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MaskedNintendoBandit yeah but with the orientation of the temple of time and Lon Lon ranch in botw. No locations actually make sense compared to previous games.
Developer 1- "Hey, why did you add those claw marks to that tree by the lake?" Developer 2- "Oh, it's going to be a reference to a dragon in a game 20 years from now."
It's happened before. Particularly in Pokemon. And it was very intentional. Especially since a lot of games are thought up long before they're created. Once again, this happened with Pokemon.
@@lolymop333 True, but because it has happened before doesn't mean that it is always the case. I seriously doubt BOTW was planned for so long, especially such a small detail.
@@sirreginaldfishingtonxvii6149 However, you cannot complete dismiss the theory, as Nintendo does similar things regularly, making it still a possibility.
Yeah, sure. It's definitively a possibility. I'm just saying, Nintendo isn't the most consistent when it comes to the Zelda timeline or canon. Pokemon is way better at that actually.
You know, my 4 grade teacher said to me “if the author implemented a detail into the story, it has to serve some purpose to the story” I don’t believe in that. What if a woodcutter had a really bad day and just took three slashes to a tree, hhm?
@@eamonia not that exactly, us 4th grade students wouldn't understand it if our teacher used that phrasing. She just told us that something wouldn't be in the story if it wasn't important, which is bs.
Maskednintendobandit: remember those claw marks on the lake hylia tree? me, who played through OoT a dozen times: THERE WERE CLAW MARKS??? i never noticed them.
Makes sense, as older link returned the sword and basically canceled out every bad thing that happened later. The dragon would have lived and never met morpha in links canon timeline because he corrected the future and returned.
@@ezachleewright2309 Unless BOTW is specifically Links future after returning the sword. If it followed a timeline where it wasn't then BOTW would be dragonless perhaps? That'd be an interesting world to see.
If the scratches are there when you are a kid that kinda disproves your theory of it being a battle scar that happened after Gannon went to the sacred realm
IT WAS THE WOLFOS who made those claw marks. It was it's training spot, my boi wolfos was training to be the very best wolfos like no one ever was. Then eventually link stumbled upon the island, wolfos thought he was ready and then he was killed by Link.... Apparently my boi Wolfos wasn't ready yet...
While it certainly doesn't disprove the theory by ANY means, the tree is a reference to the original LoZ, where a bridge went over lake hylia to an island with a tree, which was the first dungeon.
The dragons go back to skyward sword and they have a reincarnation cycle like a lot of things in the franchise, they just last longer and are more powerful
I am sorry, did you just call a dragon a lizard? Good lord, no, just no. That's like calling dinosaurs lizards, totally different species (dinosaurs being closer to birds, funnily enough). Four things: > The claw mark missing in the remake could mean that they entirely retconned everything about it > The difference in size of the lake, claw mark etc. can be explained by the simplicity of game design (i.e., the changing lake size can simply be because of graphical limitation, same with the tree and the claw mark) > Dragons are not lizards > Everyone: "Underwater levels are bad!" Nintendo:
It'd be cool if Ocarina of Time was remade to have the same sense of scale and majesty as Breath of the Wild. It was a fantastic game, but playing it as an adult and comparing it to BotW makes it feel kinda small and lame.
@Greg's Retro Channel 2 I don't think so. I got mine way after my brothers and his version didn't have scratches. I think mine might either be a third party repro cartridge cause I bought it online.
Not to mention BOTW is very likely way, way more than 10k years. Since botw takes place 10k years after the first time calamity Ganon showed up, and the time from OoT to the creation of the guardians probably took thousands of years as well.
"The dragon ascends to the heavens as the sun begins to set." In OoT, you get the fire arrow by shooting the sun as the sun begins to rise. Clearly, there are strong elemental ties to Lake Hylia when the sun is rising or setting....
The legend of the dragon ascending as the sun begins to set may be a reference to him being kicked out of his own temple.. he retreated from the battle into the heavens as the sun set on the the kingdom of Hyrule.. a 7 year+ darkness had set on the lands until Link returned and fixed everything.. perhaps once the water temple was cleansed and the land returned to light the dragon eventually returned home.
There's actually a much simpler, in-game explanation. Around Lake Hylia at night, Link encounters small bird enemies called Guay. While these birds have no feet in-game because polygons, these enemies do have talons like any other bird in their official artwork. But wait, you say, how could it have been a Guay? They're so tiny! Well, like some other enemies in the game like the Stalchild and Leever, if you kill enough Guays before the sun rises, you will summon an enormous one that swoops down and attacks! If you're quick enough, you may even be able to summon one twice for an even more monstrous version to show up and assault Link! So yeah, despite their lack of visible talons in-game (I'll assume they're tucked under their plumage while flying like many birds in real life) I believe the claw marks may have been a clue hinting at the existence of the giant Guay, should any players accidentally summon it.
very good explanation. if figured it might have been the white wolforous from the ice cave. we know that shiek rescued ruto from zora's domain and helped her escape. maybe the wolforous followed her and tried capturing her before ruto escaped into the temple and it returned back to guard zora's domain.
It's always possible that the water temple is destroyed/in ruins in BOTW and that's why Farosh leaves the water and flies around every day now But that's just a theory
Quite possibly, though seeing as it isn't a part of the map we're meant to see, it's highly unlikely it'll actually be there should someone glitch their way underwater. But given how much did carry over as ruins from OOT, it is easy to believe the water temple would be there as well, if we were intended to see it.
If there was nothing in the game code like removed dialog or deleted cut scenes and since the CD expansion for the N64 was never released then there is no reason to even have it. It doesnt add anything so just remove it and move on
We never got an answer for it so there probably wasnt a reason to add a loose thread in the remake. Honestly, this theory here is probably the best we will get, it fits better than any ideas my friends and myself had when I was a kid in the N64 era. We all had our own theory, from the giant stalchild coming from the field at night to boogeyman monsters that would delete your save if you summoned it and lost.
@@chriscumbag Wouldnt that be reason to keep it in the new version though? I get what you mean by 'videos like this' because back then, it was all schoolyard discussion and maybe 1 of the like 3 decent gaming mags. It was about discussion, which make great youtube vids from time to time. Im just trying to figure out your logic in this context, does it have meaning or not, you contradict pretty hard. Like "no meaning" and "its only purpose" for example. I may be putting more thought into your comment than I should. lol Also, there was a planned expansion for OoT that was never finished, think it was what basically turned into MM, but I think they had intentions for the expansion while they were finishing up base OoT, the claw marks just may have been a tease for something they had intended to expand upon but never got to, that logic fits better with them removing it from OoT3D.
It's so funny how in old games that things can prove theories about things that they havent even thought of yet Nintendo: let's make dragon markings in the temple Random youtuber: hell yeah Fandom: hell yeah Zelda producer: hell yeah Nintendo: idk how but hell yeah
...and then you realized that it couldn't have possibly been the case being that Breath of the Wild wasn't created for another 20 years and then you felt really stupid.
@@eamonia Aw, look at you, assuming something is wrong because to think OoT had to be inspired by BotW instead of the other way around. You're adorable, here's your allowance, go buy a candy bar or something.
I like your theory. I also recall that in Twilight Princess the spirit of lake Hylia is made to look like a giant serpent. Of course it doesn’t have a clear connection, but big serpents are found in other Zelda games around lake Hylia, too.
I think that Nintendo never thought that far, but this is an interesting theory. Just noticed how small your Channel is, you have a lot of room for growth!
There is an Ocarina of time manga where a bird like girl appears in lake hylia with huge claws for feet so... Maybe that's why its only in the N64 version
Well, i read it again and there may be 2 possibilities: 1. It may be Rouru (you were right, he is a boy, dont ask me how i get to know xD) when he fell to lake hylia at young 2.It may be volvagia, again from the manga, altough is less possible than Rouru since volvagia was still a baby in the young timeline when link bought him
Playing this at such a young age, I used to explore every nook and cranny of this game. I was just reminiscing about this small detail with my children today and had to see if anyone else had a theory. Thanks for the video!
@@theslayer4050 ahh, in our world indeed, however in the world of Zelda and the magic they possess it is easily believable to me that a powerful demon creature has an immunity to electricity, crazier things have certainly happened in other Zeldas! Lol
@@theslayer4050 not really sure what that has to do with our comment thread here lol i thought we were talking about farosh's electricity affecting morpha, not link
That would make Farosh the same as the serpent spirit of Lake Hylia in Twilight Princess: Lanayru. An old woman in Castle Town mentions that the spring and the Lakebed Temple both are dedicated to the "snake spirit", who is a servant of the spring and a guardian deity.
Potentially! Which would however imply that Farosh is actually a spirit and not a physical being... unless those are one and the same when it comes to dragons in Zelda lore... but still pretty cool stuff
It says in Farosh's description that it is a "spirit of lightning that has taken the form of a giant dragon", so it may not have always been in this form, especially as long ago as OoT's time. Regardless, I do like this theory/speculation and it does make some sense!
I remember thinking so hard about that scratch on the tree as a kid, wondering how it happened. I eventually just came to the conclusion that maybe it was done by Kaebora Gaebora. His claws are big enough.
THANK YOU finally someone who also sees this. the more the video went on the more it was becoming waaaay more little evidence based. didnt have me convinced in the slightest. picking out the tiniest bits of fact and blowing it out..
I love how everything needs a theory. I love even more that a lot of these theories hinge on games that have come out years and years after, as if the developers have it all planned out.
i don't think it's suggesting that. H's basically telling you where you can take it now that there are more games in the mix. No one believes this was set up. Even game to game the connections are abandoned or loosely tied at best...there's no way to plan or reference everything 5 games ahead and most people know that. It's just....fanfic for the heck of it.
It is an interesting theory. In BotW, Lake Hylia is in the Faron province, but in all earlier titles Lake Hylia is in the Lanayru province. It seems that the regions have changed borders over time. In both OoT and TP, Lake Hylia's shrines and temples feature dragons or giant serpents; in TP, the light spirit that watches over Lake Hylia is named Lanayru, and in ancient times (long before Skyward Sword) there was a Thunder Dragon named Lanayru who watched over the area. In SS, the hero is given the Water Dragon's Scale which allows him to swim underwater, and in OoT the hero is given both the Silver and the Gold Scales which allow him to hold his breath; in The Wind Waker, the Rito (who were once the Zora) are given the Red Scale from the Fire Dragon Valoo to get their wings. Where I'm going with this is that it seems dragons have been giving out power-enhancing gifts in the form of scales for the entirety of Hyrule's history, which explains why they're used as iconography throughout many of the temples.
Thank you! Yeah definitely, and BotW raises maaaaaany questions about layout and such with, for instance, Lon Lon Ranch from OoT being piece for piece present in BotW but not where you'd expect it to be looking at an OoT map... That's definitely interesting. Dragons have played a huge role in Zelda lore the whole time, right under our noses. Thanks for watching and being here!
I know this comment is old, but I must point out that OoT's Silver Scale comes from a Zora. Sure, it may not actually be a Zora scale, considering they say (and I quote off pure memory) "this is a 'scale' of our kind" - which may imply it doesn't truly originate from a Zora's body, but still. A dragon as an excuse for the Golden Scale has nothing to debunk it, as far as I know, though.
It was the wolfos those claw marks was it's training spot, my boi wolfos was training to be the very best wolfos like no one ever was. Then eventually link stumbled upon the island, wolfos thought he was ready and then he was killed by Link.... Apparently my boi Wolfos wasn't ready yet...
this is a good lore justification for the scratches but i wonder what the real design reasoning for it was when they made the model, perhaps there was a boss at the surface of the lake in the alpha that they cut before the final version? who knows but good vid regardless
Yeah I always assumed the water Temple Dragon statues were symbolic for a water Dragon. And when breath of the wild came out and we saw a bunch of dragons, I figured the developers took into account everything that was shown in previous games. but you're right, I'm surprised nobody has brought it to the attention of the masses this whole time. I guess it took social media age to convey information through RUclips videos like this in 2019
You went deep on that dragon stuff. I'm convinced. I like this theory. It's simple and very plausible. I'll be using this as my head-canon from now on. Good video!
I guess the only remaining question would be, “Are the claw marks there when you are child Link?” But otherwise, solid video and a cool addition to the lore.
Brilliantly-done, Bandit! Zeltik himself probably couldn't have done it better! (Plus, your edits made it SUPER entertaining.) Hope to see more great content from you and also hope to maybe get your thoughts on a Zelda theory of mine some time! Insta-subscribed, my guy.
Well thank you x1000! Can’t be happier to have you here! Hey I’d love to hear a Zelda theory!! If you want to, you can post it here, but if you’d like to send it just to me I actually have my email listed in my channel>about page. Whenever you feel like it, send it my way! Once again thank you for being here and those kind words :)
I think they are more like the dragons from Skyward Sword. They are not the goddesses themselves, but are representatives of them and have similar names
They were named after them. They arent the goddesses themselves. Actually I'm pretty sure that when you go to help Naydra theres even a bit of dialogue that talks about how HE is being effected by the calamity
I'd like to point out that the tree wasn't always that size and the scratches could have happened in one of it's early stages. If that's the case, the scratches would have gotten a little bigger as the tree got bigger and older. Also, Ganon went to Lake Hylia and he does have a beast form. For all we know people may have tried to stop him from corrupting the temple and he went beast on them. Yes I know beast Ganon has swords but he also has big hands and like Link is not required to use the swords
I appreciate the connections you made here. Solid video. The Spring of Courage, I want to ask what you mean regarding identifying what it is. It's a physical location in BotW, just like the other two springs, but did you mean to say there's more? Would watch a new video about that, sure!
Hey thanks for that, I appreciate the compliment! I actually get that question a lot due to my poor phrasing in the video; I meant to imply I was asking about what the Spring of Courage was in Ocarina of Time, since I’m implying Farosh was around back then and that may imply the Spring of Courage was as well. We don’t see it in-game (at least knowledgeably) and it may be interesting to theorize how the Spring changed over time.
That tree was one of the reasons I was so disappointed in the water temple boss. I expected some eldrich deep sea fishman monster with claws and stuff and got a beachball
Super creative theory, I like it a lot. And your editing is super slick. Fantastic video. Definitely subbing for more Zelda. My counterpoint would be to challenge the use of the term "ancient" to confirm Farosh's existence in Ocarina of Time. I don't think the conclusion follows from the premises. Farosh is definitely ancient, 100%. But the problem is that the events of Breath of the Wild by themselves cover a span long enough for Farosh to exist and still be considered ancient. The origin of the game, in which the original Guardians were created, took place 10, 000 years before the events of the BOTW Champion Link. For reference, we consider the Romans to be ancient, and they existed only 2000 years ago, not 10,000. So it is entirely possible, and even likely, for Farosh to exist only in Breath of the Wild and still be considered ancient. Especially considering that Farore already has a representative in Ocarina of Time, the Great Deku Tree. She isn't likely to have two. To have the conclusion follow, I think you'd need to prove either that Farosh is older than 10,000 years (which would be more primordial than ancient), or you'd need to show that Ocarina of Time takes place inbetween the 10, 000 year gap in BOTW, which would be a hard feat. Sorry for your first comment to be a rebuttal, but I wouldn't have given one if your content wasn't so well-thought out and engaging. Keep it up!
Hey thanks so much for the sub and for taking the time to compliment my video!! This made my day! No worries, I love discussion be it rebuttal or agreeing. I definitely get that, which is actually why I only said "probably" that old or "possibly" in the video because "ancient" is actually an unknown factor like you're saying. I wish Nintendo gave some sort of "x years" reference with which to interpret the timeline. I wonder where I'd begin to try to determine age... maybe the size growth rate of lizards in reverse? Anyway, you really have made my day with your thoughtful comment and sub. Thanks a million. I'll check your channel out too! :D
Except this theory is full of holes. First off you can't just reorient the lake like that as now North is to the East, comparing OoT to BotW maps like this means you need to turn the entire Botw map 90 degrees and the two maps just outright do not line up like that. Secondly he brings up the idea that it was from some battle between the dragon and Morpha when Link opened the Door of Time except we see those scratches on the tree when you go to the lake as child Link. They are there from the start of the game
JJAB91 regardless of the theory’s validity, because let’s be honest, taking things from future games will never be intended. Nintendo wasn’t thinking that far ahead, as far as I’m concerned the similarity between the dragon statues is still interesting and might be a callback or Easter egg
I noticed them way back then but only wondered to myself about it. This theory is definitely top shelf material ^^ I can't wait to see what else you shine a light on that has been overlooked by so many.
If that's the case, how come we don't see it while exploring the Water Temple? My guess is this: It could've been one of the stone statues, but that begs the question how was it freed from a stone statue and which one was it? My guess is that when Ganondorf got the Triforce of Power, the electric dragon battled Morpha to protect the Water Temple and lost due to Ganondorf's new power, Morpha used the power Ganon gave it to win the battle against the electric dragon (Causing it to turn to stone) and when Morpha was defeated by Link, Morpha's power was destroyed too. This causes the electric dragon to slowly break free from its stone prison and return as the rightful guardian of the Water Temple under Lake Hylia. As for which stone statue it was well that's the question. None appear out of place. So where could it be? Unless it fled, but where to? The Dragon Volvagia is close, but in the fire temple and a fire dragon. So it can't be there, so where would it be?
I had to take this theory with so much salt i gotta contact my doctor for salt poisoning. A dragon causing the claw marks? Ok, that makes sense, but how do we know this lake is the same lake in botw? Looks like the TP lake more so, but thats understandable, since they are probably closer in the timeline than OOT, but i gotta ask how north changed to east? Maybe the cartographers just go based off instinct instead of fact like checking the stars to see where north is, but i still doubt theyd draw the map wrong. The theory just seems so farfetched for a detail nobody really cares about, since theres little to no lore about it
Remember the Akkala stables there were three scientists who send link on a quest to get pictures of bones of leviathans. What if it was not Farosh, and it was actually one of the old Leviathans who were said to have made their homes in the all the main regions including Hyrule? I haven't completed the quest but I do see a lot of dragon bones across my adventures in BOTW as a whole. I just believe since we don't know where the claw came from, its extremely possible it was done by a creature who was thought to be alive back then, and the main reason I say its not the dragon Farosh is because he seems so benign. He doesn't even get remotely close enough to the bridge to destroy it. Thats why I believe it could have been the Leviathans.
Do you have a Zelda theory about Lake Hylia?
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MaskedNintendoBandit yeah but with the orientation of the temple of time and Lon Lon ranch in botw. No locations actually make sense compared to previous games.
Yep. How is Lake Hylia the way it is on BOTW?
Do you think the events in majoria's mask might have something to do with the way lake hylia turned out in botw?
Drebin 006 majoras mask happened in a alternate dimension. So no it shouldn’t have.
Weston Johnson I believe I read it was confirmed to be an alternate dimension.
Developer 1- "Hey, why did you add those claw marks to that tree by the lake?"
Developer 2- "Oh, it's going to be a reference to a dragon in a game 20 years from now."
*Theory 100*
It's happened before. Particularly in Pokemon. And it was very intentional. Especially since a lot of games are thought up long before they're created. Once again, this happened with Pokemon.
@@lolymop333
True, but because it has happened before doesn't mean that it is always the case.
I seriously doubt BOTW was planned for so long, especially such a small detail.
@@sirreginaldfishingtonxvii6149 However, you cannot complete dismiss the theory, as Nintendo does similar things regularly, making it still a possibility.
Yeah, sure. It's definitively a possibility. I'm just saying, Nintendo isn't the most consistent when it comes to the Zelda timeline or canon. Pokemon is way better at that actually.
You know, my 4 grade teacher said to me “if the author implemented a detail into the story, it has to serve some purpose to the story” I don’t believe in that. What if a woodcutter had a really bad day and just took three slashes to a tree, hhm?
Very possible. Considering how Zora link fights in Majoras mask, it could've also been a zora using the tree as a sparring dummy.
You mean to tell me that your 4th grade teacher told you that? Hmm...
@@eamonia of course I'm paraphrasing, it was a huge conversation with the class
@@petercook7521 Right, but you mean to tell me that while you were a student in a 4th grade classroom, your teacher said all that?
@@eamonia not that exactly, us 4th grade students wouldn't understand it if our teacher used that phrasing. She just told us that something wouldn't be in the story if it wasn't important, which is bs.
me: damn its late i should sleep...ok just one more video.
me 6 hours later: "what clawed the tree in lake hylia"
why is this me right now
"let's play the game again to see it with my own eyes for no reason"
Maskednintendobandit: remember those claw marks on the lake hylia tree?
me, who played through OoT a dozen times: THERE WERE CLAW MARKS??? i never noticed them.
Makes sense, as older link returned the sword and basically canceled out every bad thing that happened later. The dragon would have lived and never met morpha in links canon timeline because he corrected the future and returned.
Nah, the dragon lived either way because botw is the inevitable outcome of all timelines.
@@ezachleewright2309 Unless BOTW is specifically Links future after returning the sword. If it followed a timeline where it wasn't then BOTW would be dragonless perhaps? That'd be an interesting world to see.
If the scratches are there when you are a kid that kinda disproves your theory of it being a battle scar that happened after Gannon went to the sacred realm
Totk released....
We now know dragons live forever :D
IT WAS THE WOLFOS who made those claw marks. It was it's training spot, my boi wolfos was training to be the very best wolfos like no one ever was. Then eventually link stumbled upon the island, wolfos thought he was ready and then he was killed by Link.... Apparently my boi Wolfos wasn't ready yet...
While it certainly doesn't disprove the theory by ANY means, the tree is a reference to the original LoZ, where a bridge went over lake hylia to an island with a tree, which was the first dungeon.
The dragons go back to skyward sword and they have a reincarnation cycle like a lot of things in the franchise, they just last longer and are more powerful
Awesome video you did a great job
I have that exact shield too!
Pretty great theory! Very imaginative and helps web all the games even more together!
I am sorry, did you just call a dragon a lizard? Good lord, no, just no. That's like calling dinosaurs lizards, totally different species (dinosaurs being closer to birds, funnily enough).
Four things:
> The claw mark missing in the remake could mean that they entirely retconned everything about it
> The difference in size of the lake, claw mark etc. can be explained by the simplicity of game design (i.e., the changing lake size can simply be because of graphical limitation, same with the tree and the claw mark)
> Dragons are not lizards
> Everyone: "Underwater levels are bad!"
Nintendo:
6:28
Mini baby dragon
Nice theory
ok..... I didn't think I'd believe this theory... but why Were there dragon statues in the water temple? xD
What about a leviathan? We know nothing about them.
Hi, MNB!
It'd be cool if Ocarina of Time was remade to have the same sense of scale and majesty as Breath of the Wild. It was a fantastic game, but playing it as an adult and comparing it to BotW makes it feel kinda small and lame.
"Have you ever wondered why there are scratches on the tree at Lake Hylia"
Me: wait....there were scratches on a tree??
Same right til now lol
I forgot and assumed it was a wolfos lol
Same
Wait there was a tree
B O I
I remember that when I was young me and my sister thought Ganon was responsible for scratching the tree.
ganon: fuck that tree in particular
@@InvaderNaj Random stalchild: But why sir
You're right he doesn't have claws. He DOES have a trident, however.
@@thecplman1 he didnt have one yet
He must be really mad! Haha
The fact it was removed in the 3D remake probably means it was just a leftover of a different stage of development.
It wasn't removed from my version.
Scrapped dlc content. No doubt it
@Greg's Retro Channel 2 in my version it is.
@Greg's Retro Channel 2 I don't think so. I got mine way after my brothers and his version didn't have scratches. I think mine might either be a third party repro cartridge cause I bought it online.
@Greg's Retro Channel 2 Apparently, there were "supposed" to be EXC (dlc) for OoT. You can look it up
"ok so I put those scratches on the tree you wanted"
"oh yea we scraped that whole side quest"
😑
The Tree ist just copy pasted from lost woods. Can’t believe you can make a 10 minute video of it.
*It was the lab-shark*
*Thats why he's locked away*
It's punishment for skraching inocent trees
But how tho, flying shark with claws? XD
@@jovaneybernard2206 well we only see a small part of his body?
Maby it's not even a shark
@@ast8177What if it was the Zoras throwing their fins/wing arm thingys at the tree
But your idea is pretty good too
underrated comment
that shark scared the crap out of me when I first saw it
I think people underestimate just how much climate and geography can change over 10k years
Not to mention BOTW is very likely way, way more than 10k years. Since botw takes place 10k years after the first time calamity Ganon showed up, and the time from OoT to the creation of the guardians probably took thousands of years as well.
Devastator 4403 it only takes place 100 years after calamity Ganon took over
Liam Thibodeau
Yep. 100 years ago they dug up the guardians and 4 beasts, which were built 10,000 years ago to defeat Calamity Ganon the first time.
It's very difficult for anyone to really contemplate 10,000 years.
I'm lost. If it happens thousands of years afterwards. Does that mean it's a different link? Or the same? I never really understood that
"The dragon ascends to the heavens as the sun begins to set."
In OoT, you get the fire arrow by shooting the sun as the sun begins to rise.
Clearly, there are strong elemental ties to Lake Hylia when the sun is rising or setting....
ABob71 best response on this comment section
Not to mention that Hylia herself is said to have created the three dragons, so yet another connection.
The legend of the dragon ascending as the sun begins to set may be a reference to him being kicked out of his own temple.. he retreated from the battle into the heavens as the sun set on the the kingdom of Hyrule.. a 7 year+ darkness had set on the lands until Link returned and fixed everything.. perhaps once the water temple was cleansed and the land returned to light the dragon eventually returned home.
He seems to have forgotten that the claw marks are there even as a child in OoT. They don't just show up after becoming an adult
i came here looking for this lol
There's actually a much simpler, in-game explanation. Around Lake Hylia at night, Link encounters small bird enemies called Guay. While these birds have no feet in-game because polygons, these enemies do have talons like any other bird in their official artwork.
But wait, you say, how could it have been a Guay? They're so tiny!
Well, like some other enemies in the game like the Stalchild and Leever, if you kill enough Guays before the sun rises, you will summon an enormous one that swoops down and attacks! If you're quick enough, you may even be able to summon one twice for an even more monstrous version to show up and assault Link!
So yeah, despite their lack of visible talons in-game (I'll assume they're tucked under their plumage while flying like many birds in real life) I believe the claw marks may have been a clue hinting at the existence of the giant Guay, should any players accidentally summon it.
very good explanation. if figured it might have been the white wolforous from the ice cave. we know that shiek rescued ruto from zora's domain and helped her escape. maybe the wolforous followed her and tried capturing her before ruto escaped into the temple and it returned back to guard zora's domain.
I don’t believe that.
This is right.
There’s 3 different creatures that have a giant version. The only one I never discovered as a kid was the Guay.
@@snuffydog8153 What are the other 2 enemies? Were there any markings around where they spawn as well?
It's always possible that the water temple is destroyed/in ruins in BOTW and that's why Farosh leaves the water and flies around every day now
But that's just a theory
A GAME THEORY
The Real Psychoetry beat me to it xD
Same fml
Thanks for watching
Quite possibly, though seeing as it isn't a part of the map we're meant to see, it's highly unlikely it'll actually be there should someone glitch their way underwater. But given how much did carry over as ruins from OOT, it is easy to believe the water temple would be there as well, if we were intended to see it.
Why did nintendo erase that scratch in new versions ?
Totone Reed Smith Grezzo most likely didn’t see them and Grezzo redesigned the entire game
If there was nothing in the game code like removed dialog or deleted cut scenes and since the CD expansion for the N64 was never released then there is no reason to even have it. It doesnt add anything so just remove it and move on
We never got an answer for it so there probably wasnt a reason to add a loose thread in the remake. Honestly, this theory here is probably the best we will get, it fits better than any ideas my friends and myself had when I was a kid in the N64 era. We all had our own theory, from the giant stalchild coming from the field at night to boogeyman monsters that would delete your save if you summoned it and lost.
Because there was no meaning to them in the first place, and their only purpose is, well, videos like this.
@@chriscumbag Wouldnt that be reason to keep it in the new version though?
I get what you mean by 'videos like this' because back then, it was all schoolyard discussion and maybe 1 of the like 3 decent gaming mags. It was about discussion, which make great youtube vids from time to time.
Im just trying to figure out your logic in this context, does it have meaning or not, you contradict pretty hard. Like "no meaning" and "its only purpose" for example. I may be putting more thought into your comment than I should. lol
Also, there was a planned expansion for OoT that was never finished, think it was what basically turned into MM, but I think they had intentions for the expansion while they were finishing up base OoT, the claw marks just may have been a tease for something they had intended to expand upon but never got to, that logic fits better with them removing it from OoT3D.
back when farosh was a lil snek he was like: look at dat tree... i think i gonna scratch it.
Whatchu lookin at tree? You makin fun of me cuz I’m small? Ima scratch you . 🐉🐉🐉🐉🐲🐲🐲🐲🐲
It's so funny how in old games that things can prove theories about things that they havent even thought of yet
Nintendo: let's make dragon markings in the temple
Random youtuber: hell yeah
Fandom: hell yeah
Zelda producer: hell yeah
Nintendo: idk how but hell yeah
Lol most accurate comment ever tbh
Just like the whole Zelda timeline 😂
*_Who else had to fire up their old 64 just to double check?_*
Had to fire up my Emulator on my phone
Why do you want to know if I set my consoles on fire Mr. CIA?
Me out of the basement
@Chuck Buskee Ever heard of an emulator?
@Chuck Buskee Yes It's called Mupen64plus
The claw marks were always there even before when Link pull the Master Sword.
Thank you! I was literally searching the comments to see if anyone else ever caught that detail.
I was like "no way!" Until you pointed out the dragon statues.
And I was like "that's totally Dale" until I saw your name
Thanks for your input xD
...and then you realized that it couldn't have possibly been the case being that Breath of the Wild wasn't created for another 20 years and then you felt really stupid.
@@eamonia Aw, look at you, assuming something is wrong because to think OoT had to be inspired by BotW instead of the other way around. You're adorable, here's your allowance, go buy a candy bar or something.
I like your theory. I also recall that in Twilight Princess the spirit of lake Hylia is made to look like a giant serpent. Of course it doesn’t have a clear connection, but big serpents are found in other Zelda games around lake Hylia, too.
I think that Nintendo never thought that far, but this is an interesting theory. Just noticed how small your Channel is, you have a lot of room for growth!
There is an Ocarina of time manga where a bird like girl appears in lake hylia with huge claws for feet so... Maybe that's why its only in the N64 version
I'm pretty sure Rouru is a boy 😂
@@kitkatboard Nono, im sure its not rauru... Maybe? Idk, ill check my spanish manga lol
But im sure it looked like a girl
@@alexissandoval4394 You may be thinking about their queen but the one Link helps is definitly a male 🤔
Well, i read it again and there may be 2 possibilities:
1. It may be Rouru (you were right, he is a boy, dont ask me how i get to know xD) when he fell to lake hylia at young
2.It may be volvagia, again from the manga, altough is less possible than Rouru since volvagia was still a baby in the young timeline when link bought him
The manga isn't canon.
Playing this at such a young age, I used to explore every nook and cranny of this game. I was just reminiscing about this small detail with my children today and had to see if anyone else had a theory. Thanks for the video!
The reason for this is mentioned in the dialogue between link and the owl, he simply states that hes left a marking above the next temple
Wait, where does this dialogue appear?
THE FAROSH VS MORPHA FIGHT IS MY NEW HEADCANON SIR THANK YOU
Wouldnt the electricity surge throughout the water making the boss an easy kill?
@@theslayer4050 ahh, in our world indeed, however in the world of Zelda and the magic they possess it is easily believable to me that a powerful demon creature has an immunity to electricity, crazier things have certainly happened in other Zeldas! Lol
Just don't have anything metal equipped...
@@theslayer4050 not really sure what that has to do with our comment thread here lol i thought we were talking about farosh's electricity affecting morpha, not link
That would make Farosh the same as the serpent spirit of Lake Hylia in Twilight Princess: Lanayru. An old woman in Castle Town mentions that the spring and the Lakebed Temple both are dedicated to the "snake spirit", who is a servant of the spring and a guardian deity.
Potentially! Which would however imply that Farosh is actually a spirit and not a physical being... unless those are one and the same when it comes to dragons in Zelda lore... but still pretty cool stuff
It says in Farosh's description that it is a "spirit of lightning that has taken the form of a giant dragon", so it may not have always been in this form, especially as long ago as OoT's time. Regardless, I do like this theory/speculation and it does make some sense!
@@Solibrae thanks!
So we know Farosh is a dragon spirit that dates back to OOT is confirmed. But what about the other two dragon spirits I wonder?
@@kingnamor7777 What if dinraa went rouge in the old days... ;)
I remember thinking so hard about that scratch on the tree as a kid, wondering how it happened.
I eventually just came to the conclusion that maybe it was done by Kaebora Gaebora. His claws are big enough.
Maybe he was angry at Sheik for stealing his spotlight?
It's from the owl he even admits in in a choice of dialogue
When? Where?
@@SeightJam Owl told link that he mark the place of the temple
@@-Krosis Ok, but when?
Yea,need facts to back up
O RLY?
You work WAY too hard for your subs. This is really good. Phenomenal editing
Thank you, that means so much to me!
None of this is evidence or proof, it's all just theorizing
Yeah I was thinking the same thing. This was *heavy* speculation and just a real longshot
THANK YOU finally someone who also sees this. the more the video went on the more it was becoming waaaay more little evidence based. didnt have me convinced in the slightest. picking out the tiniest bits of fact and blowing it out..
@@schwiftynintendonerd I think this whole video was supposed to be a joke
@@brodyferencak4177 Nice pun!
@@Lost_idiot223 hehe thanks!
I believe this theory! Accounting for the growth of the dragon as well as the terraforming of lake hylia was clever
definitely subbed
Thank you! Glad you're here :D
I'll believe this on one condition: Is the scratch on the tree... in the past.
The Spring of courage is a completely different place.
I love how everything needs a theory. I love even more that a lot of these theories hinge on games that have come out years and years after, as if the developers have it all planned out.
i don't think it's suggesting that. H's basically telling you where you can take it now that there are more games in the mix. No one believes this was set up. Even game to game the connections are abandoned or loosely tied at best...there's no way to plan or reference everything 5 games ahead and most people know that. It's just....fanfic for the heck of it.
I haven’t watched yet but my guess is volvagia on a rampage
Edit: not far off
Future vision!
Like general grievous would say
Your theory will make a fine addition to my collection
It is an interesting theory. In BotW, Lake Hylia is in the Faron province, but in all earlier titles Lake Hylia is in the Lanayru province. It seems that the regions have changed borders over time.
In both OoT and TP, Lake Hylia's shrines and temples feature dragons or giant serpents; in TP, the light spirit that watches over Lake Hylia is named Lanayru, and in ancient times (long before Skyward Sword) there was a Thunder Dragon named Lanayru who watched over the area. In SS, the hero is given the Water Dragon's Scale which allows him to swim underwater, and in OoT the hero is given both the Silver and the Gold Scales which allow him to hold his breath; in The Wind Waker, the Rito (who were once the Zora) are given the Red Scale from the Fire Dragon Valoo to get their wings. Where I'm going with this is that it seems dragons have been giving out power-enhancing gifts in the form of scales for the entirety of Hyrule's history, which explains why they're used as iconography throughout many of the temples.
Thank you! Yeah definitely, and BotW raises maaaaaany questions about layout and such with, for instance, Lon Lon Ranch from OoT being piece for piece present in BotW but not where you'd expect it to be looking at an OoT map...
That's definitely interesting. Dragons have played a huge role in Zelda lore the whole time, right under our noses. Thanks for watching and being here!
I know this comment is old, but I must point out that OoT's Silver Scale comes from a Zora. Sure, it may not actually be a Zora scale, considering they say (and I quote off pure memory) "this is a 'scale' of our kind" - which may imply it doesn't truly originate from a Zora's body, but still. A dragon as an excuse for the Golden Scale has nothing to debunk it, as far as I know, though.
And that's just a theory A GAME THEORY THANKS FOR WATCHING
IVE HEARD THAT SOMEWHERE BEFORE :O
@@BanditGames yeah that is the game theory ending to the vids
@@fullcorpse1232 is a joke my guy
maybe in botw 2 we can swim underwater and explore that? (I can hope)
The wolfos that pops up on the other island
The claw marks seem a bit too big for a wolfos
Yeah as a kid always assumed it was the wolfos
It was the wolfos those claw marks was it's training spot, my boi wolfos was training to be the very best wolfos like no one ever was. Then eventually link stumbled upon the island, wolfos thought he was ready and then he was killed by Link.... Apparently my boi Wolfos wasn't ready yet...
this is a good lore justification for the scratches but i wonder what the real design reasoning for it was when they made the model, perhaps there was a boss at the surface of the lake in the alpha that they cut before the final version? who knows but good vid regardless
GUYS COME ON.
THIS IS THE TREE FROM POKEMON SWORD AND SHIELD!
OBVIOUSLY!
Yeah I always assumed the water Temple Dragon statues were symbolic for a water Dragon. And when breath of the wild came out and we saw a bunch of dragons, I figured the developers took into account everything that was shown in previous games. but you're right, I'm surprised nobody has brought it to the attention of the masses this whole time. I guess it took social media age to convey information through RUclips videos like this in 2019
Nobody:
Literally No one:
Literally no creature in the entire Universe:
maskedNintendoBandit: Wtf happened with the tree?????!?!?!?
Actually, i always wondered what's with the markings
That would be cool if there was some kind of unknown beast going around as a secret hidden boss
You went deep on that dragon stuff. I'm convinced. I like this theory. It's simple and very plausible. I'll be using this as my head-canon from now on.
Good video!
There is no way back in 1998 the developers added a scratch in a tree to reference a creature that they would later make in 2017.
I guess the only remaining question would be, “Are the claw marks there when you are child Link?” But otherwise, solid video and a cool addition to the lore.
Great theory! I never noticed the scratch unless I forgot about it. lol
I always wondered about that mark since I was very young
Brilliantly-done, Bandit! Zeltik himself probably couldn't have done it better! (Plus, your edits made it SUPER entertaining.) Hope to see more great content from you and also hope to maybe get your thoughts on a Zelda theory of mine some time! Insta-subscribed, my guy.
Well thank you x1000! Can’t be happier to have you here! Hey I’d love to hear a Zelda theory!! If you want to, you can post it here, but if you’d like to send it just to me I actually have my email listed in my channel>about page. Whenever you feel like it, send it my way!
Once again thank you for being here and those kind words :)
No problem, Bandit! Thank YOU for the hard work you put into your content! I'll send it your way sometime!
Farosh
Dinrall
Abd naydra
Are the three golden goddesses.
Its literally in their name
I think they are more like the dragons from Skyward Sword. They are not the goddesses themselves, but are representatives of them and have similar names
They were named after them. They arent the goddesses themselves. Actually I'm pretty sure that when you go to help Naydra theres even a bit of dialogue that talks about how HE is being effected by the calamity
Now i have to start my n64 again.
I think your theory makes sense. I mean, the water dungeon was literally filled with dragon sculptures and carving~
I'd like to point out that the tree wasn't always that size and the scratches could have happened in one of it's early stages. If that's the case, the scratches would have gotten a little bigger as the tree got bigger and older. Also, Ganon went to Lake Hylia and he does have a beast form. For all we know people may have tried to stop him from corrupting the temple and he went beast on them. Yes I know beast Ganon has swords but he also has big hands and like Link is not required to use the swords
TrulyNostalgic this is what I thought
I love the way Farosh and the other dragon spirits flex their claws in BOTW, maybe it's a cat lover thing, idk
Weird flex but ok
I never noticed the claw marks
I appreciate the connections you made here. Solid video.
The Spring of Courage, I want to ask what you mean regarding identifying what it is. It's a physical location in BotW, just like the other two springs, but did you mean to say there's more? Would watch a new video about that, sure!
Hey thanks for that, I appreciate the compliment!
I actually get that question a lot due to my poor phrasing in the video; I meant to imply I was asking about what the Spring of Courage was in Ocarina of Time, since I’m implying Farosh was around back then and that may imply the Spring of Courage was as well. We don’t see it in-game (at least knowledgeably) and it may be interesting to theorize how the Spring changed over time.
That tree was one of the reasons I was so disappointed in the water temple boss.
I expected some eldrich deep sea fishman monster with claws and stuff and got a beachball
The claw mark in the tree was from a White Wolfos.
Giant Spirit Thunder Dragon Would've Destroyed Morpha In The Blink Of An Eye
Not unless he was a smol boi, 10k years prior to bein dummy thicc
Even then the elemental powers of the dragon would have destroyed the elemental powers of Morphea
Just found this video and was great! My kind of editing :^) Subbed!
Thank you!! :D
Subscribed, let's see how you grow in future!
Same
I love the theory! Now in my own personal canon for the Zelda universe this is officially the reason for the claw marks.
Super creative theory, I like it a lot. And your editing is super slick. Fantastic video. Definitely subbing for more Zelda.
My counterpoint would be to challenge the use of the term "ancient" to confirm Farosh's existence in Ocarina of Time. I don't think the conclusion follows from the premises.
Farosh is definitely ancient, 100%. But the problem is that the events of Breath of the Wild by themselves cover a span long enough for Farosh to exist and still be considered ancient. The origin of the game, in which the original Guardians were created, took place 10, 000 years before the events of the BOTW Champion Link. For reference, we consider the Romans to be ancient, and they existed only 2000 years ago, not 10,000. So it is entirely possible, and even likely, for Farosh to exist only in Breath of the Wild and still be considered ancient. Especially considering that Farore already has a representative in Ocarina of Time, the Great Deku Tree. She isn't likely to have two.
To have the conclusion follow, I think you'd need to prove either that Farosh is older than 10,000 years (which would be more primordial than ancient), or you'd need to show that Ocarina of Time takes place inbetween the 10, 000 year gap in BOTW, which would be a hard feat.
Sorry for your first comment to be a rebuttal, but I wouldn't have given one if your content wasn't so well-thought out and engaging. Keep it up!
Hey thanks so much for the sub and for taking the time to compliment my video!! This made my day!
No worries, I love discussion be it rebuttal or agreeing. I definitely get that, which is actually why I only said "probably" that old or "possibly" in the video because "ancient" is actually an unknown factor like you're saying. I wish Nintendo gave some sort of "x years" reference with which to interpret the timeline. I wonder where I'd begin to try to determine age... maybe the size growth rate of lizards in reverse?
Anyway, you really have made my day with your thoughtful comment and sub. Thanks a million. I'll check your channel out too! :D
@@BanditGames I would appreciate that!
Breath of the Wild has a Great Deku Tree and a Farosh. Those are two guardian spirits of Farore.
Wait.
YOU ONLY HAVE 500 SUBS?!
WHY?! YOU'RE FUNNY AND PRETTY GOOD AT THIS!
liked and subscribed.
It is good, but the answer is in the video count. He is somewhat new
MelWolf exactly what I said! I am actually very shocked as well. This guy is a star. 🤔
@@hoowup very true
Dude great theory. The point about the serpent/dragon statues in the water temple was the "oh snap" moment for me on this one. Well done.
mlandau312 same
The similarity between them and the ruins around the spring of courage/Faron etc is really interesting
Except this theory is full of holes. First off you can't just reorient the lake like that as now North is to the East, comparing OoT to BotW maps like this means you need to turn the entire Botw map 90 degrees and the two maps just outright do not line up like that. Secondly he brings up the idea that it was from some battle between the dragon and Morpha when Link opened the Door of Time except we see those scratches on the tree when you go to the lake as child Link. They are there from the start of the game
JJAB91 regardless of the theory’s validity, because let’s be honest, taking things from future games will never be intended. Nintendo wasn’t thinking that far ahead, as far as I’m concerned the similarity between the dragon statues is still interesting and might be a callback or Easter egg
How have I played OOT for 15 years, and never noticed the scratch?
Farosh is a spirit that takes the form of a dragon so I don't know if the "reptiles growing all their lives" really works here...
Didn't know Oswald from the Drew Carrey show was such a huge zelda fan
I noticed them way back then but only wondered to myself about it. This theory is definitely top shelf material ^^ I can't wait to see what else you shine a light on that has been overlooked by so many.
Well thank you! There shall be more to come!
I was always curious about this! Subscribed
I would LOVE for a Zelda Theorist to sit down with a Geologist and go over the "It's been 10,000 years!" explanations you see everywhere.
If that's the case, how come we don't see it while exploring the Water Temple? My guess is this: It could've been one of the stone statues, but that begs the question how was it freed from a stone statue and which one was it? My guess is that when Ganondorf got the Triforce of Power, the electric dragon battled Morpha to protect the Water Temple and lost due to Ganondorf's new power, Morpha used the power Ganon gave it to win the battle against the electric dragon (Causing it to turn to stone) and when Morpha was defeated by Link, Morpha's power was destroyed too. This causes the electric dragon to slowly break free from its stone prison and return as the rightful guardian of the Water Temple under Lake Hylia. As for which stone statue it was well that's the question. None appear out of place. So where could it be? Unless it fled, but where to? The Dragon Volvagia is close, but in the fire temple and a fire dragon. So it can't be there, so where would it be?
Your theory is really smart you got a new subscriber and i love your editing
Have you ever wondered-
Me: *No.*
This video alone deserves 50K subs! Subbed!
I had to take this theory with so much salt i gotta contact my doctor for salt poisoning. A dragon causing the claw marks? Ok, that makes sense, but how do we know this lake is the same lake in botw? Looks like the TP lake more so, but thats understandable, since they are probably closer in the timeline than OOT, but i gotta ask how north changed to east? Maybe the cartographers just go based off instinct instead of fact like checking the stars to see where north is, but i still doubt theyd draw the map wrong. The theory just seems so farfetched for a detail nobody really cares about, since theres little to no lore about it
I'm convinced. I also wasn't even aware of the claw marks until you pointed them out
New upcomming RUclipsr!! legendary!
Farosh isn't an actual lizard/dragon. Farosh is a spirit. and nobody else can even see him.
When is that stated that no one else can see him?
Npcs do.
Wrong in every aspect lol
I love this, this was so well put together and funny! plus you sound so enthusiastic! Definitely subscribing :)
Well thanks!! (
Remember the Akkala stables there were three scientists who send link on a quest to get pictures of bones of leviathans. What if it was not Farosh, and it was actually one of the old Leviathans who were said to have made their homes in the all the main regions including Hyrule? I haven't completed the quest but I do see a lot of dragon bones across my adventures in BOTW as a whole. I just believe since we don't know where the claw came from, its extremely possible it was done by a creature who was thought to be alive back then, and the main reason I say its not the dragon Farosh is because he seems so benign. He doesn't even get remotely close enough to the bridge to destroy it. Thats why I believe it could have been the Leviathans.