Exactly.... This isnt even a debate fr. Penny all day. It's like when people were saying Jokic and Murray are the best duo. No TF they aren't. Jokic IS the duo.
Penny Hardaway is better than Jamal Murray. If Penny and Grant Hill did not get decimated with injuries, they would taken the mantle after Jordan was done.
Honestly in terms of just who is the best? There’s an argument to be made for sure. Only player to ever lead his team to a ring while leading in all 5 major statistical categories
You can’t base penny off numbers, he’s one of those you had to be there and understand what you’re looking at or be able to cross reference type players. It’s just like a Chauncey billups and AI conversation
Yes, you can use numbers. When you adjust for era/pace, Penny averaged 24pts IA/per 75 possessions along 7 asts per 75 on efficiency of +5%rTS from '96. That's better than pretty much every guard except Luka and Steph.
@@indmslikedeez8005 buddy was agreeing with you and provided some numbers that prove your "can't use stats to prove it" stance was incorrect. Now while yes you have to have watched penny to understand why people hold him in such high regard. BUT we can still use numbers if you should ever want to dismantle the likes of Ticket who claim Murray is better than Penny. I'm sure the guy agrees with your other stance, and only disagreed that you can't prove it by numbers.
we are ALL one of those people....we have no clue WTF your talking about " he’s one of those you had to be there and understand" despite-----------------------------------------------------------------------> or this ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------> theres a fullblown menu of unlimited fuckround findout items up & down youtube's suggestion concession 24/7 @@indmslikedeez8005
If only Penny didnt get injured than we can definitely say he's a better player than Jamal....but Jamal is a player that always step up in the Playoffs
At this point in their careers Penny averaged more points, rebounds, assists, steals and blocks. Had a higher fg%. 3x all nba. 2x first team 4x all star Swept in the finals averaging 25/5/8 on 50%\46%\91% splits. Murray shoots better
@@TrollinThru im serious. in the league right now is the most 20 ppg scorers ever. jamal murry has more comp + he been very injury prone up to this point. something people love to ignore
@@Coldskin1 Jamal may end up being better than Penny if he continues being healthy, Penny has more accolades than Murray right now. Penny is a 4-time all-star, 2-time All-NBA First Team, Third All-NBA Team, All-Rookie First Team, and the Rookie Challenge MVP, while Murray is a champion and made the All-Rookie Second Team.
Where ya proof? You talking about one series fuck wrong w you nigga what y’all forget the playoff scoring run Jamal was on in the playoffs during covid y’all really fall inlove w names instead of what they actually did Jamal bubble playoff run stat wise is better than any year penny ever had
@thialhoinj1971 penny got hurt which badly damaged his career. Not to mention teams played at a slower pace so points wasn't getting scored like that back then compared to now.
Penny Hardaway was a better player than Jamal Murray. Penny was the first player mentioned as a combination of MJ and Magic before LeBron James. Penny was special. Enough said.
I hate when they compare stats the game was played differently in the 90's than it is today if pennie played in todays pace he would of averaged 28 29 points a game more dimes rebounds and steals and would of never got injured because the medical staffs are 100 times better
Ticket is being a clown right now. Penny was All NBA 1st team by his second season, and in the Finals Penny averaged 25/5/8 on 50/45/91 splits. If not for Penny's injury, he was on course to being a hall of famer.
These dude are disrespectful. Penny was hand selected by Jordan along with Grant Hill as the two guys who could replace him moving forward. Penny was a beast and went one on one with Jordan and got the better of him on several occasions. Also penny was a point guard, Murray is really a 2 guard, Joker is the point on that team. For me Penny was better
None of these point guards in this era are better than Penny Hardaway he was playing against the bulls, Michael Jordan, Scottie Pippen, he was scoring on them penny Hardaway 20 points a game in that era is equivalent to 25 to 30 points a game in this era. He’s better than all these guys in this area.
After seeing the playoff peaks of jamal murray 2 years in a row lets you gotta give the guy his props its a conversation. In the playoffs the guy looks like kyrie with bounce.
Two years in a row? U mean bubble and this years final? Those are the ONLY times we talk highly of murray cuz before that he was still good but he wasn’t what we see now
People these days.. You can’t just look at stats, plus this era of NBA is inflated with all the foul calls, you can’t even play defense. You gotta actually watch them play.
These dudes acting like this era players are better than everybody from the past. All them are good players but Jamal isn't better than Penny comparing different eras dont always make sense
Its crazy how u ticket can sometimes go on a tangent and completely tunes everything out😭 theres no reason y multiple people should have to say "Hes not a gaurd" repeatedly before he stops
Y'all comparing Penny career when he didn't get play at full form to have a Prime or Peak is disrespectful. This is a fumb debate to argue. After 5 years u can compare but after Penny injury you can't assume. We didn't get to finish seeing a Full Healthy Penny longevity. Y'all have crazy topics. And stop comparing stats to a lesser defensive era with less zone and less hands on. It's more free space now and sensitive ref calls. Any eye test will tell u Penny full game and skills and IQ is beating Murray anyday. And saying Jimmy Butler he doesn't have a bag like Penny did and Michael Jordan would laugh at u fools! Penny had Shaq he didn't need to average 28 ppg when you have the big man eating in that paint feeding it to him and kicking the ball out to Nick Andersen for shots. Make it make since.
For his criteria ticket is right but for a normal person this shit is bad. Nigga cant talk about them as players. Its all about “HE WENT TO THE FINALS” “HE WENT TO THE CONFERENCE FINALS”.
Lol! If Jamal Murray played in the 90s, he would be 3rd string to Nick Anderson and Brian Shaw! Penny was 2x 1st team All-NBA playing with Shaq while Shaq was only 2nd team and 3rd team those couple of years. Penny was toying with Jordan and Pippen and beat them in only his 2nd year in the league. Fool doesn't know what he's talking about. 😂
This is sad it's hard to respect these young dudes all they do is throw out stats Hardaway played in a slower pace era if Hardaway played in this pace in space era no hand check offensive players allowed to travel and push off he would average adleast 28 points since he averaged 20 in the 90's
I’m confused, we talking about Penny in Orlando, or his entire career? Cause bro has like 4-5 good seasons and then he was basically done. Personally you can’t say Penny better than any elite guard all time because he doesn’t have the amount of time than most elite guards
We can’t just keep reiterating the same ol same ol narrative about Penny. “If only he would’ve stayed healthy.” We gotta operate some contextualize another supreme variable that undeniable especially for PENNY. A guard. A point guard. A 6’7 point guard in the eastern conference Jordan era, that after the departure of the dominant force the league has seen go the franchise that (some pun) the blueprint for the “magic”. For nothing!!!! Except the unfortunate resume highlight reel with Nick Anderson, Horace Grant, Ron Seikaly, Bo Outlaw, D3 & beautiful step back buzzer beater against very familiar & topical coaching foe….Pat Riley! Just with that kinda stability alone is indictment on the organization or competent model for success. Matter fact, it’s an insult, considering the premiere talent he was already up against even with ShaQ. So, let’s fast forward to Backcourt 2000 under administration of Danny Ainge & Scott Stiles. And perhaps our debut of the player empowerment of free agency that is now tradition in game today. So, after eliminating the defending champs Spurs in RD1 & putting up in valiant effort where Penny & Kobe matched point % (21) in the dawning of new dynasty. Once again, Penny is thrown back in a conference dominated by the Zen Mastermind. And standing, right there, on destiny’s doorstep. On the brink NBA revolution of product & pace. The emergence of 7 seconds or less, he’s overnight packaged to the place where nba careers go to die.
I Luuuuv That Y’all Have One Idiot with Idiotic Opinions..”TICKLETV”😅😂👎🏾..Everyone Else Was Intelligent Enough To Speak On Their Own Opinions And Have A REAL Discussion About The Topic. I Believe Y’all Got “TICKLETV” For Comic Relief…😅😂Well,It Worked😅
They’re pretty equal in terms of league appearances because of injuries obviously Jamal has more accolades. But who’s the better talent ? Penny fasho Bubble Jamal was tough thou can’t lie
HE IS NOT A GUARD..😂😂😂😂
GOTTA SAY IT FOUR TIMES 😂
Garwd!!!🤣🤣🤣 shout Marz
😂😂😂😂
He came in a guard
GUARDTT* 😂😂😂
anyone who genuinely believes murray is better than penny is a basketball reference merchant
@thialhoinj1971 well thats just projection so not even relevant
@thialhoinj1971its still a projection
@@MarzTalksSports Do you rank Penny as having a higher peak than GP?
Nah, if you go off basketball reference Penny was better by most metrics at this point in his career
@@PaulDaTruthPierce yes
This is how far he will go to try to prove a point he will go against EVERYTHING he believes in
and its absolutely hilarious
@@2FadeMusicds getting old
This is getting ridiculous. As soon someone play well and win a chip they act like they the best player on earth
💯
Big facts
Facts bruh
Exactly.... This isnt even a debate fr. Penny all day. It's like when people were saying Jokic and Murray are the best duo. No TF they aren't. Jokic IS the duo.
Penny Hardaway is better than Jamal Murray. If Penny and Grant Hill did not get decimated with injuries, they would taken the mantle after Jordan was done.
No Kobe was coming for that spot regardless
I approve
Thats excuses jamal came from a career ending injury and won a chip bffr
Ticket done lost his DAMN mind😂😂😂
He definitely drink henny before he get on. I know that typa ignorant
@@Princecharisma111 full cup & no chaser🤣
Daily reminder: Hakeem Olajuwon is the best big man ever.
everyone knows its tacko fall
@thialhoinj1971 best not greatest, there’s a difference. And in the best category, he’s top 2, and not 2
I see no lies
Honestly in terms of just who is the best? There’s an argument to be made for sure. Only player to ever lead his team to a ring while leading in all 5 major statistical categories
💯💯💯
You can’t base penny off numbers, he’s one of those you had to be there and understand what you’re looking at or be able to cross reference type players. It’s just like a Chauncey billups and AI conversation
Yes, you can use numbers. When you adjust for era/pace, Penny averaged 24pts IA/per 75 possessions along 7 asts per 75 on efficiency of +5%rTS from '96. That's better than pretty much every guard except Luka and Steph.
@@blacknetsmed you’re one of the people I’m talking about lol
@@indmslikedeez8005 buddy was agreeing with you and provided some numbers that prove your "can't use stats to prove it" stance was incorrect. Now while yes you have to have watched penny to understand why people hold him in such high regard. BUT we can still use numbers if you should ever want to dismantle the likes of Ticket who claim Murray is better than Penny. I'm sure the guy agrees with your other stance, and only disagreed that you can't prove it by numbers.
@@indmslikedeez8005so ur jus like slow slow he agreed with u dummy
we are ALL one of those people....we have no clue WTF your talking about
" he’s one of those you had to be there and understand" despite----------------------------------------------------------------------->
or this
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------->
theres a fullblown menu of unlimited fuckround findout items up & down youtube's suggestion concession 24/7
@@indmslikedeez8005
Every squad got that dude where you like “why y’all hang out wit this nigga?”
😂
If only Penny didnt get injured than we can definitely say he's a better player than Jamal....but Jamal is a player that always step up in the Playoffs
I mean jamal is coming off an acl injury lol
So did Penny. He was instrumental in that run to the finals, they just couldn't get past the Rockets. Murray too has only had one trip to the finals
The Jamal meat riding from Ticket was crazy
This was a needless argument. Hands down, Penny was a better player.
Better player based off what?
@@joshuasutton983prime
Penny was at least a top 10 player in the league, Jamal hasn’t touched that 😂
No he wasn’t
@@MOCskodencracking top 10 in the nba has never been harder to be fair, kyrie is not regarded top 15 even
At this point in their careers Penny averaged more points, rebounds, assists, steals and blocks. Had a higher fg%.
3x all nba.
2x first team
4x all star
Swept in the finals averaging
25/5/8 on 50%\46%\91% splits.
Murray shoots better
less comp
@@deylack😂😂
@@TrollinThru im serious. in the league right now is the most 20 ppg scorers ever. jamal murry has more comp + he been very injury prone up to this point. something people love to ignore
@@deylack rule changes...
@@deylack I want you to watch tape from today compared to 2012. The modern game is quite wide with all the spacing.
This proves that not every hooper knows more ball than the normal human.
This was Ticket in Super Saiyan Blue level of NASTY… a rare transformation and one the world needed to see
Penny over Jamal Murray.
it won't take much for jamal murray to be better than penny plus he alway got a chip
@@Coldskin1 Jamal may end up being better than Penny if he continues being healthy, Penny has more accolades than Murray right now. Penny is a 4-time all-star, 2-time All-NBA First Team, Third All-NBA Team, All-Rookie First Team, and the Rookie Challenge MVP, while Murray is a champion and made the All-Rookie Second Team.
Prime penny was putting up 28ppg vs pippen Rodman and mj in 96😂😂😂
When he started cooking he was unstoppable
Where ya proof? You talking about one series fuck wrong w you nigga what y’all forget the playoff scoring run Jamal was on in the playoffs during covid y’all really fall inlove w names instead of what they actually did Jamal bubble playoff run stat wise is better than any year penny ever had
He was always cooking till he got injured ofc
You are big liar you know that.Penny avg in 96 against Bulls was 19 ppg
From 96-98 his avg was 22 ppg against Bulls
🤡
@@krces1 I’m talking about playoffs
Jamal Murray would have done the same….what ur not getting.
Why is this even up for debate. It's Penny and it's not even close
@thialhoinj1971 penny got hurt which badly damaged his career. Not to mention teams played at a slower pace so points wasn't getting scored like that back then compared to now.
@Thial Hoinj Murray 0 all star
@thialhoinj1971 it basically wiped his career out. Y'all gotta stop living in the now Murray is no where near close
Dude penny has 4 all star appearances and made 2 all NBA FIRST TEAMS. How many does Murray have?
Y'all gotta stop praising dudes bc they get buckets then go on the other end and give up them same buckets. It's 2 sides of the court.
Penny in todays era would be a monster tf ticket talking about
Fox over penny is crazy
Shid murry too 😂
This might be the worst take I’ve ever seen😭
Big facts
Bro this shit was hilarious 😂😂😂😂
I be so tired of hearing “ hold on hold on hold on , you not hearing me “ 🤦🏾♂️
Ticket out here selling...
Penny Hardaway was a better player than Jamal Murray. Penny was the first player mentioned as a combination of MJ and Magic before LeBron James. Penny was special. Enough said.
penny aint on mj and magic level, lebron james is
I hate when they compare stats the game was played differently in the 90's than it is today if pennie played in todays pace he would of averaged 28 29 points a game more dimes rebounds and steals and would of never got injured because the medical staffs are 100 times better
Low screaming killed me😂😂😂
Ticket is being a clown right now. Penny was All NBA 1st team by his second season, and in the Finals Penny averaged 25/5/8 on 50/45/91 splits.
If not for Penny's injury, he was on course to being a hall of famer.
This shouldn’t even be a convo. Penny clears😂
Bro said Kawhi right now as a guard and PG😂
You can’t compare stats with different eras because they ain’t playing the same mfs
These dude are disrespectful. Penny was hand selected by Jordan along with Grant Hill as the two guys who could replace him moving forward. Penny was a beast and went one on one with Jordan and got the better of him on several occasions. Also penny was a point guard, Murray is really a 2 guard, Joker is the point on that team. For me Penny was better
None of these point guards in this era are better than Penny Hardaway he was playing against the bulls, Michael Jordan, Scottie Pippen, he was scoring on them penny Hardaway 20 points a game in that era is equivalent to 25 to 30 points a game in this era. He’s better than all these guys in this area.
Remember Ticket has Charles Barkley 12th overall in his all time list that’s all you have to know 😂😂😂😂😂
I don’t even have to watch the video.
It’s Penny on his worst day wth
Facts
After seeing the playoff peaks of jamal murray 2 years in a row lets you gotta give the guy his props its a conversation. In the playoffs the guy looks like kyrie with bounce.
But its not a valid conversation. By this time in Jamal's career, Penny was an All NBA player, and top 12 player in the league.
Two years in a row? U mean bubble and this years final? Those are the ONLY times we talk highly of murray cuz before that he was still good but he wasn’t what we see now
People these days.. You can’t just look at stats, plus this era of NBA is inflated with all the foul calls, you can’t even play defense. You gotta actually watch them play.
Penny was first team All NBA twice. Jamal Murray has never been All NBA.
All they look at as numbers and never the games smh
Ticket should’ve been a WWE superstar in all honesty
i said auto auction salesman but that works too lol
I wouldn’t even argue this. Shit is absurd. Just Ticket doubling down on a stupid argument with another stupid argument
Very surprised ticket didn't also say shai
nostalgia vs recency bias
half of yall to young to have a nostalgia bias for penny haddaway its taking someone elses opinion at face value
@@Coldskin1 well everybody has to start from somewhere. And we’ve never had more access to past information than we do now, in terms of sports wise .
It’s been days we still on this
Ticket is reaching like Pippen in the passing lane with this one. None of the players he named could mess with a healthy Penny.
Ticket turns the volume down on his phone to argue
These dudes acting like this era players are better than everybody from the past. All them are good players but Jamal isn't better than Penny comparing different eras dont always make sense
Penny > Murray
Even tho his career was cut short due to injuries he still was a better passer, rebounder, and defender than Murray.
Murray has never even made the allstar team, let alone made all NBA. Hes not even in the same league.
Ticket hold that L! Murray is not better than Penny! Most of the players on that horrible list are not better than Penny!
Its crazy how u ticket can sometimes go on a tangent and completely tunes everything out😭 theres no reason y multiple people should have to say "Hes not a gaurd" repeatedly before he stops
Can you imagine if penny played with joker. The league would be in a chokehold right now
Y'all comparing Penny career when he didn't get play at full form to have a Prime or Peak is disrespectful. This is a fumb debate to argue. After 5 years u can compare but after Penny injury you can't assume. We didn't get to finish seeing a Full Healthy Penny longevity. Y'all have crazy topics. And stop comparing stats to a lesser defensive era with less zone and less hands on. It's more free space now and sensitive ref calls. Any eye test will tell u Penny full game and skills and IQ is beating Murray anyday. And saying Jimmy Butler he doesn't have a bag like Penny did and Michael Jordan would laugh at u fools! Penny had Shaq he didn't need to average 28 ppg when you have the big man eating in that paint feeding it to him and kicking the ball out to Nick Andersen for shots. Make it make since.
For his criteria ticket is right but for a normal person this shit is bad. Nigga cant talk about them as players. Its all about “HE WENT TO THE FINALS” “HE WENT TO THE CONFERENCE FINALS”.
Ja morant is better than penny they cappin
Lol! If Jamal Murray played in the 90s, he would be 3rd string to Nick Anderson and Brian Shaw! Penny was 2x 1st team All-NBA playing with Shaq while Shaq was only 2nd team and 3rd team those couple of years. Penny was toying with Jordan and Pippen and beat them in only his 2nd year in the league. Fool doesn't know what he's talking about. 😂
This was the worst take and argument in players choice history
Sometimes ticket be reaching to much
how tf is these mfers gonna compare them , theu.going back watching old magic games or comparing highlights or
1995 Penny Hardaway is absolutley feasting in the NBA of the past decade and counting.
Tiket lost his mind 😂😂😂
TicketTv stays taking loses on a regular basis
I assume dude in his mid to early 30’s sound like he jus watch highlights read stats n come up wit this nonsense
He is not a guard ! Lol. Ticket u need to stop lmfao
I'm starting to think Ticket never watched basketball before 2010
bro ticket is drunk sometimes o my god
Jimmy butler has played shooting guard in his career so what is mars talking abt
at this point I'm more mad Ticket drug Chilltown into his antics 😂. But man was it entertaining to watch
this might be ticket's worst take in pc history lol. it's no argument at all.
😂😂😂😂 Ticket is so silly
The pannel used to be the best show on this channel, now its a shouting festival, i miss shaq as the host.
We can’t act like Shaq didn’t yell either
@@anthonycelestin3559 not as much nor as loud 😂
& I love my guy Murray, he’s home team but Penny was different n 1st team player, Penny w/o injury is top 20, but we can’t talk what if’s..
The disrespect of my favorite player is crazy!!!!!!!! I expect nothing less from ticket stub
jamals peak is way higher than yall think the disrespect is crazy
I feel like ticket is there as kinda the laughing stock and he doesn’t even realize it cause he doesn’t have enough brain power
This didn't age well 😂
TICKET, YOU’RE KILLING ME BRUH!!😶🤦🏾♂️
“Only averaged 20 three times” as if averaging 20 is easy
Ticket is so bad and inconsistent it’s laughable
HE IS NOT A GUARD 😂😂😂
Penny clears !!! Penny >>> J Murray ..
Can’t believe I heard these names being better than Penny. I get dying on a hill but my goodness 😩….none of them are better than a prime Penny!!!
Jimmy actually has played sg in his career a few times
Penny
This is sad it's hard to respect these young dudes all they do is throw out stats Hardaway played in a slower pace era if Hardaway played in this pace in space era no hand check offensive players allowed to travel and push off he would average adleast 28 points since he averaged 20 in the 90's
I’m confused, we talking about Penny in Orlando, or his entire career? Cause bro has like 4-5 good seasons and then he was basically done. Personally you can’t say Penny better than any elite guard all time because he doesn’t have the amount of time than most elite guards
Even tho penny had those 4-5yrs, jamal murray literally blew up in the bubble so he doesn’t have the amount of time under his belt
We can’t just keep reiterating the same ol same ol narrative about Penny. “If only he would’ve stayed healthy.” We gotta operate some contextualize another supreme variable that undeniable especially for PENNY. A guard. A point guard. A 6’7 point guard in the eastern conference Jordan era, that after the departure of the dominant force the league has seen go the franchise that (some pun) the blueprint for the “magic”. For nothing!!!! Except the unfortunate resume highlight reel with Nick Anderson, Horace Grant, Ron Seikaly, Bo Outlaw, D3 & beautiful step back buzzer beater against very familiar & topical coaching foe….Pat Riley!
Just with that kinda stability alone is indictment on the organization or competent model for success. Matter fact, it’s an insult, considering the premiere talent he was already up against even with ShaQ.
So, let’s fast forward to Backcourt 2000 under administration of Danny Ainge & Scott Stiles. And perhaps our debut of the player empowerment of free agency that is now tradition in game today.
So, after eliminating the defending champs Spurs in RD1 & putting up in valiant effort where Penny & Kobe matched point % (21) in the dawning of new dynasty. Once again, Penny is thrown back in a conference dominated by the Zen Mastermind. And standing, right there, on destiny’s doorstep. On the brink NBA revolution of product & pace. The emergence of 7 seconds or less, he’s overnight packaged to the place where nba careers go to die.
I Luuuuv That Y’all Have One Idiot with Idiotic Opinions..”TICKLETV”😅😂👎🏾..Everyone Else Was Intelligent Enough To Speak On Their Own Opinions And Have A REAL Discussion About The Topic. I Believe Y’all Got “TICKLETV” For Comic Relief…😅😂Well,It Worked😅
Yeah getting rid of this guy was the best thing for the channel
Marz- Giourd
Penny was ridiculous
They’re pretty equal in terms of league appearances because of injuries obviously Jamal has more accolades. But who’s the better talent ? Penny fasho
Bubble Jamal was tough thou can’t lie
The bubble 😂😂😂
Penny is a top 20 guard of all time 🤦🏾♂️🤦🏾♂️🤦🏾♂️🤦🏾♂️ Jamal Murray is jalen rose
I mean Traes numbers are absolutely crazy compared to Penny's but a prime Penny I'd rather take.
Penny beat Jordan
Ticket Proves He's Stupid Every Chance He Gets 🤣🤣🤣
I lowkey agree with with ticket, i fw penny and respect his game but lets go off wat they actually did….and who got the jewelry….?
Hold on low hold on low hold on low hold on low
Ticket hilarious 😂😂
Jimmy G. Buckets and the G stands for Gawd.