In case any one is wondering it is possible to compress water in real life but to get 10 tons per cubic meter would require pressures that you see in the center of the sun! So super compressor indeed!
Actually Cody I think you may be a bit off on that number. The center of the sun may be about the density of lead but it is also hot. If you put cold water under those pressures it would compress a lot more since it doesn't have the thermal energy puffing it out. Water would certainly heat up as it is compressed for the same reason that gasses do (unfortunately the game doesn't model this) and the fact that it wouldn't compress linearly so it is hard to calculate what the compression would be at 3.4 × 10^11 atm (pressure at center of sun) but I think 100Kg/m^3 might be a closer guess.
4:56 i must commend you for what looks like the most scientific and useful experimental setup i think i've seen so far. this tests each variable that even might have an effect, and it doesn't look too bad either.
every time you pull up the spreadsheet it gets more Copy ofs: Copy of Copy of Copy of Copy of Copy of Copy of Copy of Copy of Copy of Copy of Oxygen not Included!
On your + shaped experiment, this is effectively a corner airlock and those only seem to work down and to the right. So the left chamber, which is down and to the left, can get the gases from the top chamber, which means it might not actually evaporate to the left.
That is correct. Sublimation only occurs in tiles above polluted water. The game code has no check in any other direction. Remove the top tile to form a T instead of a +, and there would be no sublimation happening.
It is possible that it was random noise. The bubbles happen very rarely on individual tiles, so maybe 10 cycles was not enough time to get a decent sample size. According to the wiki, a tile of polluted water has a 0.1% chance to emit 0.1% of its mass 4 times a second. However, when a base gets big or time goes faster, the physics of this game can change slightly. I've noticed in one of my experiments that when I increased the speed of the game from 1 to 3, my liquid cooled aquatuners settled about 3 degrees hotter. They decreased temperature when I reduced speed. However, over massive time scales, this should not effect a settled system too much. The amount of polluted water can be modeled as exponential decay with a linear addition rate. The amount of polluted oxygen created per second in a system in equalibrium should be equal to the amount of polluted water created in your base per unit time. Though it is possible that the speed of the game can effect the decay rate, it will not effect the total amount of polluted oxygen created. I should note that my time observations were made before the automation update and may not hold anymore.
+Rubellite Fae That may be how you think of it intuitively, but it is not how the game operates. In many cases, it can appear that way because most things in the game have automatic pressure shutoff, where the local pressure disables creation of a gas (like oxylite, bleach stone, vents, deoxidizers, electrolyzers, etc). If the game actually tries to add polluted oxygen and there is a polluted oxygen tile in the immediate vicinity, it will add the masses.
In the "vent test", you're trapping polluted oxygen in the bottom 4 gas permeable tiles since they are surrounded by water on all sides. If you delete the tiles while paused, you might be able to tally this as well.
I love your vids. THIS IS HUGE TECH! I immediately implemented the third , grid based model into my base of 10 and found that with 12-15 liquid vents Evaporation takes care of all the polluted water from my 3 NatGas generators. Brilliant! A subtle thing but quite valuable to me and my dupes!
I have a challenge idea, a colony where after a startup period every colonist can only be assigned to a single role in the job chart which cannot be changed. You'd probably have to begin the challenge with extra dupes just so you have enough people to be able to do almost everything you need to get started. How long is it worth having an artist dupe, and what happens to the research dupe when the research is done?
In order to maximize surface area, what about a sandwich of mesh and gas tiles? I'm not sure about the feasibility due to gas volume/flooding of the pot, but use wheezewortto precool and compress the polluted oxygen before feeding it into an oxygen liquification system for base cooling/lossless clean oxygen generation.
I wonder how high the production rate of the compressor setup is after it ramped up for 10 cycles. As you can produce polluted water within the base and pump it from everywhere else the pressure would constantly grow while with the other setups to increase production you will need to use more space. The additional downside of using the floor based system is that you will need deodorizers everywhere instead of in one place.
Actually, if you condense polluted oxygen into liquid with a Anti Entropy Thermo-Nullifier, it will become pure liquid oxygen without having to use any sand
Did you test for depth? If you have 10 tiles deep of polluted water, does it take all the water into account when generating polluted oxygen, or only the exposed tiles? i.e., would we have to spread out the water to maximize surface area, or could we just put air-pumps over the random pools without bothering to alter them? Also... what about dripping the water? If you had a little waterfall of polluted water, would it generate polluted oxygen faster?
Dunno if morb behavior was changed, but if not, You could put them in polluted water, since they produce more P. oxygen when in liquid. This would increase the production and it's not even hard to produce infinite number of morbs...
Regarding the compressor system - what do you think will happen if the number of bacteria (an integer value) exceeds the maximum integer value on a 64-bit computer?
I may be wrong, but in the checkered setup with the 9 liquid vents, the bottom tiles are only evaporating in the tile above it, as the tiles on the side are air-locked by liquid on both sides and top? Wouldn't it be more efficient to have a solid line of airflow tiles separating each row to allow better ventilation of tiles on bottom?
They really need to add a way to control direction of free flowing gas. Like big industrial fan or something. Make it so much easier to control heating and cooling if you could control gas direction in a open space.
I was thinking the same think, like the Air Tiles but a one way Air Tile (like the valves in the Heart and Blood vessels, pretty much a Check Valve). If for balance reasons make it a powered item.
In the floor model, could you do like a battery and make layers of gas titles, connected on one side to give an exit path? drop in liquid on right, air wall on left. no need for mesh.
Brothgar wish I had the game to give you a blue print.... like the checked board but layers. Liquid tank: left wall gas perm, bottom layer 0 - water, layer 1 - gas perm, 2 water, 3 gas. Not sure if the checkered board it letting gas from the bottom to the top. PS: thank you for taking the time to respond.
Your vent chamber might be an incorrect equasion. It might have been that "effective" due to it being filled up, having more space to work at at the beginning. But is it just as effective when its fully filled? :)
how about a "not standard" Natural Gas geyser-generator closed circle? NG Generator can be used as a cooler, you just need to feed in cooled gas. Then you could take the almost freezing cool polluted water and use it to cool down the incoming NG. Probably you will need a cooling supplement for the starting-up, but then the system could be self sufficient. Moreover, after cooling down the NG geyser, the now hot polluted water can be more easily be purified and feed again to the generator.
@Brothgar. While an interesting experiment it is ultimately useless when you compare to the alternative route of just running the PW through a water sieve and using an electrolyzer. A deodorizer uses 100g PO2 and 133.33g sand to produce 90g O2 and 143.33g clay. Clay is pretty useless though. In total that's 148.14g sand per 100g O2. A water sieve uses 5000g PW and 1000g sand to produce 5000g H2O and 200g polluted dirt. The water is then electrolyzed at 88.8% efficiency so it's 22.52g sand per 100g O2. The polluted dirt the water sieve gives out also gives off PO2 which can be converted by deodorizers. In total the water sieve route while less sexy perhaps is almost 7 times more effective than passively gassing off PW.
I wouldn't say it was useless experimenting. Seeing the up and left properties and different arrangements was useful. The nice thing about this setup is that it can be done without sand. Now I know you can have a LOT of sand now with the rock crusher so the sieve does make more sense. I prefer morbs over both approaches.
Unfortunately this failed experiment will now be repeated as gospel elsewhere until people realize that Brothgar made a simple mistake in his testing set up. Sublimation can only happen up. The game code does not check in any other direction. It is a false result due to the "corner lock" bug. You can verify this by making a T shape instead of a + shape yourself. I really just point out that the method of PW to PO2 to O2 by sublimation and deodorizers uses 7 times more sand than the water sieve route. There's also the oxygen liquefier route but then we're talking 100s of times more power use per g of O2 than the water sieve route. Even for the most effective hydrogen bubblers. (Remember, the water sieve route actually creates surplus energy).
I don't understand how you can read my comment this wrong. I literally write it's an interesting experiment. Full stop. But ultimately it is useless because if you do the math and compare against the alternatives the gassing off of PW or rot piles will always be a dead end road when it comes to large scale oxygen production. It can still be relevant to feed puft for slime production for a mushroom farm however. But in that case I personally prefer morbs. And especially the massively complex automatic morb catcher made by manu_32 on the forum forums.kleientertainment.com/topic/84176-automatic-morbs-spawner-system/ I would spend time to figure out the most effective way to remove germs. Because if you feed germy water to electrolyzers you get airborne food poisoning. So you either need a low-power high through-put distiller (and no sieve) or a means to remove the germs another way (with a sieve).
So you get back 0.05% of the polluted water you put in as polluted oxygen per cycle, assuming there's somewhere for it to go. On the other hand, each dupe makes a net 6.7 kg of polluted water per cycle in the lavatory (assuming you recycle the other 5). So the steady state tank would be 13400 kg times your number of dupes, and it would produce 6.7 kg of polluted oxygen per cycle per dupe. So at steady state you can basically supply about 10% of your oxygen this way...not so great really, especially given the huge size of that tank without a super compressor. But you are right that there is a lot of polluted water on the initial map for you to use in the short run.
I know its old. I didnt understood what you mean or you are wrong. Full tile of polluted water (1000 Kg acording to liquid vent) should evaporate 2.4 Kg per cycle. I've tested it, it's close to data from video and it's backed by formula: 4 chances(0.1%) per second that 0.1% mass of PH20 will evaporate That is 600(s)*4*0,001*0,001*1000(PH2O)=2.4 Kg/cycle. So steady tank(for 1 dupe) would be 3 tiles(3 000 Kg), which evaporates 7,2 Kg per cycle when full. Tank must be little bigger than minimum due to randomnes of evaporation. Its some source of slime for dusk cup.
The 1st part of the experiment you did 10 wide. What if you did 5 wide 2 tall vs 5 wide 10 tall. The other types of gases above the polluted water. As with the 1st thing I build in a base past the bathroom. The polluted water drop point. Then I dig out a tall storage area for the polluted water for the water to fall into. Some CO2 does fall down in there which sets up a block. If it's only 1 wide and 5+ tall. It will stop the polluted water from rising past the co2. If it's wider. The polluted O2 will make it's way past the CO2.
I was hoping we would eventually be able to compress gasses and liquids to the extremes. create the various forms of ices (their are 16).; maybe even metallic hydrogen for some space tech.
WhiteIce -bit shady but you could pirate the game to get a feel of the game as in my opinion the feel of the game is diffrent (still very enjoyable) then the gameplay of it on youtube and then if you like it buy it at the 20% discount
Cool to hear. Now if only you could do the same thing you can with liquids and gasses with items... Because honestly, at this point, you have enough space dedicated to storage compactors that if you could make one of the compressors for each item, it'd be about the same amount of space as ya take up now. XP
What if you attached this compressor system to a polluted water powerplant? And also attached that to all your bathrooms? Then take that polluted water and the polluted oxygen from it into a hydrogen bubbler?
What is the max pressure possible? What if you did a combination, so that you can control temperature of the base using the temperature of the water? What if you used normal water for this, instead? What if you pressurized it into multiple blocks together?
Not sure there is a maximum pressure. I've had a polluted water tank with 154 tonnes, that's 154000kg, per tile pressurized by the crude oil over liquid vents method. No problem with those. A lot of talk and time is wasted on this channel discussing door compressors when in fact it's a slow ineffective and crude method compared to air-on-air or liquid-on-liquid compressors.
Yo man, in the Polluted Oxygen direction test you didn't test if you filled the blocks ie only available is up right and down, and then up and down. And then just down. It might just only go a maximum of 2 directions & default to up and left. Maybe.
Dude you explained that in the vid. I'm saying you didn't test it fully. Like if you test it with only gas above and below. Does the gas go below? If you test it with gas on the right only, will it stay there? Does that make sense?
Could you revisit the topic of a polluted water boiler now that the game has oil you can Aqua tune heat into an oil tank then drip polluted water into the oil for steam production it's very possible to have a system that can produce water in a stable way I just want to see if it can be optimized.
It was interesting. Having my huge tank of polluted water with just a few deodorizers is good enough for me for now. The Floral Scent is the only "germ" giving me big problems at the moment. I am just making good use of the conveyor chute, a bleach stone, and water trick you did that one video. Fridges were using so much power and the duplicates were wasting so much time harvesting. Just letting the food fall, be immediately collected by the auto sweepers, and delivered en mass to the chlorine behind a bubble of water near the dining room is perfect. So much more efficient. (yes the auto sweepers use more power than the fridges but they can stop for a while and the food will not degrade. It is just so fun)
Hear me out on this one because I’m not very good at explaining things.. however couldn’t you leave a tile wide gap in between your rooms( For example in a 15x15 area you’d have two 7x15 rooms and a 1x15 line) and filled them with a liquid couldn’t it help moderate the temperature in your base? You could pump the fluids through those big AC unit things(I don’t have a pc so I don’t play this game sadly) to cool down rooms. I know in real world terms lakes and other bodies of water moderate ambient air temperature(meaning if the air temperature is cold it’ll warm it up and if the temperature is hot it’ll cool it down) so wouldn’t this apply to the game? I’m sorry I probably over explained, I’m just kinda excited because I’ve NEVER seen someone do this in ONI before. You’d also have to make sure you tiles(walls, floor, roof etc.) are made of a thermo-conductive material.
I would greatly appreciate any feedback. Don’t worry about accidentally offending me, I won’t get butthurt about criticism so long as you provide SOME logic
@brothgar ! I was looking at the newest alpha release and polluted oxygen has already changed to Contaminated Oxygen! And Pitcher Pumps & Wash basins are gone D: We are roughly 7 weeks out from update though! :P
25:44 why should the germs convert into another germ kind? I expected that you would get food poisining polluted oxygen, like you get food poison oxygen if you use germy water for your electrolyter. Currently the dupes can't get food poisoning from the air.
When food poisoning germ count in polluted water goes above about a billion germs per tile (exact number not verified) it will produce air borne slime lung as well.
It's been that way for month and months so idk if it's a bug. I doubt it. The bug is that food poisoning germ count should not get that high except under very extreme conditions in the first place.
Brothgar: I guess since you try to clip out the clapper i have an other idea for you. Use a high pitch sound not heareable for human on ur phone instead. It should be picked up quite clearly by ur sound editing software ;)
Had a few questions about the super compressor - first of all you can clearly store an immense amount of water in this way but is it accessible to be used while you're storing it at all? Also, iss the huge mass a decent heat sink? Speaking of just letting your duplicants pee on the floor, I was trying a challenge recently to never access fresh water from the map or build a bathroom, could not manage to create steam from polluted water with pre-super computer tech but maybe you have some ideas to get that going. (nearly got down to magma which would have worked out well but it's unrealistic at that tech level - or is it?) Dupes with a small bladder or flatulence helped out considerably with waste products.
But I think everything should be able to brake if the presure goes over the limit of the thing that's holding it (door, air flow tile and so on) after all in real life everything has a durability and i believe most people don't want an easy game. 'PS. Sorry for my bad English
What happens if you want to retrieve some water from the compressor? It wouldn't take very long before trying to remove a tile would wreak havoc. Have you tested to see how liquid pumps - both regular and mini - do under high pressures? If you can operate a pump under that kind of pressure, then that opens a lot of doors for development and streamlining. Clean water, for example, could be compressed into a small space, to be kept until a hydro switch indicates that a well is low, for easy duplicate access. One of these systems could be attached to each of the geysers to prevent over pressurizing them with water, while what's stored can be siphoned out and cooled, over time. If pumps cannot operate under heavy pressure, then use a dual chamber system. Attach an 'outgoing' chamber with a pump and a hydro sensor to the main storage chamber, so that when there is too little pressure in the outgoing chamber, a connecting door will open until the sensor signals it to close. For polluted oxygen evaporation, couldn't you build a long tank, either horizontally or vertically with the pressure that you had, there? That would increase the surface area dramatically, while also moving the water away from where it's not wanted much more quickly than using the swamp floor method. In that sense, wouldn't that system be better for a swamp floor, anyway?
Pumps of all varieties in ONI are pressure-agnostic, and tiles are the only kind of building that experiences over-pressure damage, and vents are the only kind of building that stops working if over pressurized.
The name's Bond, *The* Bond. ;) For the Record, my username is The Bound (as in tied up) Fenrir (Fehn-Reer, accent on the 'Fehn') Thanks for the shoutout! I love these "let's really dig into the science behind these materials!" episodes!
In case any one is wondering it is possible to compress water in real life but to get 10 tons per cubic meter would require pressures that you see in the center of the sun! So super compressor indeed!
Cody'sLab i did not know you wached brotgar and im subed to you love your videos
Actually Cody I think you may be a bit off on that number. The center of the sun may be about the density of lead but it is also hot. If you put cold water under those pressures it would compress a lot more since it doesn't have the thermal energy puffing it out. Water would certainly heat up as it is compressed for the same reason that gasses do (unfortunately the game doesn't model this) and the fact that it wouldn't compress linearly so it is hard to calculate what the compression would be at 3.4 × 10^11 atm (pressure at center of sun) but I think 100Kg/m^3 might be a closer guess.
Well fine, but it would still be A LOT of pressure!
Lol true enough. I think diamonds are formed at only 5X10^5 atm so if he put some coal in with that super compressed water...
Yes yes it would; probably hexagonal ice eleven or possibly some more exotic form never before seen.
Watching Polluted Water become Polluted Oxygen: the ONI equivalent of watching the grass grow
4:56 i must commend you for what looks like the most scientific and useful experimental setup i think i've seen so far. this tests each variable that even might have an effect, and it doesn't look too bad either.
by "useful" past me meant "realistic"
I wonder if you can overflow the number they are using to store the amount of germs a tile has with that compressor.
I like the idea of a no toilet base now
every time you pull up the spreadsheet it gets more Copy ofs:
Copy of Copy of Copy of Copy of Copy of Copy of Copy of Copy of Copy of Copy of Oxygen not Included!
On your + shaped experiment, this is effectively a corner airlock and those only seem to work down and to the right. So the left chamber, which is down and to the left, can get the gases from the top chamber, which means it might not actually evaporate to the left.
That is correct. Sublimation only occurs in tiles above polluted water. The game code has no check in any other direction. Remove the top tile to form a T instead of a +, and there would be no sublimation happening.
I'm assuming it's because of the same bug but you can confirm that sublimation can only occur up by making a T instead of a +.
Actually. I did already make the test. It just finished. Ten cycles. No change at all in any direction. ibb.co/eDqo5R
It is possible that it was random noise. The bubbles happen very rarely on individual tiles, so maybe 10 cycles was not enough time to get a decent sample size. According to the wiki, a tile of polluted water has a 0.1% chance to emit 0.1% of its mass 4 times a second. However, when a base gets big or time goes faster, the physics of this game can change slightly. I've noticed in one of my experiments that when I increased the speed of the game from 1 to 3, my liquid cooled aquatuners settled about 3 degrees hotter. They decreased temperature when I reduced speed.
However, over massive time scales, this should not effect a settled system too much. The amount of polluted water can be modeled as exponential decay with a linear addition rate. The amount of polluted oxygen created per second in a system in equalibrium should be equal to the amount of polluted water created in your base per unit time. Though it is possible that the speed of the game can effect the decay rate, it will not effect the total amount of polluted oxygen created.
I should note that my time observations were made before the automation update and may not hold anymore.
+Rubellite Fae That may be how you think of it intuitively, but it is not how the game operates. In many cases, it can appear that way because most things in the game have automatic pressure shutoff, where the local pressure disables creation of a gas (like oxylite, bleach stone, vents, deoxidizers, electrolyzers, etc). If the game actually tries to add polluted oxygen and there is a polluted oxygen tile in the immediate vicinity, it will add the masses.
Could you store a lot of heat (or cold) in supercompressed liquid and use it to heat (or cool) an area for a long time?
In the "vent test", you're trapping polluted oxygen in the bottom 4 gas permeable tiles since they are surrounded by water on all sides. If you delete the tiles while paused, you might be able to tally this as well.
i feel very smart watching this even though i have no idea what he's talking about.
I love your vids. THIS IS HUGE TECH! I immediately implemented the third , grid based model into my base of 10 and found that with 12-15 liquid vents Evaporation takes care of all the polluted water from my 3 NatGas generators. Brilliant! A subtle thing but quite valuable to me and my dupes!
alright so ten or so cycles on, not completely evaporated all the waste water but it still is a sweet way to control polluted oxygen, thanks again
Can you post your setup on imgur and your results in the Klein Games ONI forum and share a link here as well?
tbh no.
I have a challenge idea, a colony where after a startup period every colonist can only be assigned to a single role in the job chart which cannot be changed. You'd probably have to begin the challenge with extra dupes just so you have enough people to be able to do almost everything you need to get started. How long is it worth having an artist dupe, and what happens to the research dupe when the research is done?
intersting naming policy you have for your spreadsheets: Copy of Copy of Copy of... ;)
In order to maximize surface area, what about a sandwich of mesh and gas tiles? I'm not sure about the feasibility due to gas volume/flooding of the pot, but use wheezewortto precool and compress the polluted oxygen before feeding it into an oxygen liquification system for base cooling/lossless clean oxygen generation.
I wonder how high the production rate of the compressor setup is after it ramped up for 10 cycles. As you can produce polluted water within the base and pump it from everywhere else the pressure would constantly grow while with the other setups to increase production you will need to use more space. The additional downside of using the floor based system is that you will need deodorizers everywhere instead of in one place.
Actually, if you condense polluted oxygen into liquid with a Anti Entropy Thermo-Nullifier, it will become pure liquid oxygen without having to use any sand
Did you test for depth? If you have 10 tiles deep of polluted water, does it take all the water into account when generating polluted oxygen, or only the exposed tiles? i.e., would we have to spread out the water to maximize surface area, or could we just put air-pumps over the random pools without bothering to alter them?
Also... what about dripping the water? If you had a little waterfall of polluted water, would it generate polluted oxygen faster?
Dunno if morb behavior was changed, but if not, You could put them in polluted water, since they produce more P. oxygen when in liquid. This would increase the production and it's not even hard to produce infinite number of morbs...
Regarding the compressor system - what do you think will happen if the number of bacteria (an integer value) exceeds the maximum integer value on a 64-bit computer?
There is definitely a bug with germs at the moments. They seem to grow exponentially when it should be linear.
They'll probably patch this and make airflow tiles susceptible to water pressure.
I may be wrong, but in the checkered setup with the 9 liquid vents, the bottom tiles are only evaporating in the tile above it, as the tiles on the side are air-locked by liquid on both sides and top? Wouldn't it be more efficient to have a solid line of airflow tiles separating each row to allow better ventilation of tiles on bottom?
I have a question, do those water tiles allow gasses to flow through? if not then it might be choking the oxy production a bit
Amateurish Author yes, mesh tiles are gas and air permeable
I love how you name your files.
They really need to add a way to control direction of free flowing gas. Like big industrial fan or something. Make it so much easier to control heating and cooling if you could control gas direction in a open space.
There is. Build an air pump. Air will flow towards it.
I was thinking the same think, like the Air Tiles but a one way Air Tile (like the valves in the Heart and Blood vessels, pretty much a Check Valve). If for balance reasons make it a powered item.
Can we say that compressed pH2O emits at the same rate it would spread out into 1 kg tiles?
Why? WHY? Why you dont broke a wall near overpressed water??? SO MUCH FUN!!!
Александр Кустов you need more lessons on grammar for English
It should have broke!!!
Does light affect the polluted water?
You can get polluted water by putting fire pole in cold biome.
mom just commented on how if this guy didn't do videogame research he would be the next einstein
Brothgar is already a chemical engineer at some company.
This is super but I sitll have food posioning germs coming out of my bathroom that is airborne!
Here's a question. Does a pump in super compressed water take damage from the pressure?
No.
In the floor model, could you do like a battery and make layers of gas titles, connected on one side to give an exit path? drop in liquid on right, air wall on left. no need for mesh.
Brothgar wish I had the game to give you a blue print.... like the checked board but layers. Liquid tank: left wall gas perm, bottom layer 0 - water, layer 1 - gas perm, 2 water, 3 gas. Not sure if the checkered board it letting gas from the bottom to the top.
PS: thank you for taking the time to respond.
I know it's a sad thought but does this not mean that the best option for you triple dupe base is a stress base?
The large polluted water collumn looks like a plant cell
Your vent chamber might be an incorrect equasion.
It might have been that "effective" due to it being filled up, having more space to work at at the beginning. But is it just as effective when its fully filled? :)
how about a "not standard" Natural Gas geyser-generator closed circle? NG Generator can be used as a cooler, you just need to feed in cooled gas. Then you could take the almost freezing cool polluted water and use it to cool down the incoming NG. Probably you will need a cooling supplement for the starting-up, but then the system could be self sufficient.
Moreover, after cooling down the NG geyser, the now hot polluted water can be more easily be purified and feed again to the generator.
Now a day's, there is a max pressure, of what I've seen...
@Brothgar. While an interesting experiment it is ultimately useless when you compare to the alternative route of just running the PW through a water sieve and using an electrolyzer.
A deodorizer uses 100g PO2 and 133.33g sand to produce 90g O2 and 143.33g clay. Clay is pretty useless though. In total that's 148.14g sand per 100g O2.
A water sieve uses 5000g PW and 1000g sand to produce 5000g H2O and 200g polluted dirt. The water is then electrolyzed at 88.8% efficiency so it's 22.52g sand per 100g O2.
The polluted dirt the water sieve gives out also gives off PO2 which can be converted by deodorizers.
In total the water sieve route while less sexy perhaps is almost 7 times more effective than passively gassing off PW.
I wouldn't say it was useless experimenting. Seeing the up and left properties and different arrangements was useful. The nice thing about this setup is that it can be done without sand. Now I know you can have a LOT of sand now with the rock crusher so the sieve does make more sense. I prefer morbs over both approaches.
Unfortunately this failed experiment will now be repeated as gospel elsewhere until people realize that Brothgar made a simple mistake in his testing set up.
Sublimation can only happen up. The game code does not check in any other direction. It is a false result due to the "corner lock" bug. You can verify this by making a T shape instead of a + shape yourself.
I really just point out that the method of PW to PO2 to O2 by sublimation and deodorizers uses 7 times more sand than the water sieve route.
There's also the oxygen liquefier route but then we're talking 100s of times more power use per g of O2 than the water sieve route. Even for the most effective hydrogen bubblers.
(Remember, the water sieve route actually creates surplus energy).
I don't understand how you can read my comment this wrong. I literally write it's an interesting experiment. Full stop. But ultimately it is useless because if you do the math and compare against the alternatives the gassing off of PW or rot piles will always be a dead end road when it comes to large scale oxygen production.
It can still be relevant to feed puft for slime production for a mushroom farm however. But in that case I personally prefer morbs. And especially the massively complex automatic morb catcher made by manu_32 on the forum forums.kleientertainment.com/topic/84176-automatic-morbs-spawner-system/
I would spend time to figure out the most effective way to remove germs. Because if you feed germy water to electrolyzers you get airborne food poisoning. So you either need a low-power high through-put distiller (and no sieve) or a means to remove the germs another way (with a sieve).
So you get back 0.05% of the polluted water you put in as polluted oxygen per cycle, assuming there's somewhere for it to go. On the other hand, each dupe makes a net 6.7 kg of polluted water per cycle in the lavatory (assuming you recycle the other 5). So the steady state tank would be 13400 kg times your number of dupes, and it would produce 6.7 kg of polluted oxygen per cycle per dupe. So at steady state you can basically supply about 10% of your oxygen this way...not so great really, especially given the huge size of that tank without a super compressor. But you are right that there is a lot of polluted water on the initial map for you to use in the short run.
I know its old. I didnt understood what you mean or you are wrong. Full tile of polluted water (1000 Kg acording to liquid vent) should evaporate 2.4 Kg per cycle. I've tested it, it's close to data from video and it's backed by formula: 4 chances(0.1%) per second that 0.1% mass of PH20 will evaporate That is 600(s)*4*0,001*0,001*1000(PH2O)=2.4 Kg/cycle. So steady tank(for 1 dupe) would be 3 tiles(3 000 Kg), which evaporates 7,2 Kg per cycle when full. Tank must be little bigger than minimum due to randomnes of evaporation. Its some source of slime for dusk cup.
The 1st part of the experiment you did 10 wide. What if you did 5 wide 2 tall vs 5 wide 10 tall.
The other types of gases above the polluted water.
As with the 1st thing I build in a base past the bathroom. The polluted water drop point.
Then I dig out a tall storage area for the polluted water for the water to fall into.
Some CO2 does fall down in there which sets up a block.
If it's only 1 wide and 5+ tall. It will stop the polluted water from rising past the co2.
If it's wider. The polluted O2 will make it's way past the CO2.
Please, For the love of god. take that million pressure one and have a Dupe brake the top blocks. I need to see what happens when it is released!
I was hoping we would eventually be able to compress gasses and liquids to the extremes. create the various forms of ices (their are 16).; maybe even metallic hydrogen for some space tech.
Can you give us a pole to vote on for the next video so we can prepar a little bit more plz
Damn I really should get this game. Do you think it will go on sale or it will stay with the 20% sale.
WhiteIce -bit shady but you could pirate the game to get a feel of the game as in my opinion the feel of the game is diffrent (still very enjoyable) then the gameplay of it on youtube and then if you like it buy it at the 20% discount
If u already have any games made by Klei you also get an added 20% loyalty discount
buy now, 40% off on steam
you could just buy it and refund it later...
Yeah, you really need to make this sort of compression storage for your megabase challenge, so that your pipes don't back up. XP
Cool to hear. Now if only you could do the same thing you can with liquids and gasses with items... Because honestly, at this point, you have enough space dedicated to storage compactors that if you could make one of the compressors for each item, it'd be about the same amount of space as ya take up now. XP
Bruh. You're amazing.
Can you make a hydrogen bubbler with the compressor method?
What if you attached this compressor system to a polluted water powerplant? And also attached that to all your bathrooms? Then take that polluted water and the polluted oxygen from it into a hydrogen bubbler?
What is the max pressure possible? What if you did a combination, so that you can control temperature of the base using the temperature of the water?
What if you used normal water for this, instead?
What if you pressurized it into multiple blocks together?
Not sure there is a maximum pressure. I've had a polluted water tank with 154 tonnes, that's 154000kg, per tile pressurized by the crude oil over liquid vents method. No problem with those.
A lot of talk and time is wasted on this channel discussing door compressors when in fact it's a slow ineffective and crude method compared to air-on-air or liquid-on-liquid compressors.
The clapper is back! :D
Hell yeah
YEAH the clapper!!!
Nice and sharp CLAP at the start
Yo man, in the Polluted Oxygen direction test you didn't test if you filled the blocks ie only available is up right and down, and then up and down. And then just down.
It might just only go a maximum of 2 directions & default to up and left. Maybe.
Dude you explained that in the vid. I'm saying you didn't test it fully. Like if you test it with only gas above and below. Does the gas go below? If you test it with gas on the right only, will it stay there?
Does that make sense?
Great video.
I've already seen this by painting in 80.000kg of PW per tile surrounding by air-flow-tiles ^.^
WHAT ABOUT THE ROCK GRANULATOR !
Could you revisit the topic of a polluted water boiler now that the game has oil you can Aqua tune heat into an oil tank then drip polluted water into the oil for steam production it's very possible to have a system that can produce water in a stable way I just want to see if it can be optimized.
It was interesting. Having my huge tank of polluted water with just a few deodorizers is good enough for me for now. The Floral Scent is the only "germ" giving me big problems at the moment.
I am just making good use of the conveyor chute, a bleach stone, and water trick you did that one video. Fridges were using so much power and the duplicates were wasting so much time harvesting. Just letting the food fall, be immediately collected by the auto sweepers, and delivered en mass to the chlorine behind a bubble of water near the dining room is perfect. So much more efficient.
(yes the auto sweepers use more power than the fridges but they can stop for a while and the food will not degrade. It is just so fun)
Hear me out on this one because I’m not very good at explaining things.. however couldn’t you leave a tile wide gap in between your rooms( For example in a 15x15 area you’d have two 7x15 rooms and a 1x15 line) and filled them with a liquid couldn’t it help moderate the temperature in your base? You could pump the fluids through those big AC unit things(I don’t have a pc so I don’t play this game sadly) to cool down rooms. I know in real world terms lakes and other bodies of water moderate ambient air temperature(meaning if the air temperature is cold it’ll warm it up and if the temperature is hot it’ll cool it down) so wouldn’t this apply to the game? I’m sorry I probably over explained, I’m just kinda excited because I’ve NEVER seen someone do this in ONI before. You’d also have to make sure you tiles(walls, floor, roof etc.) are made of a thermo-conductive material.
I would greatly appreciate any feedback. Don’t worry about accidentally offending me, I won’t get butthurt about criticism so long as you provide SOME logic
@brothgar ! I was looking at the newest alpha release and polluted oxygen has already changed to Contaminated Oxygen! And Pitcher Pumps & Wash basins are gone D:
We are roughly 7 weeks out from update though! :P
25:44 why should the germs convert into another germ kind?
I expected that you would get food poisining polluted oxygen, like you get food poison oxygen if you use germy water for your electrolyter. Currently the dupes can't get food poisoning from the air.
When food poisoning germ count in polluted water goes above about a billion germs per tile (exact number not verified) it will produce air borne slime lung as well.
For real? O.o is that a bug? That makes totally no sense.
It's been that way for month and months so idk if it's a bug. I doubt it. The bug is that food poisoning germ count should not get that high except under very extreme conditions in the first place.
Brothgar: I guess since you try to clip out the clapper i have an other idea for you. Use a high pitch sound not heareable for human on ur phone instead. It should be picked up quite clearly by ur sound editing software ;)
Can we convert clay into sand? I want to say yes, but not 100% sure
Only 5 people voted and now I have it perfectly balanced.
Had a few questions about the super compressor - first of all you can clearly store an immense amount of water in this way but is it accessible to be used while you're storing it at all? Also, iss the huge mass a decent heat sink?
Speaking of just letting your duplicants pee on the floor, I was trying a challenge recently to never access fresh water from the map or build a bathroom, could not manage to create steam from polluted water with pre-super computer tech but maybe you have some ideas to get that going. (nearly got down to magma which would have worked out well but it's unrealistic at that tech level - or is it?) Dupes with a small bladder or flatulence helped out considerably with waste products.
But I think everything should be able to brake if the presure goes over the limit of the thing that's holding it (door, air flow tile and so on) after all in real life everything has a durability and i believe most people don't want an easy game.
'PS. Sorry for my bad English
Leela! L-E-E-L-A, Leela! Lee-Lee-Lee-Lee-Leela! Ba-ba-ba-dum-ba-dum-bum!
Whi else thinks drones could be very useful with this game
Wow I'm so fast, didn't even get the notification 🔔 yet
Copy of Copy of Copy of Copy of Copy of Copy of Copy of Copy of Copy of Copy of Oxygen Not Included
Is this going to become a meme?
What happens if you want to retrieve some water from the compressor? It wouldn't take very long before trying to remove a tile would wreak havoc. Have you tested to see how liquid pumps - both regular and mini - do under high pressures? If you can operate a pump under that kind of pressure, then that opens a lot of doors for development and streamlining.
Clean water, for example, could be compressed into a small space, to be kept until a hydro switch indicates that a well is low, for easy duplicate access. One of these systems could be attached to each of the geysers to prevent over pressurizing them with water, while what's stored can be siphoned out and cooled, over time.
If pumps cannot operate under heavy pressure, then use a dual chamber system. Attach an 'outgoing' chamber with a pump and a hydro sensor to the main storage chamber, so that when there is too little pressure in the outgoing chamber, a connecting door will open until the sensor signals it to close.
For polluted oxygen evaporation, couldn't you build a long tank, either horizontally or vertically with the pressure that you had, there? That would increase the surface area dramatically, while also moving the water away from where it's not wanted much more quickly than using the swamp floor method. In that sense, wouldn't that system be better for a swamp floor, anyway?
Pumps of all varieties in ONI are pressure-agnostic, and tiles are the only kind of building that experiences over-pressure damage, and vents are the only kind of building that stops working if over pressurized.
The name's Bond, *The* Bond. ;)
For the Record, my username is The Bound (as in tied up) Fenrir (Fehn-Reer, accent on the 'Fehn')
Thanks for the shoutout! I love these "let's really dig into the science behind these materials!" episodes!
Gotta love those Norse references.
Did Bubbles pollute the water or is it bubble polluted ? Bubbles for the win.
sup?
nice vid bro
Copy of...
copy this comment to make a copy of a copy of a copy of a copy of a copy of a copy (joke about brothgars name for the chart
First?
Woo-hoo!
Haha
First
So close
Third
ewoud dierickx nope fourth