DF Retro Play: The Sonic 2006 Debacle Revisited - Xbox 360 vs PlayStation 3
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- Опубликовано: 21 авг 2024
- Notorious in so many ways, it's high time DF Retro revisited Sonic the Hedgehog 2006 - a 3D series entry that disappoints in so many different ways, while also highlighting the stark difference between early Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3 ports. John Linneman and Marc 'Try4ce' Duddleson get to grips with both versions, playing them head to head in real-time.
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This game has John so perplexed and angry that he's throwing curse words. I don't think I've seen that before!
I think the last time I've seen him legitimately frustrated by a game was with the first TMNT game for the NES.
..as a passionate gamer should when comes across a game like this😃
Honestly, his "what are you doing? run him into the statue!" and getting frustrated instead of just enjoying the shit show was more distracting than anything else.
He never seems like a fun person to play games with ever
@@ketchupcatsup753I don’t know about that but he seems to be that kinda person who interrupts a lot and that wouldn’t go down well with me 😂
the fact this will be 20 years old in a few makes me feel very very weird inside. life goes by so fast.
The 360 is of legal age..
It's already closer to the original Genesis game than it is present day.
@@lefszycicThis is horrifying, thanks
I'm 27 and I consider the PS3/360 to be retro
It does like holy hell
John really went through his villian arc. This is the first time I've seen him this frustrated and wheeze laugh
Oh he's had some shining moments on Twitter lol (Hogwarts Legacy)
Mariotainakaaaa!!!!!
John - "The developers made a big movement when they sh*t out this game" absolutely hysterical, I was definitely not expecting that from John 😂
This has to be one of the best jokes I've heard on DF. I laughed so hard. Totally savage.
I think he said "ship out" not "sh*t out"
@@jeffchan6607 no he definitely said shit
He said SHIP though
”when they ship out this game” does not work, grammatically. The past tense of “ship” would instead be “shipped” - which he clearly didn’t say.
The joke is the developers made a large BOWEL movement, hence shitting out the game
hysterical let's play! I laughed my ass off when the wale with sonic on the back glitched out lol
Weird, I didn't know he was in the game.
Love his music.
@@Spit1990 I see you
I remember trying to find another good ps3 game during its launch. It’s was down to this and Armored Core 4. I had the mentality of “I’m no longer a kid and want adult games” and went with Ac4. Didn’t have internet in my house at the time so I didn’t know how bad this Sonic game was.
Didnt heard that Armored Core 4 was bad
I love AC4, but on PS3 it had a lot of slowdowns, lol
@@MrVoland44 I meant how sonic was bad. Armored core 4 was really fun.
@@Ice_2192 I agree. AC4 was a bad AC game, but was still a lot more fun and well put together than S06 for sure
@clstirens that's not true at all. AC4 is awesome.
If you think this game is a mess on the outside, try modding it.
Even if you haven't reverse engineered it it's still very apparent that even the _jumping physics_ are unfinished. It's a miracle the singleplayer story content is as complete as it is.
Even then lot got cut like a day and night cycle
IIRC the build of 06 wasn't even the most up to date build they had, it was just the most stable.
One of the most glaring bugs is the bars for some of the gem abilities are supposed to deplete with use, but just don't... so you can break so many parts of the game half with that alone.
@@VexAcer The build rumor is just a rumor at the moment. No decisive evidence has been found. What we do know is that a theoretical switch to an earlier build couldn't have happened after TGS 2006.
As for the action gauge not draining, in the lua file that contains Sonic's parameters, the values for the gauge drain use the naming format "c_gauge_[color]" when they're supposed to be just "c_[color]". Changing this allows the action gauge to drain, which seems like it'd fix the issue completely, right? Well, it's a bit more complicated than that.
First of all, unlike Shadow's gauge, chaos drives and light cores give a _very_ small bonus - enough that if you drain the gauge completely, there usually aren't enough enemies to completely refill it before the next act transition. The gauge in the final game was actually intended to automatically refill, like Silver's and Sonic&Elise's gauges, but it doesn't refill properly in retail. It's anyone's guess as to whether the naming discrepancy preventing the gauge from draining at all was intentional or not, but it is clear that it wasn't supposed to be like that in the retail builds.
On the bright side, this ended up giving us Project 06 years later. Oh, what this game could’ve been…
I think the level design of the stages is great, the hub, loading times , physics and camera is trash though
Not wrong I absolutely love project 06
True. 06 had a chance to be good but it was released in barely functioning state.
The level design and art direction is a absolute joke making the controls function more like SA can only go so far when the actual level design is a vapid knockoff of SA that completely misses the mark and adds in annoyances like forced character switching that destroys flow and the still horrendous speed segments.
This was the third game in a row of them not understanding what people liked about the Adventure games, outside of a full reboot and a new director it was never gong to be anything more.
Even John and Marc, the most forgiving people I've ever seen when it comes to bad games, couldn't enjoy this train wreck. IT'S NO USE!
I’m even more forgiving than them. Even though it was a buggy mess I still found some enjoyment out of it and completed the game on my ps3 back in the days
@@Zenzuu you are a trooper
@@Mastersaifernot really the game had plenty of great elements (the stellar level design, the multiple characters incorporation music etc...) which is why p06 is a masterpiece as it just made this game my favorite 3d sonic game with a few tweaks
John: Tons of great technical analysis, fun anecdotes, informed game design critiques, clever jokes, nice to listen to
Marc: Absolutely dogshit at games, offers no analysis, did not say anything interesting whatsoever, constantly whining and saying the same thing over and over, annoying voice, pointless yelling, does not listen to advice, constantly talks over John
Can they use a new co-host?
TAKE THIS
Fun fact: Tails' dummy ring bomb attack is actually taken from Sonic Heroes, he did a similar attack there when the other two members of Team Sonic were incapacitated as a last resort sort of thing.
I find it very frustrating when people criticise the sonic franchise so much but don’t even know what they are talking about 🤷🏻♂️
@@sandman8920 What does that context change? In Heroes, you would only get bomb ring if you played poorly, so it was more of a punishment - bouncing your teammates against enemies was more powerful, instant and satisfying, compared to bomb ring is.
It's not a matter of if they "didn't know franchise" - it's a matter of "it could've been better". Switching from Sonic's powerful near-instant homing attack, over to Tails' slow box throwing with manual stick aiming... it feels awful.
You know what could've made Tails a bit better? Gadgets, like a watch that whiplashes, so he could AT LEAST have same instant gratification like homing attack does. But then again, 06 had far worse problems than this sadly.
15:57 John's emotions got over 100% at that moment xD
Going from 60 FPS to a slowed down 30 in madness. No surprise it was hard to control.
That silver boss fight is the point where I'd write an angry letter to demand a refund. Unbelievable.
John's love of Chad Warden is inspirational. WE FLY HIGH.
I love how their embracement of the memes
NO LIE
YOU KNOW THIS
The direct capture footage from John is so superb, that even Sonic 06 looks amazing! Must be the Retro-Tink 4K in action! Great video as always thankyou guys!
Sonic adventure actually started with a boss fight against Chaos 0 and then you were dropped into Station Square. It was easy to find Emerald Coast which was a good show piece level
I feel like as a palette cleanser, eventually they should give the Xbox 360/PS3 Versions of sonic unleashed a look. That title still is the best looking in the series thus far from both a stylistic and graphical standpoint imo and I’d love to see what the thoughts are on that!
Very much so agreed! I'd still really love for John to make a technical analysis of Sonic Unleashed's graphics due to that.
The PS3 version is terrible
@@hollowowlyt Yeah it's sub-720p and hangs below 20fps in all of the night stages. I know the day ones fared a bit better but performance still ping pongs all over the place.
That game has a beautifull global illumination system. A simple remaster with the assets used in the cutscenes and path tracing would make it look better than 9 out of 10 games that will come out this decade.
@no_misaki well the ps3 version has an uncapped framerate so it tries to hit 60 and never does. It feels awful compared to the 360 version's 30 fps.
What I admire about this game is that it brings everybody together. There's no big debate or argument whether or not this game is bad; everybody just agrees that it's abysmal. I think that's beautiful in its own way.
It’s not ok to like this game in public even anonymously.
Although about half the comments are trying to defend it without actually admitting they really like it.
A few admit to liking it. I counted about 5 public confessions to liking it.
Then saying, “but I know it’s bad”. Even though they don’t actually think it’s bad.
@@iwanttocomplain Novel concept here, but it's completely possible to like bad games while also being completely aware that they *are* bad.
@@Essu_ no it isn’t. If you like something then you think it is good.
@@iwanttocomplainThat's not even remotely true haha. There's a difference between quality and preference. I hate playing first person shooters. I don't think every first person shooter is bad. How is this even a debate haha
@@Bunny-zg4hd it is a debate worth having.
You are entitled to think and even say that you don’t like something.
Which means that you do not think you will enjoy a game.
As far as you are concerned, the game is bad, despite how well made you consider it.
You might enjoy an objectively bad game like Super Mario Brothers and consider it good despite it being poorly designed and clearly bad to most people.
But you are entitled to say that the game is good, despite it being a form of cruel and unusual torture.
It’s purely a point of view. It should go without saying that any statement made by people is an isolated opinion. Unless you are trying to claim objectivity somehow using some kind of data.
Is motocross a boring sport? To me it is. So how can I not m all honesty say that motocross is good? When I don think it’s good. I’m not criticising the organisers or the firm of the sport or quality of the broadcasting of events. It’s all high quality. But to me, motocross is just going round and round with a lot of mud involved. I don’t care about it. So I rate moto a 5/10 for a sport because I don’t care.
I can’t be expected to guess how enjoyable a product is to someone who is into it.
If I found Super Mario Brothers fun, I would say that I find it fun.
But even though the game is bad as far as I am concerned, it’s not wrong to call the game good, despite being so difficult and frustrating to play.
A DF retro on all 3D Sonic games would be really interesting.
The Quality of their games dont overlap with the quality of the visuals sometimes.
John was the epitome of the “look what they did to my boy” meme this entire episode. 😂
I've been waiting for this DF Retro playthrough since y'all mentioned it in one of the DF Directs...I was not disappointed 😂
As a kid i didn't have any issues with the visuals. But the number of bugs that break mission preventing them from being completed unless you reload and hope it doesn't happen where unbelievable. (edit: that exact silver softlock in the corner, it's just so easy to get trapped there)
Also the high speed sections are much better than the water gliding. You're supposed to mash the ring line ability and it snaps you to them. It's only hard if you steer manually the whole time.
The visuals are fine (actually pretty decent for the generation). It's just everything else that makes it fall apart 😆
Currently playing through this and every time I play it I age 5 years. This is the most survival horror game ever made. One wrong move or button press and you're dead and if you game over you have to do it all over again. Absolutely thrilling!
You are playing a game you don’t enjoy on purpose?
@@iwanttocomplain This is a piece of video game history and I want to experience it with all its flaws.
@@m00sician why don’t you play Keystone Capers?
have you ever consider to try Project 06 or Legacy of Solaris mod?
@@fikridroidNo coz they're still stuck in 06, but now living g in their mother's basement.
I don't think I've laughed this hard at a DF video since the "John and Audi playing Phoenix Games" one, something about John earnestly trying to engage with absolutely horrible game design is f'ing hilarious
as someone who recently checked out Sonic Boom on Wii U again. Please play that, you absolutely have to because my god that is still insane to watch just how broken it is. the choices for co op are baffling too.
Sometimes I wonder that if they had delayed the sonic boom Wii game and instead made it for the Nintendo switch during its first launch year would have been received better? You can factor in multiple things such as a new console. The fact that it was picking up steam to the point where now everyone really likes it. It would have been an extra year development and based on other games that we've seen running on it, the switch up apparently runs the crytek engine pretty well.
@@jordanwhite352 oh yeah I bet it would be way better. even if it didn't end up being good at the very least the performance would be a lot better with the extra time and maybe the switch hardware. I remember hearing the devs didn't even know they were making it for the wii u until late in development and were instead targeting consoles like the ps4 and xbox one.
Just watching this game made me feel physically ill. Kudos to you guys for actually playing this much of it. I heard how bad this game was but I never imagined it to be this broken.
Great watch though!
Did they play the fan remake of it called P06?
@@protocetidprob not but that is way better than the og release
Its not even that bad, RUclipsrs just make it sound like that.
@@FilmTrekk When I played it around the time it came out it was mediocre at best, even as a young Sonic fan I was relieved I hadn't paid full price cus I had rented it. Can only imagine how badly it has aged, play P06 instead brother, good excuse to get the best gaming device, a PC (unless you're not good with computers).
It's really bad not gonna lie. And I only paid 4 dollars for it years ago. The only good version is P-06. So you better play it and see how horrendous the original is in comparison. SOOO much cut content and make the every characters and levels more playable and extra fun.@@FilmTrekk
The joy of jank was so strong with these two that I laughed until I cried. It was amazing to see John laugh uncontrollably.
I really appreciate these types of videos because I always wanted to see these older titles get the DF treatment especially one as legendary as this. I'm one of those crazy people that gets enjoyment out of this game so this is especially fun to see.
56:44 Plenty of great tracks from this game that stand out to me
- His World (all versions + Solaris Phase 2)
- "Crisis City - The Flame - Skyscraper - Whirlwind - Tornado"
- "Kingdom Valley ~Wind ~ The Castle ~ Lakeside ~ Water~"
- VS. Character
- Egg-Wyvern
- Radical Train ~The Abandoned Mine~
- Radical Train ~The Chase~
- Aquatic Base ~Level 1~
- Aquatic Base ~Level 2~
- All Hail Shadow
- Dreams of an Absolution
And there's a lot more music in it too that isn't too "memorable" to me, per se, but still good. The game has an excellent soundtrack - it's just everything else about it that's rotten
I put 100 hours into sonic 06 on 360. I loved it. It was broken though….
Everytime i watch a DF video i hear new ways to say things lmao "ps triple" "dual shock triple" lmao
It was a meme back in the ps3 days
Chad warden baby
Sonic 06 on the PS3 is indeed a video game.
yes it is
One of the PS3 videogames of all time
If you guys wanna see how truly broken it is, try speedrunning it lmao @@rodrolliv
I just hate that there was no Trophies and loading was longer and Cutscenes wasn't 60fps like my 360 experience
hearing (mostly) un-filtered john cursing is quite a delight
would love to see a digital foundry video on the updated version of project 06, so many changes and improvements since you guys last covered it
This is one game that I wish went Backwards Compatible on Xbox Series X. Not that it would make it a better game, I just want to see if the SSD would make the incessant loading screens more tolerable.
Playing it via Xenia has almost nonexistent loading times thankfully.
This game truly is one of the games ever made
You actually don't start in emerald coast. Theres a cutscene, a boss fight then the pool and you enter emerald coast
I love how you guys tried to do a serious breakdown and Sonic 06 said "hold my rings!"
This game came out 17 years ago, released for Sonic's 15th anniversary...
The rumor I've always seen thrown around is that they either had major stability issues near the end of development, or had a giant game breaking bug appear near the end of development, so they had to revert to a much earlier beta version of the game and rush to finish the game before release.
I havent found a source for it, but I always see it get thrown around
I would say that the PS3 version is also a slightly earlier ver. than the 360 ver. as well, maybe because they only had a few months earlier build for PS3 to work off of. Its missing some small details like the gondoliers
Yeah, that's the most common rumor - if it is really the case, and I've had my doubts, it most likely occurred sometime between E3 2006 and TGS 2006.
@@DonnyKirkMusicI believe those details were deliberately removed from the PS3 version to attempt to improve performance. The PS3 version itself does fix a number of bugs from the 360 version, mostly minor, but didn't add much additional polish outside of that.
I can believe it with how rushed it was halfway through after Naka left sega and team got split in half because of the wii
This makes very little sense from a development point of view. Until weeks before shipping, games can be very broken, so reverting to an older version wouldn't have been something they'd even consider.
51:34 lmaooooo the salt in John's face when he realises Marc took him over
utterly love seeing John and Marc just talk and play. such entertaining people
This game is bringing out John’s inner AVGN
it's cool because it looks like Marc is looking at the screen above him and John is looking to their below him!
15:54 - I’ve played this game far too many times, and watched other people play it ever more times. I have NEVER seen this whale glitch before that’s properly INSANE
It's not even a glitch, I believe, there's a time limit to the Tails section of the stage.
I remember I had a broken ankle and I was in therapy and I kept reading about this game coming out because it wasn't really many games out at the time . Let me say that I hobbled my ass on over to Best buy and bought it brought it home and popped it in and bam. The intro was really badass and the song for the title screen was awesome and as soon as the game loaded I was stunned to see how pure ass it was 😂 And at that time there were no other games to really buy and play that I didn't already own because it was only so few. I had no choice but to play through and beat it because I already spent the $60 😂. Sonic and a human girl falling in love was really a super creepy thing to have in a game
Uh
turns out the ankle wouldn't be the most broken thing you'd deal with after you got your hands on that game.
also sonic and the human girl falling in love is _bad_ in so many ways...
Has John done a whole 3D Sonic series review? That'd be neat to watch.
One thing that I always appreciate with Linneman's DF Retro series is that his captured footage looks so great. I don't know if its his capture setup or if he has emulator settings, or if I'm just wrong. Any DF Retro that Linneman is in charge of is a gift to us all.
John's laugh at 15:57 is just priceless
I wore a steady grin through this, but when finally John spat out the words , "a footnote made out fecal matter" I cracked lol
Breaking the game in novel and interesting ways, kudos
The game had serious dev problems, Yuji Naka left in the middle of development to start his own studio, plus the team was also split up to work on Sonic and the Secret Rings for the Wii while trying to hit a Christmas release date. The game was incredibly rushed.
Yea it definitely was
Also a high liklihood that the deadline was to coincide with Sonic's fake birthday anniversary lol
even though sonic is still very popular i don't think it has ever properly found itself in the 3D space.
10:18 I hope that was his actual impression on the marathon
I felt obligated to watch this due to the effort/horror John and Try put themselves through with this video. Thank you to everyone at DF and MLiG.
Never play games with Jon in the room. Jesus. It's like playing with my old brother backseating.
With the fact that Zelda ocarina of time will be 25 years old next month, I’m hoping digital foundry can do a DF retro like they did with Shenmue, including emulation on current hardware.
This is one of the few games that, no matter how bad you remember it being, it's always worse than you remember.
This was the best game ever made on PS3. I used to play it 24 hours a day in Peace River Center's mental ward. I was always the only person in the hospital who cared about it.
The worst boss fight, but the best writing for such a Boss Fight. “It’s no use! This will end it!” What a way to describe playing this game, and what this fight would do to many playing this game. It literally ended people playing said game because continuing it would be no use.
Somehow I’ve never seen the fail state for the whale segment if you run out of time before. That’s comedy gold.
Great video to start the workday! Been waiting for a video about this game for a minute, keep being awesome guys
Sonic 2006: Linneman's Lament!
This has to be the funniest episode of DF retro I've ever watched. I could not stop laughing 😆
Bro 12:07 had me dead LMAO
"But maybe it actually is better later on..."
"No."
I'm genuinely interested in seeing a DF Retro on Sonic Adventure, as well as a DF Retro Play on Sonic Boom, so I'm holding you guys to it! :)
"Special" is an interesting choice of word, lol.
21:55 Sonic's hand maybe brushes past spikeball, INSTANTDEATH
Reacting to Sonic 06. The most original gaming related internet content ever.
A mild note; in Sonic Adventure 1 you actually start in the hotel pool area of Station Square... But you do walk immediately into Emerald Coast as the game directs you to, unless you're me, I immediately drown Sonic in the pool because it's wild to me that they legit put a hazard right in the opening lol. As a kid it was shocking.
You know something's really bad when you reunite with it years later, and it's even worse than you remember. Ouch. Never played this one, and I never will. Thanks guys for this video. Good times.
lmfao John trying to coach Marc through this game is too funny 😂we're gonna have to take away Marc's gamer card on this one
He redeemed himself during the Silver boss fight, imo.
Always love these console only DF retro Lets Plays. Unreal Tournament is another game that would be great to compare.
“I’ve got to hurry and save Elise.”
Interesting tidbit of info about this game there was going to be a Wii Version but it was cancelled and rightfully so after what happened with the Xbox 360 and PS3 versions it would have been a lot worse on the Wii. Also there is a fan remake of this game which is fixing everything wrong with the game called Project-06 as mentioned by John. Also the game suffered because Naka resigned from his own company so the teams had to split between this game and the Wii game Sonic and The Secret Rings on top of Sega wanted to cash in on the 2006 Holiday Season. Also remembered how this game got chastised for having terrible voice acting back then.
yeah, at least Mephiles voice acting was excellent though, for my taste
I never thought I would see a DF Retro on Sonic 06, definitely a surprise here.
The reason why every little thing triggers a full reload is due to stability. This game was rushed to hell and there was no time for testing, so saving every part of the game as an isolated instance or state was more efficient.
It's the same reason why you can't skip cut scenes in Crash Bandicoot: Twinsanity.
Would be nice if you could shout-out project 06 where a dedicated fan pretty much fixed the game and ported it to PC.
I remember saving all my allowance just to buy Sonic '06 back then.. sold out everywhere and managed to find it used at the time for about $30- only for the game to crash everytime when starting in the town area. Thought my PS3 was broken lmao
I love how much fun John is having with this 😄
Wow, I can't believe John isn't playing the Triple version.
The multiple reloading of everything for just a text box is something that had annoyed me in some rpgs in the PS2 generation, possibly before. The difference was they'd load much faster. But things like loading to get a few text boxes and get an item, then reload the town, was the kind of odd design choice wasn't unique to Sonic 06, just shown at it's worst extreme here.
I also remember the PS3 might've had some glitches exclusive to, or easier to encounter in SD resolution, than in HD. It doesn't make any sense, but it's something I noticed after playing in SD for years, before returning after getting an HD TV. Certain bugs that I was used to didn't occur, but new ones did.
However, it's such a broken game that you never run out of new glitches to discover. So maybe I just happened to regularly encounter the same glitches and then not encounter them again later.
Sonic Boom is nowhere near the broken mess that Sonic 06 is.
I've always found it fascinating how seventh generation early games run much worse on the PS3 than the Xbox 360 but as they learned to use the PS3 hardware the situation reversed.
Like RDR, GTA 4 and Sonic 2006 that run better on Xbox 360, GTA 5 and Sonic Generations run better on PS3.
I was going to mention Sonic Unleashed too but I don't know if I would say exactly that it runs better on the PS3. (the PS3 version has an unlocked framerate and some areas like Holoska even manage to maintain 50fps/60fps most of the time, but later areas have a very inconsistent framerate)
in equivalent situations with sustained heavy drops, 360's Unleashed maneged to get an advantage or 2 or 3 frames, ofc in situations where the game ran bellow 30fps
After the slim was introduced the ps3 install base skyrocketed and it became the lead platform for a lot of multi plat development (hence the performance improvement)
@@eponymous7910 i recall LA Noire having PS3 as main platform, also Battlefield 3 and 4.
@@nunosa528 PS4 was ther main platform for GTA 4 too but it had vsync while X360 had tearing.
This is the peak Sonic experience.
I love when you do these segments on the channel it had me on the floor. I played the demo in a target last time I saw this game 😂
after watching the tech demo from 2005....im hyped for it...
First time I played it was in 2008 or 2009, first game I saw on a 360 after so many years on PS2. I was amazed by it's graphics.
Same! It was impressive at the time from past sonic
Sonic 2006 was actually one of the games that came with the PS3 when I bought it back in the days. As painful and buggy it was, I actually enjoyed it and managed to complete the game. The constant loading was definintely a chore and the amount of bugs was laughable, but the game did had it's great moments in some of the levels.
It's unfortunate Sega rushed it too quickly to get the game out on time.
Sonic Frontiers was such a good improvement and fresh start for the 3D Sonic games, some people didn't enjoy it but I think it has awesome bossfights that aren't overly difficult or annoying mechanics with a killing OST
Remember that Sammy bought Sega in late 2004. The reason Sega is a shadow of their former selves is because Sammy executives have controlled SegaSammy since that buyout. They are the ones that closed down a lot of the sega studios which cased a lot of the talent to simply quit. Sammy execs are also the ones that pushed rushed and really bad Sonic games for years.
With this game and so many other missteps, it's amazing that Sonic is still even a thing in 2024.
If you made him play the PS3 version, then is Marc really your friend?
Friends don't let friends play Sonic 06 on PS3, John.
There's a reason some guy called Clement made a 3.5 hour long 7 part review of this 10 years ago 😆
Now I gotta go watch it again. It's been a while
So I think something that was missed a bit of what they were trying to do when they made this game, it’s been a longstanding Sonic tradition that each level has various mechanics that are unique to it. Even Green Hill Zone had the breakable walls and collapsing cliff edges.
Would love to see this topic revisited when P-06 is completed.
Can't believe I just spent an hour watching lightly edited Sonic '06 gameplay
Well I somehow skipped this game, and now I've bought it. This looks delightful - if not for comedy, at least as an artifact of the era.
john's face at 15:59, thats the look of absolute disbelief
I wonder if they fixed it. It used to be, installing Sonic 06 to the 360 HDD would actually make the loading times *worse* by 1-3 seconds.
I dunno if John will read this, but the story of Sonic 06 is that basically the game was slated to come out on 360, PS3, PC and Wii (when nobody knew what it was except codename "Revolution"). Sega was banking on Revolution being comparable to 360 and PS3, much like Gamecube was to PS2 and Xbox. Sonic Team was the first third-party developer to get Wii devkits, and when they saw what the hardware was actually capable of, knew that a port would be impossible. Sonic 06's original director, Yojiro Ogawa, split the team in half. One half would stay and finish Sonic 06, and the other half, his half, would spin off and come up with a new game just for the Wii (Secret Rings). Shun Nakamura would take over as director for Sonic 06 in Ogawa's absence.
Sega did not allocate any additional time or resources to either project. They were to make two games with one budget. For Sonic 06, an ambitious demonstration of new technology, it was the kiss of death. Features were slashed and burned -- datamining has uncovered huge DLC plans that never came to fruition, online multiplayer, a separate co-op campaign, leaderboards, time trial ghost sharing... all of it cut, cut, cut. Severely understaffed, the game devolved into a technical disaster and there was no time to get it into an acceptable state. A lot of Japanese developers struggled to transition to the 360 generation, and that was exacerbated here. Sega dumped it out anyway, as they tended to do back then.
In retrospect, looking back at Secret Rings in particular, it's easy to see just how much they stretched, and stretched, and stretched. There's maybe 45 minutes of content in Secret Rings, and they pad it out to last 7-10 hours. Ogawa basically disappeared after that; he hasn't been credited in anything more than "Special Thanks" in any game since 2007. His Secret Rings team eventually made Sonic Colors, which was rolled back into the main Sonic Team for Sonic Generations. Morio Kishimoto, the lead game designer of Secret Rings, has been the main director of most Sonic games since then.
21:13 SO GOOD 😆😆