or approaching 140. Also, the gas delivery is not through the long throttle body of the 1100 cat and that is the reason for the crazy instant throttle -don't sneeze while you're riding. Never mind the ski doo 4 stroke, that puppy had a big rep for throttle lag. Anyways, 14,000 miles -oil changes only. Easy on the Yamaha clutch -never serviced yet. And finally, very good gas mileage for a high performance motor (I always use less than my 2 stroke ski doo riders).
Started watching you because of my XF9000 137, good sled and super fast in a straight line but too heavy, I'm 175 6'1" and it was hard for me to muscle around. I now have 600 miles on my 22 renegade 850 and freaking love it, Rides like a Cadillac and the acceleration and nimbleness is what I needed for my 95.67% MI trail riding. Keep up the vids!
That's awesome, I'd really like to get on one of those too!
After coming off an old 2 stroke Polaris, I own a pair of 900 ACE sleds. I ride trails exclusively and its nice to be able to go nearly 200 miles on 87 octane without worrying about running out of fuel. The serenity and the reliability of the 4 stroke is nice and Ive hit 87mph routinely on the lakes, which is plenty fast enough for me. That learning key was really helpful for the kids when they were starting out too. I have no problem with the modern 2 strokes that don't have you stinking like a landscaper at the end of the day, but all in all I'm glad I made the choice.
Glad to hear your happy with yours!
My wife and I made the leap from 600 2 stroke to a pair of MXZs with the 900ACE.Couldn’t be happier
Went from 2 stroke to 4stroke now im hooked on the 4 stroke for trail riding cant be beat!!! now own a Z! 1100 turbo Artic Cat 225Hp no shortage of power LOL :-)
That's awesome! I need one with that much power!
I had the 1100 before that one, the 2010. A lot of people say the sled improved but my 2010 year was epic for trail riding.
I bought a 2015 assault and the build quality was low but the machine was cool. I found it very wobbly in trail riding.
I think the 4 stroke cruiser is the way to go for us old guys.
I think the new 2 stroke engines are made to such high quality but emissions has cut the oil to nothing.
I would Beth these new 2 strokes would last 30000k if you could re-map it to use more oil and run a touch more rich
But for me
4 stroke quiet. The Suzuki twin or the Yamahas that exhaust out back are the most quiet for us older fellows
However I think that the new Polaris are the absolute most cool looking machine ever made
I see why the resale is so high
They just look so good
I have a 2014 pro rmk and I’ve like it better then my dads assault. I even use it on the trail too. Mainly to get to the powder. But getting a 4 stroke unstuck sucks. The extra weight makes a big difference, just depends what you like better. Snappy, Lightness and off trail use, or smooth trail riding with some insane top speed.
I have a 2012 F1100 and a 2015 ZR8000.... my girl has a the 4 stroke (heated seat makes them happy)... and yeah, I prefer the two stroke. You can carbide it up and whatnot but the weight is there, but most importantly, at least for me, is the slower throttle response. It makes it less fun. With the two stroke, the response is so fast, and with less weight, I can blip the throttle on uneven trails, and that keeps the front of the sled from going down into valleys.... so it's more comfortable/smoother, as you can use the throttle on/off to even out bumpy terrible trails. The 4 stroke is still a great sled.... it's just not as fun, and not as comfortable. Try riding one back to back and report back.
I like the torque of the 4 stroke... and never adding oil is cool.... and I beat every 600 I ever raced... but.. it just wasn't as FUN, and I want to have FUN when I ride. Zuke 800 is the coolest engine you can get in this chassis imho; not very refined but super fun, only reason it was stopped was emissions.
I've actually got a 2 stroke I'm testing out right now and I definitely agree, they are fun. Especially how punchy the throttle is and how light the engine feels when it's reving. Best to just have both! Haha.
I hear the boosted 4 strokes are a whole nother level, but I'd only really be into that if I lived near a lot of lakes.
I keep going back and forth on getting a modern 4 stroke sled, my current sled is a 03 ZR900 APV with some performance mods, its 100% adrenaline rush every time I ride it, but MPG sucks and its getting hard on the body for long trail rides. Might just have to own both 2 and 4 stroke sleds. Thanks for the video.
4 stroke or not the new ones are soooo much more comfy!
I just sold my two Yamaha Nytro’s. Yes they are full of torque but I could never get my suspension properly adjusted. Had them for 5 years but ended up buying an AC Xf 1100, and wow 🤩 what an improvement in ride 👌. However the motor in the AC sounds and feels a little gutless compared to the arm ripping acceleration of the Yammis. All in all I’m very happy with my switch to the kitty cat 😃🍻🍻🍻
Glad to hear that! I really like the procross chassis, good ride and very comfy!
@@SwankyCatProductions The ride/comfort of the Procross sleds are really awesome. I actually really like going off trail with that 141 track. Not a mountain sled but definitely great back country sled for out here in Manitoba. Cheers 🍻 buddy and keep up the great videos👍
I used a 2013 F1100 Turbo for 2 years and that sled was a pain when I had to move it by hand in the snow. Going to a 2015 Polaris 800, shaving ~200lbs makes a huge difference. However, I do miss the high-end speed, smooth-running engine, and better fuel economy.
Yeah I definitely don't enjoy lugging mine around that's for sure lol.
Someone will always have a faster sled than you, no matter what you get. As you said buy a sled for your riding style. I use mine for 90% ice fishing and the rest is some trail and ditch banging. I don't care that it's not a 120mph trail sled that can boondock...that's fun and I was a teenager once, but not what I'm after now Also, the reliability factor of a 4-stroke is the biggest upside 👍
I just bought a two stroke 2000 Polaris 500 xc
Basically just for ice fishing and ripping down farm fields you’d say a 4 strokes better for that application?
No, I should have specified..my sled is a 01 Polaris Classic touring 600... Just saying that you buy what's in the budget and fits your needs. And it's not always a mountain sled
@@michaelpolitz9581 I don’t know much about sleds it’s my first and I just got it and rode it twice hopefully it will be good on the lake
@@IAmScottyE Im sure it will. Especially with the fan motor. Perfect on the ice and easy and cheap to work on 👍
I went from a ski doo 800r to a tuned 900 ace turbo and I’ll never go back you can’t beat that 200hp pull
We have a sidewinder 998 four stroke do distance trails and is comfortable smooth and reliable… had a two stroke oil cost alone adds up significantly over the course of a 2000 mile year 6800 on our sidewinder and so far two oil changes and just add gas but it all depends what type of riding you do I think there is a use for both
Went from an F7 to a 14 XF9000 with a 260 hp tune
Can’t say I miss the F7 ! For a trail sled the weight does not matter, anyone who makes a big deal about it clearly has not ridden one.
Buddies got the 8000 2 stroke sleds and they don’t compare. They are fun too but on the tail they handle 95% the same but lighter steering feel but the 9000 feels more planted with less ski lift so it’s up to you.
But out the flipper to the gripper and the Turbo makes you giggle
Yeah I think your right, and I think half the time it's kids that don't actually have a sled yet lol.
Rode 2 strokes most my life. Picked up a 2013 xf1100 turbo a couple years back now and it has some pros and cons for sure. I do like 70 trail 30 off. Mainly ride in the northern Wisconsin or UP area. I found after a long day of trail riding the extra weight really made a difference. Normally would do 200 miles a day if trail riding. So it was definitely nice not buying all that oil. And when taking it off trail it’s very hard to get it on one ski to carve. Even with the crossover version of the sled. 141” track I believe. When I got stuck as well if I was alone not sure if I’d be able to get the sled out by myself. I now ride a 2018 Polaris pro-s switchback and find its a lot better on and off trail with weight being the biggest thing for me. I’m thinking about getting a T-Cat in the coming years now that it has power steering on them. Seems like a cool thing to have. Would still need a off trail sled though as that would be trail on sled.
"If it starts and runs...that's a good sled". --- Agreed!
I started on a Yamaha phazer 500 to an apex 1000 which has 160 ish horse power and keep in mind I’m 13 and I can’t handle that much power so now I’m on a Polaris XC 500 but hoping to switch to a Polaris XC 600 and for only having a 500 two stroke love it more then my other 4 strokes
I’m in Ontario and I ride 2014 Polaris pro rmk 800. Cut my lugs down to 2-1/4” and w/155 track. It’s super light and amazing in the powder and slush if it comes up. Where is struggles though is top speed and because of the narrow ski stance I have to lean more in the corners on the trail to get to the powder. There is always pros and cons.
That being said if I where to upgrade I thing “my” perfect sled would be a khaos or SKS with wider stance and adjustable shocks, 155 w/ 2.4” lugs. Or the new maytrx assault with wider skis and 2” lug 146” track.
I have a AC T660 touring. Definitely love the 4 stroke. Quiet and you don't smell like 2 stroke oil at the end of the day. I get about 16mpg or so with mine but it's geared down compared to the regular trail version.
Nice! I think mine gets about 15mpg and while I enjoy the 2 stroke smell once in a while, it's nice not to have it all the time haha.
I went from a Zr 1010 to a F1100 turbo with big tunes about 8 years ago and I really miss the feel of the two stroke snappiness.
Yeah there is something about them!
Had a 2000 yamaha srx 700 triple 2-stroke. It was snappy as hell and scary fast. Now I have a 21 rs venture, 1049cc 4-stroke. It is great, quick, reliable and quiet. Only maintenance needed is oil changes and carbides. Nothing against 2-strokes theyre fun but for long term reliability and trail riding ill only ever own a 4-stroke snowmobile. People underestimate mid range torque on 4 strokes as well, theyre very powerful in their own way.
Agreed, I think most people who are "2 smoke for life" and hate 4 strokes just haven't ridden a good one.
I have been watching some of your videos and you really do a good job on reporting on what you like...dont like or just an honest review.
I have always had 2 strokes and sold the last two a 1.5 years ago and they were a 2015 xf8000 sno pro and the wife's was a 2014 el tigre 6000 and really liked both....next weekend we are picking up a package deal and they are a 2015 xf9000 sno pro limited 137" with the turbo and a 2015 yamaha r tx dx 129" and hoping they will be a good choice.
I read all the comments and replies on this video and its alot like republican or democrat...or dodge, chevy or ford...everyone will always like something different and that's what makes the world go around.
I'm from Minnesota and will try and give a little feedback when we get them home and can swing a leg over them and put on some miles, we ride trails around Duluth and up north and should be good with these choices.
Thanks again for your common sense videos and offering useful information from them!
Subscribed....
Thanks Bryan! Yep spot on, very few people who don't take a hard line one way or the other. Just got back from a ride (in the dirt lol) in my 4 stroke and was pretty happy to not worry about the sled getting to warm. Also really just enjoyed the sled! Definitely let me know what you think of yours!
For the average rider there is 0 issue running a 4 stroke with today's technology. The only place I'd say it's beneficial to run a smoker is in the mountains or when your worried about not starting in -40 nights at the camp otherwise it's almost always better running a 4 stroke.
Very true!
I switched in 2011 from 800cc 2 stroke to an 2012 XF 1100 turbo. Boosted it before I even rode it. 220 HP on that one. Snow checked a 2016 ZR 9000 limited with the 137" track. Boosted it and got the 3" intimidator exhaust by turbo Dynamics. And a bunch of other goodies. I still have it with 6, 390 MI. It's over 300 horsepower and I put a 2 in track on it. It's the most amazing sled ever. It has anti-lag for starts and will rip your arms off!! I will never buy another two-stroke.
Ugh... I need one of those lol
I have moved to an XF 1100 Turbo after owning and racing too many 600cc two strokes than I can count. I like the effortless, calm and quiet power of the turbo 4 stroke, but I definitely miss the lightness of my 2 strokes. I've had to put a lot of effort into getting the 4 stroke to be able to turn, and it was a big learning curve to not be able to use the throttle as an on/off switch like I could on the 600cc 2 strokes. Overall, I feel like I will never sell XF 1100 Turbo for use as a back up sled and for long rides with lakes, but I will buy another 600cc 2 stroke primary sled for corner to corner tight woods riding which is what I enjoy most.
I ❤ my 900ACE Expedition Sport. It is a heavy mashine but for my needs it's spot on.
Glad to hear that!
I went from a 700 2 stroke, to a yamaha 4 stroke non turbo, and back to a 2 stroke 850. 2 strokes are light, nimble, quick, and just straight up FUN. I love both, but just something about the 2 stroke that just brings me back (and keeps me young I guess). I'm pushin 50 years old now. My next, and probably last new sled will more than likely be a four stroke.
Yeah they definitely both have their own attitudes and it's nice to be able to switch back and forth once in a while. I've actually been testing a 19 ZR6000 which has been a lot of fun!
@@SwankyCatProductions my son has a 17, and he loves it.
4 stroke are ideal for trail riding. I got a new 2022 900 GT and I can put it in eco mode and go nearly double the distance on the same amount of gas then anyone I ride with. And in sport mode it feels identical to the power of a 2 stroke 600 but probably a bit more torque. Also once you flip it over to finger throttle. You can't go back to thumb. Much better grip and control. I know I'll never go back to 2 stroke.
Huh yeah that seems like it would be much better! Sounds like an awesome machine!
I've got a Phazer 500 MTX. I regret it. I mean it runs fine, reliable, starts easy but it's a heavy pig. I've rolled it a few times and needed help to get it back on its skis. One time I rolled it, it puked oil out of the oil reservoir through the breather into the air box. I had to limp it home with low oil. Also the finicky gearbox reverse is no way as good as a two-stroke that can just start the motor backwards.
For a trail sled on groomed trails, sure, but for mountain riding or even ditch-banging where you might end up rolling it? I'd say two-stroke all the way.
Also, and this is more a complaint about the Phazer, but why have a nice big spot on the end of the tunnel to mount extra gas or other equipment and then point the exhaust right at it?
My neighbour had one of those Phazers and every time I would bump into him he would tell me another horror story about. It was constantly in the garage. Odd for a Yamaha as my 08 Yamaha Nytro has been virtually bullet proof since I bought it 13 years ago.
I've got a 2010 ski doo gsx 1200se it's a beast it's heavy I will say it's no slouch. What I like most about my 4 stroke is it doesn't stink like a 2 stroke
Yeah that's definitely a plus!
Thanks for posting so many awesome videos I really enjoy watching them.
Question for you, which type of headlights did you end up purchasing for your sled? I think you mentioned in one of your videos that you switched over to LEDs but I'm wondering what brand and bulb number? I have a 2012 F1100 Sno Pro and I've always wanted to switch it over to LEDs as the stock bulbs are rather dim.
Thanks !
I'm really proud of the way you ride, NO THROTTLE JERKING. 🤣
I gave you a thumbs up and I subscribed !!!
Haha thanks!
Raise the front limiter strap a notch/inch. That will give you a more predictable ride on that model and more bite in the front end. You will have to balance out the ski pressure with steering effort based on your riding.
Good info thank you!
I love my 2014 yamaha nytro mtx 153" xride 140hp feels the best in the deep snow and litle les on the trail
I have a 2 stroke and 4 stroke. (20 RiotX and 15 XF7000) I love the 7000 for trail riding. I will always have a 4 stroke in my fleet. Use my Riot for deeper powder adventures.
Nice, yeah it's definitely good to have both. I've got a ZR6000 I'm testing now which has been cool to try after being on my F1100 for so long.
My wife and I run vipers . We love them . The odd time it would be nice to have a 2 stroke but we are 90% trail riding so it’s much better with the 4 stroke. What are you running for a gps?
I had a xf1100 for two seasons and ended up selling it due to the track length than it not having enough power, I'm from southeast wi and ride in the same areas you do. Bought a renegade 850 in 2019 witch was a amazing sled but 165hp can get outta control pretty easily so I sold that in fall because of the market I got more than I paid for it and picked up a 2022 tnt 600r. Only have 50 mi so far but seems to be the perfect sled for the areas I ride
Yeah I kinda figured that would be the case with the non turbo XF1100. My sled does ok but I think I'd want more power of I had a longer track. Glad you found one you like!
I don’t regret buying a 4-stroke even a little bit.
2-stroke and 4’s are very different and made for different things. We need both and I love both. As far as 4-strokes being slow?
4-strokes are more amicable to modification but are ready made for super chargers or turbochargers.
In fact, the most powerful snowmobile stock engine ever created to date is a 4-stroke.
I went from 2007 2 stroke 1000cc sno pro to a 2017 thundercat, both were fairly heavy sleds but the Tcat handles and is so much more dependable.
The old sno pro had a very comfy ride but required much more maintenance. I work on both but the tcat is much easier to work on and the newer body panels make service simple.
I'm right at 6k miles on the tcat and my 1000 I sold at 7k it was getting pretty worn out. I plan on putting as many miles on the 4 stroke as I can.
Nice! Yeah it seems like the new sleds hold up a lot better than the ones from even a few years ago did. I've got 10k on mine!
I have driven both a 4 stroke and a 2 stroke and I prefer 4 stroke over a 2 stroke because one you can travel further on the trails and the reliability I dont want to keep spending money on repairs so that is why a 4 stroke fits me better
I went from a Rev chassis MXZ 600 to '10 Yamaha Nytro XTX to a '17 Polaris Pro-S. The Polaris handles much better, is lighter, less tiring on long trail rides, and more fun in general. To me the trade off is worth it, and I don't keep my sleds long enough to worry about long term reliability. Next sled will most likely be a 2 stroke as well
I like the those Polaris sled too! If I come across a Switchback I'll probably buy it.
I got a Yamaha rx1000 warrior, can't wait to go riding this winter
Good video would be nice to say where you are riding. Would let people see what trails are like thanks
join a snowmobile club. the trails don't clear themselves and the signs don't put themselves in every fall... STAY ON THE TRAIL OR STAY HOME
I love two strokes but my next sled will be a four stroke cat…been riding since 1972 . First sled was a brand new kitty cat at 6 years old lol. I have a Thundercat and F7 zRT 800 and 2002 Yamaha SRX 700. I’m 56 now I want something quiet and comfortable
Cool. They are definitely both of those things!
4 strokes are the Cadillacs of trail riding period. Extremely planted, confidence inspiring hogs. By nature 2 strokes are lighter more playful sleds. Ridiculous to compare them. In a perfect world I'd own one of every different terrain sled.
Agreed! Neither is best, just better at one thing or another.
It's all about the weight when the trail gets bumpy. For a smooth trail, the 4 stroke is fine but when it gets moguled out, that extra 70-100 lbs is brutal. Power delivery is just different but both have plenty
Yeah I suppose the heavier ones would be a little more difficult to deal with. I think mines relatively close in weight to a 600 2 stroke though.
@@SwankyCatProductions I think it's still 50 plus pounds more, which is a noticeable weight. But you also ride pretty much 100% on trail and your trails are in pretty decent shape, most of the time. Head to say Munising or Minocqua or Eagle River on a weekend and run 40-50 miles on some pounded out trail and you'll be wishing the sled weighed 100 lbs less.
We got rid of our Cat 4 stroke for that very reason. Even the Doo 900 just feels too heavy in the front IMO compared to a 600 or 850.
Absolutely not !!!!best reason..no 2 stroke smell on your outfit when day is done...
True! No oil to carry or worry about either!
"U ain't snowmobilin' unless you smell like gas!" Hahaha
Thought the arctic cat 660 turbo pulled ok.... heavy? Yes. But smooth....1100 turbo hits..... I love 2 stroke power. But sometimes enjoy the peace and sneakability of a 4 stroke
I like camera on the front bumper looking back.
Thanks! That's my favorite too!
I have a 4 stroke Mountain sled. Yamaha Sidewinder MTX-50 Anniversary flashed to 300hp. It’s plenty capable. And arm stretching fast.
That's awesome! I'd like to get on one of those some day!
@@SwankyCatProductions Incredible. A little too heavier than a 2st. And yes even with some light parts 80 lbs heavier. So tree busting takes more effort. But at altitude where you need hp especially to set the track when sidehilling and countersteering, I still have 300hp. The 2st’s drop from 170 to 130.
Somewhat of an off topic question.... the trails you ride, are they all one way trails? They look narrow, with lots of blind turns, and kind of look scary if there was two way traffic.
Yeah they are two way and definitely dangerous. The camera makes them look much worse and like I'm riding way to fast to be able to see but that's just the wide angle lens.
I ride a 2012 F1100 turbo with a turbo dynamics programmable tune, exhaust and some other stuff and it's is crazy fast. It would be interesting to get your take on it compared to your sled.
Have same sled and an f800. Same year. Turbo is too heavy if u get stuck. Put a 136 on my f800. Fukin love it. I do mostly trail with ditch banging. Maine and NH trails
@@chucknorris277 Yeah you don't want to get this big girl stuck. My reverse went out on one of my trips and that was enough of a work out for me! I've had 2 strokes my whole life so it was big change going to the 4 stroke. I love the power but I can't ride it as hard in the trails like the lighter 2 strokes.
I've owned both, from Indy 440s, Indy 400, to Polaris XLT, two 97 700 Vmaxs, 98, 2000 SRXs, 07 Apex, 12 Apex XTX. Now on 2010 Cat Z1 turbo. The Apexs were great sleds once set up, motor is an anvil in those Yammis, just don't break. But still rode heavyish. Z1 I have now, rides much lighter than it is, feels to pull harder than my Apex XTX it replaced, and the Suzuki motor is reputed to be about bulletproof. I'd be hard pressed to ever buy a 2s again. For trail riding, reliability, you just can't beat a reputable 4s in a good chassis.
And as far as weight, if I'm just trail riding, I could care less about the weight of a 4s...I'm not carrying it...
Very true! Weight only stinks if you get stuck but is actually kind of nice on the trail since it helps keep you planted!
Bought a 2010 Polaris dragon 750 turbo 4 stroke, really fast up to 85, you'll definitely get embarrassed on the lake by a lot of 25-30 yr. Old two strokes. Be a lot less sore riding the 4 strokes though and putting 10,000 plus miles on without a rebuild is nice too.
Yeah they aren't perfect but the comfort and reliability is awesome!
Went to a 4 stroke in 2003 when Yamaha came out with the RX1, NO CHANCE of ever going back!!
12 Nytro, 06 Apex, 07 Phazer!! Heavy? Maybe alittle bit but everthing else about them outways the weight for trail riding!!
Exactly, weight might be a big issue in the mountains but on the trail... Why not ride a trail sled that doesn't need oil dumped into it every hundred miles???
Considering the RX1s were very early 4 strokes and ended up being pretty junk..... I don't blame ya.
Triple, better reread, still on 4 stroke, put 12000mi on my 03 RX1Ton. Loved it.
Where do you ride man? I ride Ozaukee trails but go up north constantly. The mountain, suring, Townsend area is also great. Would love to ride with ya sometime. Got 1500mi in already
Nice! I don't usually make it that far north. Mainly Lincoln, Langland, Marathon and Shawano.
Stud boy shaper bars are an awesome replacement for duallys
That's what we went with on the ZR!
I got an 06 Yamaha RS Vector 1000 cc four stroke I love the gas mileage
Stx sidewinder gt. We use it for pulling wood all day long.
Nice!
My 2012 XF1100 is the best sled I've ever ridden or owned. Great in all conditions.
Nice, the procross chassis is my favorite so far as well!
My 94 ZR 580 does surprisingly well for being just a 580 with a 121 track. I do mostly lake riding because the edges of the lake build of with 3-4ft deep snow. Only on my second year of riding so I'm not sure if thats considered deep for a 121 track. Not sure if I'll ever get rid of it.
Dang that's a lot of snow! We have about an 8th inch on the lake here lol. My 600 dragon with a 121 track always did surprisingly well too.
Ah yes, i miss my ole 94 580zr. Still have my 74 Eltigre, had a 84 el tigre 6000 and then that 94 ZR 580. That ZR sled design absolutely dominated the Snocross races when it came out. Everyone else had to change up quick to catch up. Funny that all the sleds were trailing arm suspensions except Arctic cat (Yamaha had those goofy telescopic front end suspensions) and now they all use the same basic version that Cat brought to snomobiling. It was a good sled for me but I did replace the clutch cuz I waited too long to get it serviced so you may want to watch that.
If you want a thrilling ride, get a Skidoo 800 ETEC. Just be careful and don't let your guard down or get too confident. Things are crotch rockets.
I ride deep powder/mountains 100% of the time with my FX Nytro MTX, but I've done some work to make better suited to mountain riding. Narrowed a-arm from Mountain Tech, 162 track with 2.5" lugs, steering relocate, turbo, etc.
It works great. Of course it's not as light as the 2 stroke mountain sleds but it gets everywhere my buddies on 2 stokes get to and with ~180hp it does it very quickly. I also have much longer range and the benefit of zero concerns about major engine failure.
Point being, the setup of the entire sled plays a much bigger role in how the sled performs for different types of riding than 2 stroke vs 4 stroke. It's just that most 4 strokes are setup to be on the comfort/touring/trail side of the market since the average mountain rider is replacing their sled ever 2 or 3 years and wants the absolute best performance and is willing to give up longevity for it.
I own a 2018 ski doo tundra and a 2019 renegade sport with the 600 ace 4stroke motor. I'll never buy another 2 stroke snowmobile ever again. My son's 2020 zr 200 is even a 4 stroke.
Nice! I think I'll own another at some point but I definitely want more 4 strokes!
I went from the fastest 800 I’ve ever owned to my 900 ace turbo and I haven’t looked back!
What phone mount are you using? Is it sturdy and reliable?
My local trails wouldn’t be open with that little snow. I would not ride on that. Just wearing stuff out for no reason
No reason??? If I waited for perfect conditions I'd never get to ride. They call em wear parts for a reason. I didn't put them on to look at them!
I like my skidoo 600etec it's just like a 4stroke it's quite and easy on gas. I ride with 2 guys one with a yamaha 4 stroke the other with a cat 4 stroke. We did a 165 mile ride they had to fill up. I made it on one tank of gas. The cat used 2 tanks of gas. I could go 200 miles on a tank easy
Yeah I'm not easy on mine at all but it gets about the same mpg as my full size pick up ha ha
@@SwankyCatProductions yeah lol
4 strokes for trail riding until the ev model comes out. 2 strokes for off trail riding. A 4 stoke can not tip over or you will leak oil into the motor. 2 stroke sleds can tip over or roll over and no issues for the machine. Living in the mtns of Idaho I need a trail sled and a mountain sled. You got your moneys worth with the hair cut.
Agreed. Yeah tipping over is one thing I do worry about a little. I've put mine on its side a few times and scrambled for the kill switch lol.
I had a mishapp this year with my xf1100 and rolled it onto its top in a ditch while turning around (was a bit embarrassing). I rolled in back over and let it sit for about 5 minutes to let the fluids settle, fired back up and rode the 40 miles back to the truck without issue. The majority of the engine oil isn't actually in the bottom of the motor so I'm not sure this should be a major concern.
@@trailbruizer4194 If you tip a 2 stroke over the oil in the external sump can turn upside down and suck air causing the same hassle.
Convert the 4 joke stroke into a dry sump and run oil injection from it. Fill up with amsoil interceptor. I run amsoil interceptor in a 4 joke crankcase many times in a mower, then have a way to pull it off and mix at 40:1 it works great. I like my 2 strokes and rotaies as they do not need any oil changes and run either XD-100 or amsoil interceptor. I even fill and run 5 gallons of XD-100 in my silver 8v92 detroit diesel 2 stroke turbo. I bleed some off and with a blending valve that goes to the fuel inlet line and presto total loss 2 stroke oil burnoff!
The extra torque is great in powder. I used to be a 2 stroke guy but now everything I got is 4 stroke except for a 92 xcr and a blown 06 renegade powertek. A couple of old outbards too I guess.....little ones.
I ride with my "antennae" all the time. 360 from the head is sweet. Now try posting 360 to RUclips. I have a few on my channel. Just learning to post them in 360 over reframing in post production. BTW, I have ridden Yamaha fourstrokes since 2006 Currently on an Apex XTX. Love four stroke and will never go back.
Nice, yeah the over head shot is cool! I can see why, they make for a nice ride!
You better make sure you don't hit one of those tree stands. Man where do you ride? Can you imagine taking a quad down that trail wearing a fur coat during deer season.